Nine People Who Saw the Greek Crisis Coming Years Before Everyone Else Did

[Dovahkiin]

Nine People Who Saw the Greek Crisis Coming Years Before Everyone Else Did
Notice:
Wynne Godley
Stephanie Kelton
Warren Mosler
L. Randall Wray
You can look them up yourselves, but they're all related in regards to MMT.

Yes when you run out of people to tax to fund your failed social programs, anyone can see that!

That scenario only applies to a country not sovereign in its own currency/with foreign debts/a pegged currency.

See how the far left will not admit that their failed social programs are to blame.

You can not generate taxes when there is no more rich people to tax. And continuing to create and expand social programs is not the answer..

Evan a two year old can see that!

Where do you think "rich people" get the dollars the government taxes from them?

By running successful business!

Not by creating and running failed far left social programs/experiments that are not funded!

Where do the dollars come from in the first place? Government spending/bank loans.

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

Nine People Who Saw the Greek Crisis Coming Years Before Everyone Else Did

Although the problems in Greece didn't begin making big headlines until 2009, a number of economists, politicians and professors spotted cracks in the European currency union as early as the 1990s. Meanwhile, it's interesting to note that the country had a tough time making it into the single currency in the first place. Greece failed to qualify for the euro in 1998 before being granted admission in 2001.

Here are some people who must have had crystal balls.

Notice:
Wynne Godley
Stephanie Kelton
Warren Mosler
L. Randall Wray
You can look them up yourselves, but they're all related in regards to MMT.

Oh not the stupid MMT. Yeah, they must have predicted that Greece goes broke because it can't print money. Damn tools!

How can a country sovereign in its own currency without pegging the currency or foreign debts ever go bankrupt on a "debt" denominated in its own currency?

By not printing money like crazy. Or just by simply defaulting or restructuring its debt because it wishes. Next question!

P.S. Printing press is not magic.

Without the government sector running a net deficit, how does the private sector get more liability free dollars? Loans create deposits, but this nets to zero (mostly.) Of course, banks loan based on the credit worthiness of the person. That person has to acquire savings from another persons spending..

Here are articles regarding Greece and Goldman Sachs, Greece already had MASSIVE debts pre-Euro, this alone would have not allowed Greece to join Eurozone, so they hired Goldman Sachs to HIDE Greece's existing debts, so Greece could get into Eurozone SIMPLY to apply for HAND-OUT'S ie. Bail Outs.

Greeks urged to sue Goldman Sachs for role in euro debacle

Greek Debt Crisis: How Goldman Sachs Helped Greece to Mask its True Debt - SPIEGEL ONLINE

Goldman Secret Greece Loan Shows Two Sinners as Client Unravels

Greece joined the Eurozone in 2001. The Greeks did their own audit of their financial books.

Then the EU Audit of the Greek financial books occured in 2004 THIS is WHEN Brussels and ECB discovered the numbers didn't add up, this is when they also discovered that Goldman Sachs had deliberately cooked the books for Greek Government so Greece on FALSE pretences could join the Eurozone....at this point ALL sympathy for Greece and her problems basically evaporated:

Greek Financial Audit, 2004 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Dovahkiin]

Nine People Who Saw the Greek Crisis Coming Years Before Everyone Else Did
Notice:
Wynne Godley
Stephanie Kelton
Warren Mosler
L. Randall Wray
You can look them up yourselves, but they're all related in regards to MMT.

Oh not the stupid MMT. Yeah, they must have predicted that Greece goes broke because it can't print money. Damn tools!

How can a country sovereign in its own currency without pegging the currency or foreign debts ever go bankrupt on a "debt" denominated in its own currency?

By not printing money like crazy. Or just by simply defaulting or restructuring its debt because it wishes. Next question!

P.S. Printing press is not magic.

Without the government sector running a net deficit, how does the private sector get more liability free dollars? Loans create deposits, but this nets to zero (mostly.) Of course, banks loan based on the credit worthiness of the person. That person has to acquire savings from another persons spending..

Here are articles regarding Greece and Goldman Sachs, Greece already had MASSIVE debts pre-Euro, this alone would have not allowed Greece to join Eurozone, so they hired Goldman Sachs to HIDE Greece's existing debts, so Greece could get into Eurozone SIMPLY to apply for HAND-OUT'S ie. Bail Outs.

Greeks urged to sue Goldman Sachs for role in euro debacle

Greek Debt Crisis: How Goldman Sachs Helped Greece to Mask its True Debt - SPIEGEL ONLINE

Goldman Secret Greece Loan Shows Two Sinners as Client Unravels

Greece joined the Eurozone in 2001. The Greeks did their own audit of their financial books.

Then the EU Audit of the Greek financial books occured in 2004 THIS is WHEN Brussels and ECB discovered the numbers didn't add up, this is when they also discovered that Goldman Sachs had deliberately cooked the books for Greek Government so Greece on FALSE pretences could join the Eurozone....at this point ALL sympathy for Greece and her problems basically evaporated:

Greek Financial Audit, 2004 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Greece should've never gone to the euro. They'd be fine if they didn't.

 

[Norman]

Oh not the stupid MMT. Yeah, they must have predicted that Greece goes broke because it can't print money. Damn tools!

How can a country sovereign in its own currency without pegging the currency or foreign debts ever go bankrupt on a "debt" denominated in its own currency?

By not printing money like crazy. Or just by simply defaulting or restructuring its debt because it wishes. Next question!

P.S. Printing press is not magic.

The government creates money "from thin air" just like banks. This happens all the time.

Yes I said "IF", they don't want to do that. Besides that it's the central bank that prints the money, NOT THE GOVERNMENT you idiot! Do you have a cognitive deficit?

For all of my discussions, I lump together the central bank and the government, since the CB is essentially an independent entity within the government.

How about not doing this and starting to live in the reality?

Reality? No way... if your school is MMT.

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

Oh not the stupid MMT. Yeah, they must have predicted that Greece goes broke because it can't print money. Damn tools!

How can a country sovereign in its own currency without pegging the currency or foreign debts ever go bankrupt on a "debt" denominated in its own currency?

By not printing money like crazy. Or just by simply defaulting or restructuring its debt because it wishes. Next question!

P.S. Printing press is not magic.

Without the government sector running a net deficit, how does the private sector get more liability free dollars? Loans create deposits, but this nets to zero (mostly.) Of course, banks loan based on the credit worthiness of the person. That person has to acquire savings from another persons spending..

Here are articles regarding Greece and Goldman Sachs, Greece already had MASSIVE debts pre-Euro, this alone would have not allowed Greece to join Eurozone, so they hired Goldman Sachs to HIDE Greece's existing debts, so Greece could get into Eurozone SIMPLY to apply for HAND-OUT'S ie. Bail Outs.

Greeks urged to sue Goldman Sachs for role in euro debacle

Greek Debt Crisis: How Goldman Sachs Helped Greece to Mask its True Debt - SPIEGEL ONLINE

Goldman Secret Greece Loan Shows Two Sinners as Client Unravels

Greece joined the Eurozone in 2001. The Greeks did their own audit of their financial books.

Then the EU Audit of the Greek financial books occured in 2004 THIS is WHEN Brussels and ECB discovered the numbers didn't add up, this is when they also discovered that Goldman Sachs had deliberately cooked the books for Greek Government so Greece on FALSE pretences could join the Eurozone....at this point ALL sympathy for Greece and her problems basically evaporated:

Greek Financial Audit, 2004 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Greece should've never gone to the euro. They'd be fine if they didn't.

You are wrong, there is nothing wrong with being on the Euro. Read the newspaper articles I provide, your response to me far to quick, you cannot POSSIBLY have had time to read those articles.

I know what I'm talking about, I have extensive knowledge of what occurs on and in my own Continent.

 

[Dovahkiin]

How can a country sovereign in its own currency without pegging the currency or foreign debts ever go bankrupt on a "debt" denominated in its own currency?

By not printing money like crazy. Or just by simply defaulting or restructuring its debt because it wishes. Next question!

P.S. Printing press is not magic.

The government creates money "from thin air" just like banks. This happens all the time.

Yes I said "IF", they don't want to do that. Besides that it's the central bank that prints the money, NOT THE GOVERNMENT you idiot! Do you have a cognitive deficit?

For all of my discussions, I lump together the central bank and the government, since the CB is essentially an independent entity within the government.

How about not doing this and starting to live in the reality?

Reality? No way... if your school is MMT.

Huh? I already know what reality is, the central bank is an independent entity within the government, subject to review.

 

[Dovahkiin]

How can a country sovereign in its own currency without pegging the currency or foreign debts ever go bankrupt on a "debt" denominated in its own currency?

By not printing money like crazy. Or just by simply defaulting or restructuring its debt because it wishes. Next question!

P.S. Printing press is not magic.

Without the government sector running a net deficit, how does the private sector get more liability free dollars? Loans create deposits, but this nets to zero (mostly.) Of course, banks loan based on the credit worthiness of the person. That person has to acquire savings from another persons spending..

Here are articles regarding Greece and Goldman Sachs, Greece already had MASSIVE debts pre-Euro, this alone would have not allowed Greece to join Eurozone, so they hired Goldman Sachs to HIDE Greece's existing debts, so Greece could get into Eurozone SIMPLY to apply for HAND-OUT'S ie. Bail Outs.

Greeks urged to sue Goldman Sachs for role in euro debacle

Greek Debt Crisis: How Goldman Sachs Helped Greece to Mask its True Debt - SPIEGEL ONLINE

Goldman Secret Greece Loan Shows Two Sinners as Client Unravels

Greece joined the Eurozone in 2001. The Greeks did their own audit of their financial books.

Then the EU Audit of the Greek financial books occured in 2004 THIS is WHEN Brussels and ECB discovered the numbers didn't add up, this is when they also discovered that Goldman Sachs had deliberately cooked the books for Greek Government so Greece on FALSE pretences could join the Eurozone....at this point ALL sympathy for Greece and her problems basically evaporated:

Greek Financial Audit, 2004 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Greece should've never gone to the euro. They'd be fine if they didn't.

You are wrong, there is nothing wrong with being on the Euro. Read the newspaper articles I provide, your response to me far to quick, you cannot POSSIBLY have had time to read those articles.

I know what I'm talking about, I have extensive knowledge of what occurs on and in my own Continent.

The euro is a disaster. Countries stuck to it, forced to follow the ECB, no control of their own currency for their individual situations.

 

[Norman]

Oh not the stupid MMT. Yeah, they must have predicted that Greece goes broke because it can't print money. Damn tools!

How can a country sovereign in its own currency without pegging the currency or foreign debts ever go bankrupt on a "debt" denominated in its own currency?

By not printing money like crazy. Or just by simply defaulting or restructuring its debt because it wishes. Next question!

P.S. Printing press is not magic.

Without the government sector running a net deficit, how does the private sector get more liability free dollars? Loans create deposits, but this nets to zero (mostly.) Of course, banks loan based on the credit worthiness of the person. That person has to acquire savings from another persons spending..

Oh, the so so so smart arguments of the MMT. And by smart I mean of course - completely retarded.

First of all "savings" is a stock. I can acquire savings by building something on my yard I don't need your stinking government to do that and neither does anyone else.

Now, you probably meant "saving" which is a flow, again no monetary transaction needs to take place for saving to occur. Only thing that has to happen is for the production to be measured. So you didn't mean this either.

What you meant is "net private saving", that is the deficit by definition for a global economy. Okay cool... and this tells us what exactly about the real economy? Why is this needed? Oh wait it isn't. Only reason why it's needed for an economy is because socialist MMTers can't stop salivating over their deficits and socialist revolution.

MMTers are the ultimate economic "gotchas". Completely clueless how economics actually works. These guys could not physically run a lemonade stand if their life dependent on it. That is what we are dealing with. Unfortunately their ability is as great as their honesty.

The fuck? I'm obviously referring to financial assets when I talk about savings, what do you think a bank cares about when they're going to do a loan?
Clueless? No, you're the clueless one.

Financial assets are different from savings you moron! This is basic economics.

Besides that, the same still applies. Nothing about the point changes. I do some yard work and the change in value gets captured in my stock price or whatever. Financial assets created!

MMT = Master Moron Theory.

 

[Dovahkiin]

How can a country sovereign in its own currency without pegging the currency or foreign debts ever go bankrupt on a "debt" denominated in its own currency?

By not printing money like crazy. Or just by simply defaulting or restructuring its debt because it wishes. Next question!

P.S. Printing press is not magic.

Without the government sector running a net deficit, how does the private sector get more liability free dollars? Loans create deposits, but this nets to zero (mostly.) Of course, banks loan based on the credit worthiness of the person. That person has to acquire savings from another persons spending..

Oh, the so so so smart arguments of the MMT. And by smart I mean of course - completely retarded.

First of all "savings" is a stock. I can acquire savings by building something on my yard I don't need your stinking government to do that and neither does anyone else.

Now, you probably meant "saving" which is a flow, again no monetary transaction needs to take place for saving to occur. Only thing that has to happen is for the production to be measured. So you didn't mean this either.

What you meant is "net private saving", that is the deficit by definition for a global economy. Okay cool... and this tells us what exactly about the real economy? Why is this needed? Oh wait it isn't. Only reason why it's needed for an economy is because socialist MMTers can't stop salivating over their deficits and socialist revolution.

MMTers are the ultimate economic "gotchas". Completely clueless how economics actually works. These guys could not physically run a lemonade stand if their life dependent on it. That is what we are dealing with. Unfortunately their ability is as great as their honesty.

The fuck? I'm obviously referring to financial assets when I talk about savings, what do you think a bank cares about when they're going to do a loan?
Clueless? No, you're the clueless one.

Financial assets are different from savings you moron! This is basic economics.

Besides that, the same still applies. Nothing about the point changes. I do some yard work and the change in value gets captured in my stock price or whatever. Financial assets created!

MMT = Master Moron Theory.

...Huh? What do you think a "financial asset" is? Deposits/bonds/stocks...

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

Oh not the stupid MMT. Yeah, they must have predicted that Greece goes broke because it can't print money. Damn tools!

How can a country sovereign in its own currency without pegging the currency or foreign debts ever go bankrupt on a "debt" denominated in its own currency?

By not printing money like crazy. Or just by simply defaulting or restructuring its debt because it wishes. Next question!

P.S. Printing press is not magic.

The government creates money "from thin air" just like banks. This happens all the time.

Yes I said "IF", they don't want to do that. Besides that it's the central bank that prints the money, NOT THE GOVERNMENT you idiot! Do you have a cognitive deficit?

For all of my discussions, I lump together the central bank and the government, since the CB is essentially an independent entity within the government.

" since the CB is essentially an independent entity within the government."

Central Banks are not connected to any government, that's the crux of the problem, if they were, they'd be more transparent and wouldn't get away with so much financial sorcery.

 

[Zander]

Once Greece gave up its ability to print its own currency, it was doomed. All of the Euro nations area headed for the exact same fate. Almost all of them are in violation of their own SGP fiscal compliance rules....

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

By not printing money like crazy. Or just by simply defaulting or restructuring its debt because it wishes. Next question!

P.S. Printing press is not magic.

Without the government sector running a net deficit, how does the private sector get more liability free dollars? Loans create deposits, but this nets to zero (mostly.) Of course, banks loan based on the credit worthiness of the person. That person has to acquire savings from another persons spending..

Here are articles regarding Greece and Goldman Sachs, Greece already had MASSIVE debts pre-Euro, this alone would have not allowed Greece to join Eurozone, so they hired Goldman Sachs to HIDE Greece's existing debts, so Greece could get into Eurozone SIMPLY to apply for HAND-OUT'S ie. Bail Outs.

Greeks urged to sue Goldman Sachs for role in euro debacle

Greek Debt Crisis: How Goldman Sachs Helped Greece to Mask its True Debt - SPIEGEL ONLINE

Goldman Secret Greece Loan Shows Two Sinners as Client Unravels

Greece joined the Eurozone in 2001. The Greeks did their own audit of their financial books.

Then the EU Audit of the Greek financial books occured in 2004 THIS is WHEN Brussels and ECB discovered the numbers didn't add up, this is when they also discovered that Goldman Sachs had deliberately cooked the books for Greek Government so Greece on FALSE pretences could join the Eurozone....at this point ALL sympathy for Greece and her problems basically evaporated:

Greek Financial Audit, 2004 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Greece should've never gone to the euro. They'd be fine if they didn't.

You are wrong, there is nothing wrong with being on the Euro. Read the newspaper articles I provide, your response to me far to quick, you cannot POSSIBLY have had time to read those articles.

I know what I'm talking about, I have extensive knowledge of what occurs on and in my own Continent.

The euro is a disaster. Countries stuck to it, forced to follow the ECB, no control of their own currency for their individual situations.

But IF you read the articles I provide, you'll see it's not the REASON why Greece is in a mess....Greece were in this mess BEFORE THEY JOINED THE EURO.

You specifically stated that it's BECAUSE Greece joined the Euro they're in the mess....you are 100% incorrect as ALL articles regarding this topic show....Greece's problems with economics including debt began BEFORE they joined the Euro.

 

[Norman]

By not printing money like crazy. Or just by simply defaulting or restructuring its debt because it wishes. Next question!

P.S. Printing press is not magic.

Without the government sector running a net deficit, how does the private sector get more liability free dollars? Loans create deposits, but this nets to zero (mostly.) Of course, banks loan based on the credit worthiness of the person. That person has to acquire savings from another persons spending..

Oh, the so so so smart arguments of the MMT. And by smart I mean of course - completely retarded.

First of all "savings" is a stock. I can acquire savings by building something on my yard I don't need your stinking government to do that and neither does anyone else.

Now, you probably meant "saving" which is a flow, again no monetary transaction needs to take place for saving to occur. Only thing that has to happen is for the production to be measured. So you didn't mean this either.

What you meant is "net private saving", that is the deficit by definition for a global economy. Okay cool... and this tells us what exactly about the real economy? Why is this needed? Oh wait it isn't. Only reason why it's needed for an economy is because socialist MMTers can't stop salivating over their deficits and socialist revolution.

MMTers are the ultimate economic "gotchas". Completely clueless how economics actually works. These guys could not physically run a lemonade stand if their life dependent on it. That is what we are dealing with. Unfortunately their ability is as great as their honesty.

The fuck? I'm obviously referring to financial assets when I talk about savings, what do you think a bank cares about when they're going to do a loan?
Clueless? No, you're the clueless one.

Financial assets are different from savings you moron! This is basic economics.

Besides that, the same still applies. Nothing about the point changes. I do some yard work and the change in value gets captured in my stock price or whatever. Financial assets created!

MMT = Master Moron Theory.

...Huh? What do you think a "financial asset" is? Deposits/bonds/stocks...

Dude, it's apparent you are clueless.

If I built a house, privately... that constitutes saving. The entire value of that house is calculated to be saving during the period. This requires no financial assets what so ever.

Financial assets are stocks bonds or other investment vehicles, you got that right.

Hopefully you now understand how people get rich in the real world vs the hocus pocus of MMT.

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

Once Greece gave up its ability to print its own currency, it was doomed. All of the Euro nations area headed for the exact same fate. Almost all of them are in violation of their own SGP fiscal compliance rules....

Yes, but regarding Greece, as articles I post links for, Greece's problems began BEFORE they joined Eurozone. So as the topic of this thread is Greece, that's the nation I'm concentrating on.

 

[Zander]

Once Greece gave up its ability to print its own currency, it was doomed. All of the Euro nations area headed for the exact same fate. Almost all of them are in violation of their own SGP fiscal compliance rules....

Yes, but regarding Greece, as articles I post links for, Greece's problems began BEFORE they joined Eurozone. So as the topic of this thread is Greece, that's the nation I'm concentrating on.

There's no question that Greece has been a fiscal mess long before they joined the Euro. Which begs the question: why were they allowed to join?

My point is that if they were still controlling their own currency, they'd have a lot more options to resolve their problems. The way it sits now they have only two options- severe austerity as imposed by Frankfurt or (gasp) a Grexit from the EU. IMHO, they are no longer a sovereign nation. Nor are any of these Euro Nations - Austria, Belgium, Cyprus, Estonia, Finland, France, Germany, Greece, Ireland, Italy, Latvia, Luxembourg, Malta, the Netherlands, Portugal, Slovakia, Slovenia, and Spain.

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

Once Greece gave up its ability to print its own currency, it was doomed. All of the Euro nations area headed for the exact same fate. Almost all of them are in violation of their own SGP fiscal compliance rules....

Yes, but regarding Greece, as articles I post links for, Greece's problems began BEFORE they joined Eurozone. So as the topic of this thread is Greece, that's the nation I'm concentrating on.

There's no question that Greece has been a fiscal mess long before they joined the Euro. Which begs the question: why were they allowed to join?

My point is that if they were still controlling their own currency, they'd have a lot more options to resolve their problems. The way it sits now they have only two options- severe austerity as imposed by Frankfurt or (gasp) a Grexit from the EU. IMHO, they are no longer a sovereign nation. Nor are any of these Euro Nations - Austria, Belgium, Cyprus, Estonia, Finland, France, Germany, Greece, Ireland, Italy, Latvia, Luxembourg, Malta, the Netherlands, Portugal, Slovakia, Slovenia, and Spain.

"There's no question that Greece has been a fiscal mess long before they joined the Euro. Which begs the question: why were they allowed to join? "

The answer to your question, is in the links to the articles I provide in earlier post in this thread. Goldman Sachs cooked the books for Greece and hid Greece's existing MASSIVE debts, they did this as Greece asked them to, in order for Greece to present false pretence that all was good with Greece and thus Greece fulfilled the criteria to be able to join the Eurozone, like Greece wanted to join.

So if you read the linked articles I provide in that other post, hopefully you'll gain an understanding of this. You'll notice that it's all in post number 22 of mine on page 3 of this thread.

With regard to Euro as a whole, no I don't support it just like I'm not supporting EU, I'm glad that EU has not much longer in existence, the only thing as of now keeping it in existence is Schengen, this is why Brussels obsessed with keeping Schengen afloat, they know if Schengen falls off cliff that's it, end of EU Project....as of now Schengen is three quarters off cliff.

Once Schengen is off cliff and end of EU Project, then Europa can return to nations having full sovereignty which include full control of nations individual borders, this is crucial happening to ensure the survival of Europa as a whole.