The Future Third Party

[PoliticalChic]

There is no doubt in my mind that we need politicians who can be true to their ideals and not their lobbies. We have got to figure out how to fix the money problem in Washington. ...and this time I'm not talking about the defecit/gov't spending.

"...we need politicians who can be true to their ideals and not their lobbies."

I don't agree....but I think the problem may be one of definition.

Today, 'lobby' has become a pejorative term.

Many think of it as a tool of some hypothetical rich profiteering minority.

It isn't.



The concept is memorialized in the Constitution.
"In the United States the right to petition is guaranteed by the First Amendment to the federal constitution, which specifically prohibits Congress from abridging "the right of the people...to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."
Right to petition in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



You see....all of us do it, all of us belong to lobbies....

In "Demosclerosis:: The Silent Killer of American Government," Jonathan Rauch points out that 7 out of 10 Americans belong to an interest group, and one out of four belong to at least four!

Your union or club, the groups that solicit donations....lots of things that you don't recognize as lobbying groups.


Heck...I want 'em to respond to my requests....my lobbying.



Think about this one: the Left demonizes "Big Oil," but who actually dictated energy policy?

The Green Lobby: Sierra Club, Greenpeace, etc.

Proof?
Sure: the Keystone Pipeline.

 

[Toronado3800]

There is no doubt in my mind that we need politicians who can be true to their ideals and not their lobbies. We have got to figure out how to fix the money problem in Washington. ...and this time I'm not talking about the defecit/gov't spending.

"...we need politicians who can be true to their ideals and not their lobbies."

I don't agree....but I think the problem may be one of definition.

Today, 'lobby' has become a pejorative term.

Many think of it as a tool of some hypothetical rich profiteering minority.

It isn't.



The concept is memorialized in the Constitution.
"In the United States the right to petition is guaranteed by the First Amendment to the federal constitution, which specifically prohibits Congress from abridging "the right of the people...to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."
Right to petition in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



You see....all of us do it, all of us belong to lobbies....

In "Demosclerosis:: The Silent Killer of American Government," Jonathan Rauch points out that 7 out of 10 Americans belong to an interest group, and one out of four belong to at least four!

Your union or club, the groups that solicit donations....lots of things that you don't recognize as lobbying groups.


Heck...I want 'em to respond to my requests....my lobbying.



Think about this one: the Left demonizes "Big Oil," but who actually dictated energy policy?

The Green Lobby: Sierra Club, Greenpeace, etc.

Proof?
Sure: the Keystone Pipeline.

You know the two big Railroad corps are huge contributirs as well. Even CSX gets a lot in.

Damn hippies and leftists lol.

 

[JoeB131]

Please, please please let the teabaggers form their own party.

PLEEEEEASE!

 

[Mac1958]

Please, please please let the teabaggers form their own party.

PLEEEEEASE!

That really would be the easiest answer, although we'd then have two war-happy Rambo parties instead of one.

I'd be surprised to see the Tea Party try it. For all their simplistic bravado, I'd bet they know what would happen.

.

 

[FJO]

The only country in the world, whose government was designed by intelligent people is the United States of America. Others have one or other variations of a parliamentary system, that encourages multiple parties, which developed over the years/centuries.

A third party will never fly in America.

 

[NYcarbineer]

The Perot party, or parties, of the nineties had the right idea, had they stuck with it and worked more from the bottom up.

 

[Toronado3800]

Please, please please let the teabaggers form their own party.

PLEEEEEASE!

God. As long as they are consistent. Then their supporters can vote for them and accomplish something or fail.

Watching Republicans honoring Reagan while cursing Obama for deficit spending makes me worry a parallel universe does exist.

 

[JoeB131]

The only country in the world, whose government was designed by intelligent people is the United States of America. Others have one or other variations of a parliamentary system, that encourages multiple parties, which developed over the years/centuries.

A third party will never fly in America.

Actually, our government was designed by slave rapists who didnt trust democracy.

The problem with the two party system is that the vast majority of us who are in the middle have to make the choice between the lesser of two evils after those in the party pander to the extremes who decide candidates.

 

[JoeB131]

Please, please please let the teabaggers form their own party.

PLEEEEEASE!

God. As long as they are consistent. Then their supporters can vote for them and accomplish something or fail.

Watching Republicans honoring Reagan while cursing Obama for deficit spending makes me worry a parallel universe does exist.

But you see, there were two Reagan.

There was the real Reagan who ran up deficits, tripled the national debt, raised taxes after cutting them, appointed moderates to the Supreme Court, gave Amnesty to Illegal Aliens, made arms control agreements with the Soviets who he assumed would be around long after he was gone.

The LEGENDARY Reagan never comprimised, was a paragon of Conservative thinking (whatever the fuck that is this week), and single handedly won the Cold War. (The collapse of the USSR happened on Bush-41's watch, and took everyone by surprise.)

I can completely understand your confusion

 

[Mac1958]

The problem with the two party system is that the vast majority of us who are in the middle have to make the choice between the lesser of two evils after those in the party pander to the extremes who decide candidates.

 

[rightwinger]

I have always encouraged Republicans to form a third party. It is for the good of the country

 

[editec]

I suspect that there is no political solution leading this nation to a soft landing, anymore.

I think it's too late for a third party to take charge. The overwhelming power of property rights has swamped the democratic process

And if a third party does form, I suspect it will be just another sham party controlled by the puppetmasters much as the TEA party so obvious is.

Organization take CAPITAL, folks.

The people don't have it, the masters do.

 

[IlarMeilyr]

I believe that the problem is not with what the people have indicated they want.

The problem is that for cheap political (and self-serving) reasons, the politicians refuse to provide the kind of representation that is sought and voted for by the people.

If the GOP cannot be reformed to more closely and fully meet the expressed demands of its voters, then the present day GOP politicians are going to hae to get shit-canned. If that requires the creation of a viable third Party, so be it.

It is a sad truth that the temporary dislocation which will be caused by the splintering of the GOP is likely to be a short term benefit to the liberals and other Democrats. But that price may have to be paid to root them out in the longer term.

 

[rightwinger]

Unless your third party can draw voters away from the Democrats it will only ensure increased power for the Democrats.

As it is, splitting the GOP vote will only create two weak political parties

 

[Mac1958]

Unless your third party can draw voters away from the Democrats it will only ensure increased power for the Democrats.

As it is, splitting the GOP vote will only create two weak political parties

I dunno. I think it's possible that Independents and moderate Democrats would look at the crazies leaving the GOP for the TP and be more likely (not certain, but more likely) to vote GOP if they feel the Dems go too far left.

.

 

[Erand7899]

Please, please please let the teabaggers form their own party.

PLEEEEEASE!

God. As long as they are consistent. Then their supporters can vote for them and accomplish something or fail.

Watching Republicans honoring Reagan while cursing Obama for deficit spending makes me worry a parallel universe does exist.

But you see, there were two Reagan.

There was the real Reagan who ran up deficits, tripled the national debt, raised taxes after cutting them, appointed moderates to the Supreme Court, gave Amnesty to Illegal Aliens, made arms control agreements with the Soviets who he assumed would be around long after he was gone.

The LEGENDARY Reagan never comprimised, was a paragon of Conservative thinking (whatever the fuck that is this week), and single handedly won the Cold War. (The collapse of the USSR happened on Bush-41's watch, and took everyone by surprise.)

I can completely understand your confusion

Now, if you can only get a handle on your own confusion. Try actually reading history instead of just gushing sophmoric talking points that you don't fully comprehend.

 

[P F Tinmore]

The bottom line is that the media tells us who to vote for and we do.

 

[lukelk]

hhahaha this OP is fucking retarded, zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz thats about what this OP is doing to me

 

[whitehall]

You have a couple of choices. You can turn on and drop out like they used to say in the 60's. You can try to get the republican party to accept the kind of agenda you want by participating in the Tea Party movement and risk the hate speech of the left or you can try to push the democrat party further left by joining CUSA. You can also waste energy and a vote on a 3rd party.

 

[P F Tinmore]

You have a couple of choices. You can turn on and drop out like they used to say in the 60's. You can try to get the republican party to accept the kind of agenda you want by participating in the Tea Party movement and risk the hate speech of the left or you can try to push the democrat party further left by joining CUSA. You can also waste energy and a vote on a 3rd party.

Many look at Tweedledee and Tweedledum and just don't bother to vote.

They say that third parties are spoilers. Spoil what? Example:

End the Fed.
Obama - no
McCain - no
Barr - yes
Baldwin - yes
McKinney - yes

Cancel NAFTA, etc.
Obama - no
McCain - no
Barr - yes
Baldwin - yes
McKinney - yes

Leave the WTO.
Obama - no
McCain - no
Barr - yes
Baldwin - yes
McKinney - yes

Completely withdraw from Iraq.
Obama - no
McCain - no
Barr - yes
Baldwin - yes
McKinney - yes

Close all military bases around the world and bring all troops home.
Obama - no
McCain - no
Barr - yes
Baldwin - yes
McKinney - yes

Stop all foreign aid.
Obama - no
McCain - no
Barr - yes
Baldwin - yes
McKinney - yes

End the Patriot Act, etc.
Obama - no
McCain - no
Barr - yes
Baldwin - yes
McKinney - yes

Enforce Posse Comitatus.
Obama - no
McCain - no
Barr - yes
Baldwin - yes
McKinney - yes

Restore habeas Corpus.
Obama - no
McCain - no
Barr - yes
Baldwin - yes
McKinney - yes

Against the bailout.
Obama - no
McCain - no
Barr - yes
Baldwin - yes
McKinney - yes

Protect gun rights.
Obama - no
McCain - yes ?
Barr - yes
Baldwin - yes
McKinney - yes

Single payer universal health care.
Obama - no
McCain - no
Barr - no
Baldwin - no
McKinney - yes

Indeed, spoil what?