Oregon Bakers: You get to pay 135,000 for being radical religious morons, Judge so orders!

[Aba Incieni]

not sure why people cheer when the Constitution is ignored.

leftist, hating America since fdr

Did you feel that way when an Oregon dentist was fined TWICE as much under the same PA law for discriminating against a christian woman based on her religion? That's the precedent for this case, you know.

Yep. And it was bad precedent. Government should be protecting equal rights, not granting special privilege.

And how are you actively working to repeal the PA laws in your state?

This again? I'm...At all?

Should the seller be forced to sell something he doesn't want to, ie, do protective rights apply to products.

 

[bodecea]

emotional distress? LMAO what a couple of fucking bedwetters
It amazes me how people cheer on loss of individuality and private property.
Fucking sickos

What amazes me is that this woman let her loser husband destroy the business she spent years building up.

Should have been a point long before this where they just acknowledged they made a mistake and settled.

There are just some so-called christians that are not happy unless they can play the persecuted in order to gain some coin.

 

[Uncensored2008]

not sure why people cheer when the Constitution is ignored.

leftist, hating America since fdr

The constitution wasn’t ignored. Thus the ruling.

Ever heard of the 1st Amendment, Comrade?

 

[WorldWatcher]

He offered them.

Neither the Kliens or Mr. Phillips offered to make the couple a Wedding Cake like other customers.

The bakers agreed to this fact in court documents.

>>>>

 

[bodecea]

emotional distress? LMAO what a couple of fucking bedwetters
It amazes me how people cheer on loss of individuality and private property.
Fucking sickos

Yeah and black people should have sucked it up and sat at the booth instead of the counter

I see nothing wrong with individuals doing as they please with their private property.

Is a business that has obtained a state business license considered private property?

Yes hahaha...is that a serious question?? I hope to god not. You have to get a license to operate a car...that doesn’t mean you no longer own your car.

What do you think happens if you do not follow vehicle laws then? Let me give you a hint......you get a F-I-N-E.

Thanks for such a wonderful example to prove my point.

 

[Aba Incieni]

A special gravel the gravel man does not offer.

If it's a special gravel and the company dosen't do special orders for other customers, then Public Accommodation laws don't require an services not normally provided.

However the bakers did normally provide Wedding Cakes as part of their business model and refused not because it was not a product they produced but based on who the customers were.

Here's the question all avoid: Should he be forced to sell something he doesn't want to, ie, do protective rights apply to products.

There is a difference between what our opinion is of what the law "should be" as opposed to what the law "is".

Personally I support the repeal of Public Accommodation laws in respect of rights of association and property as applied to private business entities.

But that is a different discussion about what the law should be and not how the law functions in reality.


>>>>>

I'm not asking about PA laws. I agree all should be served equally, if that's what you people want to do (here we can refuse service because they're Indians or blacks or whites or we don't like their gay walk), but that isn't the question. Does their right to be served equally apply to products?

 

[WorldWatcher]

I believe the quote you erased when you edited my post. From the baker.

#1 you haven't supplied a quote from either baker, you supplied a link.

#2 The link you previously supplied did not say that the baker had agreed to supply a Wedding Cake like for other customers. Selling other products does not mean they agreed to supply a Wedding Cake.


>>>>

 

[Uncensored2008]

Actually, they don't get the money...it's a state fine....a misconception....just like it's a misconception to say they sued. They never did.

`
`
Source?

Actually, they don't get the money...it's a state fine....a misconception....just like it's a misconception to say they sued. They never did.

`
`
Source?

Oregon court upholds $135,000 fine, part of ruling against bakery in gay wedding cake case

The $135,000 was a fine. The gay couple didn't sue them: they reported them.

Oregon has declared the following null and void.

Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

 

[dblack]

Should the seller be forced to sell something he doesn't want to, ie, do protective rights apply to products.

No one should be forced to sell anything they don't want to sell, for any reason. I don't know what you mean by "protective rights".

 

[WorldWatcher]

You're talking in circles, because you edited my post.

Should he be forced to sell something he doesn't want to, ie, do protective rights apply to products?

The bakers aren't forced to supply Wedding Cakes if they don't want to. They are free not to offer Wedding Cakes as part of their business model.


>>>>

 

[Aba Incieni]

Should the seller be forced to sell something he doesn't want to, ie, do protective rights apply to products.

No one should be forced to sell anything they don't want to sell, for any reason. I don't know what you mean by "protective rights".

In United States federal anti-discrimination law, a protected class is a characteristic of a person which cannot be targeted for discrimination. Individual states can and do create other protected classes, which are protected under that state's law.

Do these laws apply to products, as well?

 

[dblack]

You're talking in circles, because you edited my post.

Should he be forced to sell something he doesn't want to, ie, do protective rights apply to products?

The bakers aren't forced to supply Wedding Cakes if they don't want to. They are free not to offer Wedding Cakes as part of their business model.


>>>>

This assumes we give up our basic individual rights in exchange for the "privilege" of being allowed to trade with others. I don't accept that. And it's really the core issue here.

 

[WorldWatcher]

I'm not asking about PA laws. I agree all should be served equally, if that's what you people want to do (here we can refuse service because they're Indians or blacks or whites or we don't like their gay walk), but that isn't the question. Does their right to be served equally apply to products?

The whole issue is about PA laws.

You say "here we can refuse service because they're Indians or blacks or whites", from a general nature - where is "here"?

It's against federal law to refuse service based on race or national origin. So if you are in a US State or Territory you claim is false.


>>>>>

 

[Aba Incieni]

You're talking in circles, because you edited my post.

Should he be forced to sell something he doesn't want to, ie, do protective rights apply to products?

The bakers aren't forced to supply Wedding Cakes if they don't want to. They are free not to offer Wedding Cakes as part of their business model.


>>>>

He does offer wedding cakes, equally to everyone. Do these same laws apply to products he sells? Do they have rights, too?

 

[Uncensored2008]

Dykes refused.

The same-sex couple did not refuse the purchase of a Wedding Cake.

The bakers confirmed in court documents that they refused to sell them a Wedding Cake.


>>>>>

Refused to CREATE a homosexual themed wedding cake. The couple was free to buy a stock cake from the case.

This is a frontal assault on the first amendment.

Hundreds of thousands of Americans have died fighting to protect freedom, will we be the generation that let's black robed thugs end the experiment in liberty?

 

[Aba Incieni]

I'm not asking about PA laws. I agree all should be served equally, if that's what you people want to do (here we can refuse service because they're Indians or blacks or whites or we don't like their gay walk), but that isn't the question. Does their right to be served equally apply to products?

The whole issue is about PA laws.

You say "here we can refuse service because they're Indians or blacks or whites", from a general nature - where is "here"?

It's against federal law to refuse service based on race or national origin. So if you are in a US State or Territory you claim is false.


>>>>>

I'm not in the US. Duh.

You ever going to answer the question. Do products have protected status?

 

[WorldWatcher]

>

Well in a few minutes I need to take my daughter to the airport so she can report back to her AF base for duty.

Ya'll have a save and happy new year. Will be back later.



>>>>

 

[dblack]

Should the seller be forced to sell something he doesn't want to, ie, do protective rights apply to products.

No one should be forced to sell anything they don't want to sell, for any reason. I don't know what you mean by "protective rights".

In United States federal anti-discrimination law, a protected class is a characteristic of a person which cannot be targeted for discrimination. Individual states can and do create other protected classes, which are protected under that state's law.

Do these laws apply to products, as well?

I think such laws are invalid to begin with. The distinction between services and products is immaterial.

 

[bodecea]

You believe in sick, dystopian nonsense.

yes or no

Is the US Constitution dystopian?


I ask, b/c that's what it sounds like you are saying, but I'm going to give you the chance to backpeddle.

No. Your amateur interpretation is.

So, you should support the Constitution over a 'law' that forces people to provide goods or services.


key word; FORCE

Why should they force businesses to follow health laws now, eh?

Health laws do not conflict with their religion.

How do you know that would never happen? All I have to do, like this couple did, is say it does......then what?

 

[Aba Incieni]

Should the seller be forced to sell something he doesn't want to, ie, do protective rights apply to products.

No one should be forced to sell anything they don't want to sell, for any reason. I don't know what you mean by "protective rights".

In United States federal anti-discrimination law, a protected class is a characteristic of a person which cannot be targeted for discrimination. Individual states can and do create other protected classes, which are protected under that state's law.

Do these laws apply to products, as well?

I think such laws are invalid to begin with. The distinction between services and products is immaterial.

He offered the service. Not the product.