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Originally posted by mudwhistle
Their President had the gall to chastise us for our laws yet he knows his are draconian in comparison.
And all the while he was talking smack about us Obama was standing back there with a smug grin on his face.
Is there any wonder why I don't like the prick.
So you thank me for my post? According to US immigration law, illegal immigrants are here illegally. Mexico is responsible for there being so many illegal Mexicans here. Besides the fact that Mexico is a corrupt hell hole, they actually publish guides on how to cross the border.
Millions of our dollars go into Mexico every year.
Their President had the gall to chastise us for our laws yet he knows his are draconian in comparison.
And all the while he was talking smack about us Obama was standing back there with a smug grin on his face.
Is there any wonder why I don't like the prick.
José;3235948 said:Originally posted by Ernie S.
So you thank me for my post? According to US immigration law, illegal immigrants are here illegally. Mexico is responsible for there being so many illegal Mexicans here. Besides the fact that Mexico is a corrupt hell hole, they actually publish guides on how to cross the border.
Ernie, if you take the time to read my posts on this matter you'll see I'm absolutely fair to America, I'm of the opinion that America has the right to implement even polemic measures such as mass deportations of illegals.
Unfortunately I cannot say the same about your treatment of Mexico.
1 - Mexico cannot prevent its citizens from leaving the country freely because this goes against all the fundamental principles of democratic states. This is what totalitarian countries like North Korea do.
2 - Mexico cannot be blamed for being an underdeveloped, third world country. If America wants to blame Mexico for its poverty it should first turn that dirty poor country of Afghanistan into a developed nation since the country is currently under US control.
AMERICA HAS ABSOLUTELY NO AUTHORITY TO DEMAND PROSPERITY FROM MEXICO IF SHE CANNOT BRING THAT SAME PROSPERITY TO ITS OWN "COLONIES".
THOSE WHO WANT TO POINT THE FINGER OF BLAME AT OTHERS SHOULD BE THE FIRST ONES TO SET A GOOD EXAMPLE!!!!
3 - According to the international protocol that informally rules border relations between neighboring countries, in the absence of a broad comphehensive border agreement, each country is resposible for its own side of the border.
I urge you to get a hold of your totally out of control patriotism and try to treat Mexico in a fair manner just like I treat America, Ernie. : )
originally posted by Ernie S.
it's a shame that it's leaders are so corrupt that a country so blessed is starving when, given ethical government, should be on a par economically with canada.
José;3237006 said:originally posted by Ernie S.
it's a shame that it's leaders are so corrupt that a country so blessed is starving when, given ethical government, should be on a par economically with canada.
Come on, America!! What are you waiting for to give "ethical government" to your overseas colony?? Why don't you put in practice in Afghanistan the same "ethical government" you say it would turn mexico into a wealthy nation??
Before blaming Mexico's corruption and unethical government America must put in practice her theories and turn Afghanistan into a developed nation. Countries that cannot bring prosperity to their own colonies have no moral authority to blame others!!
Come on, America!! Cut out the cheap talk and use Afghanistan to show Mexico how it's done!!
If you can't do it, shut up and stop demanding from Mexico what you failed miserably to achieve yourself!!
Anyway, more seriously speaking, there's no such thing as jobs "Americans won't do," one of the big myths running around in the immigration debate. Of course Americans would do any job - for the right WAGE. If picking strawberries payed $60 an hour and came with full health benefits, you'd see hundreds of people waiting in lines outside United Farm Workers for a shot at the job. You would only run into trouble at the supermarket, where strawberries would cost $100 a box, demand would totally collapse and all strawberry farms would go bankrupt ...............
Anyway, more seriously speaking, there's no such thing as jobs "Americans won't do," one of the big myths running around in the immigration debate. Of course Americans would do any job - for the right WAGE. If picking strawberries payed $60 an hour and came with full health benefits, you'd see hundreds of people waiting in lines outside United Farm Workers for a shot at the job. You would only run into trouble at the supermarket, where strawberries would cost $100 a box, demand would totally collapse and all strawberry farms would go bankrupt (lest they were bailed out at your expense), thereby getting rid of not only the formerly-illegal-immigrant jobs, but their managers and owners and those of associated products (i.e. strawberry jam makers, strawberry container makers, strawberry transporting truckers, etc). But you can be sure that they would definitely do those jobs, for the right amount of money. If there's nobody who would pay that wage, then there will not be a job for anybody in the first place though.
That leads to the second giant myth about immigration: "they take our JERBS!" This point of view seems to think that the job supply is some static figure, there's X amount of jobs of which Y is stolen by immigrants, leaving Americans with X-Y amount of jobs. This is completely false: there is no set number of jobs in the country - the fact that there's some jobs being done or not being done may increase or decrease the amount of jobs available at any given time, and this figure is constantly changing. Like we saw, because there are a bunch of low-wage illegals picking strawberries and a range of other agricultural products, this makes possible the jobs of the owners, managers, transporters, container-makers for that particular industry.
Now that's not necessarily a bad thing, it's not like every country has to make everything, there's no reason why the US should be producing its own food if it can't pay its legal workers enough to make it worthwhile for them and simultaneously cheap enough for anyone to buy it. If you think its worth it to bankrupt the agricultural industry (considering they're already subsidized to their eyeballs and STILL need low-wage illegals to be competitive in any way shape or form), then you should go gung-ho in writing your congressman about it and closing the border.
Originally posted by Nate
I've finally been here long enough to realize most of your posts like this is sarcasm José for i think you love this nation of ours as much as the next U.S. citizen but I gotta say, fuck Afganistan!!! Let Russia worry about them, as we should be with our Southern neighbors. As for what we're demanding from Mexico that we have failed miserably ourselves... What's that?
José;3237633 said:Originally posted by Nate
I've finally been here long enough to realize most of your posts like this is sarcasm José for i think you love this nation of ours as much as the next U.S. citizen but I gotta say, fuck Afganistan!!! Let Russia worry about them, as we should be with our Southern neighbors. As for what we're demanding from Mexico that we have failed miserably ourselves... What's that?
Nate,
A lot of posters blame America's immigration problems on Mexico's poverty and Mexico's porverty on the "corruption" and "unethical government" among Mexico's politicians.
They say naive platitudes such as this:
"The mexican people should get rid of its corrupt politicians and the country will be on its way to become a prousperous nation" (as if Mexico hadn't already gone through dozens of revolutions, uprisings and democratic elections).
Even Epsilon Delta has said things alone these lines!!!!
They make it sound as if the extremely complex, poorly understood socio-economic-political process of economic development of nations were the easiest thing to implement!!
As if all that is necessary to turn Mexico into a developed economy was to replace Mexico's political class!!
Mexico's poverty hurts the people of Mexico infinitely more than it hurts America with her illegal immigration problem. If economic development had a definite, clear recipe the country would have become an economic powerhouse centuries ago. If it were that simple there wouldn't be a single underdeveloped nation in the world!!
Answering your question directly, Nate, America demands from Mexico the same economic development she failed to bring to Cuba, Puerto Rico, Iraq and Afghanistan after ruling those 4 countries like colonies for decades!!!!
Originally posted by FifthCollumn
It is not up to the people of the United States to feed anyone other than their own poor, which they are not doing because the illegal LaRazians get there ahead of every other race. Force LaRaza to feed itself.
most of them do get paid more than the minimum wage
Yeah, I'll believe that when Satan's pushing a snowblower. If that statement were true, those mofo's wouldn't need to hire illegal help in the first place.
José;3237922 said:[Fair enough.
I would argue that economic development is an extremely complex, poorly understood and LONG TERM process and it's not within the power of any nation to achieve it through simple, short term measures. Some nations may never be able to achieve it no matter how hard they try.
Britain failed miserably in most of the British Empire: Nigeria, South Africa, India, Jamaica etc, etc...
America failed in Cuba, Puerto Rico, etc...
It's absolutely unrealistic and tremendously unfair to demand that Mexico wave its magic wand and become a prosperous nation in the short run.
most of them do get paid more than the minimum wage
Yeah, I'll believe that when Satan's pushing a snowblower. If that statement were true, those mofo's wouldn't need to hire illegal help in the first place.
My experience in Baltimore is that many jobs that pay mimimum wage or close to mimimum wage get filled my legal woekers. There is in Baltimore currently a SURPLUS of legal workers that show up at employment agencies to get these jobs. I admit that these are not physically greulling jobs like stoop labor on a farm, but many of the jobs do require working out of doors in harsh weather conditions.
So you thank me for my post? According to US immigration law, illegal immigrants are here illegally. Mexico is responsible for there being so many illegal Mexicans here. Besides the fact that Mexico is a corrupt hell hole, they actually publish guides on how to cross the border.
Millions of our dollars go into Mexico every year.
Their President had the gall to chastise us for our laws yet he knows his are draconian in comparison.
And all the while he was talking smack about us Obama was standing back there with a smug grin on his face.
Is there any wonder why I don't like the prick.
Ya know donchya that the great statesman Messiah's wonderful goverment car company built an 800 million dollar plant in Mexico? and that was after the great statesman messiah sold all the bondholder's and stockholder right down the rio grande?? you knew that didn't ya.. walll,,, we're supposed to vote for him anyway..
