Should Churches be forced to accomodate for homosexual weddings?

[Skylar]

The fear is that the social con far right wants to exclude people from its concept of marriage when everyone else, from responsible right to far left, want every adult couple to share the right to marriage equality. Beagle9's way is anti-American, period.

No beagles way is American, but the new way is something foreign to what America always was, and in many peoples minds still should be on some of these issues, but the strategies of those who push these foreign concepts on everyone now, has been I must say clever to say the least.

It doesn't make it right still, but clever it definitely has been for sure.

Nope. Most Americans are no where near that whiny or desperate to be victims.

 

[Silhouette]

I love shutting Jake down..

That is not what Windsor says; Sil is being ludicrous and is becoming even more desperate.

United States v. Windsor

Opinion page 14
"And so New York recognized same-sex marriages performed elsewhere; and then it later amended its own marriage laws to permit same-sex marriage. New York, in common with, as of this writing, 11 other States and the District of Columbia, decided that same-sex couples should have the right to marry....After a statewide deliberative process that enabled its citizens to discuss and weigh arguments for and against same-sex marriage, New York acted to enlarge the definition of marriage... By history and tradition the definition and regulation of marriage, as will be discussed in more detail, has been treated as being within the authority and realm of the separate States.."

 

[Skylar]

Who would have ever thought that the founding documents and system created in this nation, would have not been created in a way that would keep people from exploiting it in the way that it is being exploited right now today in America? It's a sad day for America, and for the future of this nation's Christian beliefs and/or teachings that were a huge part of America's founding and it's future from that point onward. This nation now has people who can tell you that up is down and down is up, and then make you a believer of that very ridiculous thinking anymore. WOW!

So the fear is for the judges now, is that they are so power hungry themselves, that they would throw away their principles for fear of being challenged over them simply remaining in their job's ? Is this the weakness that is smelled coming from the bench now in every courtroom across America anymore ?

Lower court judges are no more powerful than the system's rules they belong to. In pretending that states had to violate their public's consensus limiting marriage to man/woman, several lower court judges actually attempted to overrule Windsor 2013 from underneath; which is prohibited.

No they didn't, Silo. Remember, you don't know how the law works. There's no provision of the Windsor ruling that any lower court overruled. Windsor never even mentions gay marriage bans, let alone affirms their constitutionality. You simply ignore those portions of the Windsor ruling that you don't like. Such as.....

Subject to certain constitutional guarantees, see, e.g., Loving v. Virginia, 388 U. S. 1, “regulation of domestic relations” is “an area that has long been regarded as a virtually exclusive province of the States,” Sosna v. Iowa, 419 U. S. 393.

Windsor v. US

You always try to pretend that no state marriage laws are subject to constitutional guarantees. Which is silly, as all State laws are subject to constitutional guarantees. And every lower court ruling that overturned gay marriage bans did so on the basis of the violation of those guarantees.

You know, the guarantees you pretend don't exist.

The Big Legal Secret is that those decisions aren't worth the paper they're written on: and neither are the marriage licenses issued in those states to same-sex people, in violation of the statewide-consensus' Will in those states.

And by 'Big Legal Secret', you mean the latest piece of pseudo-legal gibberish you made up?

If the lower court rulings overturning gay marriage aren't worth the paper they are printed on.....then why did the USSC preserve ever single one of them?

Windsor's Finding on a specific question of law was that 11 states had legal "gay marriage" because their statewide legal process made that so; and that is how it must be and the fed must respect that until further notice.

Where does the Windsor ruling state 'that is how it must be' regarding state wide legal processes?

Nowhere. You imagined it.

There has been no further notice on the merits of any challenge to that Finding. Only SCOTUS may overturn itself on a specific question of law. As has been pointed out to me several times, granting of stays without explanation is not a Finding on the merits.

As usual, Silo.....you have no idea what you're talking about. You don't even know what a 'finding' is. A finding is a decision based on a question of fact. The question posed to the Windsor court had nothing to with the applicability of State law. But the applicability of Federal law.

The Windsor court never ruled on the constitutionality of gay marriage bans or even mentioned them. You've imagined it. They ruled on the applicability of the Federal Defense of Marriage finding that Section 3 of the Defense of Marriage Act is unconstitutional as a deprivation of the equal liberty of persons that is protected by the Fifth Amendment.

You simply have no idea what you're talking about.

I love shutting Jake down..

And I rather enjoy shutting you down. You'd be shocked at how little effort it takes.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Should gays be FORCED to accommodate Christian weddings? I don't know what that means, but turn about is fair play. Given that Homosexuality is just sexual dysfunction not mentioned in the constitution, religion IS, I don't think churches should have to be made to accommodate perverts. Nope.

The far right social cons are religious perverts, without a doubt.

Not to worry, MaryL, the thirteen people that want churches to marry folks they don't want to marry won't make it happen.

 

[JakeStarkey]

PA laws exist with the consent of the governed. Are you saying that you don't have to follow any law that you don't agree with?

Last I checked consent was no where in the room when these new things that are yes new did arise in our midst, and then the laws are merely being adopted by those things in which to club another over the head with them.

Do you believe that laws passed by your elected representatives are not passed with your implicit consent? That in our representative Democracy, that we delegate our vote to our representatives and that they 'represent' us when they cast their votes?

Maybe once upon a time they represented us, and they honored our wishes given them upon our consent for them to represent us on such wishes, and then upon our asking of them to do so, but not anymore they don't. They look at us as fools anymore, and they look at us now as if we can't find our way any longer, so they have to find it for us. WHAT HAPPENED?

I am sorry that you feel like your representatives do not represent the wishes of you and your fellow citizens.

My Senators and Congresswoman represents my concerns fairly well- as do my state legislators. Sure I disagree from time to time- but there are others who do agree.

I believe in the power of the ballot- even though I was not happy at the overall results of the last election- certainly those who got elected did so because the persons voting for them thought they would represent their interests- I am happy the elections took place and show our Constitutional system in action.

Bullshit, you audacious liar!

You do NOT believe in the ballot box, you or any of your little faggot friends. Pushing your perverted agenda through the courts showed a special contempt for the democratic process. You didn't prevail upon hearts and minds, you didn't bow before the expressed will of the people, you overturned democracy through ideologue hack judges who themselves will go to hell just like you.

Stop lying, faggots!

Shut your pie hole, your far right social con religious pervert.

That you don't understand how our government and political systems work means we have to listen to your pissing and moaning.

Yes, it's constitutional, yes, it's appropriate, and, yes, you are wrong.

 

[JakeStarkey]

That's your opinion. My opinion the election of 2016 will not effect this summer's ruling at all. The Senate Dems, narrow majority or narrow minority, and several Pubs will prevent the appointments of SCOTUS candidates who have given any indication they do not accept marriage equality.

Yeah, right...because politicians haven't been paying attention to Chic-Fil-a, Boycott A&E's million "likes" on Facebook in less than 24 hours and this poll at the top of this page..

Keep dreaming. I am pretty sure they are focusing on more credible polling/internal numbers and not lines at a food food joint, "likes" on Facebook, and a random internet poll. The fact you have to use these examples only highlights your desperation.

The fact that you have to use polls instead of allowing the peoples vote to stand or be held, shows your desperation.

Your desperation is showing, beagle.

 

[Skylar]

That's your opinion. My opinion the election of 2016 will not effect this summer's ruling at all. The Senate Dems, narrow majority or narrow minority, and several Pubs will prevent the appointments of SCOTUS candidates who have given any indication they do not accept marriage equality.

Yeah, right...because politicians haven't been paying attention to Chic-Fil-a, Boycott A&E's million "likes" on Facebook in less than 24 hours and this poll at the top of this page..

The pols have been reading this for grins and giggles. Your poll is a farce as you well know.

The pols have been following the Courts, the polling, the argumentation. In no way, shape, or form are they going to try to overturn the ruling. They know they would be voted out of office in many districts.

The tide for marriage equality has turned in favor the last five years.

Who would have ever thought that the founding documents and system created in this nation, would have not been created in a way that would keep people from exploiting it in the way that it is being exploited right now today in America? It's a sad day for America, and for the future of this nation's Christian beliefs and/or teachings that were a huge part of America's founding and it's future from that point onward. This nation now has people who can tell you that up is down and down is up, and then make you a believer of that very ridiculous thinking anymore. WOW!

Or...that Christians are expected to follow the same laws as everyone else.

 

[JakeStarkey]

And Sil, who is stupid enough to contradict me on Windsor by taking bits of it our of contradiction, gets her butt kicked by Sklyar in correction.

Sil can't abstract, simply is a concrete learner. Put it in her head, settles like concrete.

It's a good day to be American.

 

[Syriusly]

PA laws exist with the consent of the governed. Are you saying that you don't have to follow any law that you don't agree with?

Last I checked consent was no where in the room when these new things that are yes new did arise in our midst, and then the laws are merely being adopted by those things in which to club another over the head with them.

Do you believe that laws passed by your elected representatives are not passed with your implicit consent? That in our representative Democracy, that we delegate our vote to our representatives and that they 'represent' us when they cast their votes?

Maybe once upon a time they represented us, and they honored our wishes given them upon our consent for them to represent us on such wishes, and then upon our asking of them to do so, but not anymore they don't. They look at us as fools anymore, and they look at us now as if we can't find our way any longer, so they have to find it for us. WHAT HAPPENED?

I am sorry that you feel like your representatives do not represent the wishes of you and your fellow citizens.

My Senators and Congresswoman represents my concerns fairly well- as do my state legislators. Sure I disagree from time to time- but there are others who do agree.

I believe in the power of the ballot- even though I was not happy at the overall results of the last election- certainly those who got elected did so because the persons voting for them thought they would represent their interests- I am happy the elections took place and show our Constitutional system in action.

Bullshit, you audacious liar!

You do NOT believe in the ballot box, you or any of your little faggot friends. Pushing your perverted agenda through the courts showed a special contempt for the democratic process. You didn't prevail upon hearts and minds, you didn't bow before the expressed will of the people, you overturned democracy through ideologue hack judges who themselves will go to hell just like you.

Stop lying, faggots!

LOL- you reek of desperation.

Among the 'perverted agenda' that has been pushed through the courts:

- the right to remain silent
- the right for all children to equal public education regardless of their race
- the right to an attorney
- the right to marriage
- the right for a mixed race couple to marry
- the right to privacy
- the right to use contraception
- the right for adults to have private consensual sex
- and in many states- the right to marry a person of the same gender.

I believe in the Constitution- and the Constitution provides for a legislative process that I am proud to participate in- I vote for my representatives and I vote for referendums.

But all such laws are subject to the Constitution- and every American has the right to appeal to the courts for redress against what they believe is an unconstitutional law- whether that is a Christian baker or a gay couple.

Bigots like yourself- shouting "f*ggots' or 'n*gger' or 'c*nts' at the people you hate just show how little and petty you are.

I can't predict what the Supreme Court will rule- but assuming that they rule in favor of marriage equality, I look forward with great anticipation to your mental and emotional outburst here on the boards, and how you will call the court 'F*ggot lovers' just like racists called them 'n*gger lovers' when they ruled against race laws.

 

[Syriusly]

That is not what Windsor says; Sil is being ludicrous and is becoming even more desperate.

United States v. Windsor

Opinion page 14
"And so New York recognized same-sex marriages performed elsewhere; and then it later amended its own marriage laws to permit same-sex marriage. New York, in common with, as of this writing, 11 other States and the District of Columbia, decided that same-sex couples should have the right to marry....After a statewide deliberative process that enabled its citizens to discuss and weigh arguments for and against same-sex marriage, New York acted to enlarge the definition of marriage... By history and tradition the definition and regulation of marriage, as will be discussed in more detail, has been treated as being within the authority and realm of the separate States.."

Or we could actually read the conclusion

The class to which DOMA directs its restrictions and restraints are those persons who are joined in same-sex marriages made lawful by the State. DOMA singles out a class of persons deemed by a State entitled to recognition and protection to enhance their own liberty. It imposes a disability on the class by refusing to acknowledge a status the State finds to be dignified and proper. DOMA instructs all federal officials, and indeed all persons with whom same-sex couples interact, including their own children, that their marriage is less worthy than the marriages of others. The federal statute is invalid, for no legitimate purpose overcomes the purpose and effect to disparage and to injure those whom the State, by its marriage laws, sought to protect in personhood and dignity. By seeking to displace this protection and treating those persons as living in marriages less respected than others, the federal statute is in violation of the Fifth Amendment. This opinion and its holding are confined to those lawful marriages.

The judgment of the Court of Appeals for the Second Circuit is affirmed.

It is so ordered.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Sil is a liar.

Sil is increasingly showing desperation.

SCOTUS will rule for it, and the without a doubt the nation as defined by the majority of citizens will uphold that ruling.

 

[saintmichaeldefendthem]

Last I checked consent was no where in the room when these new things that are yes new did arise in our midst, and then the laws are merely being adopted by those things in which to club another over the head with them.

Do you believe that laws passed by your elected representatives are not passed with your implicit consent? That in our representative Democracy, that we delegate our vote to our representatives and that they 'represent' us when they cast their votes?

Maybe once upon a time they represented us, and they honored our wishes given them upon our consent for them to represent us on such wishes, and then upon our asking of them to do so, but not anymore they don't. They look at us as fools anymore, and they look at us now as if we can't find our way any longer, so they have to find it for us. WHAT HAPPENED?

I am sorry that you feel like your representatives do not represent the wishes of you and your fellow citizens.

My Senators and Congresswoman represents my concerns fairly well- as do my state legislators. Sure I disagree from time to time- but there are others who do agree.

I believe in the power of the ballot- even though I was not happy at the overall results of the last election- certainly those who got elected did so because the persons voting for them thought they would represent their interests- I am happy the elections took place and show our Constitutional system in action.

Bullshit, you audacious liar!

You do NOT believe in the ballot box, you or any of your little faggot friends. Pushing your perverted agenda through the courts showed a special contempt for the democratic process. You didn't prevail upon hearts and minds, you didn't bow before the expressed will of the people, you overturned democracy through ideologue hack judges who themselves will go to hell just like you.

Stop lying, faggots!

LOL- you reek of desperation.

Among the 'perverted agenda' that has been pushed through the courts:

- the right to remain silent
- the right for all children to equal public education regardless of their race
- the right to an attorney
- the right to marriage
- the right for a mixed race couple to marry
- the right to privacy
- the right to use contraception
- the right for adults to have private consensual sex
- and in many states- the right to marry a person of the same gender.

I believe in the Constitution- and the Constitution provides for a legislative process that I am proud to participate in- I vote for my representatives and I vote for referendums.

But all such laws are subject to the Constitution- and every American has the right to appeal to the courts for redress against what they believe is an unconstitutional law- whether that is a Christian baker or a gay couple.

Bigots like yourself- shouting "f*ggots' or 'n*gger' or 'c*nts' at the people you hate just show how little and petty you are.

I can't predict what the Supreme Court will rule- but assuming that they rule in favor of marriage equality, I look forward with great anticipation to your mental and emotional outburst here on the boards, and how you will call the court 'F*ggot lovers' just like racists called them 'n*gger lovers' when they ruled against race laws.

You believe in democracy until you don't get your way. It's as simple as that. You're no better than the conservatives that pushed DOMA.

 

[beagle9]

That's your opinion. My opinion the election of 2016 will not effect this summer's ruling at all. The Senate Dems, narrow majority or narrow minority, and several Pubs will prevent the appointments of SCOTUS candidates who have given any indication they do not accept marriage equality.

Yeah, right...because politicians haven't been paying attention to Chic-Fil-a, Boycott A&E's million "likes" on Facebook in less than 24 hours and this poll at the top of this page..

The pols have been reading this for grins and giggles. Your poll is a farce as you well know.

The pols have been following the Courts, the polling, the argumentation. In no way, shape, or form are they going to try to overturn the ruling. They know they would be voted out of office in many districts.

The tide for marriage equality has turned in favor the last five years.

Who would have ever thought that the founding documents and system created in this nation, would have not been created in a way that would keep people from exploiting it in the way that it is being exploited right now today in America? It's a sad day for America, and for the future of this nation's Christian beliefs and/or teachings that were a huge part of America's founding and it's future from that point onward. This nation now has people who can tell you that up is down and down is up, and then make you a believer of that very ridiculous thinking anymore. WOW!

Or...that Christians are expected to follow the same laws as everyone else.

How do Christians practice what they preach anymore then, and where are they allowed to practice what they preach in their lives ? They teach their children that homosexuality is a sin right, and they are not going to end that teaching, so what do you do with the millions of up and coming citizens who don't believe in Gay Marriage or even being gay at all ? What, maybe lock them all away until they are changed by the government somehow ? I mean how does it play out between all the religious and non-religious groups in this nation in the future, otherwise I mean one has to wonder about such things right ? Can they all co-exist by themselves or does the government have to force it all somehow ?

If the government has to force it all, then I guess we have been seeing a preview of that right ?

 

[Skylar]

That's your opinion. My opinion the election of 2016 will not effect this summer's ruling at all. The Senate Dems, narrow majority or narrow minority, and several Pubs will prevent the appointments of SCOTUS candidates who have given any indication they do not accept marriage equality.

Yeah, right...because politicians haven't been paying attention to Chic-Fil-a, Boycott A&E's million "likes" on Facebook in less than 24 hours and this poll at the top of this page..

The pols have been reading this for grins and giggles. Your poll is a farce as you well know.

The pols have been following the Courts, the polling, the argumentation. In no way, shape, or form are they going to try to overturn the ruling. They know they would be voted out of office in many districts.

The tide for marriage equality has turned in favor the last five years.

Who would have ever thought that the founding documents and system created in this nation, would have not been created in a way that would keep people from exploiting it in the way that it is being exploited right now today in America? It's a sad day for America, and for the future of this nation's Christian beliefs and/or teachings that were a huge part of America's founding and it's future from that point onward. This nation now has people who can tell you that up is down and down is up, and then make you a believer of that very ridiculous thinking anymore. WOW!

Or...that Christians are expected to follow the same laws as everyone else.

How do Christians practice what they preach anymore then, and where are they allowed to practice what they preach in their lives ? They teach their children that homosexuality is a sin right, and they are not going to end that teaching, so what do you do with the millions of up and coming citizens who don't believe in Gay Marriage or even being gay at all ? What, maybe lock them all away until they are changed by the government somehow ? I mean how does it play out between all the religious and non-religious groups in this nation in the future, otherwise I mean one has to wonder about such things right ? Can they all co-exist by themselves or does the government have to force it all somehow ?

If the government has to force it all, then I guess we have been seeing a preview of that right ?

Teach your kids whatever you'd like. And in your business, treat your customers fairly and equally. As the law applies to the same as everyone else.

 

[Syriusly]

Do you believe that laws passed by your elected representatives are not passed with your implicit consent? That in our representative Democracy, that we delegate our vote to our representatives and that they 'represent' us when they cast their votes?

Maybe once upon a time they represented us, and they honored our wishes given them upon our consent for them to represent us on such wishes, and then upon our asking of them to do so, but not anymore they don't. They look at us as fools anymore, and they look at us now as if we can't find our way any longer, so they have to find it for us. WHAT HAPPENED?

I am sorry that you feel like your representatives do not represent the wishes of you and your fellow citizens.

My Senators and Congresswoman represents my concerns fairly well- as do my state legislators. Sure I disagree from time to time- but there are others who do agree.

I believe in the power of the ballot- even though I was not happy at the overall results of the last election- certainly those who got elected did so because the persons voting for them thought they would represent their interests- I am happy the elections took place and show our Constitutional system in action.

Bullshit, you audacious liar!

You do NOT believe in the ballot box, you or any of your little faggot friends. Pushing your perverted agenda through the courts showed a special contempt for the democratic process. You didn't prevail upon hearts and minds, you didn't bow before the expressed will of the people, you overturned democracy through ideologue hack judges who themselves will go to hell just like you.

Stop lying, faggots!

LOL- you reek of desperation.

Among the 'perverted agenda' that has been pushed through the courts:

- the right to remain silent
- the right for all children to equal public education regardless of their race
- the right to an attorney
- the right to marriage
- the right for a mixed race couple to marry
- the right to privacy
- the right to use contraception
- the right for adults to have private consensual sex
- and in many states- the right to marry a person of the same gender.

I believe in the Constitution- and the Constitution provides for a legislative process that I am proud to participate in- I vote for my representatives and I vote for referendums.

But all such laws are subject to the Constitution- and every American has the right to appeal to the courts for redress against what they believe is an unconstitutional law- whether that is a Christian baker or a gay couple.

Bigots like yourself- shouting "f*ggots' or 'n*gger' or 'c*nts' at the people you hate just show how little and petty you are.

I can't predict what the Supreme Court will rule- but assuming that they rule in favor of marriage equality, I look forward with great anticipation to your mental and emotional outburst here on the boards, and how you will call the court 'F*ggot lovers' just like racists called them 'n*gger lovers' when they ruled against race laws.

You believe in democracy until you don't get your way. It's as simple as that. You're no better than the conservatives that pushed DOMA.

I believe in the Constitution- and our representative government. .

Among the 'perverted agenda' that has been pushed through the courts:

- the right to remain silent
- the right for all children to equal public education regardless of their race
- the right to an attorney
- the right to marriage
- the right for a mixed race couple to marry
- the right to privacy
- the right to use contraception
- the right for adults to have private consensual sex
- and in many states- the right to marry a person of the same gender.

I believe in the Constitution- and the Constitution provides for a legislative process that I am proud to participate in- I vote for my representatives and I vote for referendums.

But all such laws are subject to the Constitution- and every American has the right to appeal to the courts for redress against what they believe is an unconstitutional law- whether that is a Christian baker or a gay couple.

Bigots like yourself- shouting "f*ggots' or 'n*gger' or 'c*nts' at the people you hate just show how little and petty you are.

I can't predict what the Supreme Court will rule- but assuming that they rule in favor of marriage equality, I look forward with great anticipation to your mental and emotional outburst here on the boards, and how you will call the court 'F*ggot lovers' just like racists called them 'n*gger lovers' when they ruled against race laws

 

[JakeStarkey]

That's your opinion. My opinion the election of 2016 will not effect this summer's ruling at all. The Senate Dems, narrow majority or narrow minority, and several Pubs will prevent the appointments of SCOTUS candidates who have given any indication they do not accept marriage equality.

Yeah, right...because politicians haven't been paying attention to Chic-Fil-a, Boycott A&E's million "likes" on Facebook in less than 24 hours and this poll at the top of this page..

The pols have been reading this for grins and giggles. Your poll is a farce as you well know.

The pols have been following the Courts, the polling, the argumentation. In no way, shape, or form are they going to try to overturn the ruling. They know they would be voted out of office in many districts.

The tide for marriage equality has turned in favor the last five years.

Who would have ever thought that the founding documents and system created in this nation, would have not been created in a way that would keep people from exploiting it in the way that it is being exploited right now today in America? It's a sad day for America, and for the future of this nation's Christian beliefs and/or teachings that were a huge part of America's founding and it's future from that point onward. This nation now has people who can tell you that up is down and down is up, and then make you a believer of that very ridiculous thinking anymore. WOW!

Or...that Christians are expected to follow the same laws as everyone else.

How do Christians practice what they preach anymore then, and where are they allowed to practice what they preach in their lives ? They teach their children that homosexuality is a sin right, and they are not going to end that teaching, so what do you do with the millions of up and coming citizens who don't believe in Gay Marriage or even being gay at all ? What, maybe lock them all away until they are changed by the government somehow ? I mean how does it play out between all the religious and non-religious groups in this nation in the future, otherwise I mean one has to wonder about such things right ? Can they all co-exist by themselves or does the government have to force it all somehow ?

If the government has to force it all, then I guess we have been seeing a preview of that right ?

You teach that in the secular world and by law each are equal and you treat them that way.

That's what you do.

 

[beagle9]

Yeah, right...because politicians haven't been paying attention to Chic-Fil-a, Boycott A&E's million "likes" on Facebook in less than 24 hours and this poll at the top of this page..

The pols have been reading this for grins and giggles. Your poll is a farce as you well know.

The pols have been following the Courts, the polling, the argumentation. In no way, shape, or form are they going to try to overturn the ruling. They know they would be voted out of office in many districts.

The tide for marriage equality has turned in favor the last five years.

Who would have ever thought that the founding documents and system created in this nation, would have not been created in a way that would keep people from exploiting it in the way that it is being exploited right now today in America? It's a sad day for America, and for the future of this nation's Christian beliefs and/or teachings that were a huge part of America's founding and it's future from that point onward. This nation now has people who can tell you that up is down and down is up, and then make you a believer of that very ridiculous thinking anymore. WOW!

Or...that Christians are expected to follow the same laws as everyone else.

How do Christians practice what they preach anymore then, and where are they allowed to practice what they preach in their lives ? They teach their children that homosexuality is a sin right, and they are not going to end that teaching, so what do you do with the millions of up and coming citizens who don't believe in Gay Marriage or even being gay at all ? What, maybe lock them all away until they are changed by the government somehow ? I mean how does it play out between all the religious and non-religious groups in this nation in the future, otherwise I mean one has to wonder about such things right ? Can they all co-exist by themselves or does the government have to force it all somehow ?

If the government has to force it all, then I guess we have been seeing a preview of that right ?

Teach your kids whatever you'd like. And in your business, treat your customers fairly and equally. As the law applies to the same as everyone else.

You have to ask yourself, how did this nation get to this point now ? If your not asking yourself this, then it could be that you are one of the ones who want everything changed in this nation and/or for everything that is new to be accepted by all in this nation, but is that a reality in the end or a recipe for disaster in the end ?

 

[JakeStarkey]

beagle, you arguing your subjective theology to marriage equality. Unimportant.

The nation is not headed for disaster. You remind of the priest in "The Last Valley", who tortured and burned the woman in order to save her eternally. You, and he, make no sense.

 

[beagle9]

beagle, you arguing your subjective theology to marriage equality. Unimportant.

The nation is not headed for disaster. You remind of the priest in "The Last Valley", who tortured and burned the woman in order to save her eternally. You, and he, make no sense.

You calling it marriage equality doesn't nessesarily make it so, so what are you really up to in this nation ? How far does it all go, and will the Christians be able to live a Christian life in this nation when all is said and done ? By the situations that we have seen as a preview, I don't think the Christians will ever live peacefully & free in this nation again, at least not in the public square they won't. If a Christian family shields their child's eyes from that which they don't aspire to or believe in, then what reaction will be drawn from that action by the ones who are being shunned in such a way ? How will Christians and the open sinners live openly together in the public square, if the square is promoting something that the Christians don't believe in ? Will the square promote any longer anything that the Christians believe in equally ?

Will everything end up as one sided in the public square as promoted by government, and the other side (Christians) will have to go into a box that only allows freedom of religion and expression to stay within the box, but no longer outside of the box ? What are we replacing with, against all that we are losing now in this nation ? Think about it..

 

[Silhouette]

You teach that in the secular world and by law each are equal and you treat them that way.

That's what you do.

So, a Christian's civil rights are equal to a gay person's? Well, that's where you see a clash and why all this "gay vs baker" crap is headed to the US Supreme Court. They will have to sort out which is dominant.. Because they both are about dogma and behaviors...