Republican’s VS. Democrat’s Health Care Plan

[Seraega]

Well, no, not since the Great Depression, actually it was under Jimmie Carter. I was referring to not buying a house in the economic downturn, and getting some insurance for you and your family....to where I don't have to pay for it. You know...the way most Americans do it, if thay can't find a job with any benefits. I have a feeling there are 2 cars in the family. Probably at least 2-3 TV's, and XBox or something like that. A couple of cell phones, and probably an IPOD or two. I have a feeling I'm not far off on this.

More great financial advice. I should pass up buying a house when there was a $7500 tax credit (now 8000) and <5% interest rates? Again, primary house is generally exempt from bankruptcy... where as any potential medical debt I could accrue in the future would be wiped out.

You're pretty far out there, don't kid yourself. I'm the kind of guy that does math before making a decision. You seem to be basing yours on emotion.

I can do a little math too, and I don't want to pay for your fucking health insurance. You figure out a way to do it yourself, just like I have. Fucking socialists!!

Oh now you lobbed that big socialist bomb my way

Unfortunately the label doesn't fit. I have no delusions that Obama is going to offer us single payer, or even a public option. What I'm holding out for is the health care exchange. Take insurance regulation away from the states under the commerce clause - then let me purchase good coverage at a fair price.

NYS Dept of Insurance has engaged in price fixing with the insurance companies for the last 15 years. You cannot get coverage here for less than $510 a person. That's outrageous. All I want is a cheap HIGH deductible plan with an HSA. It doesn't have to pay for every scrape or bruise. It doesn't have to pay for Rx, since nobody in my family is on meds. It just has to be a simple plan to cover disasters. If the govt would get the fuck out of the way I'd be happy. I wouldnt' be asking anyone else to pick up the tab. So please try not to presume too much.

 

[Oddball]

Ah...so not only do you care to commit numerous logical fallacies yourself; you choose to top it off with irony by inaccurately referring to my consultation of empirical evidence as an argumentum ad verecundiam.

The only one arguing from ignorance here is you, Skippy.

Being a college boy does not automatically make you omniscient.

 

[Meister]

More great financial advice. I should pass up buying a house when there was a $7500 tax credit (now 8000) and <5% interest rates? Again, primary house is generally exempt from bankruptcy... where as any potential medical debt I could accrue in the future would be wiped out.

You're pretty far out there, don't kid yourself. I'm the kind of guy that does math before making a decision. You seem to be basing yours on emotion.

I can do a little math too, and I don't want to pay for your fucking health insurance. You figure out a way to do it yourself, just like I have. Fucking socialists!!

Oh now you lobbed that big socialist bomb my way

Unfortunately the label doesn't fit. I have no delusions that Obama is going to offer us single payer, or even a public option. What I'm holding out for is the health care exchange. Take insurance regulation away from the states under the commerce clause - then let me purchase good coverage at a fair price.

NYS Dept of Insurance has engaged in price fixing with the insurance companies for the last 15 years. You cannot get coverage here for less than $510 a person. That's outrageous. All I want is a cheap HIGH deductible plan with an HSA. It doesn't have to pay for every scrape or bruise. It doesn't have to pay for Rx, since nobody in my family is on meds. It just has to be a simple plan to cover disasters. If the govt would get the fuck out of the way I'd be happy. I wouldnt' be asking anyone else to pick up the tab. So please try not to presume too much.

Bottom line is that Obama will make me pay for your healthcare, that's the math. it will end up pushing my healthcare out of business where I'm forced to be covered under his healthcare. Which will end up rationing healthcare.
Look...what you and I end up with will be a socialized healthcare system, that will be inferior to what I have now. The government is incapable of running a business this big. The only thing it has run properly has been the Military. Obama is getting his hands on that now, too

 

[Oddball]

The government is incapable of running a business this big.

They're incapable of running the gaddamn post office!!

 

[Seraega]

I can do a little math too, and I don't want to pay for your fucking health insurance. You figure out a way to do it yourself, just like I have. Fucking socialists!!

Oh now you lobbed that big socialist bomb my way

Unfortunately the label doesn't fit. I have no delusions that Obama is going to offer us single payer, or even a public option. What I'm holding out for is the health care exchange. Take insurance regulation away from the states under the commerce clause - then let me purchase good coverage at a fair price.

NYS Dept of Insurance has engaged in price fixing with the insurance companies for the last 15 years. You cannot get coverage here for less than $510 a person. That's outrageous. All I want is a cheap HIGH deductible plan with an HSA. It doesn't have to pay for every scrape or bruise. It doesn't have to pay for Rx, since nobody in my family is on meds. It just has to be a simple plan to cover disasters. If the govt would get the fuck out of the way I'd be happy. I wouldnt' be asking anyone else to pick up the tab. So please try not to presume too much.

Bottom line is that Obama will make me pay for your healthcare, that's the math. it will end up pushing my healthcare out of business where I'm forced to be covered under his healthcare. Which will end up rationing healthcare.
Look...what you and I end up with will be a socialized healthcare system, that will be inferior to what I have now. The government is incapable of running a business this big. The only thing it has run properly has been the Military. Obama is getting his hands on that now, too

Not sure what planet you're on but here on Earth, the government has already proven capable of running medical insurance. Medicare has less than 3% overhead compared to the private sector which averages 30%... Unfortunately, like I said before, I don't believe that we're going to get anything close to socialized medicine. Probably going to be a mixed bag of tax credits, mandating coverage, and a nation wide health insurance exchange that will allow me to buy a policy from VA or CA or MA... somewhere with cheaper insurance than NY. The net effect is more competition will drive down prices.

 

[Meister]

Oh now you lobbed that big socialist bomb my way

Unfortunately the label doesn't fit. I have no delusions that Obama is going to offer us single payer, or even a public option. What I'm holding out for is the health care exchange. Take insurance regulation away from the states under the commerce clause - then let me purchase good coverage at a fair price.

NYS Dept of Insurance has engaged in price fixing with the insurance companies for the last 15 years. You cannot get coverage here for less than $510 a person. That's outrageous. All I want is a cheap HIGH deductible plan with an HSA. It doesn't have to pay for every scrape or bruise. It doesn't have to pay for Rx, since nobody in my family is on meds. It just has to be a simple plan to cover disasters. If the govt would get the fuck out of the way I'd be happy. I wouldnt' be asking anyone else to pick up the tab. So please try not to presume too much.

Bottom line is that Obama will make me pay for your healthcare, that's the math. it will end up pushing my healthcare out of business where I'm forced to be covered under his healthcare. Which will end up rationing healthcare.
Look...what you and I end up with will be a socialized healthcare system, that will be inferior to what I have now. The government is incapable of running a business this big. The only thing it has run properly has been the Military. Obama is getting his hands on that now, too

Not sure what planet you're on but here on Earth, the government has already proven capable of running medical insurance. Medicare has less than 3% overhead compared to the private sector which averages 30%... Unfortunately, like I said before, I don't believe that we're going to get anything close to socialized medicine. Probably going to be a mixed bag of tax credits, mandating coverage, and a nation wide health insurance exchange that will allow me to buy a policy from VA or CA or MA... somewhere with cheaper insurance than NY. The net effect is more competition will drive down prices.

Did you take some LSD? Damn your school really failed you...but that's a topic for another thread.
Medicare has all sorts of problems, finacial, and proper care for the elderly...damn do a little research. Look at the Veterans Administration Hospitals, if you want to see our government at work. You better wake up to reality before it bites you in the butt.
You are "hoping" that you get the kind of insurance that your talking about. "Hope" is for church on Sundays. This administration isn't going with the tax credits. I wish they would, and it wouldn't affect me the way it's going to. Dude, you really do need to get a grip on what Obama is talking about. His plan will push my healthcare out of business

 

[driveby]

WTF ? Medicare is in shambles ........

 

[Fraulein Hilda]

Mandating coverage = making people buy insurance who don't want it.

No tyrannical fist of government here.

 

[Seraega]

Medicare is hardly in shambles. It's funding is running low, and the medicare drug plan was basically corporate welfare... but overall my statistic that medicare overhead is less than 3% is accurate AND it beats the hell out of private industry.

 

[Oddball]

Not sure what planet you're on but here on Earth, the government has already proven capable of running medical insurance. Medicare has less than 3% overhead compared to the private sector which averages 30%... Unfortunately, like I said before, I don't believe that we're going to get anything close to socialized medicine. Probably going to be a mixed bag of tax credits, mandating coverage, and a nation wide health insurance exchange that will allow me to buy a policy from VA or CA or MA... somewhere with cheaper insurance than NY. The net effect is more competition will drive down prices.

Now, I'm sure you're on crack.

What do Medicare/Medicaid cost today, versus what they were projected to cost 40-odd years ago??

And you can forget the idea of out-of-state shoping for insurance...The various HMOs and Blue Cross have the various state legislatures well bribed to prevent that from happenoing.

 

[Seraega]

Mandating coverage = making people buy insurance who don't want it.

No tyrannical fist of government here.

Mandating car insurance must be tyrannical too... or is it tyrannical to smash into somebody with your gigantic Hummer and pull out your pocket lint as payment since you're too greedy to pony up for a decent insurance policy?

 

[Fraulein Hilda]

Private healthcare has dozens more benefits to administer than Medicare.

And Medicare shifts costs to private healthcare.

 

[Meister]

Mandating coverage = making people buy insurance who don't want it.

No tyrannical fist of government here.

Mandating car insurance must be tyrannical too... or is it tyrannical to smash into somebody with your gigantic Hummer and pull out your pocket lint as payment since you're too greedy to pony up for a decent insurance policy?

Driving a car is a priviledge, you don't have to drive. But, if your alive, you do need healthcare

 

[Fraulein Hilda]

Mandating coverage = making people buy insurance who don't want it.

No tyrannical fist of government here.

Mandating car insurance must be tyrannical too... or is it tyrannical to smash into somebody with your gigantic Hummer and pull out your pocket lint as payment since you're too greedy to pony up for a decent insurance policy?

Young healthy people don't want to buy insurance. They are not smashing anything into anyone.

But at least we have gotten beyond the little fib that government won't force people to make health care decisions they would not have already made.

 

[Oddball]

Mandating coverage = making people buy insurance who don't want it.

No tyrannical fist of government here.

Mandating car insurance must be tyrannical too... or is it tyrannical to smash into somebody with your gigantic Hummer and pull out your pocket lint as payment since you're too greedy to pony up for a decent insurance policy?

Apples and atom bombs.

Auto insurance covers you in case you damage another's person or property....It doesn't cover your car for oil changes and new tires.

 

[Seraega]

Private healthcare has dozens more benefits to administer than Medicare.

And Medicare shifts costs to private healthcare.

You're right, the private sector has a unique plan for every single employer or individual. So when a claim comes in you can't just rubber stamp it and issue a check for 80% of the cost... you have to go into your records, see what plan this customer has, how much that plan pays (if anything!) and then calculate whatever discount you have for that specific doctor... THEN finally after wasting about 5 minutes you can cut a check. Medicare took about 10 seconds to settle, private insurance, 5 minutes. Geeeeeeee, that sure looks like government waste to me.

 

[Seraega]

Mandating coverage = making people buy insurance who don't want it.

No tyrannical fist of government here.

Mandating car insurance must be tyrannical too... or is it tyrannical to smash into somebody with your gigantic Hummer and pull out your pocket lint as payment since you're too greedy to pony up for a decent insurance policy?

Apples and atom bombs.

Auto insurance covers you in case you damage another's person or property....It doesn't cover your car for oil changes and new tires.

No argument here. This is one of the big problems with medical insurance. It's not really insurance........ insurance is supposed to cover a disaster, not routine maintenance. Unfortunately, like I said before- for individuals in NY it's 1 size fits all, that size costs $510 per person and is not anything close to resembling a product that I'd want to buy.

 

[Oddball]

You're right, the private sector has a unique plan for every single employer or individual. So when a claim comes in you can't just rubber stamp it and issue a check for 80% of the cost... you have to go into your records, see what plan this customer has, how much that plan pays (if anything!) and then calculate whatever discount you have for that specific doctor... THEN finally after wasting about 5 minutes you can cut a check. Medicare took about 10 seconds to settle, private insurance, 5 minutes. Geeeeeeee, that sure looks like government waste to me.

Another brain dead argument that presumes everybody has (or at least should have) a third-party payer for their medical services.

A lot of people skip all that crap and pay cash.

 

[Fraulein Hilda]

No, the private sector covers more than old people's medical and outpatient benefits.

And that 20% gets billed to somebody else.

You should feel lucky to live in a country where you can buy a health plan that works for you, and not the statists who give you no choices with your healthcare.

 

[Meister]

Private healthcare has dozens more benefits to administer than Medicare.

And Medicare shifts costs to private healthcare.

You're right, the private sector has a unique plan for every single employer or individual. So when a claim comes in you can't just rubber stamp it and issue a check for 80% of the cost... you have to go into your records, see what plan this customer has, how much that plan pays (if anything!) and then calculate whatever discount you have for that specific doctor... THEN finally after wasting about 5 minutes you can cut a check. Medicare took about 10 seconds to settle, private insurance, 5 minutes. Geeeeeeee, that sure looks like government waste to me.

Your in denial, and you can't admit that your wrong. Like I said, look at the VA Hospitals and tell me how good the government can run healthcare.