Article 15
Dr. House slayer
- Jul 4, 2008
- 24,673
- 4,916
- 183
And there's my answer ...
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LilOlLady's Everlasting Gobstopper Illegal Immigration Thread
- Thread starter LilOlLady
- Start date
And there's my answer ...
jillian
Princess
The rightwingnut loons can "consider" anything they want to in order to toss red meat to their "base" of xenophobes....
But they aren't getting a constitutional amendment. So they can waste time shrieking about it, or they can actually do something.
And there's my answer ...
bazinga!
- Thread starter
- #763
Activist are always citing the cost to taxpayers and not the savings to taxpayers if this is amemded and dream act is not passes and immigraiton laws are enforced.
Changing the 14th amendment would also change the way women immigrated to this country. They do get help for their children in Mexico, but not all the freebies they get here. Freebies all american children born here get and will not change.
Congress has been granted the power to amend the 14th amendment.
Changing the 14th amendment would also change the way women immigrated to this country. They do get help for their children in Mexico, but not all the freebies they get here. Freebies all american children born here get and will not change.
Congress has been granted the power to amend the 14th amendment.
Last edited:
I think the first issue here is relevance. I'm sure there are valid arguments on both sides of the issue. In the end, where the Government serves the will of the People, it is for the People to decide, one way or the other, and for Government to comply. Shouldn't your first concern be arguing the merits of your argument, rather than trying to discredit a sincere concern? Shouldn't we All be sincerely considering the matter, rather than obstructing and demonizing the process? Could we not trust, that in the end, one way or the other, reason will prevail?
jillian
Princess
I think the first issue here is relevance. I'm sure there are valid arguments on both sides of the issue. In the end, where the Government serves the will of the People, it is for the People to decide, one way or the other, and for Government to comply. Shouldn't your first concern be arguing the merits of your argument, rather than trying to discredit a sincere concern? Shouldn't we All be sincerely considering the matter, rather than obstructing and demonizing the process? Could we not trust, that in the end, one way or the other, reason will prevail?
once again, the point of the constitution is to protect us from the whims of the majority.
the torch and pitchfork crowd is always going to periodically get into a tizzy.
I think the first issue here is relevance. I'm sure there are valid arguments on both sides of the issue. In the end, where the Government serves the will of the People, it is for the People to decide, one way or the other, and for Government to comply. Shouldn't your first concern be arguing the merits of your argument, rather than trying to discredit a sincere concern? Shouldn't we All be sincerely considering the matter, rather than obstructing and demonizing the process? Could we not trust, that in the end, one way or the other, reason will prevail?
once again, the point of the constitution is to protect us from the whims of the majority.
the torch and pitchfork crowd is always going to periodically get into a tizzy.
No, actually it is not. It is the Foundation of Natural Law which Establishes, and gives both Authority, and Limit, to The Federal Government. Through that Jurisdiction, that Power and It's limits, translate to the State and Local Governments.
The whims of the majority, are usually either the result of good information or manipulation and misinformation, you get to choose, how you participate.
The Process involves 2/3 of Congress or the States bringing it up for consideration, but you know that. It requires a Super Majority of 3/4 of Congress or The States to Ratify an Amendment, But you know that too. Why is it your or my place to deny Due Process, to obstruct? How is this Federalism, and not Totalitarianism or Oligarchy?
If what you propose with the Courts being the Final Authority Every Time in Every Case, why even have Elections at all? Why have a Congress? To do the bidding of unelected Magistrates? I prefer the Federalist Structure of Three Equal Branches of Government, Each with an Integral Role. I denounce the obstruction of the Process.
slackjawed
Self deported
It is disappointing, to say the least, to watch our so-called leaders take such actions. In my opinion, this is a great disservice to our country.
We have problems concerning illegal immigration that are seemingly within the grasp of our elected officials in congress to solve. The thing is, attacking decent people that have come to this country for a better life, just as most of our ancestors did, is not going to achieve that end.
If our so-called leaders would cease the hyper-partisanship and actually do the job they were elected to do, this problem would be solved.
I suggest, as a first step, that we instruct our elected officials create legislation that would offer a clear, affordable and legal path to citizenship for those who's only crime has been to cross an imaginary line without permission. This would create a situation where the only ones entering the country illegally would actually be criminals. That would make the job our border patrol and law enforcement do much easier to perform. There would be less people crossing illegally and those that were would likely be drug smugglers and criminals of other stripes.
To continue the hyper-partisan lunacy serves only to leave the issue unaddressed.
We need taxpayers, that's what citizens do. Passing a constitutional amendment banning birthright citizenship, and continuing the failed policies of becoming a citizen chases away those who would otherwise pay taxes and be productive citizens.
This proposal just points to a chronic laziness and dishonesty on the part of our so-called leaders. Attacking families that are not likely to shoot at you is easier than chasing drug runners and other criminals who will.
We have problems concerning illegal immigration that are seemingly within the grasp of our elected officials in congress to solve. The thing is, attacking decent people that have come to this country for a better life, just as most of our ancestors did, is not going to achieve that end.
If our so-called leaders would cease the hyper-partisanship and actually do the job they were elected to do, this problem would be solved.
I suggest, as a first step, that we instruct our elected officials create legislation that would offer a clear, affordable and legal path to citizenship for those who's only crime has been to cross an imaginary line without permission. This would create a situation where the only ones entering the country illegally would actually be criminals. That would make the job our border patrol and law enforcement do much easier to perform. There would be less people crossing illegally and those that were would likely be drug smugglers and criminals of other stripes.
To continue the hyper-partisan lunacy serves only to leave the issue unaddressed.
We need taxpayers, that's what citizens do. Passing a constitutional amendment banning birthright citizenship, and continuing the failed policies of becoming a citizen chases away those who would otherwise pay taxes and be productive citizens.
This proposal just points to a chronic laziness and dishonesty on the part of our so-called leaders. Attacking families that are not likely to shoot at you is easier than chasing drug runners and other criminals who will.
Sallow
The Big Bad Wolf.
I think the first issue here is relevance. I'm sure there are valid arguments on both sides of the issue. In the end, where the Government serves the will of the People, it is for the People to decide, one way or the other, and for Government to comply. Shouldn't your first concern be arguing the merits of your argument, rather than trying to discredit a sincere concern? Shouldn't we All be sincerely considering the matter, rather than obstructing and demonizing the process? Could we not trust, that in the end, one way or the other, reason will prevail?
There is no real argument for getting rid of birthright citizenship.
It's a wedge issue meant to appeal to the lessor angels of people's psyche.
- Thread starter
- #769
It is disappointing, to say the least, to watch our so-called leaders take such actions. In my opinion, this is a great disservice to our country.
We have problems concerning illegal immigration that are seemingly within the grasp of our elected officials in congress to solve. The thing is, attacking decent people that have come to this country for a better life, just as most of our ancestors did, is not going to achieve that end.
If our so-called leaders would cease the hyper-partisanship and actually do the job they were elected to do, this problem would be solved.
I suggest, as a first step, that we instruct our elected officials create legislation that would offer a clear, affordable and legal path to citizenship for those who's only crime has been to cross an imaginary line without permission. This would create a situation where the only ones entering the country illegally would actually be criminals. That would make the job our border patrol and law enforcement do much easier to perform. There would be less people crossing illegally and those that were would likely be drug smugglers and criminals of other stripes.
To continue the hyper-partisan lunacy serves only to leave the issue unaddressed.
We need taxpayers, that's what citizens do. Passing a constitutional amendment banning birthright citizenship, and continuing the failed policies of becoming a citizen chases away those who would otherwise pay taxes and be productive citizens.
This proposal just points to a chronic laziness and dishonesty on the part of our so-called leaders. Attacking families that are not likely to shoot at you is easier than chasing drug runners and other criminals who will.
How much taxes does a low wage earner pay. Very little of none and their children receive all the benefits as any US citizen at the expense of those who do pay taxes. How may families have at least one gang member? How many anchor babies are gang member and is our prisons? Makes on sense to import more poverty. Lets educate our own and see what happens. or has that not worked out?
There is no promise they will be productive tax paying citizerns? You are in deep denial.
- Thread starter
- #770
There is no way ever we will be able to control illegal immigration without repealing the automatic birthright citizenship for children of illegal aliens. Deportation of parents is almost impossible now. That's not controlling immigraiton. Most of our illegal immigraiton problems hangs on the 14th.
- Thread starter
- #771
Children feel like outsiders, have trouble mastering language, assignments
April 12, 2009|By Oscar Avila, Tribune correspondentZINAPECUARO, Mexico — Juan Maldonado is suffering the same culture shock as many other children of Mexican immigrants: He's out of place at school and hasn't mastered the language.
The difference? The U.S.-born Maldonado feels like an outsider in Mexico.
With their job prospects bleak and worried about bad influences on the street, Maldonado's parents sent the 15-year-old back from West Chicago to this central Mexican town last fall. Almost immediately, he was fighting with classmates who mocked his accented Spanish. He could barely read or write in the language, so his homework was impossible.
LINK:Mexican immigrants: U.S.-born students struggle after returning to school in homeland - Chicago Tribune
When I first read this, I thougt I was reading about children of illegal aliens brought here across the border illegally and anchor babies.
April 12, 2009|By Oscar Avila, Tribune correspondentZINAPECUARO, Mexico — Juan Maldonado is suffering the same culture shock as many other children of Mexican immigrants: He's out of place at school and hasn't mastered the language.
The difference? The U.S.-born Maldonado feels like an outsider in Mexico.
With their job prospects bleak and worried about bad influences on the street, Maldonado's parents sent the 15-year-old back from West Chicago to this central Mexican town last fall. Almost immediately, he was fighting with classmates who mocked his accented Spanish. He could barely read or write in the language, so his homework was impossible.
LINK:Mexican immigrants: U.S.-born students struggle after returning to school in homeland - Chicago Tribune
When I first read this, I thougt I was reading about children of illegal aliens brought here across the border illegally and anchor babies.
- Thread starter
- #772
How automatic birthright citizenship separate families and must be repealed. Many illegal aliens cross the border with their children and some leave them behind for years and usually start another family.
Suffer the little immigrant children
By Anthea Butler
University of Pennsylvania and Patheos.com
The First Lady's recent encounter with a young girl who admitted that her mother is an illegal immigrant crystallized in an instant the Solomonic proportions of the immigration issue that faces our nation. How will immigration laws like Arizona's HB1070 affect families, specifically children? In this charged atmosphere, loving one's neighbor as oneself, a biblical admonition, only works if your neighbor has all of the paperwork proving their U.S. citizenship in order. The shock is beginning to wear off from the passage of the immigration bill, but I predict those who will bear the psychological toll of this political maneuvering are children, whose frayed nerves will fear that their parents might be taken away from them. Consider the interview held with the young girl after meeting the First Lady, in which she states, "I'm a big girl and I don't want to be left with nothing. I could almost die." Many illegal immigrants face separation from families in other countries, and for children born in this country to illegal parents, the specter of parents being taken away by ICE is an ever-present fear. The new boogeyman, it seems, does not live under the bed or in the closet, but is a state-sanctioned monster ready to pounce, rising from the sands of the Arizona desert.
LINK:Patheos/On Faith: Suffer the little immigrant children - On Faith at washingtonpost.com
Suffer the little immigrant children
By Anthea Butler
University of Pennsylvania and Patheos.com
The First Lady's recent encounter with a young girl who admitted that her mother is an illegal immigrant crystallized in an instant the Solomonic proportions of the immigration issue that faces our nation. How will immigration laws like Arizona's HB1070 affect families, specifically children? In this charged atmosphere, loving one's neighbor as oneself, a biblical admonition, only works if your neighbor has all of the paperwork proving their U.S. citizenship in order. The shock is beginning to wear off from the passage of the immigration bill, but I predict those who will bear the psychological toll of this political maneuvering are children, whose frayed nerves will fear that their parents might be taken away from them. Consider the interview held with the young girl after meeting the First Lady, in which she states, "I'm a big girl and I don't want to be left with nothing. I could almost die." Many illegal immigrants face separation from families in other countries, and for children born in this country to illegal parents, the specter of parents being taken away by ICE is an ever-present fear. The new boogeyman, it seems, does not live under the bed or in the closet, but is a state-sanctioned monster ready to pounce, rising from the sands of the Arizona desert.
LINK:Patheos/On Faith: Suffer the little immigrant children - On Faith at washingtonpost.com
This birthright perk has got to go. It only serves to bring in the poor from other countries, drop their babies here and immediately qualify for all the resources put in place for the poor here who are citizens. These babies then are deemed citizens and are entitled to everything this country has to offer. Somehow that does not seem fair to those here who have to pay those astronomical taxes that the poor don't pay and who via their birthright babies qualify for the freebies.
Sallow
The Big Bad Wolf.
It's not a "perk". It is a part of the United States Constitution.
Amendment 14 - Citizenship Rights. Ratified 7/9/1868. Note History
1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
I think the first issue here is relevance. I'm sure there are valid arguments on both sides of the issue. In the end, where the Government serves the will of the People, it is for the People to decide, one way or the other, and for Government to comply. Shouldn't your first concern be arguing the merits of your argument, rather than trying to discredit a sincere concern? Shouldn't we All be sincerely considering the matter, rather than obstructing and demonizing the process? Could we not trust, that in the end, one way or the other, reason will prevail?
There is no real argument for getting rid of birthright citizenship.
It's a wedge issue meant to appeal to the lessor angels of people's psyche.
Who died and anointed you Supreme Leader?
Thanks for the laugh.
slackjawed
Self deported
It is disappointing, to say the least, to watch our so-called leaders take such actions. In my opinion, this is a great disservice to our country.
We have problems concerning illegal immigration that are seemingly within the grasp of our elected officials in congress to solve. The thing is, attacking decent people that have come to this country for a better life, just as most of our ancestors did, is not going to achieve that end.
If our so-called leaders would cease the hyper-partisanship and actually do the job they were elected to do, this problem would be solved.
I suggest, as a first step, that we instruct our elected officials create legislation that would offer a clear, affordable and legal path to citizenship for those who's only crime has been to cross an imaginary line without permission. This would create a situation where the only ones entering the country illegally would actually be criminals. That would make the job our border patrol and law enforcement do much easier to perform. There would be less people crossing illegally and those that were would likely be drug smugglers and criminals of other stripes.
To continue the hyper-partisan lunacy serves only to leave the issue unaddressed.
We need taxpayers, that's what citizens do. Passing a constitutional amendment banning birthright citizenship, and continuing the failed policies of becoming a citizen chases away those who would otherwise pay taxes and be productive citizens.
This proposal just points to a chronic laziness and dishonesty on the part of our so-called leaders. Attacking families that are not likely to shoot at you is easier than chasing drug runners and other criminals who will.
How much taxes does a low wage earner pay. Very little of none and their children receive all the benefits as any US citizen at the expense of those who do pay taxes. How may families have at least one gang member? How many anchor babies are gang member and is our prisons? Makes on sense to import more poverty. Lets educate our own and see what happens. or has that not worked out?
There is no promise they will be productive tax paying citizerns? You are in deep denial.
I don't know about where you live, but where I live, in rural Arizona, when the news was reporting that mexicans were leaving Arizona because of the new law that took effect, it was true. Between my wife and i we know about 25 people that left. The entire kitchen staff at one of the local restaraunt left, 8 people. The local economy took an immediate hit.
Now it is true that some of the people who left were legal, and left in support of family members and friends. But still, a fair portion were likely illegals, and their leaving has affected the local econmy.
- Thread starter
- #779
Beyond Borderlines Town Hall on Immigration
WATCH: MSNBC Beyond Borderlines Town Hall on Immigration | Latina
MSNBC special on the view of Hispanic on immigrant was just an excuse for Amnesty and their trying to compare the illegal immigration from Mexico to the immigraints that came here from Europe through Ellis Island. These people were really tired, poor huddled masses yearning to breathe free, homeless and tempest-tossed to make a better life for themselves and to have a better life given to them. Not like those who are illegal crossing our southern border now asking what this country can give them.
We are no longer into nation building, but nation survival and illegal immigration today cannot be compared to immigration of old that built this country.
WATCH: MSNBC Beyond Borderlines Town Hall on Immigration | Latina
MSNBC special on the view of Hispanic on immigrant was just an excuse for Amnesty and their trying to compare the illegal immigration from Mexico to the immigraints that came here from Europe through Ellis Island. These people were really tired, poor huddled masses yearning to breathe free, homeless and tempest-tossed to make a better life for themselves and to have a better life given to them. Not like those who are illegal crossing our southern border now asking what this country can give them.
We are no longer into nation building, but nation survival and illegal immigration today cannot be compared to immigration of old that built this country.
dramaofmylife
Rookie
- Nov 13, 2010
- 11
- 2
- 1
Birthright citizenship is outdated, the US is the only developed country who still does this. It is said that the 14th amendment was written to discourage discrimination against the children of former African American slaves, not so that every illegal and her sister can come over here, have their kids and collect welfare benefits because their kids are "called" American. If the authors of the 14th amendment knew that illegal immigrants would be rushing this country and taking advantage of this amendment, I'm sure they would have taken further measures to clarify it. I live here in the Phoenix area and I see the devestating effects of birthright citizenship.
Here in Arizona, programs like medicaid and child care assistance are frozen up with a waiting list that has not budged for the last two years because of illegal immigrants and their birthright kids weighing the system down. AZ's public school system has frantically tried to keep up with this exploding population of immigrants and their birthright kids by building a school on every corner and trying to teach these kids English and it hasn't been enough; the classes are STILL overflowing with 30+ kids to each class and AZ schools are among the worst in the country. I literally received a letter from the school district a few weeks ago explaining the the reason this school district has not met state standards for the last three years and only 30% of the kids passed AZ state tests is because of the Non-English speakers. And yes, you read that right. AZ has spent all this money to build all these schools and spend all this time teaching these birthright and immigrant kids English, yet they STILL will not speak English. Enough is enough already, it has come to a point where our congress has NO CHOICE but to do something with the 14th amendment. Because if they don't do something the border states will literally be like Mexico inside the US if they are not already.
Here in Arizona, programs like medicaid and child care assistance are frozen up with a waiting list that has not budged for the last two years because of illegal immigrants and their birthright kids weighing the system down. AZ's public school system has frantically tried to keep up with this exploding population of immigrants and their birthright kids by building a school on every corner and trying to teach these kids English and it hasn't been enough; the classes are STILL overflowing with 30+ kids to each class and AZ schools are among the worst in the country. I literally received a letter from the school district a few weeks ago explaining the the reason this school district has not met state standards for the last three years and only 30% of the kids passed AZ state tests is because of the Non-English speakers. And yes, you read that right. AZ has spent all this money to build all these schools and spend all this time teaching these birthright and immigrant kids English, yet they STILL will not speak English. Enough is enough already, it has come to a point where our congress has NO CHOICE but to do something with the 14th amendment. Because if they don't do something the border states will literally be like Mexico inside the US if they are not already.
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