Pacifism and the Left

[Unkotare]

Communism - McCarthy Was Right

 

[NYcarbineer]

Wikipedia's list of people harmed by McCarthy's witchhunt:

Nelson Algren, writer[48]
Elmer Bernstein, composer and conductor[49]
David Bohm, physicist and philosopher[50]
Bertolt Brecht, poet, playwright, screenwriter
Charlie Chaplin, actor and director[51]
Aaron Copland, composer[52]
Bartley Crum, attorney[53]
Howard Da Silva, actor[54]
Jules Dassin, director[55]
Dolores del Río, actress[56]
W. E. B. Du Bois, civil rights activist and author[57]
Howard Fast, writer[58]
Carl Foreman, writer of High Noon
John Garfield, actor[52]
Jack Gilford, actor[54]
Ruth Gordon, actress[54]
Lee Grant, actress[59]
Dashiell Hammett, author[52]
Elizabeth Hawes, clothing designer, author, equal rights activist[60]
Lillian Hellman, playwright[52]
Lena Horne, singer [54]
Langston Hughes, writer[52]
Sam Jaffe, actor[52]
Theodore Kaghan, diplomat[61]
Garson Kanin, writer and director[52]
Benjamin Keen, historian[62]
Gypsy Rose Lee, actress and stripper[52]
Cornelius Lanczos, mathematician and physicist[63]
Arthur Laurents, playwright[54]
Philip Loeb, actor[64]
Joseph Losey, director[52]
Burgess Meredith, actor[52]
Arthur Miller, playwright and essayist[52]
Zero Mostel, actor[52]
J. Robert Oppenheimer, physicist, scientific director of the Manhattan Project[65]
Dorothy Parker, writer[52]
Linus Pauling, chemist, winner of two Nobel prizes[66]
Samuel Reber, diplomat[67]
Martin Ritt, actor and director[68]
Paul Robeson, actor, athlete, singer, writer, political activist[69]
Edward G. Robinson, actor[52]
Waldo Salt, screenwriter[70]
Pete Seeger, folk singer[52]
Artie Shaw, jazz musician[52]
Irwin Shaw, writer[54]
William L. Shirer, journalist[71]
Lionel Stander, actor[72]
Paul Sweezy, economist and founder-editor of Monthly Review[73]
Charles W. Thayer, diplomat[74]
Tsien Hsue-shen, physicist[75]

McCarthyism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

We'll leave it to PC to prove that either

a. each of them was in fact a 'Communist', or, b. that the ones she can't prove were Communists were not in fact harmed by the accusation.

Couldn't be easier.

1. What does 'victims of McCarthy' mean?
Define same.
OK...I'll help: their feelings were hurt.

2. "The best and most generous estimate is that during the entire decade of the red scare, ten thousand Americans lost their jobs because of their past or present affiliation with the Communist Party or one of its auxiliary organizations. Of those who lost their jobs, two thousand worked in the government, and in perhaps forty cases McCarthy himself was directly or indirectly responsible for their being fired. In only one case — that of Owen Lattimore — can anyone make the argument that McCarthy's allegations led to any actual legal proceedings, and there a judge eventually threw out most of the indictment. Paradoxically, the fact that McCarthy never sent anyone to prison is also turned against him; opponents claimed that during his entire career, he never actually exposed a single spy or Communist — a claim that is manifestly untrue, as we will see."
http://www.nytimes.com/books/first/h/herman-mccarthy.html

a. • The State Department's Owen Lattimore was the man that McCarthy made the most allegations against. McCarthy went so far as to say that he would stake his entire reputation on the question of whether Lattimore was a Communist agent. Now, of course, we have absolute proof that McCarthy was right.
Senator Joe McCarthy, anti-Communist


2. Victims??
From “blacklist survivor” Norma Barzman about her ‘exile’ in Paris: “We had dinner with Picasso every Tuesday night when we were at our country house in Provence. It was hard, but it was the time of my life.” (Dennis Hamilton, “Keeper of the Flame: A Blacklist Survivor,” Los Angeles Times, October 3, 2000) The horror, the horror.


3. Victims???
Proven guilty, jailed for 44 months for perjury (the statute of limitations had run out on espionage), Alger Hiss, traitorous agent of Soviet espionage, the American left views Hiss as a hero. After leaving prison, he spoke at Princeton and was given a standing ovation. Bard College actually has the Alger Hiss Chair of Social Studies (Lawrence Helm's Blog: The Alger Hiss Chair at Bard College)
In 1972, Massachusetts readmitted him to the bar. Liberals would never turn their backs on a man who spied for Stalin against America.



4. Victims??? I got ya' victims right here:

When anti-communism took its toll in Hollywood, the blacklisting took the “deadly” form of not having ones name in the credits, or living in Paris, or not being able to sell a teleplay for as much as three years. This for folks who had no problem with Ukrainian farmers and their children eating their shoes.
Coulter, "Treason."

Ah so by setting up a preposterous definition of what a victim would be, you manufacture an argument that you can't lose.

Why would you bother to do that when by now you must have learned that people like me will see right through in an instant?

 

[NYcarbineer]

When the French were under siege at Diem Bien Phu (the battle that ultimately led to their overall defeat)

they requested from the British and Americans the use of tactical nuclear weapons to destroy Giap's army and lift the siege.

The Americans refused. We refused because the most powerful Senator in Congress at the time refused, and with his power, he was able to say 'no' and make it stick.

His name was Lyndon Johnson.

As a consequence, the French were defeated, they departed,and we, and eventually the same Lyndon Johnson, got left with the mess. The ultimate consequence was Johnson's downfall.

One of the greatest cases of irony in modern history.

 

[Synthaholic]

Wikipedia's list of people harmed by McCarthy's witchhunt:

Nelson Algren, writer[48]
Elmer Bernstein, composer and conductor[49]
David Bohm, physicist and philosopher[50]
Bertolt Brecht, poet, playwright, screenwriter
Charlie Chaplin, actor and director[51]
Aaron Copland, composer[52]
Bartley Crum, attorney[53]
Howard Da Silva, actor[54]
Jules Dassin, director[55]
Dolores del Río, actress[56]
W. E. B. Du Bois, civil rights activist and author[57]
Howard Fast, writer[58]
Carl Foreman, writer of High Noon
John Garfield, actor[52]
Jack Gilford, actor[54]
Ruth Gordon, actress[54]
Lee Grant, actress[59]
Dashiell Hammett, author[52]
Elizabeth Hawes, clothing designer, author, equal rights activist[60]
Lillian Hellman, playwright[52]
Lena Horne, singer [54]
Langston Hughes, writer[52]
Sam Jaffe, actor[52]
Theodore Kaghan, diplomat[61]
Garson Kanin, writer and director[52]
Benjamin Keen, historian[62]
Gypsy Rose Lee, actress and stripper[52]
Cornelius Lanczos, mathematician and physicist[63]
Arthur Laurents, playwright[54]
Philip Loeb, actor[64]
Joseph Losey, director[52]
Burgess Meredith, actor[52]
Arthur Miller, playwright and essayist[52]
Zero Mostel, actor[52]
J. Robert Oppenheimer, physicist, scientific director of the Manhattan Project[65]
Dorothy Parker, writer[52]
Linus Pauling, chemist, winner of two Nobel prizes[66]
Samuel Reber, diplomat[67]
Martin Ritt, actor and director[68]
Paul Robeson, actor, athlete, singer, writer, political activist[69]
Edward G. Robinson, actor[52]
Waldo Salt, screenwriter[70]
Pete Seeger, folk singer[52]
Artie Shaw, jazz musician[52]
Irwin Shaw, writer[54]
William L. Shirer, journalist[71]
Lionel Stander, actor[72]
Paul Sweezy, economist and founder-editor of Monthly Review[73]
Charles W. Thayer, diplomat[74]
Tsien Hsue-shen, physicist[75]

McCarthyism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

We'll leave it to PC to prove that either

a. each of them was in fact a 'Communist', or, b. that the ones she can't prove were Communists were not in fact harmed by the accusation.

They missed a couple: Betty Garrett, who was a popular character actress, and her husband Larry Parks, who played Al Jolson in 'The Jolson Story'.

Garrett finally got work again in the 1970s, playing Archie Bunker's neighbor Irene on 'All In The Family', and the landlady on 'Laverne And Shirley'.

Parks had affiliations with the Communist Party early in his career, but had long ceased by the time of McCarthy's witch hunt.

 

[Synthaholic]

Annie Moss was enough.

Someone named Annie Moss was a communist. Not the one that McCarthy crucified and was made to look like a fool when he found he had the wrong person.

Seriously, I'm not even sure why you are even going there. McCarthy was evil. No one naming a school after that guy.

Except that I proved you wrong....

Oh...right, you're a Liberal: wrong doesn't count....you just continue to run with it.

Um, sorry, when you go into crazy Ann Coulter territory and try to rewrite history, I'm not sure there's much to do with you.

Go into any History and PolSci department in accredited universities, see how far your position gets.

You're done.

Universities are bastions of Liberalism, don't you know!

 

[JoeB131]

You're such a fucking idiot.

If the Cold War was really over, then Russia would quit targeting US cities with nukes. ?

So you've gone over and checked the targetting computers on those nukes? How do you know they are targetting our cities? Are we targetting their cities?

Uh, China's military took a leap forward in the 90s when Bill Clinton allowed US missile technology to help their ICBM and space programs, which are big threats to us. China has a nukes, dumbfuck.?

China has had nukes since the 1960's. It still didn't really make them a threat. They have 240 warheads compared to we and the Russians having 5000 each.

No, what has made China a threat are big corporations closing down factories in this country and moving them to China for cheap labor. What makes China a threat is that they now hold 8% of our debt and could crash our economy merely by asking us to pay it off. And we can thank Republicans and its Plutocratic wing for that one.

Iran is not obsolete if they get nukes like you want, idiot. They rely on assymetric warfare in the Gulf region with fastboats shutting down shipping lanes and using their terrorist networks spread out around the world even here. ?

Again, if Iran got a nuke, it would be a weak fission bomb. The US has 5000 nukes. Israel has 200. Pakistan has 100 and India has 100.

As for shutting down the shipping lanes (Seriously, don't you think that our 11 Aircraft Carriers could put a stop to that?) the only reason that's a big deal is because people like you let the Oil Companies have their way with us. We should have gotten off petroleum 40 years ago the first time the crazy folks over there started screwing with us.

As for Russia, you clearly don't have a fucking clue to overlook them supporting Assad RIGHT NOW in Syria while he murders thousands there to stay in power. Nevermind giving weapons and intelligence aid to Saddam right up until we bombed his ass gone. Let's see....Iran's nuclear program right now is being supported by Russia as well as their air defense systems being upgraded to prevent an attack by us and Israel.

You are dumber than shit and should be banned from this board.

?

Why is what's going on in Syria our problem? Are you willing to send your kid over there to fight? Frankly, it's a fight between Shi'ites and Sunnis over how many Imams can dance on the head of a pin, and I'm not seeing a compelling American interest.

You jokers on the right bitch about the folks who overthrew Mubarek not being our buds, what do you think the people who might overthrow Assad are going to be?

 

[Unkotare]

What a relief that a defense expert like you guarantees there is nothing to worry about. I guess that's that!

 

[JoeB131]

What a relief that a defense expert like you guarantees there is nothing to worry about. I guess that's that!

And where's your DD214? Do you even know what a DD214 is?

 

[Unkotare]

So you are saying that you are in fact a defense expert, right?

 

[JoeB131]

So you are saying that you are in fact a defense expert, right?

I'm saying 11 years of military service gives me more expertise than you have.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Um, sorry, when you go into crazy Ann Coulter territory and try to rewrite history, I'm not sure there's much to do with you.

Go into any History and PolSci department in accredited universities, see how far your position gets.

You're done.

Your protestations are always so flimsy.....

A pity you don't read.

No, I just don't "Verstehen" Crazy...

Seriously, I mean, I just can't see how any reasonable person can look at McCarthyism, where career military and civil service people, could find themselves ruined by a drunken witchhunter...

I mean, honestly, if you are engaging in this level of crazy, I;m not sure if there is any talking to you.

Imagine a world where you replace "Communist" with "Republican", and then tell me what McCarthy did was okay...

After all the righteous indignation, a person with even marginal intelligence would confront their own beliefs once I prove that there were no non-communists who 'suffered' as a result of the brave work of Senator McCarthy.
You couldn't name even one!!!

But not the co-opted Janissaies such as you.
Again: Whittaker Chambers wrote in his book WITNESS that liberals are/were incapable of ever effectively fighting Communism because they did not see anything in Communism that was antithetical to their own beliefs. In short, Liberals are Communists and Communists are Liberals.


'...replace "Communist" with "Republican",...'
That defies imagination....communists wanted a dictatorship with opponents in gulags....
Republicans want no such thing.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Wikipedia's list of people harmed by McCarthy's witchhunt:

Nelson Algren, writer[48]
Elmer Bernstein, composer and conductor[49]
David Bohm, physicist and philosopher[50]
Bertolt Brecht, poet, playwright, screenwriter
Charlie Chaplin, actor and director[51]
Aaron Copland, composer[52]
Bartley Crum, attorney[53]
Howard Da Silva, actor[54]
Jules Dassin, director[55]
Dolores del Río, actress[56]
W. E. B. Du Bois, civil rights activist and author[57]
Howard Fast, writer[58]
Carl Foreman, writer of High Noon
John Garfield, actor[52]
Jack Gilford, actor[54]
Ruth Gordon, actress[54]
Lee Grant, actress[59]
Dashiell Hammett, author[52]
Elizabeth Hawes, clothing designer, author, equal rights activist[60]
Lillian Hellman, playwright[52]
Lena Horne, singer [54]
Langston Hughes, writer[52]
Sam Jaffe, actor[52]
Theodore Kaghan, diplomat[61]
Garson Kanin, writer and director[52]
Benjamin Keen, historian[62]
Gypsy Rose Lee, actress and stripper[52]
Cornelius Lanczos, mathematician and physicist[63]
Arthur Laurents, playwright[54]
Philip Loeb, actor[64]
Joseph Losey, director[52]
Burgess Meredith, actor[52]
Arthur Miller, playwright and essayist[52]
Zero Mostel, actor[52]
J. Robert Oppenheimer, physicist, scientific director of the Manhattan Project[65]
Dorothy Parker, writer[52]
Linus Pauling, chemist, winner of two Nobel prizes[66]
Samuel Reber, diplomat[67]
Martin Ritt, actor and director[68]
Paul Robeson, actor, athlete, singer, writer, political activist[69]
Edward G. Robinson, actor[52]
Waldo Salt, screenwriter[70]
Pete Seeger, folk singer[52]
Artie Shaw, jazz musician[52]
Irwin Shaw, writer[54]
William L. Shirer, journalist[71]
Lionel Stander, actor[72]
Paul Sweezy, economist and founder-editor of Monthly Review[73]
Charles W. Thayer, diplomat[74]
Tsien Hsue-shen, physicist[75]

McCarthyism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

We'll leave it to PC to prove that either

a. each of them was in fact a 'Communist', or, b. that the ones she can't prove were Communists were not in fact harmed by the accusation.

Couldn't be easier.

1. What does 'victims of McCarthy' mean?
Define same.
OK...I'll help: their feelings were hurt.

2. "The best and most generous estimate is that during the entire decade of the red scare, ten thousand Americans lost their jobs because of their past or present affiliation with the Communist Party or one of its auxiliary organizations. Of those who lost their jobs, two thousand worked in the government, and in perhaps forty cases McCarthy himself was directly or indirectly responsible for their being fired. In only one case — that of Owen Lattimore — can anyone make the argument that McCarthy's allegations led to any actual legal proceedings, and there a judge eventually threw out most of the indictment. Paradoxically, the fact that McCarthy never sent anyone to prison is also turned against him; opponents claimed that during his entire career, he never actually exposed a single spy or Communist — a claim that is manifestly untrue, as we will see."
http://www.nytimes.com/books/first/h/herman-mccarthy.html

a. • The State Department's Owen Lattimore was the man that McCarthy made the most allegations against. McCarthy went so far as to say that he would stake his entire reputation on the question of whether Lattimore was a Communist agent. Now, of course, we have absolute proof that McCarthy was right.
Senator Joe McCarthy, anti-Communist


2. Victims??
From “blacklist survivor” Norma Barzman about her ‘exile’ in Paris: “We had dinner with Picasso every Tuesday night when we were at our country house in Provence. It was hard, but it was the time of my life.” (Dennis Hamilton, “Keeper of the Flame: A Blacklist Survivor,” Los Angeles Times, October 3, 2000) The horror, the horror.


3. Victims???
Proven guilty, jailed for 44 months for perjury (the statute of limitations had run out on espionage), Alger Hiss, traitorous agent of Soviet espionage, the American left views Hiss as a hero. After leaving prison, he spoke at Princeton and was given a standing ovation. Bard College actually has the Alger Hiss Chair of Social Studies (Lawrence Helm's Blog: The Alger Hiss Chair at Bard College)
In 1972, Massachusetts readmitted him to the bar. Liberals would never turn their backs on a man who spied for Stalin against America.



4. Victims??? I got ya' victims right here:

When anti-communism took its toll in Hollywood, the blacklisting took the “deadly” form of not having ones name in the credits, or living in Paris, or not being able to sell a teleplay for as much as three years. This for folks who had no problem with Ukrainian farmers and their children eating their shoes.
Coulter, "Treason."

Ah so by setting up a preposterous definition of what a victim would be, you manufacture an argument that you can't lose.

Why would you bother to do that when by now you must have learned that people like me will see right through in an instant?

"a preposterous definition"

Mine is the real definition....as proven by the fact that you can show no 'suffering' by non-communists.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Wikipedia's list of people harmed by McCarthy's witchhunt:

Nelson Algren, writer[48]
Elmer Bernstein, composer and conductor[49]
David Bohm, physicist and philosopher[50]
Bertolt Brecht, poet, playwright, screenwriter
Charlie Chaplin, actor and director[51]
Aaron Copland, composer[52]
Bartley Crum, attorney[53]
Howard Da Silva, actor[54]
Jules Dassin, director[55]
Dolores del Río, actress[56]
W. E. B. Du Bois, civil rights activist and author[57]
Howard Fast, writer[58]
Carl Foreman, writer of High Noon
John Garfield, actor[52]
Jack Gilford, actor[54]
Ruth Gordon, actress[54]
Lee Grant, actress[59]
Dashiell Hammett, author[52]
Elizabeth Hawes, clothing designer, author, equal rights activist[60]
Lillian Hellman, playwright[52]
Lena Horne, singer [54]
Langston Hughes, writer[52]
Sam Jaffe, actor[52]
Theodore Kaghan, diplomat[61]
Garson Kanin, writer and director[52]
Benjamin Keen, historian[62]
Gypsy Rose Lee, actress and stripper[52]
Cornelius Lanczos, mathematician and physicist[63]
Arthur Laurents, playwright[54]
Philip Loeb, actor[64]
Joseph Losey, director[52]
Burgess Meredith, actor[52]
Arthur Miller, playwright and essayist[52]
Zero Mostel, actor[52]
J. Robert Oppenheimer, physicist, scientific director of the Manhattan Project[65]
Dorothy Parker, writer[52]
Linus Pauling, chemist, winner of two Nobel prizes[66]
Samuel Reber, diplomat[67]
Martin Ritt, actor and director[68]
Paul Robeson, actor, athlete, singer, writer, political activist[69]
Edward G. Robinson, actor[52]
Waldo Salt, screenwriter[70]
Pete Seeger, folk singer[52]
Artie Shaw, jazz musician[52]
Irwin Shaw, writer[54]
William L. Shirer, journalist[71]
Lionel Stander, actor[72]
Paul Sweezy, economist and founder-editor of Monthly Review[73]
Charles W. Thayer, diplomat[74]
Tsien Hsue-shen, physicist[75]

McCarthyism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

We'll leave it to PC to prove that either

a. each of them was in fact a 'Communist', or, b. that the ones she can't prove were Communists were not in fact harmed by the accusation.

They missed a couple: Betty Garrett, who was a popular character actress, and her husband Larry Parks, who played Al Jolson in 'The Jolson Story'.

Garrett finally got work again in the 1970s, playing Archie Bunker's neighbor Irene on 'All In The Family', and the landlady on 'Laverne And Shirley'.

Parks had affiliations with the Communist Party early in his career, but had long ceased by the time of McCarthy's witch hunt.

"...had affiliations with the Communist Party..."

Just as you had a brief affiliation with learning.....

 

[PoliticalChic]

Except that I proved you wrong....

Oh...right, you're a Liberal: wrong doesn't count....you just continue to run with it.

Um, sorry, when you go into crazy Ann Coulter territory and try to rewrite history, I'm not sure there's much to do with you.

Go into any History and PolSci department in accredited universities, see how far your position gets.

You're done.

Universities are bastions of Liberalism, don't you know!

Are you denying that?

 

[JoeB131]

After all the righteous indignation, a person with even marginal intelligence would confront their own beliefs once I prove that there were no non-communists who 'suffered' as a result of the brave work of Senator McCarthy.
You couldn't name even one!!!

Seriously? Brave? Of course, half the time, McCarthy would hold up a list of names and never produce them. Eventually, his own party got sick of his shit.

What made Ike a great President. He slapped down McCarthy. He stood up to the demagogues in his own party.

But not the co-opted Janissaies such as you.
Again: Whittaker Chambers wrote in his book WITNESS that liberals are/were incapable of ever effectively fighting Communism because they did not see anything in Communism that was antithetical to their own beliefs. In short, Liberals are Communists and Communists are Liberals.

'...replace "Communist" with "Republican",...'
That defies imagination....communists wanted a dictatorship with opponents in gulags....
Republicans want no such thing.

NO, republicans want us all living in tenements slaving away for Multi-national corporations, as their 40 year war on the Middle Class has accomplished...

Hardly an improvement.

I'm just wondering why you think a situation where a few rich people get to enjoy the good life and the rest of us are struggling to put food on the table is a good situation, and why you feel the need to call anyone who thinks it isn't a "Communist".

Somehow, I doubt you're rich. I can only assume some kind of Stokholm syndrome.

 

[motownron]

Pacifists? more like violent dangerous scum

 

[PoliticalChic]

After all the righteous indignation, a person with even marginal intelligence would confront their own beliefs once I prove that there were no non-communists who 'suffered' as a result of the brave work of Senator McCarthy.
You couldn't name even one!!!

Seriously? Brave? Of course, half the time, McCarthy would hold up a list of names and never produce them. Eventually, his own party got sick of his shit.

What made Ike a great President. He slapped down McCarthy. He stood up to the demagogues in his own party.

But not the co-opted Janissaies such as you.
Again: Whittaker Chambers wrote in his book WITNESS that liberals are/were incapable of ever effectively fighting Communism because they did not see anything in Communism that was antithetical to their own beliefs. In short, Liberals are Communists and Communists are Liberals.

'...replace "Communist" with "Republican",...'
That defies imagination....communists wanted a dictatorship with opponents in gulags....
Republicans want no such thing.

NO, republicans want us all living in tenements slaving away for Multi-national corporations, as their 40 year war on the Middle Class has accomplished...

Hardly an improvement.

I'm just wondering why you think a situation where a few rich people get to enjoy the good life and the rest of us are struggling to put food on the table is a good situation, and why you feel the need to call anyone who thinks it isn't a "Communist".

Somehow, I doubt you're rich. I can only assume some kind of Stokholm syndrome.

Although his judgeship exempted him from military service, McCarthy enlisted in the Marines and was sworn in as a first lieutenant in August 1942. He served as an intelligence officer for a bomber squadron stationed in the Solomon Islands, and also risked his life by volunteering to fly in the tail-gunner's seat on many combat missions. Those who quibble about the number of combat missions he flew miss the point - he didn't have to fly any.

The enemies of McCarthy have seized on his good-natured remark about shooting down coconut trees from his tail-gunner's spot (an ABC television movie about McCarthy in the late 1970s was entitled Tail Gunner Joe) to belittle his military accomplishments, but the official record gives the true picture. Not only were McCarthy's achievements during 30 months of active duty unanimously praised by his commanding officers, but Admiral Chester Nimitz, commander in chief of the Pacific Fleet, issued the following citation regarding the service of Captain McCarthy: [/B

]For meritorious and efficient performance of duty as an observer and rear gunner of a dive bomber attached to a Marine scout bombing squadron operating in the Solomon Islands area from September 1 to December 31, 1943. He participated in a large number of combat missions, and in addition to his regular duties, acted as aerial photographer. He obtained excellent photographs of enemy gun positions, despite intense anti-aircraft fire, thereby gaining valuable information which contributed materially to the success of subsequent strikes in the area. Although suffering from a severe leg injury, he refused to be hospitalized and continued to carry out his duties as Intelligence Officer in a highly efficient manner. His courageous devotion to duty was in keeping with the highest traditions of the naval service.
Senator Joseph R. McCarthy

 

[JoeB131]

What does that have to do with anything? He served. So did my dad.

Fact is, he was a cheap demagogue who destroyed the lives of innocent people because we got into a panic about what form of government other countries were choosing, like that was any of our fucking business.

 

[Unkotare]

So you are saying that you are in fact a defense expert, right?

I'm saying 11 years of military service gives me more expertise than you have.

And more than everyone in the entire defense dept who recognizes the grave danger inherent in Iran having a nuclear bomb? You have more than all them, right? You're quite a guy.

 

[Unkotare]

So you are saying that you are in fact a defense expert, right?

I'm saying 11 years of military service gives me more expertise than you have.

I suppose you specifically worked at a high level of the defense dept where you were involved in planning and implementing foreign policy and defense planning?