They beheaded that poor Korean...

[Gaebolg]

I guess the true number lies somewhere between what my source says and what the Pentagon says. Judging by their "no comment" on this subject that number is functionally zero.

I took a look at your source and it has obvious flaws and can't be counted as factual, which I assume you acknowledge based on your comment above. it was also interesting to note that the page listed pretty much all death in Iraq, not just civilian and it didn't appear to care which side did the killing, as it stated in the methodology that it was all pretty much our fault because we invaded (Im paraphrasing the methodology section). It was an interesting read but it didn't address what I had asked you to cite. What I wanted a source for was this quote:

Thousands upon thousands of Iraqi civilians have died slow agonizing deaths over periods of days, weeks, and months from infected burns and severed limbs as a result of U.S. bombing.

Where is the information coming from for that quote? Do you have another activist website that gives a list of the way Iraqi civilians died, how long they lived after sustaining injury, how much pain they were in and what was the cause of death (i.e. infection)?

Also, where is the perspective? With all the wars that have been fought, surely you can give me one war where there were fewer casualties when a country was invaded and toppled.

 

[HGROKIT]

Originally posted by menewa
You initially brought up Abu G in this thread. You believed that the media's airing of this controversy was what was responsible for the beheadings. But the one who holds ultimate responsibilty is the perpetrators of the crimes at the prison.
As for obssessing over proof. This is a nation of laws. For us to have good laws and a good Republic we need to obsess over truth, and truth stems from proof.

Originally posted by dilloduck
The ranks of the terrorists have been decimated. I think they are now desperately trying to shock any- pro Americans that may still be out there. Makes all the prison BS look a little tame doesn't it? I'm sure the human rights groups are right on top of this problem too. NOT

Won;t get much notice or air time after today, if at all. Our elite media even as of this morning when I was getting ready for work was still beatting that dead horse call Abu what?

__________________

Now - I did bring up the Abu G bullshit, and anyone with half a brain could tell I was being facitious in making a point about how this guys death will be forgotten. However, it typifies your ilk to take this, spin to your agenda and run with it like a chicken with its head cut off.

The you southpaws wonder why you don't get any respect!

That's my two cents worth plus and extra 25 cents for you to call and get a clue!

 

[JIHADTHIS]

Originally posted by coiler
OK...you guys play rough. You are going to make me go back and provide links to all the speeches given in the buildup to the war?You mean you haven't heard of Condi Rice's "mushroom cloud" and the C.I.A.'s aerial drones? Are you honestly trying to tell me you haven't heard the story about Bush's discredited Niger uranium claim? Have you heard about David Kay and his conclusion that there never were WMD in iraq and Colin Powell's mobile weapons labs of last summer that turned out to be mobile helium plants for weather balloons?

So is your above "point" that there were no WMD's in Iraq and that's what makes the war unjusitified?
(This theory has been debunked a kazillion times already)

As for no Iraqi link to 9/11...Do I have to find a link to George Bush's quote last fall when he publicly humiliated Dick Cheney by correcting what he said like a day earlier about Saddam Hussein supporting Al Qaeda terrorists?

See, you're watching too much al-CNN and al-MSNBC who have reported this wrong. There were links between Iraq & al-Quada. No one has ever said that because there is a link between the 2 that that means that Saddam is responsible for 9/11. Did you follow that?

Even if Bush hadn't of just reaffirmed a few days ago that Iraq was not behind 9/11 the issue of no WMD and no link to Al Qaeda has been in the news so much lately it's become almost a cliche.
Only someone living in a cave could say they haven't heard of these things. But if you need links and proof give me a little while to do some quick research.

Again, what are you proving? That Iraq had no WMD's? If so you're wasting your time and ours

 

[dilloduck]

Originally posted by coiler
Did you want credible numbers showing that the latest State Department report shows that worldwide terrorism is on the increase or numbers showing how many Iraqi civilians have been maimed and murdered?

Because if it's the later I can only send you the lastest estimates by world organizations like Amnesty International. Unfortunately the Bush administration by its own admission has failed to do an accurate accounting of Iraqi civilian losses which I'm sure I don't have to tell you is a violation (one of many) of international law.

Do they keep the stats on dead terrorists and wannbes too?

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by coiler
I took a few minutes there to review the U.S. Constitution. I can't find anything in there that says the United States should give ANY Nation ANY authority over us...whatever the hell that's supposed to mean.

You tell me. You spouted off about us defying other nations and these international rules of war. I just made you prove yourself wrong in your view that we must bow to them.

I also can't find anywhere in there where it says the role of the U.S. government is to attempt to excersize ANY control over ANY other government. I believe we are still occupying Iraq trying to install our form of government aren't we?

You are absolutely correct except for one thing. If Iraq directly makes an attempt at war or threatens us directly, we can go to war.

Actually the Constitutional powers are very limited in regards to the use of military force. The Constitution is very specific in stating that this force shall only be used to defend Americas borders.

No, it claims America's borders, and security of our nation are possible reasons. You only read one of the references.

I know George Bush did his best stretch to say he was somehow defending America by attacking Iraq but I think everyone knows better by now. There was no imminent danger to the U.S. from Iraq. There were no WMD (where's the PROOF?)

And there is the problem. Because we were not Constitutional or at least publically acknowledging a direct and imminent threat against American soil, the cause is ambiguous and vague. -Maybe even illegal. We just don't know.

BTW.....evidence of the weapons WAS found.

There are no links to Al Qaeda (there are more Al Qaeda terrorists living in the U.S. and our buddy Saudi Arabia right now than ever lived in Iraq).

I don't know who you get your info from, but you are WAY off.

This (Ahem!) war in Iraq has created generations of new terrorists that we will be hearing from for now on.

We can thank George Bush that this war on terror will last forever not in spite of his policies but because of them.

You obviously know nothing about islam.

 

[NightTrain]

Originally posted by coiler
Are you honestly trying to tell me you haven't heard the story about Bush's discredited Niger uranium claim?

You must mean the intelligence report that the British got suckered with and gave to us. Yep, they got conned by an Italian. Bad intel. It happens.

Have you heard about David Kay and his conclusion that there never were WMD in iraq

Wrong.

Research what Kay did say and get back to us. I think you'll be surprised at what Kay did say.


I still can't get over your 'humanely beheaded' bit... that's a truly disturbing point of view.

 

[MtnBiker]

Holy crap, colier is wishing he hadn't logged off. There is a lot to answer to!

 

[Annie]

Originally posted by MtnBiker
Holy crap, colier is wishing he hadn't logged off. There is a lot to answer to!

Actually I was wondering if coiler will come back?

 

[Gaebolg]

Holy crap, colier is wishing he hadn't logged off. There is a lot to answer to!

That happens when you rant, it's understandable as I sometimes feel like just ranting too but I bite my tongue because I don't want to just throw stuff out there that I believe to be true, that I can't prove. If you can't prove what you present as fact, it's really just a theory or a religion... or propaganda.

 

[pegwinn]

Coiler m'boy, I guess I am coming in here a bit late. You seem to've taken the initial ass whuppin pretty well.

Just to reiterate, I saw the nick berg vid. He wasn't beheaded in the "Hassan Chop" or Guillotine sort of way.

THEY SAWED HIS FREAKING HEAD OFF

HUMANE? Dude, we need to talk.

 

[Annie]

Originally posted by pegwinn
Coiler m'boy, I guess I am coming in here a bit late. You seem to've taken the initial ass whuppin pretty well.

Just to reiterate, I saw the nick berg vid. He wasn't beheaded in the "Hassan Chop" or Guillotine sort of way.

THEY SAWED HIS FREAKING HEAD OFF

HUMANE? Dude, we need to talk.

 

[Avatar4321]

Originally posted by coiler
At least these beheaded hostages are dying relatively quickly and humanely.

I wonder on what planet having a man repeatedly chopping your neck with a dull blade is quick and in any way humanely.

 

[Gaebolg]

I wonder on what planet having a man repeatedly chopping your neck with a dull blade is quick and in any way humanely.

Well, I know for a fact that the left doesn't agree with him about it being humane. They couldn't possibly believe that and argue time after time in court that lethal injections are inhumane.

 

[nycflasher]

Originally posted by Gaebolg
Well, I know for a fact that the left doesn't agree with him about it being humane. They couldn't possibly believe that and argue time after time in court that lethal injections are inhumane.

Is there a point in there?
I don't think taht the inhumanity of cutting off someone's head is a partisan issue.

 

[Avatar4321]

Originally posted by HGROKIT
NO - our obsession with Abu whatever is what is giving the terrorists a leg up so to speak. All the freakin' left is so worried about how we look to the world about the prison BS they can't think beyonbd thier wet pants to take some proactive action and go over and kick some ass once and for all.

WE ARE apart from the "violent, brutal anarchists". We do not need any defunct world bleeding heart organization to validate that point!!!!

Enough of all this panty waist talk.

Yeah, I'm pissed.

I think you have a good reason to be pissed. we are trying to defend our civilization from being wiped from existance and the Left is obsessing over prison abuses that 1)were taken care of when found out. 2)Not a news story till the press got pictures despite knowing of it for months 3)that the Iraqis dont really care about. I mean come on you live under Saddam for thirty years do you really care of some terrorists are paraded around naked in one prison out of many?

We are the ones who were attacked. Its us and our allies who are watching our citizens get their heads chopped off. We wouldnt be fighting them if they would leave us alone. There is no justification for their attempt at genecide. and the Lefts obsession with this non issue is weakening the country.

 

[Avatar4321]

Originally posted by coiler
I guess the true number lies somewhere between what my source says and what the Pentagon says. Judging by their "no comment" on this subject that number is functionally zero.

Oh of course naturally. cant believe what the pentagon says. I mean they are only the ones who keep the records of everything that happens with the military. but hey they are obviously lying.

 

[Gaebolg]

Is there a point in there?
I don't think taht the inhumanity of cutting off someone's head is a partisan issue.

Talk to the liberal that tried to justify it in the below quote. It's pretty obvious to anyone paying attention that he is making the humanity of beheading a partisan issue... even if it is "relative" and what he compares it to unsubstantiated by fact.

At least these beheaded hostages are dying relatively quickly and humanely. Thousands upon thousands of Iraqi civilians have died slow agonizing deaths over periods of days, weeks, and months from infected burns and severed limbs as a result of U.S. bombing.

 

[Avatar4321]

Originally posted by coiler
As for no Iraqi link to 9/11...Do I have to find a link to George Bush's quote last fall when he publicly humiliated Dick Cheney by correcting what he said like a day earlier about Saddam Hussein supporting Al Qaeda terrorists?

Im going to say this for the thousanth time. Ill say it nice and slowly so everyone can understand... No one every claimed that Iraq was involved in 911!

What about that is so hard to frickin figure out by you people on the left.

 

[Yurt]

I think someone mentioned something like this a few posts ago, however, I would like to bolster the viewpoint that when you count "civilian" iraqi deaths, how many are actually civilians. It seems to me, everytime we bomb a target/house/etc in iraq, the iraqis all claim that they were civilians. Come on, there are collateral innocents in every war, but every time? The difficult thing is, we destroyed their "identifiable military." They now wear no uniforms so that we may distinguish between civilian and military. A good military tactic on their part, but they can not complain about accidents either. And I am sure our intel is not wrong that often.

 

[Avatar4321]

Originally posted by nycflasher
Menewa, those that perpetrated crimes at Abu are responsible for the recent beheadings?

I think not. At least...you can't prove that. So why say it?
These sick fucks kill Americans, Koreans, etc. for chuckles. Or for virgins. Or because Bob parked his Humvee too close to Mecca. Come on. Stop trying to blame Americans for these vicious acts. Have some sympathy for Americans over there in harms way.

Holy crap a Kerry supporter gets it!