Racist groups vs Free Speech, i've converted...

[Mac1958]

Not every post is about YOU. Did I mention you by name, or refer to a post of yours? Nope.

Despite the complaints, no one wants to say what I said was wrong.
.

Wow, that was a quick retreat. You didn't have to mention me by name, you just right into a critique about my discussion with Mr Nazi, with a false statement. It's been exposed. Run along now

Okay, I'll run along now.

And my point stands, regardless of your transparent deflect/pivot/attack strategy.

Looks like your brave OP was bullshit, huh?
.

By all means, stay and talk, but be honest in your discussion, otherwise you are just wasting our time

How ironic.
.

Did you for get you finish your statement or is that your entire argument?

I made the point twice, the second time just for fun, given the outrage it caused.

Liberals good, Regressive Leftists bad.

So yeah, I'm pleased.
.

 

[Mac1958]

Free speech is what should be the first order....

Unfortunately, that notion is no longer the given that it used to be.
.

 

[HappyJoy]

Free speech is what should be the first order....

Like burning the American flag?

 

[Slade3200]

Free speech is what should be the first order....

Free speech is important no argument there... But per this discussion that I was having with the dude that wanted ethnic cleansing in this country, how was free speech being impeded or challenged? I have every right to argue the points and it isn't right to jump to the free speech attacks to divert from the subject at hand. You don't like it when the Left does that with quick calling racism, so be careful that you don't do the same thing with the "free speech".

 

[Slade3200]

Wow, that was a quick retreat. You didn't have to mention me by name, you just right into a critique about my discussion with Mr Nazi, with a false statement. It's been exposed. Run along now

Okay, I'll run along now.

And my point stands, regardless of your transparent deflect/pivot/attack strategy.

Looks like your brave OP was bullshit, huh?
.

By all means, stay and talk, but be honest in your discussion, otherwise you are just wasting our time

How ironic.
.

Did you for get you finish your statement or is that your entire argument?

I made the point twice, the second time just for fun, given the outrage it caused.

Liberals good, Regressive Leftists bad.

So yeah, I'm pleased.
.

You've posted about this argument more than I have and you are the one that brought in the outrage at the "regressive liberal "actions that I then showed I didn't commit. I know its fun to try and discredit your opposition by painting them as over dramatic snowflakes, but just know you aren't fooling anybody.

 

[Mac1958]

Okay, I'll run along now.

And my point stands, regardless of your transparent deflect/pivot/attack strategy.

Looks like your brave OP was bullshit, huh?
.

By all means, stay and talk, but be honest in your discussion, otherwise you are just wasting our time

How ironic.
.

Did you for get you finish your statement or is that your entire argument?

I made the point twice, the second time just for fun, given the outrage it caused.

Liberals good, Regressive Leftists bad.

So yeah, I'm pleased.
.

You've posted about this argument more than I have and you are the one that brought in the outrage at the "regressive liberal "actions that I then showed I didn't commit. I know its fun to try and discredit your opposition by painting them as over dramatic snowflakes, but just know you aren't fooling anybody.

Okie dokie!
.

 

[Slade3200]

Free speech is what should be the first order....

Like burning the American flag?

No, like taking a knee during the National Anthem.

 

[sartre play]

I thought it was ACORN, the Muslim Brotherhood, George Soros and AARP? Oh, and let's keep an eye on the BBB for good measure.

I said "communists", didn't I?

Yeah, AARP, real communist. How about the cub scouts?

Are you kidding me, lolol.

SENIORS BEWARE: AARP HAS SOCIALIST AGENDA
Fran Tarkenton paraphrased - "AARP is communist"
Jim DeMint Exposes The Ugly Truth of AARP’s Agenda…. “Profit” !
Articles: AARP: One More Big Brother?
Put the AARP in the Progressive Camp

Oh, no, Fran Tarkenton and Jim DeMint don't like the AARP. By the way, you obviously didn't read any of your links, especially the second one.

Too bad you didn't. The AARP is a communist organization.

Boy scouts too, since the fag brigade took them over and sexualized it. It's all about promoting depravity and displacing traditional family values. That's the only way communism works. Honor is taught in families and churches, and people of honor and character don't fall for communism.

When did the AARP become a commie org, must have missed that talking point, no org that is run & manned by humans will be perfect, but if your over 50 they will lobby for most of the things elders want.

 

[koshergrl]

I said "communists", didn't I?

Yeah, AARP, real communist. How about the cub scouts?

Are you kidding me, lolol.

SENIORS BEWARE: AARP HAS SOCIALIST AGENDA
Fran Tarkenton paraphrased - "AARP is communist"
Jim DeMint Exposes The Ugly Truth of AARP’s Agenda…. “Profit” !
Articles: AARP: One More Big Brother?
Put the AARP in the Progressive Camp

Oh, no, Fran Tarkenton and Jim DeMint don't like the AARP. By the way, you obviously didn't read any of your links, especially the second one.

Too bad you didn't. The AARP is a communist organization.

Boy scouts too, since the fag brigade took them over and sexualized it. It's all about promoting depravity and displacing traditional family values. That's the only way communism works. Honor is taught in families and churches, and people of honor and character don't fall for communism.

When did the AARP become a commie org, must have missed that talking point, no org that is run & manned by humans will be perfect, but if your over 50 they will lobby for most of the things elders want.

Whatever. Commie organizations always "lobby for things"...that's their whole schtick. Promising shit to people that they don't have, so they can secure funding and votes until they move into power.

AARP absolutely lobbies for communism, straight up.

 

[HappyJoy]

Yeah, AARP, real communist. How about the cub scouts?

Are you kidding me, lolol.

SENIORS BEWARE: AARP HAS SOCIALIST AGENDA
Fran Tarkenton paraphrased - "AARP is communist"
Jim DeMint Exposes The Ugly Truth of AARP’s Agenda…. “Profit” !
Articles: AARP: One More Big Brother?
Put the AARP in the Progressive Camp

Oh, no, Fran Tarkenton and Jim DeMint don't like the AARP. By the way, you obviously didn't read any of your links, especially the second one.

Too bad you didn't. The AARP is a communist organization.

Boy scouts too, since the fag brigade took them over and sexualized it. It's all about promoting depravity and displacing traditional family values. That's the only way communism works. Honor is taught in families and churches, and people of honor and character don't fall for communism.

When did the AARP become a commie org, must have missed that talking point, no org that is run & manned by humans will be perfect, but if your over 50 they will lobby for most of the things elders want.

Whatever. Commie organizations always "lobby for things"...that's their whole schtick. Promising shit to people that they don't have, so they can secure funding and votes until they move into power.

AARP absolutely lobbies for communism, straight up.

The oil industry lobbies for things too, so does Americans for Prosperity, same schtick. Man, I think you're onto something.

 

[koshergrl]

Are you kidding me, lolol.

SENIORS BEWARE: AARP HAS SOCIALIST AGENDA
Fran Tarkenton paraphrased - "AARP is communist"
Jim DeMint Exposes The Ugly Truth of AARP’s Agenda…. “Profit” !
Articles: AARP: One More Big Brother?
Put the AARP in the Progressive Camp

Oh, no, Fran Tarkenton and Jim DeMint don't like the AARP. By the way, you obviously didn't read any of your links, especially the second one.

Too bad you didn't. The AARP is a communist organization.

Boy scouts too, since the fag brigade took them over and sexualized it. It's all about promoting depravity and displacing traditional family values. That's the only way communism works. Honor is taught in families and churches, and people of honor and character don't fall for communism.

When did the AARP become a commie org, must have missed that talking point, no org that is run & manned by humans will be perfect, but if your over 50 they will lobby for most of the things elders want.

Whatever. Commie organizations always "lobby for things"...that's their whole schtick. Promising shit to people that they don't have, so they can secure funding and votes until they move into power.

AARP absolutely lobbies for communism, straight up.

The oil industry lobbies for things too, so does Americans for Prosperity, same schtick. Man, I think you're onto something.

The oil industry doesn't portray itself as a non profit/watchdog organization.

See the difference?

The oil industry doesn't lie to old people in order to obtain money from them, and then use that money to promote a particular political ideology while pretending to be *objective* and non profit.

 

[SobieskiSavedEurope]

It's bad enough that within races, the idiots tend to have more kids, it's even worse that the more idiotic races have even more kids than that.

The intelligence dynamics matter a great deal, obviously the Third-World condition can't be explained away only by Colonialism, and Socialism.

If that were true, then obviously Eastern Europe should generally be behind Africa, that's not the case, though.

Nice dodge, but you didn't address my statement. You can't really because you have no arguement

What's the purpose of multiculturalism?

You have yet to address that a single time, just kicking, and screaming that I must explain myself., when I have explained myself over, and over again.

I don't really need to explain the purpose of multiculturalism, I don't care if everybody mixes races or doesn't. I'm promoting freedom. You are promoting restriction and division. I say love who you want to love and be happy. You say only stick to your own race and in the processes alienate and degrade mixed race couples because of some piss poor excuses you come up with to preserve intellect, and tradition. I've already explained the flaws in your intellect argument and shown how traditions still transcend through diversity, while also pointing out that the importance you put on the heritage aspect is all in your head. It's not a real or relevant concern in the grand scheme

Well, if it really is his choice, then why do you say his argument is flawed? Is he not entitled to make his own decisions and to have his own opinions based on his own experiences, research, etc? This is what I really find hypocritical about leftists. You want to tell other people it is none of their business, but yet you are more than willing to involve yourself in another's life decisions if you don't agree with them?

That's not at all what I've been saying, he can think whatever he wants. His philosophy and goals are to control who other people love and procreate with. It's oppression over freedom. I'm obviously questioning his reasoning and challenging his "rationale" but I find it interesting that you decided to call me out as a leftist hypocrite when he is doing the same thing you accuse me of... telling other people how to live. So how come you see that in my words and not for his? Do you sympathize with his point of view?

I never once advocated so far a government love making quota.

I'm more along the lines of seeing uncontrolled multicultural immigration as a supporter of Miscegenation.

We would not need anti-Miscegenation laws, if there was no multiculturalism.

 

[Slade3200]

Nice dodge, but you didn't address my statement. You can't really because you have no arguement

What's the purpose of multiculturalism?

You have yet to address that a single time, just kicking, and screaming that I must explain myself., when I have explained myself over, and over again.

I don't really need to explain the purpose of multiculturalism, I don't care if everybody mixes races or doesn't. I'm promoting freedom. You are promoting restriction and division. I say love who you want to love and be happy. You say only stick to your own race and in the processes alienate and degrade mixed race couples because of some piss poor excuses you come up with to preserve intellect, and tradition. I've already explained the flaws in your intellect argument and shown how traditions still transcend through diversity, while also pointing out that the importance you put on the heritage aspect is all in your head. It's not a real or relevant concern in the grand scheme

Well, if it really is his choice, then why do you say his argument is flawed? Is he not entitled to make his own decisions and to have his own opinions based on his own experiences, research, etc? This is what I really find hypocritical about leftists. You want to tell other people it is none of their business, but yet you are more than willing to involve yourself in another's life decisions if you don't agree with them?

That's not at all what I've been saying, he can think whatever he wants. His philosophy and goals are to control who other people love and procreate with. It's oppression over freedom. I'm obviously questioning his reasoning and challenging his "rationale" but I find it interesting that you decided to call me out as a leftist hypocrite when he is doing the same thing you accuse me of... telling other people how to live. So how come you see that in my words and not for his? Do you sympathize with his point of view?

I never once advocated so far a government love making quota.

I'm more along the lines of seeing uncontrolled multicultural immigration as a supporter of Miscegenation.

We would not need anti-Miscegenation laws, if there was no multiculturalism.

"I'm more along the lines of seeing uncontrolled multicultural immigration as a supporter of Miscegenation."
Doesn't this above quote of yours go directly against everything that you've been saying?

As for your other statement, we have a free multicultural society so what do you suggest?

 

[SobieskiSavedEurope]

What's the purpose of multiculturalism?

You have yet to address that a single time, just kicking, and screaming that I must explain myself., when I have explained myself over, and over again.

I don't really need to explain the purpose of multiculturalism, I don't care if everybody mixes races or doesn't. I'm promoting freedom. You are promoting restriction and division. I say love who you want to love and be happy. You say only stick to your own race and in the processes alienate and degrade mixed race couples because of some piss poor excuses you come up with to preserve intellect, and tradition. I've already explained the flaws in your intellect argument and shown how traditions still transcend through diversity, while also pointing out that the importance you put on the heritage aspect is all in your head. It's not a real or relevant concern in the grand scheme

Well, if it really is his choice, then why do you say his argument is flawed? Is he not entitled to make his own decisions and to have his own opinions based on his own experiences, research, etc? This is what I really find hypocritical about leftists. You want to tell other people it is none of their business, but yet you are more than willing to involve yourself in another's life decisions if you don't agree with them?

That's not at all what I've been saying, he can think whatever he wants. His philosophy and goals are to control who other people love and procreate with. It's oppression over freedom. I'm obviously questioning his reasoning and challenging his "rationale" but I find it interesting that you decided to call me out as a leftist hypocrite when he is doing the same thing you accuse me of... telling other people how to live. So how come you see that in my words and not for his? Do you sympathize with his point of view?

I never once advocated so far a government love making quota.

I'm more along the lines of seeing uncontrolled multicultural immigration as a supporter of Miscegenation.

We would not need anti-Miscegenation laws, if there was no multiculturalism.

"I'm more along the lines of seeing uncontrolled multicultural immigration as a supporter of Miscegenation."
Doesn't this above quote of yours go directly against everything that you've been saying?

As for your other statement, we have a free multicultural society so what do you suggest?

I'd rather see government keep out non-Whites, rather than crack down on who we have kids with.

If there's no non-Whites in that society, how would they possibly create kids with non-Whites?

I don't support your multicultural "Free society" and I'm outraged we haven't had Democratic voting rights, to
control our destiny over our heritage, and our future.

The U.S was setup to be a White nation, the Founding Fathers immigration act the Naturalization Act of 1790, proves it.

If you love non-Whites so much, why don't you leave the U.S for some Third-World 'Utopia"?

 

[Leo123]

It's been a crazy week and i've engaged in many heated discussions about the events of Charlottesville. I have to admit that i've been greatly conflicted about my anti-racist feelings and my support of free speech. I flirted dangerously close in many discussions to promoting the shutdown of speech for white supremacist groups. I saw them as threats, conveyers of hate speech and given their history which has resulted in millions of deaths I was ok with suppressing their speech and shutting down their causes by whatever means necessary. But, I've had a change of heart.

I think we can be smarter than that and not empower these assholes to strip us of our freedoms. It is a slippery slope once you start suppressing speech. We have legal censorship in a variety of areas which i'm fine with, but shutting down groups from holding rallies, having websites and protesting is only going to lead to bad things. Note that I in no way support any provocation of violence or destruction resulting from rallies or protests. If that happens then shut them down immediately and make arrests.

I would promote fighting these douchebags by ignoring them and minimizing them in a SMART way. Don't lower yourself to fight with them and fuel their cause. Take away their statues and flags that empower them in public forums and show them that our communities outright reject their hateful views. Or construct monuments and statues of civil rights leaders next to the confederate statues and tell the story about how we prevailed and fought agains their hate, and WE WON. Ignore their rallies and don't give them the exposure or attention that they crave. Speak louder and stronger for equality.

I still think that the Presidents comments that minimized the ugliness of the Nazi's and White Supremacists were wildly inappropriate. He tried to spread the blame to the left for the anti-protests and it deluded his message of condemnation that should have been crystal clear in opposition of the hate groups. He should have spread the message in a better way to fight against it. I don't want to relitigate Trumps actions in this OP but I did want to share my change of opinion and open up a discussion about productive ways to move forward that combats the hate and preserves our right of free speech.

The President didn't minimize anything. That is opinion. He blamed both groups for their violence which anyone with half a brain could see if they actually watched the riot. Honestly it was hard to tell who was who. Tearing down statues does no one any good it sanitizes history which is just what the nazi's did. We need to understand our history with all the bumps, bruises and scars instead of trying to re-define it to PC 'standards.'

The way to minimize a hate-group's power is to ignore them. Let them have their little 'rallies' and spout their racist gibberish. They DO NOT represent most Americans but by rioting against them you are bringing attention to their ranks and making of them more than what they are...a bunch of cream-puff fat-boys with loser lives.

 

[SobieskiSavedEurope]

And you are being intolerant of my intolerance!

We should be able to relate then!

I strongly disagree with racism, sexism and abuse of power. I think my OP shows a promotion and acceptance of free speech and people's right to hold whatever opinions they want. But I also believe that when those ideas get promoted to the public then the public has a right to push back. In my case I feel a moral obligation to speak up against such hate. Not to shut them down from talking but to expose the flaws in their logic. I've had a pretty rationale conversation with this guy, I've asked him questions, given him plenty of opportunities to make a sound arguement, which he has failed miserably at in my opinion. That's what debate it all about. I'd rather expose his agenda as hate filled emotion instead of calling him names and telling him to shut up

True, but I'm willing to bet that he feels as strongly about his views as you do about yours. I think that all the name calling and accusations are very counter productive. You can't change minds and hearts with negativity. As soon as you start with that, they will just tune you out and stop listening to anything you say no matter how much sense it makes. I suppose we all get frustrated though, when talking about such hot button topics.

I suggest you go back and read the discussion. I attacked his arguments and rationale, not him personally. He was the one calling people idiots and insulting the intelligence of people based on their race.

I am still curious about why you decided to come after me instead of him though... he was doing the same thing to me that I was doing to him as we both attacked each other's arguments.

Maybe because I already know all about his "arguments." He and I were members at another forum.

Did you challenge his arguments in the other forum?

Yes, she did challenge me on eugenics on this "other forum"

 

[SobieskiSavedEurope]

I'd rather expose his agenda as hate filled emotion instead of calling him names and telling him to shut up

Uh, not all racists necessarily hate, or are filled with emotion.

Rushton was a prime example of a very logical, calculated racist

 

[SobieskiSavedEurope]

Anyone who has ever read my posts would know that I am all for personal choices and personal responsibility. I have no problem with mixed race couples or gay couples. I don't feel threatened by them at all, and I would date someone of another race if it was someone that I liked and was attracted to. I just wonder how liberals can demand "tolerance" for other viewpoints when they show very little in return?

It sounds like you are being intolerant of liberal intolerance. Doesn't that make you a hypocrite?

And you are being intolerant of my intolerance!

We should be able to relate then!

I strongly disagree with racism, sexism and abuse of power. I think my OP shows a promotion and acceptance of free speech and people's right to hold whatever opinions they want. But I also believe that when those ideas get promoted to the public then the public has a right to push back. In my case I feel a moral obligation to speak up against such hate. Not to shut them down from talking but to expose the flaws in their logic. I've had a pretty rationale conversation with this guy, I've asked him questions, given him plenty of opportunities to make a sound arguement, which he has failed miserably at in my opinion. That's what debate it all about. I'd rather expose his agenda as hate filled emotion instead of calling him names and telling him to shut up

True, but I'm willing to bet that he feels as strongly about his views as you do about yours. I think that all the name calling and accusations are very counter productive. You can't change minds and hearts with negativity. As soon as you start with that, they will just tune you out and stop listening to anything you say no matter how much sense it makes. I suppose we all get frustrated though, when talking about such hot button topics.

He was the one calling people idiots and insulting the intelligence of people based on their race.

What evidence do you have of racial equality of intelligence, though?

For example, if we used tired old arguments of Colonialism, or Socialism causing the Third-World condition.

How come Estonia was colonized for nearly 1,000 years, and Communist for more than 50 years, but has bounced back as Europe's leader in educational PISA scores?

Yes, in the most recent PISA scores, Estonia has not just become Europe's leader in PISA scores, but one of the leaders of the World in PISA scores.

By Liberal logic, this should be impossible, Estonia should be way behind.

 

[SobieskiSavedEurope]

The short answer is, these people aren't liberals.
.

The short answer is you're defending this, because 'liberals', or whatever your excuse is:

That doesn't even begin to speak of damages done to intellect when a stupid people, mix with smart people.

Why is it you expect liberals to be wishy-washy anyway?

Did I say something that you feel is incorrect?

And allowing people to speak their mind is a sign of strength and confidence, not a sign of being "wishy washy".

Now, what did I say that was incorrect?
.

You said these people aren't liberals when I was doing exactly what you all were critiquing me for not doing. I have many pages of conversation with this guy where I asked questions and encouraged him to speak his mind... yet you inject some leftist critique and accuse me of trying to control him.

That's what you said that was incorrect

Not every post is about YOU. Did I mention you by name, or refer to a post of yours? Nope.

Despite the complaints, no one wants to say what I said was wrong.
.

, you just right into a critique about my discussion with Mr Nazi,

Who's this Mr Nazi?

I certainly am not a Nazi, Nazi Germany did untold damages to Europe, especially my beloved Poland.

Furthermore, No I don't agree with Nazi Germany's camps, or walled off ghettoes.

 

[Leo123]

If there's no non-Whites in that society, how would they possibly create kids with non-Whites?

I don't support your multicultural "Free society" and I'm outraged we haven't had Democratic voting rights, to
control our destiny over our heritage, and our future.

The U.S was setup to be a White nation, the Founding Fathers immigration act the Naturalization Act of 1790, proves it.

If you love non-Whites so much, why don't you leave the U.S for some Third-World 'Utopia"?

This, of course, begs the question...what are 'non-whites?' Obama, for instance, was a non-black (half white). Skin color is meaningless. Multiculturalism is a whole different thing however. Immigrants who come here should have to swear to be Americans...not hyphenated Americans living in hovels mirroring their country of origin. Multiculturalism is most prevalent in illegal alien populations. They come here for the $$$, send it back home and eventually undercut our economy. Skin color is a red herring.