NLRB: College athletes can unionize

[Steven_R]

They already get a free education and a chance at a multi million dollar career and that's not enough?

Ungrateful leeches if you want my opinion.

It's more than just that. The scholarship might not actually cover all expenses, so the athlete is forced to provide other funding. They can't work, so that means student loans. For the 1% that makes it to the NFL or NBA or NHL or MLB, that's no big deal, but for the rest they now have sports injuries and a degree in something like Sports Science or General Studies or something that is equally worthless in the job market. I have a scholarship and my department writes off my tuition, and I'm allowed to take a job off campus to help pay my bills. Players don't have that option during the school year.

Now let's say our player is able to find a summer job. Does he work his summer job and try to get a few bucks to cover his non-school expenses like clothes or car insurance or gas or even just a cup of non-cafeteria coffee...or does he go to the "voluntary" workouts and practices where attendance is take?

Now, let's look at what happens when this player is hurt. He's cut and his scholarship is revoked. Then what? A fair number of those players can barely read or write despite being "students" first. No one is on the hook for those injuries, even ones that may take decades to heal (if ever) because they aren't technically employees. If I get hurt in the lab, I'm covered for my injuries, rehab, whatever. If a football player gets hurt he can easily find himself out the door with nothing to support him.

The players don't even own their own images and likeness rights. The star players can't sign a jersey for a few bucks, but the NCAA and school can sell the jersey in the school bookstore for tons of cash and then sell pictures of the player and put the player in video games for perpetuity and the player doesn't get a dime. The coach gets kickbacks from the likes of Nike and Adidas and the player is forced to wear the gear. Maybe the Nike shoes don't fit the player's foot just right, but too bad because the coach signed a contract and the player will wear Nike.

I had an economics professor tell us in a lecture that happy employees don't form unions. What you have here is decades of the NCAA and the school exploiting players and making so much money off of them and giving nothing back under the illusion of the "student-athlete". This is a crisis of the NCAA's own making because they just refused to do the right thing time after time.

While there is some merit to your points I don't see a union being the answer.
The students FREELY accept the offer to play sports for a subsidized education. They could always, ya know, PAY for their education like the rest of us had to.
I played ball for fun when I was in school. Should the league I was in have been responsible if I was injured? Should they have paid for my education?

Sports is a CHOICE.

If it was just students organizing to play for themselves, I would agree. But the schools go out of their way to recruit players, sell the players to the public in the form of jerseys and video games and public appearances, and just make so much money off of the players. We should at least be honest and say it's a business and about the money that the schools bring in.

I think that's really what sticks in people's craw is that the NCAA just continues to say it's a student activity and these are students when the whole world knows it's a business in and of itself. Get rid of the TV contracts, the coaches being the highest paid state employees, the merchandise, multimillion dollar facilities just for football and basketball, and all that and make it just a student pastime OR just accept it's about the money and make the players employees with employee protections and call it a day.

 

[nodoginnafight]

They already get a free education and a chance at a multi million dollar career and that's not enough?

Ungrateful leeches if you want my opinion.

Yeah, a whole lot of those lacross players are looking at multi-million dollar career????

And what percentage of the football, basketball, baseball, hockey players are gonna land that multi-million $ career????

Anyway - I say cover the FULL COST of attendance and we don't have to worry about a union

Next step

Free college for all

Why is it so hard for you liberals to justify paying for your own shit?

LOL - so universities are entitled to free labor?
Why is it so hard for far right nazis to realize there are no free rides?

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Yeah, a whole lot of those lacross players are looking at multi-million dollar career????

And what percentage of the football, basketball, baseball, hockey players are gonna land that multi-million $ career????

Anyway - I say cover the FULL COST of attendance and we don't have to worry about a union

Next step

Free college for all

Why is it so hard for you liberals to justify paying for your own shit?

LOL - so universities are entitled to free labor?
Why is it so hard for far right nazis to realize there are no free rides?

Nazi's?

You make yourself less n less relevant with each post.

 

[DGS49]

SPORTS ARE A DIVERSION, unrelated to the mission of the school.

Everybody likes to point to the millions brought in by the most successful Div I programs, but if you look at all the thousands of colleges - even Division I schools around the country, most of them lose money on sports. Especially since Title IX. But they can't give it up because of pressure from alumni and students looking for diversions. In the best cases, football and basketball make so much money that they support all the other stupid sports that nobody cares enough to watch (including football, aka "soccer").

The accurate statistics are un-knowable (because of obfuscation by the schools), but most scholarship Division I athletes do not belong in the school for which they play. The schools can claim that they met their "general requirements, but if those scholarship athletes mailed in an application with their grades and SAT scores like everyone else they wouldn't have a snowball's chance in hell of getting in. Even the ones who graduate are only able to do so with substantial hand-holding, and in majors that qualify them for approximately no gainful employment. Car salesmen, maybe.

Contrary to what you might think I strongly support the idea of STUDENTS from one school playing the STUDENTS from another school. It is successful all over the country. Ever heard of "high school sports"? Is Division III this way (I used to think so, but now I'm not so sure).

If everyone competed on an equal footing, the Michigan-Southern Cal match-up would be just as competitive with STUDENTS as it is today with quasi-professionals. The alums and students could get just as excited (more excited, if they are rational - these would be actual students, after all). The only difference would be that the players would be a little smaller, a little slower, and a little bit lighter in complexion, on average. But you wouldn't know it because all the schools would be playing by the same rules. And very few of the players would end up in the NBA or the NFL.

The real badguys here are the NFL and the NBA. They are living in a dream world with a nationwide, extremely competitive, extremely sophisiticated "minor league" system, THAT THEY DON'T HAVE TO PAY FOR!!! How stupid is MLB? All the colleges do for them is ruin their young pitchers' arms.

You can be absolutely certain that if the NCAA were to outlaw athletic scholarships tomorrow, the day after tomorrow the NFL and NBA would form several minor leagues and a couple thousand frustrated and uncomfortable college "students" would drop out of college and go play for them...AND GET PAID TO DO IT!

 

[Pop23]

When coaching staffs are paid in the Millions I think big time college athletics brought this upon themselves. No reason a school paying a coach multiple millions can't pony up.

On the downside, the income and the scholarships need to be taxed.

This could end non revenue producing sports

 

[DGS49]

And let me say a few words about the racial thing. When you talk about eliminating athletic scholarships, people start to whine about all the "Black" kids who would not be able to go to college on scholarship.

But let's look a little closer. The Black kids who get athletic scholarships are not the smartest kids, the most hard working kids, or the kids who have be best chance of succeeding in life. They are typically kids who have been pampered and taken care of from grades 7-12 (remember, these are the few who eventually get Division I scholarships). The vast majority of them have dreams of playing professionally, which for 98% of the individuals is a pipe dream with no real possibility of ever coming true. And when it does come true it only lasts for a couple years. A "has been" at 28.

It would be better to enhance programs that provide full and partial scholarships to "disadvantaged" kids who show academic promise. These are the ones who offer society the most promise in the long run, rather than thousands of washed-up jocks who are used to being treated like demi-gods.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Next. Union negotiation of grades.

We already have that, it's called Common Core.

Common Core, if you had been a student, would have sent you to the sidelines.

 

[WinterBorn]

SPORTS ARE A DIVERSION, unrelated to the mission of the school.

Everybody likes to point to the millions brought in by the most successful Div I programs, but if you look at all the thousands of colleges - even Division I schools around the country, most of them lose money on sports. Especially since Title IX. But they can't give it up because of pressure from alumni and students looking for diversions. In the best cases, football and basketball make so much money that they support all the other stupid sports that nobody cares enough to watch (including football, aka "soccer").

The accurate statistics are un-knowable (because of obfuscation by the schools), but most scholarship Division I athletes do not belong in the school for which they play. The schools can claim that they met their "general requirements, but if those scholarship athletes mailed in an application with their grades and SAT scores like everyone else they wouldn't have a snowball's chance in hell of getting in. Even the ones who graduate are only able to do so with substantial hand-holding, and in majors that qualify them for approximately no gainful employment. Car salesmen, maybe.

Contrary to what you might think I strongly support the idea of STUDENTS from one school playing the STUDENTS from another school. It is successful all over the country. Ever heard of "high school sports"? Is Division III this way (I used to think so, but now I'm not so sure).

If everyone competed on an equal footing, the Michigan-Southern Cal match-up would be just as competitive with STUDENTS as it is today with quasi-professionals. The alums and students could get just as excited (more excited, if they are rational - these would be actual students, after all). The only difference would be that the players would be a little smaller, a little slower, and a little bit lighter in complexion, on average. But you wouldn't know it because all the schools would be playing by the same rules. And very few of the players would end up in the NBA or the NFL.

The real badguys here are the NFL and the NBA. They are living in a dream world with a nationwide, extremely competitive, extremely sophisiticated "minor league" system, THAT THEY DON'T HAVE TO PAY FOR!!! How stupid is MLB? All the colleges do for them is ruin their young pitchers' arms.

You can be absolutely certain that if the NCAA were to outlaw athletic scholarships tomorrow, the day after tomorrow the NFL and NBA would form several minor leagues and a couple thousand frustrated and uncomfortable college "students" would drop out of college and go play for them...AND GET PAID TO DO IT!

Absolute horseshit. Again, using the U of A as an example, we have had a quarterback in competition for a Rhodes Scholarship, an lineman that graduated Summa Cum Laue with a degree in Accounting, and a graduation rate for all athletics that exceeds the national student average.

Are there some who get favored and don't do wel in school? I have no doubt there are. But this idea that all athletes are neanderthals who avoid classes and have others taking their exams is pure myth.

 

[Nutz]

And let me say a few words about the racial thing. When you talk about eliminating athletic scholarships, people start to whine about all the "Black" kids who would not be able to go to college on scholarship.

But let's look a little closer. The Black kids who get athletic scholarships are not the smartest kids, the most hard working kids, or the kids who have be best chance of succeeding in life. They are typically kids who have been pampered and taken care of from grades 7-12 (remember, these are the few who eventually get Division I scholarships). The vast majority of them have dreams of playing professionally, which for 98% of the individuals is a pipe dream with no real possibility of ever coming true. And when it does come true it only lasts for a couple years. A "has been" at 28.

It would be better to enhance programs that provide full and partial scholarships to "disadvantaged" kids who show academic promise. These are the ones who offer society the most promise in the long run, rather than thousands of washed-up jocks who are used to being treated like demi-gods.

WTF....who in the hell brought up race? Anyway...you have no clue. The vast majority of student athletes, as stated earlier, are not on scholarship. You watch too much tv and you need to actually meet a few black people before you make ridiculous statements like this. Here is a newsflash, despite what you make think, just because someone is black and athletic, that doesn't mean they are stupid, poor, or disadvantaged.

Sure their are some freak of nature kids who have little intelligence and extraordinary athletic prowess, but that is the exception, not the norm. And if these institutions followed their own policies and wouldn't cheat...this would not be an issue.

At that, do you know how many programs there are for disadvantaged minorities to attend school...hell you just opened another can of beans for the so-called disenfranchised white people to say blacks are given a free ride.

 

[Pop23]

SPORTS ARE A DIVERSION, unrelated to the mission of the school.

Everybody likes to point to the millions brought in by the most successful Div I programs, but if you look at all the thousands of colleges - even Division I schools around the country, most of them lose money on sports. Especially since Title IX. But they can't give it up because of pressure from alumni and students looking for diversions. In the best cases, football and basketball make so much money that they support all the other stupid sports that nobody cares enough to watch (including football, aka "soccer").

The accurate statistics are un-knowable (because of obfuscation by the schools), but most scholarship Division I athletes do not belong in the school for which they play. The schools can claim that they met their "general requirements, but if those scholarship athletes mailed in an application with their grades and SAT scores like everyone else they wouldn't have a snowball's chance in hell of getting in. Even the ones who graduate are only able to do so with substantial hand-holding, and in majors that qualify them for approximately no gainful employment. Car salesmen, maybe.

Contrary to what you might think I strongly support the idea of STUDENTS from one school playing the STUDENTS from another school. It is successful all over the country. Ever heard of "high school sports"? Is Division III this way (I used to think so, but now I'm not so sure).

If everyone competed on an equal footing, the Michigan-Southern Cal match-up would be just as competitive with STUDENTS as it is today with quasi-professionals. The alums and students could get just as excited (more excited, if they are rational - these would be actual students, after all). The only difference would be that the players would be a little smaller, a little slower, and a little bit lighter in complexion, on average. But you wouldn't know it because all the schools would be playing by the same rules. And very few of the players would end up in the NBA or the NFL.

The real badguys here are the NFL and the NBA. They are living in a dream world with a nationwide, extremely competitive, extremely sophisiticated "minor league" system, THAT THEY DON'T HAVE TO PAY FOR!!! How stupid is MLB? All the colleges do for them is ruin their young pitchers' arms.

You can be absolutely certain that if the NCAA were to outlaw athletic scholarships tomorrow, the day after tomorrow the NFL and NBA would form several minor leagues and a couple thousand frustrated and uncomfortable college "students" would drop out of college and go play for them...AND GET PAID TO DO IT!

Absolute horseshit. Again, using the U of A as an example, we have had a quarterback in competition for a Rhodes Scholarship, an lineman that graduated Summa Cum Laue with a degree in Accounting, and a graduation rate for all athletics that exceeds the national student average.

Are there some who get favored and don't do wel in school? I have no doubt there are. But this idea that all athletes are neanderthals who avoid classes and have others taking their exams is pure myth.

^^^^^^ absolutely true ^^^^^^^^

Know someone who works in the compliance (I think that's what it called) department at a big time "U". She tells me there is no looking the other way anymore. They watch these athletes like hawks

 

[Unkotare]

SPORTS ARE A DIVERSION, unrelated to the mission of the school.
!

There he goes....Poindexter's at it again...

 

[WinterBorn]

When coaching staffs are paid in the Millions I think big time college athletics brought this upon themselves. No reason a school paying a coach multiple millions can't pony up.

On the downside, the income and the scholarships need to be taxed.

This could end non revenue producing sports

First you should look at the taxes paid by the NFL. That needs to be addressed long before we worry about extra taxes on colleges.

 

[Unkotare]

On the downside, the income and the scholarships need to be taxed.

This could end non revenue producing sports

And you want to do that?

 

[Unkotare]

The Black kids who get athletic scholarships are not the smartest kids, the most hard working kids, or the kids who have be best chance of succeeding in life.

You don't know that, asshole.

 

[boilermaker55]

Do you think about the affect of citizens united on other parts of the US and its functionality?
Can you say Koch brothers?

wherever there is a revenue stream you can count on lefties to glom on and fuck it up for everybody...

the fact that the lefties in their ivory towers hate the great American game of football and they can cripple it in the process at many schools is a bonus for them....or even the purpose perhaps...?

ummm, not to get in the way of your rant, but it's THE PLAYERS who seek to unionize. But carry on.

guess who's been footing the legal bills for Kain Colter and his recently founded CAPA group (College Athletes Players Association) that sued for compensation....?

the UNITED STEELWORKERS UNION.....lefties by any other name....

 

[boilermaker55]

Nah! Just trying to bring some equity to an unequal system.
Thank you very much!

Looks like the far right just can't kick the habit of exploiting others for their own person gain.

Sad.

 

[boilermaker55]

Nah! just a pipe dream of yours.

And thus the end of college sports begins, because it will eventually become more expensive to have college teams than it will be to simply not have them.

On the bright side, judging by Detroit's history, this fatal event is still more than 50 years away.

 

[boilermaker55]

Not proportionally they dont.

If they help generate the money, why shouldn't they get a portion of it.

Most of the kids are fortunate to be able to play football for a free ride and a college degree with no debt.

They do....That scholarship is plenty of compensation...

 

[bendog]

When coaching staffs are paid in the Millions I think big time college athletics brought this upon themselves. No reason a school paying a coach multiple millions can't pony up.

On the downside, the income and the scholarships need to be taxed.

This could end non revenue producing sports

First you should look at the taxes paid by the NFL. That needs to be addressed long before we worry about extra taxes on colleges.

Maybe I'm missing the sarcasm, but I'm not crying for the NFL

Brian Frederick: Why Does the National Football League Deserve Tax-Exempt Status?

 

[WinterBorn]

When coaching staffs are paid in the Millions I think big time college athletics brought this upon themselves. No reason a school paying a coach multiple millions can't pony up.

On the downside, the income and the scholarships need to be taxed.

This could end non revenue producing sports

First you should look at the taxes paid by the NFL. That needs to be addressed long before we worry about extra taxes on colleges.

Maybe I'm missing the sarcasm, but I'm not crying for the NFL

Brian Frederick: Why Does the National Football League Deserve Tax-Exempt Status?

Of course the NFL should not have tax-exempt status. That was my point.