War on Christmas

[sky dancer]

Origin of the Christmas Tree

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas_tree

 

[sky dancer]

The Prophet Jeremiah condemned as Pagan the ancient Middle Eastern practice of cutting down trees, bringing them into the home and decorating them. Of course, these were not really Christmas trees, because Jesus was not born until centuries later, and the use of Christmas trees was not introduced for many centuries after his birth. Apparently, in Jeremiah's time the "heathen" would cut down trees, carve or decorate them in the form of a god or goddess, and overlay it with precious metals. Some Christians feel that this Pagan practice was similar enough to our present use of Christmas trees that this passage from Jeremiah can be used to condemn both:

Jeremiah 10:2-4: "Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them. For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe. They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not." (KJV).

All about the Christmas tree: Pagan origins, Christian adaptation and secular status

A friend of mine is a Christian and she does not celebrate Christmas at all because of the pagan roots of the customs.

 

[Chris]

The Santa in red suit originated in a Coca Cola ad.

 

[YWN666]

Originally Posted by catzmeow
I'm saying that if Christ has disappeared from Christmas, rather than blaming those of us who are secular, the believers should take ownership of the perceived problem and solve it themselves.

We are. Of course, the seculars are the ones who took Him out but . . . that's ok. We'll put Christ back where He belongs.

How can secular people take christ out of your christmas celebration? That is what I don't unerstand about your complaint. If you want christ in your celebration, who is stopping you?

 

[YWN666]

You do not see it because you are a non-believer.

Lame excuse. We do not see it because you haven't given a reasonable explanation.

 

[YWN666]

Okay, this time (since each time I just point it out to you you don't seem to get it) point to at least two posts that say they are offended when some says that ... otherwise admit you are NOT reading anything and just posting to rile things up.

Don't waste your time with that Willow moron. She is one of those childish "nyah nyah nyah" trolls.

 

[strollingbones]

alrightie.....lets review this....first basic manners....dont be rude....if someone wishes you a happy winter solstice...its perfectly acceptable to me....if that person replies....merry christmas....there is nothing wrong with happy holidays...damn look at my signature...i bet a bunch of us are wishing i just posted happy holidays lol

 

[YWN666]

Originally Posted by YWN666 View Post
Can you give us an example where you think the secular agenda is pushing christ aside?

Changing 'Christmas' to 'holidays' - as in 'holiday tree', 'holiday parade'. Not having a Nativity scene in any 'holiday' parade. Never even saying the word 'Christmas' in advertising but always referring to it as 'holidays'. This is where Christ is taken out of Christmas. I know to you (meaning non-believers) this is a joke, a moot point. But to a believer, it smacks us in the face. I asked this before that if there was a Nativity scene in a parade would you be offended? I believe you said no you wouldn't. Then why is there an argument going on at all? Who would it harm if this were in a parade? Why completely eliminate the word 'Christmas' from everything at . . . . Christmas time? Why is it ok to have it just be 'holiday' but not ok for it to be 'holiday' and 'Christmas'? And no, I am NOT referring to some door greeter.

Perhaps the way christmas is celebrated is a reflection of the way religion is taking a less important role in people's lives so your issue is with christians, not secular folks. If your not seeing religious displays the way YOU prefer them outside your home, then that is YOUR problem. You want everyone to cater to YOUR wishes.

 

[YWN666]

Catz, this is an excellent idea. If my life permitted me to have the time to be involved in parades you can be sure I would be getting a Nativity float in there. Maybe even a giant baby Jesus balloon.

Your not having time for it is the fault of the secular folks?

 

[WillowTree]

I hate Christmas. Don't you want to know why?

not really,, It's enough just to know you hate it.. I feel badly for ya!

 

[WillowTree]

WEll here we are on Tuesday Morning..


I want to wish Merry Merry Christmas to all those who celebrate Christmass.. Merry Merry Christmas.. I feel so happy and content today..



but


I gotta clean up this home!

 

[catzmeow]

We are. Of course, the seculars are the ones who took Him out but . . . that's ok. We'll put Christ back where He belongs.

I actually don't believe this is true. We never had Christ in Christmas in the first place, so it would have been impossible for us to remove him.

But, I love how the agnostics and atheists serve as convenient scapegoats for all that is wrong with society.

"Oh, society started to go to hell in a handbasket when the atheists reared their nasty evil heads."

While you're at it, make sure you give proper credit to Madeline Murray O'Hare and the ACLU.

Do you not get that this is a pluralistic society, and always has been? That's why our national slogan is "E Pluribus Unum": out of many, ONE. People who came from many races, creeds, and countries, willingly choosing to join together as one nation. For the record, that idea predates the "In God We Trust" nonsense by at last 180 years.

This is why Thomas Jefferson, one of the founding fathers, and the author of the Declaration of Independence, wrote in 1802:

Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof," thus building a wall of separation between Church & State.

It should be duly noted that Jefferson himself, along with Thomas Paine, were ALSO primarily secular in their beliefs. See, evil atheists were here, all along, and their rights are just as important as yours.

You have ALWAYS had the right to put Christ in your Christmas. You just don't have the right to force OTHERS to do so.

This ain't rocket science, y'all. If you, or your church, want to have a manger scene, MORE POWER TO YOU. Your right to do this is protected by the First Amendment. If you want to wish me Merry Christmas, by all means, do so. I promise I won't be offended. And, if I want to put dancing reindeer on my lawn to express my own views of the holiday season, and wish you a happy yule, or seasons greetings, or happy holidays, or merry solstice, then by gosh, I have the same right to do so.

What you don't have the right to do is to ask government to endorse a specific type of celebration of this holiday for other people, or force other people to celebrate in the manner of your choosing. So, if you put a manger on the courthouse lawn, be prepared to accept a dancing Shiva or a whirling dervish, or a hannukah candle display right next to it. That's how it works.

And, the marketplace is a reflection of this fact. People celebrate in the manner OF THEIR CHOOSING. If they haven't put Christ in Christmas, or if they choose to celebrate Hannukah, Yule, Eid or Kwanzaa instead, who are you to tell them that they are wrong or unAmerican?


That's the part I just don't understand about Christians. You've ALWAYS had the right to celebrate this holiday AS YOU WISH. Why is it so important for you that others celebrate in the same way?

 

[catzmeow]

so we can stop the war on Christmas??? No one is offended by "Merry Christmas" Am I reading this right?? Tell me the truth now!

I've never been offended by this. Apparently, though, some Christians are offended when I wish them seasons greetings or happy holidays, though, because I am single-handedly responsible for "secularizing Christmas" by doing so.

 

[WillowTree]

I've never been offended by this. Apparently, though, some Christians are offended when I wish them seasons greetings or happy holidays.

I'm so glad to hear this,, so far that's the conclusion we've reached,, A. there is no war on Christmas, and B. no one is offended by saying "Merry Christmas" and when you look at it there really is no reason whatsoever to take offense.. so have a very Merry Merry Christmas to all who celebrate Christmas,, Merry Merry Christmas..

 

[catzmeow]

I'm so glad to hear this,, so far that's the conclusion we've reached,, A. there is no war on Christmas, and B. no one is offended by saying "Merry Christmas" and when you look at it there really is no reason whatsoever to take offense.. so have a very Merry Merry Christmas to all who celebrate Christmas,, Merry Merry Christmas..

And, don't worry about Skydancer. If she chooses to reject your good wishes, it's on her. Instead of choosing to become offended by the manner in which you wish you well, she could reciprocate with her own form of holiday greeting. It's a choice to walk around pissed off all the time.

 

[Lycurgus]

MERRY CHRISTMAS & GOD BLESS YOU!
MERRY CHRISTMAS & GOD BLESS YOU!
MERRY CHRISTMAS & GOD BLESS YOU!
MERRY CHRISTMAS & GOD BLESS YOU!
MERRY CHRISTMAS & GOD BLESS YOU!
MERRY CHRISTMAS & GOD BLESS YOU!
MERRY CHRISTMAS & GOD BLESS YOU!
MERRY CHRISTMAS & GOD BLESS YOU!
MERRY CHRISTMAS & GOD BLESS YOU!
MERRY CHRISTMAS & GOD BLESS YOU!
MERRY CHRISTMAS & GOD BLESS YOU!
MERRY CHRISTMAS & GOD BLESS YOU!
MERRY CHRISTMAS & GOD BLESS YOU!
MERRY CHRISTMAS & GOD BLESS YOU!
MERRY CHRISTMAS & GOD BLESS YOU!
MERRY CHRISTMAS & GOD BLESS YOU!
MERRY CHRISTMAS & GOD BLESS YOU!
MERRY CHRISTMAS & GOD BLESS YOU!
MERRY CHRISTMAS & GOD BLESS YOU!
MERRY CHRISTMAS & GOD BLESS YOU!

Open your heart to your savior Jesus Christ.

 

[catzmeow]

Thanks, but I was born okay the first time. And, my heart is already full.

 

[WillowTree]

And, don't worry about Skydancer. If she chooses to reject your good wishes, it's on her. Instead of choosing to become offended by the manner in which you wish you well, she could reciprocate with her own form of holiday greeting. It's a choice to walk around pissed off all the time.

I think SD is a guy!

 

[catzmeow]

I think SD is a guy!

SD is a lesbian, and clearly, she struggles with some anger issues.

 

[WillowTree]

SD is a lesbian, and clearly, she struggles with some anger issues.

gotcha!