People Who Don't Vote Are The Problem

[Synthaholic]

...because voting Dummycrat has worked wonders for the economy?

It sure has! Any look at the facts clearly demonstrates this.

Not this one:

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/27/business/the-typical-household-now-worth-a-third-less.html

What was the low point due to the Bush Financial Crash of 2008?

Do you want the low point or do you want 2008?

I want the low point DUE to the Bush Financial Crash.

 

[Synthaholic]

Ahahaha FAIL when Dem's won the 2006 mid term elections with about the same voter turnout as the recent 2014 mid term elections the libs claimed it was a huge mandate from the people. lol

the point being that both sides do the same thing, both sides claim this right to rule over the people, and bask in their success, and NOTHING CHANGES, it just goes around in circles, and history repeats itself and everyone's still stuck with the same nonsense like the song (Jokers to the left of me, fools to the right).

Vote properly next time, ie, not the two main parties.

After 6 years of being told to sit in the back and shut up I have a message for Dem's now calling for bi-partisan compromise, (censored) (censored) (rude gesture)

I'm not calling for bi-partisan compromise.

I'm calling for Republicans to put up or shut up. But they won't. They might not even bother trying to govern.

I'm calling for the complete destruction of the corrupt Democratic party AND their cohorts in the corrupt public unions.

Yeah, well you're an imbecile, so...

 

[Synthaholic]

I wish you Libertarians had the $ to go around the world and see how the best countries are doing it. No one is doing it your way.

Important point. No country in the world has adopted a Libertarian government.

That tells you all you need to know.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

I think people who don't vote view issues as "problems". Problems that, to them, are a very complex puzzle that they hope will solve itself. They imagine themselves as nothing but one of tens of millions of tiny pieces to that puzzle. These non-voters will eventually be fitted by someone else into that puzzle that has no possible solution. It's the easiest path to no end in sight.

I also think that people who DO vote view issues as challenges. And challenges are full of opportunity. Opportunity to make change and to make a difference. They become part of a platform and that platform becomes a springboard. It could lead to results, or it could also lead to nowhere.

But at least they stepped up to the challenge.

I think you're painting with too broad a brush.

I think you're huffing paint.

Oh brother. Some of us don't vote because we realize that the political-governmental system is the least effective and least moral means to deal with the issues or problems that you talk about.

Other people simply don't care about those issues in the least.

Thousands died for your right to vote and you throw it away. SHAME ON YOU. Also you have no right to bitch about anything if you choose to not vote.

Yup. My newly adopted response to whiners - and, I have to say - all those who were/are so up in arms (rightfully so) about Ferguson:

"Did you vote in the 2014 midterms? No? Then STFU"

That's my response to those of you who did waste your time voting.

 

[ninja007]

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton said she is not sorry she voted for a resolution authorizing President Bush to take military action in Iraq despite the recent problems there but she does regret "the way the president used the authority."


CNN.com - Hillary Clinton No regret on Iraq vote - Apr 21 2004

 

[BluesLegend]

Ahahaha FAIL when Dem's won the 2006 mid term elections with about the same voter turnout as the recent 2014 mid term elections the libs claimed it was a huge mandate from the people. lol

the point being that both sides do the same thing, both sides claim this right to rule over the people, and bask in their success, and NOTHING CHANGES, it just goes around in circles, and history repeats itself and everyone's still stuck with the same nonsense like the song (Jokers to the left of me, fools to the right).

Vote properly next time, ie, not the two main parties.

After 6 years of being told to sit in the back and shut up I have a message for Dem's now calling for bi-partisan compromise, (censored) (censored) (rude gesture)

I'm not calling for bi-partisan compromise.

I'm calling for Republicans to put up or shut up. But they won't. They might not even bother trying to govern.

I'm calling for the complete destruction of the corrupt Democratic party AND their cohorts in the corrupt public unions.

Yeah, well you're an imbecile, so...

How liberal of you. Its that sort of behavior that got your side kicked out of congress.

 

[dblack]

I think people who don't vote view issues as "problems". Problems that, to them, are a very complex puzzle that they hope will solve itself. They imagine themselves as nothing but one of tens of millions of tiny pieces to that puzzle. These non-voters will eventually be fitted by someone else into that puzzle that has no possible solution. It's the easiest path to no end in sight.

I also think that people who DO vote view issues as challenges. And challenges are full of opportunity. Opportunity to make change and to make a difference. They become part of a platform and that platform becomes a springboard. It could lead to results, or it could also lead to nowhere.

But at least they stepped up to the challenge.

I think you're painting with too broad a brush.

I think you're huffing paint.

Oh brother. Some of us don't vote because we realize that the political-governmental system is the least effective and least moral means to deal with the issues or problems that you talk about.

Other people simply don't care about those issues in the least.

Thousands died for your right to vote and you throw it away. SHAME ON YOU. Also you have no right to bitch about anything if you choose to not vote.

Yup. My newly adopted response to whiners - and, I have to say - all those who were/are so up in arms (rightfully so) about Ferguson:

"Did you vote in the 2014 midterms? No? Then STFU"

And do they?

 

[sealybobo]

Whatever broke ass. House slave.

Kaz is starting to piss me off. Big mistke..

I'm scared. What happens when you get pissed off? Do you suddenly start backing up what you said? I'd be in favor of that.

I hate giving history lessons to people who should already know history. Failing school system that you are a product of.

Why would I vote when I feel none of the candidates represent my interest?

Good question. A better one is would you vote if one cndidate said he was going to pass a program to take away your rights or vote for the other candidate that would stop that from happening and restore your lost taken rights?

They are all liars, so it doesn't matter what any of them say they are going to do. You would be a fool to listen to any of them. A smart person looks at who is funding them, and then can figure out exactly what they are going to do.

Since both political parties are receiving funding from the same sources, and intelligent person can figure out that it doesn't make a dimes worth of difference in the end WHO you vote for.

​

Either you are one of the stupid people who don't vote or you are a republican pushing the idea it doesn't matter.

 

[sealybobo]

Vote for Hillary and Democrats and the Middle Class and Poor get the tax breaks.

Dude, the poor don't pay taxes, how can they get a "tax break?" The middle class barely pay taxes.

Yea, we got it soooo good and the rich got it soooo rough.

Maybe you should work harder. As another tip as an employer, the biggest difference between those I give raises to and those I don't is when people care about their job. I"d start with yourself.

That couldn't be further from the truth. No one has worked harder for my company than me and in the end, the owner doesn't give a shit about what I did in the past. What have I done for him lately is all he cares about. He's a user. In his eyes, he already paid me for that past hard work. Want a raise? Work even harder!

Oh, and it is his fault business is slow not mine. I'm not going to go into it all but he is so far out of the loop on what's going on here and when I tell him he says I'm just making excuses. So fuck him. I'll run his business but I won't go above and beyond anymore and while I do it I'll be looking for another job. Time to move on.

And then he hires a new guy who comes in all gun ho and drinking the coolaid just like I did when I first started. It is so funny to see him doing basically what I was doing when I first started here. The owner had me go to each location and evaluate what everyone was doing wrong. Now the new guy is basically going to go do everything I already did/tried. Am I going to tell him? Fuck no! It's not my business. The owner can pay him and he will find out. I'll just do what is required of me.

See? If he paid a little more I would care and go back to working "harder". And again, everyone says there is no way he's going to find anyone like me. If he does the person is going to ask for a lot more to start and he won't pay it. I took the job with a low starting pay expecting as the business grew so would my pay. That didn't happen. When I got the sales up, he raised the quotas. So I will perpetually never make any more even if I quadruple his business? Not going to happen.

Plus don't forget his business isn't growing anymore because of the high turnover.

I wonder how much the owner makes? I know he pays him and his wife a salary and they don't do anything. At least she doesn't do anything. Oh, and they have a "foundation" charity where we all know they don't do a god damn thing for the needy. The foundation is just a way for them to make more $. They pay themselves out of the foundation and whatever is left over (the scraps) goes to the needy.

No biggy. In 19 years I'll be retired. I'm not going to start my own business. I'll just find another job. Hopefully the next person I work for will be generous like you. LOL

I don't doubt your story one bit. I've seen it plenty. I'm not sure your're schooled on the details of the operation because there are usually LOTS of things going on behind the scenes. The part about the foundation piques my interest because I know it's very hard to get any sort of measurable income out of a foundation for the people that start/control one. Don't believe me? Start one yourself and see what it takes to get certified as a tax-exempt entity and then pay yourself for your time. I'm not saying it can't be done, I'm just saying that it can't be done honestly without some political connections and those connections have to be major (way more than being buddy-buddy with a Congressman).

If you have 19 years left, that's more than enough time for you to start your own business, secure your financial future, build a leadership team, and take your company non-profit (if you choose). If you think you're out of time, you're looking at it wrong or you know that it's something you can't do (like take the risk).

You have brought up some very valid points, and you don't have to start your own business to have credibility. But if you have all the answers for the business you work for and think you can do it better but don't, well then that means you aren't being honest with yourself.

It's okay, not everyone has the stomach to take the risk you don't want to take. But don't diminish the proper role that clueless owners play in doing something you aren't willing to do. The world is better off if they (and you) succeed, but the world is much worse off if nobody tries.

Well I did it. I quit and went into business for myself. Not in the same industry though. My former boss has that industry cornered. And the problem with the one location I was stuck running is that they are more expensive than the competition in the area and the product they produce really isn't as good as it is at the other 2 locations. I can tell you now I ran a music school. Long story short, the owner got me to do outside marketing for all 3 locations for 2 years and then stuck me at one location after he kept going through people because no one wanted to work for him. So all the sales that came in to the other two locations, I wasn't compensated on. Do you understand what bullshit that is? Get me to do work that's going to pay off for years to come at those other 2 locations but then only pay me for sales at the 1 failing location? I established a relationship with almost every music teacher at every school in Metro Detroit. They refer students to this school.

So he sticks me at his smallest/failing location and doesn't listen to me when I tell him it isn't that we aren't getting new students to sign up, the instructors aren't retaining students. Students sign up but then quit before becoming good musicians. These instructors are not producing musicians and they are not inspiring. Does the owner listen to me? Nope. So, as this one location is literally falling apart, I decided to abandon ship. His other two locations are his babies and so he has nothing but the best instructors at those locations. We didn't have a good piano instructor or violin instructor and we didn't have a voice instructor for the longest time. I kept asking them to find me someone and eventually I had to find the instructor(s), who never stuck around because he didn't pay good. I think he would promise them a raise if they were good and then probably didn't give them a good enough raise and the all bailed eventually for better opportunities.

Everyone says, "he's never going to find someone like you who will do everything you did for him.".

But I believe he will. At least he'll try. And if they don't do everything I do, he'll get rid of them and hire another person and they'll come on board drinking the coolaid and bust their ass for him for anywhere from a month to a couple years and then they'll realize this is a go no where job. You think its going to be a fun place to work because its a music school but it's not because the owner is always stressing everyone out.

Does he make a decent living? Sure. Could he make more? I bet he could. Would that require paying his employees more? Maybe. Maybe if I were in his shoes, I'd pay the same amount and maybe I'd make a bunch of promises and break them too. I don't know.

As for his "foundation". He gives very little to charity and he/they put a lot of effort into having that Foundation. I suspect it's a way to get tax write offs and also a way to make $. They paid this girl $10 hr to do "all the work" and they treated her like shit and she quit too. And they also got paychecks. Do they do a lot of work behind the scenes? Sure they do. But I bet just as much as I'm underestimating what they do, you're overestimating. They get people donating all the time and then they charge $20 for their fundraising concerts. 150 people x $20 is $3000 and I very rarely saw any students getting classes free because of this charity.

So anyways, I walking into a great new business. My friends do home remodeling/painting/home improvement and they are always busy but they don't know how to make their business grow. I'm in sales/marketing. I've already found them 4 new jobs and with people who are going to give us referral business. One guy does insurance inspection. One does HVAC. Two guys I talked to own properties and said they got burned by contractors who got paid and never finished the job. There is TONS of business out there to be had and very little investment needed. When we get busier we're going to hire younger guys to do the heavy lifting for us. Maybe we'll hire illegals just like all the other corporations do so they can avoid paying a fair wage or taxes.

 

[asterism]

Dude, the poor don't pay taxes, how can they get a "tax break?" The middle class barely pay taxes.

Yea, we got it soooo good and the rich got it soooo rough.

Maybe you should work harder. As another tip as an employer, the biggest difference between those I give raises to and those I don't is when people care about their job. I"d start with yourself.

That couldn't be further from the truth. No one has worked harder for my company than me and in the end, the owner doesn't give a shit about what I did in the past. What have I done for him lately is all he cares about. He's a user. In his eyes, he already paid me for that past hard work. Want a raise? Work even harder!

Oh, and it is his fault business is slow not mine. I'm not going to go into it all but he is so far out of the loop on what's going on here and when I tell him he says I'm just making excuses. So fuck him. I'll run his business but I won't go above and beyond anymore and while I do it I'll be looking for another job. Time to move on.

And then he hires a new guy who comes in all gun ho and drinking the coolaid just like I did when I first started. It is so funny to see him doing basically what I was doing when I first started here. The owner had me go to each location and evaluate what everyone was doing wrong. Now the new guy is basically going to go do everything I already did/tried. Am I going to tell him? Fuck no! It's not my business. The owner can pay him and he will find out. I'll just do what is required of me.

See? If he paid a little more I would care and go back to working "harder". And again, everyone says there is no way he's going to find anyone like me. If he does the person is going to ask for a lot more to start and he won't pay it. I took the job with a low starting pay expecting as the business grew so would my pay. That didn't happen. When I got the sales up, he raised the quotas. So I will perpetually never make any more even if I quadruple his business? Not going to happen.

Plus don't forget his business isn't growing anymore because of the high turnover.

I wonder how much the owner makes? I know he pays him and his wife a salary and they don't do anything. At least she doesn't do anything. Oh, and they have a "foundation" charity where we all know they don't do a god damn thing for the needy. The foundation is just a way for them to make more $. They pay themselves out of the foundation and whatever is left over (the scraps) goes to the needy.

No biggy. In 19 years I'll be retired. I'm not going to start my own business. I'll just find another job. Hopefully the next person I work for will be generous like you. LOL

I don't doubt your story one bit. I've seen it plenty. I'm not sure your're schooled on the details of the operation because there are usually LOTS of things going on behind the scenes. The part about the foundation piques my interest because I know it's very hard to get any sort of measurable income out of a foundation for the people that start/control one. Don't believe me? Start one yourself and see what it takes to get certified as a tax-exempt entity and then pay yourself for your time. I'm not saying it can't be done, I'm just saying that it can't be done honestly without some political connections and those connections have to be major (way more than being buddy-buddy with a Congressman).

If you have 19 years left, that's more than enough time for you to start your own business, secure your financial future, build a leadership team, and take your company non-profit (if you choose). If you think you're out of time, you're looking at it wrong or you know that it's something you can't do (like take the risk).

You have brought up some very valid points, and you don't have to start your own business to have credibility. But if you have all the answers for the business you work for and think you can do it better but don't, well then that means you aren't being honest with yourself.

It's okay, not everyone has the stomach to take the risk you don't want to take. But don't diminish the proper role that clueless owners play in doing something you aren't willing to do. The world is better off if they (and you) succeed, but the world is much worse off if nobody tries.

Well I did it. I quit and went into business for myself. Not in the same industry though. My former boss has that industry cornered. And the problem with the one location I was stuck running is that they are more expensive than the competition in the area and the product they produce really isn't as good as it is at the other 2 locations. I can tell you now I ran a music school. Long story short, the owner got me to do outside marketing for all 3 locations for 2 years and then stuck me at one location after he kept going through people because no one wanted to work for him. So all the sales that came in to the other two locations, I wasn't compensated on. Do you understand what bullshit that is? Get me to do work that's going to pay off for years to come at those other 2 locations but then only pay me for sales at the 1 failing location? I established a relationship with almost every music teacher at every school in Metro Detroit. They refer students to this school.

So he sticks me at his smallest/failing location and doesn't listen to me when I tell him it isn't that we aren't getting new students to sign up, the instructors aren't retaining students. Students sign up but then quit before becoming good musicians. These instructors are not producing musicians and they are not inspiring. Does the owner listen to me? Nope. So, as this one location is literally falling apart, I decided to abandon ship. His other two locations are his babies and so he has nothing but the best instructors at those locations. We didn't have a good piano instructor or violin instructor and we didn't have a voice instructor for the longest time. I kept asking them to find me someone and eventually I had to find the instructor(s), who never stuck around because he didn't pay good. I think he would promise them a raise if they were good and then probably didn't give them a good enough raise and the all bailed eventually for better opportunities.

Everyone says, "he's never going to find someone like you who will do everything you did for him.".

But I believe he will. At least he'll try. And if they don't do everything I do, he'll get rid of them and hire another person and they'll come on board drinking the coolaid and bust their ass for him for anywhere from a month to a couple years and then they'll realize this is a go no where job. You think its going to be a fun place to work because its a music school but it's not because the owner is always stressing everyone out.

Does he make a decent living? Sure. Could he make more? I bet he could. Would that require paying his employees more? Maybe. Maybe if I were in his shoes, I'd pay the same amount and maybe I'd make a bunch of promises and break them too. I don't know.

As for his "foundation". He gives very little to charity and he/they put a lot of effort into having that Foundation. I suspect it's a way to get tax write offs and also a way to make $. They paid this girl $10 hr to do "all the work" and they treated her like shit and she quit too. And they also got paychecks. Do they do a lot of work behind the scenes? Sure they do. But I bet just as much as I'm underestimating what they do, you're overestimating. They get people donating all the time and then they charge $20 for their fundraising concerts. 150 people x $20 is $3000 and I very rarely saw any students getting classes free because of this charity.

So anyways, I walking into a great new business. My friends do home remodeling/painting/home improvement and they are always busy but they don't know how to make their business grow. I'm in sales/marketing. I've already found them 4 new jobs and with people who are going to give us referral business. One guy does insurance inspection. One does HVAC. Two guys I talked to own properties and said they got burned by contractors who got paid and never finished the job. There is TONS of business out there to be had and very little investment needed. When we get busier we're going to hire younger guys to do the heavy lifting for us. Maybe we'll hire illegals just like all the other corporations do so they can avoid paying a fair wage or taxes.

Good for you! I admire someone who can take skills from one industry and use them in another. It's difficult, but it'll pay off.

 

[Judicial review]

Kaz is starting to piss me off. Big mistke..

I'm scared. What happens when you get pissed off? Do you suddenly start backing up what you said? I'd be in favor of that.

I hate giving history lessons to people who should already know history. Failing school system that you are a product of.

Why would I vote when I feel none of the candidates represent my interest?

Good question. A better one is would you vote if one cndidate said he was going to pass a program to take away your rights or vote for the other candidate that would stop that from happening and restore your lost taken rights?

They are all liars, so it doesn't matter what any of them say they are going to do. You would be a fool to listen to any of them. A smart person looks at who is funding them, and then can figure out exactly what they are going to do.

Since both political parties are receiving funding from the same sources, and intelligent person can figure out that it doesn't make a dimes worth of difference in the end WHO you vote for.

​

Either you are one of the stupid people who don't vote or you are a republican pushing the idea it doesn't matter.

Which both make him stupid.

 

[Judicial review]

Dude, the poor don't pay taxes, how can they get a "tax break?" The middle class barely pay taxes.

Yea, we got it soooo good and the rich got it soooo rough.

Maybe you should work harder. As another tip as an employer, the biggest difference between those I give raises to and those I don't is when people care about their job. I"d start with yourself.

That couldn't be further from the truth. No one has worked harder for my company than me and in the end, the owner doesn't give a shit about what I did in the past. What have I done for him lately is all he cares about. He's a user. In his eyes, he already paid me for that past hard work. Want a raise? Work even harder!

Oh, and it is his fault business is slow not mine. I'm not going to go into it all but he is so far out of the loop on what's going on here and when I tell him he says I'm just making excuses. So fuck him. I'll run his business but I won't go above and beyond anymore and while I do it I'll be looking for another job. Time to move on.

And then he hires a new guy who comes in all gun ho and drinking the coolaid just like I did when I first started. It is so funny to see him doing basically what I was doing when I first started here. The owner had me go to each location and evaluate what everyone was doing wrong. Now the new guy is basically going to go do everything I already did/tried. Am I going to tell him? Fuck no! It's not my business. The owner can pay him and he will find out. I'll just do what is required of me.

See? If he paid a little more I would care and go back to working "harder". And again, everyone says there is no way he's going to find anyone like me. If he does the person is going to ask for a lot more to start and he won't pay it. I took the job with a low starting pay expecting as the business grew so would my pay. That didn't happen. When I got the sales up, he raised the quotas. So I will perpetually never make any more even if I quadruple his business? Not going to happen.

Plus don't forget his business isn't growing anymore because of the high turnover.

I wonder how much the owner makes? I know he pays him and his wife a salary and they don't do anything. At least she doesn't do anything. Oh, and they have a "foundation" charity where we all know they don't do a god damn thing for the needy. The foundation is just a way for them to make more $. They pay themselves out of the foundation and whatever is left over (the scraps) goes to the needy.

No biggy. In 19 years I'll be retired. I'm not going to start my own business. I'll just find another job. Hopefully the next person I work for will be generous like you. LOL

I don't doubt your story one bit. I've seen it plenty. I'm not sure your're schooled on the details of the operation because there are usually LOTS of things going on behind the scenes. The part about the foundation piques my interest because I know it's very hard to get any sort of measurable income out of a foundation for the people that start/control one. Don't believe me? Start one yourself and see what it takes to get certified as a tax-exempt entity and then pay yourself for your time. I'm not saying it can't be done, I'm just saying that it can't be done honestly without some political connections and those connections have to be major (way more than being buddy-buddy with a Congressman).

If you have 19 years left, that's more than enough time for you to start your own business, secure your financial future, build a leadership team, and take your company non-profit (if you choose). If you think you're out of time, you're looking at it wrong or you know that it's something you can't do (like take the risk).

You have brought up some very valid points, and you don't have to start your own business to have credibility. But if you have all the answers for the business you work for and think you can do it better but don't, well then that means you aren't being honest with yourself.

It's okay, not everyone has the stomach to take the risk you don't want to take. But don't diminish the proper role that clueless owners play in doing something you aren't willing to do. The world is better off if they (and you) succeed, but the world is much worse off if nobody tries.

Well I did it. I quit and went into business for myself. Not in the same industry though. My former boss has that industry cornered. And the problem with the one location I was stuck running is that they are more expensive than the competition in the area and the product they produce really isn't as good as it is at the other 2 locations. I can tell you now I ran a music school. Long story short, the owner got me to do outside marketing for all 3 locations for 2 years and then stuck me at one location after he kept going through people because no one wanted to work for him. So all the sales that came in to the other two locations, I wasn't compensated on. Do you understand what bullshit that is? Get me to do work that's going to pay off for years to come at those other 2 locations but then only pay me for sales at the 1 failing location? I established a relationship with almost every music teacher at every school in Metro Detroit. They refer students to this school.

So he sticks me at his smallest/failing location and doesn't listen to me when I tell him it isn't that we aren't getting new students to sign up, the instructors aren't retaining students. Students sign up but then quit before becoming good musicians. These instructors are not producing musicians and they are not inspiring. Does the owner listen to me? Nope. So, as this one location is literally falling apart, I decided to abandon ship. His other two locations are his babies and so he has nothing but the best instructors at those locations. We didn't have a good piano instructor or violin instructor and we didn't have a voice instructor for the longest time. I kept asking them to find me someone and eventually I had to find the instructor(s), who never stuck around because he didn't pay good. I think he would promise them a raise if they were good and then probably didn't give them a good enough raise and the all bailed eventually for better opportunities.

Everyone says, "he's never going to find someone like you who will do everything you did for him.".

But I believe he will. At least he'll try. And if they don't do everything I do, he'll get rid of them and hire another person and they'll come on board drinking the coolaid and bust their ass for him for anywhere from a month to a couple years and then they'll realize this is a go no where job. You think its going to be a fun place to work because its a music school but it's not because the owner is always stressing everyone out.

Does he make a decent living? Sure. Could he make more? I bet he could. Would that require paying his employees more? Maybe. Maybe if I were in his shoes, I'd pay the same amount and maybe I'd make a bunch of promises and break them too. I don't know.

As for his "foundation". He gives very little to charity and he/they put a lot of effort into having that Foundation. I suspect it's a way to get tax write offs and also a way to make $. They paid this girl $10 hr to do "all the work" and they treated her like shit and she quit too. And they also got paychecks. Do they do a lot of work behind the scenes? Sure they do. But I bet just as much as I'm underestimating what they do, you're overestimating. They get people donating all the time and then they charge $20 for their fundraising concerts. 150 people x $20 is $3000 and I very rarely saw any students getting classes free because of this charity.

So anyways, I walking into a great new business. My friends do home remodeling/painting/home improvement and they are always busy but they don't know how to make their business grow. I'm in sales/marketing. I've already found them 4 new jobs and with people who are going to give us referral business. One guy does insurance inspection. One does HVAC. Two guys I talked to own properties and said they got burned by contractors who got paid and never finished the job. There is TONS of business out there to be had and very little investment needed. When we get busier we're going to hire younger guys to do the heavy lifting for us. Maybe we'll hire illegals just like all the other corporations do so they can avoid paying a fair wage or taxes.

All you have to do is go to one of those meetings where those guys with cash buy homes cheap and remodel then sell for a profit. It's an organization there's an abbreviation for it. You'd find tons of work and your jobs would quadrupal. Make sure you go below market rate to grab their attention. You can do that when you get that much more business. Usually 30-50 people at these meetings. Every major city has one.

 

[oreo]

I've always said that other than the vote, the rich completely own our country and government. The only thing we have is our vote. But only 40% of the voting population voted on Tuesday. You can bet that every rich person in America voted on Tuesday. You can bet that all the Republicans that voted in 2012 and 2008 showed up to vote in the 2010 and 2014 midterms. Clearly. Look at how Republicans win every midterm with low turnout but lose the general elections. You can even count 2000 and 2004 because those years were close enough for Bush to steal. But that's another conversation. Point is, basically the richest Americans are all voting every 2 years and the masses only vote every 4 years in the general elections. The blacks. The under 30's. You only have yourselves to blame. I'm done caring about you if you don't even care enough to show up and vote every 2 years. You don't think it makes a difference? It makes all the difference in the world. Stupid fucking Americans.

Obama was out telling his constituents to vote. The DNC spent 16 million dollars on their get out to vote drive this midterm. Historic levels of campaign adds non stop came across our T.V sets for months, and you're blaming rich people for those that didn't vote?--LOL

Since Obamacare was shoved down everyone's throat 29 Senate democrat seats have been lost, approximately 150 Democrat house seats have been lost, along with many state legislatures and governors going from blue to red. These huge losses for Democrats are actually history making. Never before has this nation seen such dramatic losses from either party.

Virginia a very blue state, and unfunded by the GOP, a Republican candidate came within 1 % of winning the senate seat there.

It should be more than clear to you by now, that those that decided to NOT vote, are very unhappy with the way things are going in this country, and certainly do not support Barack Obama and his agenda any longer. And that's what this election was about.

This is a center country that tends to lean to the right. It's clear that Obama, Pelosi and Reid took it too far to the left and the blowback is real. What did Democrats do after these losses. They elected Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid for minority leaders. The same architects that are responsible for putting Democrats on the endangered species list in both houses, thereby giving us a preview of what 2016 is going to look like.

 

[MisterBeale]

Kaz is starting to piss me off. Big mistke..

I'm scared. What happens when you get pissed off? Do you suddenly start backing up what you said? I'd be in favor of that.

I hate giving history lessons to people who should already know history. Failing school system that you are a product of.

Why would I vote when I feel none of the candidates represent my interest?

Good question. A better one is would you vote if one cndidate said he was going to pass a program to take away your rights or vote for the other candidate that would stop that from happening and restore your lost taken rights?

They are all liars, so it doesn't matter what any of them say they are going to do. You would be a fool to listen to any of them. A smart person looks at who is funding them, and then can figure out exactly what they are going to do.

Since both political parties are receiving funding from the same sources, and intelligent person can figure out that it doesn't make a dimes worth of difference in the end WHO you vote for.

​

Either you are one of the stupid people who don't vote or you are a republican pushing the idea it doesn't matter.

OR, alternatively, you are so ignorant, you have never met a political scientist, or taken an entry level political science course on interest group politics?

Tell me, what is an Iron Triangle?

 

[sealybobo]

Yea, we got it soooo good and the rich got it soooo rough.

Maybe you should work harder. As another tip as an employer, the biggest difference between those I give raises to and those I don't is when people care about their job. I"d start with yourself.

That couldn't be further from the truth. No one has worked harder for my company than me and in the end, the owner doesn't give a shit about what I did in the past. What have I done for him lately is all he cares about. He's a user. In his eyes, he already paid me for that past hard work. Want a raise? Work even harder!

Oh, and it is his fault business is slow not mine. I'm not going to go into it all but he is so far out of the loop on what's going on here and when I tell him he says I'm just making excuses. So fuck him. I'll run his business but I won't go above and beyond anymore and while I do it I'll be looking for another job. Time to move on.

And then he hires a new guy who comes in all gun ho and drinking the coolaid just like I did when I first started. It is so funny to see him doing basically what I was doing when I first started here. The owner had me go to each location and evaluate what everyone was doing wrong. Now the new guy is basically going to go do everything I already did/tried. Am I going to tell him? Fuck no! It's not my business. The owner can pay him and he will find out. I'll just do what is required of me.

See? If he paid a little more I would care and go back to working "harder". And again, everyone says there is no way he's going to find anyone like me. If he does the person is going to ask for a lot more to start and he won't pay it. I took the job with a low starting pay expecting as the business grew so would my pay. That didn't happen. When I got the sales up, he raised the quotas. So I will perpetually never make any more even if I quadruple his business? Not going to happen.

Plus don't forget his business isn't growing anymore because of the high turnover.

I wonder how much the owner makes? I know he pays him and his wife a salary and they don't do anything. At least she doesn't do anything. Oh, and they have a "foundation" charity where we all know they don't do a god damn thing for the needy. The foundation is just a way for them to make more $. They pay themselves out of the foundation and whatever is left over (the scraps) goes to the needy.

No biggy. In 19 years I'll be retired. I'm not going to start my own business. I'll just find another job. Hopefully the next person I work for will be generous like you. LOL

I don't doubt your story one bit. I've seen it plenty. I'm not sure your're schooled on the details of the operation because there are usually LOTS of things going on behind the scenes. The part about the foundation piques my interest because I know it's very hard to get any sort of measurable income out of a foundation for the people that start/control one. Don't believe me? Start one yourself and see what it takes to get certified as a tax-exempt entity and then pay yourself for your time. I'm not saying it can't be done, I'm just saying that it can't be done honestly without some political connections and those connections have to be major (way more than being buddy-buddy with a Congressman).

If you have 19 years left, that's more than enough time for you to start your own business, secure your financial future, build a leadership team, and take your company non-profit (if you choose). If you think you're out of time, you're looking at it wrong or you know that it's something you can't do (like take the risk).

You have brought up some very valid points, and you don't have to start your own business to have credibility. But if you have all the answers for the business you work for and think you can do it better but don't, well then that means you aren't being honest with yourself.

It's okay, not everyone has the stomach to take the risk you don't want to take. But don't diminish the proper role that clueless owners play in doing something you aren't willing to do. The world is better off if they (and you) succeed, but the world is much worse off if nobody tries.

Well I did it. I quit and went into business for myself. Not in the same industry though. My former boss has that industry cornered. And the problem with the one location I was stuck running is that they are more expensive than the competition in the area and the product they produce really isn't as good as it is at the other 2 locations. I can tell you now I ran a music school. Long story short, the owner got me to do outside marketing for all 3 locations for 2 years and then stuck me at one location after he kept going through people because no one wanted to work for him. So all the sales that came in to the other two locations, I wasn't compensated on. Do you understand what bullshit that is? Get me to do work that's going to pay off for years to come at those other 2 locations but then only pay me for sales at the 1 failing location? I established a relationship with almost every music teacher at every school in Metro Detroit. They refer students to this school.

So he sticks me at his smallest/failing location and doesn't listen to me when I tell him it isn't that we aren't getting new students to sign up, the instructors aren't retaining students. Students sign up but then quit before becoming good musicians. These instructors are not producing musicians and they are not inspiring. Does the owner listen to me? Nope. So, as this one location is literally falling apart, I decided to abandon ship. His other two locations are his babies and so he has nothing but the best instructors at those locations. We didn't have a good piano instructor or violin instructor and we didn't have a voice instructor for the longest time. I kept asking them to find me someone and eventually I had to find the instructor(s), who never stuck around because he didn't pay good. I think he would promise them a raise if they were good and then probably didn't give them a good enough raise and the all bailed eventually for better opportunities.

Everyone says, "he's never going to find someone like you who will do everything you did for him.".

But I believe he will. At least he'll try. And if they don't do everything I do, he'll get rid of them and hire another person and they'll come on board drinking the coolaid and bust their ass for him for anywhere from a month to a couple years and then they'll realize this is a go no where job. You think its going to be a fun place to work because its a music school but it's not because the owner is always stressing everyone out.

Does he make a decent living? Sure. Could he make more? I bet he could. Would that require paying his employees more? Maybe. Maybe if I were in his shoes, I'd pay the same amount and maybe I'd make a bunch of promises and break them too. I don't know.

As for his "foundation". He gives very little to charity and he/they put a lot of effort into having that Foundation. I suspect it's a way to get tax write offs and also a way to make $. They paid this girl $10 hr to do "all the work" and they treated her like shit and she quit too. And they also got paychecks. Do they do a lot of work behind the scenes? Sure they do. But I bet just as much as I'm underestimating what they do, you're overestimating. They get people donating all the time and then they charge $20 for their fundraising concerts. 150 people x $20 is $3000 and I very rarely saw any students getting classes free because of this charity.

So anyways, I walking into a great new business. My friends do home remodeling/painting/home improvement and they are always busy but they don't know how to make their business grow. I'm in sales/marketing. I've already found them 4 new jobs and with people who are going to give us referral business. One guy does insurance inspection. One does HVAC. Two guys I talked to own properties and said they got burned by contractors who got paid and never finished the job. There is TONS of business out there to be had and very little investment needed. When we get busier we're going to hire younger guys to do the heavy lifting for us. Maybe we'll hire illegals just like all the other corporations do so they can avoid paying a fair wage or taxes.

All you have to do is go to one of those meetings where those guys with cash buy homes cheap and remodel then sell for a profit. It's an organization there's an abbreviation for it. You'd find tons of work and your jobs would quadrupal. Make sure you go below market rate to grab their attention. You can do that when you get that much more business. Usually 30-50 people at these meetings. Every major city has one.

That is a great idea!!!

And I'm finding if you meet someone and tell them what you do, if they know/trust you, you don't have to be the cheapest. In fact you should worry about the cheapest bid. Rumor on them is they get the job, get your money and either never show up, never finish or do a shitty job. We don't charge a dime until the job is done. Not only am I finding jobs, I'm finding young guys who will work for $10 hr. to do all the heavy lifting. I'm too old to be hauling dry wall. I have a friend he specializes in decks. He rips people off! They could get it done for thousands less. But they like him, know him, like the work he does and they don't want to take a chance going with someone they don't know. At least with him you know the job will get done and done right. But damn he charges a lot. He even ripped me off years ago. He pergo'ed half my place and when I got another bid years later to do the other half I realized he charged me maybe $3K more than he could have.

Notice I didn't say should have? I don't blame him. He should charge whatever he thinks he can get. Its my fault for paying it. LOL

 

[sealybobo]

I've always said that other than the vote, the rich completely own our country and government. The only thing we have is our vote. But only 40% of the voting population voted on Tuesday. You can bet that every rich person in America voted on Tuesday. You can bet that all the Republicans that voted in 2012 and 2008 showed up to vote in the 2010 and 2014 midterms. Clearly. Look at how Republicans win every midterm with low turnout but lose the general elections. You can even count 2000 and 2004 because those years were close enough for Bush to steal. But that's another conversation. Point is, basically the richest Americans are all voting every 2 years and the masses only vote every 4 years in the general elections. The blacks. The under 30's. You only have yourselves to blame. I'm done caring about you if you don't even care enough to show up and vote every 2 years. You don't think it makes a difference? It makes all the difference in the world. Stupid fucking Americans.

Obama was out telling his constituents to vote. The DNC spent 16 million dollars on their get out to vote drive this midterm. Historic levels of campaign adds non stop came across our T.V sets for months, and you're blaming rich people for those that didn't vote?--LOL

Since Obamacare was shoved down everyone's throat 29 Senate democrat seats have been lost, approximately 150 Democrat house seats have been lost, along with many state legislatures and governors going from blue to red. These huge losses for Democrats are actually history making. Never before has this nation seen such dramatic losses from either party.

Virginia a very blue state, and unfunded by the GOP, a Republican candidate came within 1 % of winning the senate seat there.

It should be more than clear to you by now, that those that decided to NOT vote, are very unhappy with the way things are going in this country, and certainly do not support Barack Obama and his agenda any longer. And that's what this election was about.

This is a center country that tends to lean to the right. It's clear that Obama, Pelosi and Reid took it too far to the left and the blowback is real. What did Democrats do after these losses. They elected Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid for minority leaders. The same architects that are responsible for putting Democrats on the endangered species list in both houses, thereby giving us a preview of what 2016 is going to look like.

OMG you just brought up a great point. All those fucking kids who got free Obamacare are the ones who didn't vote! I know so many 20 somethings who brag that they're still on their parents healthcare because of Obamacare and it's those idiots who didn't vote.

They get what is coming. The American people get what they deserve for voting GOP AND for not voting at all. I have talked to soooooooo many people in the last few weeks who say/think voting doesn't matter. They are god damn fools. You all are.

If you are not rich and vote GOP, you are a fool. If you don't vote at all you are a god damn fool. The only people who get it are middle class people and poor people who vote Democratic and rich people that vote GOP. Everyone else is dumb.

 

[sealybobo]

I'm scared. What happens when you get pissed off? Do you suddenly start backing up what you said? I'd be in favor of that.

I hate giving history lessons to people who should already know history. Failing school system that you are a product of.

Why would I vote when I feel none of the candidates represent my interest?

Good question. A better one is would you vote if one cndidate said he was going to pass a program to take away your rights or vote for the other candidate that would stop that from happening and restore your lost taken rights?

They are all liars, so it doesn't matter what any of them say they are going to do. You would be a fool to listen to any of them. A smart person looks at who is funding them, and then can figure out exactly what they are going to do.

Since both political parties are receiving funding from the same sources, and intelligent person can figure out that it doesn't make a dimes worth of difference in the end WHO you vote for.

​

Either you are one of the stupid people who don't vote or you are a republican pushing the idea it doesn't matter.

OR, alternatively, you are so ignorant, you have never met a political scientist, or taken an entry level political science course on interest group politics?

Tell me, what is an Iron Triangle?

Listen you stupid little prick. Ever since the Democrats took office the GOP has said repeatedly no new taxes. No new taxes. No new taxes.

They didn't mean for you dummy They meant for the rich. Because here in Michigan, GOP Governor Rick Snyder has no problem raising our taxes. He says we are broke and need the money.

Of course we are Rick Snyder. You and your GOP buddies haven't been taxing the rich enough for over 20 years now. No shit we are broke. So raise their taxes back to what they should be?

But they won't do that. They'll raise your taxes. Essentially shifting the tax burden onto you. Can you afford the tax increase more than the rich can? Stupid fuck!

 

[kaz]

OR, alternatively, you are so ignorant, you have never met a political scientist, or taken an entry level political science course on interest group politics?

Tell me, what is an Iron Triangle?

Of course we are Rick Snyder. You and your GOP buddies haven't been taxing the rich enough for over 20 years now. No shit we are broke. So raise their taxes back to what they should be?

So comrade, since 1% of taxpayers paying 40% of all taxes and 5% of taxpayers paying 60% of taxes isn't "enough," what is enough? Should 5%, one in twenty taxpayers pay all taxes? What would be "enough?"

 

[asterism]

Maybe you should work harder. As another tip as an employer, the biggest difference between those I give raises to and those I don't is when people care about their job. I"d start with yourself.

That couldn't be further from the truth. No one has worked harder for my company than me and in the end, the owner doesn't give a shit about what I did in the past. What have I done for him lately is all he cares about. He's a user. In his eyes, he already paid me for that past hard work. Want a raise? Work even harder!

Oh, and it is his fault business is slow not mine. I'm not going to go into it all but he is so far out of the loop on what's going on here and when I tell him he says I'm just making excuses. So fuck him. I'll run his business but I won't go above and beyond anymore and while I do it I'll be looking for another job. Time to move on.

And then he hires a new guy who comes in all gun ho and drinking the coolaid just like I did when I first started. It is so funny to see him doing basically what I was doing when I first started here. The owner had me go to each location and evaluate what everyone was doing wrong. Now the new guy is basically going to go do everything I already did/tried. Am I going to tell him? Fuck no! It's not my business. The owner can pay him and he will find out. I'll just do what is required of me.

See? If he paid a little more I would care and go back to working "harder". And again, everyone says there is no way he's going to find anyone like me. If he does the person is going to ask for a lot more to start and he won't pay it. I took the job with a low starting pay expecting as the business grew so would my pay. That didn't happen. When I got the sales up, he raised the quotas. So I will perpetually never make any more even if I quadruple his business? Not going to happen.

Plus don't forget his business isn't growing anymore because of the high turnover.

I wonder how much the owner makes? I know he pays him and his wife a salary and they don't do anything. At least she doesn't do anything. Oh, and they have a "foundation" charity where we all know they don't do a god damn thing for the needy. The foundation is just a way for them to make more $. They pay themselves out of the foundation and whatever is left over (the scraps) goes to the needy.

No biggy. In 19 years I'll be retired. I'm not going to start my own business. I'll just find another job. Hopefully the next person I work for will be generous like you. LOL

I don't doubt your story one bit. I've seen it plenty. I'm not sure your're schooled on the details of the operation because there are usually LOTS of things going on behind the scenes. The part about the foundation piques my interest because I know it's very hard to get any sort of measurable income out of a foundation for the people that start/control one. Don't believe me? Start one yourself and see what it takes to get certified as a tax-exempt entity and then pay yourself for your time. I'm not saying it can't be done, I'm just saying that it can't be done honestly without some political connections and those connections have to be major (way more than being buddy-buddy with a Congressman).

If you have 19 years left, that's more than enough time for you to start your own business, secure your financial future, build a leadership team, and take your company non-profit (if you choose). If you think you're out of time, you're looking at it wrong or you know that it's something you can't do (like take the risk).

You have brought up some very valid points, and you don't have to start your own business to have credibility. But if you have all the answers for the business you work for and think you can do it better but don't, well then that means you aren't being honest with yourself.

It's okay, not everyone has the stomach to take the risk you don't want to take. But don't diminish the proper role that clueless owners play in doing something you aren't willing to do. The world is better off if they (and you) succeed, but the world is much worse off if nobody tries.

Well I did it. I quit and went into business for myself. Not in the same industry though. My former boss has that industry cornered. And the problem with the one location I was stuck running is that they are more expensive than the competition in the area and the product they produce really isn't as good as it is at the other 2 locations. I can tell you now I ran a music school. Long story short, the owner got me to do outside marketing for all 3 locations for 2 years and then stuck me at one location after he kept going through people because no one wanted to work for him. So all the sales that came in to the other two locations, I wasn't compensated on. Do you understand what bullshit that is? Get me to do work that's going to pay off for years to come at those other 2 locations but then only pay me for sales at the 1 failing location? I established a relationship with almost every music teacher at every school in Metro Detroit. They refer students to this school.

So he sticks me at his smallest/failing location and doesn't listen to me when I tell him it isn't that we aren't getting new students to sign up, the instructors aren't retaining students. Students sign up but then quit before becoming good musicians. These instructors are not producing musicians and they are not inspiring. Does the owner listen to me? Nope. So, as this one location is literally falling apart, I decided to abandon ship. His other two locations are his babies and so he has nothing but the best instructors at those locations. We didn't have a good piano instructor or violin instructor and we didn't have a voice instructor for the longest time. I kept asking them to find me someone and eventually I had to find the instructor(s), who never stuck around because he didn't pay good. I think he would promise them a raise if they were good and then probably didn't give them a good enough raise and the all bailed eventually for better opportunities.

Everyone says, "he's never going to find someone like you who will do everything you did for him.".

But I believe he will. At least he'll try. And if they don't do everything I do, he'll get rid of them and hire another person and they'll come on board drinking the coolaid and bust their ass for him for anywhere from a month to a couple years and then they'll realize this is a go no where job. You think its going to be a fun place to work because its a music school but it's not because the owner is always stressing everyone out.

Does he make a decent living? Sure. Could he make more? I bet he could. Would that require paying his employees more? Maybe. Maybe if I were in his shoes, I'd pay the same amount and maybe I'd make a bunch of promises and break them too. I don't know.

As for his "foundation". He gives very little to charity and he/they put a lot of effort into having that Foundation. I suspect it's a way to get tax write offs and also a way to make $. They paid this girl $10 hr to do "all the work" and they treated her like shit and she quit too. And they also got paychecks. Do they do a lot of work behind the scenes? Sure they do. But I bet just as much as I'm underestimating what they do, you're overestimating. They get people donating all the time and then they charge $20 for their fundraising concerts. 150 people x $20 is $3000 and I very rarely saw any students getting classes free because of this charity.

So anyways, I walking into a great new business. My friends do home remodeling/painting/home improvement and they are always busy but they don't know how to make their business grow. I'm in sales/marketing. I've already found them 4 new jobs and with people who are going to give us referral business. One guy does insurance inspection. One does HVAC. Two guys I talked to own properties and said they got burned by contractors who got paid and never finished the job. There is TONS of business out there to be had and very little investment needed. When we get busier we're going to hire younger guys to do the heavy lifting for us. Maybe we'll hire illegals just like all the other corporations do so they can avoid paying a fair wage or taxes.

All you have to do is go to one of those meetings where those guys with cash buy homes cheap and remodel then sell for a profit. It's an organization there's an abbreviation for it. You'd find tons of work and your jobs would quadrupal. Make sure you go below market rate to grab their attention. You can do that when you get that much more business. Usually 30-50 people at these meetings. Every major city has one.

That is a great idea!!!

And I'm finding if you meet someone and tell them what you do, if they know/trust you, you don't have to be the cheapest. In fact you should worry about the cheapest bid. Rumor on them is they get the job, get your money and either never show up, never finish or do a shitty job. We don't charge a dime until the job is done. Not only am I finding jobs, I'm finding young guys who will work for $10 hr. to do all the heavy lifting. I'm too old to be hauling dry wall. I have a friend he specializes in decks. He rips people off! They could get it done for thousands less. But they like him, know him, like the work he does and they don't want to take a chance going with someone they don't know. At least with him you know the job will get done and done right. But damn he charges a lot. He even ripped me off years ago. He pergo'ed half my place and when I got another bid years later to do the other half I realized he charged me maybe $3K more than he could have.

Notice I didn't say should have? I don't blame him. He should charge whatever he thinks he can get. Its my fault for paying it. LOL

I applaud you for going in a new direction and I applaud you for using the law of supply and demand instead of "living wage" constraints.

 

[sealybobo]

OR, alternatively, you are so ignorant, you have never met a political scientist, or taken an entry level political science course on interest group politics?

Tell me, what is an Iron Triangle?

Of course we are Rick Snyder. You and your GOP buddies haven't been taxing the rich enough for over 20 years now. No shit we are broke. So raise their taxes back to what they should be?

So comrade, since 1% of taxpayers paying 40% of all taxes and 5% of taxpayers paying 60% of taxes isn't "enough," what is enough? Should 5%, one in twenty taxpayers pay all taxes? What would be "enough?"

What works? Or, should I say, what worked in the past? Stop crying what's fair what's fair what's fair. Tell us what worked and lets go back to that. Before you guys fucked up the American Middle class.

CLEARLY what you are saying is that the rich pay too much and the middle class needs to pay more. That is self evident by your actions. I think the middle class would disagree with you but they are too stupid to even show up to vote. Why? Because they don't think their vote matters.

You are a piece of shit. Just know that's how I view you. A stupid cock sucker.