Stalking is legal? If you're in a union, sure!

[gallantwarrior]

No, guy, you see, the difference is that rights were given up.

When my Dad was my age, he got cancer. But because he belonged to a union, he had good medical benefits, he got top notch treatment, and even though he died, anyway, after he died, they still gave my mom good benefits for the remainder of the time she lived.

On the other hand, seven years ago, I had some medical issues, and despite having six years of glowing reviews and sometimes working 60 hours a week, after my bills hit a certain level, they were pretty keen to get me off the payroll. My bosses response when I protested was "Well, good thing I don't have to deal with a union."

Incidently, by the time this "genius" was done, we lost 60% of our business and 50% of our employees. Not a union in sight.

We need unions because people like that become managers.

The simple solution is to have the unions start their own businesses.

But they won't do that because then all those union slobs might actually have to work

When unions actually do hire people themselves, do they use union folks?

Nope.

How convenient. "Giving back to the community". Hiring the unemployed for minimum wage instead of Davis-Bacon wages? The hypocrisy stinks to hell and back.

 

[JoeB131]

the 1% never had is so good under Republicans

maybe you left-wing jackbooted morons need to bring your torches and pitchforks to obama's residence

idiots and hypocrites

If the 1%ers have it so good, why did they spend a billion dollars trying to get Obama out of office?

How about basing your hatred on actual facts instead of this vague notion that the 1% are evil and need to be punished?

NIce attempt to avoid my question.

So let's try it again. If the Koch Brothers and Zionist Adelson and the rest of the 1%ers are doing sooooo well under Obama, why did they pull out all the stops to try go get Romney elected?

 

[JoeB131]

[

You do whatever you want, or not. If some union scum were blocking my way to my job, I could care less, I would walk over top of their cold, dead bodies if that's what it took to maintain my ability to support myself and my family. Unions never did anything other than extort money out of my pocket, thanks.

Unions are why you aren't working 70 hours a week in a dangerous factory for a pittance.

Too bad you are too st upid to realize that.

 

[JoeB131]

[

Meh....I beat cancer myself. It didnt cost me shit because I have good insurance and a medical savings plan.
Oh...and you cant blame others because you chose a shitty place to work. Thats all on you. And since you were still around to see this supposed loss of 60% of business and 50% of employees and you say "WE" lost,it sounds like you still had a job.
So which is it? Were you fired or not?
You story is contradictory so I'm calling bullshit.

Well, actually, yeah, I can blame the people who made it a shitty place to work because they were in charge of the place. That's the point.

And, no, I was part of the 50% of the employees who got let go. Somewhere in the middle group. They kept me around because 1) they weren't entirely sure if I'd sue them for medical discrimination and 2) when they lost 60% of the business, they still had delusions of getting it back, and frankly, the knowledge I had couldn't be easily replicated.

So they kind of strung me along for a year (I'm actually more pissed about that than I was about getting let go.)

But yeah, Mr. "I don't have to deal with a union" was the guy making all the awful decisions, like "Let's keep soaking our biggest customer with a 30% markup from the Manufacturer".

 

[JoeB131]

[

The unions aren't in it for the workers. They are in it for themselves.

Besides, you have no idea whether or not this woman is part of the 1% or not. She is the VP of a construction company doing work on apartments.

And you seem to be basing your entire opinion on your treatment by a single employer.

I can give you a clear example of a union fucking over hundreds of workers and then leaving them to their own devices.

Regardless of any of that, stalking and harassment should be illegal for every person. Unions deserve no exemption so they can extort their power from whoever they want.

Again, that happens to be your opinion.

Frankly, the thing is, the reason why we aren't looking at child labor anymore was because around the turn of the century, the Unions DID use violence against the 1%ers of the time, and those 1%ers saw what happened to their counterparts in Russia and Germany and said, 'Hey, maybe we need to give these guys Saturday off and some decent wages!"

But you are wrong one one point. I am not basing my opinion on just one employer. I'm kind of basing them on all of them. Every job I've had since leaving the Army in 1992, I've had management lie to me, promise more than they delivered, or otherwise try to pull a fast one.

That one was just so egregious in their behavior it changed my mind on political things. I stop writing it off as "business as usual" or "that was just a really bad one", and realized the whole system is dysfunctional when workers have no rights.

They treat you as badly as they think they can get away with.

case in point. When the economy was good in 2005, and they were getting away with marking up the customer at 30%, they didn't pull the kind of shit they did in 2008 when the economy sucked and people were afraid for their jobs.

 

[WinterBorn]

If the 1%ers have it so good, why did they spend a billion dollars trying to get Obama out of office?

How about basing your hatred on actual facts instead of this vague notion that the 1% are evil and need to be punished?

NIce attempt to avoid my question.

So let's try it again. If the Koch Brothers and Zionist Adelson and the rest of the 1%ers are doing sooooo well under Obama, why did they pull out all the stops to try go get Romney elected?

Because the democrats usually try and raise taxes on the upper income groups?

Now, would you care to try again answering my question about why you think it's ok for unions to be immune from stalking laws?

 

[WinterBorn]

[

You do whatever you want, or not. If some union scum were blocking my way to my job, I could care less, I would walk over top of their cold, dead bodies if that's what it took to maintain my ability to support myself and my family. Unions never did anything other than extort money out of my pocket, thanks.

Unions are why you aren't working 70 hours a week in a dangerous factory for a pittance.

Too bad you are too st upid to realize that.

I don't think anyone would argue that unions had their time, and did good things.

But the unions don't give a rat's ass about the workers now. they simply want to maintain their power base and continue to make money.

Ask the workers who were at the Gulf States Paper mill in Tuscaloosa whether the union worked for their best interest.

 

[WinterBorn]

[

The unions aren't in it for the workers. They are in it for themselves.

Besides, you have no idea whether or not this woman is part of the 1% or not. She is the VP of a construction company doing work on apartments.

And you seem to be basing your entire opinion on your treatment by a single employer.

I can give you a clear example of a union fucking over hundreds of workers and then leaving them to their own devices.

Regardless of any of that, stalking and harassment should be illegal for every person. Unions deserve no exemption so they can extort their power from whoever they want.

Again, that happens to be your opinion.

Frankly, the thing is, the reason why we aren't looking at child labor anymore was because around the turn of the century, the Unions DID use violence against the 1%ers of the time, and those 1%ers saw what happened to their counterparts in Russia and Germany and said, 'Hey, maybe we need to give these guys Saturday off and some decent wages!"

But you are wrong one one point. I am not basing my opinion on just one employer. I'm kind of basing them on all of them. Every job I've had since leaving the Army in 1992, I've had management lie to me, promise more than they delivered, or otherwise try to pull a fast one.

That one was just so egregious in their behavior it changed my mind on political things. I stop writing it off as "business as usual" or "that was just a really bad one", and realized the whole system is dysfunctional when workers have no rights.

They treat you as badly as they think they can get away with.

case in point. When the economy was good in 2005, and they were getting away with marking up the customer at 30%, they didn't pull the kind of shit they did in 2008 when the economy sucked and people were afraid for their jobs.

Ok, Joe, let's see if you are as bright as you claim.

How do you measure whether a business is successful or not?

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

[

Meh....I beat cancer myself. It didnt cost me shit because I have good insurance and a medical savings plan.
Oh...and you cant blame others because you chose a shitty place to work. Thats all on you. And since you were still around to see this supposed loss of 60% of business and 50% of employees and you say "WE" lost,it sounds like you still had a job.
So which is it? Were you fired or not?
You story is contradictory so I'm calling bullshit.

Well, actually, yeah, I can blame the people who made it a shitty place to work because they were in charge of the place. That's the point.

And, no, I was part of the 50% of the employees who got let go. Somewhere in the middle group. They kept me around because 1) they weren't entirely sure if I'd sue them for medical discrimination and 2) when they lost 60% of the business, they still had delusions of getting it back, and frankly, the knowledge I had couldn't be easily replicated.

So they kind of strung me along for a year (I'm actually more pissed about that than I was about getting let go.)

But yeah, Mr. "I don't have to deal with a union" was the guy making all the awful decisions, like "Let's keep soaking our biggest customer with a 30% markup from the Manufacturer".

Why do you feel entitled to a job?
You're only entitled to leave and look for a better one. Like I said,I survived cancer a hip replacement and diabetes all in just over a year. Insurance had to ass up close to a half mill. Nobody got fired or let go. And no unions were involved.
Sounds to me like you settled for a job that sucked. Try harder and stop blaming others.

 

[WinterBorn]

[

Meh....I beat cancer myself. It didnt cost me shit because I have good insurance and a medical savings plan.
Oh...and you cant blame others because you chose a shitty place to work. Thats all on you. And since you were still around to see this supposed loss of 60% of business and 50% of employees and you say "WE" lost,it sounds like you still had a job.
So which is it? Were you fired or not?
You story is contradictory so I'm calling bullshit.

Well, actually, yeah, I can blame the people who made it a shitty place to work because they were in charge of the place. That's the point.

And, no, I was part of the 50% of the employees who got let go. Somewhere in the middle group. They kept me around because 1) they weren't entirely sure if I'd sue them for medical discrimination and 2) when they lost 60% of the business, they still had delusions of getting it back, and frankly, the knowledge I had couldn't be easily replicated.

So they kind of strung me along for a year (I'm actually more pissed about that than I was about getting let go.)

But yeah, Mr. "I don't have to deal with a union" was the guy making all the awful decisions, like "Let's keep soaking our biggest customer with a 30% markup from the Manufacturer".

That you select the 30% markup as your contention shows you are clueless about the business. Ok, they mark the merchandise up 30%. What is the profit margin the business is running?

 

[JoeB131]

[quo

I don't think anyone would argue that unions had their time, and did good things.

But the unions don't give a rat's ass about the workers now. they simply want to maintain their power base and continue to make money.

Ask the workers who were at the Gulf States Paper mill in Tuscaloosa whether the union worked for their best interest.

Unions are needed now for the same reason they were needed then.

Because when you let the people whose obsession with acquiring things becomes a sickness, and they run the economy, you need to protect the rest of us from them.

Now, here's the thing. The company that let me go in 2008 and cured me of any Republican stupidity was actually a company that sold corrugated boxes. So I know quite a lot about that industry.

Had nothing to do with the "union", and more to do with the fact that International Paper bought out that plant, and then closed it down rather than modernize it.

If you've ever dealt with IP (and did on a regular basis for six years), you'd realize they are kind of like the Borg. They buy out a company, usually just to get the equipment and customer base, and the workers be damned.

In the last few years, they've bought out Temple Inland, Box USA, Weyerhouser, and dozens of others.

Today, there are only four companies that manufacture Corrugate, and they pretty much set the price. It's not a monopoly, but it's the next best thing.

You know the difference between the Packaging Industry and the Mafia?

The Mafia has better food.

 

[JoeB131]

[

That you select the 30% markup as your contention shows you are clueless about the business. Ok, they mark the merchandise up 30%. What is the profit margin the business is running?

Uh, no, guy. We were really ripping them off. The profit margin was pretty obscene, actually, and it didn't take the customer that long to figure it out. And when they pushed back on price, the Genius said, "Hey, we've got a three year contract and no one else can do the job we do!"

Well, they were half-right.

Eventually, they just started buying direct from one of the manufacturers.

 

[JoeB131]

[

Ok, Joe, let's see if you are as bright as you claim.

How do you measure whether a business is successful or not?

DILLIGAF!!!

Do I Look Like I Give A Fuck?

Oh, don't worry, when they are talking about raises, they will always poor-mouth and when they are talking about why you should invest in them, they always tell you how awesome they are.

I know that when I was at that company, I reduced their purchasing expenditures by about 20% through careful vendor selection and proper inventory control.

Not that I personally saw much of that.

 

[WinterBorn]

[

That you select the 30% markup as your contention shows you are clueless about the business. Ok, they mark the merchandise up 30%. What is the profit margin the business is running?

Uh, no, guy. We were really ripping them off. The profit margin was pretty obscene, actually, and it didn't take the customer that long to figure it out. And when they pushed back on price, the Genius said, "Hey, we've got a three year contract and no one else can do the job we do!"

Well, they were half-right.

Eventually, they just started buying direct from one of the manufacturers.

If they markup their items 30%, I doubt the profit margins were obscene. Most items sold retail are marked up at least that much, with many items marked up considerably more.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

[

That you select the 30% markup as your contention shows you are clueless about the business. Ok, they mark the merchandise up 30%. What is the profit margin the business is running?

Uh, no, guy. We were really ripping them off. The profit margin was pretty obscene, actually, and it didn't take the customer that long to figure it out. And when they pushed back on price, the Genius said, "Hey, we've got a three year contract and no one else can do the job we do!"

Well, they were half-right.

Eventually, they just started buying direct from one of the manufacturers.

You see mark ups on certain products pushing 100% and more.
30% isn't shocking in the least.

 

[WinterBorn]

[

Ok, Joe, let's see if you are as bright as you claim.

How do you measure whether a business is successful or not?

DILLIGAF!!!

Do I Look Like I Give A Fuck?

Oh, don't worry, when they are talking about raises, they will always poor-mouth and when they are talking about why you should invest in them, they always tell you how awesome they are.

I know that when I was at that company, I reduced their purchasing expenditures by about 20% through careful vendor selection and proper inventory control.

Not that I personally saw much of that.

It wasn't yours to see. You were paid a set amount to do a job.

It is obvious you don't know about what it takes to make a business successful in a competitive market.

But here is something to consider. You say every employer you have had since 1992 has screwed you? Maybe that is just your myopic view. Perhaps if you look at what those businesses had in common? Namely you?

Now you may love to rant about the 1%. But rest assured, most of the people you have dealt with are no more the 1% than you are.

 

[WinterBorn]

[quo

I don't think anyone would argue that unions had their time, and did good things.

But the unions don't give a rat's ass about the workers now. they simply want to maintain their power base and continue to make money.

Ask the workers who were at the Gulf States Paper mill in Tuscaloosa whether the union worked for their best interest.

Unions are needed now for the same reason they were needed then.

Because when you let the people whose obsession with acquiring things becomes a sickness, and they run the economy, you need to protect the rest of us from them.

Now, here's the thing. The company that let me go in 2008 and cured me of any Republican stupidity was actually a company that sold corrugated boxes. So I know quite a lot about that industry.

Had nothing to do with the "union", and more to do with the fact that International Paper bought out that plant, and then closed it down rather than modernize it.

If you've ever dealt with IP (and did on a regular basis for six years), you'd realize they are kind of like the Borg. They buy out a company, usually just to get the equipment and customer base, and the workers be damned.

In the last few years, they've bought out Temple Inland, Box USA, Weyerhouser, and dozens of others.

Today, there are only four companies that manufacture Corrugate, and they pretty much set the price. It's not a monopoly, but it's the next best thing.

You know the difference between the Packaging Industry and the Mafia?

The Mafia has better food.

You know the difference between unions and the Mafia?

Oh, and International Paper is one of the stock in my retirement portfolio. They haven't done great lately, but I expect they will give a good return overall. And that profit is the point of a business. Businesses do not exist to give you cushy jobs with lotsof respect and warm-fuzzy feelings. They exist to make a profit. And their competition is damn sure doing everything they can to make a bigger profit. So either grow up and learn to work in the big boy jobs or keep complaining that someone else is responsible for your problems.

 

[gallantwarrior]

[

Meh....I beat cancer myself. It didnt cost me shit because I have good insurance and a medical savings plan.
Oh...and you cant blame others because you chose a shitty place to work. Thats all on you. And since you were still around to see this supposed loss of 60% of business and 50% of employees and you say "WE" lost,it sounds like you still had a job.
So which is it? Were you fired or not?
You story is contradictory so I'm calling bullshit.

Well, actually, yeah, I can blame the people who made it a shitty place to work because they were in charge of the place. That's the point.

And, no, I was part of the 50% of the employees who got let go. Somewhere in the middle group. They kept me around because 1) they weren't entirely sure if I'd sue them for medical discrimination and 2) when they lost 60% of the business, they still had delusions of getting it back, and frankly, the knowledge I had couldn't be easily replicated.

So they kind of strung me along for a year (I'm actually more pissed about that than I was about getting let go.)

But yeah, Mr. "I don't have to deal with a union" was the guy making all the awful decisions, like "Let's keep soaking our biggest customer with a 30% markup from the Manufacturer".

Your tale of woe begins to clarify:
You apparently worked for a company (business) that, for whatever reasons, began to "go under". In order to try to salvage the business, management began cutting the fat, trimming the overhead, or which labor is often the largest portion.
The concept continues to elude you that people do not run businesses in order to ensure that the employees are always supported in the manner to which they would like to be accustomed. Businesses are established to earn the owners money. If the cost of running the business exceeds the income of the business, something has to be sacrificed.
I agree with Spiderman, why don't you and your union buddies establish your own, competing businesses and show the rest of us how things should be done?

 

[JoeB131]

[

It wasn't yours to see. You were paid a set amount to do a job.

No, it was just my job to make it work. WHich I usually did, despite the bad decisions.

[
It is obvious you don't know about what it takes to make a business successful in a competitive market.

Neither did these morons. Of the five companies I worked for since 1992, one is completely out of business, three of them are operating at less than they were when I was there (or when I started in the case of the current one), one is notorious for hiring dozens of new people every year.

Funny thing. That company actually tried to rehire me because the HR guy didn't read down on the resume to see I had worked for them before.

[
But here is something to consider. You say every employer you have had since 1992 has screwed you? Maybe that is just your myopic view. Perhaps if you look at what those businesses had in common? Namely you?

Maybe you need to go down to the rape crisis center with Spider Troll and tell them they all dressed like sluts. ...

[

Now you may love to rant about the 1%. But rest assured, most of the people you have dealt with are no more the 1% than you are.

No, they are just the toadies who do their bidding, which is sadder.

 

[WinterBorn]

[

It wasn't yours to see. You were paid a set amount to do a job.

No, it was just my job to make it work. WHich I usually did, despite the bad decisions.

[
It is obvious you don't know about what it takes to make a business successful in a competitive market.

Neither did these morons. Of the five companies I worked for since 1992, one is completely out of business, three of them are operating at less than they were when I was there (or when I started in the case of the current one), one is notorious for hiring dozens of new people every year.

Funny thing. That company actually tried to rehire me because the HR guy didn't read down on the resume to see I had worked for them before.

[
But here is something to consider. You say every employer you have had since 1992 has screwed you? Maybe that is just your myopic view. Perhaps if you look at what those businesses had in common? Namely you?

Maybe you need to go down to the rape crisis center with Spider Troll and tell them they all dressed like sluts. ...

[

Now you may love to rant about the 1%. But rest assured, most of the people you have dealt with are no more the 1% than you are.

No, they are just the toadies who do their bidding, which is sadder.

Oh I should go to the rape crisis center??? You are the one who is saying it is ok for a woman to be threatened, harassed, and to have her children threatened. And why? Because her company doesn't hire ONLY union people. They have union and nonunion employees on that job. But since its not 100% union, "she deserves it" when someone threatens her, harasses her, or follows her children?

Your hypocrisy is astounding.