They don't make Republican consevatives like they used to

[Oldstyle]

I've always been a proponent of across the board cuts phased into effect. I do so for two reasons. First, I think there is so much waste in the Federal Government that there isn't an agency or program that couldn't save huge amounts of tax payer money if they were FORCED to do so. Secondly, I think if everyone has skin in the game...defense...social programs...etc...etc...then nobody can whine about the cuts being one sided.

Bottom line is this...we elect these people...and we are solely to blame if we don't have enough common sense to realize that someone's blowing smoke up our shorts when they make promises that are unfulfillable.

How is it a lefty like me, and I'm typical but a bit moderate...can agree with a righty like you?

I'll tell you.

Throughout our dialog we peeled away the layers of misconceptions that our respective political influences have created, and found we fundamentally agree on a desired outcome...if not the process as well.

I'm a fiscal conservative, Toxic but I'm a results driven realist at heart. You're a "lefty" but you're also a realist. Common sense solutions are there to make things better for the country...it's time we elected people that understand that and get rid of the ones that don't.

I guess that's where we dissagree....I get the impression you think Republicans will actually do that this time around. Or possibly they are more likely then Democrats to do so?.....correct me if I'm wrong.

I don't think the GOP, DNC, or the Tea Party will.

Then they fail to act at their own peril, Toxic.

Would you agree with me that the #1 goal of our members of Congress is to get reelected? God knows they don't want to have to go back to having a REAL job! The voters may have actually started to send the message that they might not send their reps back to Washington if they don't stop being so dysfunctional. I don't know as the "blame game" is going to work like it has in the past. That is especially true for Republicans. The remaining Democrats are ensconced on the two very liberal coasts and what's left of the Rust Belt. I have more doubts about them being willing to compromise than the GOP at this point simply because they feel "safer" in their districts. As I said before...as long as we keep sending people to Washington that are dysfunctional then we're going to keep getting the same result.

Agreed...but I'm not confident that any candidates currently running will do what needs to be done.

On a tangent...I'm always annoyed when new networks show colored maps of counties across the US, by red and blue counties. It is decieving in that there is so much red, as opposed to blue. It gives the impression of overwhelming support for red states (the GOP), and blue states (the DNC). That reinforces my opinion that the electoral college is obsolete. The logistical disadvantages of being rural in relation to the seats of power in Washington, and the prospect of newly forming states forming thier own independent countries...no longer exist. There remains no reason for 1 person in Montana to have a vote weighted equally to 30 Californians

Other than the fact that most people in Montana have a lot more common sense than most people in California do? (Just kidding...sort of...)

The Founding Fathers came up with the electoral college because they didn't want an excess of power to lie with big cities at the expense of people who live in rural areas. Quite frankly I'm OK with that even though I'm from one of those urban areas. It isn't farmers that are getting this country into trouble. They get up and go to work each and every day just as they always have. All they're really asking is that you don't impose the views of someone living in San Francisco or New York City on them.

 

[Oldstyle]

The reason I'm more concerned about the Democrats willingness to "deal" is simply because they are led by a second term, lame duck President who seems to base most of his policies on a rather dogmatic agenda that isn't based in what will really work. Like I said before...it helps to have skin in the game and quite frankly President Obama has little at this point. The only thing that might prompt him to compromise would be if he was concerned about his legacy in office.

That ship sailed several years ago when he discovered the repugs were serious when they promised to ruin his presidency.

I'm pretty certain Obama is just waiting till he is far less in the public eye so he can start his own campaign to ruin a few republicans lives.

If he was me I would be all about the vengence. No doubt he has access to every scrap of dirt on these useless fucks and is just waiting for a time when he can use it.

I hate to break this to you, Huggy but Barack Obama is pretty much just running out the string at this point. He's a lame duck President who even a lot of his own Parties reps don't want to be seen to be too close to. He can choose to govern with Executive Actions for the next two years and totally blow up Washington...or he can admit that his agenda isn't what the electorate wanted and keep his veto pen in the top drawer of his desk while he works with the GOP on things they do agree on. Vengeance? For what exactly? He came into office with big majorities and slapped the GOP down hard those first two years. Then the mid-terms changed everything. From that point on Harry Reid was the guy obstructing the wishes of the American people...not the GOP.

 

[toxicmedia]

How is it a lefty like me, and I'm typical but a bit moderate...can agree with a righty like you?

I'll tell you.

Throughout our dialog we peeled away the layers of misconceptions that our respective political influences have created, and found we fundamentally agree on a desired outcome...if not the process as well.

I'm a fiscal conservative, Toxic but I'm a results driven realist at heart. You're a "lefty" but you're also a realist. Common sense solutions are there to make things better for the country...it's time we elected people that understand that and get rid of the ones that don't.

I guess that's where we dissagree....I get the impression you think Republicans will actually do that this time around. Or possibly they are more likely then Democrats to do so?.....correct me if I'm wrong.

I don't think the GOP, DNC, or the Tea Party will.

Then they fail to act at their own peril, Toxic.

Would you agree with me that the #1 goal of our members of Congress is to get reelected? God knows they don't want to have to go back to having a REAL job! The voters may have actually started to send the message that they might not send their reps back to Washington if they don't stop being so dysfunctional. I don't know as the "blame game" is going to work like it has in the past. That is especially true for Republicans. The remaining Democrats are ensconced on the two very liberal coasts and what's left of the Rust Belt. I have more doubts about them being willing to compromise than the GOP at this point simply because they feel "safer" in their districts. As I said before...as long as we keep sending people to Washington that are dysfunctional then we're going to keep getting the same result.

Agreed...but I'm not confident that any candidates currently running will do what needs to be done.

On a tangent...I'm always annoyed when new networks show colored maps of counties across the US, by red and blue counties. It is decieving in that there is so much red, as opposed to blue. It gives the impression of overwhelming support for red states (the GOP), and blue states (the DNC). That reinforces my opinion that the electoral college is obsolete. The logistical disadvantages of being rural in relation to the seats of power in Washington, and the prospect of newly forming states forming thier own independent countries...no longer exist. There remains no reason for 1 person in Montana to have a vote weighted equally to 30 Californians

Other than the fact that most people in Montana have a lot more common sense than most people in California do? (Just kidding...sort of...)

The Founding Fathers came up with the electoral college because they didn't want an excess of power to lie with big cities at the expense of people who live in rural areas. Quite frankly I'm OK with that even though I'm from one of those urban areas. It isn't farmers that are getting this country into trouble. They get up and go to work each and every day just as they always have. All they're really asking is that you don't impose the views of someone living in San Francisco or New York City on them.

Well...it's a statistical likelyhood that a few in any random group of 1,000 people in San Francisco, will misbehave, and wind up on the news before the one good old boy in Montana, who has to be self reliant to survive.

But that doesn't mean the ground the good old boy stands on should give him a vote equivalent to those 1000 San Franciscans, and the poorly mannered amongst them.

The senate is enough, and I'm tired of my vote meaning absolutely nothing. People in VA, OH, IA, and NC seem to pick the president all the time, and the elections are won by the time I get off work to vote!

 

[HUGGY]

The reason I'm more concerned about the Democrats willingness to "deal" is simply because they are led by a second term, lame duck President who seems to base most of his policies on a rather dogmatic agenda that isn't based in what will really work. Like I said before...it helps to have skin in the game and quite frankly President Obama has little at this point. The only thing that might prompt him to compromise would be if he was concerned about his legacy in office.

That ship sailed several years ago when he discovered the repugs were serious when they promised to ruin his presidency.

I'm pretty certain Obama is just waiting till he is far less in the public eye so he can start his own campaign to ruin a few republicans lives.

If he was me I would be all about the vengence. No doubt he has access to every scrap of dirt on these useless fucks and is just waiting for a time when he can use it.

I hate to break this to you, Huggy but Barack Obama is pretty much just running out the string at this point. He's a lame duck President who even a lot of his own Parties reps don't want to be seen to be too close to. He can choose to govern with Executive Actions for the next two years and totally blow up Washington...or he can admit that his agenda isn't what the electorate wanted and keep his veto pen in the top drawer of his desk while he works with the GOP on things they do agree on. Vengeance? For what exactly? He came into office with big majorities and slapped the GOP down hard those first two years. Then the mid-terms changed everything. From that point on Harry Reid was the guy obstructing the wishes of the American people...not the GOP.

Nonsense. The "electorite" made their choice when they elected Obama twice. The republicans took that right away from the public and just kept telling anyone that would hold a microphone in front of their foul mouths that Obama was the personal representative of satan on earth. They lied and made up lies and told those lies. They have been working 24/7/365 by 5 years doing nothing but following through on their promise to ruin Obama's presidency and any chance that America would have any usefull legislation in the off chance it would make Obama look good. This has been a display of the most arrogant missuse of elected power the world has witnessed since Hitler and his henchmen stole the German government.

The reason the democrats don't want to align themselves with Obama is not for anything that he has done or not done. They simply fear the republican dissinformation machine and do not want to get in their sights.

The evil POS's that are the republican leadership have poisoned the well. They have made it impossible to govern. They have not just ignored the publics decision to give Obama the opportunity to do what he said he would before he was elected they turned everything he did into shit in every way they could think of. The only reason they didn't arrange to have Obama assasinated is that they didn't have a Lynden Johnson in the wings to replace him. I have no doubt they considered trying to get Obama and the vice president in a vulnerable place together so they could do the deed.

IMHO the recent and ongoing attempts to get a person over the White House fence and into the White House are just dry runs getting information on how hard it would be to get to Obama off gaurd in a helpless position. The hapless Secret Service seem comical in how inept and ineffective their performance has been what with the whores in Colombia to the female SS agent being what stood between Obama and the recent invader. The scorecard on that attack was stunning. If I was Obama I would be packing 24/7 with multiple clips.

Even the American public has been worn out by the constant media blitz that the repugs have beseiged us with. Their only answer to any question is that Obama is at fault. They accept absolutely no responsibility for the lack of effectiveness of government.

Your statement "his agenda isn't what the electorate wanted" is a bald faced lie. Piss on you for carrying the lying sacks of liquid shit's water.

The American electorite knew exactly what they wanted and they were denied that by your slimy heros. They are just mad that Obama has not been able to do what he said. They don't know why and they are not educated enough in the proccess to understand the nuts and bolts of the failure.

I was born a proud republican from a proud republican family. Now after 50 years plus of watching the internal rot and destruction that has all changed. It took Johnson(southern dem actually a false republican) and Nixon and Reagan and Bush one and the false dem Clinton and Bush II to ruin our country but that's what they did. I am worn out with the lies and the stealing of treasury and lives of our youngest and best with the illegal wars and the illegal alliances with counties like Israel and the theft of our choices and giving those choices to a wealthy few(Murdoch, Cheney, Waltons, The Banks that stole multi billions...nay TRILLIONS!!! just before Obama took office...etc...). This transformation has a name and it is fascism. It is what the GOP has become and it is now neither Grand nor is it the party of Old. It is a party of theives and liars on a scale never seen in human history. I am glad only that my grand parents and my own father and mother are not alive to see what they once loved has become.

I hope Obama has kept a huge and detailed black book on these monsters you call friends. I hope to all that matters he takes this information and makes your insideous co conspirators choke on their missdeeds.

 

[Conservative65]

These guys would be drummed out of the GOP is they said things like this today.

Should any political party attempt to abolish social security, unemployment insurance, and eliminate labor laws and farm programs, you would not hear of that party again in our political history.
Dwight D. Eisenhower

Mark my word, if and when these preachers get control of the [Republican] party, and they're sure trying to do so, it's going to be a terrible damn problem. Frankly, these people frighten me. Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise. I know, I've tried to deal with them."
Barry Goldwater

One can't doubt that the American objective in Iraq has failed - different plans have to be made. And the kernal here is the acknowlegement of defeat.
William F Buckley

Freedom is an indivisible word. If we want to enjoy it, and fight for it, we must be prepared to extend it to everyone, whether they are rich or poor, whether they agree with us or not, no matter what their race or the color of their skin
Wendell Willkie

People like this say all sorts of things and the Democrat party holds them to the highest standards:

“I’ll have those ******* voting Democratic for the next 200 years.” - Lyndon Baines Johnson about the Great Society plan.
"You cannot go to a 7-11 or Dunkin Donuts unless you have a slight Indian Accent." -Senator Joe Biden
"You'd find these potentates from down in Africa, you know, rather than eating each other, they'd just come up and get a good square meal in Geneva." -- Fritz Hollings (D, S.C.)
"You f*cking Jew b@stard." -- Hillary Clinton to political operative Paul Fray. This was revealed in "State of a Union: Inside the Complex Marriage of Bill and Hillary Clinton" and has been verified by Paul Fray and three witnesses.

There are plenty more if you're willing to read them.

 

[HUGGY]

These guys would be drummed out of the GOP is they said things like this today.

Should any political party attempt to abolish social security, unemployment insurance, and eliminate labor laws and farm programs, you would not hear of that party again in our political history.
Dwight D. Eisenhower

Mark my word, if and when these preachers get control of the [Republican] party, and they're sure trying to do so, it's going to be a terrible damn problem. Frankly, these people frighten me. Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise. I know, I've tried to deal with them."
Barry Goldwater

One can't doubt that the American objective in Iraq has failed - different plans have to be made. And the kernal here is the acknowlegement of defeat.
William F Buckley

Freedom is an indivisible word. If we want to enjoy it, and fight for it, we must be prepared to extend it to everyone, whether they are rich or poor, whether they agree with us or not, no matter what their race or the color of their skin
Wendell Willkie

People like this say all sorts of things and the Democrat party holds them to the highest standards:

“I’ll have those ******* voting Democratic for the next 200 years.” - Lyndon Baines Johnson about the Great Society plan.
"You cannot go to a 7-11 or Dunkin Donuts unless you have a slight Indian Accent." -Senator Joe Biden
"You'd find these potentates from down in Africa, you know, rather than eating each other, they'd just come up and get a good square meal in Geneva." -- Fritz Hollings (D, S.C.)
"You f*cking Jew b@stard." -- Hillary Clinton to political operative Paul Fray. This was revealed in "State of a Union: Inside the Complex Marriage of Bill and Hillary Clinton" and has been verified by Paul Fray and three witnesses.

There are plenty more if you're willing to read them.

Thank you...Clinton's stock just went up in my book. The fyucking Jew Bastards have been medling in our country and it's foreign affairs for far too long. If she got elected and all she did was kick Israel to the curb she would have done more for this country than the last 8 presidents all put together.

 

[Oldstyle]

I'm a fiscal conservative, Toxic but I'm a results driven realist at heart. You're a "lefty" but you're also a realist. Common sense solutions are there to make things better for the country...it's time we elected people that understand that and get rid of the ones that don't.

I guess that's where we dissagree....I get the impression you think Republicans will actually do that this time around. Or possibly they are more likely then Democrats to do so?.....correct me if I'm wrong.

I don't think the GOP, DNC, or the Tea Party will.

Then they fail to act at their own peril, Toxic.

Would you agree with me that the #1 goal of our members of Congress is to get reelected? God knows they don't want to have to go back to having a REAL job! The voters may have actually started to send the message that they might not send their reps back to Washington if they don't stop being so dysfunctional. I don't know as the "blame game" is going to work like it has in the past. That is especially true for Republicans. The remaining Democrats are ensconced on the two very liberal coasts and what's left of the Rust Belt. I have more doubts about them being willing to compromise than the GOP at this point simply because they feel "safer" in their districts. As I said before...as long as we keep sending people to Washington that are dysfunctional then we're going to keep getting the same result.

Agreed...but I'm not confident that any candidates currently running will do what needs to be done.

On a tangent...I'm always annoyed when new networks show colored maps of counties across the US, by red and blue counties. It is decieving in that there is so much red, as opposed to blue. It gives the impression of overwhelming support for red states (the GOP), and blue states (the DNC). That reinforces my opinion that the electoral college is obsolete. The logistical disadvantages of being rural in relation to the seats of power in Washington, and the prospect of newly forming states forming thier own independent countries...no longer exist. There remains no reason for 1 person in Montana to have a vote weighted equally to 30 Californians

Other than the fact that most people in Montana have a lot more common sense than most people in California do? (Just kidding...sort of...)

The Founding Fathers came up with the electoral college because they didn't want an excess of power to lie with big cities at the expense of people who live in rural areas. Quite frankly I'm OK with that even though I'm from one of those urban areas. It isn't farmers that are getting this country into trouble. They get up and go to work each and every day just as they always have. All they're really asking is that you don't impose the views of someone living in San Francisco or New York City on them.

Well...it's a statistical likelyhood that a few in any random group of 1,000 people in San Francisco, will misbehave, and wind up on the news before the one good old boy in Montana, who has to be self reliant to survive.

But that doesn't mean the ground the good old boy stands on should give him a vote equivalent to those 1000 San Franciscans, and the poorly mannered amongst them.

The senate is enough, and I'm tired of my vote meaning absolutely nothing. People in VA, OH, IA, and NC seem to pick the president all the time, and the elections are won by the time I get off work to vote!

Sounds like you should move to Montana where your vote will equal 1000 where you are now.

 

[Oldstyle]

The reason I'm more concerned about the Democrats willingness to "deal" is simply because they are led by a second term, lame duck President who seems to base most of his policies on a rather dogmatic agenda that isn't based in what will really work. Like I said before...it helps to have skin in the game and quite frankly President Obama has little at this point. The only thing that might prompt him to compromise would be if he was concerned about his legacy in office.

That ship sailed several years ago when he discovered the repugs were serious when they promised to ruin his presidency.

I'm pretty certain Obama is just waiting till he is far less in the public eye so he can start his own campaign to ruin a few republicans lives.

If he was me I would be all about the vengence. No doubt he has access to every scrap of dirt on these useless fucks and is just waiting for a time when he can use it.

I hate to break this to you, Huggy but Barack Obama is pretty much just running out the string at this point. He's a lame duck President who even a lot of his own Parties reps don't want to be seen to be too close to. He can choose to govern with Executive Actions for the next two years and totally blow up Washington...or he can admit that his agenda isn't what the electorate wanted and keep his veto pen in the top drawer of his desk while he works with the GOP on things they do agree on. Vengeance? For what exactly? He came into office with big majorities and slapped the GOP down hard those first two years. Then the mid-terms changed everything. From that point on Harry Reid was the guy obstructing the wishes of the American people...not the GOP.

Nonsense. The "electorite" made their choice when they elected Obama twice. The republicans took that right away from the public and just kept telling anyone that would hold a microphone in front of their foul mouths that Obama was the personal representative of satan on earth. They lied and made up lies and told those lies. They have been working 24/7/365 by 5 years doing nothing but following through on their promise to ruin Obama's presidency and any chance that America would have any usefull legislation in the off chance it would make Obama look good. This has been a display of the most arrogant missuse of elected power the world has witnessed since Hitler and his henchmen stole the German government.

The reason the democrats don't want to align themselves with Obama is not for anything that he has done or not done. They simply fear the republican dissinformation machine and do not want to get in their sights.

The evil POS's that are the republican leadership have poisoned the well. They have made it impossible to govern. They have not just ignored the publics decision to give Obama the opportunity to do what he said he would before he was elected they turned everything he did into shit in every way they could think of. The only reason they didn't arrange to have Obama assasinated is that they didn't have a Lynden Johnson in the wings to replace him. I have no doubt they considered trying to get Obama and the vice president in a vulnerable place together so they could do the deed.

IMHO the recent and ongoing attempts to get a person over the White House fence and into the White House are just dry runs getting information on how hard it would be to get to Obama off gaurd in a helpless position. The hapless Secret Service seem comical in how inept and ineffective their performance has been what with the whores in Colombia to the female SS agent being what stood between Obama and the recent invader. The scorecard on that attack was stunning. If I was Obama I would be packing 24/7 with multiple clips.

Even the American public has been worn out by the constant media blitz that the repugs have beseiged us with. Their only answer to any question is that Obama is at fault. They accept absolutely no responsibility for the lack of effectiveness of government.

Your statement "his agenda isn't what the electorate wanted" is a bald faced lie. Piss on you for carrying the lying sacks of liquid shit's water.

The American electorite knew exactly what they wanted and they were denied that by your slimy heros. They are just mad that Obama has not been able to do what he said. They don't know why and they are not educated enough in the proccess to understand the nuts and bolts of the failure.

I was born a proud republican from a proud republican family. Now after 50 years plus of watching the internal rot and destruction that has all changed. It took Johnson(southern dem actually a false republican) and Nixon and Reagan and Bush one and the false dem Clinton and Bush II to ruin our country but that's what they did. I am worn out with the lies and the stealing of treasury and lives of our youngest and best with the illegal wars and the illegal alliances with counties like Israel and the theft of our choices and giving those choices to a wealthy few(Murdoch, Cheney, Waltons, The Banks that stole multi billions...nay TRILLIONS!!! just before Obama took office...etc...). This transformation has a name and it is fascism. It is what the GOP has become and it is now neither Grand nor is it the party of Old. It is a party of theives and liars on a scale never seen in human history. I am glad only that my grand parents and my own father and mother are not alive to see what they once loved has become.

I hope Obama has kept a huge and detailed black book on these monsters you call friends. I hope to all that matters he takes this information and makes your insideous co conspirators choke on their missdeeds.

We don't elect Emperors here, Huggy. When one is elected President of the United States it's a position with power but it isn't absolute power. The Founding Fathers deliberately set things up so that the Congress and the Supreme Court would provide checks and balances to Presidential power. I know you don't LIKE that but it is what it is!

The reason that Democrats lost big in both 2010 and 2014 is that the electorate wasn't happy with the progressive agenda that was being shoved down their throats. I'm amused by your contention that America has been besieged by a negative Obama news blitz. The truth of the matter is that Barack Obama has been treated with kid gloves by the majority of the main stream media. His main critic has been Fox News...one television station among CBS, NBC, ABC, CNN, MSNBC, and Public Broadcasting stations that have given him nothing but love. It was Barack Obama who publicly declared that his policies WERE on the ballot this election. If we take him at his word then his policies took another shellacking.

 

[HUGGY]

The reason I'm more concerned about the Democrats willingness to "deal" is simply because they are led by a second term, lame duck President who seems to base most of his policies on a rather dogmatic agenda that isn't based in what will really work. Like I said before...it helps to have skin in the game and quite frankly President Obama has little at this point. The only thing that might prompt him to compromise would be if he was concerned about his legacy in office.

That ship sailed several years ago when he discovered the repugs were serious when they promised to ruin his presidency.

I'm pretty certain Obama is just waiting till he is far less in the public eye so he can start his own campaign to ruin a few republicans lives.

If he was me I would be all about the vengence. No doubt he has access to every scrap of dirt on these useless fucks and is just waiting for a time when he can use it.

I hate to break this to you, Huggy but Barack Obama is pretty much just running out the string at this point. He's a lame duck President who even a lot of his own Parties reps don't want to be seen to be too close to. He can choose to govern with Executive Actions for the next two years and totally blow up Washington...or he can admit that his agenda isn't what the electorate wanted and keep his veto pen in the top drawer of his desk while he works with the GOP on things they do agree on. Vengeance? For what exactly? He came into office with big majorities and slapped the GOP down hard those first two years. Then the mid-terms changed everything. From that point on Harry Reid was the guy obstructing the wishes of the American people...not the GOP.

Nonsense. The "electorite" made their choice when they elected Obama twice. The republicans took that right away from the public and just kept telling anyone that would hold a microphone in front of their foul mouths that Obama was the personal representative of satan on earth. They lied and made up lies and told those lies. They have been working 24/7/365 by 5 years doing nothing but following through on their promise to ruin Obama's presidency and any chance that America would have any usefull legislation in the off chance it would make Obama look good. This has been a display of the most arrogant missuse of elected power the world has witnessed since Hitler and his henchmen stole the German government.

The reason the democrats don't want to align themselves with Obama is not for anything that he has done or not done. They simply fear the republican dissinformation machine and do not want to get in their sights.

The evil POS's that are the republican leadership have poisoned the well. They have made it impossible to govern. They have not just ignored the publics decision to give Obama the opportunity to do what he said he would before he was elected they turned everything he did into shit in every way they could think of. The only reason they didn't arrange to have Obama assasinated is that they didn't have a Lynden Johnson in the wings to replace him. I have no doubt they considered trying to get Obama and the vice president in a vulnerable place together so they could do the deed.

IMHO the recent and ongoing attempts to get a person over the White House fence and into the White House are just dry runs getting information on how hard it would be to get to Obama off gaurd in a helpless position. The hapless Secret Service seem comical in how inept and ineffective their performance has been what with the whores in Colombia to the female SS agent being what stood between Obama and the recent invader. The scorecard on that attack was stunning. If I was Obama I would be packing 24/7 with multiple clips.

Even the American public has been worn out by the constant media blitz that the repugs have beseiged us with. Their only answer to any question is that Obama is at fault. They accept absolutely no responsibility for the lack of effectiveness of government.

Your statement "his agenda isn't what the electorate wanted" is a bald faced lie. Piss on you for carrying the lying sacks of liquid shit's water.

The American electorite knew exactly what they wanted and they were denied that by your slimy heros. They are just mad that Obama has not been able to do what he said. They don't know why and they are not educated enough in the proccess to understand the nuts and bolts of the failure.

I was born a proud republican from a proud republican family. Now after 50 years plus of watching the internal rot and destruction that has all changed. It took Johnson(southern dem actually a false republican) and Nixon and Reagan and Bush one and the false dem Clinton and Bush II to ruin our country but that's what they did. I am worn out with the lies and the stealing of treasury and lives of our youngest and best with the illegal wars and the illegal alliances with counties like Israel and the theft of our choices and giving those choices to a wealthy few(Murdoch, Cheney, Waltons, The Banks that stole multi billions...nay TRILLIONS!!! just before Obama took office...etc...). This transformation has a name and it is fascism. It is what the GOP has become and it is now neither Grand nor is it the party of Old. It is a party of theives and liars on a scale never seen in human history. I am glad only that my grand parents and my own father and mother are not alive to see what they once loved has become.

I hope Obama has kept a huge and detailed black book on these monsters you call friends. I hope to all that matters he takes this information and makes your insideous co conspirators choke on their missdeeds.

We don't elect Emperors here, Huggy. When one is elected President of the United States it's a position with power but it isn't absolute power. The Founding Fathers deliberately set things up so that the Congress and the Supreme Court would provide checks and balances to Presidential power. I know you don't LIKE that but it is what it is!

The reason that Democrats lost big in both 2010 and 2014 is that the electorate wasn't happy with the progressive agenda that was being shoved down their throats. I'm amused by your contention that America has been besieged by a negative Obama news blitz. The truth of the matter is that Barack Obama has been treated with kid gloves by the majority of the main stream media. His main critic has been Fox News...one television station among CBS, NBC, ABC, CNN, MSNBC, and Public Broadcasting stations that have given him nothing but love. It was Barack Obama who publicly declared that his policies WERE on the ballot this election. If we take him at his word then his policies took another shellacking.

You really need to sell your propaganda elsewhere. I was clear. You are not. I was not talking about the TV news organizations. Unless you are dumber than I give you credit you know exactly to whom I was refering about the forces in the GOP that promised they would ensure Obama failed. They represent the states where the home offices of the greedy bastards that run the largest HMO's reside. They have raped the citizens of this country for health care and put up more than a billion dollars trying to reverse Obama's attempt to make health care affordable for most Americans that were under insured or could not afford any health insurance at all. That is what most of this battle is about. Americans voted for Obama to let him do what he could to make healthcare available to all Americans. That is what he ran on. There was no hidden agenda. Only a subversive on the side of the wealthy feinds that have America by the throat in a battle to squeeze every last dime out of the publics health care system would be defending these POS's.

So I take it that you are NOT stupid...just a scumbag that is working on behalf of the monsters attempting to hold America hostage over it's health costs.

Stop trying to tell me nonsense and lies. I am in no mood for your subtrafuge.

 

[Conservative65]

These guys would be drummed out of the GOP is they said things like this today.

Should any political party attempt to abolish social security, unemployment insurance, and eliminate labor laws and farm programs, you would not hear of that party again in our political history.
Dwight D. Eisenhower

Mark my word, if and when these preachers get control of the [Republican] party, and they're sure trying to do so, it's going to be a terrible damn problem. Frankly, these people frighten me. Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise. I know, I've tried to deal with them."
Barry Goldwater

One can't doubt that the American objective in Iraq has failed - different plans have to be made. And the kernal here is the acknowlegement of defeat.
William F Buckley

Freedom is an indivisible word. If we want to enjoy it, and fight for it, we must be prepared to extend it to everyone, whether they are rich or poor, whether they agree with us or not, no matter what their race or the color of their skin
Wendell Willkie

People like this say all sorts of things and the Democrat party holds them to the highest standards:

“I’ll have those ******* voting Democratic for the next 200 years.” - Lyndon Baines Johnson about the Great Society plan.
"You cannot go to a 7-11 or Dunkin Donuts unless you have a slight Indian Accent." -Senator Joe Biden
"You'd find these potentates from down in Africa, you know, rather than eating each other, they'd just come up and get a good square meal in Geneva." -- Fritz Hollings (D, S.C.)
"You f*cking Jew b@stard." -- Hillary Clinton to political operative Paul Fray. This was revealed in "State of a Union: Inside the Complex Marriage of Bill and Hillary Clinton" and has been verified by Paul Fray and three witnesses.

There are plenty more if you're willing to read them.

Thank you...Clinton's stock just went up in my book. The fyucking Jew Bastards have been medling in our country and it's foreign affairs for far too long. If she got elected and all she did was kick Israel to the curb she would have done more for this country than the last 8 presidents all put together.

So you're another one that will vote for her because she has a vagina. Got it.

 

[Oldstyle]

As for Obama keeping a black book on conservatives he's going to "get"? He's

The reason I'm more concerned about the Democrats willingness to "deal" is simply because they are led by a second term, lame duck President who seems to base most of his policies on a rather dogmatic agenda that isn't based in what will really work. Like I said before...it helps to have skin in the game and quite frankly President Obama has little at this point. The only thing that might prompt him to compromise would be if he was concerned about his legacy in office.

That ship sailed several years ago when he discovered the repugs were serious when they promised to ruin his presidency.

I'm pretty certain Obama is just waiting till he is far less in the public eye so he can start his own campaign to ruin a few republicans lives.

If he was me I would be all about the vengence. No doubt he has access to every scrap of dirt on these useless fucks and is just waiting for a time when he can use it.

I hate to break this to you, Huggy but Barack Obama is pretty much just running out the string at this point. He's a lame duck President who even a lot of his own Parties reps don't want to be seen to be too close to. He can choose to govern with Executive Actions for the next two years and totally blow up Washington...or he can admit that his agenda isn't what the electorate wanted and keep his veto pen in the top drawer of his desk while he works with the GOP on things they do agree on. Vengeance? For what exactly? He came into office with big majorities and slapped the GOP down hard those first two years. Then the mid-terms changed everything. From that point on Harry Reid was the guy obstructing the wishes of the American people...not the GOP.

Nonsense. The "electorite" made their choice when they elected Obama twice. The republicans took that right away from the public and just kept telling anyone that would hold a microphone in front of their foul mouths that Obama was the personal representative of satan on earth. They lied and made up lies and told those lies. They have been working 24/7/365 by 5 years doing nothing but following through on their promise to ruin Obama's presidency and any chance that America would have any usefull legislation in the off chance it would make Obama look good. This has been a display of the most arrogant missuse of elected power the world has witnessed since Hitler and his henchmen stole the German government.

The reason the democrats don't want to align themselves with Obama is not for anything that he has done or not done. They simply fear the republican dissinformation machine and do not want to get in their sights.

The evil POS's that are the republican leadership have poisoned the well. They have made it impossible to govern. They have not just ignored the publics decision to give Obama the opportunity to do what he said he would before he was elected they turned everything he did into shit in every way they could think of. The only reason they didn't arrange to have Obama assasinated is that they didn't have a Lynden Johnson in the wings to replace him. I have no doubt they considered trying to get Obama and the vice president in a vulnerable place together so they could do the deed.

IMHO the recent and ongoing attempts to get a person over the White House fence and into the White House are just dry runs getting information on how hard it would be to get to Obama off gaurd in a helpless position. The hapless Secret Service seem comical in how inept and ineffective their performance has been what with the whores in Colombia to the female SS agent being what stood between Obama and the recent invader. The scorecard on that attack was stunning. If I was Obama I would be packing 24/7 with multiple clips.

Even the American public has been worn out by the constant media blitz that the repugs have beseiged us with. Their only answer to any question is that Obama is at fault. They accept absolutely no responsibility for the lack of effectiveness of government.

Your statement "his agenda isn't what the electorate wanted" is a bald faced lie. Piss on you for carrying the lying sacks of liquid shit's water.

The American electorite knew exactly what they wanted and they were denied that by your slimy heros. They are just mad that Obama has not been able to do what he said. They don't know why and they are not educated enough in the proccess to understand the nuts and bolts of the failure.

I was born a proud republican from a proud republican family. Now after 50 years plus of watching the internal rot and destruction that has all changed. It took Johnson(southern dem actually a false republican) and Nixon and Reagan and Bush one and the false dem Clinton and Bush II to ruin our country but that's what they did. I am worn out with the lies and the stealing of treasury and lives of our youngest and best with the illegal wars and the illegal alliances with counties like Israel and the theft of our choices and giving those choices to a wealthy few(Murdoch, Cheney, Waltons, The Banks that stole multi billions...nay TRILLIONS!!! just before Obama took office...etc...). This transformation has a name and it is fascism. It is what the GOP has become and it is now neither Grand nor is it the party of Old. It is a party of theives and liars on a scale never seen in human history. I am glad only that my grand parents and my own father and mother are not alive to see what they once loved has become.

I hope Obama has kept a huge and detailed black book on these monsters you call friends. I hope to all that matters he takes this information and makes your insideous co conspirators choke on their missdeeds.

We don't elect Emperors here, Huggy. When one is elected President of the United States it's a position with power but it isn't absolute power. The Founding Fathers deliberately set things up so that the Congress and the Supreme Court would provide checks and balances to Presidential power. I know you don't LIKE that but it is what it is!

The reason that Democrats lost big in both 2010 and 2014 is that the electorate wasn't happy with the progressive agenda that was being shoved down their throats. I'm amused by your contention that America has been besieged by a negative Obama news blitz. The truth of the matter is that Barack Obama has been treated with kid gloves by the majority of the main stream media. His main critic has been Fox News...one television station among CBS, NBC, ABC, CNN, MSNBC, and Public Broadcasting stations that have given him nothing but love. It was Barack Obama who publicly declared that his policies WERE on the ballot this election. If we take him at his word then his policies took another shellacking.

You really need to sell your propaganda elsewhere. I was clear. You are not. I was not talking about the TV news organizations. Unless you are dumber than I give you credit you know exactly to whom I was refering about the forces in the GOP that promised they would ensure Obama failed. They represent the states where the home offices of the greedy bastards that run the largest HMO's reside. They have raped the citizens of this country for health care and put up more than a billion dollars trying to reverse Obama's attempt to make health care affordable for most Americans that were under insured or could not afford any health insurance at all. That is what most of this battle is about. Americans voted for Obama to let him do what he could to make healthcare available to all Americans. That is what he ran on. There was no hidden agenda. Only a subversive on the side of the wealthy feinds that have America by the throat in a battle to squeeze every last dime out of the publics health care system would be defending these POS's.

So I take it that you are NOT stupid...just a scumbag that is working on behalf of the monsters attempting to hold America hostage over it's health costs.

Stop trying to tell me nonsense and lies. I am in no mood for your subtrafuge.

Barack Obama RAN on promises that Americans would be able to keep their health care plans if they liked them...keep their doctors if they liked them...and if you were a Middle Class family...that the ACA would save you about $2,500 a year in healthcare costs. All of those things were lies...lies deliberately told by Barack Obama and progressives to convince Americans who desperately wanted healthcare reform that the ACA would lower their healthcare costs. The Gruber videos simply exposed that Obama and his minions didn't guess wrong on what the ACA would mean to the average American. Oh, no...Gruber's videos show that they knew EXACTLY what would happen to the healthcare costs of the average Middle Class American and lied their asses off about it because they wanted to take that first step towards government run healthcare.

You have the gall to accuse me of lying when all I've done is point out the lies told by the people you support? If I hadn't seen how clueless you are about most things to do with the ACA, I'd accuse you of being as dishonest as Barry and his little buddies like Gruber. I'm coming to the conclusion however that you're the exact person that Gruber is referring to when he talks about the stupidity of the American voter.

 

[toxicmedia]

As for Obama keeping a black book on conservatives he's going to "get"? He's

That ship sailed several years ago when he discovered the repugs were serious when they promised to ruin his presidency.

I'm pretty certain Obama is just waiting till he is far less in the public eye so he can start his own campaign to ruin a few republicans lives.

If he was me I would be all about the vengence. No doubt he has access to every scrap of dirt on these useless fucks and is just waiting for a time when he can use it.

I hate to break this to you, Huggy but Barack Obama is pretty much just running out the string at this point. He's a lame duck President who even a lot of his own Parties reps don't want to be seen to be too close to. He can choose to govern with Executive Actions for the next two years and totally blow up Washington...or he can admit that his agenda isn't what the electorate wanted and keep his veto pen in the top drawer of his desk while he works with the GOP on things they do agree on. Vengeance? For what exactly? He came into office with big majorities and slapped the GOP down hard those first two years. Then the mid-terms changed everything. From that point on Harry Reid was the guy obstructing the wishes of the American people...not the GOP.

Nonsense. The "electorite" made their choice when they elected Obama twice. The republicans took that right away from the public and just kept telling anyone that would hold a microphone in front of their foul mouths that Obama was the personal representative of satan on earth. They lied and made up lies and told those lies. They have been working 24/7/365 by 5 years doing nothing but following through on their promise to ruin Obama's presidency and any chance that America would have any usefull legislation in the off chance it would make Obama look good. This has been a display of the most arrogant missuse of elected power the world has witnessed since Hitler and his henchmen stole the German government.

The reason the democrats don't want to align themselves with Obama is not for anything that he has done or not done. They simply fear the republican dissinformation machine and do not want to get in their sights.

The evil POS's that are the republican leadership have poisoned the well. They have made it impossible to govern. They have not just ignored the publics decision to give Obama the opportunity to do what he said he would before he was elected they turned everything he did into shit in every way they could think of. The only reason they didn't arrange to have Obama assasinated is that they didn't have a Lynden Johnson in the wings to replace him. I have no doubt they considered trying to get Obama and the vice president in a vulnerable place together so they could do the deed.

IMHO the recent and ongoing attempts to get a person over the White House fence and into the White House are just dry runs getting information on how hard it would be to get to Obama off gaurd in a helpless position. The hapless Secret Service seem comical in how inept and ineffective their performance has been what with the whores in Colombia to the female SS agent being what stood between Obama and the recent invader. The scorecard on that attack was stunning. If I was Obama I would be packing 24/7 with multiple clips.

Even the American public has been worn out by the constant media blitz that the repugs have beseiged us with. Their only answer to any question is that Obama is at fault. They accept absolutely no responsibility for the lack of effectiveness of government.

Your statement "his agenda isn't what the electorate wanted" is a bald faced lie. Piss on you for carrying the lying sacks of liquid shit's water.

The American electorite knew exactly what they wanted and they were denied that by your slimy heros. They are just mad that Obama has not been able to do what he said. They don't know why and they are not educated enough in the proccess to understand the nuts and bolts of the failure.

I was born a proud republican from a proud republican family. Now after 50 years plus of watching the internal rot and destruction that has all changed. It took Johnson(southern dem actually a false republican) and Nixon and Reagan and Bush one and the false dem Clinton and Bush II to ruin our country but that's what they did. I am worn out with the lies and the stealing of treasury and lives of our youngest and best with the illegal wars and the illegal alliances with counties like Israel and the theft of our choices and giving those choices to a wealthy few(Murdoch, Cheney, Waltons, The Banks that stole multi billions...nay TRILLIONS!!! just before Obama took office...etc...). This transformation has a name and it is fascism. It is what the GOP has become and it is now neither Grand nor is it the party of Old. It is a party of theives and liars on a scale never seen in human history. I am glad only that my grand parents and my own father and mother are not alive to see what they once loved has become.

I hope Obama has kept a huge and detailed black book on these monsters you call friends. I hope to all that matters he takes this information and makes your insideous co conspirators choke on their missdeeds.

We don't elect Emperors here, Huggy. When one is elected President of the United States it's a position with power but it isn't absolute power. The Founding Fathers deliberately set things up so that the Congress and the Supreme Court would provide checks and balances to Presidential power. I know you don't LIKE that but it is what it is!

The reason that Democrats lost big in both 2010 and 2014 is that the electorate wasn't happy with the progressive agenda that was being shoved down their throats. I'm amused by your contention that America has been besieged by a negative Obama news blitz. The truth of the matter is that Barack Obama has been treated with kid gloves by the majority of the main stream media. His main critic has been Fox News...one television station among CBS, NBC, ABC, CNN, MSNBC, and Public Broadcasting stations that have given him nothing but love. It was Barack Obama who publicly declared that his policies WERE on the ballot this election. If we take him at his word then his policies took another shellacking.

You really need to sell your propaganda elsewhere. I was clear. You are not. I was not talking about the TV news organizations. Unless you are dumber than I give you credit you know exactly to whom I was refering about the forces in the GOP that promised they would ensure Obama failed. They represent the states where the home offices of the greedy bastards that run the largest HMO's reside. They have raped the citizens of this country for health care and put up more than a billion dollars trying to reverse Obama's attempt to make health care affordable for most Americans that were under insured or could not afford any health insurance at all. That is what most of this battle is about. Americans voted for Obama to let him do what he could to make healthcare available to all Americans. That is what he ran on. There was no hidden agenda. Only a subversive on the side of the wealthy feinds that have America by the throat in a battle to squeeze every last dime out of the publics health care system would be defending these POS's.

So I take it that you are NOT stupid...just a scumbag that is working on behalf of the monsters attempting to hold America hostage over it's health costs.

Stop trying to tell me nonsense and lies. I am in no mood for your subtrafuge.

Barack Obama RAN on promises that Americans would be able to keep their health care plans if they liked them...keep their doctors if they liked them...and if you were a Middle Class family...that the ACA would save you about $2,500 a year in healthcare costs. All of those things were lies...lies deliberately told by Barack Obama and progressives to convince Americans who desperately wanted healthcare reform that the ACA would lower their healthcare costs. The Gruber videos simply exposed that Obama and his minions didn't guess wrong on what the ACA would mean to the average American. Oh, no...Gruber's videos show that they knew EXACTLY what would happen to the healthcare costs of the average Middle Class American and lied their asses off about it because they wanted to take that first step towards government run healthcare.

You have the gall to accuse me of lying when all I've done is point out the lies told by the people you support? If I hadn't seen how clueless you are about most things to do with the ACA, I'd accuse you of being as dishonest as Barry and his little buddies like Gruber. I'm coming to the conclusion however that you're the exact person that Gruber is referring to when he talks about the stupidity of the American voter.

There are several aspects that get overlooked, and boiled down into talking points that create fasle and misleading impressions.

Obama screwed up when he prmised you'd get to keep your plan. He didn't stop to think that the 10 essential benefits that must be offered with health insurance policies would increase the cost, which causes, from an operational perspective, the insurance companies to add those benefits to existing plans, thus creating a new group ID# for those plans, which makes them NOT the same plan.

Not being able to keep thier doctors is 100% on the providers, and not the ACA. He didn't stop to think that providers would chose NOT to contract with the ACA plans, especially the HMO's. But there has to be more to it. Providers that accept Medicare aleady settle for around 75% reimbursement, and Medicaid about 25%!...the ACA plans run about 80%. I know of many doctors in the very red state I work with, won't take the ACA plans for political reasons. Many of the residents of this state, hate HMO's, and will only get PPO's. With the ACA PPO plans, there is no shortage of providers because it's fee for service, not capitation.

These HMO VS PPO contracting issues pre-date the ACA.

Whats happening is, by simplification, the GOP has been able to blame every new, systemic, and preexisting cost driver for medical insurance out of pocket costs on the ACA.

What you can't parse, and comprehend, without 1-2 years of training and education in how the industry works...is how much of these cost increases would still be there anyway without the ACA

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

The only religion I see fucking up our country is the "PC" religion.

 

[toxicmedia]

The only religion I see fucking up our country is the "PC" religion.

Regulating how people talk is not fucking up our country.

What IS fucking up our country, are politicans that need to cut social security, medicare, Obamacrae, defense spending, government worker pensions, and entitlements.

Nobody will, because they won't get elected if they propose it, or won't get reelected if they put into policy

 

[HUGGY]

These guys would be drummed out of the GOP is they said things like this today.

Should any political party attempt to abolish social security, unemployment insurance, and eliminate labor laws and farm programs, you would not hear of that party again in our political history.
Dwight D. Eisenhower

Mark my word, if and when these preachers get control of the [Republican] party, and they're sure trying to do so, it's going to be a terrible damn problem. Frankly, these people frighten me. Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise. I know, I've tried to deal with them."
Barry Goldwater

One can't doubt that the American objective in Iraq has failed - different plans have to be made. And the kernal here is the acknowlegement of defeat.
William F Buckley

Freedom is an indivisible word. If we want to enjoy it, and fight for it, we must be prepared to extend it to everyone, whether they are rich or poor, whether they agree with us or not, no matter what their race or the color of their skin
Wendell Willkie

People like this say all sorts of things and the Democrat party holds them to the highest standards:

“I’ll have those ******* voting Democratic for the next 200 years.” - Lyndon Baines Johnson about the Great Society plan.
"You cannot go to a 7-11 or Dunkin Donuts unless you have a slight Indian Accent." -Senator Joe Biden
"You'd find these potentates from down in Africa, you know, rather than eating each other, they'd just come up and get a good square meal in Geneva." -- Fritz Hollings (D, S.C.)
"You f*cking Jew b@stard." -- Hillary Clinton to political operative Paul Fray. This was revealed in "State of a Union: Inside the Complex Marriage of Bill and Hillary Clinton" and has been verified by Paul Fray and three witnesses.

There are plenty more if you're willing to read them.

Thank you...Clinton's stock just went up in my book. The fyucking Jew Bastards have been medling in our country and it's foreign affairs for far too long. If she got elected and all she did was kick Israel to the curb she would have done more for this country than the last 8 presidents all put together.

So you're another one that will vote for her because she has a vagina. Got it.

What an ignorant statement. No ..I will probably not vote. I just don't see the republican party doing anything responsible and Clinton's reported statement that indicated we need to divorce ourselves from alignments with Israel has merit.

 

[HUGGY]

As for Obama keeping a black book on conservatives he's going to "get"? He's

That ship sailed several years ago when he discovered the repugs were serious when they promised to ruin his presidency.

I'm pretty certain Obama is just waiting till he is far less in the public eye so he can start his own campaign to ruin a few republicans lives.

If he was me I would be all about the vengence. No doubt he has access to every scrap of dirt on these useless fucks and is just waiting for a time when he can use it.

I hate to break this to you, Huggy but Barack Obama is pretty much just running out the string at this point. He's a lame duck President who even a lot of his own Parties reps don't want to be seen to be too close to. He can choose to govern with Executive Actions for the next two years and totally blow up Washington...or he can admit that his agenda isn't what the electorate wanted and keep his veto pen in the top drawer of his desk while he works with the GOP on things they do agree on. Vengeance? For what exactly? He came into office with big majorities and slapped the GOP down hard those first two years. Then the mid-terms changed everything. From that point on Harry Reid was the guy obstructing the wishes of the American people...not the GOP.

Nonsense. The "electorite" made their choice when they elected Obama twice. The republicans took that right away from the public and just kept telling anyone that would hold a microphone in front of their foul mouths that Obama was the personal representative of satan on earth. They lied and made up lies and told those lies. They have been working 24/7/365 by 5 years doing nothing but following through on their promise to ruin Obama's presidency and any chance that America would have any usefull legislation in the off chance it would make Obama look good. This has been a display of the most arrogant missuse of elected power the world has witnessed since Hitler and his henchmen stole the German government.

The reason the democrats don't want to align themselves with Obama is not for anything that he has done or not done. They simply fear the republican dissinformation machine and do not want to get in their sights.

The evil POS's that are the republican leadership have poisoned the well. They have made it impossible to govern. They have not just ignored the publics decision to give Obama the opportunity to do what he said he would before he was elected they turned everything he did into shit in every way they could think of. The only reason they didn't arrange to have Obama assasinated is that they didn't have a Lynden Johnson in the wings to replace him. I have no doubt they considered trying to get Obama and the vice president in a vulnerable place together so they could do the deed.

IMHO the recent and ongoing attempts to get a person over the White House fence and into the White House are just dry runs getting information on how hard it would be to get to Obama off gaurd in a helpless position. The hapless Secret Service seem comical in how inept and ineffective their performance has been what with the whores in Colombia to the female SS agent being what stood between Obama and the recent invader. The scorecard on that attack was stunning. If I was Obama I would be packing 24/7 with multiple clips.

Even the American public has been worn out by the constant media blitz that the repugs have beseiged us with. Their only answer to any question is that Obama is at fault. They accept absolutely no responsibility for the lack of effectiveness of government.

Your statement "his agenda isn't what the electorate wanted" is a bald faced lie. Piss on you for carrying the lying sacks of liquid shit's water.

The American electorite knew exactly what they wanted and they were denied that by your slimy heros. They are just mad that Obama has not been able to do what he said. They don't know why and they are not educated enough in the proccess to understand the nuts and bolts of the failure.

I was born a proud republican from a proud republican family. Now after 50 years plus of watching the internal rot and destruction that has all changed. It took Johnson(southern dem actually a false republican) and Nixon and Reagan and Bush one and the false dem Clinton and Bush II to ruin our country but that's what they did. I am worn out with the lies and the stealing of treasury and lives of our youngest and best with the illegal wars and the illegal alliances with counties like Israel and the theft of our choices and giving those choices to a wealthy few(Murdoch, Cheney, Waltons, The Banks that stole multi billions...nay TRILLIONS!!! just before Obama took office...etc...). This transformation has a name and it is fascism. It is what the GOP has become and it is now neither Grand nor is it the party of Old. It is a party of theives and liars on a scale never seen in human history. I am glad only that my grand parents and my own father and mother are not alive to see what they once loved has become.

I hope Obama has kept a huge and detailed black book on these monsters you call friends. I hope to all that matters he takes this information and makes your insideous co conspirators choke on their missdeeds.

We don't elect Emperors here, Huggy. When one is elected President of the United States it's a position with power but it isn't absolute power. The Founding Fathers deliberately set things up so that the Congress and the Supreme Court would provide checks and balances to Presidential power. I know you don't LIKE that but it is what it is!

The reason that Democrats lost big in both 2010 and 2014 is that the electorate wasn't happy with the progressive agenda that was being shoved down their throats. I'm amused by your contention that America has been besieged by a negative Obama news blitz. The truth of the matter is that Barack Obama has been treated with kid gloves by the majority of the main stream media. His main critic has been Fox News...one television station among CBS, NBC, ABC, CNN, MSNBC, and Public Broadcasting stations that have given him nothing but love. It was Barack Obama who publicly declared that his policies WERE on the ballot this election. If we take him at his word then his policies took another shellacking.

You really need to sell your propaganda elsewhere. I was clear. You are not. I was not talking about the TV news organizations. Unless you are dumber than I give you credit you know exactly to whom I was refering about the forces in the GOP that promised they would ensure Obama failed. They represent the states where the home offices of the greedy bastards that run the largest HMO's reside. They have raped the citizens of this country for health care and put up more than a billion dollars trying to reverse Obama's attempt to make health care affordable for most Americans that were under insured or could not afford any health insurance at all. That is what most of this battle is about. Americans voted for Obama to let him do what he could to make healthcare available to all Americans. That is what he ran on. There was no hidden agenda. Only a subversive on the side of the wealthy feinds that have America by the throat in a battle to squeeze every last dime out of the publics health care system would be defending these POS's.

So I take it that you are NOT stupid...just a scumbag that is working on behalf of the monsters attempting to hold America hostage over it's health costs.

Stop trying to tell me nonsense and lies. I am in no mood for your subtrafuge.

Barack Obama RAN on promises that Americans would be able to keep their health care plans if they liked them...keep their doctors if they liked them...and if you were a Middle Class family...that the ACA would save you about $2,500 a year in healthcare costs. All of those things were lies...lies deliberately told by Barack Obama and progressives to convince Americans who desperately wanted healthcare reform that the ACA would lower their healthcare costs. The Gruber videos simply exposed that Obama and his minions didn't guess wrong on what the ACA would mean to the average American. Oh, no...Gruber's videos show that they knew EXACTLY what would happen to the healthcare costs of the average Middle Class American and lied their asses off about it because they wanted to take that first step towards government run healthcare.

You have the gall to accuse me of lying when all I've done is point out the lies told by the people you support? If I hadn't seen how clueless you are about most things to do with the ACA, I'd accuse you of being as dishonest as Barry and his little buddies like Gruber. I'm coming to the conclusion however that you're the exact person that Gruber is referring to when he talks about the stupidity of the American voter.

Obama's vision for health care reform was morphed by the HMO's and their representatives into what it is. As usual the psycophants that work in the shadows and lie in public have spoken again. I'm sure your job is thankless. Just because most of the people you communicate with are stupid is no gaurantee everyone is. I already said what I said. Your continued lying won't change the facts.

 

[Oldstyle]

As for Obama keeping a black book on conservatives he's going to "get"? He's

I hate to break this to you, Huggy but Barack Obama is pretty much just running out the string at this point. He's a lame duck President who even a lot of his own Parties reps don't want to be seen to be too close to. He can choose to govern with Executive Actions for the next two years and totally blow up Washington...or he can admit that his agenda isn't what the electorate wanted and keep his veto pen in the top drawer of his desk while he works with the GOP on things they do agree on. Vengeance? For what exactly? He came into office with big majorities and slapped the GOP down hard those first two years. Then the mid-terms changed everything. From that point on Harry Reid was the guy obstructing the wishes of the American people...not the GOP.

Nonsense. The "electorite" made their choice when they elected Obama twice. The republicans took that right away from the public and just kept telling anyone that would hold a microphone in front of their foul mouths that Obama was the personal representative of satan on earth. They lied and made up lies and told those lies. They have been working 24/7/365 by 5 years doing nothing but following through on their promise to ruin Obama's presidency and any chance that America would have any usefull legislation in the off chance it would make Obama look good. This has been a display of the most arrogant missuse of elected power the world has witnessed since Hitler and his henchmen stole the German government.

The reason the democrats don't want to align themselves with Obama is not for anything that he has done or not done. They simply fear the republican dissinformation machine and do not want to get in their sights.

The evil POS's that are the republican leadership have poisoned the well. They have made it impossible to govern. They have not just ignored the publics decision to give Obama the opportunity to do what he said he would before he was elected they turned everything he did into shit in every way they could think of. The only reason they didn't arrange to have Obama assasinated is that they didn't have a Lynden Johnson in the wings to replace him. I have no doubt they considered trying to get Obama and the vice president in a vulnerable place together so they could do the deed.

IMHO the recent and ongoing attempts to get a person over the White House fence and into the White House are just dry runs getting information on how hard it would be to get to Obama off gaurd in a helpless position. The hapless Secret Service seem comical in how inept and ineffective their performance has been what with the whores in Colombia to the female SS agent being what stood between Obama and the recent invader. The scorecard on that attack was stunning. If I was Obama I would be packing 24/7 with multiple clips.

Even the American public has been worn out by the constant media blitz that the repugs have beseiged us with. Their only answer to any question is that Obama is at fault. They accept absolutely no responsibility for the lack of effectiveness of government.

Your statement "his agenda isn't what the electorate wanted" is a bald faced lie. Piss on you for carrying the lying sacks of liquid shit's water.

The American electorite knew exactly what they wanted and they were denied that by your slimy heros. They are just mad that Obama has not been able to do what he said. They don't know why and they are not educated enough in the proccess to understand the nuts and bolts of the failure.

I was born a proud republican from a proud republican family. Now after 50 years plus of watching the internal rot and destruction that has all changed. It took Johnson(southern dem actually a false republican) and Nixon and Reagan and Bush one and the false dem Clinton and Bush II to ruin our country but that's what they did. I am worn out with the lies and the stealing of treasury and lives of our youngest and best with the illegal wars and the illegal alliances with counties like Israel and the theft of our choices and giving those choices to a wealthy few(Murdoch, Cheney, Waltons, The Banks that stole multi billions...nay TRILLIONS!!! just before Obama took office...etc...). This transformation has a name and it is fascism. It is what the GOP has become and it is now neither Grand nor is it the party of Old. It is a party of theives and liars on a scale never seen in human history. I am glad only that my grand parents and my own father and mother are not alive to see what they once loved has become.

I hope Obama has kept a huge and detailed black book on these monsters you call friends. I hope to all that matters he takes this information and makes your insideous co conspirators choke on their missdeeds.

We don't elect Emperors here, Huggy. When one is elected President of the United States it's a position with power but it isn't absolute power. The Founding Fathers deliberately set things up so that the Congress and the Supreme Court would provide checks and balances to Presidential power. I know you don't LIKE that but it is what it is!

The reason that Democrats lost big in both 2010 and 2014 is that the electorate wasn't happy with the progressive agenda that was being shoved down their throats. I'm amused by your contention that America has been besieged by a negative Obama news blitz. The truth of the matter is that Barack Obama has been treated with kid gloves by the majority of the main stream media. His main critic has been Fox News...one television station among CBS, NBC, ABC, CNN, MSNBC, and Public Broadcasting stations that have given him nothing but love. It was Barack Obama who publicly declared that his policies WERE on the ballot this election. If we take him at his word then his policies took another shellacking.

You really need to sell your propaganda elsewhere. I was clear. You are not. I was not talking about the TV news organizations. Unless you are dumber than I give you credit you know exactly to whom I was refering about the forces in the GOP that promised they would ensure Obama failed. They represent the states where the home offices of the greedy bastards that run the largest HMO's reside. They have raped the citizens of this country for health care and put up more than a billion dollars trying to reverse Obama's attempt to make health care affordable for most Americans that were under insured or could not afford any health insurance at all. That is what most of this battle is about. Americans voted for Obama to let him do what he could to make healthcare available to all Americans. That is what he ran on. There was no hidden agenda. Only a subversive on the side of the wealthy feinds that have America by the throat in a battle to squeeze every last dime out of the publics health care system would be defending these POS's.

So I take it that you are NOT stupid...just a scumbag that is working on behalf of the monsters attempting to hold America hostage over it's health costs.

Stop trying to tell me nonsense and lies. I am in no mood for your subtrafuge.

Barack Obama RAN on promises that Americans would be able to keep their health care plans if they liked them...keep their doctors if they liked them...and if you were a Middle Class family...that the ACA would save you about $2,500 a year in healthcare costs. All of those things were lies...lies deliberately told by Barack Obama and progressives to convince Americans who desperately wanted healthcare reform that the ACA would lower their healthcare costs. The Gruber videos simply exposed that Obama and his minions didn't guess wrong on what the ACA would mean to the average American. Oh, no...Gruber's videos show that they knew EXACTLY what would happen to the healthcare costs of the average Middle Class American and lied their asses off about it because they wanted to take that first step towards government run healthcare.

You have the gall to accuse me of lying when all I've done is point out the lies told by the people you support? If I hadn't seen how clueless you are about most things to do with the ACA, I'd accuse you of being as dishonest as Barry and his little buddies like Gruber. I'm coming to the conclusion however that you're the exact person that Gruber is referring to when he talks about the stupidity of the American voter.

There are several aspects that get overlooked, and boiled down into talking points that create fasle and misleading impressions.

Obama screwed up when he prmised you'd get to keep your plan. He didn't stop to think that the 10 essential benefits that must be offered with health insurance policies would increase the cost, which causes, from an operational perspective, the insurance companies to add those benefits to existing plans, thus creating a new group ID# for those plans, which makes them NOT the same plan.

Not being able to keep thier doctors is 100% on the providers, and not the ACA. He didn't stop to think that providers would chose NOT to contract with the ACA plans, especially the HMO's. But there has to be more to it. Providers that accept Medicare aleady settle for around 75% reimbursement, and Medicaid about 25%!...the ACA plans run about 80%. I know of many doctors in the very red state I work with, won't take the ACA plans for political reasons. Many of the residents of this state, hate HMO's, and will only get PPO's. With the ACA PPO plans, there is no shortage of providers because it's fee for service, not capitation.

These HMO VS PPO contracting issues pre-date the ACA.

Whats happening is, by simplification, the GOP has been able to blame every new, systemic, and preexisting cost driver for medical insurance out of pocket costs on the ACA.

What you can't parse, and comprehend, without 1-2 years of training and education in how the industry works...is how much of these cost increases would still be there anyway without the ACA

Kindly explain to me how it is that Barack Obama didn't grasp the same things that you claim are so self evident if you know anything about healthcare insurance? Are you telling me that his signature legislative achievement...something that profoundly affects one sixth of our economy...was written by people that understand less about healthcare and the insurance industry than you do and that he simply didn't understand what he was talking about?

It's hard to square THAT notion with the reality that this was something put together by people LIKE Gruber who have PhD's in that very subject. I'm sorry but this wasn't a "miscalculation" by progressives, Toxic...this was a very calculated plan to put something over on the American people because they felt that the "end" justified the "means".

 

[Oldstyle]

As for Obama keeping a black book on conservatives he's going to "get"? He's

I hate to break this to you, Huggy but Barack Obama is pretty much just running out the string at this point. He's a lame duck President who even a lot of his own Parties reps don't want to be seen to be too close to. He can choose to govern with Executive Actions for the next two years and totally blow up Washington...or he can admit that his agenda isn't what the electorate wanted and keep his veto pen in the top drawer of his desk while he works with the GOP on things they do agree on. Vengeance? For what exactly? He came into office with big majorities and slapped the GOP down hard those first two years. Then the mid-terms changed everything. From that point on Harry Reid was the guy obstructing the wishes of the American people...not the GOP.

Nonsense. The "electorite" made their choice when they elected Obama twice. The republicans took that right away from the public and just kept telling anyone that would hold a microphone in front of their foul mouths that Obama was the personal representative of satan on earth. They lied and made up lies and told those lies. They have been working 24/7/365 by 5 years doing nothing but following through on their promise to ruin Obama's presidency and any chance that America would have any usefull legislation in the off chance it would make Obama look good. This has been a display of the most arrogant missuse of elected power the world has witnessed since Hitler and his henchmen stole the German government.

The reason the democrats don't want to align themselves with Obama is not for anything that he has done or not done. They simply fear the republican dissinformation machine and do not want to get in their sights.

The evil POS's that are the republican leadership have poisoned the well. They have made it impossible to govern. They have not just ignored the publics decision to give Obama the opportunity to do what he said he would before he was elected they turned everything he did into shit in every way they could think of. The only reason they didn't arrange to have Obama assasinated is that they didn't have a Lynden Johnson in the wings to replace him. I have no doubt they considered trying to get Obama and the vice president in a vulnerable place together so they could do the deed.

IMHO the recent and ongoing attempts to get a person over the White House fence and into the White House are just dry runs getting information on how hard it would be to get to Obama off gaurd in a helpless position. The hapless Secret Service seem comical in how inept and ineffective their performance has been what with the whores in Colombia to the female SS agent being what stood between Obama and the recent invader. The scorecard on that attack was stunning. If I was Obama I would be packing 24/7 with multiple clips.

Even the American public has been worn out by the constant media blitz that the repugs have beseiged us with. Their only answer to any question is that Obama is at fault. They accept absolutely no responsibility for the lack of effectiveness of government.

Your statement "his agenda isn't what the electorate wanted" is a bald faced lie. Piss on you for carrying the lying sacks of liquid shit's water.

The American electorite knew exactly what they wanted and they were denied that by your slimy heros. They are just mad that Obama has not been able to do what he said. They don't know why and they are not educated enough in the proccess to understand the nuts and bolts of the failure.

I was born a proud republican from a proud republican family. Now after 50 years plus of watching the internal rot and destruction that has all changed. It took Johnson(southern dem actually a false republican) and Nixon and Reagan and Bush one and the false dem Clinton and Bush II to ruin our country but that's what they did. I am worn out with the lies and the stealing of treasury and lives of our youngest and best with the illegal wars and the illegal alliances with counties like Israel and the theft of our choices and giving those choices to a wealthy few(Murdoch, Cheney, Waltons, The Banks that stole multi billions...nay TRILLIONS!!! just before Obama took office...etc...). This transformation has a name and it is fascism. It is what the GOP has become and it is now neither Grand nor is it the party of Old. It is a party of theives and liars on a scale never seen in human history. I am glad only that my grand parents and my own father and mother are not alive to see what they once loved has become.

I hope Obama has kept a huge and detailed black book on these monsters you call friends. I hope to all that matters he takes this information and makes your insideous co conspirators choke on their missdeeds.

We don't elect Emperors here, Huggy. When one is elected President of the United States it's a position with power but it isn't absolute power. The Founding Fathers deliberately set things up so that the Congress and the Supreme Court would provide checks and balances to Presidential power. I know you don't LIKE that but it is what it is!

The reason that Democrats lost big in both 2010 and 2014 is that the electorate wasn't happy with the progressive agenda that was being shoved down their throats. I'm amused by your contention that America has been besieged by a negative Obama news blitz. The truth of the matter is that Barack Obama has been treated with kid gloves by the majority of the main stream media. His main critic has been Fox News...one television station among CBS, NBC, ABC, CNN, MSNBC, and Public Broadcasting stations that have given him nothing but love. It was Barack Obama who publicly declared that his policies WERE on the ballot this election. If we take him at his word then his policies took another shellacking.

You really need to sell your propaganda elsewhere. I was clear. You are not. I was not talking about the TV news organizations. Unless you are dumber than I give you credit you know exactly to whom I was refering about the forces in the GOP that promised they would ensure Obama failed. They represent the states where the home offices of the greedy bastards that run the largest HMO's reside. They have raped the citizens of this country for health care and put up more than a billion dollars trying to reverse Obama's attempt to make health care affordable for most Americans that were under insured or could not afford any health insurance at all. That is what most of this battle is about. Americans voted for Obama to let him do what he could to make healthcare available to all Americans. That is what he ran on. There was no hidden agenda. Only a subversive on the side of the wealthy feinds that have America by the throat in a battle to squeeze every last dime out of the publics health care system would be defending these POS's.

So I take it that you are NOT stupid...just a scumbag that is working on behalf of the monsters attempting to hold America hostage over it's health costs.

Stop trying to tell me nonsense and lies. I am in no mood for your subtrafuge.

Barack Obama RAN on promises that Americans would be able to keep their health care plans if they liked them...keep their doctors if they liked them...and if you were a Middle Class family...that the ACA would save you about $2,500 a year in healthcare costs. All of those things were lies...lies deliberately told by Barack Obama and progressives to convince Americans who desperately wanted healthcare reform that the ACA would lower their healthcare costs. The Gruber videos simply exposed that Obama and his minions didn't guess wrong on what the ACA would mean to the average American. Oh, no...Gruber's videos show that they knew EXACTLY what would happen to the healthcare costs of the average Middle Class American and lied their asses off about it because they wanted to take that first step towards government run healthcare.

You have the gall to accuse me of lying when all I've done is point out the lies told by the people you support? If I hadn't seen how clueless you are about most things to do with the ACA, I'd accuse you of being as dishonest as Barry and his little buddies like Gruber. I'm coming to the conclusion however that you're the exact person that Gruber is referring to when he talks about the stupidity of the American voter.

Obama's vision for health care reform was morphed by the HMO's and their representatives into what it is. As usual the psycophants that work in the shadows and lie in public have spoken again. I'm sure your job is thankless. Just because most of the people you communicate with are stupid is no gaurantee everyone is. I already said what I said. Your continued lying won't change the facts.

Obama cut a deal with the insurance industry to get them to go along with the ACA. Blaming it on conservatives is laughable.

 

[toxicmedia]

As for Obama keeping a black book on conservatives he's going to "get"? He's

Nonsense. The "electorite" made their choice when they elected Obama twice. The republicans took that right away from the public and just kept telling anyone that would hold a microphone in front of their foul mouths that Obama was the personal representative of satan on earth. They lied and made up lies and told those lies. They have been working 24/7/365 by 5 years doing nothing but following through on their promise to ruin Obama's presidency and any chance that America would have any usefull legislation in the off chance it would make Obama look good. This has been a display of the most arrogant missuse of elected power the world has witnessed since Hitler and his henchmen stole the German government.

The reason the democrats don't want to align themselves with Obama is not for anything that he has done or not done. They simply fear the republican dissinformation machine and do not want to get in their sights.

The evil POS's that are the republican leadership have poisoned the well. They have made it impossible to govern. They have not just ignored the publics decision to give Obama the opportunity to do what he said he would before he was elected they turned everything he did into shit in every way they could think of. The only reason they didn't arrange to have Obama assasinated is that they didn't have a Lynden Johnson in the wings to replace him. I have no doubt they considered trying to get Obama and the vice president in a vulnerable place together so they could do the deed.

IMHO the recent and ongoing attempts to get a person over the White House fence and into the White House are just dry runs getting information on how hard it would be to get to Obama off gaurd in a helpless position. The hapless Secret Service seem comical in how inept and ineffective their performance has been what with the whores in Colombia to the female SS agent being what stood between Obama and the recent invader. The scorecard on that attack was stunning. If I was Obama I would be packing 24/7 with multiple clips.

Even the American public has been worn out by the constant media blitz that the repugs have beseiged us with. Their only answer to any question is that Obama is at fault. They accept absolutely no responsibility for the lack of effectiveness of government.

Your statement "his agenda isn't what the electorate wanted" is a bald faced lie. Piss on you for carrying the lying sacks of liquid shit's water.

The American electorite knew exactly what they wanted and they were denied that by your slimy heros. They are just mad that Obama has not been able to do what he said. They don't know why and they are not educated enough in the proccess to understand the nuts and bolts of the failure.

I was born a proud republican from a proud republican family. Now after 50 years plus of watching the internal rot and destruction that has all changed. It took Johnson(southern dem actually a false republican) and Nixon and Reagan and Bush one and the false dem Clinton and Bush II to ruin our country but that's what they did. I am worn out with the lies and the stealing of treasury and lives of our youngest and best with the illegal wars and the illegal alliances with counties like Israel and the theft of our choices and giving those choices to a wealthy few(Murdoch, Cheney, Waltons, The Banks that stole multi billions...nay TRILLIONS!!! just before Obama took office...etc...). This transformation has a name and it is fascism. It is what the GOP has become and it is now neither Grand nor is it the party of Old. It is a party of theives and liars on a scale never seen in human history. I am glad only that my grand parents and my own father and mother are not alive to see what they once loved has become.

I hope Obama has kept a huge and detailed black book on these monsters you call friends. I hope to all that matters he takes this information and makes your insideous co conspirators choke on their missdeeds.

We don't elect Emperors here, Huggy. When one is elected President of the United States it's a position with power but it isn't absolute power. The Founding Fathers deliberately set things up so that the Congress and the Supreme Court would provide checks and balances to Presidential power. I know you don't LIKE that but it is what it is!

The reason that Democrats lost big in both 2010 and 2014 is that the electorate wasn't happy with the progressive agenda that was being shoved down their throats. I'm amused by your contention that America has been besieged by a negative Obama news blitz. The truth of the matter is that Barack Obama has been treated with kid gloves by the majority of the main stream media. His main critic has been Fox News...one television station among CBS, NBC, ABC, CNN, MSNBC, and Public Broadcasting stations that have given him nothing but love. It was Barack Obama who publicly declared that his policies WERE on the ballot this election. If we take him at his word then his policies took another shellacking.

You really need to sell your propaganda elsewhere. I was clear. You are not. I was not talking about the TV news organizations. Unless you are dumber than I give you credit you know exactly to whom I was refering about the forces in the GOP that promised they would ensure Obama failed. They represent the states where the home offices of the greedy bastards that run the largest HMO's reside. They have raped the citizens of this country for health care and put up more than a billion dollars trying to reverse Obama's attempt to make health care affordable for most Americans that were under insured or could not afford any health insurance at all. That is what most of this battle is about. Americans voted for Obama to let him do what he could to make healthcare available to all Americans. That is what he ran on. There was no hidden agenda. Only a subversive on the side of the wealthy feinds that have America by the throat in a battle to squeeze every last dime out of the publics health care system would be defending these POS's.

So I take it that you are NOT stupid...just a scumbag that is working on behalf of the monsters attempting to hold America hostage over it's health costs.

Stop trying to tell me nonsense and lies. I am in no mood for your subtrafuge.

Barack Obama RAN on promises that Americans would be able to keep their health care plans if they liked them...keep their doctors if they liked them...and if you were a Middle Class family...that the ACA would save you about $2,500 a year in healthcare costs. All of those things were lies...lies deliberately told by Barack Obama and progressives to convince Americans who desperately wanted healthcare reform that the ACA would lower their healthcare costs. The Gruber videos simply exposed that Obama and his minions didn't guess wrong on what the ACA would mean to the average American. Oh, no...Gruber's videos show that they knew EXACTLY what would happen to the healthcare costs of the average Middle Class American and lied their asses off about it because they wanted to take that first step towards government run healthcare.

You have the gall to accuse me of lying when all I've done is point out the lies told by the people you support? If I hadn't seen how clueless you are about most things to do with the ACA, I'd accuse you of being as dishonest as Barry and his little buddies like Gruber. I'm coming to the conclusion however that you're the exact person that Gruber is referring to when he talks about the stupidity of the American voter.

There are several aspects that get overlooked, and boiled down into talking points that create fasle and misleading impressions.

Obama screwed up when he prmised you'd get to keep your plan. He didn't stop to think that the 10 essential benefits that must be offered with health insurance policies would increase the cost, which causes, from an operational perspective, the insurance companies to add those benefits to existing plans, thus creating a new group ID# for those plans, which makes them NOT the same plan.

Not being able to keep thier doctors is 100% on the providers, and not the ACA. He didn't stop to think that providers would chose NOT to contract with the ACA plans, especially the HMO's. But there has to be more to it. Providers that accept Medicare aleady settle for around 75% reimbursement, and Medicaid about 25%!...the ACA plans run about 80%. I know of many doctors in the very red state I work with, won't take the ACA plans for political reasons. Many of the residents of this state, hate HMO's, and will only get PPO's. With the ACA PPO plans, there is no shortage of providers because it's fee for service, not capitation.

These HMO VS PPO contracting issues pre-date the ACA.

Whats happening is, by simplification, the GOP has been able to blame every new, systemic, and preexisting cost driver for medical insurance out of pocket costs on the ACA.

What you can't parse, and comprehend, without 1-2 years of training and education in how the industry works...is how much of these cost increases would still be there anyway without the ACA

Kindly explain to me how it is that Barack Obama didn't grasp the same things that you claim are so self evident if you know anything about healthcare insurance? Are you telling me that his signature legislative achievement...something that profoundly affects one sixth of our economy...was written by people that understand less about healthcare and the insurance industry than you do and that he simply didn't understand what he was talking about?

It's hard to square THAT notion with the reality that this was something put together by people LIKE Gruber who have PhD's in that very subject. I'm sorry but this wasn't a "miscalculation" by progressives, Toxic...this was a very calculated plan to put something over on the American people because they felt that the "end" justified the "means".

Obama, in terms of involvement, and micro management of it's details...and the many many authors of Obamacare, were probably busy putting the legal touches on the legislation because that's what Obama knows. Obama does not understand the insurance business, or the healthcare business.

Granted, he may very well have seen into the future and lied. However...the things that Gruber talks about have nothing to do with what I talked about.

I don't question your intellect or reasoning skills. I do question your capacity to consider the possibility that these may be unintended consequences, of a law that we had to pass to find out what's in it.

 

[HUGGY]

As for Obama keeping a black book on conservatives he's going to "get"? He's

Nonsense. The "electorite" made their choice when they elected Obama twice. The republicans took that right away from the public and just kept telling anyone that would hold a microphone in front of their foul mouths that Obama was the personal representative of satan on earth. They lied and made up lies and told those lies. They have been working 24/7/365 by 5 years doing nothing but following through on their promise to ruin Obama's presidency and any chance that America would have any usefull legislation in the off chance it would make Obama look good. This has been a display of the most arrogant missuse of elected power the world has witnessed since Hitler and his henchmen stole the German government.

The reason the democrats don't want to align themselves with Obama is not for anything that he has done or not done. They simply fear the republican dissinformation machine and do not want to get in their sights.

The evil POS's that are the republican leadership have poisoned the well. They have made it impossible to govern. They have not just ignored the publics decision to give Obama the opportunity to do what he said he would before he was elected they turned everything he did into shit in every way they could think of. The only reason they didn't arrange to have Obama assasinated is that they didn't have a Lynden Johnson in the wings to replace him. I have no doubt they considered trying to get Obama and the vice president in a vulnerable place together so they could do the deed.

IMHO the recent and ongoing attempts to get a person over the White House fence and into the White House are just dry runs getting information on how hard it would be to get to Obama off gaurd in a helpless position. The hapless Secret Service seem comical in how inept and ineffective their performance has been what with the whores in Colombia to the female SS agent being what stood between Obama and the recent invader. The scorecard on that attack was stunning. If I was Obama I would be packing 24/7 with multiple clips.

Even the American public has been worn out by the constant media blitz that the repugs have beseiged us with. Their only answer to any question is that Obama is at fault. They accept absolutely no responsibility for the lack of effectiveness of government.

Your statement "his agenda isn't what the electorate wanted" is a bald faced lie. Piss on you for carrying the lying sacks of liquid shit's water.

The American electorite knew exactly what they wanted and they were denied that by your slimy heros. They are just mad that Obama has not been able to do what he said. They don't know why and they are not educated enough in the proccess to understand the nuts and bolts of the failure.

I was born a proud republican from a proud republican family. Now after 50 years plus of watching the internal rot and destruction that has all changed. It took Johnson(southern dem actually a false republican) and Nixon and Reagan and Bush one and the false dem Clinton and Bush II to ruin our country but that's what they did. I am worn out with the lies and the stealing of treasury and lives of our youngest and best with the illegal wars and the illegal alliances with counties like Israel and the theft of our choices and giving those choices to a wealthy few(Murdoch, Cheney, Waltons, The Banks that stole multi billions...nay TRILLIONS!!! just before Obama took office...etc...). This transformation has a name and it is fascism. It is what the GOP has become and it is now neither Grand nor is it the party of Old. It is a party of theives and liars on a scale never seen in human history. I am glad only that my grand parents and my own father and mother are not alive to see what they once loved has become.

I hope Obama has kept a huge and detailed black book on these monsters you call friends. I hope to all that matters he takes this information and makes your insideous co conspirators choke on their missdeeds.

We don't elect Emperors here, Huggy. When one is elected President of the United States it's a position with power but it isn't absolute power. The Founding Fathers deliberately set things up so that the Congress and the Supreme Court would provide checks and balances to Presidential power. I know you don't LIKE that but it is what it is!

The reason that Democrats lost big in both 2010 and 2014 is that the electorate wasn't happy with the progressive agenda that was being shoved down their throats. I'm amused by your contention that America has been besieged by a negative Obama news blitz. The truth of the matter is that Barack Obama has been treated with kid gloves by the majority of the main stream media. His main critic has been Fox News...one television station among CBS, NBC, ABC, CNN, MSNBC, and Public Broadcasting stations that have given him nothing but love. It was Barack Obama who publicly declared that his policies WERE on the ballot this election. If we take him at his word then his policies took another shellacking.

You really need to sell your propaganda elsewhere. I was clear. You are not. I was not talking about the TV news organizations. Unless you are dumber than I give you credit you know exactly to whom I was refering about the forces in the GOP that promised they would ensure Obama failed. They represent the states where the home offices of the greedy bastards that run the largest HMO's reside. They have raped the citizens of this country for health care and put up more than a billion dollars trying to reverse Obama's attempt to make health care affordable for most Americans that were under insured or could not afford any health insurance at all. That is what most of this battle is about. Americans voted for Obama to let him do what he could to make healthcare available to all Americans. That is what he ran on. There was no hidden agenda. Only a subversive on the side of the wealthy feinds that have America by the throat in a battle to squeeze every last dime out of the publics health care system would be defending these POS's.

So I take it that you are NOT stupid...just a scumbag that is working on behalf of the monsters attempting to hold America hostage over it's health costs.

Stop trying to tell me nonsense and lies. I am in no mood for your subtrafuge.

Barack Obama RAN on promises that Americans would be able to keep their health care plans if they liked them...keep their doctors if they liked them...and if you were a Middle Class family...that the ACA would save you about $2,500 a year in healthcare costs. All of those things were lies...lies deliberately told by Barack Obama and progressives to convince Americans who desperately wanted healthcare reform that the ACA would lower their healthcare costs. The Gruber videos simply exposed that Obama and his minions didn't guess wrong on what the ACA would mean to the average American. Oh, no...Gruber's videos show that they knew EXACTLY what would happen to the healthcare costs of the average Middle Class American and lied their asses off about it because they wanted to take that first step towards government run healthcare.

You have the gall to accuse me of lying when all I've done is point out the lies told by the people you support? If I hadn't seen how clueless you are about most things to do with the ACA, I'd accuse you of being as dishonest as Barry and his little buddies like Gruber. I'm coming to the conclusion however that you're the exact person that Gruber is referring to when he talks about the stupidity of the American voter.

Obama's vision for health care reform was morphed by the HMO's and their representatives into what it is. As usual the psycophants that work in the shadows and lie in public have spoken again. I'm sure your job is thankless. Just because most of the people you communicate with are stupid is no gaurantee everyone is. I already said what I said. Your continued lying won't change the facts.

Obama cut a deal with the insurance industry to get them to go along with the ACA. Blaming it on conservatives is laughable.

I have no doubt you believe any responsibility assigned to the neo cons is laughable.