Voter ID terrifies Democrats

[Seawytch]

Are you stating there is no voter fraud?

No, I'm saying that the kind of fraud that would be deterred by voter ID isn't happening, but the disenfranchisement of voters as a result of these laws IS happening. What is the acceptable ratio? How many voters are you willing to disenfranchise in order to prevent one instance of fraud. Can anyone provide a recent instance of fraud that would have been deterred by these restrictive voter ID laws?

I detest the very idea of election fraud in all forms, but the Republicans only seem worried about the kind that there is no proof of it having occurred. If they truly DID care about election fraud, then they wouldn't be concentrating their efforts on just voter ID laws. They would be pushing for more transparency and accountability, but the fact that a single registrar in a Wisconsin county can store ALL the votes on her personal computer didn't even blip on their radar. The fact that over a dozen states have no paper trail on their electronic voting machines doesn't seem to concern them at all. A number of states do not do any kind of post election audit to determine if their machines are recording votes correctly. These are areas that are FRAUGHT with the possibility of fraud, but not a single Republican is making an issue of them or putting processes in place to limit the possibility of fraud.

That leads me to only one conclusion...these voter ID laws are not being put in place to stop fraud, but to keep voters (who tend to vote Democratic) from voting.

No, I'm saying that the kind of fraud that would be deterred by voter ID isn't happening

Then you are not very smart.........................2004 washington state governors race.

We already played this game. A judge ruled that there was no fraud.

 

[Seawytch]

Are you stating there is no voter fraud?

No, I'm saying that the kind of fraud that would be deterred by voter ID isn't happening, but the disenfranchisement of voters as a result of these laws IS happening. What is the acceptable ratio? How many voters are you willing to disenfranchise in order to prevent one instance of fraud. Can anyone provide a recent instance of fraud that would have been deterred by these restrictive voter ID laws?

I detest the very idea of election fraud in all forms, but the Republicans only seem worried about the kind that there is no proof of it having occurred. If they truly DID care about election fraud, then they wouldn't be concentrating their efforts on just voter ID laws. They would be pushing for more transparency and accountability, but the fact that a single registrar in a Wisconsin county can store ALL the votes on her personal computer didn't even blip on their radar. The fact that over a dozen states have no paper trail on their electronic voting machines doesn't seem to concern them at all. A number of states do not do any kind of post election audit to determine if their machines are recording votes correctly. These are areas that are FRAUGHT with the possibility of fraud, but not a single Republican is making an issue of them or putting processes in place to limit the possibility of fraud.

That leads me to only one conclusion...these voter ID laws are not being put in place to stop fraud, but to .

How does it "keep voters (who tend to vote Democratic) from voting".

Please explain.

Voter ID laws disproportionately effect poor and minority voters. These voters tend to vote Democratic.

 

[LoneLaugher]

the facts are clear nad have been proven by studies.

You all jsut ignore them and then make declaritive statements which are backed by no facts in eveidence.

How do minorities purchase alcohol and cig's?
How do they get social services?

Just curious, and have yet to get an answer.

Are you looking for someone to say "with I.D's"? I think you are. But you are not thinking. They obviously need a different form of ID than what they normally have as a result of these new laws. Duh!

 

[M14 Shooter]

No, I'm saying that the kind of fraud that would be deterred by voter ID isn't happening, but the disenfranchisement of voters as a result of these laws IS happening. What is the acceptable ratio? How many voters are you willing to disenfranchise in order to prevent one instance of fraud. Can anyone provide a recent instance of fraud that would have been deterred by these restrictive voter ID laws?

I detest the very idea of election fraud in all forms, but the Republicans only seem worried about the kind that there is no proof of it having occurred. If they truly DID care about election fraud, then they wouldn't be concentrating their efforts on just voter ID laws. They would be pushing for more transparency and accountability, but the fact that a single registrar in a Wisconsin county can store ALL the votes on her personal computer didn't even blip on their radar. The fact that over a dozen states have no paper trail on their electronic voting machines doesn't seem to concern them at all. A number of states do not do any kind of post election audit to determine if their machines are recording votes correctly. These are areas that are FRAUGHT with the possibility of fraud, but not a single Republican is making an issue of them or putting processes in place to limit the possibility of fraud.

That leads me to only one conclusion...these voter ID laws are not being put in place to stop fraud, but to .

How does it "keep voters (who tend to vote Democratic) from voting".
Please explain.

Voter ID laws disproportionately effect poor and minority voters. These voters tend to vote Democratic.

These people also tend be receive government assictance.... for which they need an ID.

And in any event... effect does not necessitate intent.

 

[g5000]

How do minorities purchase alcohol and cig's?
How do they get social services?

Just curious, and have yet to get an answer.

Are you looking for someone to say "with I.D's"? I think you are. But you are not thinking. They obviously need a different form of ID than what they normally have as a result of these new laws. Duh!

That is exactly correct.

As a new poster I have not been able to post URLs, but if you look up the voter registration requirements in Texas and South Carolina, you will find that you can prove your residency with a variety of IDs.

But the voter ID laws in those states require a very specific DMV-issued ID.

So it does not take a rocket scientist to see that a citizen would be able to register to vote but not be able to exercise their right to vote under this new law.

All that is required to fix this problem is to make the voter ID requirement the same as the registration ID requirement.

And then if you are worried illegal aliens or Al-Qaeda or somesuch are voting, you just need to tweak the voter registration requirements.

 

[Conservative]

As a new poster I have not been able to post URLs, but if you look up the voter registration requirements in Texas and South Carolina, you will find that you can prove your residency with a variety of IDs.

But the voter ID laws in those states require a very specific DMV-issued ID.

So it does not take a rocket scientist to see that a citizen would be able to register to vote but not be able to exercise their right to vote under this new law.

All that is required to fix this problem is to make the voter ID requirement the same as the registration ID requirement.

And then if you are worried illegal aliens or Al-Qaeda or somesuch are voting, you just need to tweak the voter registration requirements.

then you're doing something wrong. I am unaware of any board or technical restrictions preventing new posters from posting URL's. Check with an admin if you think there is a problem with that feature.

 

[g5000]

then you're doing something wrong. I am unaware of any board or technical restrictions preventing new posters from posting URL's. Check with an admin if you think there is a problem with that feature.

I get a message that says I have to make a certain number of posts before I can post a URL.

So I am working hard to get my post count up.

 

[LoneLaugher]

How does it "keep voters (who tend to vote Democratic) from voting".
Please explain.

Voter ID laws disproportionately effect poor and minority voters. These voters tend to vote Democratic.

These people also tend be receive government assictance.... for which they need an ID.

And in any event... effect does not necessitate intent.

Holy shit! How many times are you nutters going to make that same bullshit argument? The ID requirements are NOT THE SAME for getting assistance, buying a gun, buying cigs and VOTER ID. The argument doies not apply.

 

[Teals_Of_Wonder]

and if you could pick 5 or 6 states or towns that are the worst culprits,,,what would they be?
in my opinion:
California
Chicago
Vegas
Blue Districts Of Philly
Dade/Broward Counties
Minnesota

 

[LoneLaugher]

Let me blow your minds, nutters.

I am in favor of properly identifying ALL voters. True statement.

 

[Seawytch]

How does it "keep voters (who tend to vote Democratic) from voting".
Please explain.

Voter ID laws disproportionately effect poor and minority voters. These voters tend to vote Democratic.

These people also tend be receive government assictance.... for which they need an ID.

And in any event... effect does not necessitate intent.

Not a current photo ID. A SSN is often sufficient.

 

[g5000]

Okay. I'll try again. Here goes: SC voter registration form.

Required: If you are registering for the first time in this county, you must attach a copy of a current valid photo ID or a copy of a current utility bill, bank statement, paycheck or other government document that shows your name and address in this county. If you do not provide this identification now, you will be required to provide this information when you vote. Voters who are age 65 and over, voters with disabilities, members of the U.S. Uniformed Services or Merchant Marines and their families, and U.S. Citizens residing outside the U.S. are exempt from this requirement.
** Social Security Number is required by the S.C. Code of Laws 7-5-170. This number is used for internal purposes only and eliminates multiple registrations by a single individual. Your Social Security Number is not released to any unauthorized individual.

So there is an ID or utility bill or somesuch, and a SSN requirement.

York County SC Herald:

While South Carolina's voter ID law could well survive last week's challenge by the U.S. Justice Department, we think federal officials raise valid questions about the law - namely, why is it necessary?

Good question!

The review of South Carolina's law found that it would, as critics have claimed, have the effect of preventing African Americans from voting. The review noted that minority voters are "20 percent more likely to lack DMV-issued ID than white registered voters, and thus to be effectively disenfranchised."
The review also stated that South Carolina had provided no evidence of voter impersonation or any other type of fraud that is not already addressed by the state's existing voter identification requirement.

But we also contend that the voter ID law is largely a solution in search of a problem, as the Justice Department review states. The state offered no evidence that so-called voter fraud exists in South Carolina, certainly not enough to affect the outcome of an election.

(edited to add: I see I have surpassed the minimum post count. hoo-ray.)

 

[daveman]

Paul Weyrich - "I don't want everybody to vote" (Goo Goo) - YouTube

Got anything from this century?

Why? You are proof nothing has changed.

Really? So my opinion -- that everyone legally permitted to vote should be able to -- is the same as his opinion -- that he doesn't want everyone legally permitted to vote to do so?

I can't wait for you to make that case. And you need to get on it. Now.

 

[Seawytch]

I'll say it again...I'll believe that Republicans are serious about Fraud when they push for paper trails on voting machines, post election manual audits, cameras in all tally rooms, two person integrity on ballots and statewide databases. (among other things)

 

[daveman]

“No one has been denied the right to vote by the Indiana Voter ID Law. The record clearly
establishes without challenge that 99 percent of the Voting Age Population in Indiana already has the required ID, in the form of driver’s licenses, passports, or other identification. Of the remaining 1 percent, senior citizens and the disabled are automatically eligible to vote by absentee ballot, and such absentee voting is exempt from the Voter ID Law.”

KNIGHT: Voter ID terrifies Democrats - Washington Times

So a Murdoch paper says, so it must coincide with your opinion. Why else post this thread. All honest, aware and sane people understand voter ID is an effort by the plutocratic oligarchy which controls the GOP to disenfranchise voters, voters who are likely to vote for Democrats.

No where in the US Constitution does it require a voter to provide Identification. If the GOP and those who support this effort want that to be the law of the land, amend the Constitution.

Ask those who support Original Intent (that will provide some real spin and be quite entertaining).

Nothing in the Constitution gives non-citizens the right to vote.

So how do you propose we keep them from voting?

Oh, yeah -- you don't object to non-citizens voting.

 

[M14 Shooter]

Voter ID laws disproportionately effect poor and minority voters. These voters tend to vote Democratic.

These people also tend be receive government assictance.... for which they need an ID.

And in any event... effect does not necessitate intent.

Holy shit! How many times are you nutters going to make that same bullshit argument? The ID requirements are NOT THE SAME for getting assistance, buying a gun, buying cigs and VOTER ID. The argument doies not apply.

Really?
What's the difference between the ID requirements for voting and buying a gun?

 

[daveman]

it's out of sync, true, but I believe the guy actually did say those things. I'm sure there are other videos of better quality, or a transcript someplace.

just because HE said it, however, doesn't translate into 'the entire population of conservatives in America agree'.

libtards are famous for taking the words of one or two people, and claiming ALL conservatives or Republicans agree.

I know - They always try to claim these people are the founders of the party or the voice of the party.

He founded the Heritage Foundation.

He is your leader just like Grover Norquist is your leader.

because you dont know who these people are doesnt make them not your leader.

You are being manipulated by these people, they tell you what to think and then you think it.

You stupid sheep. I don't have or need a leader.

You do. Because you're a stupid sheep.

 

[g5000]

Nothing in the Constitution gives non-citizens the right to vote.

So how do you propose we keep them from voting?

Did you not read the topic before posting? There are existing voter registration requirements to prevent that.

 

[daveman]

No where in the US Constitution does it require a voter to provide Identification. If the GOP and those who support this effort want that to be the law of the land, amend the Constitution.

Amendment XV guarantees the right of non white citizens to vote, it does not require that they provide ID.

Amendment XIX states "the right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be abridged by the United States or by any state on account of sex", it does not require a voter to produce ID.

If the founders and Congress as well as state legislators had wanted voters to show ID to vote, they would have included such language. As it stands, any attempt to abridge the right to vote in a Federal Election is wrong. Honest men and women will question the motives of those who attempt to do so and the fellow travelers who support efforts to disenfranchise citizens.

I'd settle for disenfranchising non-citizens, you but assholes shit your pants about that, too.

 

[Conservative]

I'll say it again...I'll believe that Republicans are serious about Fraud when they push for paper trails on voting machines, post election manual audits, cameras in all tally rooms, two person integrity on ballots and statewide databases. (among other things)

I'm good with all that.

I assume there are Democrats in office who push for all that?