Muslims in America Condemn Extremists and Fear Anew for Their Lives

[mudwhistle]

Poor things..................got their feelings hurt..................

Um.............14 Americans have no more feelings about it..............They are dead............cry me a river...............perhaps they should have controlled their dang relatives......................

I'm not sure I'd call getting shot in the back or having a beer mug smashed in your face "hurt feelings".

Well, I'll remember to cry a little....and sigh a little......next time I see one of them being mistreated........then not feel so bad when I read about them burning down another Christian church and cutting another Christian's head off just because they won't convert.

When did that occur in America?

Well, this guy cut one woman's head off and was in the process of cutting another off when the cops blew his ass away.

Suspect in Oklahoma beheading tried converting co-workers to Islam | New York Post

But I'm not concerned just about Americans, but Christians in the Middle-East that have been the victims of genocide in the Sudan, Yemen, Iraq, Syria, Libya, you name it.

I suppose as long as it's not in your town, you don't give a flying-fuck, am I right?

It's not that I don't "give a flying-fuck" if it's not in my town, it's that cultures in those other countries are completely different than those here yet you are blaming Muslims here for the actions of Muslims there.

I wonder if you even know anything about the religion or have ever been in their country yourself.
I have.

There is a reason that Christians aren't going around acting like ISIS, al Qaeda, and Hamas. It's because of what they're taught in church. Problem with Muslims is there is always going to be a percentage of them that think being a good Muslim means killing people of other religions. Every single Muslim country we try to help eventually starts murdering us. That doesn't happen in any other society.

It says in the Quran that being a good Muslim means killing infidels. Their religion is backwards thinking instead of forward thinking.....and if you bring a bunch of them here, eventually they'll be doing what they're doing in Paris and have done in every part of the world they've gathered in large numbers. It's why India blew up after it's independence from Britain and the Bosnian war more recently.

For 1200 years Muslims have been committing genocide. They treat their women like slaves. They stand for everything you hate. Bigotry, racism, totalitarianism, religious persecution. They are so far right Republicans look like leftists in comparison...yet you libs carry their water. And it's only because your leaders are terrorist sympathizers.

I don't hate anyone. I just don't feel like laying out the red-carpet for those who want to murder me, but you do it appears.

 

[mudwhistle]

Well, this guy cut one woman's head off and was in the process of cutting another off when the cops blew his ass away.

Suspect in Oklahoma beheading tried converting co-workers to Islam | New York Post

But I'm not concerned just about Americans, but Christians in the Middle-East that have been the victims of genocide in the Sudan, Yemen, Iraq, Syria, Libya, you name it.

I suppose as long as it's not in your town, you don't give a flying-fuck, am I right?

It's not that I don't "give a flying-fuck" if it's not in my town, it's that cultures in those other countries are completely different than those here yet you are blaming Muslims here for the actions of Muslims there.

San Bernardino and Oklahoma are not 'over there', genius.

You need to try to follow the conversation first before opening your mouth and saying something stupid, genius.

You mean like Mudwhistles comment, "Well, this guy cut one woman's head off and was in the process of cutting another off when the cops blew his ass away.

Suspect in Oklahoma beheading tried converting co-workers to Islam | New York Post"

To which you said "It's not that I don't "give a flying-fuck" if it's not in my town, it's that cultures in those other countries are completely different than those here yet you are blaming Muslims here for the actions of Muslims there."

To which I responded, "San Bernardino and Oklahoma are not 'over there', genius." referencing recent events as well as Mudwhistle's explanation.

But in the interest of being truthful, Mudwhistle, am I following this right in your opinion or not?

If not I offer my apologies, but I dont see where I deviated from the path of good interpretation.

Perhaps I misunderstood your comment then.

Oklahoma incident is not the product of culture. If you read the articles about this man, he is clearly very mentally ill. San Bernardino is a terrorist attack. Is it any different than the terrorist attack at Planned Parenthood? How about the massacre at the Charleston Church? Is the Muslim community in San Bernardino any different than the Christian community in Charleston?

So you're saying that two people shooting up a Christmas party aren't mentally ill?

Dude....you're dancing all over the place on this.

You spend all of your life with blinders on.

I know some good Muslims.....and I also know a good number that are real assholes.....and they feel their religion gives them the right to be that way because I wouldn't understand.....I'm just an infidel.

 

[Programmer]

Mr. Chelsey esq. made a clown of himself at that press conference. Stakes are too high to play stupid for the sake of being polite.

The alarm to raise is regarding our failures to prejudice, rather than our supposed non-prejudicial nature as Americans. Check your history with that and get back to me.

 

[Jroc]

I don't like that we are now called a Judeo-Christian country. I mean by now what Jews are 3%, probably more like 10%, and are in all the high places, how did that happen. Same thing happened in Germany and Russia.

Hey Genius it comes Judeo-Christian morals from the new and old testament. Doesn't have anything with how many Jews are in the country

 

[Jroc]

We are Americans.

We should not tolerate this or excuse it in our country or in our politicians and elected officials.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/12/05/u...-anew-for-their-lives.html?smid=fb-share&_r=0

In a news conference Friday, lawyers for Mr. Farook’s family cautioned the public against jumping to conclusions about the attackers’ motivations. One lawyer, David Chesley, said the F.B.I.’s claim that Mr. Farook’s wife, Tashfeen Malik, had pledged allegiance to the Islamic State on Facebook was “nebulous” evidence.

“Until there is absolute, clear evidence, every headline doesn’t have to say ‘Muslim massacre’ or ‘Muslim shooters,’ because it’s going to cause intolerance,” Mr. Chesley said.

However, Muslim Americans are now confronting the fact that to many Americans, Mr. Farook and other terrorists do represent Islam — especially since polls show that most Americans know no Muslims and little about Islam.

“My identity and everything that I am becomes erased every time one of these incidents occurs,” said Nabihah Maqbool, 27, a law student at the University of Chicago. “It all becomes collapsed into these senseless acts of violence being committed by people who are part of my group.”

Like many other Muslim American women, Ms. Maqbool said that she had considered taking off her hijab, or head scarf, out of fear of being victimized. She said that driving back to Chicago after celebrating Thanksgiving with her family, she had decided not to stop and pray on the grassy lawn outside an interstate rest stop, as she usually does.

“I just got so nervous that something could happen to me by any unhinged individual who saw me as someone who deserved violence,” Ms. Maqbool said.

The F.B.I. said it did not yet have data for hate crimes in 2015, and would not comment on whether there had recently been a rise in attacks on Muslims and their houses of worship. A chart provided by Stephen G. Fischer Jr., chief of multimedia productions for the F.B.I.’s criminal justice information service, showed that bias-related hate crimes against Muslims were at a peak in 2001, with 481 reported. In 2014, 154 such crimes were reported.

But in recent weeks, American Muslims have reported a spate of violence and intimidation against them: women wearing head scarves accosted; Muslim children bullied; bullets shot at a mosque in Meriden, Conn.; feces thrown at a mosque in Pflugerville, Tex.

Omair Siddiqi said he had been about to get into his car in the parking lot of a shopping mall in the Dallas suburbs last month when a man came up to him, flashed a gun and said, “If I wanted to, I could kill you right now.”

Mr. Siddiqi said he stayed quiet and the man walked away. Mr. Siddiqi called 911 and is now in the process of getting a concealed-handgun permit. “It’s very scary in times like this,” he said.

In a Dallas suburb, about a dozen protesters congregated outside the Islamic Center of Irving last month, some covering their faces with bandannas and carrying hunting rifles, tactical shotguns and AR-15s. The group that organized the protest posted on Facebook a list of the names and addresses of dozens of Muslims and what they called “Muslim sympathizers.”

Khalid Y. Hamideh, a spokesman for the Islamic Association of North Texas and a Dallas lawyer, called the mosque protest “un-American.”

“It would be unfathomable for that to occur outside a church or synagogue,” he said. “At the same time, we’re realists. We understand what’s going on around the country. We thank God for our friends in law enforcement and our interfaith partners.”


​

If we were in their countries, hundreds, maybe thousands of them would have been killed by now, or burned to death the way they have to Christians in their own countries. The reason they're afraid is because they know how we would be treated in their home countries.

They have reason to be afraid. I think it's healthy.

With a few exceptions, I doubt they have anything to fear......at this time.

If Obama continues down the path he's on....that may change.

We aren't in "their" countries. THEY aren't in your so-called "their" countries. Why? Because the THEY were are talking about are American citizens! They don't belong in the Middle East. They belong here. Is Europe "your" country?

There is no Anti-muslim backlash here. You could give a shit about those people being murdered, only that it interferes with narrative you push here CAIR girl. Look at our collage campuses being taken over by the muslm's nutjobs and the leftists Jew haters you have no problem with them. You actually support them

 

[Jroc]

Poor things..................got their feelings hurt..................

Um.............14 Americans have no more feelings about it..............They are dead............cry me a river...............perhaps they should have controlled their dang relatives......................

I'm not sure I'd call getting shot in the back or having a beer mug smashed in your face "hurt feelings".

Well, I'll remember to cry a little....and sigh a little......next time I see one of them being mistreated........then not feel so bad when I read about them burning down another Christian church and cutting another Christian's head off just because they won't convert.

When did that occur in America?

Well, this guy cut one woman's head off and was in the process of cutting another off when the cops blew his ass away.

Suspect in Oklahoma beheading tried converting co-workers to Islam | New York Post

But I'm not concerned just about Americans, but Christians in the Middle-East that have been the victims of genocide in the Sudan, Yemen, Iraq, Syria, Libya, you name it.

I suppose as long as it's not in your town, you don't give a flying-fuck, am I right?

It's not that I don't "give a flying-fuck" if it's not in my town, it's that cultures in those other countries are completely different than those here yet you are blaming Muslims here for the actions of Muslims there.

You want all the muslims there here

 

[Igrok_]

liberalism can't stand against islam. If US is free and tolerant, that means it becomes islamic.

 

[eagle1462010]

Rename the thread....................

Christians in America Condemn Extremists and fear for their Lives...........

Now tell me about the lady hiding in her closet while the manhunt for the thugs went on.

Little old lady getting gas and a car full of Muslims shows up........are they the ones who are going to kill her today............Are they the good ones...........or are they gonna yell ANKAR AKINBAR and kill the little old lady.

EVERY TIME A RADICALIZED Muslim GOES ON A KILLING SPREE...................Some asshat starts PLAYING THE VICTIM CARD in response.............Look at the evil CHRISTIANS threatening PEACEFUL MUSLIMS............SCARING THEM..................

My first post stands..............................CRY ME A FUCKING RIVER.............

Look at CURRENT EVENTS................RADICAL MUSLIMS ARE KILLING PEOPLE GLOBALLY.......................

Pardon me for being suspicious of those here.............OR BRINGING MORE HERE.................

 

[Delta4Embassy]

We are Americans.

We should not tolerate this or excuse it in our country or in our politicians and elected officials.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/12/05/u...-anew-for-their-lives.html?smid=fb-share&_r=0

In a news conference Friday, lawyers for Mr. Farook’s family cautioned the public against jumping to conclusions about the attackers’ motivations. One lawyer, David Chesley, said the F.B.I.’s claim that Mr. Farook’s wife, Tashfeen Malik, had pledged allegiance to the Islamic State on Facebook was “nebulous” evidence.

“Until there is absolute, clear evidence, every headline doesn’t have to say ‘Muslim massacre’ or ‘Muslim shooters,’ because it’s going to cause intolerance,” Mr. Chesley said.

However, Muslim Americans are now confronting the fact that to many Americans, Mr. Farook and other terrorists do represent Islam — especially since polls show that most Americans know no Muslims and little about Islam.

“My identity and everything that I am becomes erased every time one of these incidents occurs,” said Nabihah Maqbool, 27, a law student at the University of Chicago. “It all becomes collapsed into these senseless acts of violence being committed by people who are part of my group.”

Like many other Muslim American women, Ms. Maqbool said that she had considered taking off her hijab, or head scarf, out of fear of being victimized. She said that driving back to Chicago after celebrating Thanksgiving with her family, she had decided not to stop and pray on the grassy lawn outside an interstate rest stop, as she usually does.

“I just got so nervous that something could happen to me by any unhinged individual who saw me as someone who deserved violence,” Ms. Maqbool said.

The F.B.I. said it did not yet have data for hate crimes in 2015, and would not comment on whether there had recently been a rise in attacks on Muslims and their houses of worship. A chart provided by Stephen G. Fischer Jr., chief of multimedia productions for the F.B.I.’s criminal justice information service, showed that bias-related hate crimes against Muslims were at a peak in 2001, with 481 reported. In 2014, 154 such crimes were reported.

But in recent weeks, American Muslims have reported a spate of violence and intimidation against them: women wearing head scarves accosted; Muslim children bullied; bullets shot at a mosque in Meriden, Conn.; feces thrown at a mosque in Pflugerville, Tex.

Omair Siddiqi said he had been about to get into his car in the parking lot of a shopping mall in the Dallas suburbs last month when a man came up to him, flashed a gun and said, “If I wanted to, I could kill you right now.”

Mr. Siddiqi said he stayed quiet and the man walked away. Mr. Siddiqi called 911 and is now in the process of getting a concealed-handgun permit. “It’s very scary in times like this,” he said.

In a Dallas suburb, about a dozen protesters congregated outside the Islamic Center of Irving last month, some covering their faces with bandannas and carrying hunting rifles, tactical shotguns and AR-15s. The group that organized the protest posted on Facebook a list of the names and addresses of dozens of Muslims and what they called “Muslim sympathizers.”

Khalid Y. Hamideh, a spokesman for the Islamic Association of North Texas and a Dallas lawyer, called the mosque protest “un-American.”

“It would be unfathomable for that to occur outside a church or synagogue,” he said. “At the same time, we’re realists. We understand what’s going on around the country. We thank God for our friends in law enforcement and our interfaith partners.”


​

Remind me again what happened to Japanese-Americans after Pearl Harbor? Sounds perfectly American to me. And they were only suspected of collusion.

Muslims in America ARE working against us. There's no indications they wanna exist side-by-side with us. They want Islam to rule the whole world and everyone that doesn't wanna convert to be killed. Where a Muslim majority exists in any country, Islam is the ruling faith in and out of government.

The people, who, like myself until recently, reasoned tolerant positions were dwelling in a sea of false-denial. And the thought of 1.7 billion enemies wasn't especially appealing either of course. But that's the reality.

If Islam got its way, we'd be living under Islamic law. They're going to be the majority global religion in a few more years, so why wouldn't they try and take over? Christianity held sway for centuries and tore through Muslim lands imposing its will onto them, and now that Christianity's weak, Islam is returning the favor.

Look at Israel, they don't wanna live peacefully and coexist, they wanna rule. And worse, they believe they can win.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Perhaps I misunderstood your comment then.

Oklahoma incident is not the product of culture. If you read the articles about this man, he is clearly very mentally ill. San Bernardino is a terrorist attack. Is it any different than the terrorist attack at Planned Parenthood? How about the massacre at the Charleston Church? Is the Muslim community in San Bernardino any different than the Christian community in Charleston?

We do not have one American culture any more. We have a salad bowl of cultures, thanks to multiculturalism, with most of these cultures adhering to a basic set of principles common to almost all of them. But some of the more recent ones do NOT hold to the basic values/principles, one of which are the Salafists here who insulate themselves from our culture based on the tenets of their faith. They are sort of 'Angry Amish' who control 90% of the mosques in the USA.

You and many others like to think that all the people who live between our borders are Americanized to some degree. But this simply is not True.

And to answer your question, yes, there is a difference between lone wolf attacks who operate autonomously vrs people who attack as part of a coordinated military style operation using bombs, bullet proof vests, etc. The first is usually spur of the moment (though not always) and is over when the shooting is over, while the latter is more deliberate usually and hints at something broader and more ominous.

 

[JimBowie1958]

obama and lynch are pushing the, "rat out the suspicious muslim program."

And will then prosecute you if it turns out to be nothing.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Look at Israel, they don't wanna live peacefully and coexist, they wanna rule. And worse, they believe they can win.

The track record has shown Israel can win and has always won. They cant afford to lose even one war.

What will end Israel is demographic growth.

The Arabs in Isral are growing much faster as a population than the Jewish population.

IT is in Israel's national interest and that of the Jews living there to bring middle class prosperity to the Arab population ASAP so it will slow down their demographic growth rates.

 

[Stephanie]

well guess what. THEY AREN'T the only ones fearing ANEW for their lives. we are all so so sorry for them and hey the hell the rest of us FEARING

gawd, if it's not them using black people, they went to using Hispanics, homosexuals, and now it's the MUSLIMS again

what ever happened to WE are all Americans?

 

[Fang]

Muslims in America Condemn Extremists and Fear Anew for Their Lives

As they should. There are walking targets for the New Crusaders off to their Holy War, for Jesus.

Luke 23:34

Jesus said, "Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing." And they divided up his clothes by casting lots.

PaintMyHouse you side with ISIS. I get it. Keep spewing your anti-Chistian garbage. It suits you well.

God Bless America.

 

[JimBowie1958]

We are a nation of laws and rights and those rights extend to all of our citizens.

IF we are a nation of laws then why do our courts ignore the specific wording of laws they make rulings on, like the case where SCOTUS ruled contrary to the specific wording of the ACA that said that states that did not set up their own exchanges were not eligible for financial assistance to insurance subscribers?

IF we are a nation of laws then why are the political parties so worried about having a majority of their own ideology in control of SCOTUS?

IF we are a nation of laws then why does the Executive branch simply ignore the limitations of the Constitution on immigration actions today that they agreed would be unconstitutional only a few years ago?

IF we are a nation of laws then why does SCOTUS simply redefine words that have had a specific meaning for thousands of years as the word 'marriage' does?

How can laws rule if you can simply ignore or redefine words meaning as you go without any legislative action?

IF we have the same rights extended to all citizens then how do we legally have government contract set asides based on race and gender?

If we have the same rights then why is it if a minority (black, Hispanic, female) person is in a lawsuit with a majority (white male) person, the case is interpreted from the viewpoint of the 'reasonable' minority person ALWAYS?

I agree we used to be a nation of laws to some extent, but there were exceptions even then.

Now we are a nation ruled by political coalitions who use the laws as a fig leaf and the Constitution to wipe their ass.

 

[JimBowie1958]

well guess what. THEY AREN'T the only ones fearing ANEW for their lives. we are all so so sorry for them and hey the hell the rest of us FEARING

gawd, if it's not them using black people, they went to using Hispanics, homosexuals, and now it's the MUSLIMS again

what ever happened to WE are all Americans?

What happened is that Identity Politics took over the left. You is what you is now rules, and the idea that we are all Americans is to betray your race and/or gender.

Unless you are a white male of course, then you are EXPECTED to betray your race and gender and the libtard white males gladly do so, hoping for some scraps to fall from the minority banquet table that they are not invited to any more.

 

[JimBowie1958]

I wonder if you even know anything about the religion or have ever been in their country yourself.
I have.

There is a reason that Christians aren't going around acting like ISIS, al Qaeda, and Hamas. It's because of what they're taught in church. Problem with Muslims is there is always going to be a percentage of them that think being a good Muslim means killing people of other religions. Every single Muslim country we try to help eventually starts murdering us. That doesn't happen in any other society.

It says in the Quran that being a good Muslim means killing infidels. Their religion is backwards thinking instead of forward thinking.....and if you bring a bunch of them here, eventually they'll be doing what they're doing in Paris and have done in every part of the world they've gathered in large numbers. It's why India blew up after it's independence from Britain and the Bosnian war more recently.

For 1200 years Muslims have been committing genocide. They treat their women like slaves. They stand for everything you hate. Bigotry, racism, totalitarianism, religious persecution. They are so far right Republicans look like leftists in comparison...yet you libs carry their water. And it's only because your leaders are terrorist sympathizers.

I don't hate anyone. I just don't feel like laying out the red-carpet for those who want to murder me, but you do it appears.

Proving that they are so 'good' that they will help those who want to kill them is a hallmark of libtard white male thought, and they are proud of it.

 

[Pogo]

You go ahead and grieve for the inconveniences suffered by this Mrs. Nagbool....who is now afraid to get out of her car in Chicago* and pray toward Mecca...like she usually does.


Us Sane Americans will grieve for the dead left behind by Mr. & Mrs. Farook...the murderous Muslims in California..

No more Muslims in America for now....Suspend all immigration...we have quite enough for now, thank you.

_______________________

*(By the way, I would be afraid to get out of my car at all in most of Chicago.)

http://www.post-gazette.com/local/c...alls-attack-a-hate-crime/stories/201511290154

__________________________________

Long boring article giving only one side of the tale....one which I wish I hadn't wasted my time on..but I suppose we can agree that driving a taxi in one of those rotting liberal cities in the North.....is a hazardous occupation.

She was attacked for speaking a language with her own family that was not English.
Doesn't get much more pig-ignorant than that.

 

[Pogo]

We are Americans.

We should not tolerate this or excuse it in our country or in our politicians and elected officials.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/12/05/u...-anew-for-their-lives.html?smid=fb-share&_r=0

In a news conference Friday, lawyers for Mr. Farook’s family cautioned the public against jumping to conclusions about the attackers’ motivations. One lawyer, David Chesley, said the F.B.I.’s claim that Mr. Farook’s wife, Tashfeen Malik, had pledged allegiance to the Islamic State on Facebook was “nebulous” evidence.

“Until there is absolute, clear evidence, every headline doesn’t have to say ‘Muslim massacre’ or ‘Muslim shooters,’ because it’s going to cause intolerance,” Mr. Chesley said.

However, Muslim Americans are now confronting the fact that to many Americans, Mr. Farook and other terrorists do represent Islam — especially since polls show that most Americans know no Muslims and little about Islam.

“My identity and everything that I am becomes erased every time one of these incidents occurs,” said Nabihah Maqbool, 27, a law student at the University of Chicago. “It all becomes collapsed into these senseless acts of violence being committed by people who are part of my group.”

Like many other Muslim American women, Ms. Maqbool said that she had considered taking off her hijab, or head scarf, out of fear of being victimized. She said that driving back to Chicago after celebrating Thanksgiving with her family, she had decided not to stop and pray on the grassy lawn outside an interstate rest stop, as she usually does.

“I just got so nervous that something could happen to me by any unhinged individual who saw me as someone who deserved violence,” Ms. Maqbool said.

The F.B.I. said it did not yet have data for hate crimes in 2015, and would not comment on whether there had recently been a rise in attacks on Muslims and their houses of worship. A chart provided by Stephen G. Fischer Jr., chief of multimedia productions for the F.B.I.’s criminal justice information service, showed that bias-related hate crimes against Muslims were at a peak in 2001, with 481 reported. In 2014, 154 such crimes were reported.

But in recent weeks, American Muslims have reported a spate of violence and intimidation against them: women wearing head scarves accosted; Muslim children bullied; bullets shot at a mosque in Meriden, Conn.; feces thrown at a mosque in Pflugerville, Tex.

Omair Siddiqi said he had been about to get into his car in the parking lot of a shopping mall in the Dallas suburbs last month when a man came up to him, flashed a gun and said, “If I wanted to, I could kill you right now.”

Mr. Siddiqi said he stayed quiet and the man walked away. Mr. Siddiqi called 911 and is now in the process of getting a concealed-handgun permit. “It’s very scary in times like this,” he said.

In a Dallas suburb, about a dozen protesters congregated outside the Islamic Center of Irving last month, some covering their faces with bandannas and carrying hunting rifles, tactical shotguns and AR-15s. The group that organized the protest posted on Facebook a list of the names and addresses of dozens of Muslims and what they called “Muslim sympathizers.”

Khalid Y. Hamideh, a spokesman for the Islamic Association of North Texas and a Dallas lawyer, called the mosque protest “un-American.”

“It would be unfathomable for that to occur outside a church or synagogue,” he said. “At the same time, we’re realists. We understand what’s going on around the country. We thank God for our friends in law enforcement and our interfaith partners.”


​

How nice, CAIR girl up to her usual propaganda. How about you show all of us the massive, muslim, demonstrations, denouncing islamic terrorism.

How 'bout you show us all the massive Christian demonstrations denouncing Robert Dear.
Or Eric Rudolph.
Or Scott Roeder.
Or Tim McVeigh.
Etc etc etc.

Or alternately -- essplain how the population of some religion as a whole is responsible for the actions of every given member that would make those necessary.

John Houser, the guy who shot up the theater in Lafayette, was a member of USMB -- are we expected to all meet somewhere in some massive demonstration?

You can't spell "Composition Fallacy" without "arrogance".

 

[Pogo]

Why would muslems in America "fear anew for their lives" when there hasn't been a single incident of assault or murder directed at muslems while Americans have endured several incidents sponsored by muslems?

Not a "single" one, no. Multiple incidents. Like those already posted in posts 13 and 15.

Way to read the thread, dumbass.