The anti-free speech left

[kaz]

It's sad that the bastions of anti-free speech hate are schools.

- The faculty and students of "liberal" universities melt down when anyone not hard left is going to speak at commencement or anything else and they shout down anyone who disagrees with them on campus. And administrators are supporting them.

- As any parent of non-liberal teenagers knows, our children are berated into silence on their views while they are endlessly subjected to leftist ideology ... from the teachers. Teachers routinely punish our kids with poor grades for even suggesting non-liberal ideas in their work.

- You can be pro-Muslim or other religions and speak to it, but if you're Christian or Jewish then STFU about your views, no one wants to hear it. By no one I mean the leftists.

Wasn't education where we were supposed to be able to express and explore all thought? So where are you, leftists? Why are you not only not being outraged at the limit of speech, but you cheer it on? Don't tell me you lied? Really, don't, you don't have to.

And why am I paying for this? It's no wonder the left grow up to throttle free speech, it's what you teach your children. And you wonder why Trump won ...

I admit we can be intolerant assholes but you guys are just as bad so stop pretending

We can? What have libertarians done to try to limit free speech?

I was going to thank you for the honesty in the first half, but you finished it with your intellectually obtuse, everyone not a Democrat is a Republican, duh, dar, drool. Tell me again how you're smarter than Republicans because you aren't all black and white like they are. They usually have no problem understanding I'm not Republican or Democrat. They're just smarter than you are

Libertarians are conservatives you stupid son of a bitch. And they are basically Republicans except they believe in paying no taxes. How the fuck are you going to pay for a broken stop light with no taxes, dumbshit? Get off your high horse

Right, we're conservatives who want to slash the military, pull out of wars and end morality laws.

And I called you intellectually obtuse. Nailed it!

The reason you see us that way is your greed. All you care about is other people's money and getting your hands on it. So that's the way you measure us.

BTW, we aren't conservatives there either. We're way, way worse. All conservatives would do would be to cut the growth in your welfare checks. We'd eliminate them.

Boo!

 

[kaz]

As any parent of non-liberal teenagers knows, our children are berated into silence on their views

Assuming that is true - and as we are talking about young conservatives, I shall take it to be so - there is a very fine reason for it. It is almost certainly an effort to inculcate those young geysers of sophistry with the notion that it’s better they keep mouth shut and appear stupid than open it and remove all doubt. It is a school, after all.

All you did was prove my point.

And I said "non-liberal." Why was that unclear to you? My daughters are libertarians like their old man. It's anything you don't agree with that you want quashed, not just conservative

 

[usmbguest5318]

As any parent of non-liberal teenagers knows, our children are berated into silence on their views

Assuming that is true - and as we are talking about young conservatives, I shall take it to be so - there is a very fine reason for it. It is almost certainly an effort to inculcate those young geysers of sophistry with the notion that it’s better they keep mouth shut and appear stupid than open it and remove all doubt. It is a school, after all.

All you did was prove my point.

And I said "non-liberal." Why was that unclear to you? My daughters are libertarians like their old man. It's anything you don't agree with that you want quashed, not just conservative

Dude, you wouldn't know a proven point if it crawled in the bed and laid down next to you. Thank you all the same for confirmin' that you didn't learn the lesson of which I earlier wrote. Maybe you should have spent more time on one of those college campus, or even nursery school, for they teach that particular lesson there too.

 

[kaz]

As any parent of non-liberal teenagers knows, our children are berated into silence on their views

Assuming that is true - and as we are talking about young conservatives, I shall take it to be so - there is a very fine reason for it. It is almost certainly an effort to inculcate those young geysers of sophistry with the notion that it’s better they keep mouth shut and appear stupid than open it and remove all doubt. It is a school, after all.

All you did was prove my point.

And I said "non-liberal." Why was that unclear to you? My daughters are libertarians like their old man. It's anything you don't agree with that you want quashed, not just conservative

Dude, you wouldn't know a proven point if it crawled in the bed and laid down next to you. Thank you all the same for confirmin' that you didn't learn the lesson of which I earlier wrote. Maybe you should have spent more time on one of those college campus, or even nursery school, for they teach that particular lesson there too.

Your response to that non-liberal views are attacked by teachers is that non-liberal views are "stupid." You're a sick authoritarian fuck. It was your answer. All you're doing is digging yourself deeper into your intolerance for views you disagree with. I understand your views fine, I completed the third grade a long time ago. Why should other views that you decided are "stupid" not be heard? Actually I kind of answered my own question, didn't I?

 

[sealybobo]

You start a thread implying that the RIGHT is for free speech. A typical b/s move by right wingers .

The left ain't perfect , but they are for freedom of speech far more than the right is .

Muslims and all wetbacks should all be deported to Mexico and then nuked....

You are going to see that Republicans are going to take in just as many immigrants as Democrats did. They will tell you we don't have enough workers to fill all the jobs. The unemployed are not qualified and in order to grow we need more immigrants.

And since people from Europe and Australia don't want to come here we have to take what we can get.

I think we should take in more Chinese. They are good people.

Republicans aren't against immigration, you stupid fuck, they are against illegal immigration. Stop being a retard

I've been telling Republicans that but they think Republicans were going to stop importing Mexicans and Muslims until

A. Our people were working and wages were up
B. Terrorism was solved. No Muslims.

Correll will want to hear about this.

How do you keep your balance with all that spinning? And wanting to not be blown up by terrorists has nothing to do with legal or illegal immigration. If you have a valid point down there somewhere, why do you have to hide it under all those layers of manure?

I'm just saying amnesty is coming and they won't stop importing middle East people.

I wish they would stop importing anyone we don't need. No bringing poor Somali refugees to Wisconsin and put them in an already poor community. Doesn't make sense

 

[usmbguest5318]

As any parent of non-liberal teenagers knows, our children are berated into silence on their views

Assuming that is true - and as we are talking about young conservatives, I shall take it to be so - there is a very fine reason for it. It is almost certainly an effort to inculcate those young geysers of sophistry with the notion that it’s better they keep mouth shut and appear stupid than open it and remove all doubt. It is a school, after all.

All you did was prove my point.

And I said "non-liberal." Why was that unclear to you? My daughters are libertarians like their old man. It's anything you don't agree with that you want quashed, not just conservative

Dude, you wouldn't know a proven point if it crawled in the bed and laid down next to you. Thank you all the same for confirmin' that you didn't learn the lesson of which I earlier wrote. Maybe you should have spent more time on one of those college campus, or even nursery school, for they teach that particular lesson there too.

Your response to that non-liberal views are attacked by teachers is that non-liberal views are "stupid." You're a sick authoritarian fuck. It was your answer. All you're doing is digging yourself deeper into your intolerance for views you disagree with. I understand your views fine, I completed the third grade a long time ago. Why should other views that you decided are "stupid" not be heard? Actually I kind of answered my own question, didn't I?

Let me answer your question by quoting Murray Rothbard.

It is no crime to be ignorant of economics, which is, after all, a specialized discipline and one that most people consider to be a "dismal science." But it is totally irresponsible to have a loud and vociferous opinion on economic subjects while remaining in this state of ignorance.​

I know Murray was speaking specifically of economics, but the general idea is applicable to all topics.

I don't have a problem with non-liberal ideals, per se, only with the stupid ones audaciously articulated by airheads. I don't actually have a preference for whether ideas are liberal or conservative; for me, ideas need only make sense in the forest and in the trees. Do you follow me? Make no mistake, there are plenty of dumb liberal ideas too, it's just that there are fewer of them than dumb conservative ones.

When it comes to people expressing their ideas, the mere fact that they have an idea does not justify their airing it. That's why we say children should be seen and not heard. They are cute to look at, but they don't have much that merits hearing.

That same idea applies at all ages, but we expect that adults have the presence of mind to know when they don't know enough to have something worth saying. What society does is send children to school so they can learn, upon reaching the age of majority, how to tell when they dwell largely in a state of ignorance on a given topic. Of course, graduation and maturation bring upon adults another expectation, a burden, if you will. Adults, when they have a point of view, are obliged to use the tools they got in school to determine whether be theirs the views of a fool.

Now as for why stupid views should not be heard, well, among adults engaged in public discourse, the reason for one to withhold one's stupid or ill considered views is so that one does not prejudice others toward surety that one is an idiot. Was that not apparent from what I wrote at the outset? "It’s better to keep mouth shut and appear stupid than open it and remove all doubt." What else does that axiom indicate?

Conservative Alternatives to the GOP

Lastly, and FWIW, I am not given to liberal or conservative idea on an qualitatively existential basis. I simply receive the ideas that come my way and consider them. Let me illustrate lest you feel compelled to refute my claim.

I recently found myself with another USMB member sharing some thoughts about how to improve our educational system. I saw the thread, and thought the topic interesting enough to offer my suggestions. A brief discourse ensued between the thread's OP and me and at the end of it, I learned the member considers himself a conservative who apparently holds liberals in low regard as adjudged by his signature line: "I was going to dress up as a liberal for Halloween, but I couldn't get my head up my ass."

I was quite surprised. I had no idea my views on education align with those of conservatives or liberals. By the same token, I have no concern over whether they do; my views on the matter are merely what what I think would be best for improving the effectiveness of education in the U.S.

To my point about knowing the limit of one's own ignorance...In the course of the conversation the other member asked me about the financial impact of my suggestions. This is how I began it: "That's a hard question for me to answer with any real rigor because financial impact necessarily means measuring costs and gains. There are too many dimensions that I've not carefully researched enough to offer a reasonably accurate and quantitative answer." So you see, it's not impossible or even difficult for one to know when one doesn't know something and simply say so, or remain silent. I can't say one of those tacks is a better/smarter one than the other, but I can say neither of them is a stupid course.

 

[kaz]

Muslims and all wetbacks should all be deported to Mexico and then nuked....

You are going to see that Republicans are going to take in just as many immigrants as Democrats did. They will tell you we don't have enough workers to fill all the jobs. The unemployed are not qualified and in order to grow we need more immigrants.

And since people from Europe and Australia don't want to come here we have to take what we can get.

I think we should take in more Chinese. They are good people.

Republicans aren't against immigration, you stupid fuck, they are against illegal immigration. Stop being a retard

I've been telling Republicans that but they think Republicans were going to stop importing Mexicans and Muslims until

A. Our people were working and wages were up
B. Terrorism was solved. No Muslims.

Correll will want to hear about this.

How do you keep your balance with all that spinning? And wanting to not be blown up by terrorists has nothing to do with legal or illegal immigration. If you have a valid point down there somewhere, why do you have to hide it under all those layers of manure?

I'm just saying amnesty is coming and they won't stop importing middle East people.

I wish they would stop importing anyone we don't need. No bringing poor Somali refugees to Wisconsin and put them in an already poor community. Doesn't make sense

No one is objecting to allowing Mexicans to legally immigrate here, it's the illegal immigration that is opposed. And most people who support restricting Muslims are referring to terror exporting countries, not all Muslims.

You take people like Odium who's not even a Republican or on the right and talk about all Republicans like they are him. It's ridiculous butt hurt. Elections have consequences. Grow up

 

[kaz]

I don't have a problem with non-liberal ideals, per se, only with the stupid ones audaciously articulated by airheads

This is the crux of your post and discussion. Since you are OK with leftists deciding what is stupid. What are you going to say if that gets turned around?

If I believed in your standard that only those without stupid ideas should have free speech and I were deciding, you'd be the one not speaking due to your intolerance to other ideas and arrogance that you think it's up to you and the left to decide what should be allowed to be heard.

That's seriously in your view the role of faculty and administrators? To decide who should be heard? It's no wonder there is no diversity of thought in the left. Sounds pretty stupid to me when you all parrot each other. Still, my strategy is to counter your lies and ignorance, not silence you as you chose to do to me

 

[usmbguest5318]

I don't have a problem with non-liberal ideals, per se, only with the stupid ones audaciously articulated by airheads

This is the crux of your post and discussion. Since you are OK with leftists deciding what is stupid. What are you going to say if that gets turned around?

If I believed in your standard that only those without stupid ideas should have free speech and I were deciding, you'd be the one not speaking due to your intolerance to other ideas and arrogance that you think it's up to you and the left to decide what should be allowed to be heard.

That's seriously in your view the role of faculty and administrators? To decide who should be heard? It's no wonder there is no diversity of thought in the left. Sounds pretty stupid to me when you all parrot each other. Still, my strategy is to counter your lies and ignorance, not silence you as you chose to do to me

I am not okay with letting anyone decide for me what is stupid. I do that for myself. I will never delegate that away.

 

[kaz]

I don't have a problem with non-liberal ideals, per se, only with the stupid ones audaciously articulated by airheads

This is the crux of your post and discussion. Since you are OK with leftists deciding what is stupid. What are you going to say if that gets turned around?

If I believed in your standard that only those without stupid ideas should have free speech and I were deciding, you'd be the one not speaking due to your intolerance to other ideas and arrogance that you think it's up to you and the left to decide what should be allowed to be heard.

That's seriously in your view the role of faculty and administrators? To decide who should be heard? It's no wonder there is no diversity of thought in the left. Sounds pretty stupid to me when you all parrot each other. Still, my strategy is to counter your lies and ignorance, not silence you as you chose to do to me

I am not okay with letting anyone decide for me what is stupid. I do that for myself. I will never delegate that away.

And yet you're willing to judge others and decide for them. Typical liberal

 

[ptbw forever]

So, we see "Waaaaaa! Leftists hate free speech!" is today's whiny delusional talking point, being there are so many threads here on it now. The righties certainly are a reliable bunch of parrots.

What's the next one? Righties, you all better run and check. You wouldn't want to be the last cultist to repeat the latest dumb cult talking points. That would be so humiliating.

Deflection and projection is all you idiots have left.

 

[TemplarKormac]

Please give me ONE example of right wing being for free speech they don't agree with ?

I would but they're being censored.

 

[whitehall]

According to political pundit and best selling author of "Radical Son", David Horowitz, every single high profile conservative speaker including 90 lb Ann Colter has been the victim of assault at least one time and in some cases numerous times on a college campus. No left wing speaker has ever been assaulted. What does that tell you? Maybe college faculties thinks assault is a legitimate political expression or maybe individual professors encourage their students to assault conservative speakers. When you factor in the list of words that can get a student expelled and the list of books that are banned it looks like college campuses have been taken over by Stalinists or Nazis.

 

[usmbguest5318]

I don't have a problem with non-liberal ideals, per se, only with the stupid ones audaciously articulated by airheads

This is the crux of your post and discussion. Since you are OK with leftists deciding what is stupid. What are you going to say if that gets turned around?

If I believed in your standard that only those without stupid ideas should have free speech and I were deciding, you'd be the one not speaking due to your intolerance to other ideas and arrogance that you think it's up to you and the left to decide what should be allowed to be heard.

That's seriously in your view the role of faculty and administrators? To decide who should be heard? It's no wonder there is no diversity of thought in the left. Sounds pretty stupid to me when you all parrot each other. Still, my strategy is to counter your lies and ignorance, not silence you as you chose to do to me

I am not okay with letting anyone decide for me what is stupid. I do that for myself. I will never delegate that away.

And yet you're willing to judge others and decide for them. Typical liberal

Why do you keep trying to put words in my mouth? If you want to know what I'm willing to do and how I see something, why can't you just ask a neutrally phrased question? Is it because you just want to think what you want to think and then make self affirming statements about it rather than finding out what actually is so?

 

[kaz]

I don't have a problem with non-liberal ideals, per se, only with the stupid ones audaciously articulated by airheads

This is the crux of your post and discussion. Since you are OK with leftists deciding what is stupid. What are you going to say if that gets turned around?

If I believed in your standard that only those without stupid ideas should have free speech and I were deciding, you'd be the one not speaking due to your intolerance to other ideas and arrogance that you think it's up to you and the left to decide what should be allowed to be heard.

That's seriously in your view the role of faculty and administrators? To decide who should be heard? It's no wonder there is no diversity of thought in the left. Sounds pretty stupid to me when you all parrot each other. Still, my strategy is to counter your lies and ignorance, not silence you as you chose to do to me

I am not okay with letting anyone decide for me what is stupid. I do that for myself. I will never delegate that away.

And yet you're willing to judge others and decide for them. Typical liberal

Why do you keep trying to put words in my mouth? If you want to know what I'm willing to do and how I see something, why can't you just ask a neutrally phrased question? Is it because you just want to think what you want to think and then make self affirming statements about it rather than finding out what actually is so?

I put shit in your mouth. I wrote the OP and you came back with that non-liberal views are stupid and you don't want to hear them

 

[12icer]

Why do you keep trying to put words in my mouth? If you want to know what I'm willing to do and how I see something, why can't you just ask a neutrally phrased question? Is it because you just want to think what you want to think and then make self affirming statements about it rather than finding out what actually is so?

Now that shit is funny as hell a damn liberal trying to cut a conservative down for assuming the conservative knows anything about him. You must admit that is a definite case of a pure onyx pot calling a stainless steel pot "BLACK" HAHAHAHAA.

 

[12icer]

Man the liberals in this country are so vile and disgusting they think they are on the verge of getting what they want, but they are sure as hell not going to like what they want when they get it. Equality IS coming, There will be no more special rights for the political correct crowd even if they have to be erased to facilitate the change. Liberal dogshit have rewritten the entire spectrum of rules and now they say "Well you can't do what we did we're special and only we can do that It's against the rules if YOU do it." Not anymore you shit opened the gate, we are going to slam it shut by any means needed to stop you. Your name calling and assaults, your rioting and lack of self discipline, your intimidating and extorting, and your immunity from recompense for your bad behavior AND your idea of freedom without the required responsibility for YOUR actions are about to come down on your sorry, vile, disgusting, asses like Mt St.Helens

 

[Norman]

Needless to say the education system has its problems.

And yet they blame TRUMP for the anti-white Trump haters who kidnapped a handicapped white guy. Because obviously that's something Trump is advocating... These people are just retarded and will say anything to justify their ideology.

 

[sealybobo]

You are going to see that Republicans are going to take in just as many immigrants as Democrats did. They will tell you we don't have enough workers to fill all the jobs. The unemployed are not qualified and in order to grow we need more immigrants.

And since people from Europe and Australia don't want to come here we have to take what we can get.

I think we should take in more Chinese. They are good people.

Republicans aren't against immigration, you stupid fuck, they are against illegal immigration. Stop being a retard

I've been telling Republicans that but they think Republicans were going to stop importing Mexicans and Muslims until

A. Our people were working and wages were up
B. Terrorism was solved. No Muslims.

Correll will want to hear about this.

How do you keep your balance with all that spinning? And wanting to not be blown up by terrorists has nothing to do with legal or illegal immigration. If you have a valid point down there somewhere, why do you have to hide it under all those layers of manure?

I'm just saying amnesty is coming and they won't stop importing middle East people.

I wish they would stop importing anyone we don't need. No bringing poor Somali refugees to Wisconsin and put them in an already poor community. Doesn't make sense

No one is objecting to allowing Mexicans to legally immigrate here, it's the illegal immigration that is opposed. And most people who support restricting Muslims are referring to terror exporting countries, not all Muslims.

You take people like Odium who's not even a Republican or on the right and talk about all Republicans like they are him. It's ridiculous butt hurt. Elections have consequences. Grow up

Correll wants immigration stopped till the millions of Americans are working.

 

[FA_Q2]

It's sad that the bastions of anti-free speech hate are schools.

- The faculty and students of "liberal" universities melt down when anyone not hard left is going to speak at commencement or anything else and they shout down anyone who disagrees with them on campus. And administrators are supporting them.

- As any parent of non-liberal teenagers knows, our children are berated into silence on their views while they are endlessly subjected to leftist ideology ... from the teachers. Teachers routinely punish our kids with poor grades for even suggesting non-liberal ideas in their work.

- You can be pro-Muslim or other religions and speak to it, but if you're Christian or Jewish then STFU about your views, no one wants to hear it. By no one I mean the leftists.

Wasn't education where we were supposed to be able to express and explore all thought? So where are you, leftists? Why are you not only not being outraged at the limit of speech, but you cheer it on? Don't tell me you lied? Really, don't, you don't have to.

And why am I paying for this? It's no wonder the left grow up to throttle free speech, it's what you teach your children. And you wonder why Trump won ...

It's been a while since I went to college but I don't remember anything being off limits. Hell, I remember one gathering during the Iran hostage crisis where one guy got up and defended the actions of the Iranians (the vast majority were on the other side).

Where is this locked down school of which you speak?

Do you read? Seriously? If you want more information that's one thing. But to say you've never heard of this and have no idea what I'm talking about, I can't take you seriously. Obviously every time it flies right by you because all you want to hear is the left

I want you to tell me your specific experience with what you're talking about. Of course we've all heard the extreme bullshit spouted by right wing sources like Fox News. Where do your kids get berated for having conservative views?

Did you not take note of the examples already linked?