Various Thoughts on the Issues of Homosexuality

[candycorn]

Someone else's sexual preferences do not affect me in any way, shape or form.

 

[Pop23]

Ok, I am not intending to derail the thread, but just a few thoughts.

When discussing whether homosexuality and whether it is nature or nurture, I often run across people that make the statement "who would choose to live that way", or "why would I choose to live this way". In either case, those phrases are sad to see.

That does not compelled me to change my mind on what homosexuality is, it simply makes me want to know the reasoning that it exists. It could indeed be a genetic issue that would make the statement true, but many with differing forms of OCD would make the same statement. So, six of one, half a dozen of the other.

As stated many times before, homosexuality does not seem to make much sense in the natural order of things. As a species, for the species to exist at all, heterosexuality must exist. The same is not true for homosexuality. That being said, humans elected to form societies and governments to protect us, so there must be a place for those who do not reproduce. They should be valued for what they are in the present, not just what they supply to the future.

This being said, true homosexuals benefit in this society to a far greater extent (especially if we allow homosexuals to be comfortable with who they are), than heterosexuals benefit from Homosexuals.

As an example, as a homosexual ages, they rely on the fact that heterosexuals reproduce. They benefit that a heterosexual created taxpayers that help fund their social security. A aging heterosexual does not get that benefit from homosexuality. True, a homosexual could raise children that become taxpayers, but a true homosexual will not create the taxpayer through homosexual activity.

The argument could be made that a homosexual could be an egg or sperm donor, but it is the male / female component of the procedure that creates the offspring, not the homosexual aspect.

If homosexuality is genetic, even sperm and egg donation needs to be extremely transparent (this my argument for a more transparent and tolerance of homosexuality). If homosexuality is a genetic condition, then those donating should be required to declare their sexuality, or at the very least declare that they are uncertain so that those seeking a donation are well aware as to the chance they could be passing the trait to future generations. If we insist in a society that forces gays to stay in the closet the chances of deceit increases.

If homosexuality is not genetic, if it is not something a person is born with, we should actively research what causes it and whether or not there is the possibility of therapy.

Ok, the above is my opinion on several aspects of the debate. Next time I stay at a Holiday Inn Express........

 

[Plasmaball]

And in none of your rambling fuck you's did you ever prove me wrong. Thank you very much for proving me right, I appreciate your effort.

well yes i did, i see you didnt bother to read. Marriage has not always been about one man and one woman.

But like i said its irrelevant, you will lose and it will become the law of the land.
People like you are barbaric savages who want no equality for certain people.

Read your own quote, you failed.

I do find it interesting you call people savages while yelling fuck you! at them. You petulant little being.

i did read the quote. I read the whole page. The definition of marriage has changed numerous times.

One King in England had 700 wives among other women. Tell me how that is traditional?
Its not. You failed. You are wrong, Gay marriage will soon be federal, and you will become irrelevant for the rest of history on the issue.

 

[GISMYS]

Your question is answered here!!!!!!!!!! THOSE THAT REJECT GOD===God abandoned them to do whatever shameful things their hearts desired. As a result, they did vile and degrading things with each other’s bodies. 25 They traded the truth about God for a lie. So they worshiped and served the things God created instead of the Creator himself, who is worthy of eternal praise! Amen. 26 That is why God abandoned them to their shameful desires. Even the women turned against the natural way to have sex and instead indulged in sex with each other. 27 And the men, instead of having normal sexual relations with women, burned with lust for each other. Men did shameful things with other men, and as a result of this sin, they suffered within themselves the penalty they deserved.

28 Since they thought it foolish to acknowledge God, he abandoned them to their foolish thinking and let them do things that should never be done. 29 Their lives became full of every kind of wickedness, sin, greed, hate, envy, murder, quarreling, deception, malicious behavior, and gossip. 30 They are backstabbers, haters of God, insolent, proud, and boastful. They invent new ways of sinning, and they disobey their parents. 31 They refuse to understand, break their promises, are heartless, and have no mercy. 32 They know God’s justice requires that those who do these things deserve to die, yet they do them anyway. Worse yet, they encourage others to do them, too.
romans 1:24-32

 

[Asclepias]

Your question is answered here!!!!!!!!!!

Where is here? In your religious handbook?

 

[GISMYS]

THE TRUTH IS HERE IN THE WORD OF GOD!!!===Your question is answered here!!!!!!!!!! THOSE THAT REJECT GOD===God abandoned them to do whatever shameful things their hearts desired. As a result, they did vile and degrading things with each other’s bodies. 25 They traded the truth about God for a lie. So they worshiped and served the things God created instead of the Creator himself, who is worthy of eternal praise! Amen. 26 That is why God abandoned them to their shameful desires. Even the women turned against the natural way to have sex and instead indulged in sex with each other. 27 And the men, instead of having normal sexual relations with women, burned with lust for each other. Men did shameful things with other men, and as a result of this sin, they suffered within themselves the penalty they deserved.

28 Since they thought it foolish to acknowledge God, he abandoned them to their foolish thinking and let them do things that should never be done. 29 Their lives became full of every kind of wickedness, sin, greed, hate, envy, murder, quarreling, deception, malicious behavior, and gossip. 30 They are backstabbers, haters of God, insolent, proud, and boastful. They invent new ways of sinning, and they disobey their parents. 31 They refuse to understand, break their promises, are heartless, and have no mercy. 32 They know God’s justice requires that those who do these things deserve to die, yet they do them anyway. Worse yet, they encourage others to do them, too.
romans 1:24-32

 

[Pop23]

THE TRUTH IS HERE IN THE WORD OF GOD!!!===Your question is answered here!!!!!!!!!! THOSE THAT REJECT GOD===God abandoned them to do whatever shameful things their hearts desired. As a result, they did vile and degrading things with each other’s bodies. 25 They traded the truth about God for a lie. So they worshiped and served the things God created instead of the Creator himself, who is worthy of eternal praise! Amen. 26 That is why God abandoned them to their shameful desires. Even the women turned against the natural way to have sex and instead indulged in sex with each other. 27 And the men, instead of having normal sexual relations with women, burned with lust for each other. Men did shameful things with other men, and as a result of this sin, they suffered within themselves the penalty they deserved.

28 Since they thought it foolish to acknowledge God, he abandoned them to their foolish thinking and let them do things that should never be done. 29 Their lives became full of every kind of wickedness, sin, greed, hate, envy, murder, quarreling, deception, malicious behavior, and gossip. 30 They are backstabbers, haters of God, insolent, proud, and boastful. They invent new ways of sinning, and they disobey their parents. 31 They refuse to understand, break their promises, are heartless, and have no mercy. 32 They know God’s justice requires that those who do these things deserve to die, yet they do them anyway. Worse yet, they encourage others to do them, too.
romans 1:24-32

Posting the same thing over and over just makes people tend to just ignore your posts.

You understand that?

 

[Foxfyre]

Sometimes I despair that a grown up discussion that encourages all points of view to be be thoughtfully and intelligently discussed is no longer possible in our dumbed down, brainwashed, and politically correct world. Hats off to the OP for trying. But it seems hopeless.

Here's the problem as I see it: The minute an issue becomes politicized, it's immediately broken down to its most simplistic level - "dumbed down", as you call it. Nuance is tossed out, everything becomes binary. And then comes the traditional deflection, distortion, straw men, hyperbole, outright lies and name-calling, and the conversation becomes nothing more than professional wrestling for political geeks.

This thread has some interesting posts, though, with some more conservative posters saying that they really don't care one way or the other about the topic, and even disagreeing with the hardcore Christian guy.

Refreshing!

.

As I posted previously, I am pretty darn sure that MOST Christians don't agree with the hardcore Christian guy. Nor with the politically correct if-you-don't-see-it-our-way-you-are-racist-homophobic-bigoted-scum-who-want-to-deny-equal-rights-to-gays crowd. But between the two of them, rational discussion seems pretty unlikely.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

no but they might beat a child to death because they act gay. Or drag one by a rope behind a truck. Or make the act of sodomy illegal, Or ban certain sections of the population from receiving rights.

no but lets just focus on beheadings as if we have some morally superior authority on the issue.

What a joke.

Show me a Christian religious leader who promotes such actions, show me another part of the world that allows such behaviors -- somehow I've missed all the passionate outrage on that -- and I'll think about taking your transparent attempt at deflection seriously.



.

The thing that is obvious in this thread is that the hypocrisy is so thick you can't even wade through it. Those throwing the Bible up as the authority have mostly missed the intent of the passages they use and only feed those intolerant of religion in general and Christianity in particular. And those intolerant ones in turn use even worse hyperbole and hate speech than some of the Christians have been using.

And if anybody offers any reasoned argument that does not fit the politically correct version, the topic is further derailed by the schoolyard food fight crowd and PC police who pile on with a chorus of charges of ignorance, and intolerance, and wanting to deprive gays of their rights, yadda yadda.

Sometimes I despair that a grown up discussion that encourages all points of view to be be thoughtfully and intelligently discussed is no longer possible in our dumbed down, brainwashed, and politically correct world. Hats off to the OP for trying. But it seems hopeless.

Those throwing the bible up as the ‘authority’ of anything only exhibit their ignorance of the law, as religious doctrine and dogma are legally and Constitutionally irrelevant, and thankfully so.

And there is no “reasoned argument” in support of denying gay Americans their civil liberties, or the right of same-sex couples to access a state’s marriage law, the many invalidated state measures to that end are proof of that. There is also nothing “politically correct” about 14th Amendment jurisprudence, nor are the judges who correctly apply that case law the “PC police.”

Those who seek to deny gay Americans their civil liberties are in fact ignorant, intolerant, and wanting to deprive gays of their rights, there is no other rational, objective, factual explanation that pursues a proper legislative end. They seek only to make gay Americans different from everyone else, which the states cannot do, they cannot render gay Americans strangers to states’ laws, including marriage law.

 

[Pop23]

THE TRUTH IS HERE IN THE WORD OF GOD!!!===Your question is answered here!!!!!!!!!! THOSE THAT REJECT GOD===God abandoned them to do whatever shameful things their hearts desired. As a result, they did vile and degrading things with each other’s bodies. 25 They traded the truth about God for a lie. So they worshiped and served the things God created instead of the Creator himself, who is worthy of eternal praise! Amen. 26 That is why God abandoned them to their shameful desires. Even the women turned against the natural way to have sex and instead indulged in sex with each other. 27 And the men, instead of having normal sexual relations with women, burned with lust for each other. Men did shameful things with other men, and as a result of this sin, they suffered within themselves the penalty they deserved.

28 Since they thought it foolish to acknowledge God, he abandoned them to their foolish thinking and let them do things that should never be done. 29 Their lives became full of every kind of wickedness, sin, greed, hate, envy, murder, quarreling, deception, malicious behavior, and gossip. 30 They are backstabbers, haters of God, insolent, proud, and boastful. They invent new ways of sinning, and they disobey their parents. 31 They refuse to understand, break their promises, are heartless, and have no mercy. 32 They know God’s justice requires that those who do these things deserve to die, yet they do them anyway. Worse yet, they encourage others to do them, too.
romans 1:24-32

Posting the same thing over and over just makes people tend to just ignore your posts.

You understand that?

YES!!! SOME ARE A LITTLE SLOW they must have truth repeated over and over before it sinks into their little satan blinded brain!!!and you????

Before I do something I've never done before, that being placing you on ignore, I simply want to say this:

In my humble opinion, there is one thing The Lord does not want to happen. That is that his word is ignored.

 

[Tank]

Someone else's sexual preferences do not affect me in any way, shape or form.

It does affect children, when trying to teach right from wrong

 

[Asclepias]

Someone else's sexual preferences do not affect me in any way, shape or form.

It does affect children, when trying to teach right from wrong

No actually it doesn't.

 

[Statistikhengst]

So did we ever get to the bottom of why lipstick lesbians crave masculine looking, talking, acting, dressing, walking, strapon-wearing "female" partners?

Or are we still with that bible-thumping diversion?

I'm glad the title of this thread includes "homosexuals". Isn't there a pitch lately to change this completely sterile diagnostic word to something that is "derogatory and hate speech"? Fuck that. Gays cannot change language and the use of basic descriptions to their liking. I've know a few homosexuals in my day. The word "gay" is not the best nickname for a homosexual. More like "crazy". If they want to be called "crazy" instead of homosexual, I suppose that would work.

That's the great thing about the 1st amendment: a person can blather and show his ass all he wants, and that's totally allowed. And YOU just proved that it works.

 

[Foxfyre]

So did we ever get to the bottom of why lipstick lesbians crave masculine looking, talking, acting, dressing, walking, strapon-wearing "female" partners?

Or are we still with that bible-thumping diversion?

I'm glad the title of this thread includes "homosexuals". Isn't there a pitch lately to change this completely sterile diagnostic word to something that is "derogatory and hate speech"? Fuck that. Gays cannot change language and the use of basic descriptions to their liking. I've know a few homosexuals in my day. The word "gay" is not the best nickname for a homosexual. More like "crazy". If they want to be called "crazy" instead of homosexual, I suppose that would work.

Militant political activists gays can and do change the language though, and I won't agree that 'homosexual' is synonymous with 'crazy'.

But there are a number of perfectly good English words that have been co-opted by the gay community and have become something very different than they orginally were whether used in postiive or negative ways: rainbow, gay, queer, faggot, butch, etc.

Since the earliest days of recorded history, marriage in all cultures has been the union between a man and a woman, regardless of how many wives any man might have had. And marriage was always a distinction from concubines, mistresses, etc. And in all cultures marriage was to form a family, economic, or political alliance, but always for the purpose of providing a traceable genetic lineage from generation to generation.

Is it good that homosexuality is losing its cultural stigma? Absolutely. Is it good to allow gay people and other non-marrying people ability to form legally recognized family units? Of course. Is it good to change the definition of marriage? No. But saying that will just generate around round of slurs and attacks by the PC police and juvenile numbnuts won't it.

 

[Statistikhengst]

Someone else's sexual preferences do not affect me in any way, shape or form.

Sometimes I despair that a grown up discussion that encourages all points of view to be be thoughtfully and intelligently discussed is no longer possible in our dumbed down, brainwashed, and politically correct world. Hats off to the OP for trying. But it seems hopeless.

Here's the problem as I see it: The minute an issue becomes politicized, it's immediately broken down to its most simplistic level - "dumbed down", as you call it. Nuance is tossed out, everything becomes binary. And then comes the traditional deflection, distortion, straw men, hyperbole, outright lies and name-calling, and the conversation becomes nothing more than professional wrestling for political geeks.

This thread has some interesting posts, though, with some more conservative posters saying that they really don't care one way or the other about the topic, and even disagreeing with the hardcore Christian guy.

Refreshing!

.

As I posted previously, I am pretty darn sure that MOST Christians don't agree with the hardcore Christian guy. Nor with the politically correct if-you-don't-see-it-our-way-you-are-racist-homophobic-bigoted-scum-who-want-to-deny-equal-rights-to-gays crowd. But between the two of them, rational discussion seems pretty unlikely.

Live and let live. Not a hard policy to follow.

 

[Statistikhengst]

Oh, look at the cocksucker with his rationale...

God didn't claim that homosexuality is a sin, the Bible did.

God didn't write the Bible, humans did.

Greed is a sin, but not homosexuality, according to God in the Bible.

And how does that make him a "cocksucker" in your mind? Just because you don't agree with him. Is that the way you roll? Really?

Sad...

 

[1776]

uh shitbag...he is trying to make excuses for his lifestyle.

Oh, look at the cocksucker with his rationale...

God didn't claim that homosexuality is a sin, the Bible did.

God didn't write the Bible, humans did.

Greed is a sin, but not homosexuality, according to God in the Bible.

And how does that make him a "cocksucker" in your mind? Just because you don't agree with him. Is that the way you roll? Really?

Sad...

 

[Statistikhengst]

uh shitbag...he is trying to make excuses for his lifestyle.

Oh, look at the cocksucker with his rationale...

And how does that make him a "cocksucker" in your mind? Just because you don't agree with him. Is that the way you roll? Really?

Sad...

You address a member whom you don't even know as "shitbag" - and you expect people to take you seriously?


Do you have anything productive to contribute to the conversation, or are you just here to insult and malign?

 

[Silhouette]

How come you guys are trading insults and not answering the question which is, again, why are lipstick lesbians attracted to bullish, male looking, acting, dressing, swaggering "women" wearing strapon penises?

Please answer the question. Diversions are nice but very transparent. I get that nobody here wants to discuss what I just said. I dare you. Discuss it.. I double-dare you..

 

[Statistikhengst]

How come you guys are trading insults and not answering the question which is, again, why are lipstick lesbians attracted to bullish, male looking, acting, dressing, swaggering "women" wearing strapon penises?

Please answer the question. Diversions are nice but very transparent. I get that nobody here wants to discuss what I just said. I dare you. Discuss it.. I double-dare you..

Because it's a non-issue for me. I'm not gay. So, ask a lesbian and see if you get an answer.