There is no rapture, Jesus is not coming back in the clouds

[irosie91]

What book of the bible did Josephus write?

oh yeah. None of them.

So why is what he says relevant to God's plan for the future?

oh yeah. It's not.

Who do you think wrote parts of the bible, if you read Josephus , you might even think he is Paul. We know Matthew, Mark, Luke and Paul (most likely mainly Philo) were fictional pen names.

I have read Josephus, and I don't think he's Paul, lol.

And no, we don't know Matthew, mark, Luke and Paul are pen names, where do you get this nonsense? lolol. ..

Really you don't see a connection between Paul and Josephus, both Pharisees , both shipwrecked, both from prominent families, one a slave turned freedman, one keeps calling himself a slave and tells you how to be a good slave, both very learned and wrote Greek. One killing Romans and the others killing Christians (gentiles) before one is capture and the other seen a vision. Both kept in chains in Caesarea. Paul becomes a slave of Christ (Jesus). Both become traitors of the Jews.


(Josephus goes on and who does this remind you of, Jesus)

Moreover, when I was a child, and about fourteen years of age, I was commended by all for the love I had to learning; on which account the high priests and principal men of the city came then frequently to me together, in order to know my opinion about the accurate understanding of points of the law

(Note below 3 crucified and one survived)

And when I was sent by Titus Caesar with Cerealins, and a thousand horsemen, to a certain village called Thecoa, in order to know whether it were a place fit for a camp, as I came back, I saw many captives crucified, and remembered three of them as my former acquaintance. I was very sorry at this in my mind, and went with tears in my eyes to Titus, and told him of them; so he immediately commanded them to be taken down, and to have the greatest care taken of them, in order to their recovery; yet two of them died under the physician's hands, while the third recovered.

I am not debating whether there is a creator, but the rapture is not happening, the world may be destroyed by man, we may have a huge flooding in the future, but Jesus is not coming in the clouds to fight a war, the end times might be aliens who come and destroy us, who knows.

The rapture happened with destruction of the temple in Jerusalem, a result of the civil war between sects of Jews,
remember Jesus warned,
A house divided can not stand. (by this he meant a country).

That is quite a stretch of imagination.

Penelope's interpretation of the events of the first century AD is -----CATECHISM primed-------it is utter nonsense from top to bottom. I am really amused that she interprets Josephus
"WARS OF THE JEWS" as a chronicle of "JEWS KILLING EACH OTHER". Lots is KNOWN about Josephus-----as for
"traitor"----nope---not really. Paul left his own writings----
his claim to Pharisee is a bit idiotic. My own opinion is that much of that attributed to paul was---kinds FIXED by the minions of Constantine. Greek was the language of "scholarship" in those days-----especially for the romans and to a significant degree for the jews. It was kinda like French for 19 th century Brits and Russians. Every "lady and gentleman" was FLUENT. The consistent fact of the time is and was-----The Pharisees hated greeks when ASSYRIAN greeks were oppressing jews (see the book of MACCABEES in your hotel bible) The Pharisees (like Jesus) hated romans when the romans were oppressing jews (see New
Testament) Jews killing jews happened less than USA presidents were assassinated. The phenomenon was so rare that such events made it into the calendar

I am so proud-----Penelope sees COMEDY in my ^^^^ post
which she has defined as "funny" Is there anyone out there who understands the "COMIC" content of my post ---
please explain it to me

 

[Penelope]

the preachers who preach this stuff are nuts and out to make money off of it. The rapture happened, it was the destruction of the temple that Jesus was talking about. The son of man in the clouds was Titus.
Time to wake up and end this end of days gloom and doom.

By Josephus :

Moreover, the eastern gate of the inner (22) [court of the] temple, which was of brass, and vastly heavy, and had been with difficulty shut by twenty men, and rested upon a basis armed with iron, and had bolts fastened very deep into the firm floor, which was there made of one entire stone, was seen to be opened of its own accord about the sixth hour of the night. Now those that kept watch in the temple came hereupon running to the captain of the temple, and told him of it; who then came up thither, and not without great difficulty was able to shut the gate again. This also appeared to the vulgar to be a very happy prodigy, as if God did thereby open them the gate of happiness. But the men of learning understood it, that the security of their holy house was dissolved of its own accord, and that the gate was opened for the advantage of their enemies. So these publicly declared that the signal foreshowed the desolation that was coming upon them. Besides these, a few days after that feast, on the one and twentieth day of the month Artemisius, [Jyar,] a certain prodigious and incredible phenomenon appeared: I suppose the account of it would seem to be a fable, were it not related by those that saw it, and were not the events that followed it of so considerable a nature as to deserve such signals; for, before sun-setting, chariots and troops of soldiers in their armor were seen running about among the clouds, and surrounding of cities. Moreover, at that feast which we call Pentecost, as the priests were going by night into the inner [court of the temple,] as their custom was, to perform their sacred ministrations, they said that, in the first place, they felt a quaking, and heard a great noise, and after that they heard a sound as of a great multitude, saying, "Let us remove hence."

Book V1 Chapt 5 Section 3, 24 http://www.sacred-texts.com/jud/josephus/war-6.htm

We'll miss you.

Grizz, you don't speak for Jesus, end of story there.

I get it; Mormons accept the gist of TNT, not the verses.

oh what's da gist and from where comes the funny underwear?------somewhere in the golden plates

What did I do to you?

I never met you. You never did anything to me about which I know. The issue of MORMON ACCEPTS THE GIST OF THE NT----intrigues me. I read the NT-----and have heard
many people cite the "TEACHINGS OF JESUS"------as if the 'TEACHINGS OF JESUS" describes all of Christianity----.
I could not find Christianity as being something that could credibly be attributed to something Jesus "taught". I was once told that Mormonism is not a Christian sect

You just seemed to have a dim view of some of the esoterical teachings of the Church.
And it was my way of sending a greeting card.
I'm a practicing Mormon. Even went on an LDS mission to Australia.
In 2014 as a truck driver I went thru the New Testament 26 times and the Book of Mormon 10 times.
When it comes to Biblical exegesis and hermanutics I can hold my own with anyone.

Those Mormon boys who come to my door are the most polite as can be, but the Baptist love to tell me how I'm going to hell because I tell them I'm a RC.

 

[irosie91]

oh what's da gist and from where comes the funny underwear?------somewhere in the golden plates

What did I do to you?

I never met you. You never did anything to me about which I know. The issue of MORMON ACCEPTS THE GIST OF THE NT----intrigues me. I read the NT-----and have heard
many people cite the "TEACHINGS OF JESUS"------as if the 'TEACHINGS OF JESUS" describes all of Christianity----.
I could not find Christianity as being something that could credibly be attributed to something Jesus "taught". I was once told that Mormonism is not a Christian sect

You just seemed to have a dim view of some of the esoterical teachings of the Church.
And it was my way of sending a greeting card.
I'm a practicing Mormon. Even went on an LDS mission to Australia.
In 2014 as a truck driver I went thru the New Testament 26 times and the Book of Mormon 10 times.
When it comes to Biblical exegesis and hermanutics I can hold my own with anyone.

Oh good-----what gist of the NT do you accept?

oh what's da gist and from where comes the funny underwear?------somewhere in the golden plates

The garments come from their temple worship. Several recent works on Masonry and Mormonism and comparative rite and ritual have been published that are quite good.

The topic, personally, bores me for I am neither Mason nor Mormon.

oh----the masons did it too?-------do CURRENT MASONS do
it? -------I do know----from my college room mate who was
in the process of becoming something weird like----first a "RAINBOW GIRL"-----and then inducted into the "EASTERN
STAR"-----she she had to struggle to find white stockings.
DON'T tell anyone-----its a secret

My father's mother was a major player in the San Fran Eastern Star a long, long time ago.

oh-----don't tell her what I know....... more to the story---I helped my roommate MEMORIZE the right answers she was supposed to parrot for her induction. ------much later-----at my
little clerical college time job-----a middle aged work mate
mentioned an UPCOMING event with the "EASTERN STAR"---and I repeated some of that induction stuff------THE WOMAN FREAKED OUT. something about my roommate revealing
SECRETS

The Mormon Church has 7 arcanes. And jakestarkey is one of them.

oh------and he was sent to HONOR this messageboard?
I do know that Mormons SEND their finest on some sort of
quests

 

[irosie91]

That is true Rosie, all the sects of jews w

the preachers who preach this stuff are nuts and out to make money off of it. The rapture happened, it was the destruction of the temple that Jesus was talking about. The son of man in the clouds was Titus.
Time to wake up and end this end of days gloom and doom.

By Josephus :

Moreover, the eastern gate of the inner (22) [court of the] temple, which was of brass, and vastly heavy, and had been with difficulty shut by twenty men, and rested upon a basis armed with iron, and had bolts fastened very deep into the firm floor, which was there made of one entire stone, was seen to be opened of its own accord about the sixth hour of the night. Now those that kept watch in the temple came hereupon running to the captain of the temple, and told him of it; who then came up thither, and not without great difficulty was able to shut the gate again. This also appeared to the vulgar to be a very happy prodigy, as if God did thereby open them the gate of happiness. But the men of learning understood it, that the security of their holy house was dissolved of its own accord, and that the gate was opened for the advantage of their enemies. So these publicly declared that the signal foreshowed the desolation that was coming upon them. Besides these, a few days after that feast, on the one and twentieth day of the month Artemisius, [Jyar,] a certain prodigious and incredible phenomenon appeared: I suppose the account of it would seem to be a fable, were it not related by those that saw it, and were not the events that followed it of so considerable a nature as to deserve such signals; for, before sun-setting, chariots and troops of soldiers in their armor were seen running about among the clouds, and surrounding of cities. Moreover, at that feast which we call Pentecost, as the priests were going by night into the inner [court of the temple,] as their custom was, to perform their sacred ministrations, they said that, in the first place, they felt a quaking, and heard a great noise, and after that they heard a sound as of a great multitude, saying, "Let us remove hence."

Book V1 Chapt 5 Section 3, 24 http://www.sacred-texts.com/jud/josephus/war-6.htm

We'll miss you.

I get it; Mormons accept the gist of TNT, not the verses.

oh what's da gist and from where comes the funny underwear?------somewhere in the golden plates

What did I do to you?

I never met you. You never did anything to me about which I know. The issue of MORMON ACCEPTS THE GIST OF THE NT----intrigues me. I read the NT-----and have heard
many people cite the "TEACHINGS OF JESUS"------as if the 'TEACHINGS OF JESUS" describes all of Christianity----.
I could not find Christianity as being something that could credibly be attributed to something Jesus "taught". I was once told that Mormonism is not a Christian sect

You just seemed to have a dim view of some of the esoterical teachings of the Church.
And it was my way of sending a greeting card.
I'm a practicing Mormon. Even went on an LDS mission to Australia.
In 2014 as a truck driver I went thru the New Testament 26 times and the Book of Mormon 10 times.
When it comes to Biblical exegesis and hermanutics I can hold my own with anyone.

Those Mormon boys who come to my door are the most polite as can be, but the Baptist love to tell me how I'm going to hell because I tell them I'm a RC.

so true-----Mormons are EXCRUTIATINGLY polite and never do that 'YOU AIN'T SAVED' thing. (saved ((???)) )

 

[tyroneweaver]

I get it; Mormons accept the gist of TNT, not the verses.

oh what's da gist and from where comes the funny underwear?------somewhere in the golden plates

What did I do to you?

I never met you. You never did anything to me about which I know. The issue of MORMON ACCEPTS THE GIST OF THE NT----intrigues me. I read the NT-----and have heard
many people cite the "TEACHINGS OF JESUS"------as if the 'TEACHINGS OF JESUS" describes all of Christianity----.
I could not find Christianity as being something that could credibly be attributed to something Jesus "taught". I was once told that Mormonism is not a Christian sect

You just seemed to have a dim view of some of the esoterical teachings of the Church.
And it was my way of sending a greeting card.
I'm a practicing Mormon. Even went on an LDS mission to Australia.
In 2014 as a truck driver I went thru the New Testament 26 times and the Book of Mormon 10 times.
When it comes to Biblical exegesis and hermanutics I can hold my own with anyone.

Oh good-----what gist of the NT do you accept?

We tend to be literalist. NT is factual but not necessarily inerrant.
I guess the gist would be that Christ is the Son of God and died for our sins and was resurrected that all may be resurrected.

 

[JakeStarkey]

What book of the bible did Josephus write?

oh yeah. None of them.

So why is what he says relevant to God's plan for the future?

oh yeah. It's not.

Who do you think wrote parts of the bible, if you read Josephus , you might even think he is Paul. We know Matthew, Mark, Luke and Paul (most likely mainly Philo) were fictional pen names.

I have read Josephus, and I don't think he's Paul, lol.

And no, we don't know Matthew, mark, Luke and Paul are pen names, where do you get this nonsense? lolol. ..

Really you don't see a connection between Paul and Josephus, both Pharisees , both shipwrecked, both from prominent families, one a slave turned freedman, one keeps calling himself a slave and tells you how to be a good slave, both very learned and wrote Greek. One killing Romans and the others killing Christians (gentiles) before one is capture and the other seen a vision. Both kept in chains in Caesarea. Paul becomes a slave of Christ (Jesus). Both become traitors of the Jews.


(Josephus goes on and who does this remind you of, Jesus)

Moreover, when I was a child, and about fourteen years of age, I was commended by all for the love I had to learning; on which account the high priests and principal men of the city came then frequently to me together, in order to know my opinion about the accurate understanding of points of the law

(Note below 3 crucified and one survived)

And when I was sent by Titus Caesar with Cerealins, and a thousand horsemen, to a certain village called Thecoa, in order to know whether it were a place fit for a camp, as I came back, I saw many captives crucified, and remembered three of them as my former acquaintance. I was very sorry at this in my mind, and went with tears in my eyes to Titus, and told him of them; so he immediately commanded them to be taken down, and to have the greatest care taken of them, in order to their recovery; yet two of them died under the physician's hands, while the third recovered.

I am not debating whether there is a creator, but the rapture is not happening, the world may be destroyed by man, we may have a huge flooding in the future, but Jesus is not coming in the clouds to fight a war, the end times might be aliens who come and destroy us, who knows.

The rapture happened with destruction of the temple in Jerusalem, a result of the civil war between sects of Jews,
remember Jesus warned,
A house divided can not stand. (by this he meant a country).

That is quite a stretch of imagination.

Penelope's interpretation of the events of the first century AD is -----CATECHISM primed-------it is utter nonsense from top to bottom. I am really amused that she interprets Josephus
"WARS OF THE JEWS" as a chronicle of "JEWS KILLING EACH OTHER". Lots is KNOWN about Josephus-----as for
"traitor"----nope---not really. Paul left his own writings----
his claim to Pharisee is a bit idiotic. My own opinion is that much of that attributed to paul was---kinds FIXED by the minions of Constantine. Greek was the language of "scholarship" in those days-----especially for the romans and to a significant degree for the jews. It was kinda like French for 19 th century Brits and Russians. Every "lady and gentleman" was FLUENT. The consistent fact of the time is and was-----The Pharisees hated greeks when ASSYRIAN greeks were oppressing jews (see the book of MACCABEES in your hotel bible) The Pharisees (like Jesus) hated romans when the romans were oppressing jews (see New
Testament) Jews killing jews happened less than USA presidents were assassinated. The phenomenon was so rare that such events made it into the calendar

You overstate. The OT is full of Jews killing Jews, check Maccabees as one example, for messing around with non Jews and non Jewish beliefs.

Jewish auxiliary troop units were part of the Roman legions surrounding Jerusalem during the Temple revolt and helped pull down the Temple after the Romans won.

 

[irosie91]

That is true Rosie, all the sects of jews w

sheeesh penny dear------looks like your post was CUT via a DEUS EX MACHINA-------you were saying... that is TYPING---
something that you "know" about "all the sects of jews w....."?????

 

[irosie91]

oh what's da gist and from where comes the funny underwear?------somewhere in the golden plates

What did I do to you?

I never met you. You never did anything to me about which I know. The issue of MORMON ACCEPTS THE GIST OF THE NT----intrigues me. I read the NT-----and have heard
many people cite the "TEACHINGS OF JESUS"------as if the 'TEACHINGS OF JESUS" describes all of Christianity----.
I could not find Christianity as being something that could credibly be attributed to something Jesus "taught". I was once told that Mormonism is not a Christian sect

You just seemed to have a dim view of some of the esoterical teachings of the Church.
And it was my way of sending a greeting card.
I'm a practicing Mormon. Even went on an LDS mission to Australia.
In 2014 as a truck driver I went thru the New Testament 26 times and the Book of Mormon 10 times.
When it comes to Biblical exegesis and hermanutics I can hold my own with anyone.

Oh good-----what gist of the NT do you accept?

We tend to be literalist. NT is factual but not necessarily inerrant.
I guess the gist would be that Christ is the Son of God and died for our sins and was resurrected that all may be resurrected.

sounds like a nice poetic interpretation-------very Aztec------the story of the Aztec Emperor, Montezuma at the hands of
Hernan Cortez -----was----"I WILL RISE LIKE THE SUN IN THE MORNING" Aztec culture and religion included the concept that the king was divine

 

[koshergrl]

That is true Rosie, all the sects of jews w

the preachers who preach this stuff are nuts and out to make money off of it. The rapture happened, it was the destruction of the temple that Jesus was talking about. The son of man in the clouds was Titus.
Time to wake up and end this end of days gloom and doom.

By Josephus :

Moreover, the eastern gate of the inner (22) [court of the] temple, which was of brass, and vastly heavy, and had been with difficulty shut by twenty men, and rested upon a basis armed with iron, and had bolts fastened very deep into the firm floor, which was there made of one entire stone, was seen to be opened of its own accord about the sixth hour of the night. Now those that kept watch in the temple came hereupon running to the captain of the temple, and told him of it; who then came up thither, and not without great difficulty was able to shut the gate again. This also appeared to the vulgar to be a very happy prodigy, as if God did thereby open them the gate of happiness. But the men of learning understood it, that the security of their holy house was dissolved of its own accord, and that the gate was opened for the advantage of their enemies. So these publicly declared that the signal foreshowed the desolation that was coming upon them. Besides these, a few days after that feast, on the one and twentieth day of the month Artemisius, [Jyar,] a certain prodigious and incredible phenomenon appeared: I suppose the account of it would seem to be a fable, were it not related by those that saw it, and were not the events that followed it of so considerable a nature as to deserve such signals; for, before sun-setting, chariots and troops of soldiers in their armor were seen running about among the clouds, and surrounding of cities. Moreover, at that feast which we call Pentecost, as the priests were going by night into the inner [court of the temple,] as their custom was, to perform their sacred ministrations, they said that, in the first place, they felt a quaking, and heard a great noise, and after that they heard a sound as of a great multitude, saying, "Let us remove hence."

Book V1 Chapt 5 Section 3, 24 http://www.sacred-texts.com/jud/josephus/war-6.htm

We'll miss you.

I get it; Mormons accept the gist of TNT, not the verses.

oh what's da gist and from where comes the funny underwear?------somewhere in the golden plates

What did I do to you?

I never met you. You never did anything to me about which I know. The issue of MORMON ACCEPTS THE GIST OF THE NT----intrigues me. I read the NT-----and have heard
many people cite the "TEACHINGS OF JESUS"------as if the 'TEACHINGS OF JESUS" describes all of Christianity----.
I could not find Christianity as being something that could credibly be attributed to something Jesus "taught". I was once told that Mormonism is not a Christian sect

You just seemed to have a dim view of some of the esoterical teachings of the Church.
And it was my way of sending a greeting card.
I'm a practicing Mormon. Even went on an LDS mission to Australia.
In 2014 as a truck driver I went thru the New Testament 26 times and the Book of Mormon 10 times.
When it comes to Biblical exegesis and hermanutics I can hold my own with anyone.

Those Mormon boys who come to my door are the most polite as can be, but the Baptist love to tell me how I'm going to hell because I tell them I'm a RC.

They're trying to save your soul. As a Catholic, you should be secure in the belief that you're in for some torture anyway so try not to take it too hard.

Like Elizabeth 1 I have no desire to make windows into men's souls. I think the only way to get into heaven is through Christ. As for the rest, God will sort it out.

 

[koshergrl]

What book of the bible did Josephus write?

oh yeah. None of them.

So why is what he says relevant to God's plan for the future?

oh yeah. It's not.

Who do you think wrote parts of the bible, if you read Josephus , you might even think he is Paul. We know Matthew, Mark, Luke and Paul (most likely mainly Philo) were fictional pen names.

I have read Josephus, and I don't think he's Paul, lol.

And no, we don't know Matthew, mark, Luke and Paul are pen names, where do you get this nonsense? lolol. ..

Really you don't see a connection between Paul and Josephus, both Pharisees , both shipwrecked, both from prominent families, one a slave turned freedman, one keeps calling himself a slave and tells you how to be a good slave, both very learned and wrote Greek. One killing Romans and the others killing Christians (gentiles) before one is capture and the other seen a vision. Both kept in chains in Caesarea. Paul becomes a slave of Christ (Jesus). Both become traitors of the Jews.


(Josephus goes on and who does this remind you of, Jesus)

Moreover, when I was a child, and about fourteen years of age, I was commended by all for the love I had to learning; on which account the high priests and principal men of the city came then frequently to me together, in order to know my opinion about the accurate understanding of points of the law

(Note below 3 crucified and one survived)

And when I was sent by Titus Caesar with Cerealins, and a thousand horsemen, to a certain village called Thecoa, in order to know whether it were a place fit for a camp, as I came back, I saw many captives crucified, and remembered three of them as my former acquaintance. I was very sorry at this in my mind, and went with tears in my eyes to Titus, and told him of them; so he immediately commanded them to be taken down, and to have the greatest care taken of them, in order to their recovery; yet two of them died under the physician's hands, while the third recovered.

I am not debating whether there is a creator, but the rapture is not happening, the world may be destroyed by man, we may have a huge flooding in the future, but Jesus is not coming in the clouds to fight a war, the end times might be aliens who come and destroy us, who knows.

The rapture happened with destruction of the temple in Jerusalem, a result of the civil war between sects of Jews,
remember Jesus warned,
A house divided can not stand. (by this he meant a country).

That is quite a stretch of imagination.

Penelope's interpretation of the events of the first century AD is -----CATECHISM primed-------it is utter nonsense from top to bottom. I am really amused that she interprets Josephus
"WARS OF THE JEWS" as a chronicle of "JEWS KILLING EACH OTHER". Lots is KNOWN about Josephus-----as for
"traitor"----nope---not really. Paul left his own writings----
his claim to Pharisee is a bit idiotic. My own opinion is that much of that attributed to paul was---kinds FIXED by the minions of Constantine. Greek was the language of "scholarship" in those days-----especially for the romans and to a significant degree for the jews. It was kinda like French for 19 th century Brits and Russians. Every "lady and gentleman" was FLUENT. The consistent fact of the time is and was-----The Pharisees hated greeks when ASSYRIAN greeks were oppressing jews (see the book of MACCABEES in your hotel bible) The Pharisees (like Jesus) hated romans when the romans were oppressing jews (see New
Testament) Jews killing jews happened less than USA presidents were assassinated. The phenomenon was so rare that such events made it into the calendar

No one person or one power had dominion over the development of the bible. That is nonsense. Scholars and men of faith from all continents and persuasions are responsible for the preservation and interpretation of the sacred texts, and they worked off of the originals. There has been no huge, cohesive bastardization of the bible. Rather it has been jealously protected and the accuracy painstakingly preserved. By many. Never has it been under the control of a single person with an agenda.

 

[irosie91]

Who do you think wrote parts of the bible, if you read Josephus , you might even think he is Paul. We know Matthew, Mark, Luke and Paul (most likely mainly Philo) were fictional pen names.

I have read Josephus, and I don't think he's Paul, lol.

And no, we don't know Matthew, mark, Luke and Paul are pen names, where do you get this nonsense? lolol. ..

Really you don't see a connection between Paul and Josephus, both Pharisees , both shipwrecked, both from prominent families, one a slave turned freedman, one keeps calling himself a slave and tells you how to be a good slave, both very learned and wrote Greek. One killing Romans and the others killing Christians (gentiles) before one is capture and the other seen a vision. Both kept in chains in Caesarea. Paul becomes a slave of Christ (Jesus). Both become traitors of the Jews.


(Josephus goes on and who does this remind you of, Jesus)

Moreover, when I was a child, and about fourteen years of age, I was commended by all for the love I had to learning; on which account the high priests and principal men of the city came then frequently to me together, in order to know my opinion about the accurate understanding of points of the law

(Note below 3 crucified and one survived)

And when I was sent by Titus Caesar with Cerealins, and a thousand horsemen, to a certain village called Thecoa, in order to know whether it were a place fit for a camp, as I came back, I saw many captives crucified, and remembered three of them as my former acquaintance. I was very sorry at this in my mind, and went with tears in my eyes to Titus, and told him of them; so he immediately commanded them to be taken down, and to have the greatest care taken of them, in order to their recovery; yet two of them died under the physician's hands, while the third recovered.

I am not debating whether there is a creator, but the rapture is not happening, the world may be destroyed by man, we may have a huge flooding in the future, but Jesus is not coming in the clouds to fight a war, the end times might be aliens who come and destroy us, who knows.

The rapture happened with destruction of the temple in Jerusalem, a result of the civil war between sects of Jews,
remember Jesus warned,
A house divided can not stand. (by this he meant a country).

That is quite a stretch of imagination.

Penelope's interpretation of the events of the first century AD is -----CATECHISM primed-------it is utter nonsense from top to bottom. I am really amused that she interprets Josephus
"WARS OF THE JEWS" as a chronicle of "JEWS KILLING EACH OTHER". Lots is KNOWN about Josephus-----as for
"traitor"----nope---not really. Paul left his own writings----
his claim to Pharisee is a bit idiotic. My own opinion is that much of that attributed to paul was---kinds FIXED by the minions of Constantine. Greek was the language of "scholarship" in those days-----especially for the romans and to a significant degree for the jews. It was kinda like French for 19 th century Brits and Russians. Every "lady and gentleman" was FLUENT. The consistent fact of the time is and was-----The Pharisees hated greeks when ASSYRIAN greeks were oppressing jews (see the book of MACCABEES in your hotel bible) The Pharisees (like Jesus) hated romans when the romans were oppressing jews (see New
Testament) Jews killing jews happened less than USA presidents were assassinated. The phenomenon was so rare that such events made it into the calendar

You overstate. The OT is full of Jews killing Jews, check Maccabees as one example, for messing around with non Jews and non Jewish beliefs.

Jewish auxiliary troop units were part of the Roman legions surrounding Jerusalem during the Temple revolt and helped pull down the Temple after the Romans won.

in fact it is you who OVER-STATEs------there was more killing of americans on americans during the revolutionary war. You do not lie-----just overstate. Jews were used as slave labor by the roman armies and ----rome itself. A colleague of mine is another jew-----his mother made bullets in a concentration camp for the germans when she was 12. The "jewish wars" by Josephus is not a compendium of jews killing jews. You have fallen for the typical islamo Nazi construct----"that bad guy had a jewish great grand father--------watch Erdogan for this kind of JUSTIFICATION for his extensive purges. Both he and Adolf learned it from the Catholic church

 

[irosie91]

That is true Rosie, all the sects of jews w

the preachers who preach this stuff are nuts and out to make money off of it. The rapture happened, it was the destruction of the temple that Jesus was talking about. The son of man in the clouds was Titus.
Time to wake up and end this end of days gloom and doom.

By Josephus :

Moreover, the eastern gate of the inner (22) [court of the] temple, which was of brass, and vastly heavy, and had been with difficulty shut by twenty men, and rested upon a basis armed with iron, and had bolts fastened very deep into the firm floor, which was there made of one entire stone, was seen to be opened of its own accord about the sixth hour of the night. Now those that kept watch in the temple came hereupon running to the captain of the temple, and told him of it; who then came up thither, and not without great difficulty was able to shut the gate again. This also appeared to the vulgar to be a very happy prodigy, as if God did thereby open them the gate of happiness. But the men of learning understood it, that the security of their holy house was dissolved of its own accord, and that the gate was opened for the advantage of their enemies. So these publicly declared that the signal foreshowed the desolation that was coming upon them. Besides these, a few days after that feast, on the one and twentieth day of the month Artemisius, [Jyar,] a certain prodigious and incredible phenomenon appeared: I suppose the account of it would seem to be a fable, were it not related by those that saw it, and were not the events that followed it of so considerable a nature as to deserve such signals; for, before sun-setting, chariots and troops of soldiers in their armor were seen running about among the clouds, and surrounding of cities. Moreover, at that feast which we call Pentecost, as the priests were going by night into the inner [court of the temple,] as their custom was, to perform their sacred ministrations, they said that, in the first place, they felt a quaking, and heard a great noise, and after that they heard a sound as of a great multitude, saying, "Let us remove hence."

Book V1 Chapt 5 Section 3, 24 http://www.sacred-texts.com/jud/josephus/war-6.htm

We'll miss you.

oh what's da gist and from where comes the funny underwear?------somewhere in the golden plates

What did I do to you?

I never met you. You never did anything to me about which I know. The issue of MORMON ACCEPTS THE GIST OF THE NT----intrigues me. I read the NT-----and have heard
many people cite the "TEACHINGS OF JESUS"------as if the 'TEACHINGS OF JESUS" describes all of Christianity----.
I could not find Christianity as being something that could credibly be attributed to something Jesus "taught". I was once told that Mormonism is not a Christian sect

You just seemed to have a dim view of some of the esoterical teachings of the Church.
And it was my way of sending a greeting card.
I'm a practicing Mormon. Even went on an LDS mission to Australia.
In 2014 as a truck driver I went thru the New Testament 26 times and the Book of Mormon 10 times.
When it comes to Biblical exegesis and hermanutics I can hold my own with anyone.

Those Mormon boys who come to my door are the most polite as can be, but the Baptist love to tell me how I'm going to hell because I tell them I'm a RC.

They're trying to save your soul. As a Catholic, you should be secure in the belief that you're in for some torture anyway so try not to take it too hard.

Like Elizabeth 1 I have no desire to make windows into men's souls. I think the only way to get into heaven is through Christ. As for the rest, God will sort it out.

Penny claims she repudiated Catholicism ----in favor of Protestantism--------nice of you, however, to pretend her post makes sense

 

[irosie91]

Who do you think wrote parts of the bible, if you read Josephus , you might even think he is Paul. We know Matthew, Mark, Luke and Paul (most likely mainly Philo) were fictional pen names.

I have read Josephus, and I don't think he's Paul, lol.

And no, we don't know Matthew, mark, Luke and Paul are pen names, where do you get this nonsense? lolol. ..

Really you don't see a connection between Paul and Josephus, both Pharisees , both shipwrecked, both from prominent families, one a slave turned freedman, one keeps calling himself a slave and tells you how to be a good slave, both very learned and wrote Greek. One killing Romans and the others killing Christians (gentiles) before one is capture and the other seen a vision. Both kept in chains in Caesarea. Paul becomes a slave of Christ (Jesus). Both become traitors of the Jews.


(Josephus goes on and who does this remind you of, Jesus)

Moreover, when I was a child, and about fourteen years of age, I was commended by all for the love I had to learning; on which account the high priests and principal men of the city came then frequently to me together, in order to know my opinion about the accurate understanding of points of the law

(Note below 3 crucified and one survived)

And when I was sent by Titus Caesar with Cerealins, and a thousand horsemen, to a certain village called Thecoa, in order to know whether it were a place fit for a camp, as I came back, I saw many captives crucified, and remembered three of them as my former acquaintance. I was very sorry at this in my mind, and went with tears in my eyes to Titus, and told him of them; so he immediately commanded them to be taken down, and to have the greatest care taken of them, in order to their recovery; yet two of them died under the physician's hands, while the third recovered.

I am not debating whether there is a creator, but the rapture is not happening, the world may be destroyed by man, we may have a huge flooding in the future, but Jesus is not coming in the clouds to fight a war, the end times might be aliens who come and destroy us, who knows.

The rapture happened with destruction of the temple in Jerusalem, a result of the civil war between sects of Jews,
remember Jesus warned,
A house divided can not stand. (by this he meant a country).

That is quite a stretch of imagination.

Penelope's interpretation of the events of the first century AD is -----CATECHISM primed-------it is utter nonsense from top to bottom. I am really amused that she interprets Josephus
"WARS OF THE JEWS" as a chronicle of "JEWS KILLING EACH OTHER". Lots is KNOWN about Josephus-----as for
"traitor"----nope---not really. Paul left his own writings----
his claim to Pharisee is a bit idiotic. My own opinion is that much of that attributed to paul was---kinds FIXED by the minions of Constantine. Greek was the language of "scholarship" in those days-----especially for the romans and to a significant degree for the jews. It was kinda like French for 19 th century Brits and Russians. Every "lady and gentleman" was FLUENT. The consistent fact of the time is and was-----The Pharisees hated greeks when ASSYRIAN greeks were oppressing jews (see the book of MACCABEES in your hotel bible) The Pharisees (like Jesus) hated romans when the romans were oppressing jews (see New
Testament) Jews killing jews happened less than USA presidents were assassinated. The phenomenon was so rare that such events made it into the calendar

No one person or one power had dominion over the development of the bible. That is nonsense. Scholars and men of faith from all continents and persuasions are responsible for the preservation and interpretation of the sacred texts, and they worked off of the originals. There has been no huge, cohesive bastardization of the bible. Rather it has been jealously protected and the accuracy painstakingly preserved. By many. Never has it been under the control of a single person with an agenda.

wrong--------lots of agenda in the NICEAN VERSION ------the version ratified by the ROMAN catholic church-----is all about
ROMAN DOMINION. Later attempts to find or theorize "originals" are nice too. ------you got a copy of the original
Q?. For the sake of my perverted interest-----do you really believe that Jesus went on some kind of magical journey to ROME? (you need not answer if the question annoys you)

 

[tyroneweaver]

Who do you think wrote parts of the bible, if you read Josephus , you might even think he is Paul. We know Matthew, Mark, Luke and Paul (most likely mainly Philo) were fictional pen names.

I have read Josephus, and I don't think he's Paul, lol.

And no, we don't know Matthew, mark, Luke and Paul are pen names, where do you get this nonsense? lolol. ..

Really you don't see a connection between Paul and Josephus, both Pharisees , both shipwrecked, both from prominent families, one a slave turned freedman, one keeps calling himself a slave and tells you how to be a good slave, both very learned and wrote Greek. One killing Romans and the others killing Christians (gentiles) before one is capture and the other seen a vision. Both kept in chains in Caesarea. Paul becomes a slave of Christ (Jesus). Both become traitors of the Jews.


(Josephus goes on and who does this remind you of, Jesus)

Moreover, when I was a child, and about fourteen years of age, I was commended by all for the love I had to learning; on which account the high priests and principal men of the city came then frequently to me together, in order to know my opinion about the accurate understanding of points of the law

(Note below 3 crucified and one survived)

And when I was sent by Titus Caesar with Cerealins, and a thousand horsemen, to a certain village called Thecoa, in order to know whether it were a place fit for a camp, as I came back, I saw many captives crucified, and remembered three of them as my former acquaintance. I was very sorry at this in my mind, and went with tears in my eyes to Titus, and told him of them; so he immediately commanded them to be taken down, and to have the greatest care taken of them, in order to their recovery; yet two of them died under the physician's hands, while the third recovered.

I am not debating whether there is a creator, but the rapture is not happening, the world may be destroyed by man, we may have a huge flooding in the future, but Jesus is not coming in the clouds to fight a war, the end times might be aliens who come and destroy us, who knows.

The rapture happened with destruction of the temple in Jerusalem, a result of the civil war between sects of Jews,
remember Jesus warned,
A house divided can not stand. (by this he meant a country).

That is quite a stretch of imagination.

Penelope's interpretation of the events of the first century AD is -----CATECHISM primed-------it is utter nonsense from top to bottom. I am really amused that she interprets Josephus
"WARS OF THE JEWS" as a chronicle of "JEWS KILLING EACH OTHER". Lots is KNOWN about Josephus-----as for
"traitor"----nope---not really. Paul left his own writings----
his claim to Pharisee is a bit idiotic. My own opinion is that much of that attributed to paul was---kinds FIXED by the minions of Constantine. Greek was the language of "scholarship" in those days-----especially for the romans and to a significant degree for the jews. It was kinda like French for 19 th century Brits and Russians. Every "lady and gentleman" was FLUENT. The consistent fact of the time is and was-----The Pharisees hated greeks when ASSYRIAN greeks were oppressing jews (see the book of MACCABEES in your hotel bible) The Pharisees (like Jesus) hated romans when the romans were oppressing jews (see New
Testament) Jews killing jews happened less than USA presidents were assassinated. The phenomenon was so rare that such events made it into the calendar

You overstate. The OT is full of Jews killing Jews, check Maccabees as one example, for messing around with non Jews and non Jewish beliefs.

Jewish auxiliary troop units were part of the Roman legions surrounding Jerusalem during the Temple revolt and helped pull down the Temple after the Romans won.

Wayne, the manager is first row, center.
The Deseret News - Google News Archive Search

 

[JakeStarkey]

No one person or one power had dominion over the development of the bible. That is nonsense. Scholars and men of faith from all continents and persuasions are responsible for the preservation and interpretation of the sacred texts, and they worked off of the originals. There has been no huge, cohesive bastardization of the bible. Rather it has been jealously protected and the accuracy painstakingly preserved. By many. Never has it been under the control of a single person with an agenda.

Don't tell Jeremiah this!

 

[irosie91]

I have read Josephus, and I don't think he's Paul, lol.

And no, we don't know Matthew, mark, Luke and Paul are pen names, where do you get this nonsense? lolol. ..

Really you don't see a connection between Paul and Josephus, both Pharisees , both shipwrecked, both from prominent families, one a slave turned freedman, one keeps calling himself a slave and tells you how to be a good slave, both very learned and wrote Greek. One killing Romans and the others killing Christians (gentiles) before one is capture and the other seen a vision. Both kept in chains in Caesarea. Paul becomes a slave of Christ (Jesus). Both become traitors of the Jews.


(Josephus goes on and who does this remind you of, Jesus)

Moreover, when I was a child, and about fourteen years of age, I was commended by all for the love I had to learning; on which account the high priests and principal men of the city came then frequently to me together, in order to know my opinion about the accurate understanding of points of the law

(Note below 3 crucified and one survived)

And when I was sent by Titus Caesar with Cerealins, and a thousand horsemen, to a certain village called Thecoa, in order to know whether it were a place fit for a camp, as I came back, I saw many captives crucified, and remembered three of them as my former acquaintance. I was very sorry at this in my mind, and went with tears in my eyes to Titus, and told him of them; so he immediately commanded them to be taken down, and to have the greatest care taken of them, in order to their recovery; yet two of them died under the physician's hands, while the third recovered.

I am not debating whether there is a creator, but the rapture is not happening, the world may be destroyed by man, we may have a huge flooding in the future, but Jesus is not coming in the clouds to fight a war, the end times might be aliens who come and destroy us, who knows.

The rapture happened with destruction of the temple in Jerusalem, a result of the civil war between sects of Jews,
remember Jesus warned,
A house divided can not stand. (by this he meant a country).

That is quite a stretch of imagination.

Penelope's interpretation of the events of the first century AD is -----CATECHISM primed-------it is utter nonsense from top to bottom. I am really amused that she interprets Josephus
"WARS OF THE JEWS" as a chronicle of "JEWS KILLING EACH OTHER". Lots is KNOWN about Josephus-----as for
"traitor"----nope---not really. Paul left his own writings----
his claim to Pharisee is a bit idiotic. My own opinion is that much of that attributed to paul was---kinds FIXED by the minions of Constantine. Greek was the language of "scholarship" in those days-----especially for the romans and to a significant degree for the jews. It was kinda like French for 19 th century Brits and Russians. Every "lady and gentleman" was FLUENT. The consistent fact of the time is and was-----The Pharisees hated greeks when ASSYRIAN greeks were oppressing jews (see the book of MACCABEES in your hotel bible) The Pharisees (like Jesus) hated romans when the romans were oppressing jews (see New
Testament) Jews killing jews happened less than USA presidents were assassinated. The phenomenon was so rare that such events made it into the calendar

You overstate. The OT is full of Jews killing Jews, check Maccabees as one example, for messing around with non Jews and non Jewish beliefs.

Jewish auxiliary troop units were part of the Roman legions surrounding Jerusalem during the Temple revolt and helped pull down the Temple after the Romans won.

Wayne, the manager is first row, center.
The Deseret News - Google News Archive Search

??? I cannot access anything related give me a hint---
does you citation state that the holy "undergarments" of Jesus were found in Utah?

 

[JakeStarkey]

I have read Josephus, and I don't think he's Paul, lol.

And no, we don't know Matthew, mark, Luke and Paul are pen names, where do you get this nonsense? lolol. ..

Really you don't see a connection between Paul and Josephus, both Pharisees , both shipwrecked, both from prominent families, one a slave turned freedman, one keeps calling himself a slave and tells you how to be a good slave, both very learned and wrote Greek. One killing Romans and the others killing Christians (gentiles) before one is capture and the other seen a vision. Both kept in chains in Caesarea. Paul becomes a slave of Christ (Jesus). Both become traitors of the Jews.


(Josephus goes on and who does this remind you of, Jesus)

Moreover, when I was a child, and about fourteen years of age, I was commended by all for the love I had to learning; on which account the high priests and principal men of the city came then frequently to me together, in order to know my opinion about the accurate understanding of points of the law

(Note below 3 crucified and one survived)

And when I was sent by Titus Caesar with Cerealins, and a thousand horsemen, to a certain village called Thecoa, in order to know whether it were a place fit for a camp, as I came back, I saw many captives crucified, and remembered three of them as my former acquaintance. I was very sorry at this in my mind, and went with tears in my eyes to Titus, and told him of them; so he immediately commanded them to be taken down, and to have the greatest care taken of them, in order to their recovery; yet two of them died under the physician's hands, while the third recovered.

I am not debating whether there is a creator, but the rapture is not happening, the world may be destroyed by man, we may have a huge flooding in the future, but Jesus is not coming in the clouds to fight a war, the end times might be aliens who come and destroy us, who knows.

The rapture happened with destruction of the temple in Jerusalem, a result of the civil war between sects of Jews,
remember Jesus warned,
A house divided can not stand. (by this he meant a country).

That is quite a stretch of imagination.

Penelope's interpretation of the events of the first century AD is -----CATECHISM primed-------it is utter nonsense from top to bottom. I am really amused that she interprets Josephus
"WARS OF THE JEWS" as a chronicle of "JEWS KILLING EACH OTHER". Lots is KNOWN about Josephus-----as for
"traitor"----nope---not really. Paul left his own writings----
his claim to Pharisee is a bit idiotic. My own opinion is that much of that attributed to paul was---kinds FIXED by the minions of Constantine. Greek was the language of "scholarship" in those days-----especially for the romans and to a significant degree for the jews. It was kinda like French for 19 th century Brits and Russians. Every "lady and gentleman" was FLUENT. The consistent fact of the time is and was-----The Pharisees hated greeks when ASSYRIAN greeks were oppressing jews (see the book of MACCABEES in your hotel bible) The Pharisees (like Jesus) hated romans when the romans were oppressing jews (see New
Testament) Jews killing jews happened less than USA presidents were assassinated. The phenomenon was so rare that such events made it into the calendar

You overstate. The OT is full of Jews killing Jews, check Maccabees as one example, for messing around with non Jews and non Jewish beliefs.

Jewish auxiliary troop units were part of the Roman legions surrounding Jerusalem during the Temple revolt and helped pull down the Temple after the Romans won.

Wayne, the manager is first row, center.
The Deseret News - Google News Archive Search

I don't remember him. I do remember Marvin Ashton. He was big in the BSA.

 

[irosie91]

No one person or one power had dominion over the development of the bible. That is nonsense. Scholars and men of faith from all continents and persuasions are responsible for the preservation and interpretation of the sacred texts, and they worked off of the originals. There has been no huge, cohesive bastardization of the bible. Rather it has been jealously protected and the accuracy painstakingly preserved. By many. Never has it been under the control of a single person with an agenda.

Don't tell Jeremiah this!

the original writings of JOSEPHUS FLAVIUS are in the VATICAN VAULT--------no reputable scholar denies the fact
that they were-----subjected to TAMPERING.

 

[Indeependent]

Mormons.are.absolutely Christians, and saved as far.as I know. My dad's ppl were mormons...my granma had the book of.mormon and a bible by her rocking chair, and read in them every day, till the day she died.

oh good----you know------I can ask questions? What did that
GIST OF THE NT mean?

The Mormon site does explain the statement.

 

[tyroneweaver]

Really you don't see a connection between Paul and Josephus, both Pharisees , both shipwrecked, both from prominent families, one a slave turned freedman, one keeps calling himself a slave and tells you how to be a good slave, both very learned and wrote Greek. One killing Romans and the others killing Christians (gentiles) before one is capture and the other seen a vision. Both kept in chains in Caesarea. Paul becomes a slave of Christ (Jesus). Both become traitors of the Jews.


(Josephus goes on and who does this remind you of, Jesus)
(Note below 3 crucified and one survived)

I am not debating whether there is a creator, but the rapture is not happening, the world may be destroyed by man, we may have a huge flooding in the future, but Jesus is not coming in the clouds to fight a war, the end times might be aliens who come and destroy us, who knows.

The rapture happened with destruction of the temple in Jerusalem, a result of the civil war between sects of Jews,
remember Jesus warned,
A house divided can not stand. (by this he meant a country).

That is quite a stretch of imagination.

Penelope's interpretation of the events of the first century AD is -----CATECHISM primed-------it is utter nonsense from top to bottom. I am really amused that she interprets Josephus
"WARS OF THE JEWS" as a chronicle of "JEWS KILLING EACH OTHER". Lots is KNOWN about Josephus-----as for
"traitor"----nope---not really. Paul left his own writings----
his claim to Pharisee is a bit idiotic. My own opinion is that much of that attributed to paul was---kinds FIXED by the minions of Constantine. Greek was the language of "scholarship" in those days-----especially for the romans and to a significant degree for the jews. It was kinda like French for 19 th century Brits and Russians. Every "lady and gentleman" was FLUENT. The consistent fact of the time is and was-----The Pharisees hated greeks when ASSYRIAN greeks were oppressing jews (see the book of MACCABEES in your hotel bible) The Pharisees (like Jesus) hated romans when the romans were oppressing jews (see New
Testament) Jews killing jews happened less than USA presidents were assassinated. The phenomenon was so rare that such events made it into the calendar

You overstate. The OT is full of Jews killing Jews, check Maccabees as one example, for messing around with non Jews and non Jewish beliefs.

Jewish auxiliary troop units were part of the Roman legions surrounding Jerusalem during the Temple revolt and helped pull down the Temple after the Romans won.

Wayne, the manager is first row, center.
The Deseret News - Google News Archive Search

??? I cannot access anything related give me a hint---
does you citation state that the holy "undergarments" of Jesus were found in Utah?

??? I have know idea what you're talking about.
But we have never believed so called undergarments of Jesus were found in Utah.