Rittenhouse ordered to stand trial

[Fort Fun Indiana]

"The apparent ease between law enforcement officials and members of the militia was apparent from cellphone video shot that night, however.

Video shot by McGinnis shows that at 11:30 p.m., about 15 minutes before Rittenhouse killed Rosenbaum and Huber, a law enforcement official in an armored vehicle gave him water and thanked him for his presence there that night.

Multiple news agencies reported the exchange, which can be seen in the video below from CBS Chicago. Warning: The footage below contains graphic images.

“Hey, thank you guys (unintelligible). You need water? Seriously. (Unintelligible) You need water?” the officer asks, according to USA Today.

“We need water,” Rittenhouse responds.

“We’ll throw you one,” the officer says.

The officer apparently pauses to order someone else to disperse from the area, citing the person’s civilian status. He returns his attention to Rittenhouse.

“We got a couple. We’ve got to save a couple, but we’ll give you a couple,” the officer tells the teen. “We appreciate you guys, we really do.”

A moment later, an officer is heard over a loudspeaker.

“You’re going to have to get out of there. This is the last warning,” the officer announces. “You’re going to have to move south or you’re going to have to get out of this block. This is the last warning. You will disperse.”

Kenosha timeline: Court docs detail shooter Kyle Rittenhouse’s actions on night of protesters’ killings

A criminal complaint filed Thursday in Wisconsin lays out in detail the timeline and actions of Kyle Rittenhouse, the 17-year-old accused of killing two men and seriously wounding a third

www.fox13memphis.com

 

[Correll]

Oh? You have these kinds of arguments with people face to face? I don't, but then I associate with very few conservatives. And the ones I do know aren't crazies like you conservative posting here

I've certainly discussed these topic with people in real life, and my positions are the same.


If anyone as much of an asshole as you lefty zealots.


I don't get off on being an asshole, like you obviously do.

 

[Correll]

You also don't necessarily chase someone to kill them.

Possibly not kill. Certainly the intent was hostile and violent. If the jury is full of real people instead of lefty zealots, and they are not lied to be the court, Rittenhouse will be found innocent.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Possibly not kill. Certainly the intent was hostile and violent. If the jury is full of real people instead of lefty zealots, and they are not lied to be the court, Rittenhouse will be found innocent.

Already queueing up the preemptive conspiracy fantasies for when, as per usual, reality does not align with your bizarre fantasies.

 

[Correll]

Already queueing up the preemptive conspiracy fantasies for when, as per usual, reality does not align with your bizarre fantasies.

The way you lefties abuse your positions based on ideology, is not conspiracy fantasy but simply common knowledge.


You know it. I know it. YOu just choose to lie about it.

 

[freyasman]

Interesting. In the Military we had rules of engagement. Those rules were decided by our higher ups, eventually with the political figures. The ones you seem to detest in this case.

Those rules determined when it was right and legal to kill someone, and when it wasn’t. You followed orders, or you faced the consequences.

When I got my briefing before we went north into Iraq, it was pretty simple. I can summarize it pretty easily.

If it is a tank, kill it. If it is a truck, kill it. If it is a soldier holding a weapon, kill him. But do not fire on unarmed people. We don’t do that.

Now, recognizing that sometimes even unarmed people are a threat, I can sort of see the need for force when the baddie is unarmed, but again, I keep coming back to the set up.

Self Defense always has something in common when it is approved by the Courts and Juries. That is the idea that the individual using the force in self defense was not doing anything wrong. Take Zimmerman and Trevon. Yes, Zimmerman acted stupidly. Incredibly stupidly. He should have waited for the cops the way the dispatcher told him to. But he did not commit a crime in going into the apartment complex. He was not committing a crime. So the Jury found him not guilty. Self defense, even if caused by incredible stupidity was a valid excuse.

Same state. A man shouts at a woman in a car in the handicapped parking spot of a convenience store. Her Boyfriend comes out and shoves the guy away from her.

Guy who gets knocked down pulls a gun, and the person who shoved him backs away, and is shot and killed. The jury rejected self defense. The guy was acting just as stupidly as Zimmerman. Getting involved in things that are none of his business, and was “attacked”. The attack could be seen as defending his family, but it should have stopped when the “attacker” backed off.

The Jury found there was no threat at the time the shots were fired, so no self defense.

Right now the McMichaels are in jail, because the Prosecutors and the Judges are in agreement, there is probable cause to believe it was not a self defense shooting. Here, like with Rittenhouse, other crimes were committed. And those crimes eliminate the valid legal and moral argument for self defense. At least so far in the case of the McMichaels. We’ll have to wait for the Jury, but I’d put money on them being found guilty.

That’s why I think that Kyle is in a lot of trouble and likely, but not certainly, going to be convicted. Because it is the jury who is going to hear how Kyle broke the law, and didn’t just act stupidly, but broke laws in the process of acting stupidly.

The idea that they’ll see him as some hero is pretty slim IMO. And that is what this entire debate is all about. Right now we are debating if he should or will be viewed as a hero. Finding twelve people who think that way for the jury would be a challenge. You might get one, but how likely is it that one will affect the outcome?

Possibly a hung jury and a retrial. But in the end I think he’ll be found guilty. Because his claim of self defense is weakened by his own criminal actions preceding the shooting. Just as the McMichael’s claim of self defense is lacking because of their own criminal actions.

You may think it’s past time for a revolution. I’m sure you can find some people online who think the same way, but they aren’t acting are they? They aren’t doing anything but shouting and screaming. Because a vast majority don’t agree.

That’s why you don’t want the trial, because you know the jury is probably going to find him guilty. And the hero will serve as a lesson, that you should mind your own business and stay the fuck out of those areas. Instead of another hero, you’re left with at Martyr at best. In a decade, he’ll fade from public consciousness, and the only people who remember him will be those like myself who remember a great deal, like Randy Weaver. A vast majority have forgotten him. And how many remember the Bundy’s of Nevada?

Just for the record, I know nothing about the McMichaels you keep on referring to, and I don't care either.

And my ROE briefing was: "You're all NCOs; if you think he needs shooting, shoot him."



We're not debating whether or not he's a hero, that's just you trying to re-frame the discussion to your own advantage.

We're discussing whether or not he was acting in self-defense.

I believe he was. So do a lot of other people.
And it only takes one of us on the jury.

 

[JoeB131]

E6..... and then I punched a guy out. LOL

Read "Landigal", by James Christ; I'm not mentioned, but I was a squad leader in one of the other platoons there when those guys got their shit pushed in.

Funny, I made it to E-6 and never manated to punch anyone out. But that's what happens when you are an adult. You seem to be a case of arrested development.

 

[AZrailwhale]

The problem is with all vigilante actions. They are always in violation of the law. And as such lose their legitimacy and moral authority.

Vigilantism is what happens when the law stops working for the common man.

 

[JoeB131]

Vigilantism is what happens when the law stops working for the common man.

Funny, I'm sure the rioters thought the same thing.

 

[freyasman]

Funny, I made it to E-6 and never manated to punch anyone out. But that's what happens when you are an adult. You seem to be a case of arrested development.

Did you ever have a guy lose his shit on a night patrol in the Korengal Valley and give away your position to the jihadis that had been hunting your patrol down for the last 2 days?

No, right?

What was your MOS, cook or something? Recruiter, maybe?

 

[freyasman]

Funny, I'm sure the rioters thought the same thing.

No, they were just out to set fires and fuck shit up.

The protestors, the ones who were actually there to protest, probably thought that though...... but when the sun went down they left the streets to the rioter's mob.

 

[JoeB131]

Did you ever have a guy lose his shit on a night patrol in the Korengal Valley and give away your position to the jihadis that had been hunting your patrol down for the last 2 days?

No, right?

What was your MOS, cook or something? Recruiter, maybe?

Actually, Supply, but that's not the point, is it.

Your made up war stories aside, the point is you lost your cool in a combat situation and struck one of your men. That's kind of fucked up.

 

[JoeB131]

No, they were just out to set fires and fuck shit up.

The protestors, the ones who were actually there to protest, probably thought that though...... but when the sun went down they left the streets to the rioter's mob.

here's the problem with that, buddy. The Protestors have been peacefully protesting police misconduct for a decade now.

Remember this guy?

Sadly, people only seem to give a shit when you threaten to burn their stuff. Shouldn't be like that. We should have moved to institute police reform when the first one of these incidents happened....

We didn't. People finally got fed up and rioted. Our own damned fault.

 

[freyasman]

Actually, Supply, but that's not the point, is it.

Your made up war stories aside, the point is you lost your cool in a combat situation and struck one of your men. That's kind of fucked up.

One, you're not combat arms and don't know shit.
And two, I didn't lose it, he did, and when he got busted in his mouth, he settled right down and started acting right for the rest of the patrol. Son of a bitch was just sandbagging the whole time.

Only reason anyone ever said shit was the higher ups were getting investigated for being fuck ups and needed someone to throw under a bus, and here's this mean assed peckerwood SSG saying "Yeah, I knocked some sense into him, so what?"
Boom..... instant sacrifice. Because all that shit about loyalty and brotherhood and taking care of your men is just a bunch of horseshit.






These are the sort of career hazards some of us faced while you supply bitches were sitting pretty back at the FOB and sucking off the 1st SGT to make rank.

 

[freyasman]

here's the problem with that, buddy. The Protestors have been peacefully protesting police misconduct for a decade now.

Remember this guy?

View attachment 523105

Sadly, people only seem to give a shit when you threaten to burn their stuff. Shouldn't be like that. We should have moved to institute police reform when the first one of these incidents happened....

We didn't. People finally got fed up and rioted. Our own damned fault.

Blame to go round on that one.

 

[JoeB131]

One, you're not combat arms and don't know shit.
And two, I didn't lose it, he did, and when he got busted in his mouth, he settled right down and started acting right for the rest of the patrol. Son of a bitch was just sandbagging the whole time.

Only reason anyone ever said shit was the higher ups were getting investigated for being fuck ups and needed someone to throw under a bus, and here's this mean assed peckerwood SSG saying "Yeah, I knocked some sense into him, so what?"
Boom..... instant sacrifice. Because all that shit about loyalty and brotherhood and taking care of your men is just a bunch of horseshit.

These are the sort of career hazards some of us faced while you supply bitches were sitting pretty back at the FOB and sucking off the 1st SGT to make rank.

That sounds like a lot of rationalization for some very poor professionalism on your part.

Of course, my MOS actually required brains and the ability to do math, so there's that, but I make it a rule to never run down anyone who served.

That said, it sounds like someone in your squad was upset enough about your behavior to report you

 

[freyasman]

That sounds like a lot of rationalization for some very poor professionalism on your part.

Of course, my MOS actually required brains and the ability to do math, so there's that, but I make it a rule to never run down anyone who served.

That said, it sounds like someone in your squad was upset enough about your behavior to report you

I just love the way I'm being second-guessed by a guy who never left the wire in his life, lol.

As far as being reported, it's not like I was hiding anything. I had went off on the chain of command for refusing to UCMJ this shitbag and a couple others weeks previously. Their bullshit was endangering the whole platoon; I had caught them sleeping on guard during a patrol and trying to sham out of leaving the wire entirely on more than one occasion.


What's the biggest dilemma you ever faced, no ice cream at the chow hall?







Pussy.

 

[JoeB131]

I just love the way I'm being second-guessed by a guy who never left the wire in his life, lol.

As far as being reported, it's not like I was hiding anything. I had went off on the chain of command for refusing to UCMJ this shitbag and a couple others weeks previously. Their bullshit was endangering the whole platoon; I had caught them sleeping on guard during a patrol and trying to sham out of leaving the wire entirely on more than one occasion.

Hmmm... men panicking in the field and sleeping on guard duty? Kind of sounds like poor leadership on your part.

I rarely had an issue with my section not doing exactly what they were supposed to. I gave clear direction to them and set clear expectations...

What's the biggest dilemma you ever faced, no ice cream at the chow hall?

Let see now. BIggest problem I ever faced was a bunch of Officers deciding that they could ignore the rules on handling of Class V supply because it was too much paperwork to return training ammo, and we ended up with a lot more than we needed. I went toe-to-toe with the battalion HQ officers, pointing out to them in the regulations EXACTLY what we should be doing. I put everything in writing to make sure my backside was covered.

Turns out I was totally vindicated when some idiot hid some training ammo in his trunk during an inspection, and then got pulled over. Now, my unit (an infantry battallion) was never in combat while I served with it in the 80's, but this funny thing, if it had been, the most vulnerable guy is the guy driving the supply truck from the BSA to the FOB.

The way I look at it, the most important people in the unit are the logistics people. Wars aren't won without logistics... period.

 

[freyasman]

Hmmm... men panicking in the field and sleeping on guard duty? Kind of sounds like poor leadership on your part.

I rarely had an issue with my section not doing exactly what they were supposed to. I gave clear direction to them and set clear expectations...




Let see now. BIggest problem I ever faced was a bunch of Officers deciding that they could ignore the rules on handling of Class V supply because it was too much paperwork to return training ammo, and we ended up with a lot more than we needed. I went toe-to-toe with the battalion HQ officers, pointing out to them in the regulations EXACTLY what we should be doing. I put everything in writing to make sure my backside was covered.

Turns out I was totally vindicated when some idiot hid some training ammo in his trunk during an inspection, and then got pulled over. Now, my unit (an infantry battallion) was never in combat while I served with it in the 80's, but this funny thing, if it had been, the most vulnerable guy is the guy driving the supply truck from the BSA to the FOB.

The way I look at it, the most important people in the unit are the logistics people. Wars aren't won without logistics... period.

I know more about logistics than your pogue ass ever will.
Infantrymen are a resource, you fucking clueless idiot. When one or more of them isn't working, you DX his ass.


It was poor leadership all right but not on my part...... I was the guy getting in the CO and the 1st SGT's faces demanding to know why these guys weren't being Article 15'd or court martialed for dereliction of duty or refusing to follow orders.
And they retaliated by doing nothing and ordering me back outside the wire they almost never left themselves, with these same guys hoping the jihadis would finally get lucky and kill my ass.


Read the book, fucktard.

 

[M14 Shooter]

So nothing preceding the actual shooting is relevant in your mind. Ok.

Under WI law, as soon as Rittenhouse disengaes, his right to self-defense resets.
It doesn't matter what he said to anyone - as soon as he runs, he can defense himself.
To believe otherwise is to believe the people chasing him with the intent to do harm had the right to do so.

Who do you believe the people chasing him with the intent to do harm had the right to do so.

Explain why we don’t allow an armed robber to claim self defense for shooting the clerk? The robbery is irrelevant. The possession of the weapon is irrelevant. The only relevant facts are the clerk tried to attack the robber. Self defense. Turn him loose right?

Non seq. Feel free to try again,