Reagan & Conservatives -- Revisonist History 101

[JoeB131]

we have the best gov't Big Business can buy.

Unfortunately...

But they couldn't do it without useful idiots like DogStyle who think the real problem is the rest of us don't work hard enough to make the rich wealthier...

Don't look now but someone's been taking a beating in this string and is now resorting to name calling...

Don't post nonsense if you can't handle being called on it, Joe...

Dogstyle, when you make retarded claims like "Bush won in 2000, despite getting less votes" and "We went after Saddam because of "treaty violations'," there's really nothing left but to call you names like "Retard".

Sadly, you are what happens when someone listens to Hate Radio all day, and is trained by the wealthy to hate those who are just a little worse off than you are.

And frankly, I used to be the same way. Until my last boss gave me a wakeup call, and realized the welfare person isn't my enemy.... he was. As much as he gladhanded me and tried to pretend to be my friend.

 

[JoeB131]

[

The people who are lazy are the ones who want government handouts to enable them to have a lifestyle they haven't earned. I was raised to respect anyone who works hard...and that goes for the poor AND the rich. I'm sorry but I don't have any respect for able bodied people who don't have any ambition...don't work hard...but think it's "fair" to take from those people who do have ambition and have worked hard.

And who are these people, exactly?

Last job I had, the one where they fired me because I got sick, I was putting in 60 hours a week managing an account that netted them 20 million a year gross. Their big complaint? With the overtime, I was netting a whopping $49K a year, when their profit margin was something like 30%. (Incidently, the reason they lost that business. The customer knew they were being gouged.)

Here's the thing. I would have no problem with "Workfare". I'd have no problem finding something constructive for those on welfare to do, to give them the dignity of work.

The problem is, of course, is your masters the Koch Brothers and their ilk would never stand for it. Because if they couldn't constantly threaten to give your job to a welfare person, they couldn't keep you in line.

That's why they hated it when Clinton got unemployment down to 3%. They couldn't threaten people anymore. Oh, man, fuck that, share with the fucking wage slaves? Hell No. Let's steal the election and put a retard in charge.

And dumb idiots like you said. 'Yeah, we totally need to impeach Clinton! He lied about a BLOW JOB!!!!"

 

[gipper]

we have the best gov't Big Business can buy.

From what I see Obama sold himself for a shit load of money.

It is nothing new. BO is very much like most of his predecessors.

To blame the wealthy, an entire class of people some of whom, work very hard, is entirely illogical. However many wealthy people are wealthy because government has allowed them to be so, with the imposition of crony capitalism.

The blame for turning America into a bankrupt welfare/warfare oligarchy state, rests entirely in Washington DC.

And anyone who thinks big uncontrolled government is good, knows nothing of history.

 

[JoeB131]

we have the best gov't Big Business can buy.

From what I see Obama sold himself for a shit load of money.

It is nothing new. BO is very much like most of his predecessors.

To blame the wealthy, an entire class of people some of whom, work very hard, is entirely illogical. However many wealthy people are wealthy because government has allowed them to be so, with the imposition of crony capitalism.

The blame for turning America into a bankrupt welfare/warfare oligarchy state, rests entirely in Washington DC.

And anyone who thinks big uncontrolled government is good, knows nothing of history.

Who said govenrment should be "uncontrolled". We have a control. It's called "elections".

I blame the wealthy because their greed is what got us here.

They were just fine. They had plenty of money. But that wasn't enough. They had to inflate the housing market. They had to move the good jobs oversees to someone who makes a pittance.

Their greed got us here, and they wonder why some of us are mad.

Because unlike you, we are paying attention.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

The housing collapse is a perfect example of government interference distorting and then collapsing a system. Bankers risking their own money tend to be very conservative, they won't lend to no income no assets borrowers unless the government is telling them "we will guarantee those loans for you" then you get a housing collapse

 

[JoeB131]

The housing collapse is a perfect example of government interference distorting and then collapsing a system. Bankers risking their own money tend to be very conservative, they won't lend to no income no assets borrowers unless the government is telling them "we will guarantee those loans for you" then you get a housing collapse

Except that's not how the housing collapse happened.

The housing collapse did not happen because the CRA prevented the banks from "redlining" certain neighborhoods.

It happened because the banks made bad loans to middle class folks buying more house than they needed, on the hope they could "Flip" that house in a few years to make a profit.

And they did this knowing damned well a lot of these folks would default, because they knew they'd get their money back by selling to the next sucker.

The housing collapse happened because of a LACK of government oversight.

 

[gipper]

The housing collapse is a perfect example of government interference distorting and then collapsing a system. Bankers risking their own money tend to be very conservative, they won't lend to no income no assets borrowers unless the government is telling them "we will guarantee those loans for you" then you get a housing collapse

Except that's not how the housing collapse happened.

The housing collapse did not happen because the CRA prevented the banks from "redlining" certain neighborhoods.

It happened because the banks made bad loans to middle class folks buying more house than they needed, on the hope they could "Flip" that house in a few years to make a profit.

And they did this knowing damned well a lot of these folks would default, because they knew they'd get their money back by selling to the next sucker.

The housing collapse happened because of a LACK of government oversight.

What you are failing to comprehend is that government was a willing partner in the corruption. They allowed it to happen. No sector of our economy is more regulated than the financial sector. Wall Street and the government are one. The regulations were in place, they were merely ignored.

You might do a little research on Fannie and Freddie...and a guy named Franklin Raines. Many in the D party including Dodd and Frank, who ironically passed a law named after themselves that has allowed the too big to fail banks to get bigger...and thus give lots of cash to politicians, were willing partners in the corruption...and that corruption continues unabated today. The housing market is once again in bubble territory all thanks to the big government you so love.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

The housing collapse is a perfect example of government interference distorting and then collapsing a system. Bankers risking their own money tend to be very conservative, they won't lend to no income no assets borrowers unless the government is telling them "we will guarantee those loans for you" then you get a housing collapse

Except that's not how the housing collapse happened.

The housing collapse did not happen because the CRA prevented the banks from "redlining" certain neighborhoods.

It happened because the banks made bad loans to middle class folks buying more house than they needed, on the hope they could "Flip" that house in a few years to make a profit.

And they did this knowing damned well a lot of these folks would default, because they knew they'd get their money back by selling to the next sucker.

The housing collapse happened because of a LACK of government oversight.

I didn't mention CRA, is English not your first language?

I said Fannie and Freddie encouraged/coerced the banks to provide them with sub-prime mortgages

 

[LA RAM FAN]

at 8:24 am today someone farted in here.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

The housing collapse is a perfect example of government interference distorting and then collapsing a system. Bankers risking their own money tend to be very conservative, they won't lend to no income no assets borrowers unless the government is telling them "we will guarantee those loans for you" then you get a housing collapse

Except that's not how the housing collapse happened.

The housing collapse did not happen because the CRA prevented the banks from "redlining" certain neighborhoods.

It happened because the banks made bad loans to middle class folks buying more house than they needed, on the hope they could "Flip" that house in a few years to make a profit.

And they did this knowing damned well a lot of these folks would default, because they knew they'd get their money back by selling to the next sucker.

The housing collapse happened because of a LACK of government oversight.

What you are failing to comprehend is that government was a willing partner in the corruption. They allowed it to happen. No sector of our economy is more regulated than the financial sector. Wall Street and the government are one. The regulations were in place, they were merely ignored.

You might do a little research on Fannie and Freddie...and a guy named Franklin Raines. Many in the D party including Dodd and Frank, who ironically passed a law named after themselves that has allowed the too big to fail banks to get bigger...and thus give lots of cash to politicians, were willing partners in the corruption...and that corruption continues unabated today. The housing market is once again in bubble territory all thanks to the big government you so love.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

[

The people who are lazy are the ones who want government handouts to enable them to have a lifestyle they haven't earned. I was raised to respect anyone who works hard...and that goes for the poor AND the rich. I'm sorry but I don't have any respect for able bodied people who don't have any ambition...don't work hard...but think it's "fair" to take from those people who do have ambition and have worked hard.

And who are these people, exactly?

Last job I had, the one where they fired me because I got sick, I was putting in 60 hours a week managing an account that netted them 20 million a year gross. Their big complaint? With the overtime, I was netting a whopping $49K a year, when their profit margin was something like 30%. (Incidently, the reason they lost that business. The customer knew they were being gouged.)

Here's the thing. I would have no problem with "Workfare". I'd have no problem finding something constructive for those on welfare to do, to give them the dignity of work.

The problem is, of course, is your masters the Koch Brothers and their ilk would never stand for it. Because if they couldn't constantly threaten to give your job to a welfare person, they couldn't keep you in line.

That's why they hated it when Clinton got unemployment down to 3%. They couldn't threaten people anymore. Oh, man, fuck that, share with the fucking wage slaves? Hell No. Let's steal the election and put a retard in charge.

And dumb idiots like you said. 'Yeah, we totally need to impeach Clinton! He lied about a BLOW JOB!!!!"

thats thr thing that is so extremely sick about our government is congress is so corrupt and bought off and lazy these days they wont do any REAL investigations into government corruption,especially presidents.

It was a joke that him getting a blowjob and lying about it is what congress impeached him for when they SHOULD have been impeaching him for all those deaths that he was behind as governor of arkansas in the MENA arkansas scandal people knowing too much of his allowing the CIA to smuggle drugs into arkansas in exchange for weapons to nicuargua that both him,Bush and facist Reagan were all involved in together.

There were arkansas state troopers flowin into washington who were willing to testify about all this but our corrupt and bought off congress never called them before the floor to speak effectively shutting down any investigation into it.

He also of course escapes impeachment for his lying about the waco events saying their helicopters never fired at the compound when the films clearly show they did and then saying the davidians started the fire when the films also shows tanks shooting flames onto the compound with a flame thrower mounted on it.

Clinton only lies about the murdering of women and children and yet our corrupt congress ignores THOSE lies and instead impeached him for lying about getting a blowjob.


some great and free country this is.

 

[Oldstyle]

Unlike you, Joe...I don't feel the need to take away things from somebody else in order to be successful and I'm not jealous of folks that have more than I. You view a big government redistributing wealth as a good thing. I see it as the beginning of the end of what made America great.

Guy, America was not great because a bunch of rich assholes exploited those who did the work.

America became great when we freed the slaves, and had a labor movement.

It's why we have a "Memorial Day" to celebrate those who died freeing the slaves, and a "Labor Day" to celebrate those who fought for the dignity of the working man.

We do not have a "Rich Douchebag Day" to celebrate those who starved children to buy another dressage horsie.....

In fact, we had our greatest prosperity when FDR raised the top marginal rate to 93%, imposed a minimum wage and established social security.... EXACTLY the kind of "Communist" redistribution you bewail.

That's when America became "Great".

Raising tax rates, imposing minimum wage and establishing social security isn't what made us prosperous, Joe. We became "Great" because in America people were allowed to become prosperous by dint of their own ambitions and hard work. People have been coming to America for centuries BECAUSE it was a place where you were allowed to raise your station in life and weren't trapped in a caste system. That made America prosperous long before FDR was even born.

What I "bewail" is the death of the spirit that made this country prosperous. What I "bewail" is an America where the majority is no longer ambitious or hard working. What I "bewail" is an America where people wait for government to help them rather than helping themselves. What I "bewail" is the gradual erosion of what made America special.

 

[Oldstyle]

Unfortunately...

But they couldn't do it without useful idiots like DogStyle who think the real problem is the rest of us don't work hard enough to make the rich wealthier...

Don't look now but someone's been taking a beating in this string and is now resorting to name calling...

Don't post nonsense if you can't handle being called on it, Joe...

Dogstyle, when you make retarded claims like "Bush won in 2000, despite getting less votes" and "We went after Saddam because of "treaty violations'," there's really nothing left but to call you names like "Retard".

Sadly, you are what happens when someone listens to Hate Radio all day, and is trained by the wealthy to hate those who are just a little worse off than you are.

And frankly, I used to be the same way. Until my last boss gave me a wakeup call, and realized the welfare person isn't my enemy.... he was. As much as he gladhanded me and tried to pretend to be my friend.

Bush did win in 2000...just as he did again in 2004...just as Obama won in 2008...and again in 2012. We have an electoral college. It determines who our President will be. It's determined that for quite some time. Calling someone who points out that reality "retarded" is simply childish.

Who's been trained to hate, Joe...you or me? I don't hate the poor. Never have...never will. You on the other hand have a seething hatred of the wealthy that seems to be based on the treatment that you received from your last boss. You have the naive notion that redistribution of wealth will cure all ills...a notion based on what? Revenge? So your old boss treated you badly...get over it and move on. This is America. You get to choose who you work for. For every asshole boss treating people badly there are five that understand their employees are their greatest asset and treat them right. Go work for them...OR BETTER YET WORK FOR YOURSELF!!!

 

[Oldstyle]

at 8:24 am today someone farted in here.

Since your head is still planted firmly in your posterior, 9/11...it's safe to assume that the person who farted "in here" would be you. Duh?

 

[LA RAM FAN]

3 farts in a row from you trollstyle.

 

[Oldstyle]

"Dogstyle, calling you retarded is an insult to Retards..." JoeB

You know what, Joe? I've patiently responded to each of your "views" in this thread...showing why it is that I think you're wrong. I haven't called you childish names. You on the other hand have decided that insults are an argument. In what way is that different than 9/11 and his "fart" comments?

 

[Camp]

"Dogstyle, calling you retarded is an insult to Retards..." JoeB

You know what, Joe? I've patiently responded to each of your "views" in this thread...showing why it is that I think you're wrong. I haven't called you childish names. You on the other hand have decided that insults are an argument. In what way is that different than 9/11 and his "fart" comments?

Old worn out propaganda and talking points gets old and boring. 9/11 thinks they smell like farts. Joe gives interesting and often original analysis and interpretations of historical events based on factual data.

 

[Oldstyle]

"Dogstyle, calling you retarded is an insult to Retards..." JoeB

You know what, Joe? I've patiently responded to each of your "views" in this thread...showing why it is that I think you're wrong. I haven't called you childish names. You on the other hand have decided that insults are an argument. In what way is that different than 9/11 and his "fart" comments?

Old worn out propaganda and talking points gets old and boring. 9/11 thinks they smell like farts. Joe gives interesting and often original analysis and interpretations of historical events based on factual data.

I'm sorry, Camp but Joe has made claims that are not factually based and his interpretations of history are NOT what one would expect from a history major. 9/11 makes his fart comments because he's not intelligent enough to come back with an intelligent counter-argument.

At this point Joe has been shown to be incorrect on SO many of his contentions that he's resorted to the same childish retorts as 9/11...only with him it's labeling people as "retards" instead of talking about "farts".

 

[Oldstyle]

Quite frankly, I'm having a hard time believing Joe was a history major. His take on history is so superficial and biased in it's view that it's simply not what you would expect from someone who was a student of history. Historians understand that things are seldom black or white but tend to be shades of gray.

 

[Oldstyle]

"Dogstyle, calling you retarded is an insult to Retards..." JoeB

You know what, Joe? I've patiently responded to each of your "views" in this thread...showing why it is that I think you're wrong. I haven't called you childish names. You on the other hand have decided that insults are an argument. In what way is that different than 9/11 and his "fart" comments?

Old worn out propaganda and talking points gets old and boring. 9/11 thinks they smell like farts. Joe gives interesting and often original analysis and interpretations of historical events based on factual data.

I'm curious, Camp...would you point to something I've posted that would fit your description of "propaganda" or "talking points"?