There is no catastrophe so ghastly that we will reform our gun laws

[kaz]

Guns are built around injuring and killing living things.

Only you sick, violent criminals and liberals cannot conceive of guns being used for anything but killing.

Space invaders, darts, humans love shooting at targets. No one is imagining killing anyone when they shoot at clay pigeons or skeet. It's fun.

And criminals have guns and other weapons. People who carry guns for defense are not imagining "injuring and killing living things." Criminals are doing that, and you are doing that. Removing guns from the victims does nothing to unarm the criminals they want defense from.

Pretty sure I was incredibly explicit in that I don't support gun bans.

I agree that horrific massacres are only a tiny blip in overall gun murders, and that a ban on assault rifles would be trading away a freedom from citizens for virtually no change in overall gun deaths. There are more effective solutions than gun bans.

Your view that guns are only for killing is sick and an indication you have no experience with guns or gun owners if that's what you think. People shooting targets are not practicing or thinking of "killing living things" just like people playing space invaders or darts aren't. Gun targets are a lot more real and a lot more fun.

As a gun collector, I am not thinking of "killing living things." And carrying guns to defend yourself isn't carrying a gun to kill "living things." That you're schizophrenic on the issue is not a defense that you have the sick view that there is no purpose in firing a projectile other than killing isn't a defense of that view, it's just a subject to discuss with your shrink as part of the issue you have with violence.

Gun cultures are about safety of humans and animals and themselves. Sure, there are nuts out there, like there are nuts in every walk of life. But they are the exception, not the rule. And taking away our guns doesn't take away theirs.

 

[kaz]

Even in just recreational shooting, the fascination with the gun stems from its status as a killing implement

Dude, this was your comment that I found to be the most seriously disturbing. It's actually what triggered the challenge.

 

[RKMBrown]

There is no catastrophe so ghastly that America will reform its gun laws - The Week

Look, we've collectively decided, as a country, that the occasional massacre is okay with us. It's the price we're willing to pay for our precious Second Amendment freedoms. We're content to forfeit the lives of a few dozen schoolkids a year as long as we get to keep our guns. The people have spoken, in a cheering civics-class example of democracy in action.

It's hard to imagine what ghastly catastrophe could possibly change America's minds about guns if the little bloody bookbags of Newtown did not. After that atrocity, it seemed as if we would finally enact some obvious, long-overdue half-measures. But perfectly reasonable, moderate legislation expanding background checks and banning assault weapons and high-capacity magazines was summarily killed in the Senate for no reason other than that a sufficient number of United States senators are owned by the NRA. It made our official position as a nation nakedly explicit: we don't care about any number of murdered children, no matter how many, or how young. We want our guns.

Listen here, oh mentally handicapped one. The reason for these assaults is your no gun zone laws. These assaults occurred where guns are not allowed. They did not occur where people are allowed to carry guns. How stupid are you leftists?

 

[P@triot]

There is no catastrophe so ghastly that America will reform its gun laws - The Week

Look, we've collectively decided, as a country, that the occasional massacre is okay with us. It's the price we're willing to pay for our precious Second Amendment freedoms. We're content to forfeit the lives of a few dozen schoolkids a year as long as we get to keep our guns. The people have spoken, in a cheering civics-class example of democracy in action.

It's hard to imagine what ghastly catastrophe could possibly change America's minds about guns if the little bloody bookbags of Newtown did not. After that atrocity, it seemed as if we would finally enact some obvious, long-overdue half-measures. But perfectly reasonable, moderate legislation expanding background checks and banning assault weapons and high-capacity magazines was summarily killed in the Senate for no reason other than that a sufficient number of United States senators are owned by the NRA. It made our official position as a nation nakedly explicit: we don't care about any number of murdered children, no matter how many, or how young. We want our guns.

If a very powerful politician lost his daughter/son in one of these massacres with a democrat in the White House, you may see some traction...

Short of that; nothing. It's too politically costly for anyone to be the grown up and point out the idiocy of the right wing on this.

Nobody knows idiocy quit like [MENTION=20614]candycorn[/MENTION] and [MENTION=20321]rightwinger[/MENTION]... Sweetie, murder is already illegal. So if that law - punishable by the death penalty - isn't stopping people from killing, please explain to us how laws banning firearms will stop guns... (I'll wait patiently while you stutter and stammer trying to think of a response that is less humiliating than your ignorant post above)

 

[P@triot]

There is no catastrophe so ghastly that America will reform its gun laws - The Week

Look, we've collectively decided, as a country, that the occasional massacre is okay with us. It's the price we're willing to pay for our precious Second Amendment freedoms. We're content to forfeit the lives of a few dozen schoolkids a year as long as we get to keep our guns. The people have spoken, in a cheering civics-class example of democracy in action.

It's hard to imagine what ghastly catastrophe could possibly change America's minds about guns if the little bloody bookbags of Newtown did not. After that atrocity, it seemed as if we would finally enact some obvious, long-overdue half-measures. But perfectly reasonable, moderate legislation expanding background checks and banning assault weapons and high-capacity magazines was summarily killed in the Senate for no reason other than that a sufficient number of United States senators are owned by the NRA. It made our official position as a nation nakedly explicit: we don't care about any number of murdered children, no matter how many, or how young. We want our guns.

If a very powerful politician lost his daughter/son in one of these massacres with a democrat in the White House, you may see some traction...

Short of that; nothing. It's too politically costly for anyone to be the grown up and point out the idiocy of the right wing on this.

Nobody knows idiocy quit like [MENTION=20614]candycorn[/MENTION] and [MENTION=20321]rightwinger[/MENTION]... Sweetie, murder is already illegal. So if that law - punishable by the death penalty - isn't stopping people from killing, please explain to us how laws banning firearms will stop guns... (I'll wait patiently while you stutter and stammer trying to think of a response that is less humiliating than your ignorant post above)

You have to love the completely irrational liberal. I mean, prostitution is illegal and that is still rampant. Cocaine is illegal and that is still rampant. Theft is illegal and that is still rampant. Assault is illegal but that is still rampant. Domestic violence is illegal but that is still rampant. Driving while intoxicated is illegal but that is still rampant.

But little brain-dead, irrational candycorn thinks that laws banning guns will instantly make them go - POOF! - and disappear. She's too dumb to realize that criminals are criminals because they don't follow the law. If they did, they wouldn't be criminals. They would law-abiding citizens. Since our laws against murder isn't deterring these people, how the fuck would laws against guns deter them?!?

 

[rightwinger]

There is no catastrophe so ghastly that America will reform its gun laws - The Week

Look, we've collectively decided, as a country, that the occasional massacre is okay with us. It's the price we're willing to pay for our precious Second Amendment freedoms. We're content to forfeit the lives of a few dozen schoolkids a year as long as we get to keep our guns. The people have spoken, in a cheering civics-class example of democracy in action.

It's hard to imagine what ghastly catastrophe could possibly change America's minds about guns if the little bloody bookbags of Newtown did not. After that atrocity, it seemed as if we would finally enact some obvious, long-overdue half-measures. But perfectly reasonable, moderate legislation expanding background checks and banning assault weapons and high-capacity magazines was summarily killed in the Senate for no reason other than that a sufficient number of United States senators are owned by the NRA. It made our official position as a nation nakedly explicit: we don't care about any number of murdered children, no matter how many, or how young. We want our guns.

If a very powerful politician lost his daughter/son in one of these massacres with a democrat in the White House, you may see some traction...

Short of that; nothing. It's too politically costly for anyone to be the grown up and point out the idiocy of the right wing on this.

Nobody knows idiocy quit like [MENTION=20614]candycorn[/MENTION] and [MENTION=20321]rightwinger[/MENTION]... Sweetie, murder is already illegal. So if that law - punishable by the death penalty - isn't stopping people from killing, please explain to us how laws banning firearms will stop guns... (I'll wait patiently while you stutter and stammer trying to think of a response that is less humiliating than your ignorant post above)

Our death penalty is not a deterrent to murder. You only have to look at the great state of Texas and their execution rate.
Fact is, the US has the highest murder rate by far in the civilized world. The question is, what do we do about it

The answer from conservatives is.....Nothing

 

[RKMBrown]

If a very powerful politician lost his daughter/son in one of these massacres with a democrat in the White House, you may see some traction...

Short of that; nothing. It's too politically costly for anyone to be the grown up and point out the idiocy of the right wing on this.

Nobody knows idiocy quit like [MENTION=20614]candycorn[/MENTION] and [MENTION=20321]rightwinger[/MENTION]... Sweetie, murder is already illegal. So if that law - punishable by the death penalty - isn't stopping people from killing, please explain to us how laws banning firearms will stop guns... (I'll wait patiently while you stutter and stammer trying to think of a response that is less humiliating than your ignorant post above)

You have to love the completely irrational liberal. I mean, prostitution is illegal and that is still rampant. Cocaine is illegal and that is still rampant. Theft is illegal and that is still rampant. Assault is illegal but that is still rampant. Domestic violence is illegal but that is still rampant. Driving while intoxicated is illegal but that is still rampant.

But little brain-dead, irrational candycorn thinks that laws banning guns will instantly make them go - POOF! - and disappear. She's too dumb to realize that criminals are criminals because they don't follow the law. If they did, they wouldn't be criminals. They would law-abiding citizens. Since our laws against murder isn't deterring these people, how the fuck would laws against guns deter them?!?

Most of the leftists are criminals. What they really want is their victims to be disarmed.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Even in just recreational shooting, the fascination with the gun stems from its status as a killing implement

I hope you're just trying to force this into your political ideology and don't believe this because if you do and you actually do own guns, seriously, you need to get rid of your guns and get help.

Again, a city liberal elitist snob who obviously knows nothing of guns, gun owners or gun cultures is telling us what we think because of course, you shoot guns!

You are full of shit. This is bull. You know nothing of what you are talking about. You're just tarring the millions of responsible gun owners with your sanctimonious attitudes and stereotypes of the minority of loonies out there.

I'd overwhelmingly trust gun owners with my wallet any day of the week before I trusted liberal city dwellers with it. They are overwhemingly good, responsible people who more than anything want NOT to kill people no matter what crap you want to make up about us because it serves your bigotry and political agenda.

Paperman would need to explain darts,horseshoes,beanbags all games where you try and hit a target.
Target shooting is just another game where you try for accuracy.

 

[kaz]

Even in just recreational shooting, the fascination with the gun stems from its status as a killing implement

I hope you're just trying to force this into your political ideology and don't believe this because if you do and you actually do own guns, seriously, you need to get rid of your guns and get help.

Again, a city liberal elitist snob who obviously knows nothing of guns, gun owners or gun cultures is telling us what we think because of course, you shoot guns!

You are full of shit. This is bull. You know nothing of what you are talking about. You're just tarring the millions of responsible gun owners with your sanctimonious attitudes and stereotypes of the minority of loonies out there.

I'd overwhelmingly trust gun owners with my wallet any day of the week before I trusted liberal city dwellers with it. They are overwhemingly good, responsible people who more than anything want NOT to kill people no matter what crap you want to make up about us because it serves your bigotry and political agenda.

Paperman would need to explain darts,horseshoes,beanbags all games where you try and hit a target.
Target shooting is just another game where you try for accuracy.

[MENTION=31057]JoeB131[/MENTION], [MENTION=48060]guno[/MENTION], [MENTION=47594]PaintMyHouse[/MENTION], [MENTION=20155]paperview[/MENTION]

Yes, none explain all the other things people do to hit targets. None of them also explain why if guns are only to kill people why they like to shoot them. And none of them ever meet anyone else who shoots guns who isn't a liberal caricature of gun owners. They just love the lie that they know guns and gun owners because they are them, and that's how they know we're one tree twig snap of a shooting rampage.

So gentlemen, I invited you here for a challenge. Act on your lie and your stereotypical liberal elitist snobby views of gun owners. Go down to your local shooting club and walk the walk of telling them you are imagining shooting people with every target and that's the only purpose of guns and ask them what shooting rampage fantasizes they have. If you want to maintain the lie, do it. The response you get isn't remotely what you think it will be...

 

[P@triot]

If a very powerful politician lost his daughter/son in one of these massacres with a democrat in the White House, you may see some traction...

Short of that; nothing. It's too politically costly for anyone to be the grown up and point out the idiocy of the right wing on this.

Nobody knows idiocy quit like [MENTION=20614]candycorn[/MENTION] and [MENTION=20321]rightwinger[/MENTION]... Sweetie, murder is already illegal. So if that law - punishable by the death penalty - isn't stopping people from killing, please explain to us how laws banning firearms will stop guns... (I'll wait patiently while you stutter and stammer trying to think of a response that is less humiliating than your ignorant post above)

Our death penalty is not a deterrent to murder. You only have to look at the great state of Texas and their execution rate.
Fact is, the US has the highest murder rate by far in the civilized world. The question is, what do we do about it

The answer from conservatives is.....Nothing

Not true at all - the answer from conservatives is ARM PEOPLE! Liberals are just too stupid to listen, so they get killed.

The answer from liberals is.....piss on the U.S. Constitution and implement the same tired and failed libtard policies that have failed America for over a centruy now.

 

[P@triot]

If a very powerful politician lost his daughter/son in one of these massacres with a democrat in the White House, you may see some traction...

Short of that; nothing. It's too politically costly for anyone to be the grown up and point out the idiocy of the right wing on this.

Nobody knows idiocy quit like [MENTION=20614]candycorn[/MENTION] and [MENTION=20321]rightwinger[/MENTION]... Sweetie, murder is already illegal. So if that law - punishable by the death penalty - isn't stopping people from killing, please explain to us how laws banning firearms will stop guns... (I'll wait patiently while you stutter and stammer trying to think of a response that is less humiliating than your ignorant post above)

Our death penalty is not a deterrent to murder. You only have to look at the great state of Texas and their execution rate.
Fact is, the US has the highest murder rate by far in the civilized world. The question is, what do we do about it

The answer from conservatives is.....Nothing

Exactly wrongwinger!!! So if DEATH isn't a deterrent for committing a crime, what the hell do you propose to do when you outlaw guns? What's going to keep criminals from buying them on the black-market and slaughtering people?!?!

No, really - what? I'm listening, but you're not saying anything. If the penalty of death didn't stop that kid in California, what will stop him from buying guns on the black-market? I'm listening but you're not saying anything. You're just crying like a little bitch. Like all emotional/irrational liberals - you have no plan. You just want to cry.

 

[paperview]

I hope you're just trying to force this into your political ideology and don't believe this because if you do and you actually do own guns, seriously, you need to get rid of your guns and get help.

Again, a city liberal elitist snob who obviously knows nothing of guns, gun owners or gun cultures is telling us what we think because of course, you shoot guns!

You are full of shit. This is bull. You know nothing of what you are talking about. You're just tarring the millions of responsible gun owners with your sanctimonious attitudes and stereotypes of the minority of loonies out there.

I'd overwhelmingly trust gun owners with my wallet any day of the week before I trusted liberal city dwellers with it. They are overwhemingly good, responsible people who more than anything want NOT to kill people no matter what crap you want to make up about us because it serves your bigotry and political agenda.

Paperman would need to explain darts,horseshoes,beanbags all games where you try and hit a target.
Target shooting is just another game where you try for accuracy.

[MENTION=31057]JoeB131[/MENTION], [MENTION=48060]guno[/MENTION], [MENTION=47594]PaintMyHouse[/MENTION], [MENTION=20155]paperview[/MENTION]

Yes, none explain all the other things people do to hit targets. None of them also explain why if guns are only to kill people why they like to shoot them. And none of them ever meet anyone else who shoots guns who isn't a liberal caricature of gun owners. They just love the lie that they know guns and gun owners because they are them, and that's how they know we're one tree twig snap of a shooting rampage.

So gentlemen, I invited you here for a challenge. Act on your lie and your stereotypical liberal elitist snobby views of gun owners. Go down to your local shooting club and walk the walk of telling them you are imagining shooting people with every target and that's the only purpose of guns and ask them what shooting rampage fantasizes they have. If you want to maintain the lie, do it. The response you get isn't remotely what you think it will be...

You're obviously not very good at paying attention.

You flagged me for a thread I'm not even posting in.

But while I'm here -- I'm a 2nd Amendment supporter, a gunowner, and a flaming liberal.

Now, go back to whatever it was you were jerking around.

C ya.

 

[RKMBrown]

If a very powerful politician lost his daughter/son in one of these massacres with a democrat in the White House, you may see some traction...

Short of that; nothing. It's too politically costly for anyone to be the grown up and point out the idiocy of the right wing on this.

Nobody knows idiocy quit like [MENTION=20614]candycorn[/MENTION] and [MENTION=20321]rightwinger[/MENTION]... Sweetie, murder is already illegal. So if that law - punishable by the death penalty - isn't stopping people from killing, please explain to us how laws banning firearms will stop guns... (I'll wait patiently while you stutter and stammer trying to think of a response that is less humiliating than your ignorant post above)

Our death penalty is not a deterrent to murder. You only have to look at the great state of Texas and their execution rate.
Fact is, the US has the highest murder rate by far in the civilized world. The question is, what do we do about it

The answer from conservatives is.....Nothing

We could ship democrats to Europe, since they, by far, are the ones committing murders.

 

[candycorn]

Nobody knows idiocy quit like [MENTION=20614]candycorn[/MENTION] and [MENTION=20321]rightwinger[/MENTION]... Sweetie, murder is already illegal. So if that law - punishable by the death penalty - isn't stopping people from killing, please explain to us how laws banning firearms will stop guns... (I'll wait patiently while you stutter and stammer trying to think of a response that is less humiliating than your ignorant post above)

Our death penalty is not a deterrent to murder. You only have to look at the great state of Texas and their execution rate.
Fact is, the US has the highest murder rate by far in the civilized world. The question is, what do we do about it

The answer from conservatives is.....Nothing

Not true at all - the answer from conservatives is ARM PEOPLE! Liberals are just too stupid to listen, so they get killed.

The answer from liberals is.....piss on the U.S. Constitution and implement the same tired and failed libtard policies that have failed America for over a centruy now.

We already have what, 300,000,000 guns in the nation....will having 300,000,000,000 make us more or less safe? Nations with fewer guns have far fewer deaths. Those are the facts now back to the conservative lie-fest.

 

[Vigilante]

 

[kaz]

Paperman would need to explain darts,horseshoes,beanbags all games where you try and hit a target.
Target shooting is just another game where you try for accuracy.

[MENTION=31057]JoeB131[/MENTION], [MENTION=48060]guno[/MENTION], [MENTION=47594]PaintMyHouse[/MENTION], [MENTION=20155]paperview[/MENTION]

Yes, none explain all the other things people do to hit targets. None of them also explain why if guns are only to kill people why they like to shoot them. And none of them ever meet anyone else who shoots guns who isn't a liberal caricature of gun owners. They just love the lie that they know guns and gun owners because they are them, and that's how they know we're one tree twig snap of a shooting rampage.

So gentlemen, I invited you here for a challenge. Act on your lie and your stereotypical liberal elitist snobby views of gun owners. Go down to your local shooting club and walk the walk of telling them you are imagining shooting people with every target and that's the only purpose of guns and ask them what shooting rampage fantasizes they have. If you want to maintain the lie, do it. The response you get isn't remotely what you think it will be...

You're obviously not very good at paying attention.

You flagged me for a thread I'm not even posting in.

But while I'm here -- I'm a 2nd Amendment supporter, a gunowner, and a flaming liberal.

Now, go back to whatever it was you were jerking around.

C ya.

I meant paperman. My apologies. A simple, you flagged the wrong poster would have been sufficient in my view. If you want to be an ass about it, I still apologize, but I'm not sure what you think you get out of it. Obviously I should have made a mistake only with someone who doesn't make mistakes. I'll keep a note to self on that for the future.

 

[Little-Acorn]

Two out of three murders are committed by gun. When knives, baseball bats and poison top the list we can start doing something to reduce those statistics

And you will fail as miserably as you have been failing, trying to ban guns from law-abiding people.

 

[martybegan]

Our death penalty is not a deterrent to murder. You only have to look at the great state of Texas and their execution rate.
Fact is, the US has the highest murder rate by far in the civilized world. The question is, what do we do about it

The answer from conservatives is.....Nothing

Not true at all - the answer from conservatives is ARM PEOPLE! Liberals are just too stupid to listen, so they get killed.

The answer from liberals is.....piss on the U.S. Constitution and implement the same tired and failed libtard policies that have failed America for over a centruy now.

We already have what, 300,000,000 guns in the nation....will having 300,000,000,000 make us more or less safe? Nations with fewer guns have far fewer deaths. Those are the facts now back to the conservative lie-fest.

and how does getting rid of the 299,500,000-ish guns that have never and will never be used in a crime somehow lower that death rate? because all the laws you propose go after those, not the 500,000 or so a year (ignoring multiple crimes using the same gun, and counting crimes where guns are carried, this is an estimate, not a hard number, but you get the scale of it) that actually are involved in crimes.

 

[deaddogseye]

There is no catastrophe so ghastly that America will reform its gun laws - The Week

Look, we've collectively decided, as a country, that the occasional massacre is okay with us. It's the price we're willing to pay for our precious Second Amendment freedoms. We're content to forfeit the lives of a few dozen schoolkids a year as long as we get to keep our guns. The people have spoken, in a cheering civics-class example of democracy in action.

It's hard to imagine what ghastly catastrophe could possibly change America's minds about guns if the little bloody bookbags of Newtown did not. After that atrocity, it seemed as if we would finally enact some obvious, long-overdue half-measures. But perfectly reasonable, moderate legislation expanding background checks and banning assault weapons and high-capacity magazines was summarily killed in the Senate for no reason other than that a sufficient number of United States senators are owned by the NRA. It made our official position as a nation nakedly explicit: we don't care about any number of murdered children, no matter how many, or how young. We want our guns.

i think thats a reasonable fair observation -- a little pejoratively stated but ultimately accurate.

Part of the problem is that the gun control crowd has to acknowledge is the give them an inch and they will take a mile concern. you can deny it and scream about it but it is very real as many jurisdictions have shown. that side of the issue is loaded with people whose ultimate goal is confiscation and thats a problem for gun owners (of which i am not one; never even fired a gun FWIW). But when Dianne Feinstein proposes these "reasonable" laws she just doesnt have credibility given her past positions on the issue.

And like it or not it is a constitutional protection.

 

[deaddogseye]

another point worthy of consideration and discussion --

the latest incident -- that shooting in Calif. makes the NRA case about as well as any could. Here is a situation where there were warning signs all over the place, the police were called in to talk to a kid with a terrible menatla health history, they met with him -- and concluded that there was no big concern (maybe they sent Chief Wiggum?).

my point is this really does make the case that the police cant or wont protect you even when they are asked to and specifically directed to a clearly dangerous person. to draw the conclusion that in the end you can only count on yourself for protection and the best way to do that is to carry a gun is not unreasonable. The gun control crowd can scream about this as supporting their position all they want but this was a terrible failure of law enforcement to protect the public. Undeniable