That plan was shelved when Diem was assassinated, Bfgrn. There is absolutely ZERO proof that Kennedy was going to go ahead with taking troops out of South Vietnam when doing so would almost certainly have caused the fall of South Vietnam.
Follow along with the video below to see how to install our site as a web app on your home screen.
Note: This feature may not be available in some browsers.
I'm not defending Nixon, you ass clown! I've already stated in this string that I loathed the man! All I'm doing is pointing out that you're COMPLETELY wrong when you accuse Nixon of supporting the Khmer Rouge and being responsible for the millions of deaths they caused. You're so fucking stupid you didn't know there was a difference between the Khmer Republic and the Khmer Rouge.
Wait, what? First off this began because you made the completely wrong claim that there was no historical evidence that John F. Kennedy was thinking about getting out of Vietnam. When you found out that was completely wrong you went off on a freakin dance to "clarify" your position. THEN you went off and said Nixon ENDED the war. Which without context sounds like Nixon was some kind of saint. Nixon was a monster. Kissinger had to stop the guy from blowing up dikes that would have killed 250,000 people in one day.
Nixon White House Considered Nuclear Options Against North Vietnam
Nixon ENDED the war after killing millions. Nixon brought about the Khmer Rouge which killed Millions more. Kennedy on the other hand was considering ending the war.
By the way, I'm not sitting here "clarifying" LBJ's position. His actions were just as monstrous.
Oldstyle said:I didn't support the Presidential pardon of William Calley but I remember that a majority of the country then didn't feel the same way as I did. Jimmy Carter was a very vocal advocate of leniency for Calley. So how does THAT compute with your notion that "you folks aren't human"? I suppose Carter IS human (because he's a liberal) but I'm not (even though I didn't support the pardon) because I'm a conservative?
How does what compute? Carter didn't think Calley was responsible for the actions of his men because the war was so screwed up in the first place. Nixon? Didn't see what Calley did as a problem.
And stow it. I don't believe you protested the war unless you were out there with Romney protesting to send folks to it.
You keep making the same ridiculous claim...that Nixon "brought about" the Khmer Rouge when I've shown you repeatedly that Nixon backed the Khmer Republic. So are you brain dead, Sallow...or just REALLY REALLY stupid?
Wait, what? First off this began because you made the completely wrong claim that there was no historical evidence that John F. Kennedy was thinking about getting out of Vietnam. When you found out that was completely wrong you went off on a freakin dance to "clarify" your position. THEN you went off and said Nixon ENDED the war. Which without context sounds like Nixon was some kind of saint. Nixon was a monster. Kissinger had to stop the guy from blowing up dikes that would have killed 250,000 people in one day.
Nixon White House Considered Nuclear Options Against North Vietnam
Nixon ENDED the war after killing millions. Nixon brought about the Khmer Rouge which killed Millions more. Kennedy on the other hand was considering ending the war.
By the way, I'm not sitting here "clarifying" LBJ's position. His actions were just as monstrous.
How does what compute? Carter didn't think Calley was responsible for the actions of his men because the war was so screwed up in the first place. Nixon? Didn't see what Calley did as a problem.
And stow it. I don't believe you protested the war unless you were out there with Romney protesting to send folks to it.
You keep making the same ridiculous claim...that Nixon "brought about" the Khmer Rouge when I've shown you repeatedly that Nixon backed the Khmer Republic. So are you brain dead, Sallow...or just REALLY REALLY stupid?
Neither.
You're a reptile.
Simple.
That plan was shelved when Diem was assassinated, Bfgrn. There is absolutely ZERO proof that Kennedy was going to go ahead with taking troops out of South Vietnam when doing so would almost certainly have caused the fall of South Vietnam.
That plan was shelved when Diem was assassinated, Bfgrn. There is absolutely ZERO proof that Kennedy was going to go ahead with taking troops out of South Vietnam when doing so would almost certainly have caused the fall of South Vietnam.
The Gulf of Tonkin Resolution was enacted August 10, 1964. WHEN did JFK die?
Regular U.S. combat units were deployed beginning in 1965. WHEN did JFK die?
Kennedy was against the deployment of American combat troops and observed that "to introduce U.S. forces in large numbers there today, while it might have an initially favorable military impact, would almost certainly lead to adverse political and, in the long run, adverse military consequences"
Lyndon B. Johnson (LBJ), as he took over the presidency after the death of Kennedy, initially did not consider Vietnam a priority and was more concerned with his "Great Society" and progressive social programs. Presidential aide Jack Valenti recalls, "Vietnam at the time was no bigger than a man's fist on the horizon. We hardly discussed it because it was not worth discussing."[158][159]
On 24 November 1963, Johnson said, "the battle against communism... must be joined... with strength and determination."[160] The pledge came at a time when the situation in South Vietnam was deteriorating, especially in places like the Mekong Delta, because of the recent coup against Diệm.[161] Johnson had reversed Kennedy's disengagement policy from Vietnam in withdrawing 1,000 troops by the end of 1963 (NSAM 263 on 11 October),[162] with his own NSAM 273 (26 November)[163][164] to expand the war.
link
That plan was shelved when Diem was assassinated, Bfgrn. There is absolutely ZERO proof that Kennedy was going to go ahead with taking troops out of South Vietnam when doing so would almost certainly have caused the fall of South Vietnam.
The Gulf of Tonkin Resolution was enacted August 10, 1964. WHEN did JFK die?
Regular U.S. combat units were deployed beginning in 1965. WHEN did JFK die?
Kennedy was against the deployment of American combat troops and observed that "to introduce U.S. forces in large numbers there today, while it might have an initially favorable military impact, would almost certainly lead to adverse political and, in the long run, adverse military consequences"
Lyndon B. Johnson (LBJ), as he took over the presidency after the death of Kennedy, initially did not consider Vietnam a priority and was more concerned with his "Great Society" and progressive social programs. Presidential aide Jack Valenti recalls, "Vietnam at the time was no bigger than a man's fist on the horizon. We hardly discussed it because it was not worth discussing."[158][159]
On 24 November 1963, Johnson said, "the battle against communism... must be joined... with strength and determination."[160] The pledge came at a time when the situation in South Vietnam was deteriorating, especially in places like the Mekong Delta, because of the recent coup against Diệm.[161] Johnson had reversed Kennedy's disengagement policy from Vietnam in withdrawing 1,000 troops by the end of 1963 (NSAM 263 on 11 October),[162] with his own NSAM 273 (26 November)[163][164] to expand the war.
link
If Kennedy was against the deployment of American combat troops then explain why he increased the number of those combat troops from under a thousand the first year he was in office to over sixteen thousand by the time he was killed? Oh, wait...let me guess...because he chose to call them "advisers" I suppose you don't think they were combat troops, right? Just how naive are you, Bfgrn?
That plan was shelved when Diem was assassinated, Bfgrn. There is absolutely ZERO proof that Kennedy was going to go ahead with taking troops out of South Vietnam when doing so would almost certainly have caused the fall of South Vietnam.
The Gulf of Tonkin Resolution was enacted August 10, 1964. WHEN did JFK die?
Regular U.S. combat units were deployed beginning in 1965. WHEN did JFK die?
Kennedy was against the deployment of American combat troops and observed that "to introduce U.S. forces in large numbers there today, while it might have an initially favorable military impact, would almost certainly lead to adverse political and, in the long run, adverse military consequences"
Lyndon B. Johnson (LBJ), as he took over the presidency after the death of Kennedy, initially did not consider Vietnam a priority and was more concerned with his "Great Society" and progressive social programs. Presidential aide Jack Valenti recalls, "Vietnam at the time was no bigger than a man's fist on the horizon. We hardly discussed it because it was not worth discussing."[158][159]
On 24 November 1963, Johnson said, "the battle against communism... must be joined... with strength and determination."[160] The pledge came at a time when the situation in South Vietnam was deteriorating, especially in places like the Mekong Delta, because of the recent coup against Diệm.[161] Johnson had reversed Kennedy's disengagement policy from Vietnam in withdrawing 1,000 troops by the end of 1963 (NSAM 263 on 11 October),[162] with his own NSAM 273 (26 November)[163][164] to expand the war.
link
The Gulf of Tonkin Resolution was enacted August 10, 1964. WHEN did JFK die?
Regular U.S. combat units were deployed beginning in 1965. WHEN did JFK die?
Kennedy was against the deployment of American combat troops and observed that "to introduce U.S. forces in large numbers there today, while it might have an initially favorable military impact, would almost certainly lead to adverse political and, in the long run, adverse military consequences"
Lyndon B. Johnson (LBJ), as he took over the presidency after the death of Kennedy, initially did not consider Vietnam a priority and was more concerned with his "Great Society" and progressive social programs. Presidential aide Jack Valenti recalls, "Vietnam at the time was no bigger than a man's fist on the horizon. We hardly discussed it because it was not worth discussing."[158][159]
On 24 November 1963, Johnson said, "the battle against communism... must be joined... with strength and determination."[160] The pledge came at a time when the situation in South Vietnam was deteriorating, especially in places like the Mekong Delta, because of the recent coup against Diệm.[161] Johnson had reversed Kennedy's disengagement policy from Vietnam in withdrawing 1,000 troops by the end of 1963 (NSAM 263 on 11 October),[162] with his own NSAM 273 (26 November)[163][164] to expand the war.
link
If Kennedy was against the deployment of American combat troops then explain why he increased the number of those combat troops from under a thousand the first year he was in office to over sixteen thousand by the time he was killed? Oh, wait...let me guess...because he chose to call them "advisers" I suppose you don't think they were combat troops, right? Just how naive are you, Bfgrn?
Regular U.S. combat units were deployed beginning in 1965. WHEN did JFK die?
Johnson had reversed Kennedy's disengagement policy from Vietnam in withdrawing 1,000 troops by the end of 1963 (NSAM 263 on 11 October),[162] with his own NSAM 273 (26 November)[163][164] to expand the war.
Kind of hard to "reverse" a policy that was never implemented in the first place!
If Kennedy was against the deployment of American combat troops then explain why he increased the number of those combat troops from under a thousand the first year he was in office to over sixteen thousand by the time he was killed? Oh, wait...let me guess...because he chose to call them "advisers" I suppose you don't think they were combat troops, right? Just how naive are you, Bfgrn?
Regular U.S. combat units were deployed beginning in 1965. WHEN did JFK die?
Johnson had reversed Kennedy's disengagement policy from Vietnam in withdrawing 1,000 troops by the end of 1963 (NSAM 263 on 11 October),[162] with his own NSAM 273 (26 November)[163][164] to expand the war.
So if we call them "advisers" instead of "combat troops" that means they didn't exist? LOL Gotcha!!!
And that was NOT the policy on the day he died because that policy had been abandoned as soon as Diem was assassinated. We were NOT pulling troops out of Vietnam when Kennedy was shot...we were sending more...A LOT MORE!
Regular U.S. combat units were deployed beginning in 1965. WHEN did JFK die?
Johnson had reversed Kennedy's disengagement policy from Vietnam in withdrawing 1,000 troops by the end of 1963 (NSAM 263 on 11 October),[162] with his own NSAM 273 (26 November)[163][164] to expand the war.
So if we call them "advisers" instead of "combat troops" that means they didn't exist? LOL Gotcha!!!
YES. Regular U.S. combat units are not the same as military advisers.
Example:
11th Marine Regiment
Vietnam War
The years between 1955 and 1965 were spent in continued training to maintain a constant state of readiness. During the Cuban Missile Crisis of October 1962, the 11th Marines played a role in the task force ordered to impose a naval quarantine against arms shipments to Cuba.
A new era opened on 8 March 1965 when the Marines were committed to ground action in South Vietnam. Beginning on 16 August 1965, the regiment was gradually deployed to South Vietnam. The transfer was completed by the arrival of the 2d Battalion on 27 May 1966. The nature of the war required the artillerymen to defend their own positions against numerous enemy probes and brought about a vastly increased employment of artillery by helicopters, both for displacement and resupply.
United States Air Force in South Vietnam
Advisory Years (1961-1964)
Late in 1961 the U.S. began sending USAF and U.S. Army personnel to South Vietnam to train and advise its personnel. U.S. personnel were not to engage in combat operations, but sometimes did. Known as the National Front for the Liberation of South Vietnam or the Viet Cong, the guerrillas shot down four U.S. Army helicopters. As the Viet Cong became more active and as more Americans became casualties, the U.S. stepped up the training and the supply of equipment. The goal was it could finish training as soon as possible and withdraw.
And that was NOT the policy on the day he died because that policy had been abandoned as soon as Diem was assassinated. We were NOT pulling troops out of Vietnam when Kennedy was shot...we were sending more...A LOT MORE!
We DID withdraw 1,000 military advisers by the end of 1963 per the policy in place the day Kennedy died. WHEN did Kennedy die, 1965? 1966?? 1972???
1963 16300
1964 23300
1965 184300
1966 385300
1967 485600
1968 536100
1969 475200
1970 334600
1971 156800
1972 24200
Your link
And that was NOT the policy on the day he died because that policy had been abandoned as soon as Diem was assassinated. We were NOT pulling troops out of Vietnam when Kennedy was shot...we were sending more...A LOT MORE!
We DID withdraw 1,000 military advisers by the end of 1963 per the policy in place the day Kennedy died. WHEN did Kennedy die, 1965? 1966?? 1972???
1963 16300
1964 23300
1965 184300
1966 385300
1967 485600
1968 536100
1969 475200
1970 334600
1971 156800
1972 24200
Your link
Provide some proof that 1,000 advisers were withdrawn...the numbers you've provided above show no such draw down...but instead show a steady increase. And I love how you decided to "leave out" the figures prior to 1963 that prove Kennedy was escalating the war.