Verifying Your Political ID

[Kosh]

Marriage existed before Christianity or even religion did.

The First Amendment had a purpose, to keep religion the fuck out of government.

Which again, you should consider a good thing. Do you really want the government telling you what the Bible says instead of your pastor? I mean, I know you religious types are all a bunch of stupid sheep, but somehow, I don't think you want to go there.

And some of us just don't want to have our lives run by a book written by bronze age shit-kickers.

I guess you see Christianity as the only religion now, interesting.

While that is the standard far left argument (which has no real merit other than a talk point), marriage at the time was based on religion. Thus, marriage is a product of religion that the government should not be involved in.

So when you going to get the government out of marriage and put your money where your mouth is?

At what time was that?

Most of the Roman Empire wasn't Christian, but it had marriage as an institution.

So did most pre-Christian societies. Oh, some had polygamy and some had other arrangements, but the reality- Christianity imposed itself into marriage, not the other way around.

Which is amusing, as Early Christians insisted that they didn't get married, and dedicate themselves to Christ.

It is better not to marry. But if you must have sex, then get married. It's better to be married than burn forever in hell.

It is good for a man not to touch a woman. Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband. -- 1 Corinthians 7:1-2

For I would that all men were even as I myself.... I say therefore to the unmarried and widows, It is good for them if they abide even as I. But if they cannot contain, let them marry: for it is better to marry than to burn. -- 1 Corinthians 7:7-9

If you're not already married, don't get married. If you have a wife, don't have sex with her. There's not enough time since Jesus is coming soon.

Art thou bound unto a wife? seek not to be loosed. Art thou loosed from a wife? seek not a wife. -- 1 Corinthians 7:27

But this I say, brethren, the time is short: it remaineth, that both they that have wives be as though they had none. -- 1 Corinthians 7:29

Once agian proving that the far left thinks of all religion to be Christianity.

More proof that this is about talking points.

Another far left fail.

 

[JoeB131]

Guy, the fact is, it isn't the Jews or the Bhuddists who are having a shit-fit because gays can get married now.

It's the people worshipping the naked guy on a stick.

 

[Kosh]

Guy, the fact is, it isn't the Jews or the Bhuddists who are having a shit-fit because gays can get married now.

It's the people worshipping the naked guy on a stick.

Same-sex marriage in Judaism has been a subject of debate within Jewish denominations. The traditional view among Jews is to regard same-sex relationships as categorically forbidden by the Torah. This remains the current view of Orthodox Judaism, but not of Reconstructionist Judaism, Reform Judaism and Conservative Judaism, which started changing its position to same-sex unions in 2006.

Same-sex marriage and Judaism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Once again the far left talking points fail!

 

[JoeB131]

Guy, the fact is, it isn't the Jews or the Bhuddists who are having a shit-fit because gays can get married now.

It's the people worshipping the naked guy on a stick.

Same-sex marriage in Judaism has been a subject of debate within Jewish denominations. The traditional view among Jews is to regard same-sex relationships as categorically forbidden by the Torah. This remains the current view of Orthodox Judaism, but not of Reconstructionist Judaism, Reform Judaism and Conservative Judaism, which started changing its position to same-sex unions in 2006.

Same-sex marriage and Judaism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Once again the far left talking points fail!

Again, you aren't seeing the Jews out there trying to write homophobia into the constitution.

They ain't doing it, no matter what religious debates they have internally.

That would be the Xians.

 

[Darkwind]

I have to admit I got one wrong. I remember hearing from my father, that religion started more wars and caused more deaths than non religion. That would be partially true. Although it has caused wars, the bulk of the wars are political or imperialistic in nature and more deaths are contributed to those wars than in the earlier wars.

My father, poor fellow, died a liberal. However if he was living today, I am certain he would not be a liberal seeing what is happening in today's society.

That would be incorrect. Secular humanists have killed more people then all the religions, combined.

 

[JoeB131]

I have to admit I got one wrong. I remember hearing from my father, that religion started more wars and caused more deaths than non religion. That would be partially true. Although it has caused wars, the bulk of the wars are political or imperialistic in nature and more deaths are contributed to those wars than in the earlier wars.

My father, poor fellow, died a liberal. However if he was living today, I am certain he would not be a liberal seeing what is happening in today's society.

That would be incorrect. Secular humanists have killed more people then all the religions, combined.

Really, where?

Or is this the part where you blame "Secular humanism" or "Atheism" or "Communism" for a civil war that went bad, and then use bullshit numbers like "Stalin killed 100 million russians!!!"

 

[PoliticalChic]

I have to admit I got one wrong. I remember hearing from my father, that religion started more wars and caused more deaths than non religion. That would be partially true. Although it has caused wars, the bulk of the wars are political or imperialistic in nature and more deaths are contributed to those wars than in the earlier wars.

My father, poor fellow, died a liberal. However if he was living today, I am certain he would not be a liberal seeing what is happening in today's society.

That would be incorrect. Secular humanists have killed more people then all the religions, combined.

Really, where?

Or is this the part where you blame "Secular humanism" or "Atheism" or "Communism" for a civil war that went bad, and then use bullshit numbers like "Stalin killed 100 million russians!!!"

No, Stalin didn't kill 100 million Russians....

...but he did kill a score of millions of Russians....

...and enslave millions of Eastern Europeans.

And it was his inspiration of Mao that led to the deaths of over 50 million Chinese.....


AND....

his having the atomic bomb caused the Koran War...


1. On April 5, 1951, Judge Irving R. Kaufman sentenced the Rosenbergs to death for theft of atomic secrets, and, resulted in "the communist aggression in Korea, with the resultant casualties exceeding 50,000 and who knows but that millions more of innocent people may pay the price of your treason." Judge Kaufman's Sentencing Statement in the Rosenberg Case


2. It is clear today, based on archival evidence, unearthed by researchers in Russia and released in the United States, that Kaufman was correct.

"Absent an atomic bomb, Stalin would not have released Pyongyang's army to conquer the entire Korean peninsula. Confident that his possession of atomic weapons neutralized America's strategic advantage, Stalin was emboldened to unleash war in Korea in 1950." Haynes, Klehr, and
Vassiliev, "Spies: The Rise and Fall of the KGB in America," p. 143, 545. And Romerstein and Breindel,"The Venona Secrets," p. xv, 253.


3. It is important to connect the treachery with the impact of that treachery: the theft of the nuclear technology with 36,940 Americans killed, 91,134 wounded, and 8,176 still missing, and this does not include at least two million civilian lives claimed on both sides.
Bruce Cumings, "The Korean War: A History.'

Included were 1.3 million South Korean casualties, including 400,000 dead. North Korea, 2 million casualties, and 900,000 Chinese soldiers killed.


4. FDR's insistence on the Soviet agents who infiltrated his administration resulted in the United States sabotage of Chaing Kai-Shek and the Nationalists in China in favor of the Mao and the Communists. From the book “Blacklisted From History,” by M. Stanton Evans: Soviet agents in the U.S. State department (and Treasury) worked actively to damage confidence of our government, in the (Nationalist) Chinese fighting in their own country, as our allies against the Japanese, and in favor of the Communist unsurgency of Mao Tse-Tung and Chou En-Lai.

While Chiang Kai-Shek was busy as our ally fighting the Japanese, White, Currie, Coe, Glasser, and Hiss were doing all they could to undermine him in favor of Mao and the communists.

a. “Another example of [Harry Dexter] White acting as an agent of influence for the Soviet Union was his obstruction of a proposed $200 million loan to Nationalist China in 1943, which he had been officially instructed to execute,[52] at a time when inflation was spiraling out of control.”
Harry Dexter White - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



Erroneous Joe.....
Don't you love it when I teach you the history you never took the time to learn?




BTW.....
100 million killed by communism.
"The Black Book of Communism: Crimes, Terror, Repression" by Jean-Louis Panné, Andrzej Paczkowski, Karel Bartosek and Jean-Louis Margolin

 

[JoeB131]

The Black Book of Communism is propaganda that would get you laughed out of History Department in any major university.

Hey, and when I usd to be as right wing as you are, I lapped that shit up.

Now that I'm older and more pragmatic, I realzie idealogies don't kill people, people kill people.

China's civil war had a high body count because shit, this isn't exactly a culture that reveres life, is it.

The Taiping Rebellion killed 20,000,000 people. Not a commie in sight. The fall of the Ming Dynasty killed tens of millions as well.

 

[JoeB131]

4. FDR's insistence on the Soviet agents who infiltrated his administration resulted in the United States sabotage of Chaing Kai-Shek and the Nationalists in China in favor of the Mao and the Communists. From the book “Blacklisted From History,” by M. Stanton Evans: Soviet agents in the U.S. State department (and Treasury) worked actively to damage confidence of our government, in the (Nationalist) Chinese fighting in their own country, as our allies against the Japanese, and in favor of the Communist unsurgency of Mao Tse-Tung and Chou En-Lai.

This is the kind of crap you guys babble, that just if we cared about Chiang a little more, he'd have won.

There was no way Chiang was ever going to win. He was incompetent and corrupt.

Do you know what western diplomats referred to him as? "Cash My Check".

 

[PoliticalChic]

The Black Book of Communism is propaganda that would get you laughed out of History Department in any major university.

Hey, and when I usd to be as right wing as you are, I lapped that shit up.

Now that I'm older and more pragmatic, I realzie idealogies don't kill people, people kill people.

China's civil war had a high body count because shit, this isn't exactly a culture that reveres life, is it.

The Taiping Rebellion killed 20,000,000 people. Not a commie in sight. The fall of the Ming Dynasty killed tens of millions as well.

The book is documented, and is a scholarly tome.


Now the obvious question: Have you read it?



Didn't think so.



You really haven't read any books, have you.

 

[Pickle]

Holodomor > holocaust

Holodomor being the result of secular humanists punishing peasants for rejecting their noble collectivism.

 

[JoeB131]

The Black Book of Communism is propaganda that would get you laughed out of History Department in any major university.

Hey, and when I usd to be as right wing as you are, I lapped that shit up.

Now that I'm older and more pragmatic, I realzie idealogies don't kill people, people kill people.

China's civil war had a high body count because shit, this isn't exactly a culture that reveres life, is it.

The Taiping Rebellion killed 20,000,000 people. Not a commie in sight. The fall of the Ming Dynasty killed tens of millions as well.

The book is documented, and is a scholarly tome.


Now the obvious question: Have you read it?


Didn't think so.


You really haven't read any books, have you.

If it was "Scholarly", why isn't it on the cirriculum of any university.

The Black Book of Communism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


The authors of the book have been criticized for historical inaccuracies. Concerning Nicolas Werth's section about Russia, Professor Peter Kenez of the University of California wrote about what he says are historical inaccurate statements[11]


Werth can also be an extremely careless historian. He gives the number of Bolsheviks in October 1917 as 2,000, which is a ridiculous underestimate. He quotes from a letter of Lenin to Aleksandr Shliapnikov and gives the date as 17 October 1917; the letter could hardly have originated at that time, since in it Lenin talks about the need to defeat the Tsarist government, and turn the war into a civil conflict. He gives credit to the Austro-Hungarian rather than the German army for the conquest of Poland in 1915. He describes the Provisional Government as "elected."


Two of the Black Book's contributors, Nicolas Werth and Jean-Louis Margolin, sparked a debate in France when they publicly disassociated themselves from Courtois's statements in the introduction about the scale of Communist terror. They felt that he was being obsessed with arriving at a total of 100 million killed.

In his review of the book, historian Jean-Jacques Becker also criticized Courtois' numbers as rather arbitrary and as having "zero historical value" (Fr. "La valeur historique est nulle") for adding up deaths due to disparate phenomena (Fr. "additionner des carottes et des navets", i.e. adding apples and oranges). Becker went further and accused Courtois of being an activist (Fr. "combattant").[16]

 

[initforme]

I do believe the country was founded on Judeo Christian values. Those values are all about helping the less fortunate. Check the bible. It speaks over and over again about that theme. Now we have a nation where a good many preach against it. Those so called evangelical(of whom I am one) who have worked hard and earned theirs but speak out about how the poor are hurting this nation are in my eyes the biggest hardest hypocrites this nation has. I've always voted republican because I am for middle of the road, center right social and fiscal policies. But I disagree with the far left and view the far right just as bad.

 

[PoliticalChic]

4. FDR's insistence on the Soviet agents who infiltrated his administration resulted in the United States sabotage of Chaing Kai-Shek and the Nationalists in China in favor of the Mao and the Communists. From the book “Blacklisted From History,” by M. Stanton Evans: Soviet agents in the U.S. State department (and Treasury) worked actively to damage confidence of our government, in the (Nationalist) Chinese fighting in their own country, as our allies against the Japanese, and in favor of the Communist unsurgency of Mao Tse-Tung and Chou En-Lai.

This is the kind of crap you guys babble, that just if we cared about Chiang a little more, he'd have won.

There was no way Chiang was ever going to win. He was incompetent and corrupt.

Do you know what western diplomats referred to him as? "Cash My Check".

The usual Leftist excuses.

I provide facts, as I know the history, and ignoramuses like you squeal 'is not, is not.'




Here's more history that you are clueless about:


1. [Owen] Lattimore was leaking information to the Soviets while he was an advisor to Chiang Kai-shek and that the Soviets considered Lattimore to be "working for them". http://foia.fbi.gov/owenlatt/owenlatt1a.pdf


2. The spies that FDR put in place continued to move Democrats in the Communist Direction. This, from a newspaper at the time:

"Mr. Truman said that the nationalists should have surrendered because they didn't have a chance to win...the opinion of American ambassador Leighton Stuart was that the failure of American aid to come at the opportune moment was the real cause of the weakness of nationalists and the disintegration of their armies....many military commanders went over to the enemy because they saw the United States withdrawing moral support from Chiang Kai-shek.

Mr. Truman boldly defends what Treasury did. He doesn't mention Harry Dexter White, mentioned in congressional hearings as a communist spy, sat at Treasury with full power to say when the money promised Chiang Kai-shek would be forwarded or withheld." Toledo Blade, Toledo Blade - Google News Archive Search




Admit it, Erroneous Joe....whatever history you know comes from reading Bazooka Bubble Gum comics.

True?

 

[JoeB131]

Holodomor > holocaust

Holodomor being the result of secular humanists punishing peasants for rejecting their noble collectivism.

Or that after the country had been devestated by several wars they just had some shitty famines.

 

[JoeB131]

[

The usual Leftist excuses.

I provide facts, as I know the history, and ignoramuses like you squeal 'is not, is not.'

Here's more history that you are clueless about:


1. [Owen] Lattimore was leaking information to the Soviets while he was an advisor to Chiang Kai-shek and that the Soviets considered Lattimore to be "working for them". http://foia.fbi.gov/owenlatt/owenlatt1a.pdf


2. The spies that FDR put in place continued to move Democrats in the Communist Direction. This, from a newspaper at the time:

"Mr. Truman said that the nationalists should have surrendered because they didn't have a chance to win...the opinion of American ambassador Leighton Stuart was that the failure of American aid to come at the opportune moment was the real cause of the weakness of nationalists and the disintegration of their armies....many military commanders went over to the enemy because they saw the United States withdrawing moral support from Chiang Kai-shek.

Mr. Truman boldly defends what Treasury did. He doesn't mention Harry Dexter White, mentioned in congressional hearings as a communist spy, sat at Treasury with full power to say when the money promised Chiang Kai-shek would be forwarded or withheld."[/

Admit it, Erroneous Joe....whatever history you know comes from reading Bazooka Bubble Gum comics.

True?

Again, I have a degree in history from the University of Illinois. And even though I was a pretty right wing ROTC type at the time, even I wouldn't have tried to get away with this sort of nonsense in a real academic setting.

The point was, after the Japanese had surrendered, Chinese folks had had quite enough of "Cash my Check" and his corruption. If anything, they US dumped too much money into the place trying to prop him up when the Europeans had already written him off.

 

[initforme]

I don't like the McCarthy part of this post. I remember that time. I disagreed with him vehemently

 

[PoliticalChic]

I do believe the country was founded on Judeo Christian values. Those values are all about helping the less fortunate. Check the bible. It speaks over and over again about that theme. Now we have a nation where a good many preach against it. Those so called evangelical(of whom I am one) who have worked hard and earned theirs but speak out about how the poor are hurting this nation are in my eyes the biggest hardest hypocrites this nation has. I've always voted republican because I am for middle of the road, center right social and fiscal policies. But I disagree with the far left and view the far right just as bad.

I thought that that was an interesting and inspiring post.

No pun intended, but the devil is in the details.
First, one can find support for any view in the Bible.
And our views of 'helping the poor' would probably differ: this is the giving a fish vs. teaching how to fish argument.

Second..." but speak out about how the poor are hurting this nation are in my eyes the biggest hardest hypocrites this nation has"....I would like to know exactly what you mean by that.
I don't recall any saying same.


Finally, I would like to add this about our nation being founded on Judeo Christian values.
That is a political statement, not a religious one.....I meant that, unlike the Enlightenment and French Revolution ideas that people are basically good...

...our view is that people are not basically good, and require checks and balances to keep them so.

See Madison in Federalist #51, "If men were angels, no government would be necessary."

 

[JoeB131]

I don't like the McCarthy part of this post. I remember that time. I disagreed with him vehemently

BizarroChick lives in a world where McCarthy was right and there really were a ton of evil communists not making history turned out the way she wanted it to.

Not the real world where the Communists won in Vietnam and China because they were fighting for their nations, and the guys we were propping up were fighting for corporate interests.

 

[PoliticalChic]

[

The usual Leftist excuses.

I provide facts, as I know the history, and ignoramuses like you squeal 'is not, is not.'

Here's more history that you are clueless about:


1. [Owen] Lattimore was leaking information to the Soviets while he was an advisor to Chiang Kai-shek and that the Soviets considered Lattimore to be "working for them". http://foia.fbi.gov/owenlatt/owenlatt1a.pdf


2. The spies that FDR put in place continued to move Democrats in the Communist Direction. This, from a newspaper at the time:

"Mr. Truman said that the nationalists should have surrendered because they didn't have a chance to win...the opinion of American ambassador Leighton Stuart was that the failure of American aid to come at the opportune moment was the real cause of the weakness of nationalists and the disintegration of their armies....many military commanders went over to the enemy because they saw the United States withdrawing moral support from Chiang Kai-shek.

Mr. Truman boldly defends what Treasury did. He doesn't mention Harry Dexter White, mentioned in congressional hearings as a communist spy, sat at Treasury with full power to say when the money promised Chiang Kai-shek would be forwarded or withheld."[/

Admit it, Erroneous Joe....whatever history you know comes from reading Bazooka Bubble Gum comics.

True?

Again, I have a degree in history from the University of Illinois. And even though I was a pretty right wing ROTC type at the time, even I wouldn't have tried to get away with this sort of nonsense in a real academic setting.

The point was, after the Japanese had surrendered, Chinese folks had had quite enough of "Cash my Check" and his corruption. If anything, they US dumped too much money into the place trying to prop him up when the Europeans had already written him off.

Judging by how little you know vis-a-vis the history that I post, " I have a degree in history from the University of Illinois" is hard to believe.


Let me put it another way.

To make a critical statement about a book you haven't read pretty much removes any cachet you claim to have.



That...plus the fact that you are wrong in just about all of your posts, means that going to your for a view on any historic fact is akin to going to England for dental care.



Hey....see if anyone likes you enough to get you a Christmas present....ask for Diana West's "American Betrayal.'

It'd be a good start.