The U.S. NOT founded upon Christianity

[AllieBaba]

No, slavery is NOT slavery.

In biblical times, "slave" was essentially a word for employee. Slaves were PAID for their services, and they were freed every so many years. And I don't believe they were born slaves, at leastSl not in Hebrew society.

Slaves could own property. Slaves could be heard in court. Slaves could be and were learned and respected members of society.

 

[Sky Dancer]

I'm really sick and tired of Lefties today attacking Christians about slavery and women's rights (their two claims to fame)....it is so hypocritical...

If they were truly concerned about those two topics they would criticize the Democratic Party instead.....and certainly voice their criticism of various Islamic practices today...

Relax. Nobody's throwing you to the lions.

 

[AllieBaba]

You're trying. Daniel was thrown to the lions because he dared to publicly proclaim a belief in God. You also want to make that illegal.

 

[Sky Dancer]

You're trying. Daniel was thrown to the lions because he dared to publicly proclaim a belief in God. You also want to make that illegal.

Really? I want it to be illegal to proclaim a belief in God? Show me any post I've written that says that. Just one.

Religious freedom comes from our Constitution, a secular document. That's my position. Nothing anti-religion in that.

Your Christian martyr complex has a hair trigger, Allie.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Not scrolling through 54 pages.

The Founders based our government on Rome, the Roman Empire, the Roman Republic.

Instead of a Caesar we have a President, we have a Senate -- albeit a bicameral one and we have the people, we have breads and circuses to keep us entertained

Not Catholicism, not the Church -- Rome. Don't forget it

"The illusion of freedom will continue as long as it's profitable to continue the illusion. At the point where the illusion becomes too expensive to maintain, they will just take down the scenery, they will pull back the curtains, they will move the tables and chairs out of the way and you will see the brick wall at the back of the theater."
— Frank Zappa

 

[AllieBaba]

No, it's not really a hair trigger. But I get highly antsy when people start claiming that the US is a secular nation, and Christian verbage has no place in public or in our politics. I suspect the motives of anyone who will lie about the principles upon which our country is founded, because I KNOW that the reason they lie about them is because they want to remove those freedoms. By claiming they never existed, or were never SUPPOSED to exist, and furthermore, are the root of myriad and elusive "problems". That is the way freedom of religion AND freedom of speech is shut down.

Read your history.

 

[rikules]

And further, if the majority of our citizenry is Christian, how do we describe our citizenry? As non-Christian?

as Americans.

as for "majority".....

are you sure you believe the "majority" are "christian"?

cus

seems to me.....

that YOU said;

liberals HATE god and CHRISTIANS!

and didn't you ALSO say that some christians sects aren't REAL christians?

I believe you did.....

basically claiming that ONLY SOME christians are REAL christians

so.....

let's add them up;

if liberals HATE christians

and 30% of the population is probably liberal

and (according to you) many christian sects are NOT real christians

let's say another 30%

That's 60% of the population that YOU have declared to NOT be REAL christians

plus;
jews
muslims
zoroastrians
buddhists
hindu

seems like
according to your own statements
the majority are NOT real christians

 

[AllieBaba]

And further, if the majority of our citizenry is Christian, how do we describe our citizenry? As non-Christian?

as Americans.

as for "majority".....

are you sure you believe the "majority" are "christian"?

cus

seems to me.....

that YOU said;

liberals HATE god and CHRISTIANS!

and didn't you ALSO say that some christians sects aren't REAL christians?

I believe you did.....

basically claiming that ONLY SOME christians are REAL christians

so.....

let's add them up;

if liberals HATE christians

and 30% of the population is probably liberal

and (according to you) many christian sects are NOT real christians

let's say another 30%

That's 60% of the population that YOU have declared to NOT be REAL christians

plus;
jews
muslims
zoroastrians
buddhists
hindu

seems like
according to your own statements
the majority are NOT real christians

Now that we've established that dikrules is insane....

 

[Sky Dancer]

No, it's not really a hair trigger. But I get highly antsy when people start claiming that the US is a secular nation, and Christian verbage has no place in public or in our politics. I suspect the motives of anyone who will lie about the principles upon which our country is founded, because I KNOW that the reason they lie about them is because they want to remove those freedoms. By claiming they never existed, or were never SUPPOSED to exist, and furthermore, are the root of myriad and elusive "problems". That is the way freedom of religion AND freedom of speech is shut down.

Read your history.

The only one lying is you. You claim I want it to be illegal to proclaim the word of God. I never said that.

I'm debating you about the Constitution which is NOT a religious document, but a secular one.

Why is the term secular so threatening to you. It simply keeps government in one place and religion in another.

Yes, some of the founders were Christian. But not all of them were and the Constitution is not a religous document.

Why is it so hard for you to understand that?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

And further, if the majority of our citizenry is Christian, how do we describe our citizenry? As non-Christian?

as Americans.

as for "majority".....

are you sure you believe the "majority" are "christian"?

cus

seems to me.....

that YOU said;

liberals HATE god and CHRISTIANS!

and didn't you ALSO say that some christians sects aren't REAL christians?

I believe you did.....

basically claiming that ONLY SOME christians are REAL christians

so.....

let's add them up;

if liberals HATE christians

and 30% of the population is probably liberal

and (according to you) many christian sects are NOT real christians

let's say another 30%

That's 60% of the population that YOU have declared to NOT be REAL christians

plus;
jews
muslims
zoroastrians
buddhists
hindu

seems like
according to your own statements
the majority are NOT real christians

Now that we've established that dikrules is insane....

Can you imagine if Riles and Shaman merged?

 

[Sky Dancer]

And further, if the majority of our citizenry is Christian, how do we describe our citizenry? As non-Christian?

as Americans.

as for "majority".....

are you sure you believe the "majority" are "christian"?

cus

seems to me.....

that YOU said;

liberals HATE god and CHRISTIANS!

and didn't you ALSO say that some christians sects aren't REAL christians?

I believe you did.....

basically claiming that ONLY SOME christians are REAL christians

so.....

let's add them up;

if liberals HATE christians

and 30% of the population is probably liberal

and (according to you) many christian sects are NOT real christians

let's say another 30%

That's 60% of the population that YOU have declared to NOT be REAL christians

plus;
jews
muslims
zoroastrians
buddhists
hindu

seems like
according to your own statements
the majority are NOT real christians

Hahaha. You're a real character.

 

[AllieBaba]

Not scrolling through 54 pages.

The Founders based our government on Rome, the Roman Empire, the Roman Republic.

Instead of a Caesar we have a President, we have a Senate -- albeit a bicameral one and we have the people, we have breads and circuses to keep us entertained

Not Catholicism, not the Church -- Rome. Don't forget it

"The illusion of freedom will continue as long as it's profitable to continue the illusion. At the point where the illusion becomes too expensive to maintain, they will just take down the scenery, they will pull back the curtains, they will move the tables and chairs out of the way and you will see the brick wall at the back of the theater."
— Frank Zappa

Partially.
However, the founding fathers also recognized that Rome's demise came about at the same time they started persecuting Christians.

So while they considered Roman political structure, they still maintained that liberty comes from God, and freedom of religion and freedom of speech in all things are God-given rights, and the federal government exists ONLY TO PROTECT THOSE RIGHTS.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Not scrolling through 54 pages.

The Founders based our government on Rome, the Roman Empire, the Roman Republic.

Instead of a Caesar we have a President, we have a Senate -- albeit a bicameral one and we have the people, we have breads and circuses to keep us entertained

Not Catholicism, not the Church -- Rome. Don't forget it

"The illusion of freedom will continue as long as it's profitable to continue the illusion. At the point where the illusion becomes too expensive to maintain, they will just take down the scenery, they will pull back the curtains, they will move the tables and chairs out of the way and you will see the brick wall at the back of the theater."
— Frank Zappa

Partially.
However, the founding fathers also recognized that Rome's demise came about at the same time they started persecuting Christians.

So while they considered Roman political structure, they still maintained that liberty comes from God, and freedom of religion and freedom of speech in all things are God-given rights, and the federal government exists ONLY TO PROTECT THOSE RIGHTS.

Wow. You really have an active imagination.

 

[AllieBaba]

No, I have a pretty good grasp of history.

Which you obviously don't. I wouldn't make fun of it, if I were you. It makes you appear pretty ridiculous.

 

[rikules]

No, it's not really a hair trigger. But I get highly antsy when people start claiming that the US is a secular nation, and Christian verbage has no place in public or in our politics. I suspect the motives of anyone who will lie about the principles upon which our country is founded, because I KNOW that the reason they lie about them is because they want to remove those freedoms. By claiming they never existed, or were never SUPPOSED to exist, and furthermore, are the root of myriad and elusive "problems". That is the way freedom of religion AND freedom of speech is shut down.

Read your history.

"No, it's not really a hair trigger."

seems like it is
you are ALWAYS very angry

you yell
and swear
and insult people
and i've been told you smell funny....


"But I get highly antsy when people start claiming that the US is a secular nation,"

it IS a secular nation

everyone has a right to worship ANY religion or NO religion
christians have no special rights in America
our laws are based onlogic and reaosn (mostly) but NOT on christian beliefs


" and Christian verbage has no place in public or in our politics."

for the most part, it doesn't.

of course
you have the right to TRY and impose your religious lunacies
unconstitutional as those may be
but you do not have the right to IMPOSE your religious beliefs
or litigate them

thanks to the secular constitution


" I suspect the motives of anyone who will lie about the principles upon which our country is founded, because I KNOW that the reason they lie about them is because they want to remove those freedoms."

you're just a paranoid lunatic

nobody is trying to remove your religious freedoms

we just want you to keep them to yourself


" By claiming they never existed, or were never SUPPOSED to exist,"

they never existed
they were NEVER suppose to exist

and you can NOT make them exist

no matter how much you lie about it


" and furthermore, are the root of myriad and elusive "problems"."

some christian beliefs WERE the root of problems;

slavery
discrimination against blacks
denying women equal rights

all problems

all stemming from christian beliefs



" That is the way freedom of religion AND freedom of speech is shut down."

you will always have your freedom of religion and your freedom to say the most insane things!

I promise I will NEVER vote for any law that would EVER deny anyone their religious freedom.

I SWEAR to that.

I would NEVER vote for any politician that ever suggested anything like that

I SWEAR to that.

I don't believe in god or religion but I would defend the freedom of ANYONE to believe in ANY religion


I have no doubt you woud NOT DO THE SAME.

YOU would deny religious freedom and freedom of speech LONG before I ever would

in fact
the more you keep saying "America IS A CHRISTIAN NATION"

the more convinced I am that you would MAKE THAT A LAW.

And make another law denying all NON-christian religions the right to practice in America

 

[Sky Dancer]

No, I have a pretty good grasp of history.

Which you obviously don't. I wouldn't make fun of it, if I were you. It makes you appear pretty ridiculous.

Show me the history book that talks about the founders drafting the Constitution because the Roman's persecuted the Christians. LOL

Hahahaha

 

[rikules]

And further, if the majority of our citizenry is Christian, how do we describe our citizenry? As non-Christian?

as Americans.

as for "majority".....

are you sure you believe the "majority" are "christian"?

cus

seems to me.....

that YOU said;

liberals HATE god and CHRISTIANS!

and didn't you ALSO say that some christians sects aren't REAL christians?

I believe you did.....

basically claiming that ONLY SOME christians are REAL christians

so.....

let's add them up;

if liberals HATE christians

and 30% of the population is probably liberal

and (according to you) many christian sects are NOT real christians

let's say another 30%

That's 60% of the population that YOU have declared to NOT be REAL christians

plus;
jews
muslims
zoroastrians
buddhists
hindu

seems like
according to your own statements
the majority are NOT real christians

Hahaha. You're a real character.

thank you
thank you

I'll be appearing here all week

so tell your friends!

 

[Sky Dancer]

as Americans.

as for "majority".....

are you sure you believe the "majority" are "christian"?

cus

seems to me.....

that YOU said;

liberals HATE god and CHRISTIANS!

and didn't you ALSO say that some christians sects aren't REAL christians?

I believe you did.....

basically claiming that ONLY SOME christians are REAL christians

so.....

let's add them up;

if liberals HATE christians

and 30% of the population is probably liberal

and (according to you) many christian sects are NOT real christians

let's say another 30%

That's 60% of the population that YOU have declared to NOT be REAL christians

plus;
jews
muslims
zoroastrians
buddhists
hindu

seems like
according to your own statements
the majority are NOT real christians

Hahaha. You're a real character.

thank you
thank you

I'll be appearing here all week

so tell your friends!

Are you a poet?

 

[AllieBaba]

"And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are the gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with his wrath? Indeed I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just: that his justice cannot sleep for ever.

Thomas Jefferson, Notes on the State of Virginia, Query 18, 1781"

Thomas Jefferson Quotes

Sheesh, I had a whole bunch of quotes from founding fathers and my stupid laptop hiccupped and there they all went, down the internet tube.

So I'll stick with this one for now.

Jefferson just never disappoints.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Where the preamble declares, that coercion is a departure from the plan of the holy author of our religion, an amendment was proposed by inserting "Jesus Christ," so that it would read "A departure from the plan of Jesus Christ, the holy author of our religion;" the insertion was rejected by the great majority, in proof that they meant to comprehend, within the mantle of its protection, the Jew and the Gentile, the Christian and Mohammedan, the Hindoo and Infidel of every denomination.
-Thomas Jefferson, Autobiography, in reference to the Virginia Act for Religious Freedom