Political outcome of 80 million employees losing

[Trajan]

heres the federal register, make of it what you will ..........semantics? lose status vs. cancelled? *shrugs* I think the point is basically the same....they will have to get a plan with the essential benes...

page 17......

http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/FR-2010-06-17/pdf/2010-14488.pdf


oh but wait.....

The Obama administration today announced a one year delay of online enrollment for small businesses looking to purchase health coverage through federal Obamacare exchanges, another high-profile setback for HealthCare.gov.

It’s the second delay for online small business enrollment, which the administration had said would begin this month.

Read more: Small business Obamacare online enrollment delayed a year - Jason Millman - POLITICO.com




oh and back to the 90's...

Small businesses have been able to apply through paper applications since Oct. 1, and HHS will announce alternative sign-up methods, like enrolling through an agent or broker or directly through an insurer.

 

[healthmyths]

Here is the link to the Federal Register: http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/FR-2010-06-17/pdf/2010-14488.pdf

Read it, and see for yourselves.

Under this assumption, the Departments’ mid-range estimate is that
66 percent of small employer plans and 45 percent of large employer plans will
relinquish their grandfather status by the end of 2013. The low-end estimates
are for 49 percent and 34 percent of small and large employer plans,
respectively, to have relinquished grandfather status, and the high-end
estimates are 80 percent and 64 percent, respectively.

The words "cancel" nor "cancelled" appear anywhere in the Register.

Here is what Fox News just claimed:

In fact, according to the Federal Register, its mid-range estimate was that by the end of 2014, 76 percent of small group plans would be cancelled, along with 55 percent of large employer plans.

You now can see Fox News lied. Flat out lied.

Stop regurgitating the piss of hack media outlets, or else you deserve to be lied to as much as a reader of the National Enquirer, and are just as gullible.

You copied..
"will relinquish their grandfather status by the end of 2013. The low-end estimates are for 49 percent and 34 percent of small and large employer plans,
respectively, to have relinquished grandfather status, and the high-end estimates are 80 percent and 64 percent, respectively."

WHAT happens when something is relinquished?? I understand it means something expires... cancelled.. give back..... all meaning "relinquished"..

So these "RELINQUISHED" plans are given up. ARE CANCELLED!
What else does it mean?
The employers will no longer provide.. the gave up their grandfather status!
MEANS the policies won't be paid by the employers.. meaning then the insurance companies CANCEL!!!

So again.. what is the difference between giving up the payment on a policy that due to ACA could be grandfathered IF employers paid more...
BUT the employers don't want to so the GIVE UP and the POLICIES ARE CANCELLED!!!

 

[Sunshine]

Almost 80 million people with employer health plans could find their coverage canceled because they are not compliant with ObamaCare, several experts predicted.
"Administration estimated that approximately 78 million Americans with employer sponsored insurance would lose their existing coverage due to the ACA.
Almost 80 million with employer health care plans could have coverage canceled, experts predict | Fox News

This will cost the democrat party the house, begin FAST track of Obama's impeachment and disgraced resignation!

It is in the best interest of the employer to stop offering health insurance as a benefit. Whether the employer policies are compliant or not really isn't the big issue here. Profitability for the employer is. Obama set up a system that grossly favors the employers who offer insurance to employers. All they have to do is adopt the McDonald's business model and voila, none of their employees will have employer provided insurance!

 

[healthmyths]

For most people, it amounts to NOTHING at all. No impact on their lives whatsoever.



Fallacious assumption.

Like I said, anyone can go to their HR department and quickly find out what a bogus pile of trash this claim is.

I sure can. And guess what? The current plans we hold aren't compliant. They will be cancelled and a new plan will emerge. My industry follows the lead of their peers. it's how they roll. i will have my current plan cancelled in order to comply with ObamaTax. The only remaining piece for me, is how much more I'm going to have to fork over to meet the demands of despotic government.

There is no trash in the claim. The current plans for those who lose grandfather stattus will be cancelled and a new plan given. Unless the costs force employers to send employees to the exchange site. The question of this is not IF, the question is how many and how much of the plans will get rolled into a new one and how much the cost will be.

So like I said, you will end up with BETTER coverage. Not NO insurance, as this bogus 80 million claim implies.


Three things happen when an employer loses their grandfather status.

1) Nothing. Many companies have already lost their grandfather status, as predicted in the Register. But since their policies exceed the minimum standards of the ACA, this loss is insignificant and has no effect on their business practice going forward.

2) Cancellation. Some companies provide insurance which is below the ACA standards. Upon losing their grandfather status, they will be required to offer insurance which does meet the standards. They may choose instead to just cancel their plans and pay the penalties. These penalties will be applied to subsidies for their employees who will now get their insurance from health insurance exchanges. These new policies will have better coverage than what they used to have.

3) Better coverage provided to employees. Some companies provide insurance which is below the ACA standards. Upon losing their grandfather status, they will be required to offer insurance which does meet the standards. They may choose to do this.


And that is why "losing grandfather status" does not automatically mean "will cancel their insurance plans".

You fall under option 3, better coverage.



What is being left out of the picture is the many other employers who currently do not provide any insurance whatsoever. They are not grandfathered because they did not have an insurance plan to begin with. These companies will either have to start providing insurance or pay a penalty.



The end result, as was seen in Massachusetts, will be a larger percentage of employers providing health insurance.

Are you saying those that meet the Minimum standards of ACA had no pre-existing conditions exclusions?
In other words person with history of cancer applies for company plan that meet the minimum ACA i.e. no pre-existing heart conditions.. plans would NOT be cancelled?
See the whole PREMISE of health insurance was based on a little known obviously to people like you "risk management"!
This means either a company pays through the nose for no limits, all conditions regardless i.e. no pre-existing conditions mean anything.. for a employee health plan that
covers infinite expenses for an infinite period... YES I can see that company exceeding minimum standards of ACA!!!

How many of the 80 million employees' plans fit the category of "exceeding minimum ACA standards"???
Almost NONE and that's the reason for cancellation and not getting grandfather status!

This banning of "pre-existing conditions" was another hokum bogus issue!
The horror stories told about those poor people because of "pre -existing" no doubt were true!
BUT THEY ARE THE EXCEPTIONS!!! There is NO rationale to make the EXCEPTION become the RULE and that's what the emotional lack of intelligent responses have done!
Banning "pre-existing" was a total idiotic step that explodes health insurance premises that have operated successfully!

The biggest problem with most people on the health issue is they are LOOKING AT THE WRONG end of the binoculars!

$850 billion a year is wasted in healthcare costs and insurance/medicare/out of pocket payers -- i.e. ALL of us pay in higher premiums!

Cut that in half and premiums drop 25% or more!!!

 

[LoneLaugher]

80 million! This is a nightmare! The GOP will run the table in 14'. This is the end of the Democratic Party as we know it! The end I say!

 

[paulitician]

Relax Peeps, the IRS is your friend. It's only lookin out for you. So don't you worry about not purchasing that insurance. The IRS will let ya slide. It won't punish you by way of Fines or Imprisonment. It's all about the love & compassion. God Bless the IRS.

 

[healthmyths]

Almost 80 million people with employer health plans could find their coverage canceled because they are not compliant with ObamaCare, several experts predicted.
"Administration estimated that approximately 78 million Americans with employer sponsored insurance would lose their existing coverage due to the ACA.
Almost 80 million with employer health care plans could have coverage canceled, experts predict | Fox News

This will cost the democrat party the house, begin FAST track of Obama's impeachment and disgraced resignation!

It is in the best interest of the employer to stop offering health insurance as a benefit. Whether the employer policies are compliant or not really isn't the big issue here. Profitability for the employer is. Obama set up a system that grossly favors the employers who offer insurance to employers. All they have to do is adopt the McDonald's business model and voila, none of their employees will have employer provided insurance!

FACT check this link out!!!
What you are looking at are the DEDUCTIONS taken by businesses, individual off their income tax payments.
The largest is payment of health benefits to employees.
Without that $131 billion in deductions corporate taxes would be higher.
And we know what happens then... more money going off shore not to pay taxes!
Fewer jobs here..

BUT don 't beat up the corporations... THEY ARE RESPONDING to a government interference in the marketplace.. ALL for less then 4 million truly uninsured!

SOURCE: What are the largest tax expenditures?

Deduction Type of deduction that government ALLOWS tax payer to subtract from taxes

1. [*]$131.0 billion Benefits individual: Exclusion of employer medical insurance premiums and medical care
   [*]$117.7 Benefits Individual: Net exclusion of pension contributions and earnings
   [*]$ 88.5 Benefits Individual : Deductibility of mortgage interest on owner-occupied homes
   [*]$ 55.9 Benefits company: Accelerated depreciation of machinery and equipment
   [*]$ 49.1 Benefits company: Deductibility of non-business state and local taxes
   [*]$ 46.8 Benefits individuals and companies Deductibility of charitable contributions (Obama deducted $245,000 in donations)
   [*]$ 31.5 Benefits company: Deferral of income from controlled foreign corporations
   [*]$ 30.0 Benefits individuals:Capital gains exclusion on home sales
   [*]$ 29.1 Benefits individualseductibility of State and local property tax on owner-occupied homes
   [*]$ 28.4 Benefits individuals: Child credit
   [*]$ 24.2 Benefits individuals:Capital gains (except agriculture,timber, and coal)
   [*]$ 21.5 Benefits individuals:Step-up basis of capital gains at death

GRAND TOTAL OF loopholes, tax credits, etc...... $653.7 billion
Of these 12 deductions 9 benefit individuals,employees,etc.. the remaining 3 companies...