The truth about Truman’s bombing Japan

[RetiredGySgt]

The original link in the opening post does NOT show what you claim. nor is it verifiable nor valid.

 

[Unkotare]

Americans need to come to the realization that the bombings of civilians was really mass murder, not unlike what Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan were guilty of.

Great column on the subject.

The Atomic Bombing of Japan, Reconsidered
By Alan Mosley
Mises.org

January 2, 2019

Russia’s move, in fact, compelled the Japanese to consider unconditional surrender; until then, they were only open to a conditional surrender that left their Emperor Hirohito some dignity and protections from war-crimes trials. Ward concludes that, as in the European theatre, Truman didn’t beat Japan; Stalin did.

Harry Truman never expressed regret publicly over his decision to use the atomic bombs. However, he did order an independent study on the state of the war effort leading up to August of 1945, and the strategic value of the Hiroshima and Nagasaki bombings. In 1946, the U.S. Bombing Survey published its findings, which concluded as follows: “Based on a detailed investigation of all the facts and supported by the testimony of the surviving Japanese leaders involved, it is the Survey’s opinion that certainly prior to 31 December 1945 and in all probability prior to 1 November 1945, Japan would have surrendered even if the atomic bombs had not been dropped, even if Russia had not entered the war, and even if no invasion had been planned or contemplated.” This is an intensive condemnation of Truman’s decision, seeing as Russia did enter the war, and that plans for an invasion had been developed.

As Timothy P. Carney writes for the Washington Examiner, the fog of war can be a tricky thing. But if we’re forced to side with Truman, or Eisenhower and the other dissenting military leaders, the Eisenhower position isn’t merely valid; it actually aligns better with some fundamental American values. Given all the uncertainty, both at the time and with modern historical revisionism, it’s better to look to principle rather than fortune-telling. One principle that should be near the top of everyone’s list is this: it’s wrong to target civilians with weapons of mass destruction. The deliberate killing of innocent men, women, and children by the hundreds of thousands cannot be justified under any circumstances, much less the ambiguous ones Truman encountered. Whether his decision was motivated by indignation toward Japanese “ pigheadedness” or concern for his troops, Truman’s use of such devastating weapons against non-combatants should not be excused. Americans must strive for complete and honest analysis of the past (and present) conflicts. And if she is to remain true to her own ideals, America must strive for more noble and moral ends—in all conflicts, domestic and foreign—guided by our most cherished first principles, such as the Golden Rule. At the very least, Americans should not try so hard to justify mass murder.

The Atomic Bombing of Japan - LewRockwell LewRockwell.com

.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Americans need to come to the realization that the bombings of civilians was really mass murder, not unlike what Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan were guilty of.

Great column on the subject.

The Atomic Bombing of Japan, Reconsidered
By Alan Mosley
Mises.org

January 2, 2019

Russia’s move, in fact, compelled the Japanese to consider unconditional surrender; until then, they were only open to a conditional surrender that left their Emperor Hirohito some dignity and protections from war-crimes trials. Ward concludes that, as in the European theatre, Truman didn’t beat Japan; Stalin did.

Harry Truman never expressed regret publicly over his decision to use the atomic bombs. However, he did order an independent study on the state of the war effort leading up to August of 1945, and the strategic value of the Hiroshima and Nagasaki bombings. In 1946, the U.S. Bombing Survey published its findings, which concluded as follows: “Based on a detailed investigation of all the facts and supported by the testimony of the surviving Japanese leaders involved, it is the Survey’s opinion that certainly prior to 31 December 1945 and in all probability prior to 1 November 1945, Japan would have surrendered even if the atomic bombs had not been dropped, even if Russia had not entered the war, and even if no invasion had been planned or contemplated.” This is an intensive condemnation of Truman’s decision, seeing as Russia did enter the war, and that plans for an invasion had been developed.

As Timothy P. Carney writes for the Washington Examiner, the fog of war can be a tricky thing. But if we’re forced to side with Truman, or Eisenhower and the other dissenting military leaders, the Eisenhower position isn’t merely valid; it actually aligns better with some fundamental American values. Given all the uncertainty, both at the time and with modern historical revisionism, it’s better to look to principle rather than fortune-telling. One principle that should be near the top of everyone’s list is this: it’s wrong to target civilians with weapons of mass destruction. The deliberate killing of innocent men, women, and children by the hundreds of thousands cannot be justified under any circumstances, much less the ambiguous ones Truman encountered. Whether his decision was motivated by indignation toward Japanese “ pigheadedness” or concern for his troops, Truman’s use of such devastating weapons against non-combatants should not be excused. Americans must strive for complete and honest analysis of the past (and present) conflicts. And if she is to remain true to her own ideals, America must strive for more noble and moral ends—in all conflicts, domestic and foreign—guided by our most cherished first principles, such as the Golden Rule. At the very least, Americans should not try so hard to justify mass murder.

The Atomic Bombing of Japan - LewRockwell LewRockwell.com

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a Book with NO actual link to any ACTUAL evidence as usual. Again I have link to ACTUAL source documents not fevered dreams of wanna be revisionists.

 

[airplanemechanic]

The best American value is that many Americans didn't die in the invasion of Japan.

The worst American value was using a weapon of mass destruction on a defenseless nation, ready to surrender.

They were so ready to surrender it took TWO nuclear weapon detonations to get them to surrender?

Quit rewriting history. 3000 Americans lost their lives at Pearl Harbor. They were innocent too. Fuck Japan. I still hate those fucking slant eyed bastards. They awoke a sleeping giant.

We fucked them up. Go 'murica!!!!

 

[Unkotare]

The best American value is that many Americans didn't die in the invasion of Japan.

The worst American value was using a weapon of mass destruction on a defenseless nation, ready to surrender.

They were so ready to surrender it took TWO nuclear weapon detonations to get them to surrender?

Quit rewriting history. 3000 Americans lost their lives at Pearl Harbor. They were innocent too. Fuck Japan. I still hate those fucking slant eyed bastards. They awoke a sleeping giant.

We fucked them up. Go 'murica!!!!

YOU didn’t do anything, boy. Learn how to drink before trying too hard.

 

[regent]

The best American value is that many Americans didn't die in the invasion of Japan.

The worst American value was using a weapon of mass destruction on a defenseless nation, ready to surrender.

If true, why were the Japanese trying to create the same weapon of mass destruction, and
a defenseless nation, ready to surrender, should not bomb or go to war with other nations.

 

[gipper]

The best American value is that many Americans didn't die in the invasion of Japan.

The worst American value was using a weapon of mass destruction on a defenseless nation, ready to surrender.

If true, why were the Japanese trying to create the same weapon of mass destruction, and
a defenseless nation, ready to surrender, should not bomb or go to war with other nations.

What?

 

[Camp]

If you, your spouse, your parent, your sibling, your child, your neighbor, your friend, a school mate or anyone you might know was scheduled and preparing for the invasion of Japan you were probably thrilled and glad the bombs were dropped and used to force Japan into surrender. Horrible battles against the Japanese, especially the recent high casualty ones at places like Iwo Jima and Okinawa, the Kamikaze attacks on US Sailors and the knowledge of the coming casualties among those fathers, brothers, sons, neighbors, etc. with a Japanese invasion made atomic bombings welcome by a grateful American population.

​

 

[gipper]

If you, your spouse, your parent, your sibling, your child, your neighbor, your friend, a school mate or anyone you might know was scheduled and preparing for the invasion of Japan you were probably thrilled and glad the bombs were dropped and used to force Japan into surrender. Horrible battles against the Japanese, especially the recent high casualty ones at places like Iwo Jima and Okinawa, the Kamikaze attacks on US Sailors and the knowledge of the coming casualties among those fathers, brothers, sons, neighbors, etc. with a Japanese invasion made atomic bombings welcome by a grateful American population.

​

BS. Why are statists such disgusting imperialists?

THERE WAS NO NEED TO INVADE

BTW my father was in southern France, preparing for the imperialist invasion of Japan.

If it weren’t for American statists, the Ruling Class wouldn’t so easily get away with mass murder.

 

[pismoe]

If you, your spouse, your parent, your sibling, your child, your neighbor, your friend, a school mate or anyone you might know was scheduled and preparing for the invasion of Japan you were probably thrilled and glad the bombs were dropped and used to force Japan into surrender. Horrible battles against the Japanese, especially the recent high casualty ones at places like Iwo Jima and Okinawa, the Kamikaze attacks on US Sailors and the knowledge of the coming casualties among those fathers, brothers, sons, neighbors, etc. with a Japanese invasion made atomic bombings welcome by a grateful American population.

​

BS. Why are statists such disgusting imperialists?

THERE WAS NO NEED TO INVADE

BTW my father was in southern France, preparing for the imperialist invasion of Japan.

If it weren’t for American statists, the Ruling Class wouldn’t so easily get away with mass murder.

-------------------------------------- my Uncle Micky is still in a French Cemetary . He wasn't worried about invading 'japan' .

 

[pismoe]

need to invade 'japan' was simply to humiliate and reform , intimidate and put them under Americas thumb and i said that earlier in this thread . Its the BEST way or tactic that the USA seems to have forgotten since we built the 'Highway of Death' on the 'iraqi' army in 91 or 92 Gipper ,

 

[gipper]

The best American value is that many Americans didn't die in the invasion of Japan.

The worst American value was using a weapon of mass destruction on a defenseless nation, ready to surrender.

If true, why were the Japanese trying to create the same weapon of mass destruction, and
a defenseless nation, ready to surrender, should not bomb or go to war with other nations.

So? Wouldn’t you if a blood thirsty asshole like FDR, was trying to murder your entire nation? WTF is wrong with you?

Statism warps the mind

 

[gipper]

need to invade 'japan' was simply to humiliate and reform , intimidate and put them under Americas thumb and i said that earlier in this thread . Its the BEST way or tactic that the USA seems to have forgotten since we built the 'Highway of Death' on the 'iraqi' army in 91 or 92 Gipper ,

Yes the USA is an imperialist power and has been for a long time, but statists don’t know it.

 

[pismoe]

i don't know or recognize 'imperialist' , i see the bombing of 'japan' simply as a FULL and total defeat of 'japan and i think it was needed . I say that ALL Wars should be fought in the same way as 'japan' was defeated rather than fecking around with the enemy the way that is been being done these last 17 years in the middle east . Seems to me that MUCH of the Genius of the WW2 Generation War Fighting has been lost with the current USA Military . i blame ALL the 'bush's' and 'colon powell' Gipper .

 

[Unkotare]

If you, your spouse, your parent, your sibling, your child, your neighbor, your friend, a school mate or anyone you might know was scheduled and preparing for the invasion of Japan you were probably thrilled and glad the bombs were dropped and used to force Japan into surrender. Horrible battles against the Japanese, especially the recent high casualty ones at places like Iwo Jima and Okinawa, the Kamikaze attacks on US Sailors and the knowledge of the coming casualties among those fathers, brothers, sons, neighbors, etc. with a Japanese invasion made atomic bombings welcome by a grateful American population.

​

Iwo and Okinawa both happened AFTER fdr chose to ignore the detailed information from MacArthur about overtures for surrender.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

If you, your spouse, your parent, your sibling, your child, your neighbor, your friend, a school mate or anyone you might know was scheduled and preparing for the invasion of Japan you were probably thrilled and glad the bombs were dropped and used to force Japan into surrender. Horrible battles against the Japanese, especially the recent high casualty ones at places like Iwo Jima and Okinawa, the Kamikaze attacks on US Sailors and the knowledge of the coming casualties among those fathers, brothers, sons, neighbors, etc. with a Japanese invasion made atomic bombings welcome by a grateful American population.

​

Iwo and Okinawa both happened AFTER fdr chose to ignore the detailed information from MacArthur about overtures for surrender.

Provide a verifiable link to these supposed peace overtures. Something from the Government will do as I have done. Then explain how your buddy Gipper claims they offered to surrender with the only request being don't hang the Emperor.

 

[pismoe]

the only way to agree to a surrender is UNCONDITIONAL with NO preconditions . Feck that 'emperor or gods' head , his head was ours . ----------------- Just a general comment .

 

[Unkotare]

Japan knew of & expected serious retaliation for Pearl Harbor and I surely wouldn't call them defenseless.



I just don't think anyone expected such destruction

By 1945, they were a defenseless nation. Please keep up.

The battles on Iwo Jima and Okinawa were fought in 1945. .....

After fdr said “fu” to the idea of peace.

 

[Unkotare]

the only way to agree to a surrender is UNCONDITIONAL with NO preconditions . Feck that 'emperor or gods' head , his head was ours . ----------------- Just a general comment .

The terms offered were exactly the ones we agreed to after Truman got the blood he was after.

 

[regent]

Won't be long on these boards until we discover it was really the Americans that bombed Pearl Harbor.