Orthodox Christianity, False Teachers, Faith, and Reason

[Foxfyre]

Looking at the James 5:15-16 verses, however, what did those verses actually mean to James? Do we seek out the church elders because they are given extra power to heal? Or because the church elders are supposed to be men of god, of deep faith, of right thinking?

How many call on the church elders--I think this is a good thing--to heal them and indeed some are healed but most are not? Is the prayer unheard? I don't think so. I just think God has something else to teach us and we have to believe he is doing something and allow him to be God. God is not a being who can be ordered by we mere created beings. God is not our servant, like a genie in a bottle, who performs what we ask of him if we 'just have enough faith'. I just can't see it that way.

In my belief, prayer is worshipfully coming to Him, humbly acknowledging His sovereign authority and loving wisdom, telling Him our need, and then patiently allowing Him to deal with our request as it seems best to Him. He knows what we need before we ask. The asking is our recognition of that and submission to his authority.

And I also believe again what John said:

9 If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater:
for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son.
:10 He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself:
he that believeth not God hath made him a liar;
because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.​

 

[Chuckt]

Galatians 6:7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.

Galatians 6:8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.

The Negative Side
We Reap the Wrong Others Have Sown
The law of sowing and reaping also has a negative side. We not only enter into the blessings God has bestowed, but we also reap the results of wrong others have sown both before us and around us.

(1) We reap a certain amount of wrong inherited from our parents (Ps. 51:5; 58:3; Gen. 5:3; Ex. 20:6; 34:6-7; Num. 14:18).

(2) We all reap the sin of Adam and we pass that along to our children. This means not only a sinful nature, but things children can learn like how to be critical from a fault-finding parent.

(3) We reap the wrong of foolish and corrupt leaders and the consequences of a decaying society (see Isa. 2:5-3:15). This often includes the judgment of God on society—past, present, and future.

What is happening in our cities across our nation is that we are treasuring up unto ourselves “wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God” (Rom. 2:5). It is of concern to us because, if the Lord tarries, it shall affect us greatly. We were willing to settle for a “no win” policy in Korea and so we settled for a “lose the war” policy in Vietnam. The next step is to settle for “no contest” right here at home.

https://bible.org/article/seven-laws-harvest

 

[Foxfyre]

I wonder Chuck, if you experience the joy in the Lord that the Bible teaches us? Is your salvation a burden to be born? Or liberation from the burden of sin? Is your salvation earned by keeping the rules? Or do you keep from sin to the best of your ability because you love the Lord so much?

 

[Chuckt]

Looking at the James 5:15-16 verses, however, what did those verses actually mean to James? Do we seek out the church elders because they are given extra power to heal? Or because the church elders are supposed to be men of god, of deep faith, of right thinking?

It says "the prayer of faith shall save the sick". Who'se faith? Not the sick person's faith like you see on t.v. It is the elder's faith.

James 5:15 And the prayer of faith shall save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him.

Sometimes we go through stuff and I went through stuff but I had a pastor pray for me and it helped.

James 5:16 Confess your faults one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much.

 

[Chuckt]

I wonder Chuck, if you experience the joy in the Lord that the Bible teaches us? Is your salvation a burden to be born? Or liberation from the burden of sin? Is your salvation earned by keeping the rules? Or do you keep from sin to the best of your ability because you love the Lord so much?

In this world you will have tribulation. What do you think happened to the Christians who stayed in Jerusalem and didn't go into all the world and preach the gospel? Did God protect them or did Titus sack Jerusalem and burn the temple? How many Christians were lost? God used it to get the Christians to go into all of the world.

John 16:33 These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world.

We each have to carry our own cross and bear our own burden. We also have to consider what it will cost us.

Luke 14:27 And whosoever doth not bear his cross, and come after me, cannot be my disciple.

Luke 14:28 For which of you, intending to build a tower, sitteth not down first, and counteth the cost, whether he have sufficient to finish it?

Why would we have to count the cost if it was going to be easy?

2 Corinthians 11:23 Are they ministers of Christ? (I speak as a fool ) I am more; in labours more abundant, in stripes above measure, in prisons more frequent, in deaths oft.

2 Corinthians 11:24 Of the Jews five times received I forty stripes save one.

2 Corinthians 11:25 Thrice was I beaten with rods, once was I stoned, thrice I suffered shipwreck, a night and a day I have been in the deep;

2 Corinthians 11:26 In journeyings often, in perils of waters, in perils of robbers, in perils by mine own countrymen, in perils by the heathen, in perils in the city, in perils in the wilderness, in perils in the sea, in perils among false brethren;

2 Corinthians 11:27 In weariness and painfulness, in watchings often, in hunger and thirst, in fastings often, in cold and nakedness.

2 Corinthians 11:28 Beside those things that are without, that which cometh upon me daily, the care of all the churches.

2 Corinthians 11:29 Who is weak, and I am not weak? who is offended, and I burn not?

2 Corinthians 11:30 If I must needs glory, I will glory of the things which concern mine infirmities.

How many people have Paul's resume today?

Philippians 4:12 I know both how to be abased, and I know how to abound: every where and in all things I am instructed both to be full and to be hungry, both to abound and to suffer need.

There are fifteen hundred people groups that no one goes to to give them the gospel because the reality is, your kids will get disease, your wife will be raped and you will be butchered. This prosperity teaching doesn't deal with reality and people who live with the idea that you have to be prosperous don't go to tell people the gospel because they can't deal with the reality.

 

[Foxfyre]

But the realities do not overshadow the fact that God loves us and the promises of a glorious future. I too care about the people trapped in horrible situations, who aren't given the opportunity to hear of Jesus and what he has done for us. I am edified and humbled to share my life with Christians who are risking their very lives to get the Gospel to such people. But we won't attract many to God by dangling them over the pit so to speak. It is the Christian filled with the life and joy of the Spirit who has a much better chance of introducing people to Christ. Jesus himself must have been a joyful and happy person to have attracted so many to himself.