Understanding Christianity

[Meriweather]

That's why I'm agnostic, because I see no proof yet either way, for or against a god. You've settled on a god you have no possibility of proving. It's kinda sad actually.

Don't be sad. God has made Himself known to me. Therefore every time I hear or read Jesus saying, "You believe because you have seen. Blessed are those who have not seen yet believe," I know I am not as blessed as others. That's kind of the way God is.

You want me to prove God to you? Go be open to God and His proofs. It is not I who can "prove" God with my experiences. Go do your own exploring. I always recommend these two points:

a) Don't go on a search for who/what you think God is. Who you think God is doesn't exist, and therefore you are correct not to believe that version of God. Allow Him to reveal Himself.
b) God's revelations are more likely to be found in the tiny whispers than what is big and powerful.

You may ask me to prove who my best friend is. I can tell you the name, but there is no way it can be proved. You either take my word as truthful...or you don't. It means nothing to me either way. You have my testimony. It's up to you what you choose to do with it.

 

[Meriweather]

So you just decide, hey, that was a brush with god! Because you feel like it. Got it. Pretty lame as well.

There is not a desk and computer in front of me because I "feel like it." I describe what is actually here. You can believe me or not. For all you know I could be sitting outside with a laptop typing this, just telling you I am actually inside.

Again, my experiences cannot to be anything other than "lame" to those who turn their backs and refuse to see.

 

[Meriweather]

So why doesn't he cure everyone of cancer?

That's what I mean earlier. You have this idea of what God "should" act like, and what He should be. No wonder people often miss seeing/hearing Him. They can't take their eyes off their own creation and simply let God be God. As He described Himself in Exodus: I am who I am; or, I'll be who I will be.

Many people who give up seeking God do so because they came to the realization that God is not a genii who can be manipulated into granting personal wishes. This being the case, they see God as of no use to them. And truly, if people are looking for a Genii, God is of no use in this role.

 

[Taz]

So why doesn't he cure everyone of cancer?

That's what I mean earlier. You have this idea of what God "should" act like, and what He should be. No wonder people often miss seeing/hearing Him. They can't take their eyes off their own creation and simply let God be God. As He described Himself in Exodus: I am who I am; or, I'll be who I will be.

Many people who give up seeking God do so because they came to the realization that God is not a genii who can be manipulated into granting personal wishes. This being the case, they see God as of no use to them. And truly, if people are looking for a Genii, God is of no use in this role.

That was a man describing god describing himself in Exodus. Nothing more, nothing less.

As for me asking why god doesn't cure everyone of cancer, the guy I was replying to said that jesus saved him, so I asked, why doesn't he save everyone then?

 

[Taz]

So you just decide, hey, that was a brush with god! Because you feel like it. Got it. Pretty lame as well.

There is not a desk and computer in front of me because I "feel like it." I describe what is actually here. You can believe me or not. For all you know I could be sitting outside with a laptop typing this, just telling you I am actually inside.

Again, my experiences cannot to be anything other than "lame" to those who turn their backs and refuse to see.

So you admit that it's a subjective brush with god, not an actual brush with god. Good for you.

 

[Taz]

That's why I'm agnostic, because I see no proof yet either way, for or against a god. You've settled on a god you have no possibility of proving. It's kinda sad actually.

Don't be sad. God has made Himself known to me. Therefore every time I hear or read Jesus saying, "You believe because you have seen. Blessed are those who have not seen yet believe," I know I am not as blessed as others. That's kind of the way God is.

You want me to prove God to you? Go be open to God and His proofs. It is not I who can "prove" God with my experiences. Go do your own exploring. I always recommend these two points:

a) Don't go on a search for who/what you think God is. Who you think God is doesn't exist, and therefore you are correct not to believe that version of God. Allow Him to reveal Himself.
b) God's revelations are more likely to be found in the tiny whispers than what is big and powerful.

You may ask me to prove who my best friend is. I can tell you the name, but there is no way it can be proved. You either take my word as truthful...or you don't. It means nothing to me either way. You have my testimony. It's up to you what you choose to do with it.

I'm open to god revealing himself to me. No problem. Except I get nothing. Why?

 

[Meriweather]

So you admit that it's a subjective brush with god, not an actual brush with god. Good for you.

If it makes you feel better to think it was subjective, be my guest.

 

[Meriweather]

I'm open to god revealing himself to me. No problem. Except I get nothing. Why?

Are you seeking?

 

[Taz]

So you admit that it's a subjective brush with god, not an actual brush with god. Good for you.

If it makes you feel better to think it was subjective, be my guest.

Then what's your proof? If it's not substantial, then it's subjective.

 

[Taz]

I'm open to god revealing himself to me. No problem. Except I get nothing. Why?

Are you seeking?

Yes, for decades. That's one of the reasons that I'm here, to see if anyone has any actual proof of a god, or an experience with god. So far, nothing. Lots of people say they have, but not much to chew on. Like, where's the beef?

 

[Meriweather]

Then what's your proof? If it's not substantial, then it's subjective.

Ah. Then since I can't prove my friend and I went on a drive, that event was subjective. By your definition the greater percentage of the events in our life are subjective.

 

[Meriweather]

Yes, for decades. That's one of the reasons that I'm here, to see if anyone has any actual proof of a god, or an experience with god. So far, nothing. Lots of people say they have, but not much to chew on. Like, where's the beef?

Sounds like you gave up. My suggestion: Don't give up; keep exploring.

 

[JohnPrewett]

from that moment till now I've never doubted that Jesus is alive with power and has me (and everyone) under surveillance.

QUOTE="HaShev, post: 18117943, member: 19748"] So you think Google is Jesus? *L*[/QUOTE]

No, Jesus is more powerful than Google. No kidding.[/QUOTE]

Then bring him to the forum, should not be a problem right, or is he sleeping? ..............

Have a nice day. JP

 

[Taz]

Then what's your proof? If it's not substantial, then it's subjective.

Ah. Then since I can't prove my friend and I went on a drive, that event was subjective. By your definition the greater percentage of the events in our life are subjective.

You're confused, your friend can be proven to be real. Your god, not so much.

 

[Taz]

Yes, for decades. That's one of the reasons that I'm here, to see if anyone has any actual proof of a god, or an experience with god. So far, nothing. Lots of people say they have, but not much to chew on. Like, where's the beef?

Sounds like you gave up. My suggestion: Don't give up; keep exploring.

I'm here, god can contact me any time it wants. If it chooses not to, then it's either non-existent or simply a big fat douchebag.

 

[Meriweather]

You're confused, your friend can be proven to be real. Your god, not so much.

No, I am not confused. My friend passed away some time ago. You only have my word that we were friends and that we did things together. I very much doubt you could "prove" what I say about her. You must have faith in what I tell you.

Same thing with my experiences of God. If there is not a God, then I couldn't have had those experiences. Neither could anyone else whose accounts are documented.

 

[Taz]

You're confused, your friend can be proven to be real. Your god, not so much.

No, I am not confused. My friend passed away some time ago. You only have my word that we were friends and that we did things together. I very much doubt you could "prove" what I say about her. You must have faith in what I tell you.

Same thing with my experiences of God. If there is not a God, then I couldn't have had those experiences. Neither could anyone else whose accounts are documented.

Your friend's grave can be visited for proof, and I can ask other people about this person's personality... your god, not so much.

 

[Meriweather]

Your friend's grave can be visited for proof, and I can ask other people about this person's personality... your god, not so much.

Ever hear of scattering ashes.... You can ask others about her personality, but that will not prove that we actually did what I present. They weren't around. But enough. I am certain you understand my point. People down through the ages, and people currently living, have had experiences of God and are willing to stand up and say so despite scoffers who only scoff because they personally require physical proof from God.

 

[Taz]

Your friend's grave can be visited for proof, and I can ask other people about this person's personality... your god, not so much.

Ever hear of scattering ashes.... You can ask others about her personality, but that will not prove that we actually did what I present. They weren't around. But enough. I am certain you understand my point. People down through the ages, and people currently living, have had experiences of God and are willing to stand up and say so despite scoffers who only scoff because they personally require physical proof from God.

Don't you find it a tad strange that NO ONE has ever come forward with real proof of your invisible god? Not. One. Shred.

 

[OnePercenter]

That's poor reasoning on your part. It does not follow from my comments that i would be ignorant of that idea.

And it has always been silly. The main reason being, one can "reason" anything, and if one starts from bad premises or bad evidence, one can reason amything false or unsupported to be true.

No, it's not poor reasoning. The remark came across as ignorant and vulgar--and the vulgarity only served to emphasize the ignorance.

As we cannot read minds, I always recommend people present their own beliefs and leave it to others to present theirs. Reasoning can--and often does--start with facts and good premises as well. Can it be misused? Sure.

While it was vulgar, it was in no way ignorant. "Reason-based faith" is still faith. And a distinction must be drawn between this and, for instance, using deductive reasoning to make a prediction from a scientifc theory.

Reason needs fact. How can you deduce fact from mythology?

Reason most certainly does not require fact. Reason is a process which operates on assertions. I can use valid reasoning to reach any conclusion which suits me. That's why we need empiricism: so we can verify or debunk the truth of assertions on which reason operates.

Reason is a logical conclusion based on fact.