Trump's Appeal to Conservatives

[Londoner]

Conservatism is actually the antithesis of Ideology. It is the pragmatic approach.

Conservatism is the respect for tradition, and preserving the longstanding and durable social institutions & mores of the culture. Conservatism preserves and conserves. It is reactionary (to change) rather than revolutionary. Eisenhower was being conservative when he acted to preserve the New Deal and Big Government infrastructure projects, which played a role in building the nation. Reagan was being liberal and revolutionary when he decided to break the consensus for the New Deal with the help of an organized, top-down movement. Indeed, movement deployed an army of think tanks and media assets for the sole purpose of changing (rather than celebrating) American opinion. Again liberals are known for imposing change rather than preserving the dominant consensus. Liberals believe they know best, and they see no problem imposing their vision.

OP. Please study the French Revolution and Burke's response to it. This is classic Left versus Right.

Conserving your use of the word pragmatic or practical. To the extent that respecting tradition is pragmatic, conservatism is pragmatic - but it always opts for the preservation of tradition over doing what is merely convenient, effective or easy. Be careful confusing pragmatism with conservatism, or Edmund Burke with William James. They are different. And don't kid yourself, the current Republican Party is not filled with pragmatic deal makers who settle for the legislation that is possible. They are 100% committed to ideology - they believe that any and all deal making is evil because it doesn't fit their ideological purity RE taxes & regulations. This is why they sing Norquist's pledge.

Trump is not a conservative; he is a self-aggrandizing narcissist who is saying whatever is necessary to win conservative votes. He is appealing to voters who are fed up with politicians and Washington. He is this cycles straight talker. The Republican Party always runs a straight talker.

Having said that, Trump is better than Cruz, who is a dangerous ideologue.

Trump had the courage to admit that George Bush destroyed Iraq and the economy. He is telling talk radio cheerleaders some inconvenient truths. Although he is relying on heavily scripted bullshit to appeal to the very naive tea party, he has a capacity to be honest that Cruz can't touch. Standing side by side, Trump sounds like a loud mouth baboon, but Cruz seems downright evil and creepy.

Anyone but Cruz.

 

[imawhosure]

I don't know why everyone is Assuming his supporters have to be Conservatives. Unless someone has gone to one of his rally's and took a poll of everyone there. Then I find this offensive to just assume that's who is supporting him. Where did this attacking your own Republican party supporters come from? That used to be a no no. But then so did attacking a candidates baby with downs syndrome.

Conservatives have taken a bum rap for many years because we've been "led" by a series of people who don't really understand what Conservative philosophy is. Reagan understood, but since Reagan we've had the Bushes, McCain, Romney, etc. None of them understand Conservative philosophy. They understand Republicanism... they might understand Social Conservative ideology... they might be a markedly better alternative to Socialist left ideology but none of it means they truly understand core Conservative philosophy.

I think a lot of Trump's support are philosophical Conservatives whether they identify as that or not. The "brand" has been so damaged by the "FAR RIGHT" rhetoric from the left which has simply gone unchecked for years that a lot of true Conservatives simply no longer identify as such. They don't want to be labeled "Teabagger Wackos" or denigrated as religious nuts, homophobes and racists. It's not who they are and not what they believe.

Boss, your thoughts are interesting, and thought provoking. Thanks for posting something that actually encompasses a thought process.

As far as the lefties, they are floundering and they know it. Just snicker as if they can't unload Hillary, they are going to get a severe spanking and control nothing! Most leading lefties know this, and the Hillary mouthpieces on here are either ignorant of it, or are trying to put on a brave face, lol.

Thnx again Boss!

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

I don't know why everyone is Assuming his supporters have to be Conservatives. Unless someone has gone to one of his rally's and took a poll of everyone there. Then I find this offensive to just assume that's who is supporting him. Where did this attacking your own Republican party supporters come from? That used to be a no no. But then so did attacking a candidates baby with downs syndrome.

Because his supporters are stupid, gullible, hateful, and politically unsophisticated. So you just assume they are all conservatives like yourself.

Oh palease.... anyone supporting a Sanders or Clinton ticket is about as stupid, gullible, hateful and unsophisticated as it gets.

I'll agree with you about Sanders supporters. The mathematics do not add up for his crazy and frankly dangerous programs and policies. He's not living in the real world.

Us Clinton supporters are supporting the candidate with the best resume in the field; the most experience of anyone to seek the office since Bush Sr. And someone who isn't running from Megan Kelly because she's mean. We're not talking about Tim Russert or Sam Donaldson...Megan Kelly????

You leftists crack me up... you blindly support anyone your party throws at you as long as you think they're gonna stick to the "other guy" in order to get you some free shit and then call the other guys stupid.

Still waiting for my "free shit" from Obama.

Geeze.. get over yourselves.. you're all as dopey as it gets.

Here is your messiah making fun of a man with birth defects:

Double-down on the stupid and tell us why that was justified or run along little boy.

That's it? Some childish little internet meme? That's your answer to my assertion?

No. That is a video of your Messiah, The Donald. A meme is when you add your own words or cartoons or whatever. This is raw feed.
You can look up the video on-line.

And when did I ever claim that Trump was my messiah?

About the same time anyone here claimed Obama was a Messiah.

And I stand by what I said earlier, all the Dems have is class warfare, stupid musings about mythical one-per-centers and climate change. Shit, you guys voted a for a junior senator with no experience based on "Yes we can" and "Hope and change".

332-206
More than "us guys" voted for him. Says a lot about the guys you've supported....

Climate change is quite real as almost every scientist on earth will attest.

Say, isn't Ted Cruz a junior Senator with no experience? Oh wait, I must be thinking of another Canadian.

Yeah yeah yeah... "Hope and Change", "Yes we can" and Climate change.

Yeah, you're a fucking genius.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

Oh, and BTW... BTW.. Cruz was an domestic policy advisory to GWB, Associate Attorney General, Solicitor General, adjunct professor of law, chairs the Senate and United States Senate Judiciary Subcommittee on Oversight, Federal Rights and Agency Activities, and is also the chairman of the United States Senate Commerce Subcommittee on Space, Science and Competitiveness.

Any one of those is far more than Obumbler has ever done prior to being POTUS.

 

[Londoner]

Don't kid yourself, the current Republican Party is NOT filled with pragmatic deal makers who settle for the legislation that is possible. They are 100% committed to ideology - they believe that any and all deal making is evil because it doesn't fit their ideological purity RE taxes & regulations. This is why they sign Grover Norquist's pledge which prohibits compromise.

The current Republican Party is NOT allowed to be practical. They either get 100% of what they want or they are removed in the next primary, vilified as RHINOs. When John McCain worked with Teddy Kennedy to create legislation that reflected the practical reality of divided government, the democratic voter was happy to see our leaders overcome dysfunction and at least try to solve problems. The rightwing voter, however, went nuts because ideological purity - getting 100% of what you want - is the only standard. Anything short of that is treasonous.

God help us, because one of this nation's two major parties views the practical necessity of governing with the other side as treason. The framers constructed this country with divided government, so when Republican voters refuse to let their politicians work with the other side, we have living proof that ideological purity is more important than the practical demands of getting things done in a system built around divided government and shared power.

 

[candycorn]

Because his supporters are stupid, gullible, hateful, and politically unsophisticated. So you just assume they are all conservatives like yourself.

Oh palease.... anyone supporting a Sanders or Clinton ticket is about as stupid, gullible, hateful and unsophisticated as it gets.

I'll agree with you about Sanders supporters. The mathematics do not add up for his crazy and frankly dangerous programs and policies. He's not living in the real world.

Us Clinton supporters are supporting the candidate with the best resume in the field; the most experience of anyone to seek the office since Bush Sr. And someone who isn't running from Megan Kelly because she's mean. We're not talking about Tim Russert or Sam Donaldson...Megan Kelly????

You leftists crack me up... you blindly support anyone your party throws at you as long as you think they're gonna stick to the "other guy" in order to get you some free shit and then call the other guys stupid.

Still waiting for my "free shit" from Obama.

Geeze.. get over yourselves.. you're all as dopey as it gets.

Here is your messiah making fun of a man with birth defects:

Double-down on the stupid and tell us why that was justified or run along little boy.

That's it? Some childish little internet meme? That's your answer to my assertion?

No. That is a video of your Messiah, The Donald. A meme is when you add your own words or cartoons or whatever. This is raw feed.
You can look up the video on-line.

And when did I ever claim that Trump was my messiah?

About the same time anyone here claimed Obama was a Messiah.

And I stand by what I said earlier, all the Dems have is class warfare, stupid musings about mythical one-per-centers and climate change. Shit, you guys voted a for a junior senator with no experience based on "Yes we can" and "Hope and change".

332-206
More than "us guys" voted for him. Says a lot about the guys you've supported....

Climate change is quite real as almost every scientist on earth will attest.

Say, isn't Ted Cruz a junior Senator with no experience? Oh wait, I must be thinking of another Canadian.

Yeah yeah yeah... "Hope and Change", "Yes we can" and Climate change.

Yeah, you're a fucking genius.

Compared to you....yes I am.

 

[candycorn]

Oh, and BTW... BTW.. Cruz was an domestic policy advisory to GWB, Associate Attorney General, Solicitor General, adjunct professor of law, chairs the Senate and United States Senate Judiciary Subcommittee on Oversight, Federal Rights and Agency Activities, and is also the chairman of the United States Senate Commerce Subcommittee on Space, Science and Competitiveness.

Any one of those is far more than Obumbler has ever done prior to being POTUS.

He was appointed to useless subcommittees with little or no power, and an advisor to the last President to be certified as a natural disaster.

Wow...no wonder he can spend 8 months campaigning; he's not doing anything in the Senate.

 

[oreo]

We hear all kinds of opinions on why people think Trump is appealing so strongly with Conservatives. What is somewhat confusing is how there seems to be SOME Conservatives who vehemently don't like Trump while others do... so what is the deal here? Are the ones who like Trump just naive and stupid? Are the ones who don't like Trump just paranoid and disillusioned? Let us throw out the OBVIOUS disdain from the liberal left Democrats who HATE Trump and any other potential Republican or person to the right of Chairman Mao... What is it about Trump that is appealing so strongly to so many Conservatives?

I personally think the very thing that many Conservatives complain about with Trump is the exact thing that appeals to so many other Conservatives. The complaint is that Trump doesn't really stand for a conservative ideology... and that's the point... he is NOT ideological! He is tapping in to something I have been vocal about here for years... Conservatism is NOT an ideology, it's an overall philosophy.

Conservatism is actually the antithesis of Ideology. It is the pragmatic approach to problem solving. Reasoned and rational solutions that are time tested and proven as opposed to some rigid ideological bent that must be adhered to in all circumstances. Looking at a problem from all sides and formulating a strategy which considers the human equation. Not being so tied to an ideological difference that you can't see any other possibility before you. It's not "go along to get along" but rather a reasoned pragmatism which considers both sides of the coin.

I think Ronald Reagan, although he articulated this better than Trump, tapped in to the same sentiment. This is precisely what promulgated the "Reagan Democrat" and was highly responsible for his immense popularity. Think about, when you encounter people who hate Reagan or hate Trump, they tend to be the more ideological type. Whether from the left or right, they are the "extremists" and they don't like Trump because he doesn't fit their mold. How many times do we hear and see the examples of how he's "not a true conservative"? It usually centers on something that he has favored or taken a position on in the past that is inconsistent with values or perceptions of what a "true" conservative is supposed to be.

This has got to be a huge advantage for him politically because he is not tied to "far-right" or "far-left" radicalism. And I think THAT is his major appeal to so many true philosophical conservatives. I also think this will be a great appeal to so-called independents and moderates. He represents the type of person they are looking for in a leader... someone who isn't rooted in some extremist rhetorical ideology but rather a problem solver who can step outside the box of political correctness or partisan politics to affect change. I think he poses a huge political problem for the ideologues on both sides because he also has a certain charisma that others don't have. Even when he is wrong he is interesting.

I am a fiscal conservative independent. I am not interested in Social Issues that belong in the U.S. Supreme court--and I would never vote for Donald Trump.

Donald Trump is no Ronald Reagan--Trump has a real track record of supporting very liberal democrat policies. They don't call Trump the liberals--liberal for no reason.

Trump supported:
1. Obama's 878 billion dollar stimulus bill during a FOX news interview with Bill O'Reilly.
That Time Donald Trump Praised The Stimulus Package On Fox News

2. Trump is off the charts on Eminent Domain.
Donald Trump: 'Eminent Domain Is Wonderful'
Donald Trump's eminent domain love nearly cost a widow her house | David Boaz

3. Trump wants Obamacare to go to single payer.
Donald Trump wants to replace Obamacare with a single-payer health care system, GOP congressman says

Donald Trump is all LIBERAL--there is nothing conservative about him. He's all about the show.

Frankly, if he can't handle Megyn Kelly of FOX News--there is no description in this that I can think of that qualifies him to be POTUS.

I think his supporters think they have some kind of John Wayne, but what they really have is Pee Wee Herman.

 

[Boss]

We hear all kinds of opinions on why people think Trump is appealing so strongly with Conservatives. What is somewhat confusing is how there seems to be SOME Conservatives who vehemently don't like Trump while others do... so what is the deal here? Are the ones who like Trump just naive and stupid? Are the ones who don't like Trump just paranoid and disillusioned? Let us throw out the OBVIOUS disdain from the liberal left Democrats who HATE Trump and any other potential Republican or person to the right of Chairman Mao... What is it about Trump that is appealing so strongly to so many Conservatives?

I personally think the very thing that many Conservatives complain about with Trump is the exact thing that appeals to so many other Conservatives. The complaint is that Trump doesn't really stand for a conservative ideology... and that's the point... he is NOT ideological! He is tapping in to something I have been vocal about here for years... Conservatism is NOT an ideology, it's an overall philosophy.

Conservatism is actually the antithesis of Ideology. It is the pragmatic approach to problem solving. Reasoned and rational solutions that are time tested and proven as opposed to some rigid ideological bent that must be adhered to in all circumstances. Looking at a problem from all sides and formulating a strategy which considers the human equation. Not being so tied to an ideological difference that you can't see any other possibility before you. It's not "go along to get along" but rather a reasoned pragmatism which considers both sides of the coin.

I think Ronald Reagan, although he articulated this better than Trump, tapped in to the same sentiment. This is precisely what promulgated the "Reagan Democrat" and was highly responsible for his immense popularity. Think about, when you encounter people who hate Reagan or hate Trump, they tend to be the more ideological type. Whether from the left or right, they are the "extremists" and they don't like Trump because he doesn't fit their mold. How many times do we hear and see the examples of how he's "not a true conservative"? It usually centers on something that he has favored or taken a position on in the past that is inconsistent with values or perceptions of what a "true" conservative is supposed to be.

This has got to be a huge advantage for him politically because he is not tied to "far-right" or "far-left" radicalism. And I think THAT is his major appeal to so many true philosophical conservatives. I also think this will be a great appeal to so-called independents and moderates. He represents the type of person they are looking for in a leader... someone who isn't rooted in some extremist rhetorical ideology but rather a problem solver who can step outside the box of political correctness or partisan politics to affect change. I think he poses a huge political problem for the ideologues on both sides because he also has a certain charisma that others don't have. Even when he is wrong he is interesting.

I am a fiscal conservative independent. I am not interested in Social Issues that belong in the U.S. Supreme court--and I would never vote for Donald Trump.

Donald Trump is no Ronald Reagan--Trump has a real track record of supporting very liberal democrat policies. They don't call Trump the liberals--liberal for no reason.

Trump supported:
1. Obama's 878 billion dollar stimulus bill during a FOX news interview with Bill O'Reilly.
That Time Donald Trump Praised The Stimulus Package On Fox News

2. Trump is off the charts on Eminent Domain.
Donald Trump: 'Eminent Domain Is Wonderful'
Donald Trump's eminent domain love nearly cost a widow her house | David Boaz

3. Trump wants Obamacare to go to single payer.
Donald Trump wants to replace Obamacare with a single-payer health care system, GOP congressman says

Donald Trump is all LIBERAL--there is nothing conservative about him. He's all about the show.

Frankly, if he can't handle Megyn Kelly of FOX News--there is no description in this that I can think of that qualifies him to be POTUS.

I think his supporters think they have some kind of John Wayne, but what they really have is Pee Wee Herman.

Well, don't think you're going to get me to defend Trump as some rock-rib conservative. I understand that he has not had a track record of supporting traditional conservative issues or taking conservative positions. But here is the catch... we are currently in a very polarized political stalemate between left and right. Something eventually has to give or we'll end up in another Civil War, that should be clear. The Right is not going to dry up and blow away... as much as the Liberal Left may wish that to be so.... just not going to ever happen. And the Left is not going away either. So, at some point, if we EVER expect to get back to the basics of compromise and working together, something has to shake things up. Maybe Trump is the catalyst for that change?

 

[Correll]

Yeah! Common sense! it doesn't take experience, gravitas or superior intellect. All we need is a guy with common sense. We need someone to make our problems sound simple.....then we can have simple solutions! Weeeeeeeee!

that's what happens when someone appeals to simplistic people.

All you just did was reveal was how narrow minded and arrogant you are.

how so? because I understand that he's providing simplistic hate-filled answers to simplistic people?

yokie dokie.

Enforcing Immigration laws and renegotiating bad trade deals is not hateful.

It's might be simple. But that does not mean it is wrong.

 

[Correll]

Don't kid yourself, the current Republican Party is NOT filled with pragmatic deal makers who settle for the legislation that is possible. They are 100% committed to ideology - they believe that any and all deal making is evil because it doesn't fit their ideological purity RE taxes & regulations. This is why they sign Grover Norquist's pledge which prohibits compromise.

The current Republican Party is NOT allowed to be practical. They either get 100% of what they want or they are removed in the next primary, vilified as RHINOs. When John McCain worked with Teddy Kennedy to create legislation that reflected the practical reality of divided government, the democratic voter was happy to see our leaders overcome dysfunction and at least try to solve problems. The rightwing voter, however, went nuts because ideological purity - getting 100% of what you want - is the only standard. Anything short of that is treasonous.

God help us, because one of this nation's two major parties views the practical necessity of governing with the other side as treason. The framers constructed this country with divided government, so when Republican voters refuse to let their politicians work with the other side, we have living proof that ideological purity is more important than the practical demands of getting things done in a system built around divided government and shared power.

McCain won the REpublican NOmination.

You are wrong.