The way to keep burkini's off the beaches

[gtopa1]

The prevalence of vitamin D deficiencies was 55.0% for covered and 20.0% for uncovered students. The vitamin D status was found to be statistically significant and had a negative correlation with the duration of Islamic dressing (P < .05, r = -0.334). We concluded that the vitamin D levels of young women are associated with clothing style, and the age at which a female begins wearing Muslim style clothing is related.

Clothing preference affects vitamin D status of young women. - PubMed - NCBI

Quite an interesting finding.

Greg

(PS: I am no great fan of WikiIslam).

I've never seen it (wiki Islam) before, just Googled the information I wanted. I've read about this problem before, in independent articles, not from wikiislam. I have lived in Islamic countries and know about the problem first hand. Have talked about this issue to Muslim women who don't cover; one of my best friends when I lived in Turkey is a Muslim. She talked about this problem and how it is a prevalent problem for Muslim women.

Depending on how religious and conservative your family is, covering is a personal choice. But, I think that the suggestion that it is somehow oppressive is correct. Women who come from families that are more modern minded and less fundamentalist about religion tend not to cover.

I get sunburn very easily so covering is not a problem for me. I've also had several hundred of those sunspot thingies burned off as well as several "near things" in the melanoma maybe stakes. But you are a welcome bit of balance on the question. I have ZERO problem with what is worn and I do get that it is a religious thingy but the banning seems to me to be just dumb. I am far more concerned with other apparel; the type that goes kaboom!!
I do wonder if the burkini is all that oppressive? Seems to me to be a transition garment to "something more comfortable".

Olympic standard

Burkini

Hopefully, whatever the VitD prob, it can be easily treated. Mine is.

Greg

 

[Esmeralda]

The prevalence of vitamin D deficiencies was 55.0% for covered and 20.0% for uncovered students. The vitamin D status was found to be statistically significant and had a negative correlation with the duration of Islamic dressing (P < .05, r = -0.334). We concluded that the vitamin D levels of young women are associated with clothing style, and the age at which a female begins wearing Muslim style clothing is related.

Clothing preference affects vitamin D status of young women. - PubMed - NCBI

Quite an interesting finding.

Greg

(PS: I am no great fan of WikiIslam).

I've never seen it (wiki Islam) before, just Googled the information I wanted. I've read about this problem before, in independent articles, not from wikiislam. I have lived in Islamic countries and know about the problem first hand. Have talked about this issue to Muslim women who don't cover; one of my best friends when I lived in Turkey is a Muslim. She talked about this problem and how it is a prevalent problem for Muslim women.

Depending on how religious and conservative your family is, covering is a personal choice. But, I think that the suggestion that it is somehow oppressive is correct. Women who come from families that are more modern minded and less fundamentalist about religion tend not to cover.

I get sunburn very easily so covering is not a problem for me. I've also had several hundred of those sunspot thingies burned off as well as several "near things" in the melanoma maybe stakes. But you are a welcome bit of balance on the question. I have ZERO problem with what is worn and I do get that it is a religious thingy but the banning seems to me to be just dumb. I am far more concerned with other apparel; the type that goes kaboom!!
I do wonder if the burkini is all that oppressive? Seems to me to be a transition garment to "something more comfortable".

Olympic standard

Burkini

Hopefully, whatever the VitD prob, it can be easily treated. Mine is.

Greg

The problem is not the burkini as such but what it represents. France has had Muslim people as part of the population for a long time. France is a former imperialist country. They have been in Morocco, Algiers, etc. There was never a problem with Muslims being a part of the culture, not in the past. In about 2,000 I stayed in Paris in the Arabic neighborhood simply because I booked my hotel online through Expedia and it was an inexpensive hotel. I had no problem being in that area or any discomfort. This was before I had lived in Turkey or other Islamic countries. But things have changed a lot in recent years.


Nowadays the Muslim population of France is 15%, as large as the black population in America, which is our largest minority. Most of these Muslims are poor and come to France for economic reasons. Like other poor people around the world who immigrate, they are not well educated and are usually fundamentalist or conservative as far as religion. They don't embrace the French culture. They don't adapt to it but, rather, expect the French to adapt to them.


There have been too many instances of so called Islamic terrorism in France. I know that is not endorsed by most Muslims, but the French are getting fed up. They expect immigrants to adapt to them, not the other way around. Because of the terrorism, they are developing a negative attitude to all Muslims; though it may not be fair, that’s the way it is.


French culture is very sophisticated culturally and very open sexually. It is very unlike conservative Islam. The Burkini represents a rejection of French culture, a rejection of the culture that the Muslims seek to live in. It is what the Burkini represents, not what it is specifically.


I have spent a lot of time in Southern France, including much time on the Mediterranean. I understand the problem. I sympathize with the French.

 

[Tilly]

I find it odd that there are those who say a woman who wears sluttish clothing contributes to her own rape but that something as sexless as a burkini is deemed improper? Sorry; I don't see any reason to ban the burkini. In fact in a land with the highest melanoma rate in the world I would find them downright sensible!!

Greg

In terms of health issues, France doesn't have the rate of melanoma Australia does, nowhere in Europe does. However, vit D deficiency, which eventually results in all sorts of health problems, including osteoporosis and heart disease, is an issue for people who swathe themselves from head to toe even in the summer months. You have to expose quite a bit of skin to make vit D.

It is true: vitamin D deficiency is a serious issue for Muslim women who 'cover.' Over exposure to the sun is a serious issue for women in the West who spend a lot of time in the sun exposing a lot of skin. Western women can wear sunscreen. Islamic women have to get medical treatment for their lack of vitamin D.

Why not just take Vitamin D tabs like I do; I hate too much sun.

Greg

If you have a proper deficiency large doses are required and it can take a long time to reverse the deficiency. It's not as simple as popping a 400iu pill from Hollande & Barrett's . People taking larger doses have to be monitored because there is a point at which the high dose becomes almost as dangerous as too little, and other health problems arise such as depositing calcium in arteries, so once again, you are at increased risk of heart disease and stroke, for example.
So, this backward faux modesty bs becomes a medical issue, and for many, ie those who were forced to dress like bin bags since they were children, some of the damage is irreversible.
I have read rulings from some imams who basically say fear the wrath of Allah, stop making excuses for not dressing how Allah decrees, pop a pill, and sit by a window. You cannot make vitamin D from sunlight that passes through glass. Newer research (I will try to find it) indicates that simply exposing hands, feet and face, is not enough to make sufficient vit D, and certainly would do very little to correct even sub clinical deficiencies.

 

[Esmeralda]

I find it odd that there are those who say a woman who wears sluttish clothing contributes to her own rape but that something as sexless as a burkini is deemed improper? Sorry; I don't see any reason to ban the burkini. In fact in a land with the highest melanoma rate in the world I would find them downright sensible!!

Greg

In terms of health issues, France doesn't have the rate of melanoma Australia does, nowhere in Europe does. However, vit D deficiency, which eventually results in all sorts of health problems, including osteoporosis and heart disease, is an issue for people who swathe themselves from head to toe even in the summer months. You have to expose quite a bit of skin to make vit D.

It is true: vitamin D deficiency is a serious issue for Muslim women who 'cover.' Over exposure to the sun is a serious issue for women in the West who spend a lot of time in the sun exposing a lot of skin. Western women can wear sunscreen. Islamic women have to get medical treatment for their lack of vitamin D.

Why not just take Vitamin D tabs like I do; I hate too much sun.

Greg

If you have a proper deficiency large doses are required and it can take a long time to reverse the deficiency. It's not as simple as popping a 1000iu pill from Hollande & Barrett's . People taking larger doses have to be monitored because there is a point at which the high dose becomes almost as dangerous as too little, and other health problems arise such as depositing calcium in arteries, so once again, you are at increased risk of heart disease and stroke, for example.
So, this backward faux modesty bs becomes a medical issue, and for many, ie those who were forced to dress like bin bags since they were children, some of the damage is irreversible.
I have read rulings from some imams who basically say fear the wrath of Allah, stop making excuses for not dressing how Allah decrees, pop a pill, and sit by a window. You cannot make vitamin D from sunlight that passes through glass. Newer research (I will try to find it) indicates that simply exposing hands, feet and face, is not enough to make sufficient vit D, and certainly would do very little to correct even sub clinical deficiencies.

I have also read that only exposing hands, feet and face is not enough to have a[ healthy dose of vitamin D. The issue of covering is a health issue.

 

[Tilly]

I think there is a similar problem in the US, plus, children born to women with vit D deficiency are at increased risk, of course.


Rickets soar as children stay indoors: Number diagnosed with disease quadruples in last ten years

• New figures from the NHS show there were 833 hospital admissions
• Ten years earlier the figure was just 190
• The disease, which causes brittle bones and deformities, was common in 19th century Britain

By DAILY MAIL REPORTER

PUBLISHED: 02:02, 22 January 2014 | UPDATED: 02:03, 22 January 2014
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ed-disease-quadruples-ten-years.html#comments

+2
New figures from the NHS show there were 833 hospital admissions for children suffering from rickets

The number of children suffering from rickets – once associated with Victorian poverty – is on the rise, with a fourfold increase in sufferers in the last ten years.

New figures from the NHS show there were 833 hospital admissions for children suffering from the condition which is caused by a lack of Vitamin D in the financial year 2012-13.

Ten years earlier the figure was just 190.

Some experts fear that parents obsessing about protecting their children from sunlight, which boosts the body’s level of the key vitamin, has led to the rise...

Rickets soar as children stay indoors

 

[Tilly]

I find it odd that there are those who say a woman who wears sluttish clothing contributes to her own rape but that something as sexless as a burkini is deemed improper? Sorry; I don't see any reason to ban the burkini. In fact in a land with the highest melanoma rate in the world I would find them downright sensible!!

Greg

In terms of health issues, France doesn't have the rate of melanoma Australia does, nowhere in Europe does. However, vit D deficiency, which eventually results in all sorts of health problems, including osteoporosis and heart disease, is an issue for people who swathe themselves from head to toe even in the summer months. You have to expose quite a bit of skin to make vit D.

It is true: vitamin D deficiency is a serious issue for Muslim women who 'cover.' Over exposure to the sun is a serious issue for women in the West who spend a lot of time in the sun exposing a lot of skin. Western women can wear sunscreen. Islamic women have to get medical treatment for their lack of vitamin D.

Why not just take Vitamin D tabs like I do; I hate too much sun.

Greg

If you have a proper deficiency large doses are required and it can take a long time to reverse the deficiency. It's not as simple as popping a 1000iu pill from Hollande & Barrett's . People taking larger doses have to be monitored because there is a point at which the high dose becomes almost as dangerous as too little, and other health problems arise such as depositing calcium in arteries, so once again, you are at increased risk of heart disease and stroke, for example.
So, this backward faux modesty bs becomes a medical issue, and for many, ie those who were forced to dress like bin bags since they were children, some of the damage is irreversible.
I have read rulings from some imams who basically say fear the wrath of Allah, stop making excuses for not dressing how Allah decrees, pop a pill, and sit by a window. You cannot make vitamin D from sunlight that passes through glass. Newer research (I will try to find it) indicates that simply exposing hands, feet and face, is not enough to make sufficient vit D, and certainly would do very little to correct even sub clinical deficiencies.

I have also read that only exposing hands, feet and face is not enough to have a[ healthy dose of vitamin D. The issue of covering is a health issue.

Also, the darker your skin, the less vit D you make, and the more sun exposure you need. In addition to vit D manufacture, the sun also helps your body produce cholesterol sulphate and D sulphate, important to cardiovascular health. The body can't produce D sulphate from D3, we need sun exposure for that to occur. Another issue is that D3 is fat soluble, whereas the sulphate form is water soluble, so they can work in different ways. Many Dr's also prescribe D2 - ergocalciferol, which does not have all the same health benefits, and is poorly absorbed and stored by the body, but it's cheaper.

 

[Coyote]

The ones oppressing their women

Was the woman in the photos being made to remove her clothing in France oppressed?

Post the photo.

Btw it's hilarious to see you try the petty Alinsky tactics. It just shows that you really have nothing to offer. Coyote at least can discuss this topic and not waste our time with Alinsky tactic after tactic

French police make woman remove clothing on Nice beach following burkini ban

'Alinsky tactics'?

There is zero reason for that lady to be on the beach. What is she there for? To sweat? Nothing like a fat sweaty Muslim woman.


.

Fat English women at the beach??

Greg

Even a burkini won't erase that.....

 

[Coyote]

Unfortunately that is not accurate. But keep trying.

And while you're at it, enlighten us as to why it's somehow progressive to remove free choice from women.

Right....more like a nightmare.

Oh yes, bring on the 9/11 imagery (as if it's the fault of all the world's Muslims and not a bunch of terrorists) - your use of it in this way cheapens the tragedy.

In the meantime, enlighten us as to why it's somehow progressive to remove free choice from women.

Your inability to grasp the actual threat and harm it has caused world wide cheapens both the religion your protect the the unfortunate victims who lost their lives.

Threat and harm Islam has caused or the actions of extremists? Seriously dude - don't use 9/11 imagery as a cheap means to score hate points.

So allowing women free choice in what they want to wear to the beach causes threat and harm worldwide?

A nuclear burkini?

I cannot make you understand what is in front of your eyes, what has been demonstrated through history and what is occurring in the world today.

Enough deflecting and attempting to change the topic - what does 9/11 have to do with women being banned from wearing burkini's? Ans: nothing.

You're trying to avoid addressing the core of the issue: removing free choice from women.

 

[Coyote]

Don't confuse a westernized Muslim for one of the crazies. Majority of the westernized ones don't force this nonsense on their women.

Europe has a crazy Muslim problem.

How do you identify the 'crazies' and chase them off the beach?

The ones oppressing their women

Was the woman in the photos being made to remove her clothing in France oppressed?

Post the photo.

Btw it's hilarious to see you try the petty Alinsky tactics. It just shows that you really have nothing to offer. Coyote at least can discuss this topic and not waste our time with Alinsky tactic after tactic

French police make woman remove clothing on Nice beach following burkini ban

'Alinsky tactics'?

That's so wrong. That is abusive and humiliating to the woman. I hope she sues them.

 

[Coyote]

Ok...you decide for her.
Fair enough...there's no way a woman could have enough free will to make that decision for herself.

So you have no problems when the victims of DV return home to their abusers?

You don't consider the years of mental punishment they have experienced that is clouding their judgement?

Why the assumption that all Muslim women are abused? That's ridiculous. Just for a bit of perspective....

Modest Swimwear - Custom sized, made to order swimsuits by CoverUpForChrist
Modest swimwear for ladies & girls | Aqua Modesta
Modest Swimwear for Girls, Teens & Women by Sea Secret

Are you going to ban all of these people from enjoying the beach? Are they all abused?

Does anyone see how utterly ridiculous this is? A supposedly free society is suddenly mandating what a woman can wear! How is that for oppression?

None of those you posted cover up their heads or below their knees.

Which is a perfect example that there is conservative alternatives already on the market for the Muslims

Ok, you are now adjusting the goalposts.

Covering to the knees is "ok", covering below the knees is not.

So, the poor Jewish girl on the right will get kicked off the beach...

We seem to have this rather arbritrary standard in which to only isolate Muslim women from comfortably swimming, but it looks like that standard will sadly affect other religious groups unless you move the goal posts some more.

Instead of the Saudi Arabian "Modesty Police" we'll have the western style "Imodesty Police". Wouldn't it simply be easier to allow women free choice....that's all we've ever wanted

You mean they girl in the swimwear designed to wear when you surf?

If the Muslims wanna dress that way then so be it. I just don't want to see this other nonsense.

If you want to live In the west then Take your 7th century bs elsewhere . Leave it at home or don't come.

So you you think this burkini ban is wrong then?

 

[Coyote]

That comment is offensive!!!

Greg

More offensive is that these unwanted hordes come over to the West and try to change our culture when they know we hate it and we know that if we go over there and wear a bikini they might throw us in jail and deport us!

What is also offensive and stupid is, how many naive Westerners are so quick to call everything which makes sense, offensive!

Oh for god's sakes, they're just people Skye. So WHAT if a woman wants to dress more modestly at the beach? Who CARES if they throw you into jail in Saudi Arabia for wearing a bikini. This isn't Saudi Arabia and maybe THAT is why those women are here and not THERE, trying to enjoy the beach. Ever thought of that?

They are bringing the Saudi Arabia lifestyle to the west. That's the problem . It wouldn't be a problem if they renounced their crazy behavior and went normal

Just have to add. Normal IS NOT thongs and speedos when your belly dunlops the speedo and the thong disappears into...enough said.

That's crazy behavior...no?

Never said normal was thongs.

But I can see every woman's head and face.

Like I said if they want to wear what that surfboard girl you posted before was wearing then that's fine. It's modest and we can still see who it is....

Normal is arbritrary and completely dependent on an individual culture's definition of "normal" and "modesty".

Normal standards usually regulate what is minimally acceptable - what needs to be covered. It's never been about "too much" with one acception: clothing issues that adversely affect public safety or one's ability to do certain jobs. Things involving public safety would be covering the face, masks, hoods etc. Things involving jobs could be clothing that affects the antiseptic quality of an operating room or could get caught in moving machinary.

None of this applies to what a person chooses to wear on the beach. In all of the burkini examples you can see her face. There is no need to see any more in order to recognize a person. This law is not about "freeing women" - it's about demeaning and humiliating Muslim women.

 

[Coyote]

Why the assumption that all Muslim women are abused? That's ridiculous. Just for a bit of perspective....

Modest Swimwear - Custom sized, made to order swimsuits by CoverUpForChrist
Modest swimwear for ladies & girls | Aqua Modesta
Modest Swimwear for Girls, Teens & Women by Sea Secret

Are you going to ban all of these people from enjoying the beach? Are they all abused?

Does anyone see how utterly ridiculous this is? A supposedly free society is suddenly mandating what a woman can wear! How is that for oppression?

None of those you posted cover up their heads or below their knees.

Which is a perfect example that there is conservative alternatives already on the market for the Muslims

Is that the criteria you'd use to kick women off the beach?
They mustn't cover their heads or lower legs?
Just trying to get a handle on the rules here.

Does it apply to men as well?

Its interesting that you are so hell bent on making sure these women can be forced to be covered head to toe.

I would rather we dial it back to normal western standards and if they decide to go modest then there are plenty of options.

No, I disagree with you telling them that the must dress a certain way.
They should be able to dress any way they like...why do you want to oppress them?

I think that they're trying to liberate them and I accept that. But many of these people are in transition. I suggest that we just be patient. Burkinis are only a recent invention.

Greg

Burkini's also allow women who might not otherwise get out to enjoy the beach, out and enjoying the beach. And what people don't realize, it's not just Muslim women who face this problem and it's not just Muslim women who are impacted by these sorts of decisions.

The challenges of exercising for some Muslim and Orthodox Jewish women

 

[saveliberty]

Because reading the thread seems to be a waste of time and effort, I will simply say that WAS the standard for beach attire back before my time. Are you going to throw people in street clothes off the beach?

 

[StLucieBengal]

So you have no problems when the victims of DV return home to their abusers?

You don't consider the years of mental punishment they have experienced that is clouding their judgement?

Why the assumption that all Muslim women are abused? That's ridiculous. Just for a bit of perspective....

Modest Swimwear - Custom sized, made to order swimsuits by CoverUpForChrist
Modest swimwear for ladies & girls | Aqua Modesta
Modest Swimwear for Girls, Teens & Women by Sea Secret

Are you going to ban all of these people from enjoying the beach? Are they all abused?

Does anyone see how utterly ridiculous this is? A supposedly free society is suddenly mandating what a woman can wear! How is that for oppression?

None of those you posted cover up their heads or below their knees.

Which is a perfect example that there is conservative alternatives already on the market for the Muslims

Ok, you are now adjusting the goalposts.

Covering to the knees is "ok", covering below the knees is not.

So, the poor Jewish girl on the right will get kicked off the beach...

We seem to have this rather arbritrary standard in which to only isolate Muslim women from comfortably swimming, but it looks like that standard will sadly affect other religious groups unless you move the goal posts some more.

Instead of the Saudi Arabian "Modesty Police" we'll have the western style "Imodesty Police". Wouldn't it simply be easier to allow women free choice....that's all we've ever wanted

You mean they girl in the swimwear designed to wear when you surf?

If the Muslims wanna dress that way then so be it. I just don't want to see this other nonsense.

If you want to live In the west then Take your 7th century bs elsewhere . Leave it at home or don't come.

So you you think this burkini ban is wrong then?

No. The Burkini ban is only temporary and was on direct result from the Muslims waging war on France. Maybe these supposed good Muslims can denounce the oppressive and violent nature of their religion.

Or maybe just go to the beach like a normal person and show everyone that Muslims can be just like anyone else. At the beach not dressed as a black ghost

 

[Mindful]

Why the assumption that all Muslim women are abused? That's ridiculous. Just for a bit of perspective....

Modest Swimwear - Custom sized, made to order swimsuits by CoverUpForChrist
Modest swimwear for ladies & girls | Aqua Modesta
Modest Swimwear for Girls, Teens & Women by Sea Secret

Are you going to ban all of these people from enjoying the beach? Are they all abused?

Does anyone see how utterly ridiculous this is? A supposedly free society is suddenly mandating what a woman can wear! How is that for oppression?

None of those you posted cover up their heads or below their knees.

Which is a perfect example that there is conservative alternatives already on the market for the Muslims

Ok, you are now adjusting the goalposts.

Covering to the knees is "ok", covering below the knees is not.

So, the poor Jewish girl on the right will get kicked off the beach...

We seem to have this rather arbritrary standard in which to only isolate Muslim women from comfortably swimming, but it looks like that standard will sadly affect other religious groups unless you move the goal posts some more.

Instead of the Saudi Arabian "Modesty Police" we'll have the western style "Imodesty Police". Wouldn't it simply be easier to allow women free choice....that's all we've ever wanted

You mean they girl in the swimwear designed to wear when you surf?

If the Muslims wanna dress that way then so be it. I just don't want to see this other nonsense.

If you want to live In the west then Take your 7th century bs elsewhere . Leave it at home or don't come.

So you you think this burkini ban is wrong then?

No. The Burkini ban is only temporary and was on direct result from the Muslims waging war on France. Maybe these supposed good Muslims can denounce the oppressive and violent nature of their religion.

Or maybe just go to the beach like a normal person and show everyone that Muslims can be just like anyone else. At the beach not dressed as a black ghost

Or they could segregate beaches, as in Tel Aviv.

 

[StLucieBengal]

None of those you posted cover up their heads or below their knees.

Which is a perfect example that there is conservative alternatives already on the market for the Muslims

Is that the criteria you'd use to kick women off the beach?
They mustn't cover their heads or lower legs?
Just trying to get a handle on the rules here.

Does it apply to men as well?

Its interesting that you are so hell bent on making sure these women can be forced to be covered head to toe.

I would rather we dial it back to normal western standards and if they decide to go modest then there are plenty of options.

No, I disagree with you telling them that the must dress a certain way.
They should be able to dress any way they like...why do you want to oppress them?

I think that they're trying to liberate them and I accept that. But many of these people are in transition. I suggest that we just be patient. Burkinis are only a recent invention.

Greg

Burkini's also allow women who might not otherwise get out to enjoy the beach, out and enjoying the beach. And what people don't realize, it's not just Muslim women who face this problem and it's not just Muslim women who are impacted by these sorts of decisions.

The challenges of exercising for some Muslim and Orthodox Jewish women

Showing up to the beach in a burqa is a joke.

Muslims don't need to go burqa. They can wear a wetsuit or an fat persons moo moo with an old lady hat

There is no need for the burqa or Burkini. It's just absurd and unnecessary.

I love how concerned you are for them to enjoy the beach .... You said it allows them to go out .

Why on earth are they not allowed to go out? Especially if they have free choice.... Or don't they...

 

[StLucieBengal]

None of those you posted cover up their heads or below their knees.

Which is a perfect example that there is conservative alternatives already on the market for the Muslims

Ok, you are now adjusting the goalposts.

Covering to the knees is "ok", covering below the knees is not.

So, the poor Jewish girl on the right will get kicked off the beach...

We seem to have this rather arbritrary standard in which to only isolate Muslim women from comfortably swimming, but it looks like that standard will sadly affect other religious groups unless you move the goal posts some more.

Instead of the Saudi Arabian "Modesty Police" we'll have the western style "Imodesty Police". Wouldn't it simply be easier to allow women free choice....that's all we've ever wanted

You mean they girl in the swimwear designed to wear when you surf?

If the Muslims wanna dress that way then so be it. I just don't want to see this other nonsense.

If you want to live In the west then Take your 7th century bs elsewhere . Leave it at home or don't come.

So you you think this burkini ban is wrong then?

No. The Burkini ban is only temporary and was on direct result from the Muslims waging war on France. Maybe these supposed good Muslims can denounce the oppressive and violent nature of their religion.

Or maybe just go to the beach like a normal person and show everyone that Muslims can be just like anyone else. At the beach not dressed as a black ghost

Or they could segregate beaches, as in Tel Aviv.

Why waste prime beach property on a small group of extremists who oppress woman?

Should we give private beaches for all small groups of extremists? I bet the child predators would like to enjoy the beach with children. Maybe they can share one with the Muslims since they enjoy the same fare.

 

[StLucieBengal]

How do you identify the 'crazies' and chase them off the beach?

The ones oppressing their women

Was the woman in the photos being made to remove her clothing in France oppressed?

Post the photo.

Btw it's hilarious to see you try the petty Alinsky tactics. It just shows that you really have nothing to offer. Coyote at least can discuss this topic and not waste our time with Alinsky tactic after tactic

French police make woman remove clothing on Nice beach following burkini ban

'Alinsky tactics'?

That's so wrong. That is abusive and humiliating to the woman. I hope she sues them.

What's humiliating to women is that other women are actually promoting for Muslim women to be oppressed further.

 

[StLucieBengal]

More offensive is that these unwanted hordes come over to the West and try to change our culture when they know we hate it and we know that if we go over there and wear a bikini they might throw us in jail and deport us!

What is also offensive and stupid is, how many naive Westerners are so quick to call everything which makes sense, offensive!

Oh for god's sakes, they're just people Skye. So WHAT if a woman wants to dress more modestly at the beach? Who CARES if they throw you into jail in Saudi Arabia for wearing a bikini. This isn't Saudi Arabia and maybe THAT is why those women are here and not THERE, trying to enjoy the beach. Ever thought of that?

They are bringing the Saudi Arabia lifestyle to the west. That's the problem . It wouldn't be a problem if they renounced their crazy behavior and went normal

Just have to add. Normal IS NOT thongs and speedos when your belly dunlops the speedo and the thong disappears into...enough said.

That's crazy behavior...no?

Never said normal was thongs.

But I can see every woman's head and face.

Like I said if they want to wear what that surfboard girl you posted before was wearing then that's fine. It's modest and we can still see who it is....

Normal is arbritrary and completely dependent on an individual culture's definition of "normal" and "modesty".

Normal standards usually regulate what is minimally acceptable - what needs to be covered. It's never been about "too much" with one acception: clothing issues that adversely affect public safety or one's ability to do certain jobs. Things involving public safety would be covering the face, masks, hoods etc. Things involving jobs could be clothing that affects the antiseptic quality of an operating room or could get caught in moving machinary.

None of this applies to what a person chooses to wear on the beach. In all of the burkini examples you can see her face. There is no need to see any more in order to recognize a person. This law is not about "freeing women" - it's about demeaning and humiliating Muslim women.

Normal is what we see at the beach in the west. That's western normal. When I say normal I am taking about this and you know that...

Playing word games is just a waste of time and should be beneath any adult trying to discuss this reasonably.

 

[Coyote]

None of those you posted cover up their heads or below their knees.

Which is a perfect example that there is conservative alternatives already on the market for the Muslims

Ok, you are now adjusting the goalposts.

Covering to the knees is "ok", covering below the knees is not.

So, the poor Jewish girl on the right will get kicked off the beach...

We seem to have this rather arbritrary standard in which to only isolate Muslim women from comfortably swimming, but it looks like that standard will sadly affect other religious groups unless you move the goal posts some more.

Instead of the Saudi Arabian "Modesty Police" we'll have the western style "Imodesty Police". Wouldn't it simply be easier to allow women free choice....that's all we've ever wanted

You mean they girl in the swimwear designed to wear when you surf?

If the Muslims wanna dress that way then so be it. I just don't want to see this other nonsense.

If you want to live In the west then Take your 7th century bs elsewhere . Leave it at home or don't come.

So you you think this burkini ban is wrong then?

No. The Burkini ban is only temporary and was on direct result from the Muslims waging war on France. Maybe these supposed good Muslims can denounce the oppressive and violent nature of their religion.

Or maybe just go to the beach like a normal person and show everyone that Muslims can be just like anyone else. At the beach not dressed as a black ghost

Or they could segregate beaches, as in Tel Aviv.

So Jews and Muslims, who wish to cover more parts of their body will have to go special beaches?

This gets weirder and weirder. Such a free country....for women....