Mom of Mauled Boy Says People More Concerned About the Dog

[Coyote]

And I'll tell you something else...if you're out in public walking multiple powerful dogs, and you have to prevent children from running up because you're afraid your dog is going to bite them..you're a huge part of the problem, and you're on borrowed time until somebody gets hurt.

Exactly - good point.

I've been in that situation, with one of my old aussies who didn't like children. Parents would let them come running up to us and I'd step in front of her and hold my hand out and say STOP. Then I'd tell them how to approach a dog, always to ask first and I'd let them pet my other dog, who was friendly. But if they had been both big powerful reactive dogs under poor control? What then?

 

[Coyote]

Go away Luddly, you fucking moron. The thought of any dog being subjected to you makes me want to cry.

You're free to disagree with me but, IMO, torturing a dog teaches him nothing except pain. The "fucking moron" is the one who believes torture is a good idea and its not my fault that the "fucking moron" also says she's a "christian".

It isn't the dogs fault but he needs to be put down. a whole lot of people dropped the ball on that one. Maybe people wanting to adopt a big dog need to pass an IQ test to prove that they are smarter than the dog.

I agree that the dog was failed by the people around him.

Stats show that the most bites are from intact males who are tied up. They live lives of quiet desperation - horny, lonely, lack of socialization. Dogs are not lawn ornaments. Spay/neuter them, bring them into your home and make them a member of your family.

Cute balls of fluff can grow up to be huge dogs. If you're not willing to teach obedience and socialize the dog, get a stuffed animal for the bed.

OTOH, once a dog bites a child, my opinion is he can never be trusted around children again.

There are millions of dogs and cats put down every year. More than 24% are so-called "purebred" and most are under the age of 3 years.

IOW, we're killing young healthy animals because there are more born than we have available homes.

Why put our limited resources into animals that cannot be placed?

Terrible tragedy.

We never learn.

I agree except with the statement they can never be trusted around children again - a lot depends on the bite and the circumstances and the particular dog. I would not make it an automatic death sentence for the dog.

But - a dog like Micki, is not a dog I'd try to save, and all that money and effort trying to save him could have been towards saving the many pitbulls that are put down for no other reason than being surplus. You have to draw lines somewhere and public safety is one of those lines in my mind.

 

[koshergrl]

The key to making a dog safe around kids is to always be in control when there are kids around. Not of the kids..you can't control random children...but of your dog. If your dog knows you're in control, they don't feel like they need to bite. Biting is a reaction to uncertainty, fear, or alternately, aggression...but it happens only when the dog doesn't trust/recognize someone as the leader.

If your dog looks to you for cues, and trusts you to manage situations, your dog isn't going to bite a kid that runs up to you because your dog knows you're going to deal with whatever happens. He trusts you to protect him, and to deal with whatever.

If he doesn't trust you, or feels like he's the one controlling the situation, he's going to act defensively because that's the role you've assigned him or allowed him to assume. And a dog that's just left to his own devices, particularly on a chain, is going to be fearful and possibly aggressive. Because they can't get away. The chain restricts their movement, they feel trapped, and they don't feel like anybody is looking out for them, except themselves. They are going to protect that space.

 

[gallantwarrior]

I know that site is not entirely impartial. But listen to you now...you're saying other dogs (plural?) have been killed by him and children attacked? You make it sound like he'd killed more than one dog and attacked more than one child. Exaggeration by choice of words.

It does disturb me that he killed a puppy. Was it really a small puppy, or was it a year-old type puppy? When I got my second doberman pup I was somewhat concerned because Greta was 10 months old and I was worried she my hurt the tiny pup. But my vet said "even a mean old junk-yard dog won't hurt a puppy." And he was right, she didn't hurt the puppy, although she bossed her around a lot.

It's just so bizarre..I wouldn't go anywhere near a chained dog I didn't know, especially a pitbull, and they just had this dog tied out there where children could run up to it!

You're an adult, of course you know better. . He was 4 years old and was most likely trying to play with the dog. The sitter was with the owner and watching the boy together. If there was danger the owner should have said, "don't let him play with the dog". The owner, in her interviews never claimed to have said such.

The puppy that entered his 18 foot radius should have never been killed, especially in a common area where everyone should be able to walk and play without fear. Some people may not even notice the dog as they are running and playing. The puppy getting mauled to death was a warning this dog was vicious. You just said your vet said, "even a mean ol junk yard dog wound not hurt a puppy".

It's quite clear to me that the people who put this dog out their on his 18' chain are the ones who need to be held accountable. I'm certainly not blaming the 4-year-old child.

My question about the puppy is how old was it? I've noticed a lot of people lately referring to year-old dogs as puppies, or saying they're still puppies until 18 months, that sort of thing. Because while people still refer to dogs that old as puppies, other dogs may not perceive them as puppies. I really wish I knew how old the puppy was. Not that it's okay for the pitbull to kill it, but you know when a dog is chained they are more dangerous...because they feel vulnerable.

You, of all people, should know that some dogs do not mature until 3-4 years of age. Even my Pyr required monitoring until she was about 3. Like humans children, dogs do not all mature to adulthood on a set schedule. Regardless, a dog that will kill another dog is useless...unless you are fighting dogs?

 

[gallantwarrior]

Totally by accident, I stumbled onto a program on the Animal Planet channel, called "Pit bulls and Parolees".

Here was a program that dealt with the pariahs of both the human and canine world.

The breed of dog that receives no mercy, because of an often undeserved reputation, that was created and fostered by irresponsible owners, and humans who are written off by self-righteous hypocritical bigots, who preach about, but don't believe in redemption.

I could have brought to this board a bunch of youtube episodes of the show in order to show that the merciless cruelty of those who jump into execution/euthanasia mode at the drop of a hat, is misplaced, but I will, instead, let those with an open mind find what I am talking about.

I could post at least an equal number of utube videos where pits attack and kill various other animals and humans with no viable provocation. People are supposed to be the intelligent factor in this equation. Pits are genetically coded for certain characteristics. OK, I accept that. But too many irresponsible, foolish, asshole humans own pitbulls...just because of those characteristics. They have no clue about proper training and socialization of the dog. Since controlling human behavior and choices is difficult, at best, maybe we should consider removing the dogs?

 

[gallantwarrior]

A bunch of very, very stupid adults who were responsible for the dog and for the child. The owner should be prosecuted. The baby sitter should get some kind of punishment. The pitbull should be put down. Those people who are supporting the dog are idiots and miscreants. It's all about the sympathy and blind support all over the country that people give to pitbulls: it's insane. The whole breed needs to be wiped off the face of the Earth.

I'm not a fan of the pitbull-type breeds, either. Most dog breeds are "specialists", having been genetically selected and bred for some specific trait. For example: I have a Great Pyrenees that lives with my goats. The breed has for centuries been selected for their herd-bonding and gaurdian traits. It's interesting to watch what she does when a friend's malamute gets a bit too interested in the goat kids that come to the fence when he's around. Of course, malamutes have an entirely different world view when it comes to prey species, like goats. My dog places herself between the goats and the malamute, actually sends the goats away. When the malamute moves away from the fence, the Pyr will lie down and even let the little kid goats use her as a playground. So, taking advantage of inborne traits and with proper training, I have a splendid gaurdian for my goats.
Pits, on the other hand, have been bred for the purpose of fighting and protection (to some extent). The breed has been selected for their physical strength and aggression. Why are people even surprised when pits react the way the one in this story did? Yes, if properly socialized and trained, a pit may make it through life without exhibting the tendencies it has been genetically selected for, but it might not, either. There's a woman of my acquaintence who is dying to take a couple of my kids. Not on a bet. She's got a pretty nice blue-nose pit bitch, but I could not be satisfied that the pit would not brutally attack and destroy any small animals this woman might bring into her home/yard.
People really do seem to think dog=dog. Not true.

If you understand about genetics you should probably look up what pits were bred for. They were bred specifically to be dog aggressive and specifically people friendly. Of all the dogs I have worked with they have this peculiar trait of being able to focus their aggression on one object and be completely passive with another at the same time. Its in their genetics not to bite people. The ones that do have been overbred and have temperament/mental issues.

They are genetically selected for aggression. Dogs, small children, cats, other animals...they are aggressive. They do seem very popular with certain people who have "small dick syndrome", though. You have one?

 

[koshergrl]

The poor/criminal class of people are always *fadding* on one breed of dog or the other, and whatever that breed is gets the reputation of being a killer.

Again..it's not the dogs, it's the owners. EDUCATION IS KEY. If you make pit bulls illegal, you just create a black market for them, and another breed will move into the spot vacated by them in the mainstream.

Wait till these fellas become the mean dog of choice:

Caucasian Shepherd Dog, Caucasian Ovcharka Information and Pictures

 

[gallantwarrior]

The poor/criminal class of people are always *fadding* on one breed of dog or the other, and whatever that breed is gets the reputation of being a killer.

Again..it's not the dogs, it's the owners. EDUCATION IS KEY. If you make pit bulls illegal, you just create a black market for them, and another breed will move into the spot vacated by them in the mainstream.

Wait till these fellas become the mean dog of choice:

Caucasian Shepherd Dog, Caucasian Ovcharka Information and Pictures

Those look like Tibetian Mastiffs, another rare breed of livestock guardian dogs...but also know for their aggressive nature.

 

[CaféAuLait]

Wow you are blaming the victim, Mom, who wasn't even there! The boy was with his baby sitter, visiting the dog owner, who was sitting outside in the common area when the boy was mauled, in the common area of the apartments.

The dog already mauled a puppy to death, who dared to walk by in the COMMON area of the apartments and a month or so later nearly killed Kevin. Wow.

Oh, wow. Do you think the dog knew this was the COMMON area of the apartments? Hmmm? Do you really think the dog knew that? Or perhaps, did the dog think it was his territory?

I suspect these people all knew each other, the babysitter, the mom, the dog's owners. I suspect they're all of the same ilk, meaning people who think they're "just dogs," doesn't matter if they're starving or miserable or neglected. because they're "just dogs." I notice the dog owners immediately released the dog, obviously had no love for the dog, didn't try to save him or anything like that.

They brought this on themselves. You think the mother had no idea a dog was kept there on a chain? A skinny, neglected dog, whose pathetic bone was probably his most prized possession? I think she did know, and is therefore culpable.

Do we have pictures of the dog prior to the mauling? Proof that the dog was skinny and neglected? Or just the word of people more concerned with a dog than a Guatemalan?

Yes, this was the dog the day after he was picked up.

He was not starving and or skin and bones as his supporters state. The Save Mickey site has pushed this rumor as well as the LIE he was in his own yard or on his property. Mickey was chained in the common area, where people should be safe. They also like to neglect the FACT Mickey mauled a German Shepherd puppy to death, that had come within his 18 foot range as well- shortly before he nearly killed Kevin.

 

[Gracie]

Idiot Blessing Woman wants to tear the face off the dog, then explain as she tears and rips, "doggie, you must be punished because you hurt the little boy and you are not supposed to hurt the little boy. This was awhile back, but see, this punishment comes now because you must understand that hurting little boys trying to take your bone away is not nice. So I shall tear the other side of your face off as you howl in pain, then I will explain further why this punishment is necessary because you are a dog and understand all I say perfectly"......RIPPPPPPPPPPPPP.

I hope to the God that Idiot Woman that blesses daily, has no pets. Ever. Because she is an idiot.

 

[koshergrl]

So are you, gracie. Do you have pets?

 

[Wake]

A few things.

• It's a dog. Not a human being. When it comes to the concept of morality, it's not on the level of a human.

• Killing the animal is nonsensical, because it's an animal behaving on instinct.

• Wanting the dog to live is not the same as not caring about what happened to the child.

• I don't think animals premeditate their attacks on people. They behave as they're trained.

 

[Gracie]

You bet I have pets. And none of them bite. Except Moki isn't fond of kids. So guess where he is when a kid happens to come over to visit the inlaws? In the bedroom.

Why have a dog if someone is going to slap it on a fucking chain? The idiot managers of the complex are just as responsible as the owner knowing he had an attacking dog..and the babysitter for not watching the kid.

So who is stupid again?

Do YOU have pets? Do you want to join Idiot Woman and explain to the dog it was BAD and now must be punished? Wanna take some pliers and rip that dogs face off as that punishment? I knew you were a bitch but I had no clue you were as stupid as JOS.

 

[Gracie]

A few things.

• It's a dog. Not a human being. When it comes to the concept of morality, it's not on the level of a human.

• Killing the animal is nonsensical, because it's an animal behaving on instinct.

• Wanting the dog to live is not the same as not caring about what happened to the child.

• I don't think animals premeditate their attacks on people. They behave as they're trained.

THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS^^^^^^^^^^^^

I am still just gobsmacked at Idiot Woman wanting to do the same thing to the dog so it would understand how BAD it was. Fucking tard.

 

[Coyote]

A few things.

• It's a dog. Not a human being. When it comes to the concept of morality, it's not on the level of a human.

• Killing the animal is nonsensical, because it's an animal behaving on instinct.

• Wanting the dog to live is not the same as not caring about what happened to the child.

• I don't think animals premeditate their attacks on people. They behave as they're trained.

They behave according to their instincts - they are strangers in a strange land, living by and expecting to understand human (primate) rules. It's a foreign language, and it's up to us to help them be good citizens in a human world.

Too often we fail at our responsibilities.

 

[Wake]

A few things.

• It's a dog. Not a human being. When it comes to the concept of morality, it's not on the level of a human.

• Killing the animal is nonsensical, because it's an animal behaving on instinct.

• Wanting the dog to live is not the same as not caring about what happened to the child.

• I don't think animals premeditate their attacks on people. They behave as they're trained.

They behave according to their instincts - they are strangers in a strange land, living by and expecting to understand human (primate) rules. It's a foreign language, and it's up to us to help them be good citizens in a human world.

Too often we fail at our responsibilities.

I think the public needs further education when it comes to responsible dog ownership. Not only that, but owners need to take full responsibility for what their dogs do, within reason.

The poor mother is heavily influenced by her anger and sorrow. Her judgement is affected.

 

[Againsheila]

This just goes to show how sick this world have become. To me, what was done to the boy should be done to the dog because it is the only way that the dog would know what it did to the boy.

God bless you and the boy and his mom always!!!

Holly

No, it would make no difference. Dogs are not capable of that level of reasoning. Putting down a vicious animal that has proven its nature to attack, maim, and kill smaller animals, including human children, is warranted, IMHO. I would certainly not want such a creature in my vicinity.

The dog should have been put down after he killed the other dog. He definitely should be put down now.

 

[Againsheila]

A few things.

• It's a dog. Not a human being. When it comes to the concept of morality, it's not on the level of a human.

• Killing the animal is nonsensical, because it's an animal behaving on instinct.

• Wanting the dog to live is not the same as not caring about what happened to the child.

• I don't think animals premeditate their attacks on people. They behave as they're trained.

They behave according to their instincts - they are strangers in a strange land, living by and expecting to understand human (primate) rules. It's a foreign language, and it's up to us to help them be good citizens in a human world.

Too often we fail at our responsibilities.

I think the public needs further education when it comes to responsible dog ownership. Not only that, but owners need to take full responsibility for what their dogs do, within reason.

The poor mother is heavily influenced by her anger and sorrow. Her judgement is affected.

We don't have room in this society for vicious dogs. The dog should have been put down when he killed the other dog. We had a dog when I was growing up that got out and killed two of my friend's cats. We had to put our dog down. I was told he was taken to a farm and it wasn't until I was an adult that I found out what happened. I agree with the decision. Once a dog has killed it will do so again.

 

[Asclepias]

I'm not a fan of the pitbull-type breeds, either. Most dog breeds are "specialists", having been genetically selected and bred for some specific trait. For example: I have a Great Pyrenees that lives with my goats. The breed has for centuries been selected for their herd-bonding and gaurdian traits. It's interesting to watch what she does when a friend's malamute gets a bit too interested in the goat kids that come to the fence when he's around. Of course, malamutes have an entirely different world view when it comes to prey species, like goats. My dog places herself between the goats and the malamute, actually sends the goats away. When the malamute moves away from the fence, the Pyr will lie down and even let the little kid goats use her as a playground. So, taking advantage of inborne traits and with proper training, I have a splendid gaurdian for my goats.
Pits, on the other hand, have been bred for the purpose of fighting and protection (to some extent). The breed has been selected for their physical strength and aggression. Why are people even surprised when pits react the way the one in this story did? Yes, if properly socialized and trained, a pit may make it through life without exhibting the tendencies it has been genetically selected for, but it might not, either. There's a woman of my acquaintence who is dying to take a couple of my kids. Not on a bet. She's got a pretty nice blue-nose pit bitch, but I could not be satisfied that the pit would not brutally attack and destroy any small animals this woman might bring into her home/yard.
People really do seem to think dog=dog. Not true.

If you understand about genetics you should probably look up what pits were bred for. They were bred specifically to be dog aggressive and specifically people friendly. Of all the dogs I have worked with they have this peculiar trait of being able to focus their aggression on one object and be completely passive with another at the same time. Its in their genetics not to bite people. The ones that do have been overbred and have temperament/mental issues.

They are genetically selected for aggression. Dogs, small children, cats, other animals...they are aggressive. They do seem very popular with certain people who have "small dick syndrome", though. You have one?

The first one to bring up little dicks is the one that is worried about his. Helen Keller was a female. What was her reasoning? Again do some research and explain to me how its possible for a total stranger to examine your aggressive pitbull before a fight?

 

[Againsheila]

Totally by accident, I stumbled onto a program on the Animal Planet channel, called "Pit bulls and Parolees".

Here was a program that dealt with the pariahs of both the human and canine world.

The breed of dog that receives no mercy, because of an often undeserved reputation, that was created and fostered by irresponsible owners, and humans who are written off by self-righteous hypocritical bigots, who preach about, but don't believe in redemption.

I could have brought to this board a bunch of youtube episodes of the show in order to show that the merciless cruelty of those who jump into execution/euthanasia mode at the drop of a hat, is misplaced, but I will, instead, let those with an open mind find what I am talking about.

I could post at least an equal number of utube videos where pits attack and kill various other animals and humans with no viable provocation. People are supposed to be the intelligent factor in this equation. Pits are genetically coded for certain characteristics. OK, I accept that. But too many irresponsible, foolish, asshole humans own pitbulls...just because of those characteristics. They have no clue about proper training and socialization of the dog. Since controlling human behavior and choices is difficult, at best, maybe we should consider removing the dogs?

I would never condemn and entire breed. I've met some wonderful pit bulls. That doesn't negate the fact that this pit bull killed a dog and should have been put down long before he tore into that child.