So...if you were in that Nightclub in Cali. would you want a gun to stop the shooter?

[2aguy]

usually the bouncer or security has the weapons in a place that serves alcohol.
Would I want to be in a room with drunks and guns, no way..

In Virginia, they passed a law allowing concealed carry in bars....crime in bars went down 5.2%....and other states already allow people to carry in bars, they just can't drink.....so, once again, nothing you stated has a bearing on what is actually happening right now...

Allowing guns into bars has ‘surprising’ result - WND



When Virginia passed a law allowing concealed carry in bars and alcohol-serving restaurants beginning July 1 of last year, opponents of the change decried the dangers of mixing guns and alcohol, for fear violent crimes would escalate.

But one year later, the Richmond Times-Dispatch did a study to see if the gloomy prognostications came true.

According to state police records, not only did gun violence in bars and restaurants not increase under the new law, it decreased by 5.2 percent.

In fact, of the 145 reported crimes with guns that occurred in Virginia bars and restaurants in fiscal 2010-11 (compared to 153 incidents in the year before the new law took effect), only two of the aggravated assault cases were related to concealed-carry permit holders. In one incident, the crime took place at a restaurant that didn’t serve alcohol – thus unrelated to the new law – and in the other, the weapon was neither discharged nor withdrawn from its holster.

“The numbers basically just confirm what we’ve said would happen if the General Assembly changed the law,” Philip Van Cleave, president of the pro-gun Virginia Citizens Defense League, told the Times-Dispatch. “Keep in mind what the other side was saying – that this was going to be a blood bath, that restaurants will be dangerous and people will stop going. But there was nothing to base the fear-mongering on.”

Do you realize this article is from 2012?

Do you happen to have the results thru 2017, so we can get a better idea on how the law has been working for 5 years or more, instead of just 1 year??

A quick search shows no interest in this from the press, but I will keep looking.

 

[danielpalos]

usually the bouncer or security has the weapons in a place that serves alcohol.
Would I want to be in a room with drunks and guns, no way..

In Virginia, they passed a law allowing concealed carry in bars....crime in bars went down 5.2%....and other states already allow people to carry in bars, they just can't drink.....so, once again, nothing you stated has a bearing on what is actually happening right now...

Allowing guns into bars has ‘surprising’ result - WND



When Virginia passed a law allowing concealed carry in bars and alcohol-serving restaurants beginning July 1 of last year, opponents of the change decried the dangers of mixing guns and alcohol, for fear violent crimes would escalate.

But one year later, the Richmond Times-Dispatch did a study to see if the gloomy prognostications came true.

According to state police records, not only did gun violence in bars and restaurants not increase under the new law, it decreased by 5.2 percent.

In fact, of the 145 reported crimes with guns that occurred in Virginia bars and restaurants in fiscal 2010-11 (compared to 153 incidents in the year before the new law took effect), only two of the aggravated assault cases were related to concealed-carry permit holders. In one incident, the crime took place at a restaurant that didn’t serve alcohol – thus unrelated to the new law – and in the other, the weapon was neither discharged nor withdrawn from its holster.

“The numbers basically just confirm what we’ve said would happen if the General Assembly changed the law,” Philip Van Cleave, president of the pro-gun Virginia Citizens Defense League, told the Times-Dispatch. “Keep in mind what the other side was saying – that this was going to be a blood bath, that restaurants will be dangerous and people will stop going. But there was nothing to base the fear-mongering on.”

Do we know why gun violence occurs in "places of entertainment"?

Because they are usually gun free zones, as this night club, the pulse nightclub were.....and there are large numbers of people in a tightly packed space, with escape slowed down by few external exits...

that does not make sense. why would a Person want to go there instead of somewhere else, if they just want to shoot.

I just explained why they pick those locations...it also helps that the people there may be intoxicated making them easier to trap and kill...


They do go elsewhere.....schools, gun free zones with large groups of unarmed victims....churches....gun free zones with large groups of unarmed victims.....and so on....

in other words; you are claiming some gun lovers are only brave enough to cause problems in gun free zones.

 

[2aguy]

In Virginia, they passed a law allowing concealed carry in bars....crime in bars went down 5.2%....and other states already allow people to carry in bars, they just can't drink.....so, once again, nothing you stated has a bearing on what is actually happening right now...

Allowing guns into bars has ‘surprising’ result - WND



When Virginia passed a law allowing concealed carry in bars and alcohol-serving restaurants beginning July 1 of last year, opponents of the change decried the dangers of mixing guns and alcohol, for fear violent crimes would escalate.

But one year later, the Richmond Times-Dispatch did a study to see if the gloomy prognostications came true.

According to state police records, not only did gun violence in bars and restaurants not increase under the new law, it decreased by 5.2 percent.

In fact, of the 145 reported crimes with guns that occurred in Virginia bars and restaurants in fiscal 2010-11 (compared to 153 incidents in the year before the new law took effect), only two of the aggravated assault cases were related to concealed-carry permit holders. In one incident, the crime took place at a restaurant that didn’t serve alcohol – thus unrelated to the new law – and in the other, the weapon was neither discharged nor withdrawn from its holster.

“The numbers basically just confirm what we’ve said would happen if the General Assembly changed the law,” Philip Van Cleave, president of the pro-gun Virginia Citizens Defense League, told the Times-Dispatch. “Keep in mind what the other side was saying – that this was going to be a blood bath, that restaurants will be dangerous and people will stop going. But there was nothing to base the fear-mongering on.”

Do we know why gun violence occurs in "places of entertainment"?

Because they are usually gun free zones, as this night club, the pulse nightclub were.....and there are large numbers of people in a tightly packed space, with escape slowed down by few external exits...

that does not make sense. why would a Person want to go there instead of somewhere else, if they just want to shoot.

I just explained why they pick those locations...it also helps that the people there may be intoxicated making them easier to trap and kill...


They do go elsewhere.....schools, gun free zones with large groups of unarmed victims....churches....gun free zones with large groups of unarmed victims.....and so on....

in other words; you are claiming some gun lovers are only brave enough to cause problems in gun free zones.

You really should stop drinking and mixing meds so early in the morning.....

 

[danielpalos]

Do we know why gun violence occurs in "places of entertainment"?

Because they are usually gun free zones, as this night club, the pulse nightclub were.....and there are large numbers of people in a tightly packed space, with escape slowed down by few external exits...

that does not make sense. why would a Person want to go there instead of somewhere else, if they just want to shoot.

I just explained why they pick those locations...it also helps that the people there may be intoxicated making them easier to trap and kill...


They do go elsewhere.....schools, gun free zones with large groups of unarmed victims....churches....gun free zones with large groups of unarmed victims.....and so on....

in other words; you are claiming some gun lovers are only brave enough to cause problems in gun free zones.

You really should stop drinking and mixing meds so early in the morning.....

it makes more sense; that some people prefer to solve problems with guns instead of words.

 

[2aguy]

Because they are usually gun free zones, as this night club, the pulse nightclub were.....and there are large numbers of people in a tightly packed space, with escape slowed down by few external exits...

that does not make sense. why would a Person want to go there instead of somewhere else, if they just want to shoot.

I just explained why they pick those locations...it also helps that the people there may be intoxicated making them easier to trap and kill...


They do go elsewhere.....schools, gun free zones with large groups of unarmed victims....churches....gun free zones with large groups of unarmed victims.....and so on....

in other words; you are claiming some gun lovers are only brave enough to cause problems in gun free zones.

You really should stop drinking and mixing meds so early in the morning.....

it makes more sense; that some people prefer to solve problems with guns instead of words.

Which problems?

 

[Jimmy_Chitwood]

Another gun free zone, and another question for our anti-gunners....if you were in that NightClub when the shooter came in.....violating the gun control laws of California, the gun free zone, and the laws against murder.....

Would you want a gun to save your life with? How about to save your wife, or other family members?

A couple large caliber firearms and gratuitous ammunition.

Does that make me a bad person?

under Capitalism, someone is making money.

My mind on my money, my money on my mind homey

 

[miketx]

usually the bouncer or security has the weapons in a place that serves alcohol.
Would I want to be in a room with drunks and guns, no way..

In Virginia, they passed a law allowing concealed carry in bars....crime in bars went down 5.2%....and other states already allow people to carry in bars, they just can't drink.....so, once again, nothing you stated has a bearing on what is actually happening right now...

Allowing guns into bars has ‘surprising’ result - WND



When Virginia passed a law allowing concealed carry in bars and alcohol-serving restaurants beginning July 1 of last year, opponents of the change decried the dangers of mixing guns and alcohol, for fear violent crimes would escalate.

But one year later, the Richmond Times-Dispatch did a study to see if the gloomy prognostications came true.

According to state police records, not only did gun violence in bars and restaurants not increase under the new law, it decreased by 5.2 percent.

In fact, of the 145 reported crimes with guns that occurred in Virginia bars and restaurants in fiscal 2010-11 (compared to 153 incidents in the year before the new law took effect), only two of the aggravated assault cases were related to concealed-carry permit holders. In one incident, the crime took place at a restaurant that didn’t serve alcohol – thus unrelated to the new law – and in the other, the weapon was neither discharged nor withdrawn from its holster.

“The numbers basically just confirm what we’ve said would happen if the General Assembly changed the law,” Philip Van Cleave, president of the pro-gun Virginia Citizens Defense League, told the Times-Dispatch. “Keep in mind what the other side was saying – that this was going to be a blood bath, that restaurants will be dangerous and people will stop going. But there was nothing to base the fear-mongering on.”

Do you realize this article is from 2012?

Do you happen to have the results thru 2017, so we can get a better idea on how the law has been working for 5 years or more, instead of just 1 year??

Why do libs always demand more data that they know they will just deny. It's classic, you all do it.

 

[danielpalos]

that does not make sense. why would a Person want to go there instead of somewhere else, if they just want to shoot.

I just explained why they pick those locations...it also helps that the people there may be intoxicated making them easier to trap and kill...


They do go elsewhere.....schools, gun free zones with large groups of unarmed victims....churches....gun free zones with large groups of unarmed victims.....and so on....

in other words; you are claiming some gun lovers are only brave enough to cause problems in gun free zones.

You really should stop drinking and mixing meds so early in the morning.....

it makes more sense; that some people prefer to solve problems with guns instead of words.

Which problems?

How many uniformed, well regulated militia being "on duty" does it take to ensure we have no security problems in our free States?

 

[danielpalos]

Another gun free zone, and another question for our anti-gunners....if you were in that NightClub when the shooter came in.....violating the gun control laws of California, the gun free zone, and the laws against murder.....

Would you want a gun to save your life with? How about to save your wife, or other family members?

A couple large caliber firearms and gratuitous ammunition.

Does that make me a bad person?

under Capitalism, someone is making money.

My mind on my money, my money on my mind homey

This is what we are supposed to be doing:

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

 

[Skull Pilot]

usually the bouncer or security has the weapons in a place that serves alcohol.
Would I want to be in a room with drunks and guns, no way..

Bouncers don’t carry guns. Also anyone carrying a gun won’t be drinking. We’re not stupid like the liberals.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Stupid people hang in bars and nightclubs, carry-on.

Which is why I don't hang out in nightclubs and bars

 

[Moonglow]

Another gun free zone, and another question for our anti-gunners....if you were in that NightClub when the shooter came in.....violating the gun control laws of California, the gun free zone, and the laws against murder.....

Would you want a gun to save your life with? How about to save your wife, or other family members?

A couple large caliber firearms and gratuitous ammunition.

Does that make me a bad person?

under Capitalism, someone is making money.

My mind on my money, my money on my mind homey

This is what we are supposed to be doing:

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

Unless you are black...

 

[danielpalos]

Another gun free zone, and another question for our anti-gunners....if you were in that NightClub when the shooter came in.....violating the gun control laws of California, the gun free zone, and the laws against murder.....

Would you want a gun to save your life with? How about to save your wife, or other family members?

A couple large caliber firearms and gratuitous ammunition.

Does that make me a bad person?

under Capitalism, someone is making money.

My mind on my money, my money on my mind homey

This is what we are supposed to be doing:

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

Unless you are black...

There is no provision for excuses in the federal doctrine, only Results: The Citizens of each State shall be entitled to all Privileges and Immunities of Citizens in the several States.

 

[Moonglow]

A couple large caliber firearms and gratuitous ammunition.

Does that make me a bad person?

under Capitalism, someone is making money.

My mind on my money, my money on my mind homey

This is what we are supposed to be doing:

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

Unless you are black...

There is no provision for excuses in the federal doctrine, only Results: The Citizens of each State shall be entitled to all Privileges and Immunities of Citizens in the several States.

There was an excuse when the document was written..

 

[danielpalos]

under Capitalism, someone is making money.

My mind on my money, my money on my mind homey

This is what we are supposed to be doing:

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

Unless you are black...

There is no provision for excuses in the federal doctrine, only Results: The Citizens of each State shall be entitled to all Privileges and Immunities of Citizens in the several States.

There was an excuse when the document was written..

It expired after 1808.

 

[Moonglow]

My mind on my money, my money on my mind homey

This is what we are supposed to be doing:

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

Unless you are black...

There is no provision for excuses in the federal doctrine, only Results: The Citizens of each State shall be entitled to all Privileges and Immunities of Citizens in the several States.

There was an excuse when the document was written..

It expired after 1808.

The document is pure propaganda and the franchise was limited.

 

[pinqy]

usually the bouncer or security has the weapons in a place that serves alcohol.
Would I want to be in a room with drunks and guns, no way..

In Virginia, they passed a law allowing concealed carry in bars....crime in bars went down 5.2%....and other states already allow people to carry in bars, they just can't drink.....so, once again, nothing you stated has a bearing on what is actually happening right now...

Allowing guns into bars has ‘surprising’ result - WND



When Virginia passed a law allowing concealed carry in bars and alcohol-serving restaurants beginning July 1 of last year, opponents of the change decried the dangers of mixing guns and alcohol, for fear violent crimes would escalate.

But one year later, the Richmond Times-Dispatch did a study to see if the gloomy prognostications came true.

According to state police records, not only did gun violence in bars and restaurants not increase under the new law, it decreased by 5.2 percent.

In fact, of the 145 reported crimes with guns that occurred in Virginia bars and restaurants in fiscal 2010-11 (compared to 153 incidents in the year before the new law took effect), only two of the aggravated assault cases were related to concealed-carry permit holders. In one incident, the crime took place at a restaurant that didn’t serve alcohol – thus unrelated to the new law – and in the other, the weapon was neither discharged nor withdrawn from its holster.

“The numbers basically just confirm what we’ve said would happen if the General Assembly changed the law,” Philip Van Cleave, president of the pro-gun Virginia Citizens Defense League, told the Times-Dispatch. “Keep in mind what the other side was saying – that this was going to be a blood bath, that restaurants will be dangerous and people will stop going. But there was nothing to base the fear-mongering on.”

Do you realize this article is from 2012?

Do you happen to have the results thru 2017, so we can get a better idea on how the law has been working for 5 years or more, instead of just 1 year??

I wouldn’t expect the data to be different, but Virginia isn’t a good example.

First, while we can carry concealed in an establishment which serves alcohol, if you actually drink, that’s a clas 2 misdemeanor.

Second, we don’t have bars in Virginia. If you have a mixed drink license, 45% of your sales must be food and non-alcoholic beverages, and of the license is beer and wine only, at least $4,000 a month of revenue must be food and non-alcoholic drinks and at least $2,000 must be from entree meals.

I believe there are other rules about how mush of the area must be tables etc, but I’m too lazy to look.

So the environment is quite different from most states, and I wouldn’t have expected any real change.

So my answer to the OP would be “it depends.”

 

[2aguy]

usually the bouncer or security has the weapons in a place that serves alcohol.
Would I want to be in a room with drunks and guns, no way..

In Virginia, they passed a law allowing concealed carry in bars....crime in bars went down 5.2%....and other states already allow people to carry in bars, they just can't drink.....so, once again, nothing you stated has a bearing on what is actually happening right now...

Allowing guns into bars has ‘surprising’ result - WND



When Virginia passed a law allowing concealed carry in bars and alcohol-serving restaurants beginning July 1 of last year, opponents of the change decried the dangers of mixing guns and alcohol, for fear violent crimes would escalate.

But one year later, the Richmond Times-Dispatch did a study to see if the gloomy prognostications came true.

According to state police records, not only did gun violence in bars and restaurants not increase under the new law, it decreased by 5.2 percent.

In fact, of the 145 reported crimes with guns that occurred in Virginia bars and restaurants in fiscal 2010-11 (compared to 153 incidents in the year before the new law took effect), only two of the aggravated assault cases were related to concealed-carry permit holders. In one incident, the crime took place at a restaurant that didn’t serve alcohol – thus unrelated to the new law – and in the other, the weapon was neither discharged nor withdrawn from its holster.

“The numbers basically just confirm what we’ve said would happen if the General Assembly changed the law,” Philip Van Cleave, president of the pro-gun Virginia Citizens Defense League, told the Times-Dispatch. “Keep in mind what the other side was saying – that this was going to be a blood bath, that restaurants will be dangerous and people will stop going. But there was nothing to base the fear-mongering on.”

Do you realize this article is from 2012?

Do you happen to have the results thru 2017, so we can get a better idea on how the law has been working for 5 years or more, instead of just 1 year??

I wouldn’t expect the data to be different, but Virginia isn’t a good example.

First, while we can carry concealed in an establishment which serves alcohol, if you actually drink, that’s a clas 2 misdemeanor.

Second, we don’t have bars in Virginia. If you have a mixed drink license, 45% of your sales must be food and non-alcoholic beverages, and of the license is beer and wine only, at least $4,000 a month of revenue must be food and non-alcoholic drinks and at least $2,000 must be from entree meals.

I believe there are other rules about how mush of the area must be tables etc, but I’m too lazy to look.

So the environment is quite different from most states, and I wouldn’t have expected any real change.

So my answer to the OP would be “it depends.”

Virginia isn't the only state... from 2010....

Going to the Bar, Pistol in Pocket, Is Legal in 4 States

Tennessee is one of four states, along with Arizona, Georgia and Virginia, that recently enacted laws explicitly allowing loaded guns in bars. (Eighteen other states allow weapons in restaurants that serve alcohol.)

------

The new laws have also brought to light the status of 20 other states — New York, New Jersey and Massachusetts among them — that do not address the question, appearing by default to allow those with permits to carry guns into establishments that serve alcohol, according to the Legal Community Against Violence, a nonprofit group that promotes gun control and tracks state gun laws.

 

[boedicca]

Yes indeed. Self-defense is an inalienable right.

 

[pinqy]

usually the bouncer or security has the weapons in a place that serves alcohol.
Would I want to be in a room with drunks and guns, no way..

In Virginia, they passed a law allowing concealed carry in bars....crime in bars went down 5.2%....and other states already allow people to carry in bars, they just can't drink.....so, once again, nothing you stated has a bearing on what is actually happening right now...

Allowing guns into bars has ‘surprising’ result - WND



When Virginia passed a law allowing concealed carry in bars and alcohol-serving restaurants beginning July 1 of last year, opponents of the change decried the dangers of mixing guns and alcohol, for fear violent crimes would escalate.

But one year later, the Richmond Times-Dispatch did a study to see if the gloomy prognostications came true.

According to state police records, not only did gun violence in bars and restaurants not increase under the new law, it decreased by 5.2 percent.

In fact, of the 145 reported crimes with guns that occurred in Virginia bars and restaurants in fiscal 2010-11 (compared to 153 incidents in the year before the new law took effect), only two of the aggravated assault cases were related to concealed-carry permit holders. In one incident, the crime took place at a restaurant that didn’t serve alcohol – thus unrelated to the new law – and in the other, the weapon was neither discharged nor withdrawn from its holster.

“The numbers basically just confirm what we’ve said would happen if the General Assembly changed the law,” Philip Van Cleave, president of the pro-gun Virginia Citizens Defense League, told the Times-Dispatch. “Keep in mind what the other side was saying – that this was going to be a blood bath, that restaurants will be dangerous and people will stop going. But there was nothing to base the fear-mongering on.”

Do you realize this article is from 2012?

Do you happen to have the results thru 2017, so we can get a better idea on how the law has been working for 5 years or more, instead of just 1 year??

I wouldn’t expect the data to be different, but Virginia isn’t a good example.

First, while we can carry concealed in an establishment which serves alcohol, if you actually drink, that’s a clas 2 misdemeanor.

Second, we don’t have bars in Virginia. If you have a mixed drink license, 45% of your sales must be food and non-alcoholic beverages, and of the license is beer and wine only, at least $4,000 a month of revenue must be food and non-alcoholic drinks and at least $2,000 must be from entree meals.

I believe there are other rules about how mush of the area must be tables etc, but I’m too lazy to look.

So the environment is quite different from most states, and I wouldn’t have expected any real change.

So my answer to the OP would be “it depends.”

Virginia isn't the only state... from 2010....

Going to the Bar, Pistol in Pocket, Is Legal in 4 States

Tennessee is one of four states, along with Arizona, Georgia and Virginia, that recently enacted laws explicitly allowing loaded guns in bars. (Eighteen other states allow weapons in restaurants that serve alcohol.)

------

The new laws have also brought to light the status of 20 other states — New York, New Jersey and Massachusetts among them — that do not address the question, appearing by default to allow those with permits to carry guns into establishments that serve alcohol, according to the Legal Community Against Violence, a nonprofit group that promotes gun control and tracks state gun laws.

Again, we do not have any bars in Virginia, so for the articles say bar gives a false impression.

 

[Moonglow]

Yes indeed. Self-defense is an inalienable right.

No it isn't..Just ask a cop that made a mistake and thinks you committed a crime then proceeds to beat yer ass.