Is Trump even eligible to receive a presidential pardon?

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Define "dangled pardons". Your dick is probably so short it cannot dangle!

On January 25, 2019, Stone was arrested at his Fort Lauderdale, Florida, home in connection with Robert Mueller's Special Counsel investigation and charged in an indictment with witness tampering, obstructing an official proceeding, and five counts of making false statements.

Jun 4, 2020 — President Trump strongly hinted Thursday at a pardon of friend and longtime political adviser Roger Stone, who has been ordered to report to ...

Jul 10, 2020 — Trump Commutes Sentence of Roger Stone in Case He Long Denounced .

Dec 23, 2020 - 1 day ago — US President Donald Trump has pardoned his former campaign manager Paul Manafort, ex-adviser Roger Stone and the father of Mr Trump's .

So that's "dangling"? You really are mentally retarded.

 

[meaner gene]

So that's "dangling"? You really are mentally retarded.

Why Dangling a Pardon Could Be an Obstruction of Justice—Even if the Pardon Power is Absolute

According to the New York Times and Washington Post, Donald Trump's personal lawyer may have offered a pardon to Paul Manafort and Michael Flynn to get them to avoid cooperating with the special counsel's investigation. Whiting argues that debates about whether exercise of the pardon power is...

www.justsecurity.org

While acting as Donald Trump’s personal lawyer, John Dowd reportedly discussed the possibility of presidential pardons for Michael Flynn and Paul Manafort in separate conversations with their lawyers.

If Trump actually pardoned Flynn and Manafort, he would have to do so publicly and accept the political consequences of this profound act.

The pardon dangle works completely differently

the objective of the dangle appears to have been to foreclose the prospect of Flynn and Manfort’s cooperating or testifying.

The message of the dangle was sufficiently clear: hang in there and keep fighting (do not cut a deal with the special counsel) because you will be pardoned before you spend a day in jail.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

So that's "dangling"? You really are mentally retarded.

Why Dangling a Pardon Could Be an Obstruction of Justice—Even if the Pardon Power is Absolute

According to the New York Times and Washington Post, Donald Trump's personal lawyer may have offered a pardon to Paul Manafort and Michael Flynn to get them to avoid cooperating with the special counsel's investigation. Whiting argues that debates about whether exercise of the pardon power is...

www.justsecurity.org

While acting as Donald Trump’s personal lawyer, John Dowd reportedly discussed the possibility of presidential pardons for Michael Flynn and Paul Manafort in separate conversations with their lawyers.

If Trump actually pardoned Flynn and Manafort, he would have to do so publicly and accept the political consequences of this profound act.

The pardon dangle works completely differently

the objective of the dangle appears to have been to foreclose the prospect of Flynn and Manfort’s cooperating or testifying.

The message of the dangle was sufficiently clear: hang in there and keep fighting (do not cut a deal with the special counsel) because you will be pardoned before you spend a day in jail.

I want facts! That is an opinion piece by a left wing university's law school. Of course they are anti-Trump, shit for brains!

 

[meaner gene]

I want facts! That is an opinion piece by a left wing university's law school. Of course they are anti-Trump, shit for brains!

I gave you the facts. The dates of the various events. Then I gave you the definition of a dangled pardon with specific reference to Flynn and Manafort.

You're worse than a colic baby.

 

[9thIDdoc]

Not really. The POTUS can give a blanket pardon for any future potential charges.. What I do like is that by accepting a pardon you give up your 5th Amendment rights and have to testfy as a witness against any co-conspirators you may have been invoved with in commiting a crime.

Disagree. I don't think that's true and even if that were true Ford was not POTUS until after Nixon was allowed to resign without charges.

Ford granted Nixon a blanket pardon of any crimes he committed during his term(s) as president. A presidents pardon power can extend into the past, example Jake Johnson, or Robert E. Lee, into the present, but NOT into the future. A pardon covers when the crimes were committed, independent of when charged, convicted, or imprisoned.

Like I said I don't think any actual pardon was ever issued. The threat of one was sufficient to derail prosecution. Nor am I aware that the SCUSA has ever made any such ruling. Pardon for what? No crime was confessed or officially alleged in Court. Surely you are not saying that that tomorrow ex-president Obama could pardon the Clintons if they were charged with treason long after his term as President. How can a Presidential pardon be issued by someone who is not President?

 

[Crepitus]

Whether granted by himself (self pardon) or by Pence, or any future president, are such pardons prohibited by the Constitution?

US Constitution
Article 2 Section 2.
The President ,,, shall have power to grant reprieves and pardons for offenses against the United States, except in cases of impeachment.

Article 1 Section 3
Judgment in Cases of Impeachment shall not extend further than to removal from Office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy any Office of honor, Trust or Profit under the United States: but the Party convicted shall nevertheless be liable and subject to Indictment, Trial, Judgment and Punishment, according to Law.

The constitution clearly believes those impeached should suffer the consequences of their actions through both a political and legal judgement. So does article 2 section 3 preclude the derailing of a legal judgement by precluding presidential pardons to those impeached?

If he resigned pence could pardon him. Joe biden could after 1/20/21. He can't pardon himself.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

I want facts! That is an opinion piece by a left wing university's law school. Of course they are anti-Trump, shit for brains!

I gave you the facts. The dates of the various events. Then I gave you the definition of a dangled pardon with specific reference to Flynn and Manafort.

You're worse than a colic baby.

Your "reference" was an opinion piece! There were no facts there! You are worse than a 4-year old mentally!

 

[basquebromance]

despite all that presidential power, Trump has never felt more powerless

 

[Papageorgio]

You're right, however I have seen a couple of legal pundits say that in the case of pardoning complicit cronies in order to silence them can be investigated if not overturned. And Rudy is in bigly trouble whether Donald pardons him or not in the State of NY.

Investigated YES, but the pardon itself is not subject to legal review or judgement. There was even a case made after Bill Clinton pardoned Marc Rich, that an ex-president, could be impeached after leaving office. Since one of the judgments of the senate would be to prohibit him from ever holding another federal office.

I don't think it likely in todays political climate, but there is an argument in that an ex-president remains on the federal payroll.

I'm not really as concerned that Donald will pay for his crimes as I am what stunts he will pull in his final 25 days. I just mainly want him OUT.

Time left until Trump leaves office

25	days
610	hours
36646	minutes
2198778	seconds

until Wednesday, January 20, 2021 (Washington DC, District of Columbia time)

another butt hurt left wing nutter. Thanks for the laughs.

 

[Dragonlady]

Bullshit! You have no proof of that! What testimony?

Are you intent on showing the entire board what a mental midget you are?

Trump dangled pardons to everyone charged by Mueller. He called those who signed Plea Agreements and who cooperated with the Mueller Investigation "rats", and threatened their families, and promised to take care of those who didn't turn state's evidence. He tried to permanent jail and muzzle Micheal Cohen, and others who refused his offers. Rick Gates, who did cooperate with the FBI, but didn't directly implicate Trump, has not been pardoned, but Stone, who lied to the FBI, Congress, and committed perjury in his trial, has been pardoned.

And Trump didn't pardon any of them until after it was too late to impeach him for it.

On July 10, 2020, days before Stone was scheduled to report to prison, Trump commuted his sentence.

Trump didn't pardon Stone until after the election

What part of "Presidential pardons are absolute" do you not get?

The President “shall have Power to grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offenses against the United States, except in Cases of Impeachment.”

You cannot impeach him over a pardon! You need to shut your cock holster!

Yes you can. If the pardon was given for a corrupt reason, it's "obstruction of justice". I think that the Stone, Manafort and Flynn pardons would all meet that criteria, as would any "pre-emptive" pardons for crimes that haven't even been charged yet.

Mueller certainly considered Trump's dangling of pardons on Twitter sufficient to meet the "obstruction of justice" criteria. You fools consistently say that Mueller "cleared" Trump of any crimes but he did not, and he was very specific about Trump's dangling of pardons, and threatening of witnesses as indictable crimes.

 

[meaner gene]

You cannot impeach him over a pardon! You need to shut your cock holster!

Yes you can. If the pardon was given for a corrupt reason, it's "obstruction of justice". I think that the Stone, Manafort and Flynn pardons would all meet that criteria, as would any "pre-emptive" pardons for crimes that haven't even been charged yet.

Mueller certainly considered Trump's dangling of pardons on Twitter sufficient to meet the "obstruction of justice" criteria. You fools consistently say that Mueller "cleared" Trump of any crimes but he did not, and he was very specific about Trump's dangling of pardons, and threatening of witnesses as indictable crimes.

Do you expect any of them to have read the Mueller report? They listen to William Barr, who Mueller had to disagree with saying

"If we had confidence that the president did not commit a crime, we would have said so," Mueller said.

 

[Dragonlady]

You cannot impeach him over a pardon! You need to shut your cock holster!

Yes you can. If the pardon was given for a corrupt reason, it's "obstruction of justice". I think that the Stone, Manafort and Flynn pardons would all meet that criteria, as would any "pre-emptive" pardons for crimes that haven't even been charged yet.

Mueller certainly considered Trump's dangling of pardons on Twitter sufficient to meet the "obstruction of justice" criteria. You fools consistently say that Mueller "cleared" Trump of any crimes but he did not, and he was very specific about Trump's dangling of pardons, and threatening of witnesses as indictable crimes.

Do you expect any of them to have read the Mueller report? They listen to William Barr, who Mueller had to disagree with saying

"If we had confidence that the president did not commit a crime, we would have said so," Mueller said.

They think that because they didn't read the Mueller Report, no one else did. And then they quote Barr's summary as evidence of anything. By and large, they're right. Mueller is no John Grisham when it comes to writing a crime story. It was lawerly, unexciting and dryer than dust.

They haven't read the court filings in the election cases either - all of which are posted online. They've routinely accused me of parrotting left wing talking points or CNN about the court cases, as they were being dismissed. I linked to a few of the Orders. What is shocking to me is the scathing rebuke being issued by the judges in these Orders.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

You cannot impeach him over a pardon! You need to shut your cock holster!

Yes you can. If the pardon was given for a corrupt reason, it's "obstruction of justice". I think that the Stone, Manafort and Flynn pardons would all meet that criteria, as would any "pre-emptive" pardons for crimes that haven't even been charged yet.

Mueller certainly considered Trump's dangling of pardons on Twitter sufficient to meet the "obstruction of justice" criteria. You fools consistently say that Mueller "cleared" Trump of any crimes but he did not, and he was very specific about Trump's dangling of pardons, and threatening of witnesses as indictable crimes.

Do you expect any of them to have read the Mueller report? They listen to William Barr, who Mueller had to disagree with saying

"If we had confidence that the president did not commit a crime, we would have said so," Mueller said.

"If he did commit a crime, we have absolutely no proof", would be a more accurate and truthful statement.

 

[LuckyDuck]

Whether granted by himself (self pardon) or by Pence, or any future president, are such pardons prohibited by the Constitution?

US Constitution
Article 2 Section 2.
The President ,,, shall have power to grant reprieves and pardons for offenses against the United States, except in cases of impeachment.

Article 1 Section 3
Judgment in Cases of Impeachment shall not extend further than to removal from Office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy any Office of honor, Trust or Profit under the United States: but the Party convicted shall nevertheless be liable and subject to Indictment, Trial, Judgment and Punishment, according to Law.

The constitution clearly believes those impeached should suffer the consequences of their actions through both a political and legal judgement. So does article 2 section 3 preclude the derailing of a legal judgement by precluding presidential pardons to those impeached?

A president first has to actually have committed a serious crime. To date, Trump has not. Just because you hate the president and don't like the platform he ran on (strong borders to reduce the illegal drugs from getting in, vetting migrants to ensure that they aren't criminals, a stronger military, tax reduction, eliminating unfair trade deals, cutting back on regulations, moving the US Embassy to Jerusalem, making NATO members pay the amount they agreed to for NATO's defense, Opportunity Zones for the inner-city minorities, Operation Warp Speed to get new treatments and vaccines to people in need, the Right-to-Try Act which allows the terminally-ill access to experimental therapies in the possibility of helping those terminally-ill patients) and trying to ensure that our citizens, born here, be taken care of first, ahead of those in foreign nations). I know, they are all, in the leftists eyes, horrible things. Not to worry though, sleepy Joe Biden has said that he will undue all of Trumps achievements, so that those absolutely horrid things he's done, will go away, in the name of Marxism and George Soros' goals, of course.

 

[OldLady]

Is Trump even eligible to receive a presidential pardon?

No, he'd have to have committed a crime to be eligible.

Not true. The Pres can pardon people for crimes they haven't been charged with, or even investigated for. Don't know that he can pardon himself, but anyone, anytime, can be given a blanket pardon for any crime, known or not.

 

[OKTexas]

Whether granted by himself (self pardon) or by Pence, or any future president, are such pardons prohibited by the Constitution?

US Constitution
Article 2 Section 2.
The President ,,, shall have power to grant reprieves and pardons for offenses against the United States, except in cases of impeachment.

Article 1 Section 3
Judgment in Cases of Impeachment shall not extend further than to removal from Office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy any Office of honor, Trust or Profit under the United States: but the Party convicted shall nevertheless be liable and subject to Indictment, Trial, Judgment and Punishment, according to Law.

The constitution clearly believes those impeached should suffer the consequences of their actions through both a political and legal judgement. So does article 2 section 3 preclude the derailing of a legal judgement by precluding presidential pardons to those impeached?

The short answer is yes, he is eligible.

.

 

[OKTexas]

You're getting a little carried away there, dude. Maybe he should actually be judged guilty of a crime before the question of a pardons is considered.

An adjudication is not required for a pardon, Nixon was never charged or convicted, but was pardoned by Ford.

.

 

[OKTexas]

There's no crime. Therefore no pardon.

A crime is not required for the feds to destroy someone. Just ask the folks from Arthur Anderson.

.

 

[Orangecat]

No, he'd have to have committed a crime to be eligible.

Not true. The Pres can pardon people for crimes they haven't been charged with, or even investigated for. Don't know that he can pardon himself, but anyone, anytime, can be given a blanket pardon for any crime, known or not.

What would he be pardoning himself for when he's committed no crimes?

 

[OldLady]

No, he'd have to have committed a crime to be eligible.

Not true. The Pres can pardon people for crimes they haven't been charged with, or even investigated for. Don't know that he can pardon himself, but anyone, anytime, can be given a blanket pardon for any crime, known or not.

What would he be pardoning himself for when he's committed no crimes?

Good question! I guess you'd have to ask him what he was thinking.