Ukraine Pleads with US to Send Missiles

[AntonToo]

Ukraine violated those agreements by killing Russians in Ukraine.

They brought this upon themselves.

What "killing Russians in Ukraine"? What the fuck are talking about?

 

[DarthTrader]

Again..........SOURCE.......Not long ago Ukraine claimed mass graves with hands tied behind their backs......men women and children there..

Don't tell me there aren't 2 sides to these stories...............

I remember in Bosnia ........Serbs there butchered men women and children until Clinton finally hit them.........at the end Russian troops came there threatening us with War..........even though the Serbs committed genocide.........PROVEN........in stadiums...butchering everyone.

Serbs killed Muslim invaders who never belonged there.

 

[DarthTrader]

What "killing Russians in Ukraine"? What the fuck are talking about?

Oh you don't know shit...of course.

 

[Rigby5]

And yet Putin did it and Lied about it............the reason for the INF was to end that......so NO ACCIDENTS HAPPEN.......Not a good idea to have your finger on a trigger all the time.

By his doing so......caused a response..........We have NO REASON TO APOLOGIZE for the response..........he pointed them at Europe firtst..........then goes I'M UPSET when missiles get pointed back.

Wah..................

First of all, it was not Russia but the USSR that signed the INF treaty.
Second is that Trump also withdrew from the INF treaty in 2019.
So then what is the point?

{...
The Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty (INF Treaty, formally the Treaty Between the United States of America and the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics on the Elimination of Their Intermediate-Range and Shorter-Range Missiles; Russian: Договор о ликвидации ракет средней и меньшей дальности / ДРСМД, Dogovor o likvidatsiy raket sredney i menshey dalnosti / DRSMD) was an arms control treaty between the United States and the Soviet Union (and its successor state, the Russian Federation). US President Ronald Reagan and Soviet General Secretary Mikhail Gorbachev signed the treaty on 8 December 1987.[1][2] The US Senate approved the treaty on 27 May 1988, and Reagan and Gorbachev ratified it on 1 June 1988.[2][3]

The INF Treaty banned all of the two nations' land-based ballistic missiles, cruise missiles, and missile launchers with ranges of 500–1,000 kilometers (310–620 mi) (short medium-range) and 1,000–5,500 km (620–3,420 mi) (intermediate-range). The treaty did not apply to air- or sea-launched missiles.[4][5] By May 1991, the nations had eliminated 2,692 missiles, followed by 10 years of on-site verification inspections.[6]

Amidst continuing growth of China's missile forces, US President Donald Trump announced on 20 October 2018 that he was withdrawing the US from the treaty due to supposed Russian non-compliance.[7][8] The United States claimed another reason for the withdrawal was to counter a Chinese arms buildup in the Pacific, including within the South China Sea, as China was not a signatory to the treaty.[7][9][10] The US formally suspended the treaty on 1 February 2019,[11] and Russia did so on the following day in response.[citation needed] The US formally withdrew from the treaty on 2 August 2019.[12]
...}

But according to the Russians, it was the US who violated the treaty.

{...
According to Russian officials and the American academic Theodore Postol, the US decision to deploy its missile defense system in Europe was a violation of the treaty as they claim they could be quickly retrofitted with offensive capabilities;[57][58][59] this accusation has in turn been rejected by US and NATO officials and analyst Jeffrey Lewis.[59][60] Russian experts also stated that the US usage of target missiles and unmanned aerial vehicles, such as the MQ-9 Reaper and MQ-4 Triton, violated the INF Treaty[61] which has also in turn been rejected by US officials.[62]
...}

It is true the US ABM system used nuclear warheads, so could easily have also been used offensively.

 

[AntonToo]

Wrong.
The Crimea has been ethnic Russian for over 1000 years, and was part of Russia in 1954.
Khrushchev would not have given the Crimea to the Ukraine if he had not secretly been Ukrainian.

Russia recognized Crimea to be part of sovereign Ukraine in 1954 and it remained Ukrainian territory untill 2014 when Putin ordered invasion and annexation of it.

Is that true or false? Come on moron, you can do this.

 

[eagle1462010]

Serbs killed Muslim invaders who never belonged there.

They killed men women and children.......mass murder.....

And in response our airforce fucked up the serbs..........Ivan got mad and threatened War there.......

The War ended and so did the genocide.........with both our sides pointing guns at each other again.

Imagine that Ivan..............

 

[bripat9643]

What does that have to do with anything?
The point is the Ukraine signed a treaty to NOT join NATO.
Trying to join NATO is an act of war, similar to the USSR putting nukes in Cuba, so can't be allowed.
It is an act of war.

No, it' not an act of war. Countries violate treaties all the time without going to war.

 

[Rigby5]

Again..........SOURCE.......Not long ago Ukraine claimed mass graves with hands tied behind their backs......men women and children there..

Don't tell me there aren't 2 sides to these stories...............

I remember in Bosnia ........Serbs there butchered men women and children until Clinton finally hit them.........at the end Russian troops came there threatening us with War..........even though the Serbs committed genocide.........PROVEN........in stadiums...butchering everyone.

Wrong.
The mass graves were ethnic Russians, not ethnic Ukrainians.
Just like at Bucha.
If Russians had done it they would have brought tie straps.
They would not have improvised pieces of cloth, plastic bags, etc.
These murders were by AZOV, not Russians.

 

[eagle1462010]

First of all, it was not Russia but the USSR that signed the INF treaty.
Second is that Trump also withdrew from the INF treaty in 2019.
So then what is the point?

lol

You are in a thread pissed off about NATO pointing missiles at Russia.........and WHAT'S THE POINT........Putin pointed first...........and was still supposed to honor the INF TREATY........to prevent Nuclear War.............HE LIED.......

And we point back and he GET'S BUTT HURT................FUCK HIM..........Europe has every right to point missiles back at him.........if he doesn't like that OH WELL.

 

[AntonToo]

Oh you don't know shit...of course.

I "know shit" which is exactly why I want him to answer that question.

Checkmate is ready.

 

[Rigby5]

No, it' not an act of war. Countries violate treaties all the time without going to war.

Not when the treaty is about nukes on your border.
The US would have gone to war with Russia over nukes in Cuba.
Anyone would go to war over an attempt to put nukes on your border, because the only reason to put nukes on the border is for a first strike.

 

[eagle1462010]

Not when the treaty is about nukes on your border.
The US would have gone to war with Russia over nukes in Cuba.
Anyone would go to war over an attempt to put nukes on your border, because the only reason to put nukes on the border is for a first strike.

And Putin put nukes on the border of EUROPE..............FUCK IT.

We should just go in and fuck Russia up then.

We have a right to do it...........by your reasoning.........He aimed medium ranged cruise missiles that could be nukes at EUROPE.

By your justification we can go KILL RUSSIANS THEN.

 

[Rigby5]

lol

You are in a thread pissed off about NATO pointing missiles at Russia.........and WHAT'S THE POINT........Putin pointed first...........and was still supposed to honor the INF TREATY........to prevent Nuclear War.............HE LIED.......

And we point back and he GET'S BUTT HURT................FUCK HIM..........Europe has every right to point missiles back at him.........if he doesn't like that OH WELL.

Wrong.
Putin disagreed about the range of missile Russia was only testing.
They were not mass producing or installing.
So there was no Russian violation of the INF.
And since other NATO countries were not following the INF treaty it was useless and obsolete.
The INF treaty was making nuclear war more likely by preventing Russia from having a deterrent against other nuclear NATO countries.

 

[eagle1462010]

Wrong.
Putin disagreed about the range of missile Russia was only testing.
They were not mass producing or installing.
So there was no Russian violation of the INF.
And since other NATO countries were not following the INF treaty it was useless and obsolete.
The INF treaty was making nuclear war more likely by preventing Russia from having a deterrent against other nuclear NATO countries.

BS.......He wasn't even supposed to be testing them

Fuck him............if he aims them at us we have every right to aim back.

If he doesn't like it..........then pull the dang trigger and lets get this over with.

 

[Rigby5]

And Putin put nukes on the border of EUROPE..............FUCK IT.

We should just go in and fuck Russia up then.

We have a right to do it...........by your reasoning.........He aimed medium ranged cruise missiles that could be nukes at EUROPE.

By your justification we can go KILL RUSSIANS THEN.

WRONG!

Putin NEVER put nukes on the border of Europe.
Putin was only TESTING cruise missiles we claimed had too great a range.
You are lying.

 

[AntonToo]

No, it' not an act of war. Countries violate treaties all the time without going to war.

Ukraine did not violate any treaty. Russia torn up all treaties by invading Ukraine and annexing Crimea.

That act pushed Ukraine to seek NATO membership to ensure it's long term security.

 

[eagle1462010]

 

[eagle1462010]

WRONG!

Putin NEVER put nukes on the border of Europe.
Putin was only TESTING cruise missiles we claimed had too great a range.
You are lying.

And I posted information from the State dept that Putin is LYING...........

And they weren't even in Ukraine................You can't point weapons at NATO in their back yard and not expect them to point back at you. That is STUPID.

Putin LIED..........and this is a NATO ISSUE versus Russia issue.......NOT UKRAINE as they are not NATO.

 

[Rigby5]

BS.......He wasn't even supposed to be testing them

Fuck him............if he aims them at us we have every right to aim back.

If he doesn't like it..........then pull the dang trigger and lets get this over with.

Wrong.
Testing was not part of the INF treaty.
And the INF treaty clearly was obsolete since no other country was bound by it.
It was EUROPE who was pointing the threatening missiles, NOT Russia.
Putin was NOT aiming any new missiles at the US, because that took a longer range.

 

[bripat9643]

Not when the treaty is about nukes on your border.
The US would have gone to war with Russia over nukes in Cuba.
Anyone would go to war over an attempt to put nukes on your border, because the only reason to put nukes on the border is for a first strike.

Wrong:

Examining SALT Violations and the Problems of Verification