So Obama care will force Catholic churches who employ people

[Ravi]

In a way, the Catholic Church is asking big government to enforce Catholic theology.

 

[Dr.Drock]

Question for those in favor of the enforcement. If I'm correct and the outcome of this enforcement would be to require Catholic/religious hospitals/doctors to provide care per insurance, are you cool with the possible shut down of these hospitals?

How many are in 'poor areas'? Hint, more than the public ones.

We'll see what the Church rules, seriously I've not a clue. They may well cave, but if they choose to close them, it's the poor that will pay the price of Obama's principles.

The Church is unlikely to 'cave'. Same thing happened with adoption in Britain. The law changed to force all adoption agencies to allow gay adoptions. That's against the Church's doctrine. They shut their adoption services throughout Britain.

They will do exactly the same here.

I'm on your side in terms of gov't not forcing birth control on catholic hospitals, if that's the case.

But shutting down adoption agencies, and not helping or potentially saving many children's lives just because of the chance of a tiny minority of the children being adopted to gays? That sounds really sad and pathetic to me. Besides, how many kids before the law were adopted by gays anyways who were just stating they were straight?

 

[Katzndogz]

If only we could get schools to give the same level of attention to coach and teacher molestations as given to the Catholic Church!

No organization associated with the Church or other Christian sects is proposing to prohibit contraception or abortion. Just prohibit forcing people who don't believe it in from paying for the folly of others.

 

[California Girl]

Question for those in favor of the enforcement. If I'm correct and the outcome of this enforcement would be to require Catholic/religious hospitals/doctors to provide care per insurance, are you cool with the possible shut down of these hospitals?

How many are in 'poor areas'? Hint, more than the public ones.

We'll see what the Church rules, seriously I've not a clue. They may well cave, but if they choose to close them, it's the poor that will pay the price of Obama's principles.

The Church is unlikely to 'cave'. Same thing happened with adoption in Britain. The law changed to force all adoption agencies to allow gay adoptions. That's against the Church's doctrine. They shut their adoption services throughout Britain.

They will do exactly the same here.

I'm on your side in terms of gov't not forcing birth control on catholic hospitals, if that's the case.

But shutting down adoption agencies, and not helping or potentially saving many children's lives just because of the chance of a tiny minority of the children being adopted to gays? That sounds really sad and pathetic to me. Besides, how many kids before the law were adopted by gays anyways who were just stating they were straight?

The Catholic Adoption Agency places children in Catholic families. Many Catholics used it to ensure that a child that - for whatever reason - was placed in the best possible home, and, for Catholic Moms, that would be a Catholic family.

Non Catholics, gays, etc had a service - provided by the UK government. It had nothing to do with the 'gay' thing - they only placed children in Catholic families... meaning a Mom and Dad.... no single parents, no gay couples, no non Catholics. It was a service specifically for Catholics. And the UK Government destroyed it.... and made it impossible for Catholics to adopt within their faith. I find that remarkably intolerant of the UK Government.

 

[Dr.Drock]

The Church is unlikely to 'cave'. Same thing happened with adoption in Britain. The law changed to force all adoption agencies to allow gay adoptions. That's against the Church's doctrine. They shut their adoption services throughout Britain.

They will do exactly the same here.

I'm on your side in terms of gov't not forcing birth control on catholic hospitals, if that's the case.

But shutting down adoption agencies, and not helping or potentially saving many children's lives just because of the chance of a tiny minority of the children being adopted to gays? That sounds really sad and pathetic to me. Besides, how many kids before the law were adopted by gays anyways who were just stating they were straight?

The Catholic Adoption Agency places children in Catholic families. Many Catholics used it to ensure that a child that - for whatever reason - was placed in the best possible home, and, for Catholic Moms, that would be a Catholic family.

Non Catholics, gays, etc had a service - provided by the UK government. It had nothing to do with the 'gay' thing - they only placed children in Catholic families... meaning a Mom and Dad.... no single parents, no gay couples, no non Catholics. It was a service specifically for Catholics. And the UK Government destroyed it.... and made it impossible for Catholics to adopt within their faith. I find that remarkably intolerant of the UK Government.

Thanks for expanding on this, I'll have to look this up and read more.

 

[California Girl]

I'm on your side in terms of gov't not forcing birth control on catholic hospitals, if that's the case.

But shutting down adoption agencies, and not helping or potentially saving many children's lives just because of the chance of a tiny minority of the children being adopted to gays? That sounds really sad and pathetic to me. Besides, how many kids before the law were adopted by gays anyways who were just stating they were straight?

The Catholic Adoption Agency places children in Catholic families. Many Catholics used it to ensure that a child that - for whatever reason - was placed in the best possible home, and, for Catholic Moms, that would be a Catholic family.

Non Catholics, gays, etc had a service - provided by the UK government. It had nothing to do with the 'gay' thing - they only placed children in Catholic families... meaning a Mom and Dad.... no single parents, no gay couples, no non Catholics. It was a service specifically for Catholics. And the UK Government destroyed it.... and made it impossible for Catholics to adopt within their faith. I find that remarkably intolerant of the UK Government.

Thanks for expanding on this, I'll have to look this up and read more.

British Catholic adoption agency closes - CSMonitor.com

That's a decent article about it.

Catholic Care has been offering adoption services for over 100 years, successfully placing children with families and offering post-adoption support services. It has a much better record than a lot of adoption agencies run purely by local authorities and receives its funding from the Catholic Church. By removing the agency’s right to offer adoption to heterosexual couples only, the Commission has effectively cut off funding for this service, as the Church will not give money to support a service that acts contrary to their beliefs. As a result, orphans and vulnerable children will lose out as a respected provider of these services is forced to close.

Even now, it is beyond my comprehension that this service was forced to close because of the UK Government's irrational approach to adoption.

 

[Dr.Drock]

The Catholic Adoption Agency places children in Catholic families. Many Catholics used it to ensure that a child that - for whatever reason - was placed in the best possible home, and, for Catholic Moms, that would be a Catholic family.

Non Catholics, gays, etc had a service - provided by the UK government. It had nothing to do with the 'gay' thing - they only placed children in Catholic families... meaning a Mom and Dad.... no single parents, no gay couples, no non Catholics. It was a service specifically for Catholics. And the UK Government destroyed it.... and made it impossible for Catholics to adopt within their faith. I find that remarkably intolerant of the UK Government.

Thanks for expanding on this, I'll have to look this up and read more.

British Catholic adoption agency closes - CSMonitor.com

That's a decent article about it.

Catholic Care has been offering adoption services for over 100 years, successfully placing children with families and offering post-adoption support services. It has a much better record than a lot of adoption agencies run purely by local authorities and receives its funding from the Catholic Church. By removing the agency’s right to offer adoption to heterosexual couples only, the Commission has effectively cut off funding for this service, as the Church will not give money to support a service that acts contrary to their beliefs. As a result, orphans and vulnerable children will lose out as a respected provider of these services is forced to close.

Even now, it is beyond my comprehension that this service was forced to close because of the UK Government's irrational approach to adoption.

Another battle in the war of government vs charity won by government .

 

[California Girl]

Thanks for expanding on this, I'll have to look this up and read more.

British Catholic adoption agency closes - CSMonitor.com

That's a decent article about it.

Catholic Care has been offering adoption services for over 100 years, successfully placing children with families and offering post-adoption support services. It has a much better record than a lot of adoption agencies run purely by local authorities and receives its funding from the Catholic Church. By removing the agency’s right to offer adoption to heterosexual couples only, the Commission has effectively cut off funding for this service, as the Church will not give money to support a service that acts contrary to their beliefs. As a result, orphans and vulnerable children will lose out as a respected provider of these services is forced to close.

Even now, it is beyond my comprehension that this service was forced to close because of the UK Government's irrational approach to adoption.

Another battle in the war of government vs charity won by government .

Yep, it sure was. Particularly since the Catholic Adoption Agency had such a great record of successfully placing children. From recollection, the Church offered to fully financially support the agency, and were turned down.

You should take a look into the absolute clusterfuck that the adoption service now is in the UK.

 

[Ravi]

And yet, Catholic Care is still running adoption services.

Adoption - Catholic Care

 

[GuyPinestra]

I was going to post something about the intolerance of the tolerant Left but I said "Fuck it, it'll go right over their heads, anyway..."

 

[California Girl]

And yet, Catholic Care is still running adoption services.

Adoption - Catholic Care

That's because it's under appeal. Once the appeals processes are complete, all the agencies will close permanently. Some are still open while the appeals processes go through.

 

[JamesInFlorida]

Actually, accused priests were moved into roles where they had no contact with children, therefore your accusation about new victims is bullshit.

You're getting very hysterical about it. Calm down. The Church has and continues to deal with this issue directly with those affected. It does not concern you.

Interesting that you ignore the thousands of teachers - in this country alone - that are accused... and the way the US government has paid people off - but you're all butthurt about the Catholics. You demonstrate a lack of logic and show no ability to reason. In short, you're a fool.

I think you're trying to belittle how serious the molestations were. I've been a life-long Catholic and went to Catholic school for a few years instead of a public elementary school. There was one father there who would always play with the boys, and was very involved with the students, and we all looked up to him, and trusted him, and he was a lot of kid's role model. When I was in high school it came out that he was sexually molesting some of the boys at school. I don't know if you have any personal experience with fathers who turn out to be molesters or not-but to simply say that they moved them to positions where they don't interact with children-and that that's somehow OK is absurd.

That pedophile, low-life predator was protected by the church and is still a "father" to this day. I've never wavered from the church-but yes I do think it's absolutely ridiculous when people shrug it off, or try to make it not a bad deal. The man should be in jail (or should have been put in jail)-and thrown out of the church.

I'm not 'belittling' it, I'm putting it in proportion. I grew up a Catholic, so did my brothers... all of us hung out with our priest.... he ran a baseball team. Were any of us abused? No. Has he ever been accused of molesting kids? No.

Fact remains: 400,000 priests - 0.03% have ever been accused. That's considerably less than many other professions that have access to children. And yet, we are the ones who are hammered. I find that to be disingenuous.

Oh I absolutely agree it's a very small minority of priests, and also that people tend to paint Catholic all priests (or many) as being perverts. I guess my point was that the way the church protected the ones who did molest children was pretty disgusting in my opinion. That's all.

 

[JohnA]

pay for this even though the morning after pill and other birth control is on this plan. Why is the catholic church allow to get waivers but so many others can. This is against their religion. And why is the morning after pill on this. That is the same as covering an abortion so the people on public assistance we are paying for this with our tax dollars /

that's a good question, all his union buddies got waivers but the catholic church cannot get one.. teee heee..

good post you hit it on the head . obama is nothing but a empty suit the power comes from the unseen commies who work his strings those who wish to turn this country into a western USSR which was proven to be a failure long before it disintigrated .
im not a catholic by any means but my opinion is the govt should keep out of telling folks how to run their business .
if you want birth control there are plenty of places to get it .

 

[Ravi]

And yet, Catholic Care is still running adoption services.

Adoption - Catholic Care

That's because it's under appeal. Once the appeals processes are complete, all the agencies will close permanently. Some are still open while the appeals processes go through.

Actually, they haven't decided if they will close or not.

 

[California Girl]

I think you're trying to belittle how serious the molestations were. I've been a life-long Catholic and went to Catholic school for a few years instead of a public elementary school. There was one father there who would always play with the boys, and was very involved with the students, and we all looked up to him, and trusted him, and he was a lot of kid's role model. When I was in high school it came out that he was sexually molesting some of the boys at school. I don't know if you have any personal experience with fathers who turn out to be molesters or not-but to simply say that they moved them to positions where they don't interact with children-and that that's somehow OK is absurd.

That pedophile, low-life predator was protected by the church and is still a "father" to this day. I've never wavered from the church-but yes I do think it's absolutely ridiculous when people shrug it off, or try to make it not a bad deal. The man should be in jail (or should have been put in jail)-and thrown out of the church.

I'm not 'belittling' it, I'm putting it in proportion. I grew up a Catholic, so did my brothers... all of us hung out with our priest.... he ran a baseball team. Were any of us abused? No. Has he ever been accused of molesting kids? No.

Fact remains: 400,000 priests - 0.03% have ever been accused. That's considerably less than many other professions that have access to children. And yet, we are the ones who are hammered. I find that to be disingenuous.

Oh I absolutely agree it's a very small minority of priests, and also that people tend to paint Catholic all priests (or many) as being perverts. I guess my point was that the way the church protected the ones who did molest children was pretty disgusting in my opinion. That's all.

I don't know any Catholics who would disagree that the way the Church initially reacted was exceptionally wrong. Utterly and completely wrong. The argument of the Bishops was that it was not protecting the priests, it was protecting the Church. I found that unacceptable - as did most Catholics. You probably are not aware but hundreds of thousands of Catholics around the world petitioned the Church about it.

However, the fact remains, non-Catholics use this as a weapon... and point blank refuse to recognize the stupidity of labeling all priests with the actions of a very small minority.

 

[L.K.Eder]

I was going to post something about the intolerance of the tolerant Left but I said "Fuck it, it'll go right over their heads, anyway..."

a true loss for usmb

 

[California Girl]

And yet, Catholic Care is still running adoption services.

Adoption - Catholic Care

That's because it's under appeal. Once the appeals processes are complete, all the agencies will close permanently. Some are still open while the appeals processes go through.

Actually, they haven't decided if they will close or not.

Yea, they have. They'll shut down completely if the final appeals go against them.

 

[Ravi]

They lost their appeal last April. They are still operating.

 

[California Girl]

They lost their appeal last April. They are still operating.

There's another appeal.

If that goes against them, as is likely, they will - over quite a long time - withdraw the service. It's not as straightforward as one would think - it can't just shut down in a day. It has couples, and children, that it has made commitments to, and it needs to provide it's care service to families who have already been through the adoption process. It's a huge commitment that the Church undertakes.

One of the vast number of things that the Church does quietly and without any other agenda than to help people.

Just imagine how it will impact across the US if it pulls out of providing social care over this ridiculous issue.

 

[L.K.Eder]

a decent article

British Catholic adoption agency closes - CSMonitor.com



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