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The Real Face of Terrorism

...I wonder why we don't hear more about terrorists from Indonesia, Malaysia, Bangladesh, India, countries with huge Muslim populations. The whole us vs the Muslim world scenario provides easy explanations for thoughtless children.
Because those Muslim-dominated countries were (comparatively) latter-day 'conversions' that did not share in the traditions and history of Islamic conquest?

Subscription to Islam does not ipso facto make one aggressive.

However...

Islamic dogma - as it is practically applied - both historically and presently - lends itself to the initiation of Religious Warfare and Religious Violence on a scale unknown to any other mainstream global religious belief system as these are presently configured and practiced in our present age.

Indonesia, Malaysia and Bangladesh (not to mention India [with only a 13% Islamic population, vs. 80% Hindu]) do not share those same Islamic Conquest traditions.

However, in an arc spanning the entire North African coast, other elements of the northern half of Africa, the Arabian peninsula, the eastern shore of the Med, and the western areas of Asia (Turkey, Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, the various Russian-affiliated 'Stans', etc.) - the tradition and mindset of Islamic Conquest is very much alive and well.

And, given that those regions, when taken as a whole, vastly outnumber the populations of fringe Muslim countries (those converted later, after most of the Era of Islamic Conquest had long past)... and given the ease with which Islamic dogma is so easily invoked, to trigger violent outbursts even in those 'fringe' Islamic countries...

In the whole... in the main... the Us-versus-Them (The West versus Islam) theme holds sufficient credibility to compel The West to remain skeptical, alert, and ready to counter-punch, when the inevitable Islamic Militancy du Jour raises its ugly head, to kill more innocents who do not think and believe like them, or who oppose them politically.

Islam is re-awakening after centuries of domination by Euro-Trash, and it is pissed, and it is re-militarizing, and already probing for weaknesses amongst its enemies, while making pretense that its macro-level intentions are peaceful.

Failure to recognize this new (more like, resurgent) macro-level threat to world peace is to hide one's head in the sand...

Far better to play the child, then to play the foolish ostrich, or to serve-up a Neville Chamberlain impression...

kondor-----do not underestimate the terrorist potential
of muslims from Pakistan, India and Indonesia

Plenty of potential there if they are reading this forum, hopefully they're smart enough to know that the hair brained remarks they see here don't represent a cross section of America.


I encountered muslims long before al gore invented the
internet-----and got their POV and their versions of
history. I also encountered hindus and Sikhs and
Zoroastrians and Christians and jews-----from the CITY OF LOVE------Mumbai (the erstwhile Bombay). If you do not know that there is terrorism going on in India and Pakistan and------well--then you just do not know------if you do not know that it has been going on for more than 1000 years---ok---
you don't know
 
...of muslims from Pakistan, India and Indonesia
I don't - although I don't worry much over India, because they're so heavily Hindu-dominated.

I am not suggesting that India will orchestrate attacks-----but
Indian muslims are just as likely to JOIN up Isis as are any
muslims in the world and get involved in the machinations of
al Qaeda. I learned lots from Indian muslims-----like the single
word "zionistCONTROLLEDcia"------way back pre 1970
 
...of muslims from Pakistan, India and Indonesia
I don't - although I don't worry much over India, because they're so heavily Hindu-dominated.

I am not suggesting that India will orchestrate attacks-----but Indian muslims are just as likely to JOIN up Isis as are any muslims in the world and get involved in the machinations of al Qaeda. I learned lots from Indian muslims-----like the single word "zionistCONTROLLEDcia"------way back pre 1970
Now that I can buy into...
 
...Extremists glean whatever they want. Why do you want to help spread their message?
I don't spread their message.

I - like so many others - merely work to keep the dangers inherent in Islamic dogma and practical application of same in today's world - in the public eye.

Our collective commitment to egalitarianism and goodwill has a downside - blinding us to large-scale malevolent intent from outside our own cultural framework.

It's not worth going overboard about, but it's certainly worthwhile to keep-going, discussions of such threat vectors --- pointing out the wolves, to our flock.

Lets follow your reasoning to it's logical conclusions. Let's say you achieve your apparent goal of warning everyone about the dangers of the diabolical threat posed by all Muslims everywhere, and the whole western civilized world is persuaded to your point of view. What then? What comes after that? Will there be a global military campaign to eradicate Islam? Or do you satisfy yourself with more hollow rhetoric?
 
...I wonder why we don't hear more about terrorists from Indonesia, Malaysia, Bangladesh, India, countries with huge Muslim populations. The whole us vs the Muslim world scenario provides easy explanations for thoughtless children.
Because those Muslim-dominated countries were (comparatively) latter-day 'conversions' that did not share in the traditions and history of Islamic conquest?

Subscription to Islam does not ipso facto make one aggressive.

However...

Islamic dogma - as it is practically applied - both historically and presently - lends itself to the initiation of Religious Warfare and Religious Violence on a scale unknown to any other mainstream global religious belief system as these are presently configured and practiced in our present age.

Indonesia, Malaysia and Bangladesh (not to mention India [with only a 13% Islamic population, vs. 80% Hindu]) do not share those same Islamic Conquest traditions.

However, in an arc spanning the entire North African coast, other elements of the northern half of Africa, the Arabian peninsula, the eastern shore of the Med, and the western areas of Asia (Turkey, Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, the various Russian-affiliated 'Stans', etc.) - the tradition and mindset of Islamic Conquest is very much alive and well.

And, given that those regions, when taken as a whole, vastly outnumber the populations of fringe Muslim countries (those converted later, after most of the Era of Islamic Conquest had long past)... and given the ease with which Islamic dogma is so easily invoked, to trigger violent outbursts even in those 'fringe' Islamic countries...

In the whole... in the main... the Us-versus-Them (The West versus Islam) theme holds sufficient credibility to compel The West to remain skeptical, alert, and ready to counter-punch, when the inevitable Islamic Militancy du Jour raises its ugly head, to kill more innocents who do not think and believe like them, or who oppose them politically.

Islam is re-awakening after centuries of domination by Euro-Trash, and it is pissed, and it is re-militarizing, and already probing for weaknesses amongst its enemies, while making pretense that its macro-level intentions are peaceful.

Failure to recognize this new (more like, resurgent) macro-level threat to world peace is to hide one's head in the sand...

Far better to play the child, then to play the foolish ostrich, or to serve-up a Neville Chamberlain impression...

kondor-----do not underestimate the terrorist potential
of muslims from Pakistan, India and Indonesia

Plenty of potential there if they are reading this forum, hopefully they're smart enough to know that the hair brained remarks they see here don't represent a cross section of America.


I encountered muslims long before al gore invented the
internet-----and got their POV and their versions of
history. I also encountered hindus and Sikhs and
Zoroastrians and Christians and jews-----from the CITY OF LOVE------Mumbai (the erstwhile Bombay). If you do not know that there is terrorism going on in India and Pakistan and------well--then you just do not know------if you do not know that it has been going on for more than 1000 years---ok---
you don't know

These kind of anecdotes are always so helpful, makes complex issues much easier to understand.
 
...Lets follow your reasoning to it's logical conclusions. Let's say you achieve your apparent goal of warning everyone about the dangers of the diabolical threat posed by all Muslims everywhere, and the whole western civilized world is persuaded to your point of view...
My goal - and that of many others - is merely to outline the risks and the threat-vector, in order to encourage sustained watchfulness, skepticism, and readiness.

...What then? What comes after that?...
Trouble is, your "then" and "that" were defined incorrectly.

...Will there be a global military campaign to eradicate Islam?...
Let's hope not.

But, personally, and anecdotally, I DO see a time of large-scale confrontation between the domains of Islam and The West (or even simply the rest of the non-Islamic world).

And, in our present (and future) age of high-speed travel, instantaneous communications, weapons of mass destruction, etc., I foresee this threat continuing until we see an end to whatever period of conflict occurs between the two sides, with Islam getting the worst of it, and being obliged to undertake dogmatic reforms and to shed old, warfare- and violence- inducing interpretations, and even to jettison or de-emphasize various texts and passages, as detrimental to human survival in such an age.

...Or do you satisfy yourself with more hollow rhetoric?
Personally, I'm always glad when people visit such discussions, and walk away thoughtful, and skeptical, and believing that some measure of watchfulness and resolute behavior and readiness is appropriate in light of the nature of the threat-vector. That's enough, and its own reward, for sounding an alarm, without inducing paranoia or paralysis.
 
...Extremists glean whatever they want. Why do you want to help spread their message?
I don't spread their message.

I - like so many others - merely work to keep the dangers inherent in Islamic dogma and practical application of same in today's world - in the public eye.

Our collective commitment to egalitarianism and goodwill has a downside - blinding us to large-scale malevolent intent from outside our own cultural framework.

It's not worth going overboard about, but it's certainly worthwhile to keep-going, discussions of such threat vectors --- pointing out the wolves, to our flock.

Lets follow your reasoning to it's logical conclusions. Let's say you achieve your apparent goal of warning everyone about the dangers of the diabolical threat posed by all Muslims everywhere, and the whole western civilized world is persuaded to your point of view. What then? What comes after that? Will there be a global military campaign to eradicate Islam? Or do you satisfy yourself with more hollow rhetoric?

You are incapable of following reasoning. It is important to
KNOW the situation. Wars happen because of lots of
NOT KNOWING -----and are conducted badly because of
NOT KNOWING. In the 1980s--the USA saw resistence
to RUSSIAN incursion in Afghanistan-----so the US supported the resistence----completely unaware of the real
motivation of that resistence which was actually---very much IDEOLOGICALLY Pakistan driven as in "ISLAMIC STATE". Support by the US rendered Afghanistan an ideal base for your hero OSAMA -----the history of the past 35 years IS -----we facilitated a big tragedy by not knowing. ---I kinda knew------it was not so hard to know. Afghanistan was once a VERY culturally diverse land------good to know that too. Today we are facilitating by people like you----who prefer not to know------a really horrific monster ------the CALIPHATE MOVEMENT ------if you were close to a decent
and honest person you would not pepper your rant with those old worn out libels "you said ALL muslims are monsters"
 
...Lets follow your reasoning to it's logical conclusions. Let's say you achieve your apparent goal of warning everyone about the dangers of the diabolical threat posed by all Muslims everywhere, and the whole western civilized world is persuaded to your point of view...
My goal - and that of many others - is merely to outline the risks and the threat-vector, in order to encourage sustained watchfulness, skepticism, and readiness.

...What then? What comes after that?...
Trouble is, your "then" and "that" were defined incorrectly.

...Will there be a global military campaign to eradicate Islam?...
Let's hope not.

But, personally, and anecdotally, I DO see a time of large-scale confrontation between the domains of Islam and The West (or even simply the rest of the non-Islamic world).

And, in our present (and future) age of high-speed travel, instantaneous communications, weapons of mass destruction, etc., I foresee this threat continuing until we see an end to whatever period of conflict occurs between the two sides, with Islam getting the worst of it, and being obliged to undertake dogmatic reforms and to shed old, warfare- and violence- inducing interpretations, and even to jettison or de-emphasize various texts and passages, as detrimental to human survival in such an age.

...Or do you satisfy yourself with more hollow rhetoric?
Personally, I'm always glad when people visit such discussions, and walk away thoughtful, and skeptical, and believing that some measure of watchfulness and resolute behavior and readiness is appropriate in light of the nature of the threat-vector. That's enough, and its own reward, for sounding an alarm, without inducing paranoia or paralysis.

Well General, I can only describe your strategy as vague, at best. Perhaps you'd like to describe in more detail how you would conduct this war against a whole people who are geographically dispersed and interspersed with other populations.
 
...Extremists glean whatever they want. Why do you want to help spread their message?
I don't spread their message.

I - like so many others - merely work to keep the dangers inherent in Islamic dogma and practical application of same in today's world - in the public eye.

Our collective commitment to egalitarianism and goodwill has a downside - blinding us to large-scale malevolent intent from outside our own cultural framework.

It's not worth going overboard about, but it's certainly worthwhile to keep-going, discussions of such threat vectors --- pointing out the wolves, to our flock.

Lets follow your reasoning to it's logical conclusions. Let's say you achieve your apparent goal of warning everyone about the dangers of the diabolical threat posed by all Muslims everywhere, and the whole western civilized world is persuaded to your point of view. What then? What comes after that? Will there be a global military campaign to eradicate Islam? Or do you satisfy yourself with more hollow rhetoric?

You are incapable of following reasoning. It is important to
KNOW the situation. Wars happen because of lots of
NOT KNOWING -----and are conducted badly because of
NOT KNOWING. In the 1980s--the USA saw resistence
to RUSSIAN incursion in Afghanistan-----so the US supported the resistence----completely unaware of the real
motivation of that resistence which was actually---very much IDEOLOGICALLY Pakistan driven as in "ISLAMIC STATE". Support by the US rendered Afghanistan an ideal base for your hero OSAMA -----the history of the past 35 years IS -----we facilitated a big tragedy by not knowing. ---I kinda knew------it was not so hard to know. Afghanistan was once a VERY culturally diverse land------good to know that too. Today we are facilitating by people like you----who prefer not to know------a really horrific monster ------the CALIPHATE MOVEMENT ------if you were close to a decent
and honest person you would not pepper your rant with those old worn out libels "you said ALL muslims are monsters"

I don't give two shits about ideology, I only care about results.
 
...I wonder why we don't hear more about terrorists from Indonesia, Malaysia, Bangladesh, India, countries with huge Muslim populations. The whole us vs the Muslim world scenario provides easy explanations for thoughtless children.
Because those Muslim-dominated countries were (comparatively) latter-day 'conversions' that did not share in the traditions and history of Islamic conquest?

Subscription to Islam does not ipso facto make one aggressive.

However...

Islamic dogma - as it is practically applied - both historically and presently - lends itself to the initiation of Religious Warfare and Religious Violence on a scale unknown to any other mainstream global religious belief system as these are presently configured and practiced in our present age.

Indonesia, Malaysia and Bangladesh (not to mention India [with only a 13% Islamic population, vs. 80% Hindu]) do not share those same Islamic Conquest traditions.

However, in an arc spanning the entire North African coast, other elements of the northern half of Africa, the Arabian peninsula, the eastern shore of the Med, and the western areas of Asia (Turkey, Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, the various Russian-affiliated 'Stans', etc.) - the tradition and mindset of Islamic Conquest is very much alive and well.

And, given that those regions, when taken as a whole, vastly outnumber the populations of fringe Muslim countries (those converted later, after most of the Era of Islamic Conquest had long past)... and given the ease with which Islamic dogma is so easily invoked, to trigger violent outbursts even in those 'fringe' Islamic countries...

In the whole... in the main... the Us-versus-Them (The West versus Islam) theme holds sufficient credibility to compel The West to remain skeptical, alert, and ready to counter-punch, when the inevitable Islamic Militancy du Jour raises its ugly head, to kill more innocents who do not think and believe like them, or who oppose them politically.

Islam is re-awakening after centuries of domination by Euro-Trash, and it is pissed, and it is re-militarizing, and already probing for weaknesses amongst its enemies, while making pretense that its macro-level intentions are peaceful.

Failure to recognize this new (more like, resurgent) macro-level threat to world peace is to hide one's head in the sand...

Far better to play the child, then to play the foolish ostrich, or to serve-up a Neville Chamberlain impression...

kondor-----do not underestimate the terrorist potential
of muslims from Pakistan, India and Indonesia

Plenty of potential there if they are reading this forum, hopefully they're smart enough to know that the hair brained remarks they see here don't represent a cross section of America.


I encountered muslims long before al gore invented the
internet-----and got their POV and their versions of
history. I also encountered hindus and Sikhs and
Zoroastrians and Christians and jews-----from the CITY OF LOVE------Mumbai (the erstwhile Bombay). If you do not know that there is terrorism going on in India and Pakistan and------well--then you just do not know------if you do not know that it has been going on for more than 1000 years---ok---
you don't know

These kind of anecdotes are always so helpful, makes complex issues much easier to understand.

all of science depends on anecdotal observation-----the dictum in scientific research is "once is an accident"-----
"twice is a coincidence" "three times is a pattern"----I will
give you a real example. A person shows up in hospital emergency room with a rash---a slight fever---muscle and headaches------a single slightly sick person from---well probably a virus. ------one hour later----two more the same---two hours later----five more the same. That is all you need to know that there is ------at the very least a local BREAKOUT of something and time to find out what is going on in the other hospitals. Anecdotal observation starts it all.-
Later on-----intial impressions are either demonstrated or not
demonstrated That which I learned many years ago did
PAN OUT In fact,, back then I predicted it would all
"go away"
 
Well General, I can only describe your strategy as vague, at best. Perhaps you'd like to describe in more detail how you would conduct this war against a whole people who are geographically dispersed and interspersed with other populations.
What is vague about a strategy of watchfulness and skepticism and readiness and projections of strength and resolute thinking?

A strategy directed towards practitioners of an alien belief system that is inherently and manifestly hostile to the beliefs and cultures of those who do not believe or think like them?

You confuse War with Watchfulness and Readiness.

Your problem - not mine.
 
Well General, I can only describe your strategy as vague, at best. Perhaps you'd like to describe in more detail how you would conduct this war against a whole people who are geographically dispersed and interspersed with other populations.
What is vague about a strategy of watchfulness and skepticism and readiness and projections of strength and resolute thinking?

A strategy directed towards practitioners of an alien belief system that is inherently and manifestly hostile to the beliefs and cultures of those who do not believe or think like them?

You confuse War with Watchfulness and Readiness.

Your problem - not mine.

If your not making war on all Muslims then it would seem that kind of simplistic reasoning must be counter productive.
 
...If your not making war on all Muslims then it would seem that kind of simplistic reasoning must be counter productive.
There is nothing simplistic about calling for Skepticism and Watchfulness and Readiness and Projections of Strength, directed against both the belief-system itself, and those nations and regions in which that belief system dominates and has a demonstrated history or present-day tendency towards religiously-focused warfare or aggression or terrorism, especially when those intentions and behaviors are directed against Infidels.

Watchfulness is almost always more productive than War, and has oftentimes avoided that most UNproductive of Man's endeavors.
 
...If your not making war on all Muslims then it would seem that kind of simplistic reasoning must be counter productive.
There is nothing simplistic about calling for Skepticism and Watchfulness and Readiness and Projections of Strength, directed against both the belief-system itself, and those nations and regions in which that belief system dominates and has a demonstrated history or present-day tendency towards religiously-focused warfare or aggression or terrorism, especially when those intentions and behaviors are directed against Infidels.

Watchfulness is almost always more productive than War, and has oftentimes avoided that most UNproductive of Man's endeavors.

Watchfulness? Is that it? That's your strategy to defeat Islamic extremists? Still sounds sort of vague and generic. I'd like to know what the plan is to defeat these people. Will they be overwhelmed and conquered by more talk? Will your campaign of watchfullness observe them to death? I'm not seeing a plan of action here.
 
...If your not making war on all Muslims then it would seem that kind of simplistic reasoning must be counter productive.
There is nothing simplistic about calling for Skepticism and Watchfulness and Readiness and Projections of Strength, directed against both the belief-system itself, and those nations and regions in which that belief system dominates and has a demonstrated history or present-day tendency towards religiously-focused warfare or aggression or terrorism, especially when those intentions and behaviors are directed against Infidels.

Watchfulness is almost always more productive than War, and has oftentimes avoided that most UNproductive of Man's endeavors.

Watchfulness? Is that it? That's your strategy to defeat Islamic extremists? Still sounds sort of vague and generic. I'd like to know what the plan is to defeat these people. Will they be overwhelmed and conquered by more talk? Will your campaign of watchfullness observe them to death? I'm not seeing a plan of action here.
What more is needed, beyond watchfulness and readiness?
 
...If your not making war on all Muslims then it would seem that kind of simplistic reasoning must be counter productive.
There is nothing simplistic about calling for Skepticism and Watchfulness and Readiness and Projections of Strength, directed against both the belief-system itself, and those nations and regions in which that belief system dominates and has a demonstrated history or present-day tendency towards religiously-focused warfare or aggression or terrorism, especially when those intentions and behaviors are directed against Infidels.

Watchfulness is almost always more productive than War, and has oftentimes avoided that most UNproductive of Man's endeavors.

Watchfulness? Is that it? That's your strategy to defeat Islamic extremists? Still sounds sort of vague and generic. I'd like to know what the plan is to defeat these people. Will they be overwhelmed and conquered by more talk? Will your campaign of watchfullness observe them to death? I'm not seeing a plan of action here.
What more is needed, beyond watchfulness and readiness?

What happened to the epic global struggle with Islam? All this talk about the inevitable historic clash of opposing civilizations seems to go nowhere.
 
Because those Muslim-dominated countries were (comparatively) latter-day 'conversions' that did not share in the traditions and history of Islamic conquest?

Subscription to Islam does not ipso facto make one aggressive.

However...

Islamic dogma - as it is practically applied - both historically and presently - lends itself to the initiation of Religious Warfare and Religious Violence on a scale unknown to any other mainstream global religious belief system as these are presently configured and practiced in our present age.

Indonesia, Malaysia and Bangladesh (not to mention India [with only a 13% Islamic population, vs. 80% Hindu]) do not share those same Islamic Conquest traditions.

However, in an arc spanning the entire North African coast, other elements of the northern half of Africa, the Arabian peninsula, the eastern shore of the Med, and the western areas of Asia (Turkey, Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, the various Russian-affiliated 'Stans', etc.) - the tradition and mindset of Islamic Conquest is very much alive and well.

And, given that those regions, when taken as a whole, vastly outnumber the populations of fringe Muslim countries (those converted later, after most of the Era of Islamic Conquest had long past)... and given the ease with which Islamic dogma is so easily invoked, to trigger violent outbursts even in those 'fringe' Islamic countries...

In the whole... in the main... the Us-versus-Them (The West versus Islam) theme holds sufficient credibility to compel The West to remain skeptical, alert, and ready to counter-punch, when the inevitable Islamic Militancy du Jour raises its ugly head, to kill more innocents who do not think and believe like them, or who oppose them politically.

Islam is re-awakening after centuries of domination by Euro-Trash, and it is pissed, and it is re-militarizing, and already probing for weaknesses amongst its enemies, while making pretense that its macro-level intentions are peaceful.

Failure to recognize this new (more like, resurgent) macro-level threat to world peace is to hide one's head in the sand...

Far better to play the child, then to play the foolish ostrich, or to serve-up a Neville Chamberlain impression...

kondor-----do not underestimate the terrorist potential
of muslims from Pakistan, India and Indonesia

Plenty of potential there if they are reading this forum, hopefully they're smart enough to know that the hair brained remarks they see here don't represent a cross section of America.


I encountered muslims long before al gore invented the
internet-----and got their POV and their versions of
history. I also encountered hindus and Sikhs and
Zoroastrians and Christians and jews-----from the CITY OF LOVE------Mumbai (the erstwhile Bombay). If you do not know that there is terrorism going on in India and Pakistan and------well--then you just do not know------if you do not know that it has been going on for more than 1000 years---ok---
you don't know

These kind of anecdotes are always so helpful, makes complex issues much easier to understand.

all of science depends on anecdotal observation-----the dictum in scientific research is "once is an accident"-----
"twice is a coincidence" "three times is a pattern"----I will
give you a real example. A person shows up in hospital emergency room with a rash---a slight fever---muscle and headaches------a single slightly sick person from---well probably a virus. ------one hour later----two more the same---two hours later----five more the same. That is all you need to know that there is ------at the very least a local BREAKOUT of something and time to find out what is going on in the other hospitals. Anecdotal observation starts it all.-
Later on-----intial impressions are either demonstrated or not
demonstrated That which I learned many years ago did
PAN OUT In fact,, back then I predicted it would all
"go away"

Yup, three times is the charm, and with three posts like this one I can draw my own conclusions.
 
...If your not making war on all Muslims then it would seem that kind of simplistic reasoning must be counter productive.
There is nothing simplistic about calling for Skepticism and Watchfulness and Readiness and Projections of Strength, directed against both the belief-system itself, and those nations and regions in which that belief system dominates and has a demonstrated history or present-day tendency towards religiously-focused warfare or aggression or terrorism, especially when those intentions and behaviors are directed against Infidels.

Watchfulness is almost always more productive than War, and has oftentimes avoided that most UNproductive of Man's endeavors.

Watchfulness? Is that it? That's your strategy to defeat Islamic extremists? Still sounds sort of vague and generic. I'd like to know what the plan is to defeat these people. Will they be overwhelmed and conquered by more talk? Will your campaign of watchfullness observe them to death? I'm not seeing a plan of action here.
What more is needed, beyond watchfulness and readiness?

What happened to the epic global struggle with Islam? All this talk about the inevitable historic clash of opposing civilizations seems to go nowhere.
I dunno.

Am I supposed to?
 

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