This one is for the gun grabbers. Explain this.

[2aguy]

Tougher background checks and ban military style weapons no citizen needs..
Boom.

Here is actual gun control...

1) if you use a gun to commit a crime...30 years in prison.

2) if you are a violent felon caught with a gun....30 years in prison.

BOOM.....

 

[Reasonable]

When the 2nd amendment was added muskets shot one bullet. Out founders never imagined people would have automatic weapons killing hundreds in a matter of minutes..
It definitely needs a huge overhaul to adjust to modern times.

You think the 2nd amendment is sacred but want to restrict the 1st amendment.
Imagine that.

 

[2aguy]

Yeah.......except the actual research says you are wrong.....

Self defense with a gun......40 years of actual research...first is the name of the group that conducted the research, then the year, then the number of defensive gun uses and finally wether the research contained police or military defensive gun uses....

A quick guide to the studies and the numbers.....the full lay out of what was studied by each study is in the links....
GunCite-Gun Control-How Often Are Guns Used in Self-Defense

GunCite Frequency of Defensive Gun Use in Previous Surveys

Field...1976....3,052,717 ( no cops, military)

DMIa 1978...2,141,512 ( no cops, military)

L.A. TIMES...1994...3,609,68 ( no cops, military)

Kleck......1994...2.5 million ( no cops, military)

Obama's CDC....2013....500,000--3million

--------------------


Bordua...1977...1,414,544

DMIb...1978...1,098,409 ( no cops, military)

Hart...1981...1.797,461 ( no cops, military)

Mauser...1990...1,487,342 ( no cops, military)

Gallup...1993...1,621,377 ( no cops, military)

DEPT. OF JUSTICE...1994...1.5 million ( the bill clinton study)

Journal of Quantitative Criminology--- 989,883 times per year."

(Based on survey data from a 2000 study published in the Journal of Quantitative Criminology,[17] U.S. civilians use guns to defend themselves and others from crime at least 989,883 times per year.[18])

Paper: "Measuring Civilian Defensive Firearm Use: A Methodological Experiment." By David McDowall and others. Journal of Quantitative Criminology, March 2000. Measuring Civilian Defensive Firearm Use: A Methodological Experiment - Springer


-------------------------------------------

Ohio...1982...771,043

Gallup...1991...777,152

Tarrance... 1994... 764,036 (no cops, military)

Lawerence Southwich Jr. 400,000 fewer violent crimes and at least 800,000 violent crimes deterred..

*****************************************
If you take the studies from that Kleck cites in his paper, 16 of them....and you only average the ones that exclude military and police shootings..the average becomes 2 million...I use those studies because I have the details on them...and they are still 10 studies (including Kleck's)....

Posting a lie doesn't make it true. Learn some common sense.

Then you should stop posting lies.

Notice that two of those studies....one was from the Department of Justice under bill clinton......and another was done by obama's Centers for Disease control in 2013 that looked at all gun research....those are listed.......tell me they are lying....

They are lying because it's absolutely impossible to get any good numbers. That's like counting how many clouds in the sky. You can guess but that's all it is. Common sense, when mostly Americans don't even own a gun, says they aren't used 1.5 million times a year in self defense. That's just some idiot pulling out his gun because a black kid walking home from the store minding is own business scares your pathetic white ass.

I find myself wondering how many people have you on their ignore list. You've just been added to mine. You keep spamming stupidity, forcing me to check my alerts every two minutes. You will no longer waste my valuable time. Good riddance.

Like most conservatives you lack the courage to acknowledge the fact that you’re wrong.

Your thread premise fails as a fallacy because you can’t compare two dissimilar things and draw conclusions from that false comparison.

And the notion of ‘gun grabbers’ is just as false as your thread premise – no one is going to take your guns away.

You pretend to be familiar with the law...explain what the 4th Circuit just did......

 

[2aguy]

When the 2nd amendment was added muskets shot one bullet. Out founders never imagined people would have automatic weapons killing hundreds in a matter of minutes..
It definitely needs a huge overhaul to adjust to modern times.

You think the 2nd amendment is sacred but want to restrict the 1st amendment.

Moron....they had a repeating weapon at the time the Constitution was written...

Who wants to restrict the 1st? Oh, you mean you left wingers and your antifa thugs want to end the 1st Amendment..got it.

 

[RWNJ]

If guns solved crime there wouldn't be any here.

Detectives "solve" crimes.....Guns PREVENT Crimes.

But neither detectives nor guns can prevent ALL crime.
By your logic.....If LAWS prevented crime there would be no crime.

Crime exists laws or no laws, guns or no guns. More laws and more guns do not solve crime, neither do more prisons.

Guns may not solve all crime, but they do prevent many.

They prevent jack shit but they do kill 30,000 Americans each year. That we can get good numbers on because all we have to do is count up the dead bodies.

Yeah....here is the truth to that number...you should do some research...

Gun suicide..

Leading Causes of Death | WISQARS | Injury Center | CDC

2015
Gun suicide...

22,018

Non Gun suicide...

22,078
========================

Gun Accidental death.....
2015

489

==================

Gun murder ( 70-80% of the victims of gun murder are actual criminals, not law abiding people)

Expanded Homicide Data Table 8


2015--

9,616

=======================

Suicide
Japan, Korea, China, all have absolute gun control for law abiding citizens...only criminals and cops can have guns.......and they have higher suicide rates than we do....and our non-gun suicide rate has been higher than our gun suicide rate for 2 years in a row.....

Gun Accidental Death...

Gun accidents....in a country with over 320,000,000 people...... with 400,000,000 guns in private hands, and over 15,700,000 people carrying guns for self defense..... 489 accidental gun deaths....

Gun murder
Of the 9,616 gun murders in this country, 70-80% of the victims are criminals, engaged in criminal activity or part of the criminal life style....and of the remaining victims....many of them are friends and family of the criminal...caught up in the criminal's lifestyle.....

Non-fatal gun accidents....
WISQARS Nonfatal Injury Reports

CDC non fatal gun accident.....

2001.... 17,696

2002... 17,579

2003... 18,941

2004... 16,555

2005... 15,388

2006... 14,678

2007... 15,698

2008... 17,215

2009... 18,610

2010... 14,161

2011... 14,675

2012... 17,362

2013... 16,864

2014..... 15,928

2015... 17,311

Accidental gun deaths equal .0000015 percent of the population. many times that number are the result of heart attack, cancer and stroke. In other words, it much ado about nothing.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

When the 2nd amendment was added muskets shot one bullet. Out founders never imagined people would have automatic weapons killing hundreds in a matter of minutes..

Of course they did. Do you really believe that the founders thought that horse and buggy would be our only means of transportation 200 years later?

They knew weapons would advance. They knew transportation would advance. They knew farming would advance. And for those things that the Constitution outlined, the founders included an amendment process for changes.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Well, it's because I understand liberals, that's why. Let me explain, and please excuse my lack of brevity here:

I was a kid when gay rights was introduced. Back then, they told us all they wanted was to be let out of the closet. So we did. Today they are forcing themselves into our military, forced us to accept their marriages in states that forbade it, and are adopting children.

I remember when the anti-smokers just wanted no smoking in movie theaters. That's all they claimed to have wanted, and they will be happy. Today smoking is forbidden in most public places. There are parks and beaches where smoking is prohibited. Nobody told the law makers that parks and beaches were outside. Now some places won't give you a job if you're a smoker, and nobody even makes a car or truck with ashtrays anymore.

I remember when the environmentalists insisted we get rid of lead in our gasoline. That's all they wanted, and they would be happy. Today we have spent trillions of dollars making everything "greener" and they are complaining now more than ever.

The point is, when it comes to liberal agendas, there is no "we just want X" Because after X comes Y, and after Y comes Z, then Z+, then Z++ and so on.

To put it another way, let's say Hillary won the presidency, and she filled the courts with leftist judges all the way up to the Supreme Court. Do you really believe for one minute our rights to own firearms would be protected in five years or so from now?

and yep. i do agree that is a large part of why there is ZERO give from the gun side.

1) liberals don't know what they want to ban. if it looks scary, ban it. trouble is, they never define "Scary" and when they do, it changes to fit their mood.
2) they have zero knowledge that an AR15 is NOT an automatic weapon. hell, it wasn't even an "assault rifle" until liberals forces changing the meaning of words so they could be "right"
3) i don't trust obama for shit - when you say green tipped 223 is armor piercing you just told anyone with any knowledge at all what a fucktard you are. it's was all "if i cant get the gun i'll get the bullets" and nothing more.

so i do agree that if you want "common sense gun talk" you usually have to leave liberals out of it.

guess that just paints us into a corner and is what can be frustrating to me.

Liberals don't have a problem with the guns themselves. Liberals just don't like us having the ability to protect ourselves with guns. Thats their real problem.

Stupid comments from the gun babbas I'm use to but this is a couple of steps above stupid.

So would you care to explain why Democrats want our guns so badly? Or would you like me to give you several examples on how liberals create victims?

You’ve been crying for 8 years that Obama was coming for your guns.
Are you gunless?
The large % of the American people wants Congress to do something and pass some common sense legislation on gun control. Problem is there’s no common sense in the Congress and they suck at the NRA’s tit.

Then why didn't DumBama pass such new gun laws when he had control over the Congress and Senate?

The only thing stopping leftists from taking our guns is our Constitution and Supreme Court. If Democrats had any chance at disarming the public--they would.

 

[2aguy]

Detectives "solve" crimes.....Guns PREVENT Crimes.

But neither detectives nor guns can prevent ALL crime.
By your logic.....If LAWS prevented crime there would be no crime.

Crime exists laws or no laws, guns or no guns. More laws and more guns do not solve crime, neither do more prisons.

Guns may not solve all crime, but they do prevent many.

They prevent jack shit but they do kill 30,000 Americans each year. That we can get good numbers on because all we have to do is count up the dead bodies.

Yeah....here is the truth to that number...you should do some research...

Gun suicide..

Leading Causes of Death | WISQARS | Injury Center | CDC

2015
Gun suicide...

22,018

Non Gun suicide...

22,078
========================

Gun Accidental death.....
2015

489

==================

Gun murder ( 70-80% of the victims of gun murder are actual criminals, not law abiding people)

Expanded Homicide Data Table 8


2015--

9,616

=======================

Suicide
Japan, Korea, China, all have absolute gun control for law abiding citizens...only criminals and cops can have guns.......and they have higher suicide rates than we do....and our non-gun suicide rate has been higher than our gun suicide rate for 2 years in a row.....

Gun Accidental Death...

Gun accidents....in a country with over 320,000,000 people...... with 400,000,000 guns in private hands, and over 15,700,000 people carrying guns for self defense..... 489 accidental gun deaths....

Gun murder
Of the 9,616 gun murders in this country, 70-80% of the victims are criminals, engaged in criminal activity or part of the criminal life style....and of the remaining victims....many of them are friends and family of the criminal...caught up in the criminal's lifestyle.....

Non-fatal gun accidents....
WISQARS Nonfatal Injury Reports

CDC non fatal gun accident.....

2001.... 17,696

2002... 17,579

2003... 18,941

2004... 16,555

2005... 15,388

2006... 14,678

2007... 15,698

2008... 17,215

2009... 18,610

2010... 14,161

2011... 14,675

2012... 17,362

2013... 16,864

2014..... 15,928

2015... 17,311

Accidental gun deaths equal .0000015 percent of the population. many times that number are the result of heart attack, cancer and stroke. In other words, it much ado about nothing.

In a country of over 320 million people...this is how many of us die from gun accidents...by year....from the CDC...

Leading Causes of Death | WISQARS | Injury Center | CDC

2015...489

2014.....486
2013 ..... 505
2012 ..... 548
2011 ..... 591
2010 ..... 606
2009 ..... 554
2008 ..... 592
2007..... 613
2006..... 642
2005 ..... 789
2004 ..... 649
2003 ..... 730
2002 ..... 762
2001 ..... 802
2000 ..... 776
1999 ..... 824

 

[Skull Pilot]

When the 2nd amendment was added muskets shot one bullet. Out founders never imagined people would have automatic weapons killing hundreds in a matter of minutes..
It definitely needs a huge overhaul to adjust to modern times.

You think the 2nd amendment is sacred but want to restrict the 1st amendment.
Imagine that.

OK so if you want to be consistent with the 18th century then get rid of your computer, write your post on parchment paper with quill and ink and send it to me by a mail carrier on horseback.

 

[jbander]

cause all i have to do is answer no to all but 1 question here in texas so no idea what that's about. then they run my SS# - just what are they looking for?

why are people opposed to looking into how we do background checks?

Well, it's because I understand liberals, that's why. Let me explain, and please excuse my lack of brevity here:

I was a kid when gay rights was introduced. Back then, they told us all they wanted was to be let out of the closet. So we did. Today they are forcing themselves into our military, forced us to accept their marriages in states that forbade it, and are adopting children.

I remember when the anti-smokers just wanted no smoking in movie theaters. That's all they claimed to have wanted, and they will be happy. Today smoking is forbidden in most public places. There are parks and beaches where smoking is prohibited. Nobody told the law makers that parks and beaches were outside. Now some places won't give you a job if you're a smoker, and nobody even makes a car or truck with ashtrays anymore.

I remember when the environmentalists insisted we get rid of lead in our gasoline. That's all they wanted, and they would be happy. Today we have spent trillions of dollars making everything "greener" and they are complaining now more than ever.

The point is, when it comes to liberal agendas, there is no "we just want X" Because after X comes Y, and after Y comes Z, then Z+, then Z++ and so on.

To put it another way, let's say Hillary won the presidency, and she filled the courts with leftist judges all the way up to the Supreme Court. Do you really believe for one minute our rights to own firearms would be protected in five years or so from now?

Yes obama was going to take all the guns. Funny

You don't think he would of if he could? That's the point I'm making.

You people are complete idiots there is no threat to the second amendment , there are just a lot regulations that need to be added. Tell me how there is a threat to the 2nd when I can buy and own and shoot a Machine gun and buy and shoot a piece of artillery with shells to put in my front yard on display. You are all idiots.

You can buy a gun in New York, after jumping through countless legal hoops and paying through the nose for it, but you cannot get a concealed carry permit, and there is no open carry. In other words, you have to keep it in your home where it's no use to you if you're not there. The criminals know this, which is why New York has such a high crime rate. Now, if you allowed people to carry those guns, the crime rate would drop. Do you deny this? Please say yes. I could use a good laugh.

Total nonsense , there is zero threat from the left as far as the 2nd is concerned , the only threat is from the gun Bubba's that think that there can't be regulations or shouldn't be regulations to something as lethal as a gun. The people will get so pissed off at these stupid comments about guns from the gun Bubba's that they will go after the 2nd to shut these half wits up.

 

[jbander]

Safer? We have a much higher homicide rate than countries with gun control...

Then do this: Get a huge sign made that says WE HAVE NO FIREARMS IN THIS HOUSE and hang that on your front porch. Get back to us in a few months (if you're still alive) and let us know how it worked out for ya. Because that's exactly what you would do by disarming the US public; hanging a big sign around your neck that tells everybody you are not able to defend yourself.

WTF do you think that mass murderers usually choose gun-free zones to carry out their plots?

Orlando there was an armed officer there. There were plenty of guns at Vegas too.

It is funny your are so paranoid and scared you that sign would make any difference.

I've gone my entire life without needing a gun for anything. I've still never known anyone who needed one. Stop being so scared and giving incentive for criminals to be armed.

As I stated, it doesn't matter if you're armed or not. The idea that you could be armed is what protects you.

This reminds me of a discussion I was having on a local blog when our state was considering CCW laws. An anti-gunner asked me why I wanted CCW's so bad? I told him because of my mother. She lives alone and doesn't drive. She likes to walk everywhere if possible and having CCW's would help protect her. He wrote back and asked if my elderly mother would carry a gun if the law was passed. To that question I answered "No she wouldn't, but the criminal doesn't know that."

Here we used to have ATM robberies all the time; some even turned out deadly. That was until we passed a law that allowed CCW holders to carry their guns in their cars. Later they got rid of the holster law which means I didn't have to have my gun in a compartment or holster. I could ride around with my loaded gun right on my passenger seat.

Does it? Why do countries with much lower gun ownership rates have so much less crime than us? Sorry, fail. For that matter why is crime in NYC down while places with more carry it is up? Fail again.

They don't....Britain has more crime than we do....Japan is a virtual police state

Crime is down in New York because they went after actual criminals under Rudy Guiliani, and they have kept his methods...now deblasio, the communist, is getting rid of those methods and their crime rate is going up.

Bullshit, your comment are made up of so much lies that anyone would be nuts to believe anything that comes out of your mouth, There are tons of country where people don't get killed like in this country , literally all countries in the world. , There are few that even come close , So simply put there is not one part of what you wrote that is true.

 

[jbander]

Safer? We have a much higher homicide rate than countries with gun control...

Then do this: Get a huge sign made that says WE HAVE NO FIREARMS IN THIS HOUSE and hang that on your front porch. Get back to us in a few months (if you're still alive) and let us know how it worked out for ya. Because that's exactly what you would do by disarming the US public; hanging a big sign around your neck that tells everybody you are not able to defend yourself.

WTF do you think that mass murderers usually choose gun-free zones to carry out their plots?

Orlando there was an armed officer there. There were plenty of guns at Vegas too.

It is funny your are so paranoid and scared you that sign would make any difference.

I've gone my entire life without needing a gun for anything. I've still never known anyone who needed one. Stop being so scared and giving incentive for criminals to be armed.

As I stated, it doesn't matter if you're armed or not. The idea that you could be armed is what protects you.

This reminds me of a discussion I was having on a local blog when our state was considering CCW laws. An anti-gunner asked me why I wanted CCW's so bad? I told him because of my mother. She lives alone and doesn't drive. She likes to walk everywhere if possible and having CCW's would help protect her. He wrote back and asked if my elderly mother would carry a gun if the law was passed. To that question I answered "No she wouldn't, but the criminal doesn't know that."

Here we used to have ATM robberies all the time; some even turned out deadly. That was until we passed a law that allowed CCW holders to carry their guns in their cars. Later they got rid of the holster law which means I didn't have to have my gun in a compartment or holster. I could ride around with my loaded gun right on my passenger seat.

Bullshit every crook knows that every year there are less and less people who have guns in their homes, so as far as your home is concerned it is safer for them to do anything they want to do.
You need to come up with something that is true and a real argument supporting your nonsense. This is just like dealing with children, it's to easy and that makes me lose interest. I mean every point you got is nonsense and easy to dump on. We need to keep these threads interesting.

Wrong....in fact, gun ownership in minority homes is going up....dittos women buying guns....please, try to do some basic research. Even left wing socialist, social justice warriors are buying guns now...

Fact there is less houses every day in this country that have guns in them. The increase in guns are going to the same group of wackos that make up the right. They are paranoid and think that it is the end of the world or commies that are around every corner are going to take over this country. You know wackos

 

[jbander]

When the 2nd amendment was added muskets shot one bullet. Out founders never imagined people would have automatic weapons killing hundreds in a matter of minutes..
It definitely needs a huge overhaul to adjust to modern times.

You think the 2nd amendment is sacred but want to restrict the 1st amendment.
Imagine that.

OK so if you want to be consistent with the 18th century then get rid of your computer, write your post on parchment paper with quill and ink and send it to me by a mail carrier on horseback.

What does your coment even mean.

 

[jbander]

Orlando there was an armed officer there. There were plenty of guns at Vegas too.

It is funny your are so paranoid and scared you that sign would make any difference.

I've gone my entire life without needing a gun for anything. I've still never known anyone who needed one. Stop being so scared and giving incentive for criminals to be armed.

As I stated, it doesn't matter if you're armed or not. The idea that you could be armed is what protects you.

This reminds me of a discussion I was having on a local blog when our state was considering CCW laws. An anti-gunner asked me why I wanted CCW's so bad? I told him because of my mother. She lives alone and doesn't drive. She likes to walk everywhere if possible and having CCW's would help protect her. He wrote back and asked if my elderly mother would carry a gun if the law was passed. To that question I answered "No she wouldn't, but the criminal doesn't know that."

Here we used to have ATM robberies all the time; some even turned out deadly. That was until we passed a law that allowed CCW holders to carry their guns in their cars. Later they got rid of the holster law which means I didn't have to have my gun in a compartment or holster. I could ride around with my loaded gun right on my passenger seat.

Does it? Why do countries with much lower gun ownership rates have so much less crime than us? Sorry, fail. For that matter why is crime in NYC down while places with more carry it is up? Fail again.

They don't....Britain has more crime than we do....Japan is a virtual police state

Crime is down in New York because they went after actual criminals under Rudy Guiliani, and they have kept his methods...now deblasio, the communist, is getting rid of those methods and their crime rate is going up.

Your kind has no problems at all with a police state, as long as it only affects people who aren't white.

Wow...you actually put down the drugs and the booze to post that.....good for you...now try doing that more often so you can kick both of them....

What a stupid response.

 

[jbander]

cause all i have to do is answer no to all but 1 question here in texas so no idea what that's about. then they run my SS# - just what are they looking for?

why are people opposed to looking into how we do background checks?

Well, it's because I understand liberals, that's why. Let me explain, and please excuse my lack of brevity here:

I was a kid when gay rights was introduced. Back then, they told us all they wanted was to be let out of the closet. So we did. Today they are forcing themselves into our military, forced us to accept their marriages in states that forbade it, and are adopting children.

I remember when the anti-smokers just wanted no smoking in movie theaters. That's all they claimed to have wanted, and they will be happy. Today smoking is forbidden in most public places. There are parks and beaches where smoking is prohibited. Nobody told the law makers that parks and beaches were outside. Now some places won't give you a job if you're a smoker, and nobody even makes a car or truck with ashtrays anymore.

I remember when the environmentalists insisted we get rid of lead in our gasoline. That's all they wanted, and they would be happy. Today we have spent trillions of dollars making everything "greener" and they are complaining now more than ever.

The point is, when it comes to liberal agendas, there is no "we just want X" Because after X comes Y, and after Y comes Z, then Z+, then Z++ and so on.

To put it another way, let's say Hillary won the presidency, and she filled the courts with leftist judges all the way up to the Supreme Court. Do you really believe for one minute our rights to own firearms would be protected in five years or so from now?

Yes obama was going to take all the guns. Funny

You don't think he would of if he could? That's the point I'm making.

You people are complete idiots there is no threat to the second amendment , there are just a lot regulations that need to be added. Tell me how there is a threat to the 2nd when I can buy and own and shoot a Machine gun and buy and shoot a piece of artillery with shells to put in my front yard on display. You are all idiots.

Moron...the democrats put the fight in the courts and in local gun battles...they pass stupid gun laws in various cities, then get them declared constitutional in the Courts...giving all the other gun grabbers power to implement their gun control...

In a country where you can own a machine gun and shoot it every day or buy a piece of artillery and shoot it every day, How the fucjk are you going to convince me that there is a threat to the second amendment.

 

[jbander]

If you are a criminal in the usa would you be unarmed? Not with all the guns around. All you have done is arm more criminals.

THAT'S THE POINT!!! You can create all the laws you like, but you're never going to disarm the criminal. They will always have access to guns and will use them. All you'd really do is disarm the victims, and that only makes the problem worse.

Actually arming the criminals makes it worse:
Why the US has the most mass shootings - CNN
US cops killed 100 times more than German police in 2015
Analysis | American toddlers are still shooting people on a weekly basis this year
Study: Road rage incidents involving guns are increasing

The “boyfriend loophole” in U.S. gun laws is costing women’s lives

More police officers die on the job in states with more guns

Fallen officers: 64 shot dead in the line of duty in 2016 - CNN

FBI: Violent crime increases for second straight year

Moron...the Yakuza in Japan have more guns than members......in Japan...

And we have more guns than people here. So fucking what?

And our gun murder rate went down 49%....and our gun crime rate went down 75%....and our violent crime rate went down 72%....that is so what....banning guns for normal, law abiding people doesn't lower gun crime or violent crime....that is a fact.

Your full of shit , Fact less houses every year have guns in them, fact all crimes including all crimes that their isn't even a thought of using a gun are going down and and these numbers went down all by themselves before the increase of guns being sold . So as usual your full of shit.

 

[Skull Pilot]

When the 2nd amendment was added muskets shot one bullet. Out founders never imagined people would have automatic weapons killing hundreds in a matter of minutes..
It definitely needs a huge overhaul to adjust to modern times.

You think the 2nd amendment is sacred but want to restrict the 1st amendment.
Imagine that.

OK so if you want to be consistent with the 18th century then get rid of your computer, write your post on parchment paper with quill and ink and send it to me by a mail carrier on horseback.

What does your coment even mean.

When some idiot says the second amendment only applies to 18th century technology then all the other original amendments must as well.

The rest you can figure out on your own

 

[Skull Pilot]

Well, it's because I understand liberals, that's why. Let me explain, and please excuse my lack of brevity here:

I was a kid when gay rights was introduced. Back then, they told us all they wanted was to be let out of the closet. So we did. Today they are forcing themselves into our military, forced us to accept their marriages in states that forbade it, and are adopting children.

I remember when the anti-smokers just wanted no smoking in movie theaters. That's all they claimed to have wanted, and they will be happy. Today smoking is forbidden in most public places. There are parks and beaches where smoking is prohibited. Nobody told the law makers that parks and beaches were outside. Now some places won't give you a job if you're a smoker, and nobody even makes a car or truck with ashtrays anymore.

I remember when the environmentalists insisted we get rid of lead in our gasoline. That's all they wanted, and they would be happy. Today we have spent trillions of dollars making everything "greener" and they are complaining now more than ever.

The point is, when it comes to liberal agendas, there is no "we just want X" Because after X comes Y, and after Y comes Z, then Z+, then Z++ and so on.

To put it another way, let's say Hillary won the presidency, and she filled the courts with leftist judges all the way up to the Supreme Court. Do you really believe for one minute our rights to own firearms would be protected in five years or so from now?

Yes obama was going to take all the guns. Funny

You don't think he would of if he could? That's the point I'm making.

You people are complete idiots there is no threat to the second amendment , there are just a lot regulations that need to be added. Tell me how there is a threat to the 2nd when I can buy and own and shoot a Machine gun and buy and shoot a piece of artillery with shells to put in my front yard on display. You are all idiots.

Moron...the democrats put the fight in the courts and in local gun battles...they pass stupid gun laws in various cities, then get them declared constitutional in the Courts...giving all the other gun grabbers power to implement their gun control...

In a country where you can own a machine gun and shoot it every day or buy a piece of artillery and shoot it every day, How the fucjk are you going to convince me that there is a threat to the second amendment.

So there haven't been gun bans on semiautomatic rifles?

And it's not that easy to own a fully automatic weapon. But then again if you knew anything about guns you would know that.

And where do people shoot artillery every day in this country outside of military bases that is?

 

[iceberg]

Well, it's because I understand liberals, that's why. Let me explain, and please excuse my lack of brevity here:

I was a kid when gay rights was introduced. Back then, they told us all they wanted was to be let out of the closet. So we did. Today they are forcing themselves into our military, forced us to accept their marriages in states that forbade it, and are adopting children.

I remember when the anti-smokers just wanted no smoking in movie theaters. That's all they claimed to have wanted, and they will be happy. Today smoking is forbidden in most public places. There are parks and beaches where smoking is prohibited. Nobody told the law makers that parks and beaches were outside. Now some places won't give you a job if you're a smoker, and nobody even makes a car or truck with ashtrays anymore.

I remember when the environmentalists insisted we get rid of lead in our gasoline. That's all they wanted, and they would be happy. Today we have spent trillions of dollars making everything "greener" and they are complaining now more than ever.

The point is, when it comes to liberal agendas, there is no "we just want X" Because after X comes Y, and after Y comes Z, then Z+, then Z++ and so on.

To put it another way, let's say Hillary won the presidency, and she filled the courts with leftist judges all the way up to the Supreme Court. Do you really believe for one minute our rights to own firearms would be protected in five years or so from now?

Yes obama was going to take all the guns. Funny

You don't think he would of if he could? That's the point I'm making.

You people are complete idiots there is no threat to the second amendment , there are just a lot regulations that need to be added. Tell me how there is a threat to the 2nd when I can buy and own and shoot a Machine gun and buy and shoot a piece of artillery with shells to put in my front yard on display. You are all idiots.

You can buy a gun in New York, after jumping through countless legal hoops and paying through the nose for it, but you cannot get a concealed carry permit, and there is no open carry. In other words, you have to keep it in your home where it's no use to you if you're not there. The criminals know this, which is why New York has such a high crime rate. Now, if you allowed people to carry those guns, the crime rate would drop. Do you deny this? Please say yes. I could use a good laugh.

Total nonsense , there is zero threat from the left as far as the 2nd is concerned , the only threat is from the gun Bubba's that think that there can't be regulations or shouldn't be regulations to something as lethal as a gun. The people will get so pissed off at these stupid comments about guns from the gun Bubba's that they will go after the 2nd to shut these half wits up.

Bring it on. Not like many on the left arent pretty damn ignorant about guns anyway.

 

[iceberg]

THAT'S THE POINT!!! You can create all the laws you like, but you're never going to disarm the criminal. They will always have access to guns and will use them. All you'd really do is disarm the victims, and that only makes the problem worse.

Actually arming the criminals makes it worse:
Why the US has the most mass shootings - CNN
US cops killed 100 times more than German police in 2015
Analysis | American toddlers are still shooting people on a weekly basis this year
Study: Road rage incidents involving guns are increasing

The “boyfriend loophole” in U.S. gun laws is costing women’s lives

More police officers die on the job in states with more guns

Fallen officers: 64 shot dead in the line of duty in 2016 - CNN

FBI: Violent crime increases for second straight year

Moron...the Yakuza in Japan have more guns than members......in Japan...

And we have more guns than people here. So fucking what?

And our gun murder rate went down 49%....and our gun crime rate went down 75%....and our violent crime rate went down 72%....that is so what....banning guns for normal, law abiding people doesn't lower gun crime or violent crime....that is a fact.

Your full of shit , Fact less houses every year have guns in them, fact all crimes including all crimes that their isn't even a thought of using a gun are going down and and these numbers went down all by themselves before the increase of guns being sold . So as usual your full of shit.

Links to these "facts"?

FYI... This bullshitting attitude like yours are why people will not compromise.