Is defining what socialism really is all that tough?

[JimBowie1958]

View attachment 236307

Let me give you my understanding of what the word 'socialism' is used for, and maybe it will help us understand where we are each coming from.

1. When American conservatives talk about socialism, they mean any kind of government control or oversight. Conservatives in America are about the only group who uses the word this way.

2. In Nordic Model Socialism, as I was educated by some posters on this board last year, it is essentially capitalism with a heavy dose of government oversight and regulation. Capitalism under Nordic Model Socialism does not have as its sole purpose to make maximum profit, but to serve the interests of the people of a nation. This is my preferred system of economics and the 'lodestone', as Pence might say, for economic policy.

3. Fabian Socialism is the most commonly advocated form of socialism in industrialized countries, and I believe it requires the government to own the basic resources and heavy industry which the businesses purchase from and then make products for the consumer. This was the economic socialism pursued by the Labor party in the UK for decades until Blair sort of re-oriented the party.

4. Marxism is the hard-core socialist theory that is more philosophical ideology than economic theory. In it the government owned ALL means of production of just about everything and distributed these resources and products to people based on their needs instead of any sort of commodity barter or purchasing activity in a market. While the first three have operated with mixed success, Nordic Model though is the best performing economic system as yet implemented to include capitalism, Marxism is always a failure because it removes all motivation to engage in labor.

As we face an uncertain labor market in the future I think more and more nations will move toward Nordic Model Socialism because it not only makes people feel like we are all in this economic endeavor together to benefit each other, but it actually does work better than any other capitalist system when measured by average income per capita.

 

[danielpalos]

the right wing is economically clueless and economically Causeless.

we have a Command economy. Congress commands fiscal policy and the Fed commands monetary policy. Government is socialism. Government fixes the regulatory "goalposts" for Capitalism.

 

[eagle1462010]

the right wing is economically clueless and economically Causeless.

we have a Command economy. Congress commands fiscal policy and the Fed commands monetary policy. Government is socialism. Government fixes the regulatory "goalposts" for Capitalism.

ummm...........who da fuck stole my wallet.............keep an eye on this guy.

 

[Oddball]

View attachment 236307

Let me give you my understanding of what the word 'socialism' is used for, and maybe it will help us understand where we are each coming from.

1. When American conservatives talk about socialism, they mean any kind of government control or oversight. Conservatives in America are about the only group who uses the word this way.

2. In Nordic Model Socialism, as I was educated by some posters on this board last year, it is essentially capitalism with a heavy dose of government oversight and regulation. Capitalism under Nordic Model Socialism does not have as its sole purpose to make maximum profit, but to serve the interests of the people of a nation. This is my preferred system of economics and the 'lodestone', as Pence might say, for economic policy.

3. Fabian Socialism is the most commonly advocated form of socialism in industrialized countries, and I believe it requires the government to own the basic resources and heavy industry which the businesses purchase from and then make products for the consumer. This was the economic socialism pursued by the Labor party in the UK for decades until Blair sort of re-oriented the party.

4. Marxism is the hard-core socialist theory that is more philosophical ideology than economic theory. In it the government owned ALL means of production of just about everything and distributed these resources and products to people based on their needs instead of any sort of commodity barter or purchasing activity in a market. While the first three have operated with mixed success, Nordic Model though is the best performing economic system as yet implemented to include capitalism, Marxism is always a failure because it removes all motivation to engage in labor.

As we face an uncertain labor market in the future I think more and more nations will move toward Nordic Model Socialism because it not only makes people feel like we are all in this economic endeavor together to benefit each other, but it actually does work better than any other capitalist system when measured by average income per capita.

I understand all of those and disagree with your assessment that the Nordic model is workable.

First of all, the most populace of those countries has the population approximately that of Minnesota...The most "successful" -Norway- has the nationalized North Sea oil patch to support its gigantic welfare state.....Sweden has run out of things to tax and its politicians have run out of free shit to bribe the masses with, in order to get elected.

Laissez-faire brough Murica from near bankruptcy to its position as the globe's economic superpower in about a century....It's the ONLY way out now.

 

[danielpalos]

the right wing is economically clueless and economically Causeless.

we have a Command economy. Congress commands fiscal policy and the Fed commands monetary policy. Government is socialism. Government fixes the regulatory "goalposts" for Capitalism.

ummm...........who da fuck stole my wallet.............keep an eye on this guy.

only lousy capitalists lose money on public policies.

 

[Ame®icano]

“You Conservatives don’t even know what socialism is.

 

[eagle1462010]

the right wing is economically clueless and economically Causeless.

we have a Command economy. Congress commands fiscal policy and the Fed commands monetary policy. Government is socialism. Government fixes the regulatory "goalposts" for Capitalism.

ummm...........who da fuck stole my wallet.............keep an eye on this guy.

only lousy capitalists lose money on public policies.

Give me back my dang wallet........you socialist thief............

 

[Ame®icano]

.
It takes a special class of morons to believe that Venezuela is Utopia.

Those are "weapon grade" morons.

We should send them to Venezuela.

 

[danielpalos]

the right wing is economically clueless and economically Causeless.

we have a Command economy. Congress commands fiscal policy and the Fed commands monetary policy. Government is socialism. Government fixes the regulatory "goalposts" for Capitalism.

ummm...........who da fuck stole my wallet.............keep an eye on this guy.

only lousy capitalists lose money on public policies.

Give me back my dang wallet........you socialist thief............

national capitalists make money on public policies not lose money; only national socialists, do that.

 

[eagle1462010]

the right wing is economically clueless and economically Causeless.

we have a Command economy. Congress commands fiscal policy and the Fed commands monetary policy. Government is socialism. Government fixes the regulatory "goalposts" for Capitalism.

ummm...........who da fuck stole my wallet.............keep an eye on this guy.

only lousy capitalists lose money on public policies.

Give me back my dang wallet........you socialist thief............

national capitalists make money on public policies not lose money; only national socialists, do that.

You mean you promote stealing my money..........there fixed it for you.

 

[JimBowie1958]

I understand all of those and disagree with your assessment that the Nordic model is workable.

Not workable? When you look at the purchase parity average incomes, it is far more workable than what we have. Look at Iceland how well they handled the banking finance crisis or Finland Far better than the more capitalist countries of Europe like Germany or France. Compared to the Mediteranean sphere of the EU, capitalism there has been an unmitigated disaster.

American conservatives like to promote Venezuela as the epitome of socialism, but never bring up Greece or Argentina.

First of all, the most populace of those countries has the population approximately that of Minnesota...The most "successful" -Norway- has the nationalized North Sea oil patch to support its gigantic welfare state.....Sweden has run out of things to tax and its politicians have run out of free shit to bribe the masses with, in order to get elected.

Top 20 nations ranked by Nominal average incomes.

Iceland 61,787 90,662

Switzerland 62,283 88,159

Luxembourg 63,062 71,710

Norway 51,212 65,786

Denmark 51,466 65,674

Australia 49,126 61,620

United States 60,558 60,558

Ireland 47,653 53,112

Netherlands 52,877 52,705

Canada 47,622 50,033

Belgium 49,675 49,419

Austria 50,349 48,306

Sweden 42,393 47,783

New Zealand 40,043 46,917

Finland 42,964 46,772

United Kingdom 43,732 45,280

Germany 47,585 44,466

France 43,755 42,410

Israel 35,067 42,378

Japan 40,863 38,234

So, yeah, Norway has North Sea oil, but little Denmark has no huge natural resources, and yet performs almost as well as Norway does.

All the Nordic model nations are in the top 20 while many capitalist nations did not make the list at all. The worst, Finland, still did better than the UK, Germany orFrance and Japan.

The evidence suggests that Nordic model socialism works much better than capitalism on the average.

Laissez-faire brough Murica from near bankruptcy to its position as the globe's economic superpower in about a century....It's the ONLY way out now.

Lol, no, I disagree. Androids with Strong AI are coming out soon, and costs are estimated at around $2k per android.

As labor markets collapse slowly over the course of ten to twenty years, Nordic Model Socialism will stand out as the most humane and successful economic system by far as it does already.

 

[JimBowie1958]

national capitalists make money on public policies not lose money; only national socialists, do that.

You mean you promote stealing my money..........there fixed it for you.

So why do so few conservatives in America advocate ending corporate welfare as much as they do ending welfare for people?

 

[eagle1462010]

national capitalists make money on public policies not lose money; only national socialists, do that.

You mean you promote stealing my money..........there fixed it for you.

So why do so few conservatives in America advocate ending corporate welfare as much as they do ending welfare for people?

LOL

I'd end subsidies across the board...............I'm not in office..........

LOL

They should stand or fall on their own abilities...............tax payers shouldn't have to flip the bill on their winning or losing.

 

[Brain357]

“You Conservatives don’t even know what socialism is.”
That seems to be the common thing said among the LefTarded beggars these days....Have they created their own definitions?

so·cial·ism
/ˈsōSHəˌlizəm/
noun
noun: socialism

1. a political and economic theory of social organization that advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole.
   synonyms: leftism, welfarism; More
   radicalism, progressivism, social democracy;y
   communism, Marxism, labor movement
   "my appreciation for certain aspects of socialism does not mean I'm a socialist"
   • policy or practice based on the political and economic theory of socialism.
     synonyms: leftism, welfarism; More
     radicalism, progressivism, social democracy;
     communism, Marxism, labor movement
     "my appreciation for certain aspects of socialism does not mean I'm a socialist"
   • (in Marxist theory) a transitional social state between the overthrow of capitalism and the realization of communism.

Sounds like deals like Foxconn. Yeah repubs are very socialist, stop kidding yourself.

 

[JimBowie1958]

national capitalists make money on public policies not lose money; only national socialists, do that.

You mean you promote stealing my money..........there fixed it for you.

So why do so few conservatives in America advocate ending corporate welfare as much as they do ending welfare for people?

LOL

I'd end subsidies across the board...............I'm not in office..........

LOL

They should stand or fall on their own abilities...............tax payers shouldn't have to flip the bill on their winning or losing.

I wasnt asking about YOU, but about American conservatives. There is a point to the question if you are interested, but seems that you are not.

You have your ideological view of Reality and you are sticking to it.

 

[Oddball]

So why do so few conservatives in America advocate ending corporate welfare as much as they do ending welfare for people?

I do...But I cased being a "conservative" ( whatever the hell that's supposed to mean anymore) a long time ago.

 

[eagle1462010]

national capitalists make money on public policies not lose money; only national socialists, do that.

You mean you promote stealing my money..........there fixed it for you.

So why do so few conservatives in America advocate ending corporate welfare as much as they do ending welfare for people?

LOL

I'd end subsidies across the board...............I'm not in office..........

LOL

They should stand or fall on their own abilities...............tax payers shouldn't have to flip the bill on their winning or losing.

I wasnt asking about YOU, but about American conservatives. There is a point to the question if you are interested, but seems that you are not.

You have your ideological view of Reality and you are sticking to it.

Career politicians have long ago stop caring what we think................they are there to serve themselves .......both sides.............unless you are living under a rock.

 

[danielpalos]

the right wing is economically clueless and economically Causeless.

we have a Command economy. Congress commands fiscal policy and the Fed commands monetary policy. Government is socialism. Government fixes the regulatory "goalposts" for Capitalism.

ummm...........who da fuck stole my wallet.............keep an eye on this guy.

only lousy capitalists lose money on public policies.

Give me back my dang wallet........you socialist thief............

national capitalists make money on public policies not lose money; only national socialists, do that.

You mean you promote stealing my money..........there fixed it for you.

the right wing is too lazy to even argue. Talk, is what they do best.

 

[DOTR]

If you can’t define it then you can’t object to it is their thinking.
Liberals believe the purpose of words is to hinder communication.

 

[danielpalos]

national capitalists make money on public policies not lose money; only national socialists, do that.

You mean you promote stealing my money..........there fixed it for you.

So why do so few conservatives in America advocate ending corporate welfare as much as they do ending welfare for people?

the right wing is about the Profit not the People.

 

[eagle1462010]

ummm...........who da fuck stole my wallet.............keep an eye on this guy.

only lousy capitalists lose money on public policies.

Give me back my dang wallet........you socialist thief............

national capitalists make money on public policies not lose money; only national socialists, do that.

You mean you promote stealing my money..........there fixed it for you.

the right wing is too lazy to even argue. Talk, is what they do best.

more bot talk...............change your programming to something funny.........we could use the laughs........now give me back my stinking wallet..................which is how socialism always goes.