Is it too late for the GOP to defeat Identity Politics?

[Avatar4321]

Avatar, do you have a better suggestion than what we have as a government today?

Don't tell us a theocracy under God's leaders, because you have told us that you would not follow King Benjamin.

Just what kind of government do you want.

First, I find it amazing that after having countless discussions about King Benjamin and his encouragement of individuals to minister to the needs of their neighbors, you are still mischaracterizing my position.

I might also point out K. Benjamin ruled over a kingdom not a theocracy.

Second, though it's completely irrelevant to the discussion at hand, I will answer your question. I want our Constitutional Republic restored. i am just sick and tired of the corruption in both parties and the fact that they continually act contrary to the wises of the people and to the people's detriment and would like us to someday elect good and honorable men who are actually going to work for this nations wellbeing rather than to protect their political positions and privileges.

 

[bendog]

The OP failed to note Mitt's campaign. It's over. Today we have Rick Perry questioning a state senator's birth and her decision to bear her own child out of wedlock. Just another "non-rebranding of the brand name."

 

[Sallow]

.

For a couple of generations now, the Democrats have been wildly successful in dividing Americans into groups (particularly ethnic & economic) and engaging in targeted marketing to those groups. Divide and conquer has been a brilliant strategy politically, and it has paid off handsomely. As a result, we are now a hyphenated-America, with each constituency placing its status above all else. The Democrats have kicked ass. We're divided as all hell, with each constituency screaming for its stuff.
Meanwhile, the GOP has assisted the Democrats in their endeavors in two ways: by doing little to counter that tactic, and by being terrifically lousy messengers.

The GOP message (at least as I see it) should be something like, "We don't believe in dividing America into little pieces. We believe that we are all Americans who deserve the same rights and liberties, no one more than the other, to chase our dreams and build our future. We believe that when we're divided we are weaker."

Instead, the lousier messengers have made the GOP easy pickins for the Dems, refusing to bend an inch on safety net issues, giving a strong impression that they want the abject elimination of ALL government services, painting a nice, big target on their backs.

So, is it too late for the GOP to convince the individual groups -- pretty much owned by the Dems -- that their way is better?

.

Yep.

These "constituencies" keep screaming for stuff like:

Freedom
Equality
Justice.

How dare they.

 

[Katzndogz]

Identity politics has gone too far in fracturing the nation to be defeated.

 

[bendog]

The reality is quite simple. young folks really don't want to be forced to buy a middle aged health plan. young folks really don't want to be burdened by the boomers (and their parents') debt. young folks really don't want to pay taxes to keep failed public schools open and let kids who just skate such off their tits.

But we have a gop that is hostile to young folks on social issues and is determined to not let women make reproductive choices and not let gay and lesbians get married. And lastly, and perhaps most fundametally for the latino vote, we have a gop with a core belief that govt has no role in solving social welfare issues. 11 miillon can't become ciitzens and for kids of the working poor seeking educatonal oportunities and helthcare - you're on your own jack, i got miine.

 

[Ava]

yes it's too late. The GOP has had it's ass kicked.

The problem is the percentage of uninformed voters.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Avatar, do you have a better suggestion than what we have as a government today?

Don't tell us a theocracy under God's leaders, because you have told us that you would not follow King Benjamin.

Just what kind of government do you want.

First, I find it amazing that after having countless discussions about King Benjamin and his encouragement of individuals to minister to the needs of their neighbors, you are still mischaracterizing my position.

I might also point out K. Benjamin ruled over a kingdom not a theocracy.

Second, though it's completely irrelevant to the discussion at hand, I will answer your question. I want our Constitutional Republic restored. i am just sick and tired of the corruption in both parties and the fact that they continually act contrary to the wises of the people and to the people's detriment and would like us to someday elect good and honorable men who are actually going to work for this nations wellbeing rather than to protect their political positions and privileges.

Your position is quite clear. You are mistaken if you believe King Benjamin was libertarian, since he commanded his people to assemble and follow his directions as King and Priest: he was autocratic. You would have obeyed his directives or been banished from the kingdom.

Your concept of the "Constitutional Republic" never existed except in your mind.

I agree that we should elect good and honorable men and women.

 

[whitehall]

Democrats are successful propagandists because the liberal media promotes the lies or obscures the truth. If the media ever turned on Obama and demanded justice the administration would be finished.

 

[dilloduck]

Democrats are successful propagandists because the liberal media promotes the lies or obscures the truth. If the media ever turned on Obama and demanded justice the administration would be finished.

I used to think that but I think the dogma is so deep that if the media even made an attempt at the truth, liberals would reject it as a conservative effort. We would have a whole lot of media outlets getting the FOX treatment.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

The GOP is just as guilty of special interest group liberalism as the democrats.

 

[Mac1958]

.

For a couple of generations now, the Democrats have been wildly successful in dividing Americans into groups (particularly ethnic & economic) and engaging in targeted marketing to those groups. Divide and conquer has been a brilliant strategy politically, and it has paid off handsomely. As a result, we are now a hyphenated-America, with each constituency placing its status above all else. The Democrats have kicked ass. We're divided as all hell, with each constituency screaming for its stuff.
Meanwhile, the GOP has assisted the Democrats in their endeavors in two ways: by doing little to counter that tactic, and by being terrifically lousy messengers.

The GOP message (at least as I see it) should be something like, "We don't believe in dividing America into little pieces. We believe that we are all Americans who deserve the same rights and liberties, no one more than the other, to chase our dreams and build our future. We believe that when we're divided we are weaker."

Instead, the lousier messengers have made the GOP easy pickins for the Dems, refusing to bend an inch on safety net issues, giving a strong impression that they want the abject elimination of ALL government services, painting a nice, big target on their backs.

So, is it too late for the GOP to convince the individual groups -- pretty much owned by the Dems -- that their way is better?

.

Yep.

These "constituencies" keep screaming for stuff like:

Freedom
Equality
Justice.

How dare they.

An absolutely perfect illustration of my point.

So these groups want precisely what any other American wants, we're all one, E Pluribus Unum. Yet you position me as the bad guy for pointing it out, and them as the victims, as if I'm somehow trying to stop them. The exact opposite of what I'm saying.

A brilliant strategy, it's worked well for you. I don't see how the GOP can combat this.

.

 

[Avatar4321]

.

For a couple of generations now, the Democrats have been wildly successful in dividing Americans into groups (particularly ethnic & economic) and engaging in targeted marketing to those groups. Divide and conquer has been a brilliant strategy politically, and it has paid off handsomely. As a result, we are now a hyphenated-America, with each constituency placing its status above all else. The Democrats have kicked ass. We're divided as all hell, with each constituency screaming for its stuff.
Meanwhile, the GOP has assisted the Democrats in their endeavors in two ways: by doing little to counter that tactic, and by being terrifically lousy messengers.

The GOP message (at least as I see it) should be something like, "We don't believe in dividing America into little pieces. We believe that we are all Americans who deserve the same rights and liberties, no one more than the other, to chase our dreams and build our future. We believe that when we're divided we are weaker."

Instead, the lousier messengers have made the GOP easy pickins for the Dems, refusing to bend an inch on safety net issues, giving a strong impression that they want the abject elimination of ALL government services, painting a nice, big target on their backs.

So, is it too late for the GOP to convince the individual groups -- pretty much owned by the Dems -- that their way is better?

.

Yep.

These "constituencies" keep screaming for stuff like:

Freedom
Equality
Justice.

How dare they.

An absolutely perfect illustration of my point.

So these groups want precisely what any other American wants, we're all one, E Pluribus Unum. Yet you position me as the bad guy for pointing it out, and them as the victims, as if I'm somehow trying to stop them. The exact opposite of what I'm saying.

A brilliant strategy, it's worked well for you. I don't see how the GOP can combat this.

.

Deception is a good tactic against the uninitiated. It loses it's fluster when you are aware of whats going on.

 

[Mac1958]

Yep.

These "constituencies" keep screaming for stuff like:

Freedom
Equality
Justice.

How dare they.

An absolutely perfect illustration of my point.

So these groups want precisely what any other American wants, we're all one, E Pluribus Unum. Yet you position me as the bad guy for pointing it out, and them as the victims, as if I'm somehow trying to stop them. The exact opposite of what I'm saying.

A brilliant strategy, it's worked well for you. I don't see how the GOP can combat this.

.

Deception is a good tactic against the uninitiated. It loses it's fluster when you are aware of whats going on.

And that goes back to the OP. How does the GOP deal with this? Playing the same game will not work, the Dems own Identity Politics. So wouldn't the GOP need to try the "we're all Americans with the same desires, don't let the other guys continue to divide/hyphenate us" approach?

.

 

[Avatar4321]

An absolutely perfect illustration of my point.

So these groups want precisely what any other American wants, we're all one, E Pluribus Unum. Yet you position me as the bad guy for pointing it out, and them as the victims, as if I'm somehow trying to stop them. The exact opposite of what I'm saying.

A brilliant strategy, it's worked well for you. I don't see how the GOP can combat this.

.

Deception is a good tactic against the uninitiated. It loses it's fluster when you are aware of whats going on.

And that goes back to the OP. How does the GOP deal with this? Playing the same game will not work, the Dems own Identity Politics. So wouldn't the GOP need to try the "we're all Americans with the same desires, don't let the other guys continue to divide/hyphenate us" approach?

.

Simple, we stop being afraid to speak the truth. We have charity for all and malice for none. We create a contrast between what Democrats say and what we say and do.

Of course, i have doubts that GOP leadership can do that.

 

[bendog]

An absolutely perfect illustration of my point.

So these groups want precisely what any other American wants, we're all one, E Pluribus Unum. Yet you position me as the bad guy for pointing it out, and them as the victims, as if I'm somehow trying to stop them. The exact opposite of what I'm saying.

A brilliant strategy, it's worked well for you. I don't see how the GOP can combat this.

.

Deception is a good tactic against the uninitiated. It loses it's fluster when you are aware of whats going on.

And that goes back to the OP. How does the GOP deal with this? Playing the same game will not work, the Dems own Identity Politics. So wouldn't the GOP need to try the "we're all Americans with the same desires, don't let the other guys continue to divide/hyphenate us" approach?

.

Yes, Mitt shoud have do so, but unfortunately he explicitly lumped in guys who worked for 55 years before taking social security as takers amongst the 47%. He also said latinos should self deport, women shouldn't get contraceptives via planned parenthood with govt support, gays and lesbians should not have equal civil rights (even though he thinks Modern Familiy is fab)

We have a party with two wings. Social issue conservatives whose desire is to tell other people that morality doesn't allow what they do to be done, so they must stop doing what they're doing. And fiscal libertarians, who it seems to me simply aim to defund any social program not benefitting the 1%. Other than that, we're doing GREAT!

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

The dems have perfected it and the Rs are in hot pursuit of it. Why would they give it up?

Well, that's the thing. The Dems own Identity Politics, and I don't see the GOP taking it away from them. So I'd think the better move would be to take it head-on and provide some contrast.

.

Or just wait for the dems to implode from all their bullshit. When people get tired of being the "poor" shit on subjects maybe they will wake up

 

[dilloduck]

The dems have perfected it and the Rs are in hot pursuit of it. Why would they give it up?

Well, that's the thing. The Dems own Identity Politics, and I don't see the GOP taking it away from them. So I'd think the better move would be to take it head-on and provide some contrast.

.

Or just wait for the dems to implode from all their bullshit. When people get tired of being the "poor" shit on subjects maybe they will wake up

The collateral damage caused by that implosion could be enormous.

 

[Sallow]

.

For a couple of generations now, the Democrats have been wildly successful in dividing Americans into groups (particularly ethnic & economic) and engaging in targeted marketing to those groups. Divide and conquer has been a brilliant strategy politically, and it has paid off handsomely. As a result, we are now a hyphenated-America, with each constituency placing its status above all else. The Democrats have kicked ass. We're divided as all hell, with each constituency screaming for its stuff.
Meanwhile, the GOP has assisted the Democrats in their endeavors in two ways: by doing little to counter that tactic, and by being terrifically lousy messengers.

The GOP message (at least as I see it) should be something like, "We don't believe in dividing America into little pieces. We believe that we are all Americans who deserve the same rights and liberties, no one more than the other, to chase our dreams and build our future. We believe that when we're divided we are weaker."

Instead, the lousier messengers have made the GOP easy pickins for the Dems, refusing to bend an inch on safety net issues, giving a strong impression that they want the abject elimination of ALL government services, painting a nice, big target on their backs.

So, is it too late for the GOP to convince the individual groups -- pretty much owned by the Dems -- that their way is better?

.

Yep.

These "constituencies" keep screaming for stuff like:

Freedom
Equality
Justice.

How dare they.

An absolutely perfect illustration of my point.

So these groups want precisely what any other American wants, we're all one, E Pluribus Unum. Yet you position me as the bad guy for pointing it out, and them as the victims, as if I'm somehow trying to stop them. The exact opposite of what I'm saying.

A brilliant strategy, it's worked well for you. I don't see how the GOP can combat this.

.

I didn't do anything you didn't do all by yourself.

You may want to ignore institutional racism and all that goes along with that, but rectifying that damage is still a work in progress.

One of the major problems with the GOP is that they think everything is just "Jim Dandy" or they completely deny or minimalize these things.

It's not working.

 

[dilloduck]

rectifying institutional racism by fucking innocent people around sucks.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Well, that's the thing. The Dems own Identity Politics, and I don't see the GOP taking it away from them. So I'd think the better move would be to take it head-on and provide some contrast.

.

Or just wait for the dems to implode from all their bullshit. When people get tired of being the "poor" shit on subjects maybe they will wake up

The collateral damage caused by that implosion could be enormous.

Perhaps. But it would make rebuilding much easier with their gubmit for all nonsense debunked