The biggest reason by far workers can't support themselves is they don't care...

[kaz]

Regarding wal-mart, McDonalds and other discussions going on across the board, there is one thing that is overwhelmingly clear. Workers need to invest in themselves by getting an education, training, working harder, working longer and paying attention to detail. Those are how they make more money, and that is their job, not taxpayers and not their employers. However, the simple ability to support themselves is more basic than that. First, my background.

I have managed people starting about six months after I graduated college in 1988. For the next 20 years, I spent about half doing two stints in GE Management (GE Information Services, GE Power Systems, GE Capital, GE Consumer Finance) and the other half in management consulting (Booz Allen, et al). Since 2009, I have bought 5 businesses. I spun two off and merged the other three and run those as a single business.

Any worker other than extreme cases of retardation or mental illness, any worker could support themselves if they do one thing. Care. Of the hundred or so people I've fired in my career, they had repeated chances and their shortcomings were well within their ability. But they made the same stupid mistakes over and over and over. My low skilled workers now have to be closely managed and their work double checked by people who do care. No matter how poor a choices workers have made in the past, if they get a job and go every day and care about the quality of their work and reliably double check it before passing it on to someone else, they would quickly earn enough to support themselves.

It's indisputable fact to anyone with any real management and business experience.

 

[Edgetho]

kaz, there's really not a lot of work out there. And some areas are just simply dying.

Around the Great Lakes area, there's just nothing going on. A little bit of shale drilling and that's it. But all that money leaves the area.

And people just don't want to leave the area they grew up in, the area their parents grew up in, the area where all their friends and relatives are, the area their wife is from, the area they went to school in.....

I understand it. I left Cleveland in 1977. Used to be one the best places in the Country until the mid/late 60s. High-Paying Jobs, low cost of living, big enough City to find things to do but not so big that you felt claustrophobic.....

I left because I could see the handwriting on the wall. dimocrap scum took over. And they FUCKED the City up.

Dennis Kucinich was Mayor and he got into a pissing contest with Diamond Shamrock over something. My buddy's wife worked there as a Chemical Engineer. Hot as a firecracker, too

So Diamond Shamrock said, "FUCK YOU" and left for Texas. They offered to let her go with them but he wouldn't move. Divorce.

Not only that, but HUNDREDS of Companies left the Area. BIG ones. Cleveland lost 300,000 Steel Jobs ALONE between 1970 and 1990.

I was there. I was at Republic Steel as a Security Guard when I walked in on the Executive VP (He ran that Division) sitting at his desk LITERALLY crying.

I mean LITERALLY. A grown man..... Crying

I kinda reached down toward my Gun and asked him, "Are you okay, Sir?"

He didn't see me and I kinda startled him... So anyway, not to bore you but this is FACT.

He had just gotten back from a meeting with the Union. He told them, "Look guys, we have to modernize. The Japanese are killing us."

The Union Thugs refused of course. They said, "You do that and we'll Strike and shut you down." Which for a Steel Company is catastrophic. He even promised, in writing, that there would not be ONE LAYOFF.

The refused to budge.

That's when I moved to Florida. Shortly after. The plant was shut down within the year.

dimocraps and their minions. scum of the Earth.

Things could have been done, compromises could have been reached... But typical of dimocraps, they only care about what they want and if the working man and woman get caught in the middle? Tuff shit.

I hate dimocraps.

And they're the ones responsible for all the SHIT that's gone down in the last four decades.

So I'm just saying, there ain't a lot of work out there anymore.

And with dimocraps in charge.... There ain't gonna be. Not for the kid just starting out. Not when you need a College Degree to be a Bank Teller. Not everybody has a Mommy and Daddy that can afford to pay for a College Education so their little darling can work at the Bank Drive Up Window.

Times are tough, and dimocraps are the reason why.

Sorry to bore you

 

[rightwinger]

What about the workers who do sacrifice to get an education and still find there are no jobs out there where they can support themselves?

 

[Edgetho]

What about the workers who do sacrifice to get an education and still find there are no jobs out there where they can support themselves?

 

[rightwinger]

What about the workers who do sacrifice to get an education and still find there are no jobs out there where they can support themselves?

I do realize that Conservatives off up hard work and initaitive as the answer to all problems. They then do everything in their power to ensure that hard work and intiative go unrewarded

Unless we are talking about the 1%

 

[ba1614]

What about the workers who do sacrifice to get an education and still find there are no jobs out there where they can support themselves?

Depends on their course of study, if they have a phd in 13th century french lesbian studies then tell them they deserve it, otherwise, tell them to keep swinging and doing the right things.

 

[Edgetho]

What about the workers who do sacrifice to get an education and still find there are no jobs out there where they can support themselves?

I do realize that Conservatives off up hard work and initaitive as the answer to all problems. They then do everything in their power to ensure that hard work and intiative go unrewarded

Unless we are talking about the 1%

THAT is a complete and utter lie.

Not only that, it's self-delusional and self destructive.

I'm living proof.

No College. Enlisted in the Army in 1965 for the VA College Program (my parents couldn't afford to send me to College -- No way)

Got sent off to a place I'd never heard of before.... Viet Nam. Left the Army in 1971, went home, found that I was better off telling prospective employers that I was 'down on the Farm' instead of Honorably Serving my Country. (wanna hear about prejudice? Oh yeah)

Tried College for a Month. Not for me.

Worked some good jobs and some not-so-good jobs. Left Cleveland came to Florida and when I retired thirteen years ago (at age 53) I left with almost a half-million dollars in cash and cash obligations. Maybe a little more.

Of which half is now gone And I don't mind one goddam bit.

So there's only one of two possibilities here... Either I am twice the Man you'll ever hope to be or times were better back then..... Like, as in, when we had Republican Leadership and dimocraps weren't dimocraps, they were democrats and a few of them were even Democrats (a now extinct brand of honorable politician).

Now..... Your party isn't even that. You're dimocraps. semi-marxist, third way, Euro-trash socialists.

And even in this SHIT market, maybe if you'd stop crying and feeling sorry for yourself and blaming everybody else for your loserdom.... Maybe you could be somebody....

Or not.

Never gonna happen until you change your mindset. You can't have the mindset of a loser and expect to have a brick hit you in the ass and make you a winner.

Don't work like that.

Grow up

 

[rightwinger]

I do realize that Conservatives off up hard work and initaitive as the answer to all problems. They then do everything in their power to ensure that hard work and intiative go unrewarded

Unless we are talking about the 1%

THAT is a complete and utter lie.

Not only that, it's self-delusional and self destructive.

I'm living proof.

No College. Enlisted in the Army in 1965 for the VA College Program (my parents couldn't afford to send me to College -- No way)

Got sent off to a place I'd never heard of before.... Viet Nam. Left the Army in 1971, went home, found that I was better off telling prospective employers that I was 'down on the Farm' instead of Honorably Serving my Country. (wanna hear about prejudice? Oh yeah)

Tried College for a Month. Not for me.

Worked some good jobs and some not-so-good jobs. Left Cleveland came to Florida and when I retired thirteen years ago (at age 53) I left with almost a half-million dollars in cash and cash obligations. Maybe a little more.

Of which half is now gone And I don't mind one goddam bit.

So there's only one of two possibilities here... Either I am twice the Man you'll ever hope to be or times were better back then..... Like, as in, when we had Republican Leadership and dimocraps weren't dimocraps, they were democrats and a few of them were even Democrats (a now extinct brand of honorable politician).

Now..... Your party isn't even that. You're dimocraps. semi-marxist, third way, Euro-trash socialists.

And even in this SHIT market, maybe if you'd stop crying and feeling sorry for yourself and blaming everybody else for your loserdom.... Maybe you could be somebody....

Or not.

Never gonna happen until you change your mindset. You can't have the mindset of a loser and expect to have a brick hit you in the ass and make you a winner.

Don't work like that.

Grow up

Nice story, Inspirational

Has nothing to do with todays job market

 

[Katzndogz]

Today's job market is suffering from many different causes. Over taxation, over regulation, exhorbitant energy costs expected to go higher as power plants close, a workforce that is suspect. American workers aren't exactly the best in the world. They used to be. Not any more and not for awhile. The perception is that Americans are fat, lazy, drug users looking for a lawsuit and early retirement.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

kaz, there's really not a lot of work out there. And some areas are just simply dying.

Around the Great Lakes area, there's just nothing going on. A little bit of shale drilling and that's it. But all that money leaves the area.

And people just don't want to leave the area they grew up in, the area their parents grew up in, the area where all their friends and relatives are, the area their wife is from, the area they went to school in.....

I understand it. I left Cleveland in 1977. Used to be one the best places in the Country until the mid/late 60s. High-Paying Jobs, low cost of living, big enough City to find things to do but not so big that you felt claustrophobic.....

I left because I could see the handwriting on the wall. dimocrap scum took over. And they FUCKED the City up.

Dennis Kucinich was Mayor and he got into a pissing contest with Diamond Shamrock over something. My buddy's wife worked there as a Chemical Engineer. Hot as a firecracker, too

So Diamond Shamrock said, "FUCK YOU" and left for Texas. They offered to let her go with them but he wouldn't move. Divorce.

Not only that, but HUNDREDS of Companies left the Area. BIG ones. Cleveland lost 300,000 Steel Jobs ALONE between 1970 and 1990.

I was there. I was at Republic Steel as a Security Guard when I walked in on the Executive VP (He ran that Division) sitting at his desk LITERALLY crying.

I mean LITERALLY. A grown man..... Crying

I kinda reached down toward my Gun and asked him, "Are you okay, Sir?"

He didn't see me and I kinda startled him... So anyway, not to bore you but this is FACT.

He had just gotten back from a meeting with the Union. He told them, "Look guys, we have to modernize. The Japanese are killing us."

The Union Thugs refused of course. They said, "You do that and we'll Strike and shut you down." Which for a Steel Company is catastrophic. He even promised, in writing, that there would not be ONE LAYOFF.

The refused to budge.

That's when I moved to Florida. Shortly after. The plant was shut down within the year.

dimocraps and their minions. scum of the Earth.

Things could have been done, compromises could have been reached... But typical of dimocraps, they only care about what they want and if the working man and woman get caught in the middle? Tuff shit.

I hate dimocraps.

And they're the ones responsible for all the SHIT that's gone down in the last four decades.

So I'm just saying, there ain't a lot of work out there anymore.

And with dimocraps in charge.... There ain't gonna be. Not for the kid just starting out. Not when you need a College Degree to be a Bank Teller. Not everybody has a Mommy and Daddy that can afford to pay for a College Education so their little darling can work at the Bank Drive Up Window.

Times are tough, and dimocraps are the reason why.

Sorry to bore you

I disagree that there's not a lot of work to be found. The problem is welfare, unemployment insurance etc..., pays more.

I see signs all of the place where companies are hiring, especially in oil and petro-chemical industries.

But again, maybe this is just a Texas thing.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

What about the workers who do sacrifice to get an education and still find there are no jobs out there where they can support themselves?

A degree in liberal arts doesn't do much good in the real world.

What this country needs is more pipefitters, masons, mechanics, welders, ironworkers, carpenters etc....trades that do not require a college degree.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Regarding wal-mart, McDonalds and other discussions going on across the board, there is one thing that is overwhelmingly clear. Workers need to invest in themselves by getting an education, training, working harder, working longer and paying attention to detail. Those are how they make more money, and that is their job, not taxpayers and not their employers. However, the simple ability to support themselves is more basic than that. First, my background.

I have managed people starting about six months after I graduated college in 1988. For the next 20 years, I spent about half doing two stints in GE Management (GE Information Services, GE Power Systems, GE Capital, GE Consumer Finance) and the other half in management consulting (Booz Allen, et al). Since 2009, I have bought 5 businesses. I spun two off and merged the other three and run those as a single business.

Any worker other than extreme cases of retardation or mental illness, any worker could support themselves if they do one thing. Care. Of the hundred or so people I've fired in my career, they had repeated chances and their shortcomings were well within their ability. But they made the same stupid mistakes over and over and over. My low skilled workers now have to be closely managed and their work double checked by people who do care. No matter how poor a choices workers have made in the past, if they get a job and go every day and care about the quality of their work and reliably double check it before passing it on to someone else, they would quickly earn enough to support themselves.

It's indisputable fact to anyone with any real management and business experience.

So which college did you graduate from and who paid for it? Dd you have to work long hours yourself while you were going to college or is that just something that you expect others to do?

The reason I ask is because I actually did work long hours and put myself through college while I was working. So when I hear someone handing out that "advice" I want to know if they have been there and done that themselves. I know that I had more than a few "support systems" in place that made it possible. Without them it would never have happened.

So who was your "support system" and how much did that help you to end up where you are today?

 

[rightwinger]

Heads up America

The reason you are having difficulties finding jobs from which you can support yourself has nothing to do with the worst economy in 70 years

Its that you just don't care

 

[g5000]

Less time working, and more pay for jobs that require zero skills. That's the Democratic platform.

We need to educate our workforce for the jobs of tomorrow, not the jobs of yesterday. The days of growing up to work in your daddy's factory are long gone.

As a general rule, high tech jobs are not unionized. You know why? Because people with those skills are so few and far between they are in high demand and are paid accordingly.

If everyone in the workforce was highly educated, then employers in the high tech jobs of tomorrow would have the upper hand because they would have their pick of workers, and unions would be more necessary.

Instead of demanding more pay for jobs which require no skills, we need to hit the books.

Instead of demanding everyone pay for the medical insurance of people who choose to drop out of high school, we need to make bad choices come with a high penalty. One third of the involuntarily uninsured are high school dropouts, and yet the Obama and the Democrats are rewarding them with "free" health insurance.

That is the absolutely wrong direction to be going.

 

[ClosedCaption]

I do realize that Conservatives off up hard work and initaitive as the answer to all problems. They then do everything in their power to ensure that hard work and intiative go unrewarded

Unless we are talking about the 1%

THAT is a complete and utter lie.

Not only that, it's self-delusional and self destructive.

I'm living proof.

No College. Enlisted in the Army in 1965 for the VA College Program (my parents couldn't afford to send me to College -- No way)

Got sent off to a place I'd never heard of before.... Viet Nam. Left the Army in 1971, went home, found that I was better off telling prospective employers that I was 'down on the Farm' instead of Honorably Serving my Country. (wanna hear about prejudice? Oh yeah)

Tried College for a Month. Not for me.

Worked some good jobs and some not-so-good jobs. Left Cleveland came to Florida and when I retired thirteen years ago (at age 53) I left with almost a half-million dollars in cash and cash obligations. Maybe a little more.

Of which half is now gone And I don't mind one goddam bit.

So there's only one of two possibilities here... Either I am twice the Man you'll ever hope to be or times were better back then..... Like, as in, when we had Republican Leadership and dimocraps weren't dimocraps, they were democrats and a few of them were even Democrats (a now extinct brand of honorable politician).

Now..... Your party isn't even that. You're dimocraps. semi-marxist, third way, Euro-trash socialists.

And even in this SHIT market, maybe if you'd stop crying and feeling sorry for yourself and blaming everybody else for your loserdom.... Maybe you could be somebody....

Or not.

Never gonna happen until you change your mindset. You can't have the mindset of a loser and expect to have a brick hit you in the ass and make you a winner.

Don't work like that.

Grow up

Nice story, Inspirational

Has nothing to do with todays job market

I love how they address todays problems by talking about how they tended the fields when younger, delivered milk, shined shoes and built a lemonade stand

 

[g5000]

What about the workers who do sacrifice to get an education and still find there are no jobs out there where they can support themselves?

Every bad government program was enacted because someone rolled out some poor suffering bastard to serve as a representative example of ALL the people who would benefit from that government program.

That's why Obama rolled out a cancer lady and not a high school dropout, even though one third of the involuntarily uninsured are high school dropouts.

The Appeal to Emotion fallacy is one of the most common tools in a politician's toolbox.

And the media's. Look how frequently their articles start out like some great American novel.

"Susie Meadows squints into the setting sun as she rolls her wheelchair..." blah blah blah. After painting a sympathetic creature, they then go on to show how heartless some bastard is for trying to get the budget under control.

 

[ClosedCaption]

Whenever someone attributes failure to immeasurables like "caring" you know they are snake oil salesmen

 

[Edgetho]

kaz, there's really not a lot of work out there. And some areas are just simply dying.

Around the Great Lakes area, there's just nothing going on. A little bit of shale drilling and that's it. But all that money leaves the area.

And people just don't want to leave the area they grew up in, the area their parents grew up in, the area where all their friends and relatives are, the area their wife is from, the area they went to school in.....

I understand it. I left Cleveland in 1977. Used to be one the best places in the Country until the mid/late 60s. High-Paying Jobs, low cost of living, big enough City to find things to do but not so big that you felt claustrophobic.....

I left because I could see the handwriting on the wall. dimocrap scum took over. And they FUCKED the City up.

Dennis Kucinich was Mayor and he got into a pissing contest with Diamond Shamrock over something. My buddy's wife worked there as a Chemical Engineer. Hot as a firecracker, too

So Diamond Shamrock said, "FUCK YOU" and left for Texas. They offered to let her go with them but he wouldn't move. Divorce.

Not only that, but HUNDREDS of Companies left the Area. BIG ones. Cleveland lost 300,000 Steel Jobs ALONE between 1970 and 1990.

I was there. I was at Republic Steel as a Security Guard when I walked in on the Executive VP (He ran that Division) sitting at his desk LITERALLY crying.

I mean LITERALLY. A grown man..... Crying

I kinda reached down toward my Gun and asked him, "Are you okay, Sir?"

He didn't see me and I kinda startled him... So anyway, not to bore you but this is FACT.

He had just gotten back from a meeting with the Union. He told them, "Look guys, we have to modernize. The Japanese are killing us."

The Union Thugs refused of course. They said, "You do that and we'll Strike and shut you down." Which for a Steel Company is catastrophic. He even promised, in writing, that there would not be ONE LAYOFF.

The refused to budge.

That's when I moved to Florida. Shortly after. The plant was shut down within the year.

dimocraps and their minions. scum of the Earth.

Things could have been done, compromises could have been reached... But typical of dimocraps, they only care about what they want and if the working man and woman get caught in the middle? Tuff shit.

I hate dimocraps.

And they're the ones responsible for all the SHIT that's gone down in the last four decades.

So I'm just saying, there ain't a lot of work out there anymore.

And with dimocraps in charge.... There ain't gonna be. Not for the kid just starting out. Not when you need a College Degree to be a Bank Teller. Not everybody has a Mommy and Daddy that can afford to pay for a College Education so their little darling can work at the Bank Drive Up Window.

Times are tough, and dimocraps are the reason why.

Sorry to bore you

I disagree that there's not a lot of work to be found. The problem is welfare, unemployment insurance etc..., pays more.

I see signs all of the place where companies are hiring, especially in oil and petro-chemical industries.

But again, maybe this is just a Texas thing.

A LOT of it is where you live. If you live in a Free State instead of one controlled by dimocrap scum, you're much better off.

But someone else mentioned that today's youth doesn't want to get their hands dirty.

So true.

Why do you think 20,000,000 Illegals are here? They're finding work. No doubt about it.

Every roofing crew, ever landscaping crew, every construction you see anymore is either mostly or completely Hispanic.

Nothing wrong with that. Some hard-working people.

But why aren't Americans willing to take those jobs?

Because, frankly, it's too hard.

The money that can be made in those fields is unimaginable to the youth of today.

I can tell you all kinds of stories of people I personally know who started out as kids working a trade, started their own Company and are sitting fat and happy in Million Dollar Homes right now with College pukes running errands for them.

Some of it really is that kids today think 'work' is beneath them.

SOME of it is that the jobs available kinda suck. A lot of it. Certainly not all of it

 

[Derideo_Te]

What about the workers who do sacrifice to get an education and still find there are no jobs out there where they can support themselves?

Every bad government program was enacted because someone rolled out some poor suffering bastard to serve as a representative example of ALL the people who would benefit from that government program.

That's why Obama rolled out a cancer lady and not a high school dropout, even though one third of the involuntarily uninsured are high school dropouts.

The Appeal to Emotion fallacy is one of the most common tools in a politician's toolbox.

And the media's. Look how frequently their articles start out like some great American novel.

"Susie Meadows squints into the setting sun as she rolls her wheelchair..." blah blah blah. After painting a sympathetic creature, they then go on to show how heartless some bastard is for trying to get the budget under control.

A police captain once told me that every regulation like miranda and search warrants were because the cops did something wrong in the first place. Not all government legislation is emotion based. A great deal has to because someone did something wrong albeit unintentionally.

 

[kaz]

Around the Great Lakes area, there's just nothing going on. A little bit of shale drilling and that's it. But all that money leaves the area

...

I understand it. I left Cleveland in 1977. Used to be one the best places in the Country until the mid/late 60s. High-Paying Jobs, low cost of living, big enough City to find things to do but not so big that you felt claustrophobic.....

...

Sorry to bore you

You didn't bore me at all, great story. I am a midwesterner also, Kaz is actually short for my home town, Kalamazoo, Michigan. Other than returning for 2 years to get my MBA at Michigan, I left in 1981. Love going back, wouldn't want to live there again and for the same reasons.