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See, I'm not seeing it that way....I see the arguments about indiginous-ity as a means to disenfranchise one or the other side, and I see it just as strongly played out by the pro-Israeli side seeking make Palestinians "non-People" with every rhetorical tool available: they are an invented people, they don't have a unique (enough) culture, they didn't exist before a certain date, they are squatters, they are colonists, they should be sent to some other country - the propoganda on that is relentness. How can you not see that? If arguments need to be countered - surely, they should be countered on both sides.
If you mean by dismanteling Israel - I agree.
However, Israel took for itself the territory the Palestinians live on and has held it under occupation - utilizing that territory to create their state is not carving it out of Israel.
But it has not taken it, and those that say they have are the ones trying to dismantle Israel. The land was Jewish in law, and that can not be disputed by anyone. The evidence was the Jordanian enacting of a law to relieve the Jews of ownership of the lands that Jordan occupied in 1949 and turning it over to Palestinian ownership. The Oslo accords turned back the pages of history and allowed the Jews who owned land in the west bank to reclaim it and make it theirs again. So get your facts right and stop posting from the Jew hatred anti semitic islamonazi POV
Well yes. It can.
Then dispute it in law, lets see how far you are prepared to go in your demonization of the Jews.
A history lesson for you that in itself proves that the land was Jewish.
Prior to 1900 the land was owned by the Ottoman empire that allowed minimal self rule by certain parts of the empire. The Ottomans went to war as allies of Germany and the Palestinians fought alongside their Mufti. They lost the war and so in line with the usual practise the losers lost land and goods to offset the costs incurred by the winning side. The land of Palestine was part of the reparations made to the LoN as the negotiators for the winning side. The LoN made treaties with various people allocating land to different groups, one of the groups was the Jews who received what was called Jewish Palestine, while the arab muslims received the lions share of all the land in the M.E. So dispute the international laws and the facts all you dare, as doing so will just show that you are a rabid anti Jew racist and Nazi.
According to the debate in the Mandate thread there were NO promises made to either the Jews or the Arabs and no land legally allocated to either group. It was an agreement between powers, not law.
And who said this then as the Mandate is very clear in its words.
Here it is again making just thaose promises
The Avalon Project : The Palestine Mandate
The Palestine Mandate
The Council of the League of Nations:
Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have agreed, for the purpose of giving effect to the provisions of Article 22 of the Covenant of the League of Nations, to entrust to a Mandatory selected by the said Powers the administration of the territory of Palestine, which formerly belonged to the Turkish Empire, within such boundaries as may be fixed by them; and
Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have also agreed that the Mandatory should be responsible for putting into effect the declaration originally made on November 2nd, 1917, by the Government of His Britannic Majesty, and adopted by the said Powers, in favor of the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, it being clearly understood that nothing should be done which might prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country; and
Whereas recognition has thereby been given to the historical connection of the Jewish people with Palestine and to the grounds for reconstituting their national home in that country; and
Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have selected His Britannic Majesty as the Mandatory for Palestine; and
Whereas the mandate in respect of Palestine has been formulated in the following terms and submitted to the Council of the League for approval; and
Whereas His Britannic Majesty has accepted the mandate in respect of Palestine and undertaken to exercise it on behalf of the League of Nations in conformity with the following provisions; and
Whereas by the afore-mentioned Article 22 (paragraph 8), it is provided that the degree of authority, control or administration to be exercised by the Mandatory, not having been previously agreed upon by the Members of the League, shall be explicitly defined by the Council of the League Of Nations;
VERY VERY VERY CLEAR PROMISES, UNLESS YOU ARE A JEW HATER
See, I'm not seeing it that way....I see the arguments about indiginous-ity as a means to disenfranchise one or the other side, and I see it just as strongly played out by the pro-Israeli side seeking make Palestinians "non-People" with every rhetorical tool available: they are an invented people, they don't have a unique (enough) culture, they didn't exist before a certain date, they are squatters, they are colonists, they should be sent to some other country - the propoganda on that is relentness. How can you not see that? If arguments need to be countered - surely, they should be countered on both sides.
If you mean by dismanteling Israel - I agree.
However, Israel took for itself the territory the Palestinians live on and has held it under occupation - utilizing that territory to create their state is not carving it out of Israel.
But it has not taken it, and those that say they have are the ones trying to dismantle Israel. The land was Jewish in law, and that can not be disputed by anyone. The evidence was the Jordanian enacting of a law to relieve the Jews of ownership of the lands that Jordan occupied in 1949 and turning it over to Palestinian ownership. The Oslo accords turned back the pages of history and allowed the Jews who owned land in the west bank to reclaim it and make it theirs again. So get your facts right and stop posting from the Jew hatred anti semitic islamonazi POV
Well yes. It can.
Then dispute it in law, lets see how far you are prepared to go in your demonization of the Jews.
A history lesson for you that in itself proves that the land was Jewish.
Prior to 1900 the land was owned by the Ottoman empire that allowed minimal self rule by certain parts of the empire. The Ottomans went to war as allies of Germany and the Palestinians fought alongside their Mufti. They lost the war and so in line with the usual practise the losers lost land and goods to offset the costs incurred by the winning side. The land of Palestine was part of the reparations made to the LoN as the negotiators for the winning side. The LoN made treaties with various people allocating land to different groups, one of the groups was the Jews who received what was called Jewish Palestine, while the arab muslims received the lions share of all the land in the M.E. So dispute the international laws and the facts all you dare, as doing so will just show that you are a rabid anti Jew racist and Nazi.
According to the debate in the Mandate thread there were NO promises made to either the Jews or the Arabs and no land legally allocated to either group. It was an agreement between powers, not law.
And who said this then as the Mandate is very clear in its words.
Here it is again making just thaose promises
The Avalon Project : The Palestine Mandate
The Palestine Mandate
The Council of the League of Nations:
Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have agreed, for the purpose of giving effect to the provisions of Article 22 of the Covenant of the League of Nations, to entrust to a Mandatory selected by the said Powers the administration of the territory of Palestine, which formerly belonged to the Turkish Empire, within such boundaries as may be fixed by them; and
Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have also agreed that the Mandatory should be responsible for putting into effect the declaration originally made on November 2nd, 1917, by the Government of His Britannic Majesty, and adopted by the said Powers, in favor of the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, it being clearly understood that nothing should be done which might prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country; and
Whereas recognition has thereby been given to the historical connection of the Jewish people with Palestine and to the grounds for reconstituting their national home in that country; and
Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have selected His Britannic Majesty as the Mandatory for Palestine; and
Whereas the mandate in respect of Palestine has been formulated in the following terms and submitted to the Council of the League for approval; and
Whereas His Britannic Majesty has accepted the mandate in respect of Palestine and undertaken to exercise it on behalf of the League of Nations in conformity with the following provisions; and
Whereas by the afore-mentioned Article 22 (paragraph 8), it is provided that the degree of authority, control or administration to be exercised by the Mandatory, not having been previously agreed upon by the Members of the League, shall be explicitly defined by the Council of the League Of Nations;
VERY VERY VERY CLEAR PROMISES, UNLESS YOU ARE A JEW HATER
Because Zionists declared Israel an independent Jewish State on May 15, 1948, when it was only 30% of the populationWhat makes you think Israel has prejudiced anyones religious or civil rights.
I don't think the majority 70% of Arabs living there, would've voted for the creation of a Jewish State.
The fact that it was called a "Jewish State", meant that any non-Jewish residents, had no representation in the new government.
And driving out over 700,000 Arabs with Jewish terrorism, proves it.
There was no hostility between Arabs and Jews in that area until the Zionist migration.And remember protected persons are not those who have engaged in hostile acts against the state, assisted those who engaged in hostile acts against the state or are suspected of engaging or assisting in hostile acts against the state ;--)
The people that colonized Palestine, ejected the native people from the land they had been living on for several millennia and established a state for Jews at the expense of the Christians and Muslims were nearly all European Zionists. That was my only point. Whether Jews from Mars or anywhere else arrived after the native people were dispossessed is not in question. Unless the Jews face the fact that they expropriated a whole people to create their Jewish state, why would they ever compromise and come to some sort of peace. If all Jews believe the propaganda that Boston posts, then the propaganda has them believing:
1. God gave them the land so it was ok to expropriate the Christians and Muslims
2. There were no non-Jews living in Palestine before the Zionists colonized the place.
3. The Palestinians don't exist.
4. The Palestinians arrived after partition.
etc. etc.etc. all Zionist propaganda.
And the lies go on and on.
1 The lands legal sovereign owners gave the Jews the land under International law
2 The Catholic encyclopedia shows that the Ottomans counted more Jews than muslims in Palestine ( sanjak of Jerusalem)
3 Define Palestinians as the evidence shows that most arrived in the invasion forces from the arab league
4 So the evidence shows that they did arrive during the invasion, care to show they didn't.
Yes your lies do go on and on and on
You keep going back to the Catholic encyclopedia. Nothing else supports your claim.
Apart from the Ottoman census records and the LoN records that are where the data comes from. All team Palestine has is a novel written by a committee and that contains errors all the way through. One of which is that the Jews own the most land on one page, and then on the next the whole of the muslim peoples are lumped together to show they inhabit more land.
Now as any intelligent person will tell you I can own land and you can inhabit it.
Then how about the UN setting up the Palestinians own refugee agency because the "Palestinians" did not meet the two year residency criteria to be classed as refugees otherwise.
Now prove that I have lied or I will be putting in a formal complaint about your behaviour and be asking that you be removed from this board.
I can't picture Coyote going anywhere. Actually she's one of the more civil posters on this thing. While I completely disagree with most of her views. I'd rather have an at least somewhat rational opposing view than a completely irrational one.
In any case we now return you to your normally scheduled discussion
So who is considered an indigenous person to Judea. Obviously the Judaic people.
Judea is not indigenous to the area. It was Canaan before it was Judea. In any case, the European Zionists were not from Judea, they were from Europe, by definition.
Furthermore, since the Judaic people can be of any national, ethnic and racial heritage, they cannot be indigenous to any one place, by definition. Descendants of European converts to Judaism, for example, cannot be indigenous to a place in the Middle East, by definition.
The people that colonized Palestine, ejected the native people from the land they had been living on for several millennia and established a state for Jews at the expense of the Christians and Muslims were nearly all European Zionists. That was my only point. Whether Jews from Mars or anywhere else arrived after the native people were dispossessed is not in question. Unless the Jews face the fact that they expropriated a whole people to create their Jewish state, why would they ever compromise and come to some sort of peace. If all Jews believe the propaganda that Boston posts, then the propaganda has them believing:
1. God gave them the land so it was ok to expropriate the Christians and Muslims
2. There were no non-Jews living in Palestine before the Zionists colonized the place.
3. The Palestinians don't exist.
4. The Palestinians arrived after partition.
etc. etc.etc. all Zionist propaganda.
And the lies go on and on.
1 The lands legal sovereign owners gave the Jews the land under International law
2 The Catholic encyclopedia shows that the Ottomans counted more Jews than muslims in Palestine ( sanjak of Jerusalem)
3 Define Palestinians as the evidence shows that most arrived in the invasion forces from the arab league
4 So the evidence shows that they did arrive during the invasion, care to show they didn't.
Yes your lies do go on and on and on
You keep going back to the Catholic encyclopedia. Nothing else supports your claim.
Apart from the Ottoman census records and the LoN records that are where the data comes from.
Yes, and they did not support your claim - we went over that in another thread and you kept bringing up the Catholic Encyclopedia as if it were the Bible.
All team Palestine has is a novel written by a committee and that contains errors all the way through.
One of which is that the Jews own the most land on one page, and then on the next the whole of the muslim peoples are lumped together to show they inhabit more land.
Now as any intelligent person will tell you I can own land and you can inhabit it.
I have no idea what "novel" you are talking about. I used Ottoman census records for my claims.
Then how about the UN setting up the Palestinians own refugee agency because the "Palestinians" did not meet the two year residency criteria to be classed as refugees otherwise.
What about it? Are you now claiming that the Palestinians had only been their < 2 yrs?
Now prove that I have lied or I will be putting in a formal complaint about your behaviour and be asking that you be removed from this board.
Please do.
But it has not taken it, and those that say they have are the ones trying to dismantle Israel. The land was Jewish in law, and that can not be disputed by anyone. The evidence was the Jordanian enacting of a law to relieve the Jews of ownership of the lands that Jordan occupied in 1949 and turning it over to Palestinian ownership. The Oslo accords turned back the pages of history and allowed the Jews who owned land in the west bank to reclaim it and make it theirs again. So get your facts right and stop posting from the Jew hatred anti semitic islamonazi POV
Well yes. It can.
Then dispute it in law, lets see how far you are prepared to go in your demonization of the Jews.
A history lesson for you that in itself proves that the land was Jewish.
Prior to 1900 the land was owned by the Ottoman empire that allowed minimal self rule by certain parts of the empire. The Ottomans went to war as allies of Germany and the Palestinians fought alongside their Mufti. They lost the war and so in line with the usual practise the losers lost land and goods to offset the costs incurred by the winning side. The land of Palestine was part of the reparations made to the LoN as the negotiators for the winning side. The LoN made treaties with various people allocating land to different groups, one of the groups was the Jews who received what was called Jewish Palestine, while the arab muslims received the lions share of all the land in the M.E. So dispute the international laws and the facts all you dare, as doing so will just show that you are a rabid anti Jew racist and Nazi.
According to the debate in the Mandate thread there were NO promises made to either the Jews or the Arabs and no land legally allocated to either group. It was an agreement between powers, not law.
And who said this then as the Mandate is very clear in its words.
Here it is again making just thaose promises
The Avalon Project : The Palestine Mandate
The Palestine Mandate
The Council of the League of Nations:
Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have agreed, for the purpose of giving effect to the provisions of Article 22 of the Covenant of the League of Nations, to entrust to a Mandatory selected by the said Powers the administration of the territory of Palestine, which formerly belonged to the Turkish Empire, within such boundaries as may be fixed by them; and
Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have also agreed that the Mandatory should be responsible for putting into effect the declaration originally made on November 2nd, 1917, by the Government of His Britannic Majesty, and adopted by the said Powers, in favor of the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, it being clearly understood that nothing should be done which might prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country; and
Whereas recognition has thereby been given to the historical connection of the Jewish people with Palestine and to the grounds for reconstituting their national home in that country; and
Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have selected His Britannic Majesty as the Mandatory for Palestine; and
Whereas the mandate in respect of Palestine has been formulated in the following terms and submitted to the Council of the League for approval; and
Whereas His Britannic Majesty has accepted the mandate in respect of Palestine and undertaken to exercise it on behalf of the League of Nations in conformity with the following provisions; and
Whereas by the afore-mentioned Article 22 (paragraph 8), it is provided that the degree of authority, control or administration to be exercised by the Mandatory, not having been previously agreed upon by the Members of the League, shall be explicitly defined by the Council of the League Of Nations;
VERY VERY VERY CLEAR PROMISES, UNLESS YOU ARE A JEW HATER
But it has not taken it, and those that say they have are the ones trying to dismantle Israel. The land was Jewish in law, and that can not be disputed by anyone. The evidence was the Jordanian enacting of a law to relieve the Jews of ownership of the lands that Jordan occupied in 1949 and turning it over to Palestinian ownership. The Oslo accords turned back the pages of history and allowed the Jews who owned land in the west bank to reclaim it and make it theirs again. So get your facts right and stop posting from the Jew hatred anti semitic islamonazi POV
Well yes. It can.
Then dispute it in law, lets see how far you are prepared to go in your demonization of the Jews.
A history lesson for you that in itself proves that the land was Jewish.
Prior to 1900 the land was owned by the Ottoman empire that allowed minimal self rule by certain parts of the empire. The Ottomans went to war as allies of Germany and the Palestinians fought alongside their Mufti. They lost the war and so in line with the usual practise the losers lost land and goods to offset the costs incurred by the winning side. The land of Palestine was part of the reparations made to the LoN as the negotiators for the winning side. The LoN made treaties with various people allocating land to different groups, one of the groups was the Jews who received what was called Jewish Palestine, while the arab muslims received the lions share of all the land in the M.E. So dispute the international laws and the facts all you dare, as doing so will just show that you are a rabid anti Jew racist and Nazi.
According to the debate in the Mandate thread there were NO promises made to either the Jews or the Arabs and no land legally allocated to either group. It was an agreement between powers, not law.
And who said this then as the Mandate is very clear in its words.
Here it is again making just thaose promises
The Avalon Project : The Palestine Mandate
The Palestine Mandate
The Council of the League of Nations:
Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have agreed, for the purpose of giving effect to the provisions of Article 22 of the Covenant of the League of Nations, to entrust to a Mandatory selected by the said Powers the administration of the territory of Palestine, which formerly belonged to the Turkish Empire, within such boundaries as may be fixed by them; and
Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have also agreed that the Mandatory should be responsible for putting into effect the declaration originally made on November 2nd, 1917, by the Government of His Britannic Majesty, and adopted by the said Powers, in favor of the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, it being clearly understood that nothing should be done which might prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country; and
Whereas recognition has thereby been given to the historical connection of the Jewish people with Palestine and to the grounds for reconstituting their national home in that country; and
Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have selected His Britannic Majesty as the Mandatory for Palestine; and
Whereas the mandate in respect of Palestine has been formulated in the following terms and submitted to the Council of the League for approval; and
Whereas His Britannic Majesty has accepted the mandate in respect of Palestine and undertaken to exercise it on behalf of the League of Nations in conformity with the following provisions; and
Whereas by the afore-mentioned Article 22 (paragraph 8), it is provided that the degree of authority, control or administration to be exercised by the Mandatory, not having been previously agreed upon by the Members of the League, shall be explicitly defined by the Council of the League Of Nations;
VERY VERY VERY CLEAR PROMISES, UNLESS YOU ARE A JEW HATER
Yes, let's get the facts right and you're still dribbling "Jew hatred" and "anti semitic islamonazi". I'm no expert on the Mandate and it's history, but there are others here who are far better informed (not you by the way) so I trust their analysis:
The Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate
The people that colonized Palestine, ejected the native people from the land they had been living on for several millennia and established a state for Jews at the expense of the Christians and Muslims were nearly all European Zionists. That was my only point. Whether Jews from Mars or anywhere else arrived after the native people were dispossessed is not in question. Unless the Jews face the fact that they expropriated a whole people to create their Jewish state, why would they ever compromise and come to some sort of peace. If all Jews believe the propaganda that Boston posts, then the propaganda has them believing:
1. God gave them the land so it was ok to expropriate the Christians and Muslims
2. There were no non-Jews living in Palestine before the Zionists colonized the place.
3. The Palestinians don't exist.
4. The Palestinians arrived after partition.
etc. etc.etc. all Zionist propaganda.
And the lies go on and on.
1 The lands legal sovereign owners gave the Jews the land under International law
2 The Catholic encyclopedia shows that the Ottomans counted more Jews than muslims in Palestine ( sanjak of Jerusalem)
3 Define Palestinians as the evidence shows that most arrived in the invasion forces from the arab league
4 So the evidence shows that they did arrive during the invasion, care to show they didn't.
Yes your lies do go on and on and on
You keep going back to the Catholic encyclopedia. Nothing else supports your claim.
Apart from the Ottoman census records and the LoN records that are where the data comes from.
Yes, and they did not support your claim - we went over that in another thread and you kept bringing up the Catholic Encyclopedia as if it were the Bible.
All team Palestine has is a novel written by a committee and that contains errors all the way through.
One of which is that the Jews own the most land on one page, and then on the next the whole of the muslim peoples are lumped together to show they inhabit more land.
Now as any intelligent person will tell you I can own land and you can inhabit it.
I have no idea what "novel" you are talking about. I used Ottoman census records for my claims.
Then how about the UN setting up the Palestinians own refugee agency because the "Palestinians" did not meet the two year residency criteria to be classed as refugees otherwise.
What about it? Are you now claiming that the Palestinians had only been their < 2 yrs?
Now prove that I have lied or I will be putting in a formal complaint about your behaviour and be asking that you be removed from this board.
Please do.
No you claimed that was the case without showing any evidence other than Because I say so. The census records speak for themselves.
The one used by monte that has been proven fake
If you use Ottoman records then they will say the same as my posts, that the Jews were the majority in Palestine ( sanjak of Jerusalem ) with the muslims being a minority.
I am saying nothing, I am letting the UN show the facts by its actions. And one of those is being unable to apply refugee status to the arab muslims because they did not hit the criteria for gaining citizenship of Palestine. The Jews and Christians did not have a special agency invented for there displaced persons because they hit the criteria and had already been absorbed into other nations.
OK will do.
Well yes. It can.
Then dispute it in law, lets see how far you are prepared to go in your demonization of the Jews.
A history lesson for you that in itself proves that the land was Jewish.
Prior to 1900 the land was owned by the Ottoman empire that allowed minimal self rule by certain parts of the empire. The Ottomans went to war as allies of Germany and the Palestinians fought alongside their Mufti. They lost the war and so in line with the usual practise the losers lost land and goods to offset the costs incurred by the winning side. The land of Palestine was part of the reparations made to the LoN as the negotiators for the winning side. The LoN made treaties with various people allocating land to different groups, one of the groups was the Jews who received what was called Jewish Palestine, while the arab muslims received the lions share of all the land in the M.E. So dispute the international laws and the facts all you dare, as doing so will just show that you are a rabid anti Jew racist and Nazi.
According to the debate in the Mandate thread there were NO promises made to either the Jews or the Arabs and no land legally allocated to either group. It was an agreement between powers, not law.
And who said this then as the Mandate is very clear in its words.
Here it is again making just thaose promises
The Avalon Project : The Palestine Mandate
The Palestine Mandate
The Council of the League of Nations:
Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have agreed, for the purpose of giving effect to the provisions of Article 22 of the Covenant of the League of Nations, to entrust to a Mandatory selected by the said Powers the administration of the territory of Palestine, which formerly belonged to the Turkish Empire, within such boundaries as may be fixed by them; and
Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have also agreed that the Mandatory should be responsible for putting into effect the declaration originally made on November 2nd, 1917, by the Government of His Britannic Majesty, and adopted by the said Powers, in favor of the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, it being clearly understood that nothing should be done which might prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country; and
Whereas recognition has thereby been given to the historical connection of the Jewish people with Palestine and to the grounds for reconstituting their national home in that country; and
Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have selected His Britannic Majesty as the Mandatory for Palestine; and
Whereas the mandate in respect of Palestine has been formulated in the following terms and submitted to the Council of the League for approval; and
Whereas His Britannic Majesty has accepted the mandate in respect of Palestine and undertaken to exercise it on behalf of the League of Nations in conformity with the following provisions; and
Whereas by the afore-mentioned Article 22 (paragraph 8), it is provided that the degree of authority, control or administration to be exercised by the Mandatory, not having been previously agreed upon by the Members of the League, shall be explicitly defined by the Council of the League Of Nations;
VERY VERY VERY CLEAR PROMISES, UNLESS YOU ARE A JEW HATER
Well yes. It can.
Then dispute it in law, lets see how far you are prepared to go in your demonization of the Jews.
A history lesson for you that in itself proves that the land was Jewish.
Prior to 1900 the land was owned by the Ottoman empire that allowed minimal self rule by certain parts of the empire. The Ottomans went to war as allies of Germany and the Palestinians fought alongside their Mufti. They lost the war and so in line with the usual practise the losers lost land and goods to offset the costs incurred by the winning side. The land of Palestine was part of the reparations made to the LoN as the negotiators for the winning side. The LoN made treaties with various people allocating land to different groups, one of the groups was the Jews who received what was called Jewish Palestine, while the arab muslims received the lions share of all the land in the M.E. So dispute the international laws and the facts all you dare, as doing so will just show that you are a rabid anti Jew racist and Nazi.
According to the debate in the Mandate thread there were NO promises made to either the Jews or the Arabs and no land legally allocated to either group. It was an agreement between powers, not law.
And who said this then as the Mandate is very clear in its words.
Here it is again making just thaose promises
The Avalon Project : The Palestine Mandate
The Palestine Mandate
The Council of the League of Nations:
Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have agreed, for the purpose of giving effect to the provisions of Article 22 of the Covenant of the League of Nations, to entrust to a Mandatory selected by the said Powers the administration of the territory of Palestine, which formerly belonged to the Turkish Empire, within such boundaries as may be fixed by them; and
Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have also agreed that the Mandatory should be responsible for putting into effect the declaration originally made on November 2nd, 1917, by the Government of His Britannic Majesty, and adopted by the said Powers, in favor of the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, it being clearly understood that nothing should be done which might prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country; and
Whereas recognition has thereby been given to the historical connection of the Jewish people with Palestine and to the grounds for reconstituting their national home in that country; and
Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have selected His Britannic Majesty as the Mandatory for Palestine; and
Whereas the mandate in respect of Palestine has been formulated in the following terms and submitted to the Council of the League for approval; and
Whereas His Britannic Majesty has accepted the mandate in respect of Palestine and undertaken to exercise it on behalf of the League of Nations in conformity with the following provisions; and
Whereas by the afore-mentioned Article 22 (paragraph 8), it is provided that the degree of authority, control or administration to be exercised by the Mandatory, not having been previously agreed upon by the Members of the League, shall be explicitly defined by the Council of the League Of Nations;
VERY VERY VERY CLEAR PROMISES, UNLESS YOU ARE A JEW HATER
Yes, let's get the facts right and you're still dribbling "Jew hatred" and "anti semitic islamonazi". I'm no expert on the Mandate and it's history, but there are others here who are far better informed (not you by the way) so I trust their analysis:
The Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate
Even when I link to the official mandate documents that show the land was granted to the Jews you still argue that they have less rights than arab muslim illegal immigrants. Want to give a title to that action ?
The native people of Palestine are the Palestinians. The Jews were in Europe when the Mandate was signed. The Jews that colonized Palestine were natives of Europe, by definition.
And now the Jewish people are in Israel. So they are the natives of Israel and the Palestinians who no longer live there are Jordanians and Syrians. See how easy that was?
The Europeans of the Jewish faith are in Israel now. The Europeans of the Christian faith were there too, for a while. Longer than the European Jews have been there.
And they're welcome because they don't stab people or blow themselves up in buses.
At least he can't make any trouble there.The native people of Palestine are the Palestinians. The Jews were in Europe when the Mandate was signed. The Jews that colonized Palestine were natives of Europe, by definition.
And now the Jewish people are in Israel. So they are the natives of Israel and the Palestinians who no longer live there are Jordanians and Syrians. See how easy that was?
The Europeans of the Jewish faith are in Israel now. The Europeans of the Christian faith were there too, for a while. Longer than the European Jews have been there.
And they're welcome because they don't stab people or blow themselves up in buses.
George Habash is laughing in Heaven. LOL
The native people of Palestine are the Palestinians. The Jews were in Europe when the Mandate was signed. The Jews that colonized Palestine were natives of Europe, by definition.
And now the Jewish people are in Israel. So they are the natives of Israel and the Palestinians who no longer live there are Jordanians and Syrians. See how easy that was?
The Europeans of the Jewish faith are in Israel now. The Europeans of the Christian faith were there too, for a while. Longer than the European Jews have been there.
And they're welcome because they don't stab people or blow themselves up in buses.
George Habash is laughing in Heaven. LOL
The native people of Palestine are the Palestinians. The Jews were in Europe when the Mandate was signed. The Jews that colonized Palestine were natives of Europe, by definition.
And now the Jewish people are in Israel. So they are the natives of Israel and the Palestinians who no longer live there are Jordanians and Syrians. See how easy that was?
The Europeans of the Jewish faith are in Israel now. The Europeans of the Christian faith were there too, for a while. Longer than the European Jews have been there.
And they're welcome because they don't stab people or blow themselves up in buses.
George Habash is laughing in Heaven. LOL
I very much doubt that a bloodthirsty murderer/terrorist is in Heaven.
So you're arguing Israel is not legitimate/legal.. while unwittingly saying the entire Ottoman break up was.I'm not arguing that ANYONE has less rights - you're the one doing that. I'm just pointing out that regardless of what the mandate says, it was an agreement between powers and did not include either representatives of or promises to Jewish or Arab people nor did it have any force of law.
So you're arguing Israel is not legitimate/legal.. while unwittingly saying the entire Ottoman break up was.I'm not arguing that ANYONE has less rights - you're the one doing that. I'm just pointing out that regardless of what the mandate says, it was an agreement between powers and did not include either representatives of or promises to Jewish or Arab people nor did it have any force of law.
The British weighed the interests of the parties in their decisions, and indeed the Mandate, due to ARAB interest, was altered to split Palestine into two pieces, instead of One Jewish state as envisioned by that Mandate.
Even after The Sole Representative of the Arabs had agreed to the creation of Palestine as a Jewish state.
The Weizmann-Faisal Agreement
That's right, The 1919 agreement BETWEEN the Arab state and Palestine/The JEWISH one.
(Never carried out but posted for intent/state of mind at the time)
Faisal did spectacularly well for the Arabs in those years, getting them 99% of the Ottoman lands and reigning over Other groups such as the Kurds. He also got 'Jordan', 77% of the Mandate before lesser Palestine was even considered.
There were no Votes/Plebiscites at that time, and even the concept would have been foreign to Arabs, and arbitrary in geography/citizenship.
So you're arguing Israel is not legitimate/legal.. while unwittingly saying the entire Ottoman break up was.I'm not arguing that ANYONE has less rights - you're the one doing that. I'm just pointing out that regardless of what the mandate says, it was an agreement between powers and did not include either representatives of or promises to Jewish or Arab people nor did it have any force of law.
The British weighed the interests of the parties in their decisions, and indeed the Mandate, due to ARAB interest, was altered to split Palestine into two pieces, instead of One Jewish state as envisioned by that Mandate.
Even after The Sole Representative of the Arabs had agreed to the creation of Palestine as a Jewish state.
The Weizmann-Faisal Agreement
That's right, The 1919 agreement BETWEEN the Arab state and Palestine/The JEWISH one.
(Never carried out but posted for intent/state of mind at the time)
Faisal did spectacularly well for the Arabs in those years, getting them 99% of the Ottoman lands and reigning over Other groups such as the Kurds. He also got 'Jordan', 77% of the Mandate before lesser Palestine was even considered.
There were no Votes/Plebiscites at that time, and even the concept would have been foreign to Arabs, and arbitrary in geography/citizenship.
The Mandate specifically did not envision a Jewish State. In fact, the French and Italians refused to agree to the text unless it was clear that a Jewish sate was not contemplated.
Churchill made this clear in the British Mandate policy statement of 1922:
"Phrases have been used such as that Palestine is to become as Jewish as England is English. His Majesty's Government regard any such expectation as impracticable and have no such aim in view. Nor have they at any time contemplated, as appears to be feared by the Arab delegation, the disappearance or the subordination of the Arabic population, language or culture in Palestine...."
The Avalon Project : British White Paper of June 1922
So you're arguing Israel is not legitimate/legal.. while unwittingly saying the entire Ottoman break up was.I'm not arguing that ANYONE has less rights - you're the one doing that. I'm just pointing out that regardless of what the mandate says, it was an agreement between powers and did not include either representatives of or promises to Jewish or Arab people nor did it have any force of law.
The British weighed the interests of the parties in their decisions, and indeed the Mandate, due to ARAB interest, was altered to split Palestine into two pieces, instead of One Jewish state as envisioned by that Mandate.
Even after The Sole Representative of the Arabs had agreed to the creation of Palestine as a Jewish state.
The Weizmann-Faisal Agreement
That's right, The 1919 agreement BETWEEN the Arab state and Palestine/The JEWISH one.
(Never carried out but posted for intent/state of mind at the time)
Faisal did spectacularly well for the Arabs in those years, getting them 99% of the Ottoman lands and reigning over Other groups such as the Kurds. He also got 'Jordan', 77% of the Mandate before lesser Palestine was even considered.
There were no Votes/Plebiscites at that time, and even the concept would have been foreign to Arabs, and arbitrary in geography/citizenship.
British White Paper of 1939The Mandate specifically did not envision a Jewish State. In fact, the French and Italians refused to agree to the text unless it was clear that a Jewish state was not contemplated.
Churchill made this clear in the British Mandate policy statement of 1922:
"Phrases have been used such as that Palestine is to become as Jewish as England is English. His Majesty's Government regard any such expectation as impracticable and have no such aim in view. Nor have they at any time contemplated, as appears to be feared by the Arab delegation, the disappearance or the subordination of the Arabic population, language or culture in Palestine...."
So much for Palestinians NOT WORKING Hard,in Israel they build your towns etc.,in Kuwait,Saudi Palestinian engineers,school teachers,builders are in high demand and have been for 50 years.....the Palestinians have one of the highest matriculation rates to University in the world,so your debased comment means Shit......as usualTrouble is you have NO INTENTION of giving the Palestinians anything..............So that's why I am a Shining Sentinel against Zionist ShitheadsEvery Dog has its Day,Shusha........be circumspect of what you have done........WITH ARROGANCE AND HATE
Footnote.....You are also ahead of yourself......Palestinians do live there and LIVE
There is no arrogance or hate in wanting a safe place for the Jewish people to have self-determination and sovereignty over their ancestral lands. Isn't that exactly what the Palestinians are asking for too?
This is a perfect example of whats wrong with the pali's in the first place. They expect to be GIVEN everything and to WORK for nothing.
ISRAEL DOESN'T OWE THE PALI'S ANYTHING
And no Israel shouldn't GIVE the pali's one more inch of the area legally available for the creation of a national Jewish homeland. The pali's were ALREADY GIVEN about 80% of the mandated area, if thats not good enough, then tough shit.
Something else your comment shows is that its really not a land issue. Its three generations of welfare recipients who are beating down the doors for more more more. The UNs funding is drying up, in difficult economic times for the typical donors. One of the major issues is the hand outs are drying up and the mob is getting restless.
No the indigenous people have no obligation to the Arab Muslim colonists who are just going to have to satisfy themselves with the 80% of the mandate they already received.
In the end the Arab Muslim colonists will have to learn to fend for themselves. Once that is, the war is over and the POWs repatriated to neutral third party countries. Whoever might remain of the pali's in Israeli territories will be those wiling to act as civilized people within Israel.
Throw out the UNWRA and hasten the collapse of the Arab Muslim colonists welfare system such that we move that much closer to unconditional surrender, which is obviously the only viable option at this point.
