Obama the Lawless

[FA_Q2]

Really?



You're going to pretend you 'misunderstood' my evisceration of your fraudulent attempt to defend the Obama-criminal?



He has no constitutional right to re-write or change laws passed by the legislature.





Be more honest in the future.

No I'm being intentionally flippant about a ridiculous premise.

Neither you or Rabbi proved my post a "lie" regardless.

"Obama Rewrites ObamaCare

....the law increasingly means whatever President Obama says it does on any given day. His latest lawless rewrite arrived on Monday as the White House decided to delay the law's employer mandate for another year and in some cases maybe forever."
Obama Rewrites ObamaCare - WSJ.com



So.....would you care to defend Obama's actions?


And....be certain you are able to do so based on the Constitution, article two.

I do ever so like the way that he moves the deadline out to after each election.

No political corruption there at all.

 

[The Rabbi]

If Obamacare was supposed to lower costs and benefit everyone, then why is Obama delaying implementing it? Is he working against America?

 

[JoeB131]

If Obamacare was supposed to lower costs and benefit everyone, then why is Obama delaying implementing it? Is he working against America?

only 9% of employers with 50-199 employees don't offere health insurance.

Giving them another year is perfectly reasonable.

I really do love how you guys insist we should all get health coverage through the kindness of employers, and then whine when employers can't meet the challenge.

Like the CEO of AOL, who was whining the other day that he had to cut 401K payouts because two ladies had babies that required medical attention.

 

[gipper]

If Obamacare was supposed to lower costs and benefit everyone, then why is Obama delaying implementing it? Is he working against America?

only 9% of employers with 50-199 employees don't offere health insurance.

Giving them another year is perfectly reasonable.

I really do love how you guys insist we should all get health coverage through the kindness of employers, and then whine when employers can't meet the challenge.

Like the CEO of AOL, who was whining the other day that he had to cut 401K payouts because two ladies had babies that required medical attention.

I know no one who INSISTS Americans get their health care from their employer.

Another strawman argument posited by you. Did you get that erroneous belief from your Messiah or was it the state run media?

 

[Wildman]

yeah, but no one in the government is personally profiting from it like Cheney did.

hilarious that you guys whine all day about some poor kid getting a food stamp, but man, Haliburton raking in the Corporate Welfare is just soooo okay with you.

Wow, the fallacies keep building.
First, everyone profits from a gov't contract. Like the one for the Healthcare.gov website, given without bid to Michelle's old pals in Canada.
Second, Cheney didnt personally profit from the contracts.
Third, Halliburton provided valuable services. What do welfare recipients provide, other than more welfare recipients?

Chris Matthews says Cheney got $34 million payday from Halliburton
True
Share this story:


The oil-services and infrastructure giant Halliburton is a favorite target for critics of former Vice President Dick Cheney, who used to be the company's CEO. During the presidency of George W. Bush, the company's Iraq War-related contracts attracted wide attention. Now, the company's role in the Deepwater Horizon oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico has brought Halliburton back into the headlines.

During a May 20, 2010, appearance with Jay Leno on the Tonight Show, MSNBC host and political commentator Chris Matthews revived the Cheney-Halliburton connection while discussing the spill.

At one point in the interview, Leno said, "All right, a lot going on in politics with this BP thing. This is the one-month anniversary. Where are we? Who’s the lying scum here?"

Matthews responded, "Yeah, it’s the scariest thing I’ve ever seen, and, you know, I don’t know where to start. I mean, Halliburton. Sound familiar? Cheney. Cheney was head of Halliburton. When he got to be vice president, when he was signed for vice president, the oil company gave him a $34 million signing bonus to become vice president of the United States."

We'll grant Matthews some artistic license with his comment. We know he doesn't mean that Cheney literally got a signing bonus for becoming the vice presidential candidate, as a newly signed free agent would in baseball. But we thought it was worth checking whether Cheney did in fact end up with a $34 million payout when he stepped down as CEO to join Bush on the ticket in 2000.

We looked at a personal financial disclosure form that Cheney signed on Sept. 1, 2000. This is the filing made once someone joins a national presidential ticket. It represents the candidate's holdings and income as of August. In the portion addressing Cheney's compensation from Halliburtion, the file lists the following categories and dollar amounts as of that date:

• Salary/bonus (gross): $4,721, 947
• Deferred salary: $1,042, 441
• Senior executive deferred compensation contributions: $654,804

Meanwhile, on May 15, 2001, Cheney also signed a second disclosure form that is supposed to update the August 2000 filing so that it covers the full year. In this filing, Cheney disclosed the following Halliburton income:

• Salary/bonus (gross): $821,896
• Elective deferred salary: $403,166
• Stock equivalent unit bonus: $396,213
• Senior executive deferred compensation contributions: $53,692
• Elective deferred salary lump sum payout: $1,140,160
• Restricted stock imputed income: $7,560,000
• Nonqualified stock option income: $21,964,254
• Senior executive deferred compensation payout: $2,797,128

However, we were unclear about whether the totals from the May 2001 filing, which amount to $35.1 million, should be added to those from the August 2000 filing, which amount to $6.4 million, or whether the amounts in the two filings overlap somewhat. Experts we spoke to expressed uncertainty on this question as well. So we decided to take the most cautious approach and only use the numbers from the second filing, which covers the whole year.

That still leaves a total of $35.1 million earned from Halliburtion reported on the May 2001 filing. Of that total, just over $800,000 represents salary and bonus, which Cheney would have earned regardless of whether he joined the ticket or not. Many of the other categories were subject to some calculation and/or negotiation, as would happen in the case of any CEO who left a position early, so it seems fair to call the rest of the income he received an exit package.

So, if you subtract the salary and bonus from the larger amount, voila -- you get $34 million and change. So Matthews is right.

A footnote: Cheney's timing was impeccable. As the disclosure forms indicate, he held a large number of stock options, which means he had been given the right to purchase shares of the company for an old (and, hopefully for the holder of the options) lower price than the current market value. When the holder chooses to exercise those options, they can buy the shares at the low price and then sell them at the market price, pocketing the difference.

It's not clear when Cheney sold his stock options, but it likely was within weeks of his being named to the ticket -- a period when Halliburtion shares hit their 2000 peak, in the low-to-mid $50 range. By November 30, 2000, the stock had fallen to $33 a share. If he'd waited until then to sell, his payday would have been one-third lower, or roughly $14 million rather than $22 million.

But Cheney does appear to have had timing on his side, so we find Matthews' statement -- that Cheney had a payday of $34 million -- to be accurate. If anything, it may have been a bit low. Either way, we give it a rating of True.


Rabbit let google be your friend. Even when it tells you stuff you don't want to believe.

Cheney didn't have to wait for the war to be able to profit. Halliburton was willing to give him his share UP FRONT. Cause they knew what was coming. Iraq.

Chris Matthews, is your source of this Earth shaking news isn't he on LMSNBC ? the most trusted news service on TV

 

[JoeB131]

If Obamacare was supposed to lower costs and benefit everyone, then why is Obama delaying implementing it? Is he working against America?

only 9% of employers with 50-199 employees don't offere health insurance.

Giving them another year is perfectly reasonable.

I really do love how you guys insist we should all get health coverage through the kindness of employers, and then whine when employers can't meet the challenge.

Like the CEO of AOL, who was whining the other day that he had to cut 401K payouts because two ladies had babies that required medical attention.

I know no one who INSISTS Americans get their health care from their employer.

Another strawman argument posited by you. Did you get that erroneous belief from your Messiah or was it the state run media?

NO, I got it from all the insurance companies that INSISTED that we couldn't have a single payer system, universal coverage or anything like that because it might cut into our profits... oh, wait, no, I mean "Freedom". Yeah. THat's it. "Freedom".

 

[The Rabbi]

only 9% of employers with 50-199 employees don't offere health insurance.

Giving them another year is perfectly reasonable.

I really do love how you guys insist we should all get health coverage through the kindness of employers, and then whine when employers can't meet the challenge.

Like the CEO of AOL, who was whining the other day that he had to cut 401K payouts because two ladies had babies that required medical attention.

I know no one who INSISTS Americans get their health care from their employer.

Another strawman argument posited by you. Did you get that erroneous belief from your Messiah or was it the state run media?

NO, I got it from all the insurance companies that INSISTED that we couldn't have a single payer system, universal coverage or anything like that because it might cut into our profits... oh, wait, no, I mean "Freedom". Yeah. THat's it. "Freedom".

Liar!

 

[The Rabbi]

Wow, the fallacies keep building.
First, everyone profits from a gov't contract. Like the one for the Healthcare.gov website, given without bid to Michelle's old pals in Canada.
Second, Cheney didnt personally profit from the contracts.
Third, Halliburton provided valuable services. What do welfare recipients provide, other than more welfare recipients?

Chris Matthews says Cheney got $34 million payday from Halliburton
True
Share this story:


The oil-services and infrastructure giant Halliburton is a favorite target for critics of former Vice President Dick Cheney, who used to be the company's CEO. During the presidency of George W. Bush, the company's Iraq War-related contracts attracted wide attention. Now, the company's role in the Deepwater Horizon oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico has brought Halliburton back into the headlines.

During a May 20, 2010, appearance with Jay Leno on the Tonight Show, MSNBC host and political commentator Chris Matthews revived the Cheney-Halliburton connection while discussing the spill.

At one point in the interview, Leno said, "All right, a lot going on in politics with this BP thing. This is the one-month anniversary. Where are we? Who’s the lying scum here?"

Matthews responded, "Yeah, it’s the scariest thing I’ve ever seen, and, you know, I don’t know where to start. I mean, Halliburton. Sound familiar? Cheney. Cheney was head of Halliburton. When he got to be vice president, when he was signed for vice president, the oil company gave him a $34 million signing bonus to become vice president of the United States."

We'll grant Matthews some artistic license with his comment. We know he doesn't mean that Cheney literally got a signing bonus for becoming the vice presidential candidate, as a newly signed free agent would in baseball. But we thought it was worth checking whether Cheney did in fact end up with a $34 million payout when he stepped down as CEO to join Bush on the ticket in 2000.

We looked at a personal financial disclosure form that Cheney signed on Sept. 1, 2000. This is the filing made once someone joins a national presidential ticket. It represents the candidate's holdings and income as of August. In the portion addressing Cheney's compensation from Halliburtion, the file lists the following categories and dollar amounts as of that date:

• Salary/bonus (gross): $4,721, 947
• Deferred salary: $1,042, 441
• Senior executive deferred compensation contributions: $654,804

Meanwhile, on May 15, 2001, Cheney also signed a second disclosure form that is supposed to update the August 2000 filing so that it covers the full year. In this filing, Cheney disclosed the following Halliburton income:

• Salary/bonus (gross): $821,896
• Elective deferred salary: $403,166
• Stock equivalent unit bonus: $396,213
• Senior executive deferred compensation contributions: $53,692
• Elective deferred salary lump sum payout: $1,140,160
• Restricted stock imputed income: $7,560,000
• Nonqualified stock option income: $21,964,254
• Senior executive deferred compensation payout: $2,797,128

However, we were unclear about whether the totals from the May 2001 filing, which amount to $35.1 million, should be added to those from the August 2000 filing, which amount to $6.4 million, or whether the amounts in the two filings overlap somewhat. Experts we spoke to expressed uncertainty on this question as well. So we decided to take the most cautious approach and only use the numbers from the second filing, which covers the whole year.

That still leaves a total of $35.1 million earned from Halliburtion reported on the May 2001 filing. Of that total, just over $800,000 represents salary and bonus, which Cheney would have earned regardless of whether he joined the ticket or not. Many of the other categories were subject to some calculation and/or negotiation, as would happen in the case of any CEO who left a position early, so it seems fair to call the rest of the income he received an exit package.

So, if you subtract the salary and bonus from the larger amount, voila -- you get $34 million and change. So Matthews is right.

A footnote: Cheney's timing was impeccable. As the disclosure forms indicate, he held a large number of stock options, which means he had been given the right to purchase shares of the company for an old (and, hopefully for the holder of the options) lower price than the current market value. When the holder chooses to exercise those options, they can buy the shares at the low price and then sell them at the market price, pocketing the difference.

It's not clear when Cheney sold his stock options, but it likely was within weeks of his being named to the ticket -- a period when Halliburtion shares hit their 2000 peak, in the low-to-mid $50 range. By November 30, 2000, the stock had fallen to $33 a share. If he'd waited until then to sell, his payday would have been one-third lower, or roughly $14 million rather than $22 million.

But Cheney does appear to have had timing on his side, so we find Matthews' statement -- that Cheney had a payday of $34 million -- to be accurate. If anything, it may have been a bit low. Either way, we give it a rating of True.


Rabbit let google be your friend. Even when it tells you stuff you don't want to believe.

Cheney didn't have to wait for the war to be able to profit. Halliburton was willing to give him his share UP FRONT. Cause they knew what was coming. Iraq.

Chris Matthews, is your source of this Earth shaking news isn't he on LMSNBC ? the most trusted news service on TV

Dont pay attentiuon to Zeke, Toothless Stumpbroke of USMB. Critical thinking to him is like astrophysics to a rooster. The article doesnt support what he wrote. But he's too stupid to understand that.

 

[natstew]

only 9% of employers with 50-199 employees don't offere health insurance.

Giving them another year is perfectly reasonable.

I really do love how you guys insist we should all get health coverage through the kindness of employers, and then whine when employers can't meet the challenge.

Like the CEO of AOL, who was whining the other day that he had to cut 401K payouts because two ladies had babies that required medical attention.

I know no one who INSISTS Americans get their health care from their employer.

Another strawman argument posited by you. Did you get that erroneous belief from your Messiah or was it the state run media?

NO, I got it from all the insurance companies that INSISTED that we couldn't have a single payer system, universal coverage or anything like that because it might cut into our profits... oh, wait, no, I mean "Freedom". Yeah. THat's it. "Freedom".

Joeb131, I'm no fan of insurance companies, but a lesser fan of the Federal Government. If you think for one second that the Government would do a better job than private insurance companies in running our healthcare industry you're goddamn delusional. The waste in anything the Federal, State, County, and City Governments do triple the profits by private insurance companies, and that doesn't even begin to address the graft and political corruption involved in all things 'Government'!

Want to make healthcare better? Begin with the Government, Repeal the 17th amendment, outlaw Political Parties, prohibit political donations from out of State, (no political money crossing State Lines), treat political organizations the same as terrorist organizations, the same as the KKK, institute term limits, and pass a Constitutional Amendment that strips the Supreme Court of all it's Justices and replaces them with new ones chosen by elections in which Attorneys General of the States vote.

An observation: Barack Obama reminds me more of Andrew Jackson than any previous President, and that is indeed ironic, Andrew Jackson was a racist slave owner.

 

[natstew]

Really?



You're going to pretend you 'misunderstood' my evisceration of your fraudulent attempt to defend the Obama-criminal?



He has no constitutional right to re-write or change laws passed by the legislature.





Be more honest in the future.

No I'm being intentionally flippant about a ridiculous premise.

Neither you or Rabbi proved my post a "lie" regardless.

"Obama Rewrites ObamaCare

....the law increasingly means whatever President Obama says it does on any given day. His latest lawless rewrite arrived on Monday as the White House decided to delay the law's employer mandate for another year and in some cases maybe forever."
Obama Rewrites ObamaCare - WSJ.com



So.....would you care to defend Obama's actions?


And....be certain you are able to do so based on the Constitution, article two.

And, don't forget the 10th Amendment!

 

[gipper]

only 9% of employers with 50-199 employees don't offere health insurance.

Giving them another year is perfectly reasonable.

I really do love how you guys insist we should all get health coverage through the kindness of employers, and then whine when employers can't meet the challenge.

Like the CEO of AOL, who was whining the other day that he had to cut 401K payouts because two ladies had babies that required medical attention.

I know no one who INSISTS Americans get their health care from their employer.

Another strawman argument posited by you. Did you get that erroneous belief from your Messiah or was it the state run media?

NO, I got it from all the insurance companies that INSISTED that we couldn't have a single payer system, universal coverage or anything like that because it might cut into our profits... oh, wait, no, I mean "Freedom". Yeah. THat's it. "Freedom".

So you lied...again. You asserted that posters on this forum INSISTED HC come from employers.

And why has your Messiah gone along with big insurance companies? Certainly the most powerful man in the world, who is unconstrained by any laws, could give you what you want.

I thought your Messiah was against big business....too funny...he and big business sleep together nightly, but you and your kind can't see that.

 

[gipper]

I know no one who INSISTS Americans get their health care from their employer.

Another strawman argument posited by you. Did you get that erroneous belief from your Messiah or was it the state run media?

NO, I got it from all the insurance companies that INSISTED that we couldn't have a single payer system, universal coverage or anything like that because it might cut into our profits... oh, wait, no, I mean "Freedom". Yeah. THat's it. "Freedom".

Joeb131, I'm no fan of insurance companies, but a lesser fan of the Federal Government. If you think for one second that the Government would do a better job than private insurance companies in running our healthcare industry you're goddamn delusional. The waste in anything the Federal, State, County, and City Governments do triple the profits by private insurance companies, and that doesn't even begin to address the graft and political corruption involved in all things 'Government'!

Want to make healthcare better? Begin with the Government, Repeal the 17th amendment, outlaw Political Parties, prohibit political donations from out of State, (no political money crossing State Lines), treat political organizations the same as terrorist organizations, the same as the KKK, institute term limits, and pass a Constitutional Amendment that strips the Supreme Court of all it's Justices and replaces them with new ones chosen by elections in which Attorneys General of the States vote.

An observation: Barack Obama reminds me more of Andrew Jackson than any previous President, and that is indeed ironic, Andrew Jackson was a racist slave owner.

Similarities between Big Ears and Old Hickory do exist, but I would argue they are not significant.

Remember Jackson ended the central bank. BO loves the central bank. Huge difference.

BO has much more in common with the three worst POTUS's in our history....Lincoln, Wilson, and FDR.

 

[natstew]

NO, I got it from all the insurance companies that INSISTED that we couldn't have a single payer system, universal coverage or anything like that because it might cut into our profits... oh, wait, no, I mean "Freedom". Yeah. THat's it. "Freedom".

Joeb131, I'm no fan of insurance companies, but a lesser fan of the Federal Government. If you think for one second that the Government would do a better job than private insurance companies in running our healthcare industry you're goddamn delusional. The waste in anything the Federal, State, County, and City Governments do triple the profits by private insurance companies, and that doesn't even begin to address the graft and political corruption involved in all things 'Government'!

Want to make healthcare better? Begin with the Government, Repeal the 17th amendment, outlaw Political Parties, prohibit political donations from out of State, (no political money crossing State Lines), treat political organizations the same as terrorist organizations, the same as the KKK, institute term limits, and pass a Constitutional Amendment that strips the Supreme Court of all it's Justices and replaces them with new ones chosen by elections in which Attorneys General of the States vote.

An observation: Barack Obama reminds me more of Andrew Jackson than any previous President, and that is indeed ironic, Andrew Jackson was a racist slave owner.

Similarities between Big Ears and Old Hickory do exist, but I would argue they are not significant.

Remember Jackson ended the central bank. BO loves the central bank. Huge difference.

BO has much more in common with the three worst POTUS's in our history....Lincoln, Wilson, and FDR.

The thing that reminds me of Jackson is his arrogance and contempt for the Constitution, and his ruling by E.O. It stops there.

Thanks for reminding me of the other three, you're right about them.

 

[blackhawk]

I hope the left are still good with this when the next Republican President continues the abuse of power begun by Obama and the right is still as upset over it as they are now.

 

[JoeB131]

[

Joeb131, I'm no fan of insurance companies, but a lesser fan of the Federal Government. If you think for one second that the Government would do a better job than private insurance companies in running our healthcare industry you're goddamn delusional. The waste in anything the Federal, State, County, and City Governments do triple the profits by private insurance companies, and that doesn't even begin to address the graft and political corruption involved in all things 'Government'!

That's a nice regurgitation of whatever you heard on Hate Radio today, but here's the reality.

The government ALREADY runs half the health care system, and they do a vastly better job than the insurance industry does. Consumer satisfaction with Medicare, Medicaid and the VA is VASTLY higher than that of those who buy their insurance on the individual market.

[

Want to make healthcare better? Begin with the Government, Repeal the 17th amendment, outlaw Political Parties, prohibit political donations from out of State, (no political money crossing State Lines), treat political organizations the same as terrorist organizations, the same as the KKK, institute term limits, and pass a Constitutional Amendment that strips the Supreme Court of all it's Justices and replaces them with new ones chosen by elections in which Attorneys General of the States vote.

Yup, all the Hate Radio Crazy in one "Stew".

[
An observation: Barack Obama reminds me more of Andrew Jackson than any previous President, and that is indeed ironic, Andrew Jackson was a racist slave owner.

Are you kidding. I wish Obama had Old Hickory's balls.

 

[JoeB131]

I hope the left are still good with this when the next Republican President continues the abuse of power begun by Obama and the right is still as upset over it as they are now.

Until you guys get rid of the Plutocrats and FundiTards, I'm more worried about a unicorn invasion than a future GOP president.

 

[mudwhistle]

A black president teaching liberals to hate white people.

Never gonna happen..............

 

[JoeB131]

[

So you lied...again. You asserted that posters on this forum INSISTED HC come from employers.

And why has your Messiah gone along with big insurance companies? Certainly the most powerful man in the world, who is unconstrained by any laws, could give you what you want.

I thought your Messiah was against big business....too funny...he and big business sleep together nightly, but you and your kind can't see that.

Not sure where you get Obama is my "Messiah". I didn't vote for him in 2008, and I only voted for him in 2012 because I REALLY FUCKING HATE MORMONS.

But to the point, realistically, you can't get rid of big insurance in one fell swoop. The flip side of that was that Big INsurance knows that in the long run, employer insurance isn't viable without government support.

Now, for Obama sleeping with big business, I have to wonder why they hate him so much, given they've done pretty well on his watch. better than they did under George W. Retard.

 

[natstew]

[

Joeb131, I'm no fan of insurance companies, but a lesser fan of the Federal Government. If you think for one second that the Government would do a better job than private insurance companies in running our healthcare industry you're goddamn delusional. The waste in anything the Federal, State, County, and City Governments do triple the profits by private insurance companies, and that doesn't even begin to address the graft and political corruption involved in all things 'Government'!

That's a nice regurgitation of whatever you heard on Hate Radio today, but here's the reality.

The government ALREADY runs half the health care system, and they do a vastly better job than the insurance industry does. Consumer satisfaction with Medicare, Medicaid and the VA is VASTLY higher than that of those who buy their insurance on the individual market.




Yup, all the Hate Radio Crazy in one "Stew".

"Hate Radio"? Yo don't like the truth so it's "Hate Radio"! You're disgusting!!



Are you kidding. I wish Obama had Old Hickory's balls.

No I'm not kidding. there's more fraud in medicare and medicaid than some half the World's Countries.

 

[JoeB131]

[

No I'm not kidding. there's more fraud in medicare and medicaid than some half the World's Countries.

Ummm. I think you might want to rework the math there.

The CBO estimates "improper payments" from Medicare at 47 billion out of some 550 billion spent, but revised its numbers down when it found out most of those payments turned out to be valid.

Medicare fraud - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia