LilOlLady's Everlasting Gobstopper Illegal Immigration Thread

[brokenarrow]

You cannot lay mine-fields around the country.

You can, but it is very expensive. Just ask North/South Korea.

There is no way for Immigration officials to indentify Illegals already in the country if the country has no system of idenifying who is legal and who is not.

I remember having to take polygraph tests for a few of the jobs I had in the past. What ever happened to those guys?

Without foolproof ID's for its legal residents, any Illegal can claim he is a legal/citizen and there is no practical way to deport them.

Don't bother deporting. Send a bill to Mexico for every illegal Mexican now here. What are they going to say? They even brag that a Mexican who becomes an American is still a Mexican. Stop playing their games and make those countries pay up. You'll see a change almost immediately.

All they do is borrow somebody's birth record or Social Security Number. The USA has no system of legal picture ID's. And any illegal can obtain a US Passport by using a phoney birth cirtificate and an illegally obtained state ID card. It is common practice.

We have so many departments. Start the US Department of Identification.
Unless you are willing to prove you are American and help aid that department in enforcement efforts, you are barred from receiving any aid whatsoever. If this was wartime, all those privacy rights would go right out the window. And this is war!

In order to enforce immigration, you must have a legal method of ID-ing the illegal, and this is what patriotic Americans need to start demanding of their government. If the US Government refuses, Private Industry must step up to the plate and start garateeing citizens true identifications.

What private industry can you trust anymore. They have all been infilitrated by the very families of the people you want to keep out.

 

[ROBESPIERRE]

The USA does not have an immigration problem; it has an invasion problem.

There is no effective way to police the long and desolate border the US has with Mexico, (where most of the poor illegals cross), so the ONLY way you are going to get a grip on the situation is to go after those who are hiring illegals, renting to illegals and providing illegals with phoney or stolen IDs.

There is only ONE way to do this: (1) Issue foolproof identification to all native born US Citizens and legal immigrants. (2) Require every employer to check IDs and show proof they have hired only legal residents. (3) Require every landlord to demand a copy of legal ID before they rent out property.

If there is no verifyable National Citizens ID Card, how can law enforcement even BEGIN to enforce the Immigration Laws?

Without proper IDs the whole issue of "who is legal and who is not" is dead in the water!​

 

[brokenarrow]

The USA does not have an immigration problem; it has an invasion problem.

There is no effective way to police the long and desolate border the US has with Mexico, (where most of the poor illegals cross), so the ONLY way you are going to get a grip on the situation is to go after those who are hiring illegals, renting to illegals and providing illegals with phoney or stolen IDs.

There is only ONE way to do this: (1) Issue foolproof identification to all native born US Citizens and legal immigrants. (2) Require every employer to check IDs and show proof they have hired only legal residents. (3) Require every landlord to demand a copy of legal ID before they rent out property.

If there is no verifyable National Citizens ID Card, how can law enforcement even BEGIN to enforce the Immigration Laws?

Without proper IDs the whole issue of "who is legal and who is not" is dead in the water!​

ID is real. Child is fake.

 

[LilOlLady]

Obama assembles all-star cast to talk immigration
Associated Press Jim Kuhnhenn,
Thu Apr 28,

But immigration legislation that would provide a path to citizenship for millions of illegal immigrants has stalled even when Democrats controlled both chambers in 2009 and 2010. Its prospects are even more remote now that Republicans control the House.

Participants said Obama was pressed to do something about the record 393,000 illegal immigrants forced to leave the country last year, but Obama indicated that without congressional action his hands were tied.
Obama assembles all-star cast to talk immigration - Yahoo! News


Does this sound like someone who want to provide a path to citizenship for million of illegal aliens? Obama is just putting on a show or effort that he knows would not have a chance in hell of passing at this time. BUT his effort could get him re-elected.

 

[brokenarrow]

Obama assembles all-star cast to talk immigration
Associated Press Jim Kuhnhenn,
Thu Apr 28,

But immigration legislation that would provide a path to citizenship for millions of illegal immigrants has stalled even when Democrats controlled both chambers in 2009 and 2010. Its prospects are even more remote now that Republicans control the House.

Participants said Obama was pressed to do something about the record 393,000 illegal immigrants forced to leave the country last year, but Obama indicated that without congressional action his hands were tied.
Obama assembles all-star cast to talk immigration - Yahoo! News


Does this sound like someone who want to provide a path to citizenship for million of illegal aliens? Obama is just putting on a show or effort that he knows would not have a chance in hell of passing at this time. BUT his effort could get him re-elected.

Obama. Escucha. Estamos en la lucha"

Yeah. They really want to be AMERICANS!!

 

[Angelhair]

This all star cast are a bunch of pro-illegal creeps who think it's okay to break the laws of this country as long as it's 'their people' doing it.

 

[LilOlLady]

OUR BROKEN IMMIGRATION SYSTEM.

Our immigration system is broken because 20 million illegal aliens entered this country illegally ignoring and disrespecting our immigration laws which our government has refused to enforce. We fix the broken system not by allowing those who broke it to be rewarded with a green card by paying a fine. If we do that we our immigration system continue to be broken and encourages other to break it because it send the message that if you enter the country illegal by ignoring and disrespecting our immigration law you will be allowed to pay a fine and get a green card.

Comprehensive Immigration Reform do not fix the broken immigration system, it expands it. 20 million green cards today would guarantee 20 million more in 20 years, etc.

We can only fix the broken immigration system by “tough love.” Deportation by Attrition those who are here illegally with mandatory E-Verify system and finger printed Social Security cards. If they cannot work they will leave and they will not come.

The Dream Act is just a scheme leading to amnesty because we if we legalize the children, we are not going to deport their families. Instant amnesty. “The reason the children are here is of no fault of their own” The reason the children are here is because their parents chose to enter the country illegally breaking our immigration law and children cannot and should not be used as “get out of jail cards” or anchors.

Democrats cannot get a Comprehensive Immigration Reform bill passed so they use the excuse that their children should be legalized because the “poor helpless innocent little babies” should not be punished because their parents broke the law. Using the “helpless children” “compassion” “humane” card to excuse illegal immigration.

Unfortunately, children of criminals do pay a price for the sins of their parents and illegal immigration is a crime, a federal crime, and that makes their parents criminals and should not be excused under no circumstances.

Criminals who have children cannot pay a fine and get out of jail. Why do we think we can have one set of laws for one group of people and anther set for another group?

“Poverty is no excuse to break the law.” I want a better life for my children but I did not break the law to achieve it. I did it legally because of my children. “Lead by example.”

Illegal immigration is a broken security system that need to be fixed. You fix the law not by changing it but by enforcing it. Jay walking is illegal, because if every one is crossing the street against the light, it will cause accidents and death.

20 million illegal aliens are not all hard working law abiding people who only want to take care of their children. All children of illegal aliens are not working hard in school trying to get an education. Our prison are full of illegal aliens who have committed crimes. Gangs, drug dealers, etc.

The Federal Immigration and Nationality Act is a worthless piece of paper if we do not enforce it. Who gets to decide which laws are to be enforced and which are not?

Just because 20 million people broke our immigration laws do not mean the law is broken and need to be fixed.

Criminals live in fear in the shadows because they broke the law. Don’t break the law.

Racial profiling has long been used to arrest criminals and it the most effective way to find illegal aliens and deport them and it is legal under the Federal Immigration and Nationality Act. “Reasonable suspicions” legalize racial profiling in enforcing our immigration laws. I carry an identification that proves I am legal and every one in this country should and it is not a briefcase full of papers. A green card is the size of a drivers’ license.
Our immigration system is not broken (it is being broken) and if it is not broken, don’t fix it.

 

[JBeukema]

Do you ever think about anything else?

 

[brokenarrow]

This all star cast are a bunch of pro-illegal creeps who think it's okay to break the laws of this country as long as it's 'their people' doing it.

The more people corrupted by drug use, the more people spending indiscriminately, the more people become the slaves of the wealthy.

 

[editec]

It's either boken, indicating that our Masters are total incompetents

OR...

It is working exactly as the MASTERS want it to work indicating that they're lying to us about their REAL AGENDA.

I'll leave it to you which of the above is more likely

 

[Epsilon Delta]

Maybe you can "fix" immigration...

...but you can never fix stupid.

BA-DAM CHING!!!!


p9sadu[sdo9ysdp[09sdysdp09asydadsp098yds9s8yas098da0ds98s

 

[editec]

Maybe you can "fix" immigration...

...but you can never fix stupid.

BA-DAM CHING!!!!


p9sadu[sdo9ysdp[09sdysdp09asydadsp098yds9s8yas098da0ds98s

Maybe the masters AREN'T stupid.

AFter all driving down the market value of labor is something that CAPITAL loves.

 

[brokenarrow]

Maybe you can "fix" immigration...

...but you can never fix stupid.

BA-DAM CHING!!!!


p9sadu[sdo9ysdp[09sdysdp09asydadsp098yds9s8yas098da0ds98s

Maybe the masters AREN'T stupid.

AFter all driving down the market value of labor is something that CAPITAL loves.

And overpopulating the country worked really good for Mexico!

 

[Epsilon Delta]

Maybe you can "fix" immigration...

...but you can never fix stupid.

BA-DAM CHING!!!!


p9sadu[sdo9ysdp[09sdysdp09asydadsp098yds9s8yas098da0ds98s

Maybe the masters AREN'T stupid.

AFter all driving down the market value of labor is something that CAPITAL loves.

No, I was only kidding, but I wasn't implying that it is the masters that are stupid.

Illegal immigration isn't a black and white issue, and it's a bit more complicated than that. Illegal immigrants, being the very low-skilled bunch that they are, may drive down the value of some kinds of labor (ie, very low-skilled labor, not even having completed highschool), but thankfully for the US, the vast majority of its workforce is at least semi-skilled (most at least complete high school).

Most of the roughly 10 million illegal immigrants (not 20 million, as the OP claims) basically work in jobs in which they're not quite in competition with American workers, which isn't the same as the usual "they do jobs Americans wouldn't do" line of argument. No such argument actually exists - of course Americans would do these jobs, for the right [read: a much, much higher] wage, but at the same, at a much, much higher wage those jobs probably wouldn't be in the United States at all.

The real way that the Masters (or at least some masters) definitely benefit is by being able to simultaneously take advantage of the underground nature of illegal immigrant work (i.e. paying even less) while AT THE SAME TIME managing to siphon off political votes from the jingoist sectors of American society by appealing to ultra-nationalism, despite the fact that they themselves are engaging in this sort of thing.

So what should be the real solution? The only real way to go about it is to first of all regularize (yes, that means to legalize/give amnesty/whatever) the current illegal immigrant population and get them to pay taxes and come out of the shadows (ie, so that they can actually report on crimes), and then increase guest-worker programs specifically for the type of sectors that would be illegal immigrants (again, because these are low-skill sectors that in general are not competing with American workers) - these programs allow the government to encourage immigrants to go back after a certain period (if you actually think about it logically, most illegal immigrants are basically trapped in the United States for longer than they otherwise would be, because of the extreme dangers in attempting to come back). In fact, in almost every single survey of immigrants, in the US, in Canada, in Europe, and wherever, it is a stated fact for a sizable majority of immigrants (legal and illegal) to go back home. Furthermore, studies have shown that a large portion of returning emigrants to developing countries bring back a lot more capital which they can re-invest in their communities, creating virtuous cycles, reducing poverty, and then *BINGO* stemming the tide of migration from those places.

But hey, that just sounds too complicated. We might as well just round them up, shoot 'em on the spot, or institute a police state all over the United States to hunt them down, and then spend hundreds of billions of dollars putting up a wall on the entire US-Mexico border, right? After all, might is always right!

[Note: this is a general response to the thread]

 

[LilOlLady]

1886 AMNESTY A COMPLETE FAILURE

The 1986 amnesty for 2.8 million illegal aliens led to the illegal immigration of 20 million more illegal aliens and over 500,000 anchor babies and 27% of prison inmates are illegal aliens.

The real victims of illegal immigration are the American tax payers. If it failed the first time why are they wanting a repeat performance? If we had deported 2.8 million in 1896 we would not be thinking of another amnesty in 2011 for 20 million illegals. Why is it that just because they are here we have to let them stay? 1986 amnesty proves amnesty to not fix the illegal immigration problem. Call it a “path to citizenship with a fine” and it still will not fix illegal immigration. If we had fixed it the first time we would not have to do a “do over.” Lets learn from our mistakes because if we don’t we tend to make them over and over.

1986 amnesty for 2.8 million illegal aliens are still costing us billions on top of the billions 20 million are costing us now.

They will only have to pay a fine and learn English if they want to become U.S. citizens and many will not. Just like some who were given amnesty in 1986 have not learned English. I meet lot of elderly illegal aliens who cannot speak English and have not applied for U.S. citizenship and is collecting SSI because they did not pay into Social Security.

1986 was a costly mistake we cannot afford to repeat.

 

[LilOlLady]

Do you ever think about anything else?

Yes and No.

 

[LilOlLady]

Maybe you can "fix" immigration...

...but you can never fix stupid.

BA-DAM CHING!!!!


p9sadu[sdo9ysdp[09sdysdp09asydadsp098yds9s8yas098da0ds98s

Maybe the masters AREN'T stupid.

AFter all driving down the market value of labor is something that CAPITAL loves.

No, I was only kidding, but I wasn't implying that it is the masters that are stupid.

Illegal immigration isn't a black and white issue, and it's a bit more complicated than that. Illegal immigrants, being the very low-skilled bunch that they are, may drive down the value of some kinds of labor (ie, very low-skilled labor, not even having completed highschool), but thankfully for the US, the vast majority of its workforce is at least semi-skilled (most at least complete high school).
[Note: this is a general response to the thread]

Not even near. We have more unskilled worker than ever.
"Since 1970, immigration has increased the number of unskilled job applicants faster than the number of skilled job applicants.
High Immigration Harms Many American Workers | NumbersUSA - For Lower Immigration Levels

U.S. Workers Crowding Out Immigrant Laborers for Unskilled Jobs
"Everybody is coming to look for work," says Rene Jemio, outreach coordinator for the hiring hall. "It's not just your average immigrant anymore; it's African-Americans and whites, too."For the first time in a decade, unskilled immigrants are competing with Americans for work. And evidence is emerging that tens of thousands of Hispanic immigrants are withdrawing from the labor market as U.S. workers crowd them out of potential jobs. At least some of the foreigners are returning home.
U.S. Workers Crowding Out Immigrant Laborers for Unskilled Jobs

 

[brokenarrow]

1886 AMNESTY A COMPLETE FAILURE

The 1986 amnesty for 2.8 million illegal aliens led to the illegal immigration of 20 million more illegal aliens and over 500,000 anchor babies and 27% of prison inmates are illegal aliens.

The real victims of illegal immigration are the American tax payers. If it failed the first time why are they wanting a repeat performance? If we had deported 2.8 million in 1896 we would not be thinking of another amnesty in 2011 for 20 million illegals. Why is it that just because they are here we have to let them stay? 1986 amnesty proves amnesty to not fix the illegal immigration problem. Call it a “path to citizenship with a fine” and it still will not fix illegal immigration. If we had fixed it the first time we would not have to do a “do over.” Lets learn from our mistakes because if we don’t we tend to make them over and over.

1986 amnesty for 2.8 million illegal aliens are still costing us billions on top of the billions 20 million are costing us now.

They will only have to pay a fine and learn English if they want to become U.S. citizens and many will not. Just like some who were given amnesty in 1986 have not learned English. I meet lot of elderly illegal aliens who cannot speak English and have not applied for U.S. citizenship and is collecting SSI because they did not pay into Social Security.

1986 was a costly mistake we cannot afford to repeat.

Aren't the Mexican WAY past their quota for having diversity in the US? They are less than 2% of the world's population. How can LA RAZA justify the amount already here to all US Americans?

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

The 1986 amnesty for 2.8 million illegal aliens led to the illegal immigration of 20 million more illegal aliens and over 500,000 anchor babies and 27% of prison inmates are illegal aliens.

The real victims of illegal immigration are the American tax payers. If it failed the first time why are they wanting a repeat performance? If we had deported 2.8 million in 1896 we would not be thinking of another amnesty in 2011 for 20 million illegals. Why is it that just because they are here we have to let them stay? 1986 amnesty proves amnesty to not fix the illegal immigration problem. Call it a “path to citizenship with a fine” and it still will not fix illegal immigration. If we had fixed it the first time we would not have to do a “do over.” Lets learn from our mistakes because if we don’t we tend to make them over and over.

1986 amnesty for 2.8 million illegal aliens are still costing us billions on top of the billions 20 million are costing us now.

They will only have to pay a fine and learn English if they want to become U.S. citizens and many will not. Just like some who were given amnesty in 1986 have not learned English. I meet lot of elderly illegal aliens who cannot speak English and have not applied for U.S. citizenship and is collecting SSI because they did not pay into Social Security.

So you solution is what? Suspend habeas, the 5th, 6th and 14th Amendments, round everyone up in trains and trucks, and send them all south to the border?

 

[brokenarrow]

[So you solution is what? Suspend habeas, the 5th, 6th and 14th Amendments, round everyone up in trains and trucks, and send them all south to the border?

If only Adolph were here to help us!