Supreme Court Allows Sandy Hook Families' Case Against Remington Arms To Proceed

[Ghost of a Rider]

Great news. The gun industry has been irresponsible in selling weapons for mass killing to the public. Hopefully they will be soon paying for it.

Supreme Court Allows Sandy Hook Families' Case Against Remington Arms To Proceed

The Supreme Court has denied Remington Arms Co.'s bid to block a lawsuit filed by families who lost loved ones in the Sandy Hook school massacre. The families say Remington should be held liable, as the maker of the AR-15-style rifle used in the 2012 killings.

The link provided by the OP only mentions in passing that the lawsuit is about Remington's advertising of that particular gun. From the link:

"While the suit initially centered on a claim of negligent entrustment — or providing a gun to someone who plans to commit a crime with it — the case now hinges on how Remington marketed the gun."

Also, further down in the article:

"the Sandy Hook families say Remington "published promotional materials that promised 'military-proven performance' for a 'mission-adaptable' shooter in need of the 'ultimate combat weapons system.' " They also accuse the company of fostering a "lone gunman" narrative as it promoted the Bushmaster, citing an ad that proclaimed, "Forces of opposition, bow down. You are single-handedly outnumbered."

So, the lawsuit was changed because you cannot prosecute a manufacturer for the misuse of their product. Now they are going for the advertising claiming that is why Lanza chose that particular rifle. IMO it seems a bit of a stretch to try to divine what was in the killer's mind. Also, that advertisment probably reached thousands if not millions and only Lanza chose to use the rifle to commit his horrendous act.

The problem with this as I see it is that, however Remington marketed the gun, that is not evidence or proof that Lanza even saw the advertisements or acted because of them. Also, the Remington didn't even belong to him and it was right there in the home, making it a weapon of convenience. What was he going to do, go and pay $800 for a new one when there was one right there? I don't think so. I would say that marketing was not a factor here in any way whatsoever.

This whole case stinks and should have been tossed out at the beginning.

This isn't about the merits of the case...this is simply setting the precedent that gun makers can be sued for anything.....and allowing left wing, democrat, anti-gun lawyers sue them into obedience......forcing them to stop making guns for civilians. The democrats want to take every gun maker to court, cost them millions and discourage them from resisting....since fighting back will put them out of business...this should have been squashed at the state level.....

Right. But make no mistake, this is not about saving lives or even about gun control. It's about eliminating a way of life, a way of thinking, a way of viewing the world and a way of belief. This is just the first step in purging what they see as the redneck persona from society. Or at least, taking away all the things that make a redneck a redneck.

If you look at gun control advocates' arguments from a critical thinking perspective, they simply don't stand up and collapse under their own weight. If it was about reducing the number of deaths, they would go after other, worse causes than firearms such as motor vehicle deaths. At the very least they would go after handguns more rigorously than AR-15s as handguns constitute the majority of firearm deaths.

People like this don't give two shits about people dying. What they care about is how they die.

A well written response..Thanks.

I think you're in the right area with your analysis. This is being treated in the same tort model as won against big tobacco.

About changing a way of life? Maybe, maybe not--I've been country all my life...and as long as I can get a gun when I want one...I'm cool. I like it when any huge business takes it in the shorts. Taking them down as peg..as long as my 2nd is intact....is fine with me. I don't foresee a gun shortage any time soon!

Redneckery is alive and well..trust me on this!

ROTFLMAO Guns are not the be-all and the end-all of rural culture. This is a tempest in a teapot, I think

None of that was to say they will be successful or that guns are the end-all, be-all of redneckdom. I just look at the bigger picture and I see a pattern emerging. We see the words "old white men" popping up a lot; people being summarily called "racist" for nothing more than their political views; being judged as "uneducated" and racist for having voted for Trump; being considered a heartless monster who doesn't care about children being killed for supporting the 2nd Amendment; being ridiculed for being Christian, etc., etc.

Liberals these days simply do not (and don't want to) understand middle class rural Americans and it makes them uneasy. The fact that they keep asking why anyone needs an AR-15 is evidence of that. If it were anything else, such as a four wheeler or something, they wouldn't bother asking the question. They simply do not understand the mindset of a gun enthusiast and for that, they feel he shouldn't have his guns. There is much they don't understand about the average conservative and for that, we are evil.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

None of that was to say they will be successful or that guns are the end-all, be-all of redneckdom. I just look at the bigger picture and I see a pattern emerging. We see the words "old white men" popping up a lot; people being summarily called "racist" for nothing more than their political views; being judged as "uneducated" and racist for having voted for Trump; being considered a heartless monster who doesn't care about children being killed for supporting the 2nd Amendment; being ridiculed for being Christian, etc., etc.

Liberals these days simply do not (and don't want to) understand middle class rural Americans and it makes them uneasy. The fact that they keep asking why anyone needs an AR-15 is evidence of that. If it were anything else, such as a four wheeler or something, they wouldn't bother asking the question. They simply do not understand the mindset of a gun enthusiast and for that, they feel he shouldn't have his guns. There is much they don't understand about the average conservative and for that, we are evil.

What it comes down to is that LIbErals, in general, are intensely bigoted against a major part of mainstream America. From Hitllary's “basket of deplorables” remark, to the anti-American rant from EvilEyeFleegle to which you were responding, you see the same hatred, the same contempt, against this heart of the American population and American culture. They openly embrace evil and madness and tyranny, and somehow think that it makes them superior to those who do not.

And then they wonder why they lost so big in 2016, and they will similarly wonder why they will have lost so big in 2020. It will never be enough to court the votes of perverts, criminals, traitors and such, while alienating mainstream Americans.

 

[Aletheia4u]

Hey, if car companies can be sued for lethal airbags, then gun makers should face the same consequences.

And so what about vaccines makers?

Non sequitur. Sorry, but vaccines don't kill people nearly as much as guns do. If you are talking about vaccines POSSIBLY causing autism, again, sorry, because they are still trying to figure if it is real or not. Not vaccinating your kids is dangerous not only to your kids, but to the population at large.

A Botched Vaccine Campaign For Measles Killed 15 Children in South Sudan

You should read your own link. It wasn't because the vaccination itself was dangerous, it was because the vaccines were mishandled and were not properly refrigerated. Sorry, but food can become dangerous if left un refrigerated for a couple of hours. If you don't believe that, then at your next BBQ, leave the potato salad made with mayo out in the sun for a couple of hours before eating. Guarantee it will at a minimum make you sick. If it's bad enough, it can kill you.

Oh, so I guess that heroin users and diabetes patients knows how to handle needles and their insulin heroin that they shoots up, better than those that went to school for handling them.
That is how the vaccines makers lies to get out of trouble. Most vaccines are made with mercury, and that it is very toxic to the brain. You aren't even allowed to touch or inhale that stuff.









People are not dumb as you think.

CDC on vaccines: More children are not getting immunization shots

 

[EvilEyeFleegle]

None of that was to say they will be successful or that guns are the end-all, be-all of redneckdom. I just look at the bigger picture and I see a pattern emerging. We see the words "old white men" popping up a lot; people being summarily called "racist" for nothing more than their political views; being judged as "uneducated" and racist for having voted for Trump; being considered a heartless monster who doesn't care about children being killed for supporting the 2nd Amendment; being ridiculed for being Christian, etc., etc.

Liberals these days simply do not (and don't want to) understand middle class rural Americans and it makes them uneasy. The fact that they keep asking why anyone needs an AR-15 is evidence of that. If it were anything else, such as a four wheeler or something, they wouldn't bother asking the question. They simply do not understand the mindset of a gun enthusiast and for that, they feel he shouldn't have his guns. There is much they don't understand about the average conservative and for that, we are evil.

What it comes down to is that LIbErals, in general, are intensely bigoted against a major part of mainstream America. From Hitllary's “basket of deplorables” remark, to the anti-American rant from EvilEyeFleegle to which you were responding, you see the same hatred, the same contempt, against this heart of the American population and American culture. They openly embrace evil and madness and tyranny, and somehow think that it makes them superior to those who do not.

And then they wonder why they lost so big in 2016, and they will similarly wonder why they will have lost so big in 2020. It will never be enough to court the votes of perverts, criminals, traitors and such, while alienating mainstream Americans.

ROTF!You found that an anti-American rant? Either you can't read...or are as drunk as a skunk!

 

[August West]

The link provided by the OP only mentions in passing that the lawsuit is about Remington's advertising of that particular gun. From the link:

"While the suit initially centered on a claim of negligent entrustment — or providing a gun to someone who plans to commit a crime with it — the case now hinges on how Remington marketed the gun."

Also, further down in the article:

"the Sandy Hook families say Remington "published promotional materials that promised 'military-proven performance' for a 'mission-adaptable' shooter in need of the 'ultimate combat weapons system.' " They also accuse the company of fostering a "lone gunman" narrative as it promoted the Bushmaster, citing an ad that proclaimed, "Forces of opposition, bow down. You are single-handedly outnumbered."

So, the lawsuit was changed because you cannot prosecute a manufacturer for the misuse of their product. Now they are going for the advertising claiming that is why Lanza chose that particular rifle. IMO it seems a bit of a stretch to try to divine what was in the killer's mind. Also, that advertisment probably reached thousands if not millions and only Lanza chose to use the rifle to commit his horrendous act.

The problem with this as I see it is that, however Remington marketed the gun, that is not evidence or proof that Lanza even saw the advertisements or acted because of them. Also, the Remington didn't even belong to him and it was right there in the home, making it a weapon of convenience. What was he going to do, go and pay $800 for a new one when there was one right there? I don't think so. I would say that marketing was not a factor here in any way whatsoever.

This whole case stinks and should have been tossed out at the beginning.

This isn't about the merits of the case...this is simply setting the precedent that gun makers can be sued for anything.....and allowing left wing, democrat, anti-gun lawyers sue them into obedience......forcing them to stop making guns for civilians. The democrats want to take every gun maker to court, cost them millions and discourage them from resisting....since fighting back will put them out of business...this should have been squashed at the state level.....

Right. But make no mistake, this is not about saving lives or even about gun control. It's about eliminating a way of life, a way of thinking, a way of viewing the world and a way of belief. This is just the first step in purging what they see as the redneck persona from society. Or at least, taking away all the things that make a redneck a redneck.

If you look at gun control advocates' arguments from a critical thinking perspective, they simply don't stand up and collapse under their own weight. If it was about reducing the number of deaths, they would go after other, worse causes than firearms such as motor vehicle deaths. At the very least they would go after handguns more rigorously than AR-15s as handguns constitute the majority of firearm deaths.

People like this don't give two shits about people dying. What they care about is how they die.

A well written response..Thanks.

I think you're in the right area with your analysis. This is being treated in the same tort model as won against big tobacco.

About changing a way of life? Maybe, maybe not--I've been country all my life...and as long as I can get a gun when I want one...I'm cool. I like it when any huge business takes it in the shorts. Taking them down as peg..as long as my 2nd is intact....is fine with me. I don't foresee a gun shortage any time soon!

Redneckery is alive and well..trust me on this!

ROTFLMAO Guns are not the be-all and the end-all of rural culture. This is a tempest in a teapot, I think

None of that was to say they will be successful or that guns are the end-all, be-all of redneckdom. I just look at the bigger picture and I see a pattern emerging. We see the words "old white men" popping up a lot; people being summarily called "racist" for nothing more than their political views; being judged as "uneducated" and racist for having voted for Trump; being considered a heartless monster who doesn't care about children being killed for supporting the 2nd Amendment; being ridiculed for being Christian, etc., etc.

Liberals these days simply do not (and don't want to) understand middle class rural Americans and it makes them uneasy. The fact that they keep asking why anyone needs an AR-15 is evidence of that. If it were anything else, such as a four wheeler or something, they wouldn't bother asking the question. They simply do not understand the mindset of a gun enthusiast and for that, they feel he shouldn't have his guns. There is much they don't understand about the average conservative and for that, we are evil.

Here`s an alternate theory. Could it be that Americans are tired of seeing people leaving Walmart, schools, churches, etc. in body bags? You simply do not understand the mindset of those who are anti-mass murder. No one wants your deer rifle or your six shooter.

 

[JoeB131]

From what I understand is he was too young to buy that type of weapon so advertising has no basis in this case. It will go nowhere.

The problem is, his mother was the kind of irresponsbile crazy person that never should have had that kind of gun to start with. Remington put that gun in that home with the crazy mom and the brain damaged kid.

 

[JoeB131]

The problem with this argument is that Americans have always had the right to keep and bear arms and have been doing so from the beginning, long before the first mass shooting.

The right to keep and bear arms has no bearing on mass shootings other than that the firearms are just a tool to commit mass killing. If it did, there would always have been mass shootings. This should tell any person with a modicum of common sense and critical thinking that the guns are not what is killing the people, per se.

Most of our history, civilians did not have access to weapons like THIS!

The problem with the gun nuts is they misrepresent history. Gun ownership was actually RARE in the colonies. A gun cost more than a skilled laborer made in a month, and it had very little value to most people, so few people had them. Guns were actually owned by the state militias...

Industrialization in the 19th century made them a little more common, but nowhere near what we have today.

 

[JoeB131]

Right. But make no mistake, this is not about saving lives or even about gun control. It's about eliminating a way of life, a way of thinking, a way of viewing the world and a way of belief. This is just the first step in purging what they see as the redneck persona from society. Or at least, taking away all the things that make a redneck a redneck.

Good point. Once we end the gun ownership, we need to end the inbreeding you people do, it's just making you mean and stupid.

If you look at gun control advocates' arguments from a critical thinking perspective, they simply don't stand up and collapse under their own weight. If it was about reducing the number of deaths, they would go after other, worse causes than firearms such as motor vehicle deaths. At the very least they would go after handguns more rigorously than AR-15s as handguns constitute the majority of firearm deaths.

People like this don't give two shits about people dying. What they care about is how they die.

Okay, let's look at this shit-for-brains argument.

Yes, more people die in accidents in a needed vehicle that we use every day. But everyone involved is working very hard to make them safer. The car companies roll out new safety features every year, government puts up new traffic controls and regulations every year. When a problem emerges, like idiots texting and driving, we pass sensible laws against doing that. We make the laws against DUI tougher every year...

ON the other hand, THERE IS NO GOOD REASON for a civilian to own an AR-15 or other military grade assault rifle. None. They have limited utility for home defense, they aren't good for hunting... they are designed for one purpose, and one purpose only, which is to kill people.

So, um, yeah, when Remington decides to sell that weapon to Crazy Nancy Lanza and her Zombie Kid, they are responsible for what follows.

 

[JoeB131]

Hey, if car companies can be sued for lethal airbags, then gun makers should face the same consequences.

And so what about vaccines makers?

What about them? Oh, wait, you are one of those crazy Anti-Vaxers, aren't you?

 

[JoeB131]

None of that was to say they will be successful or that guns are the end-all, be-all of redneckdom. I just look at the bigger picture and I see a pattern emerging. We see the words "old white men" popping up a lot; people being summarily called "racist" for nothing more than their political views; being judged as "uneducated" and racist for having voted for Trump; being considered a heartless monster who doesn't care about children being killed for supporting the 2nd Amendment; being ridiculed for being Christian, etc., etc.

Um, yeah, the thing is, all of those are valid complaints.

Most of Trump's supporters ARE racist. They enjoy the fact Trump can get away with racism that would get their asses hauled down to Human Resources.

Liberals these days simply do not (and don't want to) understand middle class rural Americans and it makes them uneasy. The fact that they keep asking why anyone needs an AR-15 is evidence of that. If it were anything else, such as a four wheeler or something, they wouldn't bother asking the question. They simply do not understand the mindset of a gun enthusiast and for that, they feel he shouldn't have his guns. There is much they don't understand about the average conservative and for that, we are evil.

Oh, quite the contrary, I understand your mindset perfectly fine. The problem with the Angry White Male is that he's angry that he doesn't enjoy the affluence his father or grandfather enjoyed, but he's too stupid to realize who took that affluence away from him. So he clings to his guns and his bible like that does him any good. And when Trump tells him to blame the darkies who have a little more than they used to have, instead of the wealthy like himself who took that affluence away, they go for it... mostly because it's always easier to kick down than to punch up.

 

[JoeB131]

What it comes down to is that LIbErals, in general, are intensely bigoted against a major part of mainstream America. From Hitllary's “basket of deplorables” remark, to the anti-American rant from EvilEyeFleegle to which you were responding, you see the same hatred, the same contempt, against this heart of the American population and American culture. They openly embrace evil and madness and tyranny, and somehow think that it makes them superior to those who do not.

And then they wonder why they lost so big in 2016, and they will similarly wonder why they will have lost so big in 2020. It will never be enough to court the votes of perverts, criminals, traitors and such, while alienating mainstream Americans.

Yawn.. guy, 54% of the population voted against Trump in 2016. You've already lost the room, you are just relying on technicalities to win now..

The reality is, you guys are on the losing side of history... Racism is no longer acceptable. Homophobia is no longer acceptable. Any day now, your Mormon Prophet is going to have a talk with God and find out God is okay with the gays...

 

[flack]

Hey, if car companies can be sued for lethal airbags, then gun makers should face the same consequences.

And so what about vaccines makers?

Non sequitur. Sorry, but vaccines don't kill people nearly as much as guns do. If you are talking about vaccines POSSIBLY causing autism, again, sorry, because they are still trying to figure if it is real or not. Not vaccinating your kids is dangerous not only to your kids, but to the population at large.

A Botched Vaccine Campaign For Measles Killed 15 Children in South Sudan

You should read your own link. It wasn't because the vaccination itself was dangerous, it was because the vaccines were mishandled and were not properly refrigerated. Sorry, but food can become dangerous if left un refrigerated for a couple of hours. If you don't believe that, then at your next BBQ, leave the potato salad made with mayo out in the sun for a couple of hours before eating. Guarantee it will at a minimum make you sick. If it's bad enough, it can kill you.

It's not the mayo it's the onions that make you sick.

 

[flack]

None of that was to say they will be successful or that guns are the end-all, be-all of redneckdom. I just look at the bigger picture and I see a pattern emerging. We see the words "old white men" popping up a lot; people being summarily called "racist" for nothing more than their political views; being judged as "uneducated" and racist for having voted for Trump; being considered a heartless monster who doesn't care about children being killed for supporting the 2nd Amendment; being ridiculed for being Christian, etc., etc.

Um, yeah, the thing is, all of those are valid complaints.

Most of Trump's supporters ARE racist. They enjoy the fact Trump can get away with racism that would get their asses hauled down to Human Resources.

Liberals these days simply do not (and don't want to) understand middle class rural Americans and it makes them uneasy. The fact that they keep asking why anyone needs an AR-15 is evidence of that. If it were anything else, such as a four wheeler or something, they wouldn't bother asking the question. They simply do not understand the mindset of a gun enthusiast and for that, they feel he shouldn't have his guns. There is much they don't understand about the average conservative and for that, we are evil.

Oh, quite the contrary, I understand your mindset perfectly fine. The problem with the Angry White Male is that he's angry that he doesn't enjoy the affluence his father or grandfather enjoyed, but he's too stupid to realize who took that affluence away from him. So he clings to his guns and his bible like that does him any good. And when Trump tells him to blame the darkies who have a little more than they used to have, instead of the wealthy like himself who took that affluence away, they go for it... mostly because it's always easier to kick down than to punch up.

Wow, just wow.

 

[flack]

What it comes down to is that LIbErals, in general, are intensely bigoted against a major part of mainstream America. From Hitllary's “basket of deplorables” remark, to the anti-American rant from EvilEyeFleegle to which you were responding, you see the same hatred, the same contempt, against this heart of the American population and American culture. They openly embrace evil and madness and tyranny, and somehow think that it makes them superior to those who do not.

And then they wonder why they lost so big in 2016, and they will similarly wonder why they will have lost so big in 2020. It will never be enough to court the votes of perverts, criminals, traitors and such, while alienating mainstream Americans.

Yawn.. guy, 54% of the population voted against Trump in 2016. You've already lost the room, you are just relying on technicalities to win now..

The reality is, you guys are on the losing side of history... Racism is no longer acceptable. Homophobia is no longer acceptable. Any day now, your Mormon Prophet is going to have a talk with God and find out God is okay with the gays...

Uh, no. A third of the voting age population didn't vote at all.

 

[flack]

Right. But make no mistake, this is not about saving lives or even about gun control. It's about eliminating a way of life, a way of thinking, a way of viewing the world and a way of belief. This is just the first step in purging what they see as the redneck persona from society. Or at least, taking away all the things that make a redneck a redneck.

Good point. Once we end the gun ownership, we need to end the inbreeding you people do, it's just making you mean and stupid.

If you look at gun control advocates' arguments from a critical thinking perspective, they simply don't stand up and collapse under their own weight. If it was about reducing the number of deaths, they would go after other, worse causes than firearms such as motor vehicle deaths. At the very least they would go after handguns more rigorously than AR-15s as handguns constitute the majority of firearm deaths.

People like this don't give two shits about people dying. What they care about is how they die.

Okay, let's look at this shit-for-brains argument.

Yes, more people die in accidents in a needed vehicle that we use every day. But everyone involved is working very hard to make them safer. The car companies roll out new safety features every year, government puts up new traffic controls and regulations every year. When a problem emerges, like idiots texting and driving, we pass sensible laws against doing that. We make the laws against DUI tougher every year...

ON the other hand, THERE IS NO GOOD REASON for a civilian to own an AR-15 or other military grade assault rifle. None. They have limited utility for home defense, they aren't good for hunting... they are designed for one purpose, and one purpose only, which is to kill people.

So, um, yeah, when Remington decides to sell that weapon to Crazy Nancy Lanza and her Zombie Kid, they are responsible for what follows.

There is no military in the world that uses or owns an AR-15. It would be suicide to do so.

 

[JoeB131]

Uh, no. A third of the voting age population didn't vote at all.

So. They never do... what's your point?

There is no military in the world that uses or owns an AR-15. It would be suicide to do so.

The AR-15 and M-16 are the same weapon... the M16 just has a full-auto option.

 

[Ghost of a Rider]

The problem with this as I see it is that, however Remington marketed the gun, that is not evidence or proof that Lanza even saw the advertisements or acted because of them. Also, the Remington didn't even belong to him and it was right there in the home, making it a weapon of convenience. What was he going to do, go and pay $800 for a new one when there was one right there? I don't think so. I would say that marketing was not a factor here in any way whatsoever.

This whole case stinks and should have been tossed out at the beginning.

This isn't about the merits of the case...this is simply setting the precedent that gun makers can be sued for anything.....and allowing left wing, democrat, anti-gun lawyers sue them into obedience......forcing them to stop making guns for civilians. The democrats want to take every gun maker to court, cost them millions and discourage them from resisting....since fighting back will put them out of business...this should have been squashed at the state level.....

Right. But make no mistake, this is not about saving lives or even about gun control. It's about eliminating a way of life, a way of thinking, a way of viewing the world and a way of belief. This is just the first step in purging what they see as the redneck persona from society. Or at least, taking away all the things that make a redneck a redneck.

If you look at gun control advocates' arguments from a critical thinking perspective, they simply don't stand up and collapse under their own weight. If it was about reducing the number of deaths, they would go after other, worse causes than firearms such as motor vehicle deaths. At the very least they would go after handguns more rigorously than AR-15s as handguns constitute the majority of firearm deaths.

People like this don't give two shits about people dying. What they care about is how they die.

A well written response..Thanks.

I think you're in the right area with your analysis. This is being treated in the same tort model as won against big tobacco.

About changing a way of life? Maybe, maybe not--I've been country all my life...and as long as I can get a gun when I want one...I'm cool. I like it when any huge business takes it in the shorts. Taking them down as peg..as long as my 2nd is intact....is fine with me. I don't foresee a gun shortage any time soon!

Redneckery is alive and well..trust me on this!

ROTFLMAO Guns are not the be-all and the end-all of rural culture. This is a tempest in a teapot, I think

None of that was to say they will be successful or that guns are the end-all, be-all of redneckdom. I just look at the bigger picture and I see a pattern emerging. We see the words "old white men" popping up a lot; people being summarily called "racist" for nothing more than their political views; being judged as "uneducated" and racist for having voted for Trump; being considered a heartless monster who doesn't care about children being killed for supporting the 2nd Amendment; being ridiculed for being Christian, etc., etc.

Liberals these days simply do not (and don't want to) understand middle class rural Americans and it makes them uneasy. The fact that they keep asking why anyone needs an AR-15 is evidence of that. If it were anything else, such as a four wheeler or something, they wouldn't bother asking the question. They simply do not understand the mindset of a gun enthusiast and for that, they feel he shouldn't have his guns. There is much they don't understand about the average conservative and for that, we are evil.

Here`s an alternate theory. Could it be that Americans are tired of seeing people leaving Walmart, schools, churches, etc. in body bags? You simply do not understand the mindset of those who are anti-mass murder.

I understand the mindset of those who are anti-mass murder as I am anti-mass murder myself. Are you implying that gun enthusiasts are pro-mass murder?

No one wants your deer rifle or your six shooter.

I don't own a six shooter and I'm not offering my deer rifle to anyone and you are not obligated to take it.

 

[Ghost of a Rider]

From what I understand is he was too young to buy that type of weapon so advertising has no basis in this case. It will go nowhere.

The problem is, his mother was the kind of irresponsbile crazy person that never should have had that kind of gun to start with. Remington put that gun in that home with the crazy mom and the brain damaged kid.

First of all, Remington didn't put that rifle anywhere but on the store shelf. The mom put it in the home. Secondly, Remington has no way of knowing if a particular customer will use their product irresponsibly and they are not obligated to know. They and all other gun manufacturers don't sell their product to the customer, they sell it to the dealers and the dealers are duly licensed to do so.

 

[Ghost of a Rider]

The problem with this argument is that Americans have always had the right to keep and bear arms and have been doing so from the beginning, long before the first mass shooting.

The right to keep and bear arms has no bearing on mass shootings other than that the firearms are just a tool to commit mass killing. If it did, there would always have been mass shootings. This should tell any person with a modicum of common sense and critical thinking that the guns are not what is killing the people, per se.

Most of our history, civilians did not have access to weapons like THIS!

View attachment 289733

Like what, a rifle that shoots no faster than a semi-automatic pistol but looks like an M-16?

The problem with the gun nuts is they misrepresent history. Gun ownership was actually RARE in the colonies. A gun cost more than a skilled laborer made in a month, and it had very little value to most people, so few people had them. Guns were actually owned by the state militias...

Industrialization in the 19th century made them a little more common, but nowhere near what we have today.

It doesn't negate the fact that the 2nd Amendment says "...the right to keep and bear arms...". It also doesn't negate the fact that some citizens did have guns and they wanted to make sure they would always have the right to own them. Also, when they wrote the Constitution, they likely had no idea how many citizens actually had guns and probably didn't care. They just wanted to be sure that in times of trouble, the citizens would be armed or could be armed to help defend the country.

 

[flack]

Uh, no. A third of the voting age population didn't vote at all.

So. They never do... what's your point?

There is no military in the world that uses or owns an AR-15. It would be suicide to do so.

The AR-15 and M-16 are the same weapon... the M16 just has a full-auto option.

A fact sheet of the FBI’s 2018 crime statistics published Monday detailed some of the Bureau’s analysis of crime statistics, particularly studying the types of weapons used in murders. Rifles, as a particular category of firearm, were used to kill 297 people in 2018. By comparison, knives and other cutting instruments were the murder weapon for 1,515 murders in 2018.


The rifle category of firearms is a broad one comprised of bolt, pump, and lever-action firearms in addition to semi-automatic firearms like AR-15s, suggesting semi-automatic rifles comprise an even smaller number than the 297 total murders by rifle in 2018.



As a complete category in the FBI statistics, all firearms accounted for 10,265 of the 14,123 murders assessed for the year 2018.


Handguns were the primary firearm used in murders, having been used in 6,603 of the firearm-related murders, while shotguns were used in 235 murders, “other guns” were used in 167 and unspecified types of firearms accounted for the 2,963 remaining firearms-related murders.