If God is all powerful, ...

I would bet you would deny God even then.
no proof at all = no god
There is no proof you will accept.

It's literally all around you.
no proof -plain and simple
The laws of nature prove God's existence. Your existence proves God's existence. Your behaviors prove God's existence. The proof is all around you.
in your mind only
you HAVE to believe that or else you wouldn't know what to do
No. Not in my mind only. In reality.

No. I don't have to believe. I choose to believe.

At the heart of this debate is whether or not the material world was created by spirit. If the material world were not created by spirit, then everything which has occurred since the beginning of space and time are products of the material world. Everything which is incorporeal proceeded from the corporeal. There is no middle ground. There is no other option. Either the material world was created by spirit or it wasn't. All other options will simplify to one of these two lowest common denominators which are mutually exclusive.

So we need to start from that position and examine the evidence we have at our disposal which is creation itself. Specifically, the laws of nature; physical, biological and moral. And how space and time has evolved. And how we perceive God.

If we perceive God to be some magical fairy tale then everything we see will skew to that result. There won't be one single thing that we will agree with or accept. Whereas if we were trying to objectively analyze the evidence for spirit creating the material world we would listen to the whole argument and not look for trivial things to nitpick.

But since this is my argument we will use my perception of God. Which is there no thing that can describe God because God is no thing. God is not matter and energy like us and God exists outside of our four dimension space time. In fact the premise is that God is no thing. That God is a spirit. A spirit is no thing. Being things we can't possibly relate to being no things. A two dimensional being would have an easier time trying to understand our third dimension than we - a four dimensional being - would in trying to understand a multi-dimensional being outside of our space time. The closest I can come to and later confirm with the physical laws is that God is consciousness. That Mind, rather than emerging as a late outgrowth in the evolution of life, has existed always as the matrix, the source and condition of physical reality - that the stuff of which physical reality is composed is mind-stuff. It is Mind that has composed a physical universe that breeds life, and so eventually evolves creatures that know and create.

A case for spirit creating the material world can be made by examining the evidence that we have at our disposal.

So now that a realistic perception of God has been established we need to examine the only evidence at our disposal. It should be obvious that if the material world were not created by spirit that everything that has unfolded in the evolution of space and time would have no intentional purpose. That it is just matter and energy doing what matter and energy do. Conversely, if the material world were created by spirit it should be obvious that the creation of the material world was intentional. After all in my perception of God, God is no thing and the closest thing I can relate to is a mind with no body. Using our own experiences as creators as a proxy, we know that when we create things we create them for a reason and that reason is to serve some purpose. So it would be no great leap of logic to believe that something like a mind with no body would do the same. We also know from our experiences that intelligence tends to create intelligence. We are obsessed with making smart things. So what better thing for a mind with no body to do than create a universe where beings with bodies can create smart things too.

We have good reason to believe that we find ourselves in a universe permeated with life, in which life arises inevitably, given enough time, wherever the conditions exist that make it possible. Yet were any one of a number of the physical properties of our universe otherwise - some of them basic, others seemingly trivial, almost accidental - that life, which seems now to be so prevalent, would become impossible, here or anywhere. It takes no great imagination to conceive of other possible universes, each stable and workable in itself, yet lifeless. How is it that, with so many other apparent options, we are in a universe that possesses just that peculiar nexus of properties that breeds beings that know and create.

The biological laws are such that life is programmed to survive and multiply which is a requisite for intelligence to arise. If the purpose of the universe was to create intelligence then a preference in nature for it had to exist. The Laws of Nature are such that the potential for intelligence to existed the moment space and time were created. One can argue that given the laws of nature and the size of the universe that intelligence arising was inevitable. One can also argue that creating intelligence from nothing defies the Second Law of Entropy. That creating intelligence from nothing increases order within the universe. It actually doesn't because usable energy was lost along the way as a cost of creating order from disorder. But it is nature overriding it's tendency for ever increasing disorder that interests me and raises my suspicions to look deeper and to take seriously the proposition that a mind without a body created the material world so that minds with bodies could create too.

If we examine the physical laws we discover that we live in a logical universe governed by rules, laws and information. Rules laws and information are a signs of intelligence. Intentionality and purpose are signs of intelligence. The definition of reason is a cause, explanation, or justification for an action or event. The definition of purpose is the reason for which something is done or created or for which something exists. The consequence of a logical universe is that every cause has an effect. Which means that everything happens for a reason and serves a purpose. The very nature of our physical laws point to reason and purpose.

All we have done so far is to make a logical argument for spirit creating the material world. Certainly not an argument built of fairy tales that's for sure. So going back to the two possibilities; spirit creating the material world versus everything proceeding from the material, the key distinction is no thing versus thing. So if we assume that everything I have described was just an accidental coincidence of the properties of matter, the logical conclusion is that matter and energy are just doing what matter and energy do which makes sense. The problem is that for matter and energy to do what matter and energy do, there has to be rules in place for matter and energy to obey. The formation of space and time followed rules. Specifically the law of conservation and quantum mechanics. These laws existed before space and time and defined the potential of everything which was possible. These laws are no thing. So we literally have an example of no thing existing before the material world. The creation of space and time from nothing is literally correct. Space and time were created from no thing. Spirit is no thing. No thing created space and time.
 
Unknown. All that I see is a fully scientific need for a programmer of life

God could even be a verb meaning interstellar travel, thus we got here by God meaning space travel, which would mean aliens were involved which might look or not look like us.

Still its unknown.

That said what I think is irrelevant unless you are a doc shrinking yourself

I don't think there was a programmer , just evolution, but the universe, that is another question.

Think less know more.

The simplest life forms DNA has hundreds of thousands of lines of code, I know that the statistical probability of these lines of code forming themselves as a base 4 code then aligning themselves in exactly the proper order to form a life form is essentially null. I also know that modern science has disproved and teaches that spontaneous generation is impossible on one page, then on another says it happened in Darwins magical muddy pond. I also know that DNA evolves but that can not evolve until existing.

Why exactly do you reject God creating life, but accept that God created the Universe?

I do not accept god created the universe whatever you imagine god to be. Why don't you admit you are agnostic and don't know anything about who created the universe, instead you take the easy road out and believe in God, which God? The Jewish God, the Christian God , the Muslim God, etc. Which God do you believe in?

1. I have never said that I believe that God created the Universe...…………
2. I am a Christian and Jesus is with me, always, unless Jesus is busy and he ask his Father to hang with me.
3. No human, of any religion or atheist knows where the Universe came from or even what it is.
4. DNA is a complicated code that did not form itself in Darwin's mythical pond out of nothing because nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code. Thus God is a scientific need, unless you believe that nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code.
5. Nothing does not have the ability to write...………………….Prove otherwise

PS. The densest hard drive material known to man is DNA. It was created by a master creator and there is nothing you can do about it. Have fun trying

A DNA Hard Drive Has Been Built That Can Store Data For 1 MILLION Years

Your future DNA hard drive will use enzymes - SynBioBeta
Why don't you believe God created the universe?

Is it your belief that the universe just happened to exist and God took advantage of it?

Because believing anything about the creation of the universe when nothing is known about this is irrational. One may entertain theories but as said belief is irrational
 
If God is all powerful, all knowing, and an all loving God, then why didn't he create us to be perfect?

If God is all powerful and can do all things, surely he would be able to create a perfect being who has all power, all knowledge, and is a perfectly loving being. To say that he cannot create such a being is to admit that God is not all powerful.

If God is all knowing surely he has the knowledge to create a perfect being and to give that perfect being a perfect knowledge.

If God is an all loving being who loves his creations then he would surely want the best for his creations. He would want his creations to be perfect. Thus he would create us to be perfect. Even in a world or universe where free will exists, if God created us to be perfect, then we with our perfect knowledge could surely reason out that we should choose good over evil always and never make a bad decision. We would be created with a heart filled with love for our fellow beings and our own creations. God would spare us the evil we experience in this world as we would have started out from creation as perfect beings never to commit any act that is contrary to what is right and good.

So why didn't God simply create us to be perfect?



I don't know, why does a caterpillar have to crawl on the ground before it becomes a butterfly? Do you think the caterpillar is aware that one day it will be a butterfly? or do you think that it only knows that it's life sucks crawling on the ground?
There is a belief out there, that this life is only the begining of life before we move on to the next thing. If that is the case, why would god make us perfect in a physical world where everything around us, including ourselves is temporary?
 
If God is all powerful, all knowing, and an all loving God, then why didn't he create us to be perfect?

If God is all powerful and can do all things, surely he would be able to create a perfect being who has all power, all knowledge, and is a perfectly loving being. To say that he cannot create such a being is to admit that God is not all powerful.

If God is all knowing surely he has the knowledge to create a perfect being and to give that perfect being a perfect knowledge.

If God is an all loving being who loves his creations then he would surely want the best for his creations. He would want his creations to be perfect. Thus he would create us to be perfect. Even in a world or universe where free will exists, if God created us to be perfect, then we with our perfect knowledge could surely reason out that we should choose good over evil always and never make a bad decision. We would be created with a heart filled with love for our fellow beings and our own creations. God would spare us the evil we experience in this world as we would have started out from creation as perfect beings never to commit any act that is contrary to what is right and good.

So why didn't God simply create us to be perfect?



I don't know, why does a caterpillar have to crawl on the ground before it becomes a butterfly? Do you think the caterpillar is aware that one day it will be a butterfly? or do you think that it only knows that it's life sucks crawling on the ground?
There is a belief out there, that this life is only the begining of life before we move on to the next thing. If that is the case, why would god make us perfect in a physical world where everything around us, including ourselves is temporary?
Not the point, the point is that a caterpillar becomes a butterfly which can not happen until there is a butterfly to create a caterpillar, but the butterfly comes from a caterpillar.

The only solution is that the computer and win 10 were made together by their creators

Applies to everything that runs on code
 
If God is all powerful, all knowing, and an all loving God, then why didn't he create us to be perfect?

If God is all powerful and can do all things, surely he would be able to create a perfect being who has all power, all knowledge, and is a perfectly loving being. To say that he cannot create such a being is to admit that God is not all powerful.

If God is all knowing surely he has the knowledge to create a perfect being and to give that perfect being a perfect knowledge.

If God is an all loving being who loves his creations then he would surely want the best for his creations. He would want his creations to be perfect. Thus he would create us to be perfect. Even in a world or universe where free will exists, if God created us to be perfect, then we with our perfect knowledge could surely reason out that we should choose good over evil always and never make a bad decision. We would be created with a heart filled with love for our fellow beings and our own creations. God would spare us the evil we experience in this world as we would have started out from creation as perfect beings never to commit any act that is contrary to what is right and good.

So why didn't God simply create us to be perfect?



I don't know, why does a caterpillar have to crawl on the ground before it becomes a butterfly? Do you think the caterpillar is aware that one day it will be a butterfly? or do you think that it only knows that it's life sucks crawling on the ground?
There is a belief out there, that this life is only the begining of life before we move on to the next thing. If that is the case, why would god make us perfect in a physical world where everything around us, including ourselves is temporary?
Not the point, the point is that a caterpillar becomes a butterfly which can not happen until there is a butterfly to create a caterpillar, but the butterfly comes from a caterpillar.

The only solution is that the computer and win 10 were made together by their creators

Applies to everything that runs on code


except that my analogy wasn't litteral. Just making a simple point that a caterpillar may not be aware of its next life after it comes out of a cocoon, just as we may not be aware of our next life, which may only be an extension of this one.
 
What do you picture God to be, is there more than one?
Unknown. All that I see is a fully scientific need for a programmer of life

God could even be a verb meaning interstellar travel, thus we got here by God meaning space travel, which would mean aliens were involved which might look or not look like us.

Still its unknown.

That said what I think is irrelevant unless you are a doc shrinking yourself

I don't think there was a programmer , just evolution, but the universe, that is another question.

Think less know more.

The simplest life forms DNA has hundreds of thousands of lines of code, I know that the statistical probability of these lines of code forming themselves as a base 4 code then aligning themselves in exactly the proper order to form a life form is essentially null. I also know that modern science has disproved and teaches that spontaneous generation is impossible on one page, then on another says it happened in Darwins magical muddy pond. I also know that DNA evolves but that can not evolve until existing.

Why exactly do you reject God creating life, but accept that God created the Universe?

I do not accept god created the universe whatever you imagine god to be. Why don't you admit you are agnostic and don't know anything about who created the universe, instead you take the easy road out and believe in God, which God? The Jewish God, the Christian God , the Muslim God, etc. Which God do you believe in?

1. I have never said that I believe that God created the Universe...…………
2. I am a Christian and Jesus is with me, always, unless Jesus is busy and he ask his Father to hang with me.
3. No human, of any religion or atheist knows where the Universe came from or even what it is.
4. DNA is a complicated code that did not form itself in Darwin's mythical pond out of nothing because nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code. Thus God is a scientific need, unless you believe that nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code.
5. Nothing does not have the ability to write...………………….Prove otherwise

PS. The densest hard drive material known to man is DNA. It was created by a master creator and there is nothing you can do about it. Have fun trying

A DNA Hard Drive Has Been Built That Can Store Data For 1 MILLION Years

Your future DNA hard drive will use enzymes - SynBioBeta

1. I have never said that I believe that God created the Universe...…………
True you never said that , but you said I did and I did not.

2. I am a Christian and Jesus is with me, always, unless Jesus is busy and he ask his Father to hang with me.

Funny Jesus was never busy when he was my best friend, what is the name of your jewish God?

3. No human, of any religion or atheist knows where the Universe came from or even what it is.

True, but you believe God created everything, in Genesis 1 it says God created the heavens and the earth...….
if you believe in Jesus and his father then you must believe in the Bible.

4. DNA is a complicated code that did not form itself in Darwin's mythical pond out of nothing because nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code. Thus God is a scientific need, unless you believe that nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code.
5. Nothing does not have the ability to write...………………….Prove otherwise

DNA evolved and continues to evolve and actually its mutates to cause cancer, disease, genetic conditions and diseases, and old age.

How does DNA damage contribute to Ageing?
The DNA damage theory of aging proposes that aging is a consequence of unrepaired accumulation of naturally occurring DNA damages. ... Nuclear DNA damage can contribute to aging either indirectly (by increasing apoptosis or cellular senescence) or directly (by increasing cell dysfunction).
DNA damage theory of aging - Wikipedia

DNA damage theory of aging - Wikipedia

I guess its not as strong as you thought it was.
 
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If God is all powerful, all knowing, and an all loving God, then why didn't he create us to be perfect?

If God is all powerful and can do all things, surely he would be able to create a perfect being who has all power, all knowledge, and is a perfectly loving being. To say that he cannot create such a being is to admit that God is not all powerful.

If God is all knowing surely he has the knowledge to create a perfect being and to give that perfect being a perfect knowledge.

If God is an all loving being who loves his creations then he would surely want the best for his creations. He would want his creations to be perfect. Thus he would create us to be perfect. Even in a world or universe where free will exists, if God created us to be perfect, then we with our perfect knowledge could surely reason out that we should choose good over evil always and never make a bad decision. We would be created with a heart filled with love for our fellow beings and our own creations. God would spare us the evil we experience in this world as we would have started out from creation as perfect beings never to commit any act that is contrary to what is right and good.

So why didn't God simply create us to be perfect?
Suffer the little children... Abortion is an abomination. Yeah, ok. Perhaps, and then IF the poor kid had lived, it would have been born with a heart defect, or without most of its brain, gotten cancer or been beaten to death by a relative. I don't know anymore which is worse, gods will or randomness of men's laws.
 
Unknown. All that I see is a fully scientific need for a programmer of life

God could even be a verb meaning interstellar travel, thus we got here by God meaning space travel, which would mean aliens were involved which might look or not look like us.

Still its unknown.

That said what I think is irrelevant unless you are a doc shrinking yourself

I don't think there was a programmer , just evolution, but the universe, that is another question.

Think less know more.

The simplest life forms DNA has hundreds of thousands of lines of code, I know that the statistical probability of these lines of code forming themselves as a base 4 code then aligning themselves in exactly the proper order to form a life form is essentially null. I also know that modern science has disproved and teaches that spontaneous generation is impossible on one page, then on another says it happened in Darwins magical muddy pond. I also know that DNA evolves but that can not evolve until existing.

Why exactly do you reject God creating life, but accept that God created the Universe?

I do not accept god created the universe whatever you imagine god to be. Why don't you admit you are agnostic and don't know anything about who created the universe, instead you take the easy road out and believe in God, which God? The Jewish God, the Christian God , the Muslim God, etc. Which God do you believe in?

1. I have never said that I believe that God created the Universe...…………
2. I am a Christian and Jesus is with me, always, unless Jesus is busy and he ask his Father to hang with me.
3. No human, of any religion or atheist knows where the Universe came from or even what it is.
4. DNA is a complicated code that did not form itself in Darwin's mythical pond out of nothing because nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code. Thus God is a scientific need, unless you believe that nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code.
5. Nothing does not have the ability to write...………………….Prove otherwise

PS. The densest hard drive material known to man is DNA. It was created by a master creator and there is nothing you can do about it. Have fun trying

A DNA Hard Drive Has Been Built That Can Store Data For 1 MILLION Years

Your future DNA hard drive will use enzymes - SynBioBeta

1. I have never said that I believe that God created the Universe...…………
True you never said that , but you said I did and I did not.

2. I am a Christian and Jesus is with me, always, unless Jesus is busy and he ask his Father to hang with me.

Funny Jesus was never busy when he was my best friend, what is the name of your jewish God?

3. No human, of any religion or atheist knows where the Universe came from or even what it is.

True, but you believe God created everything, in Genesis 1 it says God created the heavens and the earth...….
if you believe in Jesus and his father then you must believe in the Bible.

4. DNA is a complicated code that did not form itself in Darwin's mythical pond out of nothing because nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code. Thus God is a scientific need, unless you believe that nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code.
5. Nothing does not have the ability to write...………………….Prove otherwise

DNA evolved and continues to evolve and actually its mutates to cause cancer, disease, genetic conditions and diseases, and old age.

How does DNA damage contribute to Ageing?
The DNA damage theory of aging proposes that aging is a consequence of unrepaired accumulation of naturally occurring DNA damages. ... Nuclear DNA damage can contribute to aging either indirectly (by increasing apoptosis or cellular senescence) or directly (by increasing cell dysfunction).
DNA damage theory of aging - Wikipedia

DNA damage theory of aging - Wikipedia

I guess its not as strong as you thought it was.
I never said that God created everything, I said that complicated matter building and replicating code can not assemble itself out of nothing, because only intelligence can produce code, as such a coder, programmer or creator commonly referred to as God is a scientific requirement, that is typically referred to as a spiritual being, but as said is actually quite scientific.

DNA caused everything you are looking at. Old age is part of the DNA code, the parent organisms die after creating superior to the parent offspring. If GM could create a Corvette that would mate with other sexy Corvettes that would be faster and more fuel efficient and sexier than the parent Vetts they would...………………. This is exactly what evolution does, yes evolution is real and like the Vette did not build itself

Example...……………… Me! Though I opted for a Camaro, V8 5L Coupe top speed 126mph
 
If God is all powerful, all knowing, and an all loving God, then why didn't he create us to be perfect?

If God is all powerful and can do all things, surely he would be able to create a perfect being who has all power, all knowledge, and is a perfectly loving being. To say that he cannot create such a being is to admit that God is not all powerful.

If God is all knowing surely he has the knowledge to create a perfect being and to give that perfect being a perfect knowledge.

If God is an all loving being who loves his creations then he would surely want the best for his creations. He would want his creations to be perfect. Thus he would create us to be perfect. Even in a world or universe where free will exists, if God created us to be perfect, then we with our perfect knowledge could surely reason out that we should choose good over evil always and never make a bad decision. We would be created with a heart filled with love for our fellow beings and our own creations. God would spare us the evil we experience in this world as we would have started out from creation as perfect beings never to commit any act that is contrary to what is right and good.

So why didn't God simply create us to be perfect?
Suffer the little children... Abortion is an abomination. Yeah, ok. Perhaps, and then IF the poor kid had lived, it would have been born with a heart defect, or without most of its brain, gotten cancer or been beaten to death by a relative. I don't know anymore which is worse, gods will or randomness of men's laws.
Hillary Clinton aborted all of Bills kids...………………….Nothing wrong with that

Chelsea, her father is Webb Hubble
 
I don't think there was a programmer , just evolution, but the universe, that is another question.

Think less know more.

The simplest life forms DNA has hundreds of thousands of lines of code, I know that the statistical probability of these lines of code forming themselves as a base 4 code then aligning themselves in exactly the proper order to form a life form is essentially null. I also know that modern science has disproved and teaches that spontaneous generation is impossible on one page, then on another says it happened in Darwins magical muddy pond. I also know that DNA evolves but that can not evolve until existing.

Why exactly do you reject God creating life, but accept that God created the Universe?

I do not accept god created the universe whatever you imagine god to be. Why don't you admit you are agnostic and don't know anything about who created the universe, instead you take the easy road out and believe in God, which God? The Jewish God, the Christian God , the Muslim God, etc. Which God do you believe in?

1. I have never said that I believe that God created the Universe...…………
2. I am a Christian and Jesus is with me, always, unless Jesus is busy and he ask his Father to hang with me.
3. No human, of any religion or atheist knows where the Universe came from or even what it is.
4. DNA is a complicated code that did not form itself in Darwin's mythical pond out of nothing because nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code. Thus God is a scientific need, unless you believe that nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code.
5. Nothing does not have the ability to write...………………….Prove otherwise

PS. The densest hard drive material known to man is DNA. It was created by a master creator and there is nothing you can do about it. Have fun trying

A DNA Hard Drive Has Been Built That Can Store Data For 1 MILLION Years

Your future DNA hard drive will use enzymes - SynBioBeta

1. I have never said that I believe that God created the Universe...…………
True you never said that , but you said I did and I did not.

2. I am a Christian and Jesus is with me, always, unless Jesus is busy and he ask his Father to hang with me.

Funny Jesus was never busy when he was my best friend, what is the name of your jewish God?

3. No human, of any religion or atheist knows where the Universe came from or even what it is.

True, but you believe God created everything, in Genesis 1 it says God created the heavens and the earth...….
if you believe in Jesus and his father then you must believe in the Bible.

4. DNA is a complicated code that did not form itself in Darwin's mythical pond out of nothing because nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code. Thus God is a scientific need, unless you believe that nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code.
5. Nothing does not have the ability to write...………………….Prove otherwise

DNA evolved and continues to evolve and actually its mutates to cause cancer, disease, genetic conditions and diseases, and old age.

How does DNA damage contribute to Ageing?
The DNA damage theory of aging proposes that aging is a consequence of unrepaired accumulation of naturally occurring DNA damages. ... Nuclear DNA damage can contribute to aging either indirectly (by increasing apoptosis or cellular senescence) or directly (by increasing cell dysfunction).
DNA damage theory of aging - Wikipedia

DNA damage theory of aging - Wikipedia

I guess its not as strong as you thought it was.
I never said that God created everything, I said that complicated matter building and replicating code can not assemble itself out of nothing, because only intelligence can produce code, as such a coder, programmer or creator commonly referred to as God is a scientific requirement, that is typically referred to as a spiritual being, but as said is actually quite scientific.

DNA caused everything you are looking at. Old age is part of the DNA code, the parent organisms die after creating superior to the parent offspring. If GM could create a Corvette that would mate with other sexy Corvettes that would be faster and more fuel efficient and sexier than the parent Vetts they would...………………. This is exactly what evolution does, yes evolution is real and like the Vette did not build itself

Example...……………… Me! Though I opted for a Camaro, V8 5L Coupe top speed 126mph

So God is chemical reactions.
 
If God is all powerful, all knowing, and an all loving God, then why didn't he create us to be perfect?

If God is all powerful and can do all things, surely he would be able to create a perfect being who has all power, all knowledge, and is a perfectly loving being. To say that he cannot create such a being is to admit that God is not all powerful.

If God is all knowing surely he has the knowledge to create a perfect being and to give that perfect being a perfect knowledge.

If God is an all loving being who loves his creations then he would surely want the best for his creations. He would want his creations to be perfect. Thus he would create us to be perfect. Even in a world or universe where free will exists, if God created us to be perfect, then we with our perfect knowledge could surely reason out that we should choose good over evil always and never make a bad decision. We would be created with a heart filled with love for our fellow beings and our own creations. God would spare us the evil we experience in this world as we would have started out from creation as perfect beings never to commit any act that is contrary to what is right and good.

So why didn't God simply create us to be perfect?
If God is all powerful, all knowing, and an all loving God, then why didn't he create us to be perfect?

We were created perfect.

But we chose to die and have free will and the decay of time was inserted.

It seems to me that if a person was created perfect, he/she would not need to choose to die because they have already reached their potential. I believe that they would already have free will.
 
If God is all powerful, all knowing, and an all loving God, then why didn't he create us to be perfect?

If God is all powerful and can do all things, surely he would be able to create a perfect being who has all power, all knowledge, and is a perfectly loving being. To say that he cannot create such a being is to admit that God is not all powerful.

If God is all knowing surely he has the knowledge to create a perfect being and to give that perfect being a perfect knowledge.

If God is an all loving being who loves his creations then he would surely want the best for his creations. He would want his creations to be perfect. Thus he would create us to be perfect. Even in a world or universe where free will exists, if God created us to be perfect, then we with our perfect knowledge could surely reason out that we should choose good over evil always and never make a bad decision. We would be created with a heart filled with love for our fellow beings and our own creations. God would spare us the evil we experience in this world as we would have started out from creation as perfect beings never to commit any act that is contrary to what is right and good.

So why didn't God simply create us to be perfect?

Because perfection is not a standard based in human reality. It's philosophical.

Are you suggesting that God doesn't have the power, or know how to make us perfect? Is it impossible for God to do this?

All I know is I can't define nor measure perfection, can you? I've never seen perfection with my own eyes just as I've also never seen this god person, so I have no basis for referencing perfection. You could be describing the habits of Disney characters and I would likely give you a similar answer.

I can however read about God and pick up the concept that he created the heavens and the earth, created man and gave him commandment to be perfect even and He is. I read about all his powers and knowledge and love that he has and compare it to myself. I then wonder if God's purpose is that we become one with him even as He and Jesus are one, why didn't he simply create us that way from the beginning. Why the earth life with all its trials and hardships when He simply could have accomplished his design when he created us instead of putting us through the hardships, sufferings, and death of this life? I don't know that I need to perfectly understand or measure perfection to know that I lack it.
 
If God is all powerful, all knowing, and an all loving God, then why didn't he create us to be perfect?

If God is all powerful and can do all things, surely he would be able to create a perfect being who has all power, all knowledge, and is a perfectly loving being. To say that he cannot create such a being is to admit that God is not all powerful.

If God is all knowing surely he has the knowledge to create a perfect being and to give that perfect being a perfect knowledge.

If God is an all loving being who loves his creations then he would surely want the best for his creations. He would want his creations to be perfect. Thus he would create us to be perfect. Even in a world or universe where free will exists, if God created us to be perfect, then we with our perfect knowledge could surely reason out that we should choose good over evil always and never make a bad decision. We would be created with a heart filled with love for our fellow beings and our own creations. God would spare us the evil we experience in this world as we would have started out from creation as perfect beings never to commit any act that is contrary to what is right and good.

So why didn't God simply create us to be perfect?
If God is all powerful, all knowing, and an all loving God, then why didn't he create us to be perfect?

We were created perfect.

But we chose to die and have free will and the decay of time was inserted.
obviously we were not created perfect if we became imperfect
if ''god'' [ hahahah ] gave us free will, that means he created a flaw
If you consider the choice of having free will being a flaw there’s nothing more I can say.
Free will is not perfection.

God did not create something perfect. He created something good. He walked with His creation; i.e., He had fellowship with His creation. That's what He created.

But does God have the power and knowledge to create us perfect and avoid putting us through this earth life with all its heartache, despair, pain, suffering, and death?
 
If God is all powerful, all knowing, and an all loving God, then why didn't he create us to be perfect?

If God is all powerful and can do all things, surely he would be able to create a perfect being who has all power, all knowledge, and is a perfectly loving being. To say that he cannot create such a being is to admit that God is not all powerful.

If God is all knowing surely he has the knowledge to create a perfect being and to give that perfect being a perfect knowledge.

If God is an all loving being who loves his creations then he would surely want the best for his creations. He would want his creations to be perfect. Thus he would create us to be perfect. Even in a world or universe where free will exists, if God created us to be perfect, then we with our perfect knowledge could surely reason out that we should choose good over evil always and never make a bad decision. We would be created with a heart filled with love for our fellow beings and our own creations. God would spare us the evil we experience in this world as we would have started out from creation as perfect beings never to commit any act that is contrary to what is right and good.

So why didn't God simply create us to be perfect?

Because "God is all powerful, all knowing, and an all loving God" as you say and he knows a thing or two about creating universes that you dont.
Sorry humans dont meet your specs. Maybe you should create some perfect ones and then we can compare?

You are right that I don't have the knowledge of God and that he would know much more than I do. Don't you think that is why I am asking the question? Perhaps someone else might have good answers.
 
If God is all powerful, all knowing, and an all loving God, then why didn't he create us to be perfect?

If God is all powerful and can do all things, surely he would be able to create a perfect being who has all power, all knowledge, and is a perfectly loving being. To say that he cannot create such a being is to admit that God is not all powerful.

If God is all knowing surely he has the knowledge to create a perfect being and to give that perfect being a perfect knowledge.

If God is an all loving being who loves his creations then he would surely want the best for his creations. He would want his creations to be perfect. Thus he would create us to be perfect. Even in a world or universe where free will exists, if God created us to be perfect, then we with our perfect knowledge could surely reason out that we should choose good over evil always and never make a bad decision. We would be created with a heart filled with love for our fellow beings and our own creations. God would spare us the evil we experience in this world as we would have started out from creation as perfect beings never to commit any act that is contrary to what is right and good.

So why didn't God simply create us to be perfect?



I don't know, why does a caterpillar have to crawl on the ground before it becomes a butterfly? Do you think the caterpillar is aware that one day it will be a butterfly? or do you think that it only knows that it's life sucks crawling on the ground?
There is a belief out there, that this life is only the begining of life before we move on to the next thing. If that is the case, why would god make us perfect in a physical world where everything around us, including ourselves is temporary?

You are telling me that that is just the way things are. I am asking "Why?" if God had the means to avoid all the pain, suffering, and death.
 
Think less know more.

The simplest life forms DNA has hundreds of thousands of lines of code, I know that the statistical probability of these lines of code forming themselves as a base 4 code then aligning themselves in exactly the proper order to form a life form is essentially null. I also know that modern science has disproved and teaches that spontaneous generation is impossible on one page, then on another says it happened in Darwins magical muddy pond. I also know that DNA evolves but that can not evolve until existing.

Why exactly do you reject God creating life, but accept that God created the Universe?

I do not accept god created the universe whatever you imagine god to be. Why don't you admit you are agnostic and don't know anything about who created the universe, instead you take the easy road out and believe in God, which God? The Jewish God, the Christian God , the Muslim God, etc. Which God do you believe in?

1. I have never said that I believe that God created the Universe...…………
2. I am a Christian and Jesus is with me, always, unless Jesus is busy and he ask his Father to hang with me.
3. No human, of any religion or atheist knows where the Universe came from or even what it is.
4. DNA is a complicated code that did not form itself in Darwin's mythical pond out of nothing because nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code. Thus God is a scientific need, unless you believe that nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code.
5. Nothing does not have the ability to write...………………….Prove otherwise

PS. The densest hard drive material known to man is DNA. It was created by a master creator and there is nothing you can do about it. Have fun trying

A DNA Hard Drive Has Been Built That Can Store Data For 1 MILLION Years

Your future DNA hard drive will use enzymes - SynBioBeta

1. I have never said that I believe that God created the Universe...…………
True you never said that , but you said I did and I did not.

2. I am a Christian and Jesus is with me, always, unless Jesus is busy and he ask his Father to hang with me.

Funny Jesus was never busy when he was my best friend, what is the name of your jewish God?

3. No human, of any religion or atheist knows where the Universe came from or even what it is.

True, but you believe God created everything, in Genesis 1 it says God created the heavens and the earth...….
if you believe in Jesus and his father then you must believe in the Bible.

4. DNA is a complicated code that did not form itself in Darwin's mythical pond out of nothing because nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code. Thus God is a scientific need, unless you believe that nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code.
5. Nothing does not have the ability to write...………………….Prove otherwise

DNA evolved and continues to evolve and actually its mutates to cause cancer, disease, genetic conditions and diseases, and old age.

How does DNA damage contribute to Ageing?
The DNA damage theory of aging proposes that aging is a consequence of unrepaired accumulation of naturally occurring DNA damages. ... Nuclear DNA damage can contribute to aging either indirectly (by increasing apoptosis or cellular senescence) or directly (by increasing cell dysfunction).
DNA damage theory of aging - Wikipedia

DNA damage theory of aging - Wikipedia

I guess its not as strong as you thought it was.
I never said that God created everything, I said that complicated matter building and replicating code can not assemble itself out of nothing, because only intelligence can produce code, as such a coder, programmer or creator commonly referred to as God is a scientific requirement, that is typically referred to as a spiritual being, but as said is actually quite scientific.

DNA caused everything you are looking at. Old age is part of the DNA code, the parent organisms die after creating superior to the parent offspring. If GM could create a Corvette that would mate with other sexy Corvettes that would be faster and more fuel efficient and sexier than the parent Vetts they would...………………. This is exactly what evolution does, yes evolution is real and like the Vette did not build itself

Example...……………… Me! Though I opted for a Camaro, V8 5L Coupe top speed 126mph

So God is chemical reactions.

God played with molecules, forming codes to form other molecules and you can't either prove or disprove otherwise. (have fun trying) (really) (makes life interesting) (you will give up or die trying)

Unless you can demonstrate how molecular code (me) capable of building the computer that I am using sprang out of the mud.

Chemist frequently cause chemical reactions. You may add chemist to coder, programmer or creator if you so choose because we are the result of molecular chemical reactions initiated by a type of computer code that actually uses electricity to transmit thoughts in the brain as does the machine you are looking at. Thus you might want to add in electrician.

Or just the all purpose label God.

the-bill-gates-guide-to-success-13-powerful-quotes-by-the-founder-of-microsoft-3-638.jpg
 
If God is all powerful, all knowing, and an all loving God, then why didn't he create us to be perfect?

If God is all powerful and can do all things, surely he would be able to create a perfect being who has all power, all knowledge, and is a perfectly loving being. To say that he cannot create such a being is to admit that God is not all powerful.

If God is all knowing surely he has the knowledge to create a perfect being and to give that perfect being a perfect knowledge.

If God is an all loving being who loves his creations then he would surely want the best for his creations. He would want his creations to be perfect. Thus he would create us to be perfect. Even in a world or universe where free will exists, if God created us to be perfect, then we with our perfect knowledge could surely reason out that we should choose good over evil always and never make a bad decision. We would be created with a heart filled with love for our fellow beings and our own creations. God would spare us the evil we experience in this world as we would have started out from creation as perfect beings never to commit any act that is contrary to what is right and good.

So why didn't God simply create us to be perfect?
Suffer the little children... Abortion is an abomination. Yeah, ok. Perhaps, and then IF the poor kid had lived, it would have been born with a heart defect, or without most of its brain, gotten cancer or been beaten to death by a relative. I don't know anymore which is worse, gods will or randomness of men's laws.

If man had been created perfect, would not all of this unecessary pain, suffering, and death been avoided?
 
If God is all powerful, all knowing, and an all loving God, then why didn't he create us to be perfect?

If God is all powerful and can do all things, surely he would be able to create a perfect being who has all power, all knowledge, and is a perfectly loving being. To say that he cannot create such a being is to admit that God is not all powerful.

If God is all knowing surely he has the knowledge to create a perfect being and to give that perfect being a perfect knowledge.

If God is an all loving being who loves his creations then he would surely want the best for his creations. He would want his creations to be perfect. Thus he would create us to be perfect. Even in a world or universe where free will exists, if God created us to be perfect, then we with our perfect knowledge could surely reason out that we should choose good over evil always and never make a bad decision. We would be created with a heart filled with love for our fellow beings and our own creations. God would spare us the evil we experience in this world as we would have started out from creation as perfect beings never to commit any act that is contrary to what is right and good.

So why didn't God simply create us to be perfect?



I don't know, why does a caterpillar have to crawl on the ground before it becomes a butterfly? Do you think the caterpillar is aware that one day it will be a butterfly? or do you think that it only knows that it's life sucks crawling on the ground?
There is a belief out there, that this life is only the begining of life before we move on to the next thing. If that is the case, why would god make us perfect in a physical world where everything around us, including ourselves is temporary?
Why would he make the temporary world at all, then? You can see the absurd, convoluted positions you have to take to explain or justify the absurd idea of an all powerful god.
 
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I do not accept god created the universe whatever you imagine god to be. Why don't you admit you are agnostic and don't know anything about who created the universe, instead you take the easy road out and believe in God, which God? The Jewish God, the Christian God , the Muslim God, etc. Which God do you believe in?

1. I have never said that I believe that God created the Universe...…………
2. I am a Christian and Jesus is with me, always, unless Jesus is busy and he ask his Father to hang with me.
3. No human, of any religion or atheist knows where the Universe came from or even what it is.
4. DNA is a complicated code that did not form itself in Darwin's mythical pond out of nothing because nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code. Thus God is a scientific need, unless you believe that nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code.
5. Nothing does not have the ability to write...………………….Prove otherwise

PS. The densest hard drive material known to man is DNA. It was created by a master creator and there is nothing you can do about it. Have fun trying

A DNA Hard Drive Has Been Built That Can Store Data For 1 MILLION Years

Your future DNA hard drive will use enzymes - SynBioBeta

1. I have never said that I believe that God created the Universe...…………
True you never said that , but you said I did and I did not.

2. I am a Christian and Jesus is with me, always, unless Jesus is busy and he ask his Father to hang with me.

Funny Jesus was never busy when he was my best friend, what is the name of your jewish God?

3. No human, of any religion or atheist knows where the Universe came from or even what it is.

True, but you believe God created everything, in Genesis 1 it says God created the heavens and the earth...….
if you believe in Jesus and his father then you must believe in the Bible.

4. DNA is a complicated code that did not form itself in Darwin's mythical pond out of nothing because nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code. Thus God is a scientific need, unless you believe that nothing decided to write complicated matter assembling code.
5. Nothing does not have the ability to write...………………….Prove otherwise

DNA evolved and continues to evolve and actually its mutates to cause cancer, disease, genetic conditions and diseases, and old age.

How does DNA damage contribute to Ageing?
The DNA damage theory of aging proposes that aging is a consequence of unrepaired accumulation of naturally occurring DNA damages. ... Nuclear DNA damage can contribute to aging either indirectly (by increasing apoptosis or cellular senescence) or directly (by increasing cell dysfunction).
DNA damage theory of aging - Wikipedia

DNA damage theory of aging - Wikipedia

I guess its not as strong as you thought it was.
I never said that God created everything, I said that complicated matter building and replicating code can not assemble itself out of nothing, because only intelligence can produce code, as such a coder, programmer or creator commonly referred to as God is a scientific requirement, that is typically referred to as a spiritual being, but as said is actually quite scientific.

DNA caused everything you are looking at. Old age is part of the DNA code, the parent organisms die after creating superior to the parent offspring. If GM could create a Corvette that would mate with other sexy Corvettes that would be faster and more fuel efficient and sexier than the parent Vetts they would...………………. This is exactly what evolution does, yes evolution is real and like the Vette did not build itself

Example...……………… Me! Though I opted for a Camaro, V8 5L Coupe top speed 126mph

So God is chemical reactions.

God played with molecules, forming codes to form other molecules and you can't either prove or disprove otherwise. (have fun trying) (really) (makes life interesting) (you will give up or die trying)

Unless you can demonstrate how molecular code (me) capable of building the computer that I am using sprang out of the mud.

Chemist frequently cause chemical reactions. You may add chemist to coder, programmer or creator if you so choose because we are the result of molecular chemical reactions initiated by a type of computer code that actually uses electricity to transmit thoughts in the brain as does the machine you are looking at. Thus you might want to add in electrician.

Or just the all purpose label God.

the-bill-gates-guide-to-success-13-powerful-quotes-by-the-founder-of-microsoft-3-638.jpg
Here I thought God was all knowing. ……
So Gates is a God now. I love my windows but still......
 
If God is all powerful, all knowing, and an all loving God, then why didn't he create us to be perfect?

If God is all powerful and can do all things, surely he would be able to create a perfect being who has all power, all knowledge, and is a perfectly loving being. To say that he cannot create such a being is to admit that God is not all powerful.

If God is all knowing surely he has the knowledge to create a perfect being and to give that perfect being a perfect knowledge.

If God is an all loving being who loves his creations then he would surely want the best for his creations. He would want his creations to be perfect. Thus he would create us to be perfect. Even in a world or universe where free will exists, if God created us to be perfect, then we with our perfect knowledge could surely reason out that we should choose good over evil always and never make a bad decision. We would be created with a heart filled with love for our fellow beings and our own creations. God would spare us the evil we experience in this world as we would have started out from creation as perfect beings never to commit any act that is contrary to what is right and good.

So why didn't God simply create us to be perfect?
Suffer the little children... Abortion is an abomination. Yeah, ok. Perhaps, and then IF the poor kid had lived, it would have been born with a heart defect, or without most of its brain, gotten cancer or been beaten to death by a relative. I don't know anymore which is worse, gods will or randomness of men's laws.

If man had been created perfect, would not all of this unecessary pain, suffering, and death been avoided?
If there was any prayer I ever asked: please do something GOOD unequivocally undeniably. Anything. I want to believe. Instead of this middling fiddly maybe sorta fiddly stuff that's a matter of opinion that may have happened or not recently or 2000 years ago stuff. I like the idea of a god. But instead, I see a uncaring almost sadistic universe that follows murphy's law. A undesirable outcome 99% will randomly be the result. Gods will? Hardly.
 

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