I'm Muslim, and I hate terrorism

[JakeStarkey]

The Irish Ram and Emily are going to go head to head.

Unsubscribe. I like them both, but I will merely go into a glaze.

Have fun, ladies.

 

[Indofred]

What is most interestimg to me is, a thread condemning terrorists is being used as a tool to spread hate.

Haters gotta hate......it's like a drug.......

I find that a little odd but I don't hate anyone so I have no real frame of reference.
I always assume the hater is transferring self hate onto others in some pointless attempt to love him/herself.

Maybe they're gay and don't feel they can come out of the closet or whatever.
Come on haters; take a look at yourself and solve your own Inadequacy, not hate people you don't even know.

 

[emilynghiem]

Yep. because I understand my Bible. Leviticus puts Jews under the Law. Christ put those that follow Him under a new covenant. I am not under the Law. So I follow the teachings of Christ. A religion that does not tell us to kill everyone that is not Christian.

Dear IrishRam: the military strategies, battlecries, and calls for killing attributed to Mohammad were during wartime. This is not to be taken out of context and applied to civilians during peacetime. That is why you will see it explained that anyone who kills innocent civilians is under judgment.

I think what you may be reacting to with Sunni is that he is being a hypocrite if he thinks he is not part of the problem of spreading hatred here. He is not helping at all with his attitude, especially blaming others for hypocrisy.

This is really what causes conflict and war to continue, yet he "claims" to hate terrorism.

It is not Islam that is the problem here, but Sunni's lack of faith in how justice is established through Christ by accepting responsibility for the laws ourselves, where we rebuke and correct one another out of love, and in this way, form agreements to establish truth.

This is supposed to be taught in Christianity, but not many practice it.
And the same Christian scriptures (Matthew 18:15-20) are equally supposed to be in Islam, but that is rarely taught either. This would also perfect the democratic process or due process under Constitutional laws, but that is not being practiced or protected either.

So it's the hypocrisy that is the problem.
Not any of these systems themselves, but how we don't teach or enforce them
consistently. If we did, we wouldn't have the problems we are seeing now.

If Islam is taught as rejecting Christianity, that rejection of Christ is the problem.
the Muslims I know teach Islam as including Christianity, as well as respecting natural and Constitutional laws as given by God. the way the Head of CAIR stated it, many of the Muslim followers are the ones in need of reform; and if they followed what Mohammad actually taught, we wouldn't have these issues.

So that is where I do recommend that it be established and taught more clearly that since Christian laws and Constitutional principles are both given by God, these are included in Islam. Without those to check and balance how other religions are practiced and taught, then not only Islam but other religions also suffer from imbalances and abuses.

When practiced consistently, any religion is compatible with Christian and Constitutional laws.
If our friend Sunni is taking parts of Islam out of context with the rest of Scripture, he is HARDLY in any position to complain if you or others do the same, taking parts out of context.

Too bad he cannot see he is doing this, and blames others instead!

 

[The Irish Ram]

What is most interestimg to me is, a thread condemning terrorists is being used as a tool to spread hate.

Haters gotta hate......it's like a drug.......

Share your love of the Jews with us again Sunni.......

 

[yidnar]

(CNN) -- I'm an American-Muslim and I despise Islamic terrorists. In fact, despise is not even a strong enough word to convey my true feelings about those who kill innocent people in the name of Islam. I hate them with every fiber of my being.

I'm not going to tell you, "Islam is a religion of peace." Nor will I tell you that Islam is a religion of violence. What I will say is that Islam is a religion that, like Christianity and Judaism, is intended to bring you closer to God. And sadly we have seen people use the name of each of these Abrahamic faiths to wage and justify violence.

The unique problem for Muslims is that our faith is being increasingly defined by the actions of a tiny group of morally bankrupt terrorists. Just to be clear: The people who commit violence in the name of Islam are not Muslims, they are murderers. Their true religion is hatred and inhumanity.

The only people terrorists speak for are themselves and the others involved in their despicable plot. They do not represent me, my family or any other Muslim I know. And believe me, I know a lot of Muslims.

Read more at the link.
I'm a Muslim, and I hate terrorism - CNN.com

I don't believe you.

 

[emilynghiem]

I've always felt that mainstream Muslims on the whole did very little in terms of speaking out against these acts of terror. Thanks Sunni Man there is now soup for you!

Muslims have always been speaking out against these types of domestic terrorists attacks but the media just ignored us.

This is the first time the main stream media has given American muslims a chance to voice their condemnation of these types of events. ..

I credit the Uncle for setting the stage, when he made public statements
SHARING responsibility for asking forgiveness:

"Dzhokhar, If you're alive, turn yourself in and ask for forgiveness from the victims [and] the injured," he said. "He put a shame on our family. He put a shame on the entire Chechnyan ethnicity. Turn yourself in."

He added that he hadn't been in touch with the family for several years but would not say why.

"I'm ready to kneel in front of them and ask their forgiveness," Tsarni said of the victims of his nephews' crime. "I respect this country; I love this country ... this country that gives everybody chance to be treated like human being."

SunniMan do you see the difference?

He speaks from a position of accepting responsibility HIMSELF, not just telling others what they need to do or change.

He is not asking his nephews to do what he didn't ALSO offer to do himself.

This is why he has credibility, while others here still question yours.

 

[emilynghiem]

You get what you give, Sunni.

When it bothers you enough, you will go through the trouble to change this scenario.
but as long as you are content to keep blaming others for how they react to you, then you will see this scenario repeat over and over. Half of the problem is coming from your side.

You change that, and voila, lo and behold, people start changing how they respond as well!

I think it's called the law of attraction.
also the abundance mentality vs. the scarcity mentality.

When you focus more on the positive, you attract the same.
So the power to change begins with you.

Sorry, but I don't believe in new age pop psychology. ..

???
NEW age???

the Golden Rule of Reciprocity is a universal law for human nature.
you get what you give
you reap what you sow
laws of karma, ie cause and effect

It's in every religion, including Islam.

"No one of you is a believer
until he desires for his brother
that which he desires
for himself. " -- Islam

Golden Rule - World Religion Day

You are FUNNY SunniMan.
I think I will call you FunniMan from now on.

You respond to terrorism with "hate", then you blame others
for responses that express "hate"

You claim to follow Islam, yet don't seem to recognize Christian rebuke according to Scripture that is supposed to be received and respected equally in Islam as "sent by God"

and now some of God's natural laws that are as old as old
you are writing off as "new age" pop psychology ????

FunniMan!

 

[Gracie]

Everybody is different. Each person has individual ways. Sunni is no different. I THINK I get where he is coming from now, whereas before, I was like..wtf?
You have to remember (general you, not a certain person *you* ), we are all complex and there is no way anyone can know the heart of another person on a message board.

I hope that made sense. I acknowledge that sometimes I do not express my thoughts well.

 

[emilynghiem]

Dear JakeStarkey and IrishRam:

http://www.usmessageboard.com/law-a...-a-sharia-compliant-state-62.html#post3921858

Please leave me out of your silliness.

Why won't you state you will live by the Constitution and its interpretation

Sunni Man believes in and the purpose of sharia law.

He would impose it on all Americans if he could do so.

I hope he does not support military activities against America, but his interests are not American.

Dear Jake: I was responding to YOUR points YOU brought up, which are not "silly" at all!

I agree with you that not just Muslim, but ALL religious organizations licensed or incorporated in the US SHOULD be required to uphold Constitutional principles of due process and protection of individual members as the Govt in order to prevent abuses of collective authority or influence. Corporations and nonprofits also, which are too often abused without equal check.

So where is the argument?

In your mind, because you are more afraid of making peace than of waging war?

you call other people "wussies," then you bow out over
two Christian women trying to make PEACE citing scriptures civilly as we should.

Too bad, Jake

you said you believe in the concepts of Restorative Justice
"but don't believe" they will ever happen.

Well this shows why, if you run away like this!

The believers like IrishRam and me stick it out, and work it out as we should.
what is wrong with that?

And you run off, afraid?
afraid of what? you are the one who is silly!
you and "FunniMan" both!

you don't want war, but when it comes to the WORK it takes to make PEACE
then you blame others as an excuse to run away. And what, go start some more verbal wars?
as if you are not going to take the same problems with you, wherever you go!

ppbbfftt!!
I guess I should laugh and consider this ironic and hilariously funny!

either that, or a sad statement on why
the world is in the shape that it is right now!

with "men" denouncing war but
running away at any sign of making peace

 

[depotoo]

Just as the Boston marathon bombing has united all Americans.

It has also united the American muslim community in common cause against domestic terrorism. ..

let me ask, if the bombers had only killed American Jews would you still be renouncing it?

 

[depotoo]

Dear JakeStarkey and IrishRam:

http://www.usmessageboard.com/law-a...-a-sharia-compliant-state-62.html#post3921858

Please leave me out of your silliness.

Why won't you state you will live by the Constitution and its interpretation

Sunni Man believes in and the purpose of sharia law.

He would impose it on all Americans if he could do so.

I hope he does not support military activities against America, but his interests are not American.

Dear Jake: I was responding to YOUR points YOU brought up, which are not "silly"

I agree with you that ALL religious organizations licensed or incorporated in the US SHOULD be required to uphold Constitutional principles of due process and protection of individual members as the Govt in order to prevent abuses of collective authority or influence.

So where is the argument?

In your mind, because you are more afraid of making peace than of waging war.

you call other wussies, then you bow out over
two Christian women trying to make PEACE citing scriptures as we should

Too bad, Jake

you said you believe in the concepts of Restorative Justice
"but don't believe" they will ever happen.

Well this shows why.

The believers like IrishRam and me stick it out, and work it out as we should.
what is wrong with that?

And you run off, afraid?
afraid of what? you are the one who is silly!
you and FunniMan both!

you don't want war, but when it comes to the WORK it takes to make PEACE
then you blame others as an excuse to run away.

I guess I should laugh and consider this ironic and hilariously funny!

Emily, do you understand there are those that will never under any circumstance turn toward peace? I don't care how much goodwill we put out, there is evil that will always resist for eternity.

Is it true some minds can be changed? Yes. Does it mean all minds can be changed? No.

 

[Sunni Man]

Just as the Boston marathon bombing has united all Americans.

It has also united the American muslim community in common cause against domestic terrorism. ..

let me ask, if the bombers had only killed American Jews would you still be renouncing it?

Yes

 

[depotoo]

Just as the Boston marathon bombing has united all Americans.

It has also united the American muslim community in common cause against domestic terrorism. ..

let me ask, if the bombers had only killed American Jews would you still be renouncing it?

Yes

thank you for that answer. I do wish it would extend to Israeli Jews as well. I understand that is for a different topic.

I do wish that you could see, if you are a true American that many of the laws of sharia are not compatible with the US COnstitution nor the Bill of Rights. Once again for another topic as I know you want to stay focused here.

 

[The Irish Ram]

(CNN) -- I'm an American-Muslim and I despise Islamic terrorists. In fact, despise is not even a strong enough word to convey my true feelings about those who kill innocent people in the name of Islam. I hate them with every fiber of my being.

I'm not going to tell you, "Islam is a religion of peace." Nor will I tell you that Islam is a religion of violence. What I will say is that Islam is a religion that, like Christianity and Judaism, is intended to bring you closer to God. And sadly we have seen people use the name of each of these Abrahamic faiths to wage and justify violence.

The unique problem for Muslims is that our faith is being increasingly defined by the actions of a tiny group of morally bankrupt terrorists. Just to be clear: The people who commit violence in the name of Islam are not Muslims, they are murderers. Their true religion is hatred and inhumanity.

The only people terrorists speak for are themselves and the others involved in their despicable plot. They do not represent me, my family or any other Muslim I know. And believe me, I know a lot of Muslims.

Read more at the link.
I'm a Muslim, and I hate terrorism - CNN.com

I don't believe you.

You must have read some of his other works!

Em, Sunni hates in his heart, but is too timid to take up the sword of Allah. But make no mistake about where He stands. He's as radical in his hatred for God's children as those who make bombs.
And remember where the God of Abraham stands, and what the Lion of Judah, our Lord, has in store for the Muslims, when they invade Israel the next time, in the name of Allah.

And Jesus told us to do the opposite of shut up. We are to proclaim His Good News. Paul never shut up. Neither should we. Nor are we to be lukewarm or politically correct about what is to come and why.

Eze 38:1 And the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,
Eze 38:2 Son of man, set thy face against Gog, the land of Magog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal, and prophesy against him,
Eze 38:3 And say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I [am] against thee, O Gog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal:
Eze 38:4 And I will turn thee back, and put hooks into thy jaws, and I will bring thee forth, and all thine army, horses and horsemen, all of them clothed with all sorts [of armour, even] a great company [with] bucklers and shields, all of them handling swords:
Eze 38:5 Persia, Ethiopia, and Libya with them; all of them with shield and helmet:
Eze 38:6 Gomer, and all his bands; the house of Togarmah of the north quarters, and all his bands: [and] many people with thee.

And we are called to set our face against them. The day of the passover lamb is over. Our Lord is coming back as a Lion, and we'll be right behind Him.



Sunni, the media is in love with the Mus brotherhood, and ridicules our ally, Israel. You've never had it better, and yet the Muslim truth still can't hide behind our newscasters.

Answer the question Sunni.............. what is the "moderate Muslim doctrine" concerning infidels, and the Jews?

 

[Sunni Man]

^^^ Please get a life........seriously. ..

 

[Gracie]

How can Sunni speak for all muslims, Irish? How can he honestly answer your question of what a moderate muslim doctrine is concerning infidels and Jews when he is just one person following that particular faith? That would be like asking ME, Gracie, what Christians views are concerning...whatever.

Wouldn't it?

 

[Gracie]

btw...I'm glad you stayed here, Irish. You're still my bud and have been for some years now.

 

[emilynghiem]

Dear Irish Ram:
1. I would say SunniMan is not following the whole of the law, since this would include Christian scripture and teachings.
2. He is also coming across as much a hypocrite, as Christians who say they follow civil laws and respect religious freedom under the Constitution but then push laws violating that; or people who say they are against bullying in schools, but root on politicians and parties for bullying each other in the media. he is about at the same level of hypocrisy he yells about.
3. As for Islamic scriptures being used to preach killing of infidels in religious wars
a. the context was during times of religious wars, so these are not for civilians in peacetime
b. Mohammad taught there was "no compulsion in religion" and included all people of the Book, all sent by God as part of the faith of believers, including Jewish Christian and Muslim
So you are right, that the correct interpretation is to respect one another as neighbors in Christ, that IS the true message for ALL believers under Scripture whether Christian or other
4. The problem is, where there is dispute over interpretation of Scripture, you and I know as Christians we are supposed to follow instructions as in Matthew 18:15-20 or in the Constitutional laws to present the evidence and charges directly to the person and allow for defenses to be heard and truth to be established.

But people who don't know or follow this, end up fighting politically to overrule each other. This is especially bad in countries which don't have a solid foundation in either Christian or Constitutional law, so the bullies end up dominating the peaceful people and taking over by force.

In Islam in the very last scriptures in Sura 109, instructions are given to respect each other's way civilly in case of unresolved dispute. The problem is, where people disagree, one group goes into PREVIOUS scriptures in the Quran to justify condemning infidels; while other people go into the interpretations and teaching of Mohammad OUTSIDE the Quran that interpret Sura 109 as "peaceful co-existence". So they disagree which has precedence. Since the LATER verses trump the earlier ones, but things INSIDE the Quran trump verses OUTSIDE.

So that is why making peace usually depends on invoking ADDITIONAL sources of support, such as Christian scriptures or Constitutional principles. That is why I prefer to see these recognized and taught as "sent by God" among all Muslim followers, so the Quran is never taken out of context with the other laws given by the same God.

To take the war cries (some of them being in visions or dreams and not actual instructions)
"out of context" is like taking military commands by US soldiers in wartime "out of context" and saying it's okay to practice that on civilians in society during peacetime. The Constitution makes it very clear about respecting due process and not having police or searches and seizures without following legal procedures. So these are two different contexts.

Mohammad was both a military leader fighting historic wars,
and a spiritual prophet preparing followers for peace. So these are two different contexts.

Where Jews, Christians and Muslims unite in Christ, in agreement on truth and what the laws mean and how to live by them, then we will not have these wars or threats of war.

I'm sorry Irish that our fellow "men" on here bowed out gracefully
and could not endure the work it takes to resolve things peacefully.

I respect and thank you for your convictions in seeing this through,
and will trust you will not compromise but will continue until all issues are resolved in full.

thank you for this
and maybe our "men" on here will learn not to be the "wussies"
they accuse others of being!

I have no ill will toward any Muslim, that doesn't mean I am to be ignorant of their teachings or their agenda for Israel, or to believe bullshit in an effort to be politically correct.

Christ never told me to kill children, or anyone else for that matter.
Sunni won't tell you what Mohammad and Sunni's father, Allah, say to do to those that don't follow Allah. Sunni knows the truth, he just doesn't want you to know it.

Sunni, do you just scratch out the parts of the Qur'an that tell you to mutilate and destroy non believers?
The Qur'an contains over 100 verses that call Muslims to war with nonbelievers for the sake of Islamic rule. Some are quite graphic, with commands to chop off heads and fingers and kill infidels wherever they may be hiding. Muslims who do not join the fight are called 'hypocrites' .

And,
Gracie, listen to what Sunni says, and then read what Sunni reads, to detect the truth. Then ask him for his "moderate" Islam stance on Jews. He is quite vocal here, on how his "fellow man" should be dealt with.
Then ask him if he believes what he reads:

Quran (4:76) - "Those who believe fight in the cause of Allah…"

Quran (4:89) - "They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them; and take no friends or helpers from their ranks."

Then ask Sunni if you can be his friend, you little renegade. Then, when he says sure, "we can be friends", you won't be fooled either.

Quran (4:95) - "Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) and receive no hurt, and those who strive and fight in the cause of Allah with their goods and their persons. Allah hath granted a grade higher to those who strive and fight with their goods and persons than to those who sit. Unto all (in Faith) Hath Allah promised good: But those who strive and fight Hath He distinguished above those who sit (at home) by a special reward,-"

SO, Praying for the death of non Muslims is good, but not as good as killing them yourself.
So Sunni is either not a good Muslim, or he is trying to get us to believe he's not like all those other Qur'an Muslims.
There is no other kind of Muslim.
Jesus Christ does not advocate killing or mutilating anybody. He wants us all to be friends, no exceptions.

yes I agree that Christ calls for Justice with Mercy and Peace for all humanity,
no anger or ill will or hatred, but forgiveness and healig, correction and restitution for peace.

I believe we will see this in our lifetime
thanks to people like you, so thank you Irish!

 

[Gracie]

It's all too....organized...for me. I'll just stay on my path and nod to passersby politely and yes, even give them a hand up out of ditch they may have fallen in and not ask questions. Shits too deep for me to understand and I won't pretend it isn't. I like being blind and ignorant on this stuff. I'll just follow my own heart. What theirs carries is on them. Not me.

 

[emilynghiem]

Emily, do you understand there are those that will never under any circumstance turn toward peace? I don't care how much goodwill we put out, there is evil that will always resist for eternity.

Is it true some minds can be changed? Yes. Does it mean all minds can be changed? No.

That is left to them when is the right time to change or not change.

Any opportunity to offer a better choice, is still better to offer.
If they don't take it, at least it was offered.

Not every vote is going to mean you win, but it is still important to vote.

Thanks for your concern and sharing on here.

I agree with Sunni that we will win this battle against terrorism,
and this incident will lead to uniting people in new ways.

So eventually even those who bowed out, will come around later.
We all want peace, but just don't all agree how exactly to get there from here!

Thanks and hope you enjoy the journey to get there
as much as the destination. Blessings to all!