Teacher Compensation

[Dekster]

I think teacher pay should be increased commensurate to a teacher's education. Teachers should have a formal education background in the courses they are instructing. For example, my biology teacher in high school had his masters in the field. My history teacher had her masters and was a former USN officer and War College instructor. Their experience and educational backgrounds were evident, both in their curriculum and in their ability to deviate and expound upon subjects.

That along with results
I want to see improved performance of their students regardless of their level
D students become C students
C students become B students
B students become A students

That is a problem as educational success has been measured for far too long based upon performance of students. This is too easily manipulated. As a result our schools have been 'dumbed down' ridiculously to accommodate the slowest.
Doubt me? Take the time to peruse 19th and early 20th century textbooks. Students were required to critically think about the material presented to them. School today is a joke...many students agree.
High school is just too easy, students say
What we need to do is to raise the standards required of students. If you press them to strive they will. You cannot expect to produce future leaders by hamstringing the masses for the benefit of the stupid or lazy. As it sits, K-12 in the US is a joke.

In our state there is a rudimentary bar that students must pass. The school is evaluated on how many students you can get over the bar

To me, if you can take a student who has little promise in life and teach him basic functionality......you have accomplished a lot

19th and early 20th century schooling was a sham. More emphasis on memorization of irrelevant facts and rote learning than critical thinking

I think today’s students are more creative

Creativity and critical thinking are not always the same thing. Need to write a critical analysis, just google it. Somebody else has already done it for you. Just change the wording.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

I think teacher pay should be increased commensurate to a teacher's education. Teachers should have a formal education background in the courses they are instructing. For example, my biology teacher in high school had his masters in the field. My history teacher had her masters and was a former USN officer and War College instructor. Their experience and educational backgrounds were evident, both in their curriculum and in their ability to deviate and expound upon subjects.

What makes you think they aren't?

I have a Master's degree and get paid more because of it.

Well, if they are, then they should be compensated in kind. If they are not then they should not. This is not rocket surgery. Who would you rather take a biology course from? An English lit grad or a biologist?

Did you read my post?

Teachers are certified in the subject they teach about 99 percent of the time. You can be certified without having the degree. I teach math but took my classwork at 2 different schools and I know the subject better than those with a degree hang on the wall. I do have a degree in history and masters in education.

Did you not comprehend my post? There is a distinct difference between certification to instruct a subject and formal learning in that subject. Do you dispute the depth of knowledge that one would gain? Don't you feel that teachers who are FORMALLY trained in maths, biology et al. should be better compensated to encourage entrants FROM those fields?
You teaching math with a history degree is a prime example of the NORM.

Certification requires you be TESTED to verify you have the requisite knowledge to teach the course.

As I stated, I have all the requirements for a degree in math but I gained them at two different universities, so I have no degree from either one. I am a better math teacher than most who have math education degrees and plain old math degrees.

Do you know why I can't get a regular job as a math teacher with 21 years as an educator? They do not want to pay me even the $50K salary I would get. They would rather get someone out of college at $35K a year and keep them 4 years and discard them before they get tenure.

The high school where I normally substitute has a math position and chemistry position they cannot fill because the district is under a budget freeze because our state legislature is cutting the budget about 17%.

Right now, I get paid $105 a day with zero benefits to cover a National Guardsman who was called up for a training deployment. They will actually save thousands of dollars over the next 3 months by having me replace him. He will make more drawing a Captain's pay than he did as a teacher by a long shot!

 

[Anathema]

Since the law has been in force for decades and I wasn't a teacher in KY until 2007, what difference did it make?

Then maybe you should have chosen a different profession or a different state to be a teacher in.

 

[Dekster]

There is only so much money to go around. Raising education spending may require cuts to police or fire departments or highways or whatever. States cannot print their own money so if teachers need to be paid more, then you should tell us what you think should be cut to pay for it. Whenever teacher pay makes the front page of the paper (or police pay or sanitation workers pay) I know for certain I can expect 1) to see the real estate assessor's car setting in front of my house reassessing my property and 2) Enhanced enforcement of zoning/local code is about to start up. They just raised rates over 11% this year so they know they will not be able to raise those again anytime soon so they will inflate assessments.

Again, you get what you pay for

If education is not a priority, teachers are always at the back of the line
A college educated teacher who is not even making $40,000 after ten years on the job will find better options

Yet they seldom do....

Many do ....especially in math, science, computers

Then the problem is solved. Let them go work in math and science and computers, but in the redneck part of our nation, they are going to have a hard time finding a job doing that in their field, so hope they didn't buy a house with a big fat mortgage that needs paying off.

What happens to the students in those states who don’t have qualified teachers in math, science, computers or any other subject in demand in the private sector?

They go to college and learn what they need to know. It isn't like a high school diploma means anything. A 4 year degree barely means something.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Some of you are whining about a person making 40 some thousand per year...chump change...poverty pay.

Then they shouldn't have taken the job. Their problem, not mine.

No, the problem is now we will not be getting the pay and pension that we were promised when we took the damn job!

Would you like it if your boss came in and said, I am taking away part of your pay and reducing your pension and there is not a damn thing you can do about it? Also, if you retire before Medicare kicks in, you are on your own!

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Teachers are not all unionized. Being a union member before you get tenure is stupid because they will not represent you.

Strikes are illegal in most locations.

Tell me about this supposed power that teachers have when they can not strike?!

Any non-unionized teacher is a fool, who deserves exactly what they get.

The rest of your post is simply a matter of poorly negotiated contracts. Especially the inability to strike. I work in a Federslly regulated industry far more important than teaching and we retain our right to strike.

Good for you dumbass! You are not subject to state governments! Get an education about education, dumbass!

Your posts are misguided rantings. That is all!

You vote for those who make the decisions in your State.

But those who teach our Children are the future of those same Children’s
That will take over our Country. Nothing is more Importatnt.

Good for you dumbass! You are not subject to state governments! Get an education about education, dumbass!

We're also regulated at the Stste level. I can guarantee you that we would not allow any clause reducing our ability to righteously strike when necessary.

Strikes were outlawed decades ago. Our state legislature just financially raped every teacher by passing a pension reform bill that will cost every retiree dearly. We're they listening then like they did when they outlawed strikes? Yes, it is a law not a fucking contract item.

Reminder. Kasich.

We killed him at the Ballot box. His remark! “ The people have spoken!” 1.3 Million signatures and an overwhelming rejecton at the Voting booth.

Time to Talk About John Kasich's Biggest Failure as Ohio Governor: Union Reform

No. I vote for 3 people that make decisions in may state. That is all. I have a state rep, state senator and governor. The last vote for our governor is one I will not make again.

 

[rightwinger]

I think teacher pay should be increased commensurate to a teacher's education. Teachers should have a formal education background in the courses they are instructing. For example, my biology teacher in high school had his masters in the field. My history teacher had her masters and was a former USN officer and War College instructor. Their experience and educational backgrounds were evident, both in their curriculum and in their ability to deviate and expound upon subjects.

That along with results
I want to see improved performance of their students regardless of their level
D students become C students
C students become B students
B students become A students

That is a problem as educational success has been measured for far too long based upon performance of students. This is too easily manipulated. As a result our schools have been 'dumbed down' ridiculously to accommodate the slowest.
Doubt me? Take the time to peruse 19th and early 20th century textbooks. Students were required to critically think about the material presented to them. School today is a joke...many students agree.
High school is just too easy, students say
What we need to do is to raise the standards required of students. If you press them to strive they will. You cannot expect to produce future leaders by hamstringing the masses for the benefit of the stupid or lazy. As it sits, K-12 in the US is a joke.

In our state there is a rudimentary bar that students must pass. The school is evaluated on how many students you can get over the bar

To me, if you can take a student who has little promise in life and teach him basic functionality......you have accomplished a lot

19th and early 20th century schooling was a sham. More emphasis on memorization of irrelevant facts and rote learning than critical thinking

I think today’s students are more creative

Creativity and critical thinking are not always the same thing. Need to write a critical analysis, just google it. Somebody else has already done it for you. Just change the wording.

Agree

But students today have all the knowledge in the world available on their smartphone. They can communicate instantly with anyone on earth and are quite adept at emerging technology

A 19th century student may memorize more facts, but facts can be quickly googled

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

I think Hills only retired old people, and teachers thinking they would be making what the top graduate at an Ivy League school would be getting is their own naive nature. Every time I hear a teacher complain about their pay, I tell them, "Well quit and go into the private sector." I have yet to see someone do it.

If we all did that, what would the schools do? They will close, like the schools did in KY when the state legislature stabbed us in the back last week!

Home school. one parent will have to stay home which will create a labor shortage which will drive up wages and make us all so rich we don't need no stinking education.

Go for it! You want to raise another generation of idiots, go right ahead!

The biggest complaint from parents is that they don't understand math. You want parents to teach them now?

 

[rightwinger]

Again, you get what you pay for

If education is not a priority, teachers are always at the back of the line
A college educated teacher who is not even making $40,000 after ten years on the job will find better options

Yet they seldom do....

Many do ....especially in math, science, computers

Then the problem is solved. Let them go work in math and science and computers, but in the redneck part of our nation, they are going to have a hard time finding a job doing that in their field, so hope they didn't buy a house with a big fat mortgage that needs paying off.

What happens to the students in those states who don’t have qualified teachers in math, science, computers or any other subject in demand in the private sector?

They go to college and learn what they need to know. It isn't like a high school diploma means anything. A 4 year degree barely means something.

Bullshit

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Since the law has been in force for decades and I wasn't a teacher in KY until 2007, what difference did it make?

Then maybe you should have chosen a different profession or a different state to be a teacher in.

I was naval officer until the Cold War ended. I was already shafted once.

The problem is idiots like you don't realize that each and every state will be going through this. Does West Virginia ring a bell? I was a teacher in Florida and left there because the pay sucked! You want me to change again? I can't afford to move!

 

[Anathema]

No, the problem is now we will not be getting the pay and pension that we were promised when we took the damn job!

Would you like it if your boss came in and said, I am taking away part of your pay and reducing your pension and there is not a damn thing you can do about it? Also, if you retire before Medicare kicks in, you are on your own!

Seems like your Union isn't worth shit.

I've been a Contractor, a Management employee and now for the last ten years as a Union employee. In fact I was one of the people who pushed for my Department to Unionize in 2007.

Why? Specifically because my employer was seeking to screw us over and we weren't going to stand for that. The Union has preserved many of our benefits and gotten us many more than we've lost. In fact I got a Pension by joining the Union that I didn't have as a Management employee.

I will not be accepting Medicare or Social Security for Moral reasons.

 

[Dekster]

Yet they seldom do....

Many do ....especially in math, science, computers

Then the problem is solved. Let them go work in math and science and computers, but in the redneck part of our nation, they are going to have a hard time finding a job doing that in their field, so hope they didn't buy a house with a big fat mortgage that needs paying off.

What happens to the students in those states who don’t have qualified teachers in math, science, computers or any other subject in demand in the private sector?

They go to college and learn what they need to know. It isn't like a high school diploma means anything. A 4 year degree barely means something.

Bullshit

I take it you never went to college then American lit, same stuff. Britist lit, same stuff. Biology, chemistry, history, same stuff.

 

[Dekster]

I think Hills only retired old people, and teachers thinking they would be making what the top graduate at an Ivy League school would be getting is their own naive nature. Every time I hear a teacher complain about their pay, I tell them, "Well quit and go into the private sector." I have yet to see someone do it.

If we all did that, what would the schools do? They will close, like the schools did in KY when the state legislature stabbed us in the back last week!

Home school. one parent will have to stay home which will create a labor shortage which will drive up wages and make us all so rich we don't need no stinking education.

Go for it! You want to raise another generation of idiots, go right ahead!

The biggest complaint from parents is that they don't understand math. You want parents to teach them now?

They couldn't do worse than this common core finger counting crap they are doing instead of having people just learn how to do things in their head.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

No, the problem is now we will not be getting the pay and pension that we were promised when we took the damn job!

Would you like it if your boss came in and said, I am taking away part of your pay and reducing your pension and there is not a damn thing you can do about it? Also, if you retire before Medicare kicks in, you are on your own!

Seems like your Union isn't worth shit.

I've been a Contractor, a Management employee and now for the last ten years as a Union employee. In fact I was one of the people who pushed for my Department to Unionize in 2007.

Why? Specifically because my employer was seeking to screw us over and we weren't going to stand for that. The Union has preserved many of our benefits and gotten us many more than we've lost. In fact I got a Pension by joining the Union that I didn't have as a Management employee.

I will not be accepting Medicare or Social Security for Moral reasons.

You are just a pompous blowhard who has a bullshit answer for everything. First, the unions are all powerful and then you claim they aren't worth shit? Which is it, dumbass? Make up your mind!

You are a waste of good oxygen!

 

[TheOldSchool]

These states look at education as nonessential and are willing to hire those who may not be the best available. The bottom of the barrel is good enough to educate their youth

Trump country

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

I think Hills only retired old people, and teachers thinking they would be making what the top graduate at an Ivy League school would be getting is their own naive nature. Every time I hear a teacher complain about their pay, I tell them, "Well quit and go into the private sector." I have yet to see someone do it.

If we all did that, what would the schools do? They will close, like the schools did in KY when the state legislature stabbed us in the back last week!

Home school. one parent will have to stay home which will create a labor shortage which will drive up wages and make us all so rich we don't need no stinking education.

Go for it! You want to raise another generation of idiots, go right ahead!

The biggest complaint from parents is that they don't understand math. You want parents to teach them now?

They couldn't do worse than this common core finger counting crap they are doing instead of having people just learn how to do things in their head.

Where did you get your degree in math and your education degree? I must have missed it!

Just because you don't understand it doesn't mean the kids cannot handle it. The methods actually help you do the math in your head as opposed to working it out on paper. I'll bet you had no clue that was the case.

 

[Dekster]

Since the law has been in force for decades and I wasn't a teacher in KY until 2007, what difference did it make?

Then maybe you should have chosen a different profession or a different state to be a teacher in.

I was naval officer until the Cold War ended. I was already shafted once.

The problem is idiots like you don't realize that each and every state will be going through this. Does West Virginia ring a bell? I was a teacher in Florida and left there because the pay sucked! You want me to change again? I can't afford to move!

Teach NJROTC instead of substitute teaching

 

[Dekster]

I think Hills only retired old people, and teachers thinking they would be making what the top graduate at an Ivy League school would be getting is their own naive nature. Every time I hear a teacher complain about their pay, I tell them, "Well quit and go into the private sector." I have yet to see someone do it.

If we all did that, what would the schools do? They will close, like the schools did in KY when the state legislature stabbed us in the back last week!

Home school. one parent will have to stay home which will create a labor shortage which will drive up wages and make us all so rich we don't need no stinking education.

Go for it! You want to raise another generation of idiots, go right ahead!

The biggest complaint from parents is that they don't understand math. You want parents to teach them now?

They couldn't do worse than this common core finger counting crap they are doing instead of having people just learn how to do things in their head.

Where did you get your degree in math and your education degree? I must have missed it!

Just because you don't understand it doesn't mean the kids cannot handle it. The methods actually help you do the math in your head as opposed to working it out on paper. I'll bet you had no clue that was the case.

I know I stood up in class and had to recite my multiplication tables up to 13 squared in 4th grade without needing to use my fingers. 75% of common core seniors fail the math test. 63% fail the reading test. 2/3rds of CC seniors are rated as not ready for college. If that is a success to you, you should have stayed in the military.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Since the law has been in force for decades and I wasn't a teacher in KY until 2007, what difference did it make?

Then maybe you should have chosen a different profession or a different state to be a teacher in.

I was naval officer until the Cold War ended. I was already shafted once.

The problem is idiots like you don't realize that each and every state will be going through this. Does West Virginia ring a bell? I was a teacher in Florida and left there because the pay sucked! You want me to change again? I can't afford to move!

Teach NJROTC instead of substitute teaching

You obviously have no clue as to the requirements to teach NJROTC do you? Of course not! You are just like Anathema and throwing crap into the game. I am not retired, so I cannot do it.

Besides, do you know how many NJROTC units are withing driving distance of my home? They are all in a district where I would not work if you. Most rural schools do not have enough students to support an ROTC and the waiting list is endless even if they do.

The district I am in has three high schools, and all have Army JROTC. The district I live in has three high schools and they all have Army JROTC. Think it might be because we are next to an Army post?

 

[Anathema]

You are just a pompous blowhard who has a bullshit answer for everything. First, the unions are all powerful and then you claim they aren't worth shit? Which is it, dumbass? Make up your mind!!

No. I said YOUR Union isn't worth shit, and from what you've said, I stand by that statement.