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You dont think folks should have healthcare?WV, KY, AR, and LA are very poor states...they all expanded medicaid.
Now other states are poorer.
Great job !!!
Sure, if they work and pay for it, they should have whatever they are willing to work for.
If you are saying I should give up my money to pay for your health care, no.
Why should I work like a slave, for your benefit? When I went to the hospital, I paid for it. Because that's what a man does. You pay for what you want. That's normal.
The actual cost of health care is very low because most people do not need it unless there is an emergency.
So there is no reason to exclude the poor from the common risk pool for health care, even if they can't pay in.
They are such a small percentage, that is costs you essentially nothing to cover them as well.
No one pays for what you want in a normal society.
Do the firemen give you a quote before you decide you can afford for them to put out the fire in your home?
But that is not what we have seen in states that have tried universal health care. What we saw in Massachusetts, is that when care was offered for free, people swarmed into the system. People even canceled their insurance, to go get 'free' care, resulting in the system being over burdened with people, and massively long wait times for the simplest of things. People were showing up with coughs, and sprained ankles. And of course if it's free, why not?
In fact, in France they had a massive problem with specifically older people, going to the doctor for no other reason than because they were lonely and wanted someone to talk to. And again... why not if it is free?
Here in Ohio, after the state caved into pressure from the Feds to expand the Medicaid program, the cost doubled from even the predicted increase. They estimated that costs would range near $200 Billion. The reality was, expanding medicaid increased $400 Billion.
Gov-care systems have never resulted in the small increases in cost that you claim. Instead the increases in cost have always been massive.
So there is no reason to exclude the poor from the common risk pool for health care, even if they can't pay in.
And the result of that, will be to drastically increase the cost on everyone. Take myself for example. The cost of Obama care has made getting insurance really expensive, thus... I have none.
When I get sick, I'll apply for insurance. Without pre-existing condition clauses, insurance companies can't refuse me. I'll get care, and then cancel my insurance.
So who is going to pay for that? Everyone who has insurance. That's why insurance premiums are drastically increasing.
No one pays for what you want in a normal society.
Do the firemen give you a quote before you decide you can afford for them to put out the fire in your home?
You have one exception, to a universal reality.
Fireman are an understandable exception.
To claim that the fire department, is an example that disproves all of capitalism is ridiculous. We accept that you need a fire department, because otherwise, a single fire could wipe out a city.
It is not the same, to suggest that all services we want in life, should be socialized. The relative costs on society to provide fire protection, or police protection, is insignificant to the costs of taking over a massive portion of the US economy.
Additionally, the government is extremely wasteful and inefficient at everything it does. Police departments are routinely wasteful. We understand that it will be difficult to privatize the police force.... so we accept this wasteful behavior. But it is not even remotely efficient.
Tesla police vehicle ran out of power during a car chase
Same is true of the fire department. Extremely expensive relative to what services it provides.
To put the health care system under that level of incompetence, is a very bad idea. All you have to do is go to the BMV, or the USPS, and see 7 cash stations, 3 workers, and only one person actually working, to see that having government in charge of health care would be a terrible idea.
And again, if you doubt that, go to your local government run clinic or hospital, or a VA clinic, and see what it's like. I have. It's terrible. Absolutely terrible.
NHS Waiting List over 4 million Long.
12th August 2019 by Healys
In 2018, official figures showed the waiting list for an NHS operation was over 4.3 million patients long. To put this into context, if we were to print this off, assuming an average of 50 patients per page, and laid end to end, the list would be 23 kilometres long (or 14 miles) – enough to stretch from our office in Brighton to Worthing (via the A27).
NHS Waiting List Now Over 4 Million Patients Long - Healys LLP
Does anyone here know how the NHS is funded?
I do.
I've looked this up before.
The National Insurance Tax, is 12% on income over $10,000. So the poorest of people, lose 12% of their income in just the National insurance tax.
That said, the National Insurance Contribution (NIC) (I love how they call it a contribution, to make you feel like they are not just steal 12% of your income).... that NIC does not cover the cost of NHS. Not even close.
View attachment 285517
The NIC barely covers 20% of NHS costs. A little less than 5% is covered by patients paying. One of the ironies of the UK NHS system, is that contrary to the equality minded people where supposedly the poor are not left behind, is that people with money can, and often, pay to get quality service in the NHS. For a fee, you can skip the year long wait lists that the poor are doomed to.
However, despite that 12% tax on the poor.... 80% of the cost of health care, comes from general tax revenue.
This is why someone who earns just $16K, you are subjected to a 20% tax. If you earn over $64K (a married couple earning just $32K each), you are subjected to a 40% tax.
When I said the lower and middle class lose almost half their income, that wasn't a joke.
This is how NHS is funded.
This is why when idiots like Bernie Sanders says that we can have Medicare for all, and only have an increase in taxes of 6%... . he is freaking insane. There is no possible way to make that math work.
Same thing for people who claim we'll just have the rich pay for it. People that say that are completely bonkers. No country with national health care has gotten the rich to pay for it. If they did, why are the poor in the UK paying 32% in taxes to cover health care?
NHS is not funded by insurance schemes, and the choices contained therein.
Deductions are taken out of your salary, whether you like it or not. Even should you choose to take the private route, you will still be paying those contributions into the system.
The results aren’t worse. The costs are high but taxes are lower. It’s a wash.And our health care costs are twice as much as anywhere else with worse results...If they were better they would not come here when they are really sick. We have the best hospitals and universities in the world.Our health care system is one of the worst in the world.
It not only costs over twice as much, but is rated 29th in the world, and it murders over 100,000 people a year in the US, due to medical malpractice.
Yep, wait til it's free, then you'll know how bad it can really get.
The whole rest of the world does free health care, and almost all of them are better than ours.
Zero to do with the ACA. I have private insurance.Also thanks to Obamacare in great part.We were on vacation. No idea. Google it. In terms of my friend he said he was having chest pains. We did the paper work afterwards. The paperwork for my daughter took less than five minutes. We have these things called computers now.I was in Hyannis MA with my 10-yr old. Arm infection and cut. We were in and out in less than 30 minutes. It depends where you go and how severe your condition is. Many times people go to the ER when they don’t have to. My friend just had a heart scare. He was seen in literally seconds. You lie, Rigby.I have been to ERs in the US and had to wait an hour and a half, dripping blood on the carpet, before they would stitch up a bad cut.
I have been to ERs in other countries and they are faster, more careful, and no paperwork at all.
I have never seen anyone get US ER service faster than an hour or so.
Nope, you are the one lying.
The only way you can get through the paperwork that quickly is if you already are a patient with a particular private doctor or clinic. You did not just to into a strange hospital off the street and get that fast of care.
And what is the average income leval of Hyannis, MA?
The results aren’t worse. The costs are high but taxes are lower. It’s a wash.And our health care costs are twice as much as anywhere else with worse results...If they were better they would not come here when they are really sick. We have the best hospitals and universities in the world.Yep, wait til it's free, then you'll know how bad it can really get.
The whole rest of the world does free health care, and almost all of them are better than ours.
No, it is not at all a wash.
The MAIN cost of health care in the US is not from the providers, but the insurance companies.
So when you remove their useless overhead, you end up with better health care, at HALF the cost.
The cost includes both private and tax contributions.
It is NOT at all a wash.
You save 50% by going public health care for all.
Zero to do with the ACA. I have private insurance.Also thanks to Obamacare in great part.We were on vacation. No idea. Google it. In terms of my friend he said he was having chest pains. We did the paper work afterwards. The paperwork for my daughter took less than five minutes. We have these things called computers now.I was in Hyannis MA with my 10-yr old. Arm infection and cut. We were in and out in less than 30 minutes. It depends where you go and how severe your condition is. Many times people go to the ER when they don’t have to. My friend just had a heart scare. He was seen in literally seconds. You lie, Rigby.
Nope, you are the one lying.
The only way you can get through the paperwork that quickly is if you already are a patient with a particular private doctor or clinic. You did not just to into a strange hospital off the street and get that fast of care.
And what is the average income leval of Hyannis, MA?
Until ACA, private insurance often was not accepted out of state.
Happened to me several times.
For example, doctors in TX would not accept an insurance policy from OR,
Locals can always tell tourists.
Clothing, familiarity with the locals, address on insurance card, license plates, appearance, accent, etc.
They may also error on the side of catering to the wealthy.
But they also may have so few poor or indigent, they don't care.
If a poor person gets good treatment once in a while, it won't cost them that much.
But in a place like Chicago, Detroit, NYC, etc., there is an obvious difference how people are treated, based on income.
You have no clue what you're talking about. Its about an hour drive, maybe a little more. There is no such thing as a different accent LOL. Same accent. Why are you so obsessed with the poor and indigent? I live in Boston and we have better hospitals than Cape Cod. You're really clueless about life. Good God.
Each suburb has its own accent.
Do you think Brooklyn has the same accent as Long Island?
But you miss the point in that when health care is based on profits, then obviously care will differentiate depending on if minimal government subsidy vs deluxe and tax exempt private insurance.
Cape Cod is not going to have as many indigent, so is less likely to work at weeding out the poor.
No. That is untrue, LOL. No difference at the Cape or in Boston. Of course its based on profits. My point was our wait was nothing. But anyone could have gone in there. The healthcare system sucks but we still have the best doctors and medical advancements. IDGAF about your "poor and indigent". The poor here live like kings with smart phones, $100 sneakers and cable TV. Stop your bullshit.
But the POINT is that poor people do NOT go there.
A presumption of wealth likely worked in your favor.
It is silly not to admit that reality.
Again, to tell how bad US health care is, you have to put on old clothes and go to an inner city hospital.
Why are you even arguing about this?
It is what average people experience that counts, not at some vacation resort.
I am an average person. It was not a "resort". Some of the best hospitals in Boston are in run down areas. You know not of what you speaketh and again IDGAF about the fake poor and indigent.
I don't see that as necessarily a positive. May change some now that women can drive and go out in public LOL.KSA is awful but even there families stay together and there is no drug or alcohol abuse. One of the few positives.More modern Arab countries like turkey and Morocco do. Dictatorships like Saudi Arabia not so much... GOP just loves them.Is Medical School Worth it Financially? - BestMedicalDegrees.com
Becoming a doctor is super expensive so they should be able to charge as much as they want to.
You still do NOT get it at all.
The salary paid to the doctor is an INSIGNIFICANT part of what you pay for health care.
Over half of what we pay for health care is just corporate profit.
And the way it SHOULD work is that is costs nothing to become a doctor, so that we get the most and best doctors, and then they won't need to charge as much because there won't be a shortage.
High medical costs are totally artificial, and have nothing to do with doctor's salaries.
I was wondering about the true costs of medicines.
In Arab countries for instance, they are cheaper than on prescription. (For the rest of us)
And well stocked pharmacies are plentiful.
Arab countries don't have alcoholics or drug abusers. Since both are prohibited and punishable by death.
NHS Waiting List over 4 million Long.
12th August 2019 by Healys
In 2018, official figures showed the waiting list for an NHS operation was over 4.3 million patients long. To put this into context, if we were to print this off, assuming an average of 50 patients per page, and laid end to end, the list would be 23 kilometres long (or 14 miles) – enough to stretch from our office in Brighton to Worthing (via the A27).
NHS Waiting List Now Over 4 Million Patients Long - Healys LLP
Does anyone here know how the NHS is funded?
This is deceptive because the waiting list in the US is much longer.
The implication that emergencies are put off, is false.
It is preventive maintenance like mammograms and colonoscopies that are scheduled far off, just like they are in all countries.
Knee replacements are put off too. Living with pain is so much fun I am sure.
The results aren’t worse. The costs are high but taxes are lower. It’s a wash.And our health care costs are twice as much as anywhere else with worse results...If they were better they would not come here when they are really sick. We have the best hospitals and universities in the world.The whole rest of the world does free health care, and almost all of them are better than ours.
No, it is not at all a wash.
The MAIN cost of health care in the US is not from the providers, but the insurance companies.
So when you remove their useless overhead, you end up with better health care, at HALF the cost.
The cost includes both private and tax contributions.
It is NOT at all a wash.
You save 50% by going public health care for all.
And you have proof of this?
Quote what I said and people will understand what an brainwashed functional idiot you are. People and corporations run wild when you don't regulate them. Even a basic operation like Obamacare has cut down on rising costs. Of course we need more regulation transparency and competition, what Obamacare is based onFranco thinks it is "funny" for healthcare costs to rise as government steals ever more from the taxpayer.
"Funny," because that money ends up in Franco's kleptocratic pockets....
The bigger and more unaccountable government gets, the "funnier" life is for Franco and the kleptocratic Left.
People and corporations run wild when you don't regulate them.
Even a basic operation like Obamacare has cut down on rising costs
They had no idea who I was? I walked in with a little girl and they saw us right away. Hospitals should have a profit motive. Great care means people will come back.You have no clue what you're talking about. Its about an hour drive, maybe a little more. There is no such thing as a different accent LOL. Same accent. Why are you so obsessed with the poor and indigent? I live in Boston and we have better hospitals than Cape Cod. You're really clueless about life. Good God.
Each suburb has its own accent.
Do you think Brooklyn has the same accent as Long Island?
But you miss the point in that when health care is based on profits, then obviously care will differentiate depending on if minimal government subsidy vs deluxe and tax exempt private insurance.
Cape Cod is not going to have as many indigent, so is less likely to work at weeding out the poor.
No. That is untrue, LOL. No difference at the Cape or in Boston. Of course its based on profits. My point was our wait was nothing. But anyone could have gone in there. The healthcare system sucks but we still have the best doctors and medical advancements. IDGAF about your "poor and indigent". The poor here live like kings with smart phones, $100 sneakers and cable TV. Stop your bullshit.
But the POINT is that poor people do NOT go there.
A presumption of wealth likely worked in your favor.
It is silly not to admit that reality.
Again, to tell how bad US health care is, you have to put on old clothes and go to an inner city hospital.
Why are you even arguing about this?
It is what average people experience that counts, not at some vacation resort.
I am an average person. It was not a "resort". Some of the best hospitals in Boston are in run down areas. You know not of what you speaketh and again IDGAF about the fake poor and indigent.
Again you make no sense.
You brought up an example in Hyannis, and I pointed out that you likely benefited from the perception you were a wealthy tourist.
It does not matter if you actually were a wealthy person or not, and it does not matter if there are great hospitals in poor areas.
The point is your experience was invalid for generalizations.
And my point is that when there are indigent and poor, the profit motive to weed them out, also would have greatly impacted your experience.
Do you understand that due to the profit motive, hospital are essentially running a credit check before admitting, as if they were trying to drive off in a new Cadillac?
How will it change when drug use and drinking is against the law?I don't see that as necessarily a positive. May change some now that women can drive and go out in public LOL.KSA is awful but even there families stay together and there is no drug or alcohol abuse. One of the few positives.More modern Arab countries like turkey and Morocco do. Dictatorships like Saudi Arabia not so much... GOP just loves them.You still do NOT get it at all.
The salary paid to the doctor is an INSIGNIFICANT part of what you pay for health care.
Over half of what we pay for health care is just corporate profit.
And the way it SHOULD work is that is costs nothing to become a doctor, so that we get the most and best doctors, and then they won't need to charge as much because there won't be a shortage.
High medical costs are totally artificial, and have nothing to do with doctor's salaries.
I was wondering about the true costs of medicines.
In Arab countries for instance, they are cheaper than on prescription. (For the rest of us)
And well stocked pharmacies are plentiful.
Arab countries don't have alcoholics or drug abusers. Since both are prohibited and punishable by death.
Surprise, super duper, premiums go up when your coverage is guaranteed and you have a annual cap on spending and you get free tests, etc etc instead of a GOP scam twice as expensive as anywhere else that doesn't cover half the people and cut you off if you get really sick. The only stealing being done in this country is the GOP stealing from regular people to save the greedy idiot GOP Rich from paying their fair share. Of course as a dupe you don't know any of that LOL. And every report you have their prices are going to go up 76% etc etc are total garbage propaganda and never happened, dumbass. Just letting corporations insurers doctors and hospitals charge whatever they want is right-wing idiocy that got us in this mess in the first placePeople and corporations run wild when you don't regulate them.
Translation = America prospers, government kleptocrats do not....
Even a basic operation like Obamacare has cut down on rising costs
Obamacare did that???
Democrats and truth.... do not mix well...
Yes, It Was The 'Affordable' Care Act That Increased Premiums
Good news about Obamacare premiums can't hide long-term pain Donald Trump is trying to fix
Oklahoma Obamacare Premiums to Increase by 76 Percent
Democrats will never stop lying because Democrats will never stop stealing, and they need to lie to you first before you part with your money....
I really Believe you’re mentally ill. Tell me again how $100k is a lot lolNHS Waiting List over 4 million Long.
12th August 2019 by Healys
In 2018, official figures showed the waiting list for an NHS operation was over 4.3 million patients long. To put this into context, if we were to print this off, assuming an average of 50 patients per page, and laid end to end, the list would be 23 kilometres long (or 14 miles) – enough to stretch from our office in Brighton to Worthing (via the A27).
NHS Waiting List Now Over 4 Million Patients Long - Healys LLP
Does anyone here know how the NHS is funded?
This is deceptive because the waiting list in the US is much longer.
The implication that emergencies are put off, is false.
It is preventive maintenance like mammograms and colonoscopies that are scheduled far off, just like they are in all countries.
Knee replacements are put off too. Living with pain is so much fun I am sure.
That is foolish.
Knee replacement should always be put off.
But it is not a static period of time, but just to even out congestion in people needing the same procedure at the same time, so that you do not have to increase staff, only to have them idle.
There is no better service in the US.
It is far worse.
There are NO statistics claiming US heath care is nearly as good as public health care in other countries.
premiums go up when
The only stealing being done in this country is
NHS is not funded by insurance schemes, and the choices contained therein.
Deductions are taken out of your salary, whether you like it or not. Even should you choose to take the private route, you will still be paying those contributions into the system.
That is silly, because even if you have no children, you pay for public education because it benefits you by having less crime, better employees, a stronger economy, etc.
When they get a democracy and freedom, drinking won't be against the law and drug abuse will not be a death penalty. Fundamentalists in charge of government is a catastrophe. Any fundamentalists....How will it change when drug use and drinking is against the law?I don't see that as necessarily a positive. May change some now that women can drive and go out in public LOL.KSA is awful but even there families stay together and there is no drug or alcohol abuse. One of the few positives.More modern Arab countries like turkey and Morocco do. Dictatorships like Saudi Arabia not so much... GOP just loves them.I was wondering about the true costs of medicines.
In Arab countries for instance, they are cheaper than on prescription. (For the rest of us)
And well stocked pharmacies are plentiful.
Arab countries don't have alcoholics or drug abusers. Since both are prohibited and punishable by death.
